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Diesel engines, which is better: Ford, Dodge, Chevy



  • mesazonemesazone Posts: 51
    To get this back onto Diesel engines...

    Over the weekend, I got into a conversation with a friend about the Cummings Diesel. He claims that Ford told Dodge to take a flying leap and they can't use the Cummings anymore. I recall hearing something about how Ford has ties to the Cummings but use Navistar. My friend further claims that Ford's new Diesel will be the Cummings. That's not what I've heard here. I heard here that Ford is staying with Navistar but haven't heard about Ford pulling the Cummings from Dodge.

    Anyone who can confirm/deny any of these?
  • mullins87mullins87 Posts: 959
    I've been told that Ford has ownership in/of Cummins also, but I don't know if that is fact. I have not heard anything about Ford leaving the Navistar for the Cummins.
  • mullins87mullins87 Posts: 959
    I do know for a fact that Ford made the dually before the '99 model year, I almost bought a '96. I thought the question you were asking was if they made the dually in 4x4 trim. I have seen several of them, but like I said, maybe they were 4x4 SRW converted to 4x4 DRW. I don't think so, but I cannot say with 100% certainty.

    But, they DID make the DRW before '99.

    BTW: I like this site, but I have found many holes in the information on this site, especially when it comes to diesels.
  • lariat1lariat1 Posts: 461
    Ford made the DRW 4x4 in only standard and crew cab configurations but not the supercab, but I think that changed with the superduties.
  • loncrayloncray Posts: 301
    I've seen this pop up again and again - here's the straight deal:
    Ford used to own less than 10% of Cummins' stock but now owns none. Cummins is independent. They have a contract with Dodge that expires in 2007. I believe you can get a Cummins engine in a Ford truck, but only in F450/550/650 etc.
  • mesazonemesazone Posts: 51
    Thanks for the information. I'll have to pass that onto my friend who thinks he knows everything.

  • rageeragee Posts: 9
    I have heard that Ford has a contract with navistar that doesn't end till 2010, and the reason you cannot get a cummins in any other truck except for say the chevy topkick, or the F650/750 is the fact that one of the stipulations dodge gave cummins was that they would have control and only cummins would be placed in dodge trucks. So up to the F-550 you can only get a PSD. Go to the commercial website and look at the engine options.... After that like on a F650 you have to have a CDL due to the I think 33,000 pound gross weight. I cannot remember if that is for the 650 or 750, but once you get up into those trucks I would rather have the CAT 3126B with 950ft/lbs off the flywheel and 300 hp. teamed with like a seven speed MT or Eaton tranny. If anyone has any other info in case I have heard things wrong, please post to correct me...

    I have been out of the loop for a long time and I have been trying to catch up on some of the posts but not all. I have been reading some of the posts on auto tranny's and I have to tell you that for a light truck a manual is the way to go, and I just purchased a new Mack vision and instead of swapin holes all the time, I opted for the AUTO yeah I said AUTO tranny. The only catch to the auto tranny in my new rig is that I still have a clutch but I don't have to switch gears. It is used for starting and stopping only after that the computer does all of the shifting for me. It has been doing great, and to talk about fuel economy, I normally only get around 6.4 mpg in my E7-460 Mack.....that is a far cry from my PSD...... but then again I can hook up a 50ft drop deck and go to town loading it down with whatever my farm needs hauled around.....

  • bigfurbigfur Posts: 649
    Kinda like the Pete i use at work with the 550hp cat and fuller 8sp manual. but thats me, i enjoy throwin gears
  • natescapenatescape Posts: 176
    Hi all. Just a diesel enthusiast swinging by. I drive a 1996 VW Passat TDI (diesel). I keep my eye here because I'm going to be in the market for a 6-passenger diesel in a few years (be it a minivan, full-sized van, or SUV).

    I had a couple of things to add.

    Don't be at all surprised if/when Dodge drops Cummins after the contract is up. As part of Daimler Chrysler, they might just switch over to a Mercedes diesel engine like the one used in the Freightliner Sprinter (which is MB everywhere but the badging).

    Diesels have a gigantic advantage over gasoline: they can run on renewable fuel. Just run it on biodiesel instead of petroleum diesel. Biodiesel is made from vegetable oil (usually soy in the US). It keeps your fuel dollars at home instead of sending them abroad. It burns quite clean. It has higher cetane (minimum 50... depends on the base oil), and massively higher lubricity. It virtually eliminates smoke. And best of all, it makes your exaust smell like popcorn. ;)

    I put up a page about it here -

    The page is car-oriented, but applies to trucks too.

  • tbunder1tbunder1 Posts: 257
    just check out this article:

    the new ford 6.0 power-stroke embarrasses the gm and dodge. HO or not for dodge, the PS kills it in performance.

