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They are told to obey the law? They do no better a job at that than most of those they observe.
I guess I was fortunate in that I came from Berkeley PD onto a traffic entity and worked the freways and was "present " at every riot in the Bay Area including SF State and Cal Berkeley and everything in between. (i.e. I knew what to expect.)
I do know we lose about 12 officers each year via accidents/run over/ (rarely) a shoot out. And very high speed chases which I was an active participant I understand is the real killer of many of us.
Lastly I am speaking only for me, I tried to give people the benefit of the doubt and only cited the ones that really were violating the law and common sense. But that is another time and this is not the place. Eg. 110 mph cite in an 65 mph zone.
I responsded to that poster as I was tired of the "tried and true" assault on the Ca law enforcement community. (And I would be the first to say much of the criticism is warranted)
I hope I did not insult anyone and/or get your ire up but that one post got to me. Lastly, there was an "expectation" of a range of numbers that were "expected" by the bosses per month. Just for me, my rule of thumb was about 1 to 2 tickets or fix it tickers per day. Probably today its more but then my time has past.
I enjoyed everyone posts as this to me, jmo is one excellent group.
Good luck to all and stay safe.
jensad
I am sure the expected quota is higher in these days of budget woes...of course, when interviewed, the suits will deny the quita system. Maybe that draws some ire, not being told the real motivations behind enforcement. But it's the fault of the boss more than the employee.
I wonder if I'll see a speed trap on my way home today, it will be all for safety of course :shades:
Nearly as irrelevant and insane as stating that police officers don't have to go out and do their jobs as they have been told to do. I don't know about your job, but most people who work for a living have to do what their bosses expect them to do, or they aren't employed for long.
Have you ever been a police officer? If not, you have no right stating that they should simply not do the job they are told to do, just so people can break traffic laws more easily and not get so upset at the officers trying to enforce those laws.
No wonder there's so many inconsiderate drivers out there. Their solution to making driving better for everyone is to expect the police to stop enforcing traffic laws.
Have you ever been a police officer? I will wager an awful lot you have not. Seriously? Another bizarre tangental comment. I have every right to state what I did, you are not in a position to determine my rights to state anything. Please, simmer down and do not think you have the means to determine the rights of others, you do not.
Who said anyone should stop enforcing laws - sounds awfully and insanely absolutist...but when some laws are based on cash flow above all else, and hinder LEOs from looking after actual crimes, then they indeed do not deserve strict enforcement.
Show me the money, that's what it's all about, whether you like it or not.
Oh, I understand perfectly how it works: cities/counties are getting less money from states/feds, and they can't raise taxes (or not enough to cover the gap), so they have to make it up somehow to pay the bills. Why not let those who break the law pay the bills? So the police on the street are told to go out and bring in tickets. But why should we get upset at those officers because they are doing what their captains told them to do? Why should we expect them to not do their jobs?
"If you can't do the time, don't do the crime."
There's also another motivation for police to regulate traffic laws: public safety. How many people, if they thought there was a decent chance of getting a ticket, would follow traffic laws more closely? How many people, if they knew police would always ignore traffic law violations, would press the pedal to the metal?
You should be thanking highway patrol officers for going out everyday to encourage drivers to drive in a more considerate fashion... even if their motivation is only to avoid a ticket.
They don't have to enforce everything to the letter, and they don't. They do give leeway, sometimes significant, and it seems for the most part they meet the quota and move on - as they should.
Do you seriously believe speed enforcement as it exists today is about safety? Really? If so, there's really nothing to discuss here. Other than in special cases (school zones, etc), it is not.
Yes, when I see speed traps on wide open roads in perfect conditions as social ills continue to expand everywhere, I should be thankful!
No. You are the only person here who said anything about police enforcing "everything to the letter." Besides, that's contradictory to what you said a couple of posts ago, that police let a lot of "little" stuff go--might as well go after the worst offenders, yes?
I believe part of speed enforcement today is about safety, yes. (And you said you believe that, too--school zones are a pretty darn important "special case", don't you think?) Otherwise you wouldn't see officers let people go when they are only a few mph over the limit. And part is revenue generation. Think again about my question: if drivers KNEW there was no enforcement of speed limits, how many do you think would break them--by a big margin? And that would create a huge public safety problem--because most drivers in the USA don't drive as skillfully and courteously as those in Germany.
