Secrets of a Professional Negotiator

Edmunds.com

Secrets of a Professional Negotiator

The secrets of Car Negotiation are revealed by Oren Weintraub, president of Authority Auto.

Read the full story here

driverthegreat

Really? The customer never drove the car before and your calling salesman up and they are actually responding to this nonsence running back to the sales desk working imaginary deals? Any professional salesman that has a book of business, laughs thanks you and hangs up when you call.

lazlo_toth

Seriously, all over the phone. Never at the dealership, no test drive , no commitment. My sales force knows not to bring anything like that to my desk.

autoadvocate1

to:drivethegreat, I'm surprised to see your comment when it's clearly written that both sales were made.
any "good salesman", that recognizes an opportunity for a sale, never takes a shortcut and hangs up on a potential sale.
if the salesman took your advise, he and the dealer would have missed a sale and more importantly missed an opportunity for creating a long term relationship with customer, their family, colleges and friends.

boatbroker1

In the 35' to 50' boat biz and structure deals this way all the time. Verbal negotiations to arrive at a sale price followed by a written offer signed by both parties accompanied by a buyers deposit held in escrow. If the boat passes individual and professional scrutiny the deal is done. If not, the offer can be adjusted or rescinded. Saves everyone's time, money, and energy by keeping the horse in front of the cart. Why view a boat the owner won't sell at the price you're willing to pay?

l2louie

So, you can't negotiate effectively without lying? It is perfectly acceptable to tell someone an untruth to accomplish your ends? No thanks. I would much rather pay a bit more than the absolute minimum than pay with my soul.

luckydog01

I recently bought a certified used BMW from a dealer on the other side of the state using some of the techniques described in the article. I never met the salesperson until she delivered the car to my door. The car was as advertised and I got a good deal. I never set foot in the dealership or drove the car. I thought I must be crazy to do it this way right up to the end, but I must say it worked for me. Of course, I was familiar with BMWs and did my homework on the car, the dealer, etc.

bought_unseen

Dealers commenting - shows what you know. I bought my certified car sight unseen and never regretted it for a moment. Sounds like you are leaving a lot of deals on the table. The key word here it is certified.

chikoo

I am sure a mid to high end salesman can differentiate a serious offer from that of a joker calling in.

Now I am sure this might not work in low end cars where the key is to reel the customer in.

kittymama

Not impressed! I actually hired them for the full service based on Edmund's recommendation. Came out extremely unsatisfied. They charged me $200 upfront for the retainer's fee and quoted me an OTD price almost 1500 higher for a Camry LE base model. I shopped around myself and got it close to 1500 less and mine came with Alloy wheel package. When they quoted me, they acted as if I'm getting a good deal (just like a car salesman). Makes me wonder are they really working for the dealers or the consumers.

You can do the job yourself, as a first time new car buyer this is what I have learned.

Give yourself about a month to do research. Then do price comparison online (there are many websites that will allow you to get haggle free price quotes). Have everything in writing (print out certified price). Then call the dealers in area and ask if they can beat it (have it in writing). Then call up other dealers to see if you can get them to beat it. Go to test drive the car but don't buy the first day. You may have to make multiple trips to same dealers in your area. Finally fix on a price and buy it. Remember invoice price isn't the dealer's true cost.

Note: This is only valid for new cars (my experience). The bargaining power depends on the market trend so do research well.

Finally, know your worth. You shouldn't walk around in a Chanel purse and then expect them to lower the price by $50 when clearly you can afford more (also, don't run credit check before settling on a price).

I hope it helps. Happy Car Shopping!!

kittymama

PS: For those who said that one must test drive the car before shipping, are very wrong. Now a days a car negotiation can be done via online or over the telephone and then get it shipped. I had the opportunity to do that but I opted for test driving it first and buying from a dealer near by.

hdauto

I like the article. I use to be the salesperson so I understand the comments below but if you are working business to business this is how selling works. Sale first, then demo. It's a trade off. Lower margins for higher volume. There's nothing wrong with holding your ground and letting some deal go down the road. It just goes back to what the article said. What's your style and stick with it.

ctmlhr

Weintraub is EXACTLY the way new customers negotiate. I bought my first SAAB over the phone and fax in 1987 -- no sight, no test drive, just agreed on a price and it was delivered to my garage... and all my friends do the same ever since because everyone is so BUSY! My boss and I recently went out to buy a car for him -- his time is worth at very least $2500 an hour to the company... When sales types kept him sitting while they thought they were stewing the deal... he walked out and never returned. The guy that got the deal understood NOT to waste this customer's time. Really...there was a time when a car purchase was as careful an act as buying a house, but today with online checks of VIN numbers etc. People who make deals every day that cost their companies millions...do their jobs in less time than it takes to buy a car the old fashioned way... The car business is changing and Weintraub is on the cutting edge.