  • loncrayloncray Posts: 301
    Um, Tbunder, they didn't test the HO. Against the 235 hp regular Cummins, I can well imagine the big 6.0 would be a lot more powerful. However, the Dodge boys are still working out an auto tranny that will hold up against the power of the HO engine. Once they get that done, let the people run the test again. Me, I didn't feel like waiting so I got myself a 6-speed and I love it. 305 hp - plenty powerful for anything I want to do!
  • novoqnovoq Posts: 26
    Review of new Power Stroke engine and Power Torq trans.

  • Go to for the latest review by their staff of the 2003 Ford F-350, Chevy 2500HD and the 3500 Dodge. All with diesel engines and factory automatic transmissions. The new 5 speed Ford auto is driven. Read their comments. They may be enlightening! The new Powerstroke 6.0 is being featured. All is very interesting but you should note that Dodge couldn't provide the newest version of the Cummins 5.9 diesel, so comparisons with this truck are using the current issue 5.9 ISB 24 valve engine w/o the latest updates.
  • tbunder1tbunder1 Posts: 257
    so what. it can't even be sold in california.
    and i would bet the house that the SD will outpull and outmuscle the HO as well. nothing beats a ford SD, it's as simple as that.
  • I may just have to trade my 7.3 PSD for this 6.0 PSD.

  • bigfurbigfur Posts: 649
    OK people i need a lil help. Looking at a 2001 F-350 crew cab short bed diesel with a 6-speed. Just need to know how well the 6-speed will hold up. Clutches rebuilds etc etc anyone have any idea bout how long these trannys last without alot of heavy hauling
  • Well, I hope I don't jinx myself here. I have just under 120k on mine. Daily driver, original clutch. I haven't heard of too many problems with them. The factory clutch supposedly has a weak spot in the springs. For $600 you can completely replace everything in the clutch, including the flywheel. Or, for $400 you can put on OE parts and just resurface the flywheel.
  • guys, guys. When a person wants to buya truck. above a 1500 let's say. Go to a commercial salesperson. I am one. I know the extensive training we have to go through to sell a "truck". Most of us that are real professionals aren't just trying to sell one unit. It's about relationships. As far as our Duramax. Well Izuzu has done a great job. I never tell anyone it's OUR new diesel, because of the past. As far as capacity. Refer to a trailering guide. We don't make anymore commission on an automatic! Right now there is a waiting list of about 8-10 weeks for a duramax unless you find one on a lot. Whether you have a problem with any vehicle is not the problem. It's always how your local dealer services you. Unforunately there are some bad ones out there. I feel lucky to work for a dealer that stands behind what we sell.
  • loncrayloncray Posts: 301
    Been awhile since I came and looked at this thread. You might be right - the SD engine might have more hp than the Dodge HO now - all the manufacturers are trying to one up each other. But then I'da had to drive a Ferd instead of my big beautiful Ram! ;)
    Seriously, I hope you're happy with your Ford, I'm loving life in my Dodge, everybody wins.
  • wwhite2wwhite2 Posts: 535
    The tree hugggers wont let my buy a 03 HO cummins here in Massachusetts ( land of the free ?) wonder if I can go to new hampshire and bring one back :-)
  • bigfurbigfur Posts: 649
    A guy at Lenz Auto Sales in Fond Du Lac WI was tryint to tell me today that a truck he has is worth MORE cuz its a manual 6-speed ford diesel. I think he full of something, and it aint hot air. Would you guys trust this guy or am i wrong here???
  • I'm awfully partial to the 6 speed, but I'd be wary of him. I'm sure there are exceptions, but I have never personally witnessed a manual tranny vehicle sell for more than an auto tranny vehicle of the same make, model and options. (I'm talking about cars and light duty trucks.) It could be that HE THINKS HIS manual is worth more, or it could be he has a lot full of manual tranny trucks and wants to get rid of them.

    I don't trust many salesmen. The few I do have earned my respect.
  • The six speed with 6.0 Powerstroke had BIG production delays due to quality problems. They were supposed to be produced back in Sept/Oct, but stopped the entire run and went back to drawing board . From what I've read they finally ran a bunch through line in Kentuckey a couple of weeks back. Guess since they're so rare right now your dealer thinks he's got the ability to rape his customer on this truck. It's gonna take Ford a while to fill all the back orders on this combination, then prices will fall back to normal.
  • Beware, I've heard a lot bad lately about Lenz - we looked at a used Explorer years ago there and it was way out of wack on the price - ended up at the time with a used Blazer from Ripon, but that was way back in '96 or something around there. What year is it? Have you looked it up for market price? lol.
  • bigfurbigfur Posts: 649
    Ive looked it up on NADA and the price seems right on, but like i said and mullins stated we have never seen a manual be more expensive than a 6-speed. Been trying forever to find a decent mile crew cab single rear wheel diesel 6-speed and for the life of me i cant find one. oh well i have time for one to appear. Happy Trails everyone.
  • Best of luck - they're starting to show up. Here in Wautoma there was a (if I remember right) '00 crew cab, auto, diesel, XLT, tow, off road, etc. with 102,000 miles - they wanted about $17,000 for that one. Hubby would have loved it, but I really don't want 2 diesels right now - I want a gas to drive in winter to work (2 miles each way). Best of luck - keep looking.

