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Comments
Yes the leather was not tight in the area where your butt sits.
I'm wondering, if when the hitch is installed, if there's room for a full-size spare, if the owner should decide to purchase one? It looked very tight. Also, I didn't see the wiring hookup?!
I didn't know Honda was offering a dog/cargo guard. It looked like it might be retractable(?), as well as being part of a cargo cover, but it was hard to tell, looking through the tinted side windows. With this installed you can't use the 3rd row seat.
Bob
Thanks.
Steve
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The separation net goes behind the second row and is NOT for keeping heavy items from falling into the second row. Looks like it's primary use is to keep your dog from jumping into the front.
My leather looked great from day 1. No "fuzzies".
There is no separate button for the liftgate on the remote. However, when the doors are unlocked the gate can be opened with a lever that is tucked up under the license plate frame.
then got to pricing. i looked at sticker on window and salesman pulled out an envelope that had their real pricing -- told me to forget the sticker prices and i told him to forget the sale.
Sticker shock does make one go running... I hope that most prospective Pilot buyers react the same way.
anyway, i still think usaa is probably the best game in town. let me know if you find out differently.
We did all the paperwork tonight at MSRP, I added my own accessories (splash guards, wheel locks, nothing else), I gave them a refundable security deposit and the vehicle should be here and in my garage before the 4th of July.
I'm still in shock. After reading all the postings and such, I had such low expections.
I'll definitely post an updated message if this was all a weird dream and I end up getting screwed in the end.
Edmunds should let the buyers setup a black list of the dealers who charge over the MSRP, who put options on withou buyers' consent, who treat buyers badly, who is a son of ... we want to punch his face.
The list should be able to sort on maker and state.
-mike
They also said that I was the last one to get it at MSRP and that from now on Loeber would be charging $1,000 over MSRP. I'm afraid come August they might forget our conversation and try to stiff me as well.
One a related note, there have been times when one salesman at a dealer gave me a hard time, but another was perfectly nice. You can't generalize about an entire dealership based on the attitude of one person. So be specific.
We used to have some "Post Your Bad Dealers" discussions around - if you search for "dealers" you'll get three pages of mostly dead topics with all sorts of dealer complaints (and then there's the one about a VW dealer who supposedly was going to sue someone for posting dirt about him....).
Steve
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SUVs, Vans and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards
-mike
There we can also rate the dealers. All the bad dealers make the good dealer look bad.
Why anyone is willing to pay them more than MSRP is ?????
I'm excited it's made in ohio. I'm excited it looks so cool. But really, i'm excited i like that an S.U.V. actually has some U.
Utility. Would you put a bag of mulch in the back of an Escalade? I own a Jeep Cherokee.
It is very much a utility vehicle. there really isn't a good Utility vehicle out there this year. Am i missing any?
I am also looking forward to info on the hidden hitch install and part number.
To me if you're going to buy an SUV you might as well use the "utility" part of it even if you're not rolling up over boulders (exceptions noted for my friend Paisan). Otherwise, you might as well own a sedan.
I suspect the Element will provide you with your utility at a lower price then the Pilot though I think the Pilot has plenty of utility as well.
My total came out $296 higher than Honda website estimate. Their excuse is the labor rates are higher in Bay Area than the "average" rate that Honda website is based on ($70/hr.).
I did not give in and insisted on MSRP; I was plenty able to walk out on dealers who charge markups or add ridiculous amounts as "protection" packages. One dealer in San Jose, CA had balls to tell me a markup of OVER $7000 is a good deal and the car will sell fast.
Bottom line; This is all nonsense. As a buyer with $$$'s, YOU control the action.
You have to be 1) patient and 2) demand that they meet YOUR price. They do this for a living and will subject you to loads of crap about not making any/enough money, how new this car is, limited inventory and the like to extract every last dollar from the deal.
BTW - the car handles better than ANY 7 or 8 passenger Ford or Dodge SUV, has better acceleration and quiter than a ML320, and still cheaper than an MDX. I'd tried them all. The Toyotas are too heavy, and the Lexus are too small for us.
My Pilot experience & 2 cents worth.
I suggest you shop the Pilot last!
First drive an Explorer $34K+ EB V6
Then try out a Trailblazer EXT $37K+
Then you might take a look something larger perhaps a Sequoia (very nice truck)$38K+ or something similar like a Tahoe in the low 40's, ETC...
IMO the closest thing you'll come up with is a Highlander (very nice but smaller).
I haven't even brought up Resale value.
Good Luck and happy Piloting
All are 4x4.
Explorer EB V6 31-32k Includes tow package, memory seats, electrochomic mirror, trip computer, power pedals etc.
Trailblazer EXT 31-32k Includes memory seats, electochromic mirror, trip computer etc. 2 feet longer - 3rd row seats adults.
Sequoia SR5 35k Includes trip computer. 3rd row seats adults. V8.
Tahoe SLT 34k Includes memory seats, electrochromic mirror, trip computer, etc. V8.
Pilot is competitive, but please compare apples to apples. Pilot sells for sticker. All of these others have 2000 to 6000 off sticker on their out the door price. All of these models also have options not available on the Pilot such as a "Sunroof".
-mike
If you do not need the leather or navigation or DVD systems, you might find the LX model to be insubstantially different from the EX. The LX lacks the following features:
• security system
• privacy glass
• alloy wheels
• roof rack
• electric drivers seat
• steering wheel audio controls
• second row "activity tray"
The absence of the acitivity tray is actually a benefit as it makes the middle seating position more comfortable. Furthermore the Honda security system seems to be rudimentary compared to some of the aftermarket systems available. The most important part of the security system, electronic keys that prevent starting the engine without a key in close proximity to the steeering column, is included on the LX model.