mschuyler

Oh, come on. test drives are useless and just provide face time with the sales guy. If you know what you want and have done your homework you don't need a test drive. If that's your criteria to make a deal you just lost. My second last deals were entirely negotiated on the Internet prior to my stepping foot on the lot, and an extremely good deals. I'd never go back to lot deals. Don't waste my time and I won't waste yours.

schmuey1

First of all, I, as a customer, go dressed as poorly as I can. It is suprising how few salespersons approach me. Usually they are hesitant to even LET me take a test drive. If I like the car, AND the way the dealership treated me, I go home, change clothes, and come back. I sit down, and give the salesperson ONE chance to give me his best price. I don't EVEN think of buying at a dealership when they do the sales mgr-gm stuff on a price. I don't give my registration, but I want to see their license to make an appropriate report if I feel the dealership is taking advantage of people.Also get the name of the F & I person to verify their info. If they give me a price thats agreeable on the FIRST visit, then I show them my trade.If the price suddenly changes, I leave. I forgot to tell you, my car keys NEVER leave my possesion. I go on the test ride with them. If I finally agree, ON THE ONE PRICE QUOTED, I will talk with the F & I guy. No kickbacks from lenders, no 200% markup on extras(warranties, etc). And I want proof who they are sending the deal to. After all of this, I leave. I come back in a day and pay cash. I don't mind a dealer making a few bucks, but dealer hold back, dealer cash, kickbacks from lenders, are MORE than enough. There are always MORE than one dealer in the area. ALWAYS DRESS LIKE YOU DON"T HAVE A PENNY TO YOUR NAME. SEE HOW THEY TREAT YOU. This has always worked for me and I pick up me 2008 Jag tomorrow, jeans with holes in and all.

deepond9

This is a joke right!? I don't know about anyone else here, but the buyer must be in front of me to even consider an offer.

I wonder what this guy charges for his service.

bb71

For all the salesmen who have responded to this article and scoffed: the reason that this guy is in business is because consumers don't want to deal with a salesman's BS. I understand the irony in that Weintraub is a salesman himself, but if salespeople didn't have such a well-deserved reputation of screwing people over, Weintraub would not be in business. So...if you would have laughed and hung up the phone on him (or me, for that matter), he (or I) will just call somebody else who will make a deal. It's as simple as that.

oubobcat

Of course you can work a deal over the phone. It's merely a conversation with someone who isn't in the same room. The last car I purchased was handled primarily through email. Naturally the deal wasn't final until I'd seen the car and had a satisfactory test drive, but the negotiation wasn't face-to-face.

hunt99

Driver and lazlo's comments below are excellent examples of how traditional auto sales techniques are eliminating sales for their employer's. On all of my transactions I know exactly what I want to buy and exactly how much I am willing to spend before ever contacting a dealership. When clowns like these blow me off I simply move on to another dealership that treats me seriously and I make the purchase there.

bl4444

lazlo_toth - "Seriously, all over the phone. Never at the dealership, no test drive , no commitment. My sales force knows not to bring anything like that to my desk."

Seriously? In the age of the internet, you won't deal over the phone?

I'm a current buyer shopping in three states from my computer. I can't drive to look at every car I'm interested in and hope the dealer will work with me. Anyone who isn't willing to deal with me over the phone and finalize in person won't get a second call from me.

Conversely, you're looking at the opportunity to open your potential customer base up by hundreds of thousands of people, and instead you scoff and say "business as usual, please."

I'm the future of your industry. You're a dinosaur and you're going to get left behind.

bocaraton2002

I also offer a car buying service in Boca Raton, FL. I have bought most of the cars for my customers through telephone negotiations. The key is that I am not driving to each dealership and spending an afternoon, rather I spend 10 minutes or less on the phone and the best deal gets the sale. Sure, there are dealers who refuse to give a price over the phone, but they are the losers. And if a seller doesn't honor the price, I never return to him, and buy the car elsewhere. Negotiation is an art, not a science. Oren did well.

brian125

great stuff i have been buying cras on line since the internet came out. my approach is very similiar to how a professional servicel buys for clients.... i should have went into this kind of buiness......... brian 125

brian125

when i buy a new vehicle i always get my target price of below invoice or at invoice, and only when supply and demand are not in my favor.. honda loves to stick together when they make a hot new vehicle like the 2013 accord.. i try to send out 20 to 30 emails or phone calls to the dealers that i'm buying. I always buy the last 2 days of the month or at quarters end. 1- quick simply phone call or emails to internet mngrs.. letting them know that for this price i'm buying today never fails. within 1 hour or so i have a sign buyers order with the price and vehicle requested supply and demand plays a big part of pricing but i find if your a good negioater the bigger dealerships who sell cars always meet your price or come close. i will buy with in a 100 mile radius of the nyc area. today it seems like dealers are really banging people out on these doc fees . my thoughts on that are if doc fees are $249 to $300 like in the new york area thats how much lower my below invoice price goes. plain and simple. the internet has changed the game of car buying and i'm loving it.