  • Yeah, I looked long and hard before I found mine. Seems as though all of the nice used SD's are auto's while the 6-speeds are really used to work. I got lucky and found exactly the truck I would have ordered. Keep looking, one will eventually turn up.
  • bigfurbigfur Posts: 649
    I just hope i dont have to settle for an automatic... but if i have to i have to i guess. Even an auto broker cant find one at Ford auctions. Oh well i have wheels for now, just a waiting game, only depends on how much paitence i have lol.
  • Have you tried an auto and compared the two? True, even when looking at new ones, manuals were hard to find, but we're happy with the auto. Actually, hubby has gotten older and is sick of shifting - he drives truck & says "I do it all week, I'm done doing it on the weekends". When we get rid of our 1/2 ton manual, it will be replaced with another automatic.

    Good luck in finding what you're looking for. lol.

  • bigfurbigfur Posts: 649
    I DO drive trucks all week and i still like them manuals. Ive owned both and driven both for work, and i perfer a manual. Personal preferance thing i know, but i dont do a whole lot of city driving in my personal truck. Had an auto broker find me a new one...lil more than i wanted to spend but looks like i can afford it so ill let you know what happens there :)
  • we love our ' the 100,000 mile warranty is nice. The plus is you can get what you want too...(don't get me wrong, I've got nothing against manuals - drive one myself)...I was just saying that they seem few and far between on new lots, making them harder to find on used ones too. Best of luck.

  • bigfurbigfur Posts: 649
    Used some guys up here thru my credit union...i told them this is what i want, FIND IT lol and they did :)
  • CitizensFirst has that option too in Oshkosh, or maybe that's where you went through. Kinda nice when they can get you what you need without a problem.
  • mledtjemledtje Posts: 1,123
    The only manual trans pickups I have seen on a dealer's lot in the last 5 years were the ones I had special ordered.

    Dealers make more money on high optioned trucks, so they don't order manual trans unless it is already sold.

    Mike L
  • ezshift5ezshift5 West coastPosts: 858
  • ezshift5ezshift5 West coastPosts: 858
    and see if you see anything.

    It's a diesel. Small, fuel-efficient, reliable. Got a 5-speed manual transmission, air, sliding rear window and a bed liner.

    It also gets 55 highway mpg and shows 275,000 original engine/0 overhaul miles on the clock.

    I got fifty bucks says y'all got no clue.
  • bigfurbigfur Posts: 649
    id guess its the VW pickup with the diesel in it. question is am i right???
  • ezshift5ezshift5 West coastPosts: 858
    ...........the same outfit that built the Japanese Zero fighter plane in WWII?
  • mullins87mullins87 Posts: 959
  • ezshift5ezshift5 West coastPosts: 858
    Yes, Mitsubishi built the Zero. And also (several wars later) produced a small diesel pickup.
  • Clearly each of the five trucks is an awsome pulling machine.

    Great set of tests, but acceleration is only a single criteria for measuring the suitability of a truck. Since my truck mostly pulls a 5th-wheel RV, I'd like to see a real world test which would be pulling that load at legal speeds over about a 500 mile course of typical highway types (flatland and hilly) and reporting the fuel mileage.

  • cspauldingcspaulding Posts: 159
    been less than impressed with Ford's new diesel? Hubby test drove one and prefers our '02 PSD over the new 6.0 - said it was good after you got it over 2000 rpms, but seemed to take a little to get going. Anyone have one that has a better feel of the truck? - Thanks
  • jeff186jeff186 Posts: 95
    I heard that Ford might offer a diesel in the Expedition since the Excursion is going out of production? Anyone in the know?
  • mullins87mullins87 Posts: 959
    I was told that Ford and Navistar was working on a Baby Powerstroke V-6, somewhere in the 4.5 liter range. I have heard since then the project was scrapped, reason unknown to me. It stands to reason if a Baby 'Stroke is being developed for the F-150, then the Expedition is a logical choice.
  • gagricegagrice Pahrump, NevadaPosts: 31,450
    If Ford beats Chevy to building a small diesel engine I will switch in a heartbeat.
  • jaijayjaijay Posts: 162
    Wpalkowski, interesting article although from what I have been reading from the (formely known as indicates that many owners are having trouble after having a few thousand miles put on them. Problems with stalling, injector failure and oil leaks.
  • What would be the point of a small diesel? Diesel is good for work, and who would want "small" work?
  • natescapenatescape Posts: 176
    black_silver, the point of a small diesel engine: efficiency. I get 48 MPG in my VW Passat TDI. I'd KILL for a small SUV or minivan with a diesel engine that got 35+ MPG. :)
This discussion has been closed.