The point I am trying to make is that the LX model is an impressive vehicle in its own right and at $27,000 is hard to beat.
With the price of 02-mdx dropping, (texstim MSRP-$500, woodard1 -$800 and tom208 -$1000 plus) there is reason to re-compare the two. Below is
my understanding and personal opinion.
advantage
mdx pilot mdx($)
cost: $35.2K, $31K(?)
safety: proven, expected to be
good but not proven 2K
2nd row
middle
seat: uncomfortable, very
uncomfortable 0.25K
exterior
look: better, good 0.5K
interior
look: much better, good 1K
spare: normal, small 0.1K
moonroof yes no 0.4K
resale: better, good $2K
model yr: 1 yr old, just born -$2K
------
tot: 4.25K
If the $ amount is reasonable and if one could
afford either one, mdx is preferred. In order to
know other opinions, I will post
this in both pilot and mdx boards.
I am not aware that LX does not have the "activity tray". Thanks!
For the 2nd row, how does the middle seat compares to to the seat on the left and right?
There is no LX at the dealership to check.
I understand that for 10 pilots there is only one LX. Do you have problem getting it. Does it has any options? Any other fees other than MSRP+transport+tax+license plate?
You get the idea... The best comparisons start with similarly equipped vehicles which offer similar performance or utility. Paper comparisons of equipment lists tend not to allow for that.
* security system
* privacy glass
* alloy wheels
* roof rack
* electric drivers seat
* steering wheel audio controls
* second row "activity tray"
You forget to list:
* Remote keyless entry
* Auto-off headlights
* Body coloured side mouldings
* Automatic climate control
* CD/cassette 7 speaker stereo
* Driver manual lumbar adjust
* Cargo net
But there are those who say that the auto-off headlights help illuminate the walkway or other paths at night after you've left the car.
I tried that 2nd row center seat and found it also uncomfortable for the back.
Once you've had an in-dash changer, you can never go back, IMO. Those "old-style" trunk- or under seat-mounted changers are a pain in the butt with their stupid cartridges. You end up listening to the same six CDs over and over again.
When I am ready to look at the Pilot, the LX is going to be my default choice, I think.
I cannot remember where, but I read that the production of EX:LX will be 70%:30%. I probably ran accross these numbers in the recent USA Today or Car and Driver articles. In order to find the LX that I eventually purchased, I called around to at least 12 Honda dealers in the Detroit and Toledo area. I did this about a month before the car was released and found only two LX models that were expected to be available in June. I placed a deposit in May and then took delivery on June 4th. I did not pay anything other than MSRP + transport + tax/license.
Fedlawman - I apologize for the omissions. I should have made it clear that the list I posted was composed of items I considered to be substantive differences. Obviously we will all have our own opinions about what is actually "substantive".
I was more than happy to forego the options on the EX to bring the price down a few thousand dollars. The additional items on the EX are nice but for the most part seem cosmetic or "luxury". I suppose that luxury is in the eye of the beholder and depends on your perspective. Since my last vehicle was a 1989 hatchback that lacked air-conditioning, I view items such as the automatic climate control, lumbar support, and electric seat to be unnecessary. Just my opinion.
I would like to clarify one item on your list:
EX stereo: CD/casette + 7 speakers
LX stereo: CD + 4 speakers
The way this is listed in your post implies that the LX lacks a stereo altogether.
now that u have driven the pilot -- how would you compare the two vehicles. also, did u compare to the mdx?? which pilot did u get?
I am used to the solid feel and quick response of the ML -- as well as the good service i get. but the pilot drove pretty good -- my 9 year old told me it was the best car she ever drove in (can't bring her to the negotiations...)
thx.
Also, I saw an newspaper ad for 2003 new Expedition for 26k-27K. Wow, if I really needed a bigger car, and a tow capacity, I'd go for that. Much better value, and the newly designed Expedition is better than ever. Something to consider.
Honda more than likely tracks any issues to see if there are any recurring problems with a certain batch of vehicles. If there are recurrences, then they start looking at the possibility of a bad batch of parts.
On the down side for the MDX.
* It requires premium gas
* You can only access the 3rd row from the passenger side.
* I don't believe the base model includes a roof rack
Also, don't forgot to check with your Insurance company.
A few of the more common issues on the first year MDX:
- "The thud" (front suspension noise in some vehicles) -- fixed by a TSB during the first model year, and various updates made to vehicles produced during the first model year (there were three separate VIN ranges in the TSB; anything after each VIN range did not have the specific problem for that range).
- "Weeping mirrors" (water dripping out of door mirrors after a hard rain or wash, again affecting some vehicles). Addressed by TSB in the first model year. Mirrors redesigned in the second model year. Unknown if vehicles made late in the first model year had the TSB fix already in them.
- Stereo faceplate (some owners reported failure in a couple of station preset buttons). Faceplates bad, TSB issued, and most dealers replace the faceplate in vehicles brought in for other service without even asking. Newer vehicles have the fixed faceplate.
- Complaints about road noise. The 2002 MDX had some noise reduction changes in design, but no retrofit to 2001.
- Sloshing gas tank. Not fixed in 2002 MDX. Interesting "feature."
There have been some MDX lemons, with leaking oil or transmissions. I haven't yet thought it is a distinct pattern, however. Hard to judge (if it's a trend or not) by Internet reports.