dariusbot

I am the Internet Sales Specialist for my VW Dealership and I try to spend a lot of my time finding out what people want. and I mean A LOT OF TIME. I cant tell you how much less stress there is on the consumer and the salesperson when the buyer is prepared. I have been in the car business for over two years and I can count on one hand the number of people who had a negative experience with me. Don't waste your time calling and visiting dealership after dealership asking them to give you their "Best Price". Be prepared! When you call, or visit, or email them offer them YOUR BEST PRICE, and see if they will take it or leave it. Most people nowadays are doing a lot of research when it comes to car shopping. Know the invoice price of the vehicle you want, and know the MSRP of the vehicle you want, then, MAKE AN OFFER! what's the worst that could happen, they say no? then you make someone else the offer. If they say yes, then GREAT! you had the least amount of price haggeling and negotiating possible by making the first offer! if none of the dealerships accept your offer, then it's one of two things.
1. Your offer is to low for the vehicle you want
2. The vehicle is out of your price range

This is the advice I will give all of my friends when they are looking for a car. These are the things you need to know before you even think about contacting a dealership.
1. What vehicle and trim level you want.
2. What is your trade in worth? (NADA.com is an excellent resource to use when looking for a value for your vehicle because THAT IS WHAT DEALERSHIPS USE. it's very easy to use and very straightforward about the value of your vehicle)
3. What is the invoice cost of the vehicle? (this is also pretty easy to find, I recommend CarsDirect.com. It will tell you the MSRP, Dealer Invoice, and even suggest a price that you should pay)
4. Be prepared to pay OVER INVOICE. (why would the dealership sell the vehicle at a loss)
5. Know what you want to accomplish, and tell the salesman that! (Don't beat around the bush, if you have done your research, and know what you expect to pay for the vehicle, be up front with the salesman and they SHOULD be up front with you.)
6. This is the most important thing. Ask if the sales person works on commission or on salary! (I work at a dealership that pays a salary to its employees, with a Volume Bonus for vehicles. So I am able to stand by the Consumer when it comes to price, and fight on their side, because the selling price is irrelevent to me. I want them to get a vehicle, and I will do everything I can to get them to the price they want to pay.)

jim1935

If the client is looking for a car I am sure that he has had a test drive of models that he likes and has given the negotiator them. And if the negotiator knows that the dealer has that specific car in stock he has visited the dealership - right? How else did he get the information about number of miles - whether or not it was a demo -hmmm?

carlineneg

I am in complete agreement with autoadvocate! The dealers made the deal, made the money and didn't let it go to another dealer. I understand dealers don't like having their leverage reduced, it reduces gross. However, unless you are the only dealer in 100 miles another dealer will do the deal. You have to take the high gross with the low unless you sell every car on your lot in less than 30 days and even if you do, you are not selling as many cares as you could. If you think you are, you need more people or a larger store.

shatner

"Dealers commenting - shows what you know. I bought my certified car sight unseen and never regretted it for a moment. Sounds like you are leaving a lot of deals on the table. The key word here it is certified."
_________

Well certified does not mean all that much really. In fat not all new cars are the same. I test drove some new Mustangs recently, the first one had huge play in the gas pedal that did nothing, the 2nd one just had a weird feeling to it when driven and a vibration in the steering column.

Make sure you drive a car before you actually buy it.

shatner

Oh, come on. test drives are useless and just provide face time with the sales guy. If you know what you want and have done your homework you don't need a test drive. If that's your criteria to make a deal you just lost. My second last deals were entirely negotiated on the Internet prior to my stepping foot on the lot, and an extremely good deals. I'd never go back to lot deals. Don't waste my time and I won't waste yours.
____________

That is crazy, I have driven some well reviewed cars and hated them for some reason or another. Waste your time? LOL how many hours will you spend in a car? Thousands!

ripper44_

Its funny seeing these car salesmen trashing this article. I guess they knows pros like Oren will cost them a few bucks by not letting them take advantage of as many customers.

breeze7

My take on this is if the salespeople are working on commission then they have to say whatever it takes to make a sales. So they can be payed for the day. The ones who are payed a salary are easy to deal with. I will be going to a dealership soon to get a new car and reading
all of this is going to help me a lot.

spahut

Looking at Edmuds and CarsDirect, I think all these MSRP/Invoice pricing is way off. There is no way a car dealer is only going to make $2000 on a new Audi (difference between MSRP and Invoice). I do like the way they negotiate but there is more leeway than just invoice pricing