So if someone doesn't agree with you, you refuse to have a discussion with them? :surprise:
I don't like speed traps either. But I realize why they're there. And I realize they're not the fault of the officers sent out to run the trap. They don't have the option of saying, "Gee, Captain, I really don't feel like running speed traps anymore. I don't like the fact that they're there mainly to raise money to pay the bills of the city, plus I might upset some folks, like fintail."
It was so absurd, I couldn't even reply to it.
I think most people are so chicken and/or so blindly deferential that if the "laws" stood, but enforcement was more logical, there would not be a significant increase in high speed issues, no.
It's about money, plain and simple, money demanded by forces who might not have the courage or intellectual honesty to admit their motivations.
You not agreeing doesn't make my eyes roll, the random insane tangents and positions do that. If you don't like it, maybe you can tell me what my rights are again
If LEOs did in fact call BS on their revenue collection duties, as most do to a degree (by not enforcing strictly), they could in fact have that option. All it takes is a solid and committed majority to act. They aren't going to be fired or sent to the sticks, hell, they have some of the most militant unions in the land, ones that nobody cries about. Nothing would come of it.
Let's be real and move on. Money money money, it controls this revenue collection masquerading as safety.
How a nation founded in opposition to unjust laws has devolved to this, amusing and sad.
As real crimes continue to fester and grow, second world, here we come.
There may be some of that going on but I don't much buy it. There's plenty of links out there showing that traffic patrols increase road safety and have the ancillary benefit of napping perps for other crimes, like burglary. For example:
"In 2009, Charleston Police made 12,688 traffic stops within Charleston's 33.3 square mile jurisdiction. In 2010, that number jumped to 13,996, an increase of 1,308."
And the headline?
Extra patrols in Charleston may be linked to decrease in crimes (Charleston Gazette)
Here's a pure safety link from the Camarillo Acorn in CA.
I am sure the local vodka makers association would tell me a fifth a day keeps the doctor away, too :shades:
Money money money...got a faltering city with insane expenses and overpaid suits running the show? Crank up the speed traps and cameras, and try to save the day.
Thanks for your posts which are very informative. You are one of the good one's...I salute you sir!
The Sandman
2023 Hyundai Kona Limited AWD (wife) / 2025 VW GTI (me) / 2019 Chevrolet Cruze Premier RS (daughter #1) / 2020 Hyundai Accent SE (daughter #2) / 2023 Subaru Impreza Base (son)
I have personally seen both sides of this story. I've had two speeding tickets in my life and both were in classic speeding traps. I was pissed I got the tickets, but not at the officers. They were very professional, actually quite courteous as they wrote me up. The speed zones involved were I think clearly designed to catch speeders, not for safety reasons. The DMV officers didn't design those speed zones. But I'm pretty sure they were given a quota of tickets to fill. In my job I get quotas to fill also. Sometimes I think they are really ridiculous quotas. But if I don't make them, at best I lose a lot of my income. At worst, I lose my job.
Then there's the safety-related cases. A good one off the top of my head is a RR crossing I frequently use. Many people ignore it... it's just a stop sign, no crossing arms or signals. One day, I was preoccupied and forgot to stop there. I was pulled over by a local policeman who was sitting there to catch people doing exactly what I did. He gave me a lecture about the importance of watching out for crossings like that, what could happen if I don't, and let me go. If he were motivated by "money, money, money", he would have written a ticket, and I would have deserved it. But he was clearly motivated by something else. Safety, maybe? I'm sure to stop at that crossing every time now, that's for sure.
I have lived in towns like that.
I know a few other like that too.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
http://autos.yahoo.com/articles/autos_content_landing_pages/1728/americas-worst-- speed-traps/
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Today, on I70 the trucks didn't do that as well. A Dodge Ram truck with a flatbed trailer, empty, behind moved on up ahead. He wanted to cut over in front of me. I just stayed my ground and he had to pull in behind me. So he zoomed up as close as he could get that dominating ram grill as he could to my rear end.
I have seem many displays of aggression from Ram truck drivers. Is it a character type that buys these trucks with the "Ram" image. I recall one Ram pickup which tailgated me in our home town then passed illegally in the middle left turn lane. I called the dispatch and told them it was dangerous driver in one of the pickup trucks for people with too much testosterone!!! He was headed to a new home construction area with a large gas heater in the rear of his pickem'up truck.
The best handling of the zippering together of two lanes reducing to one was in Tennessee. There was large sign on the roadside that said Merge NOW! People alternated and filled into the right lane. It worked so much better without groups running up far to the front of the line and then holding the polite lane drivers back while they bull their way in.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Ohio used to have one on the old Route 40 west of Columbus. I think they outlawed Mayors Courts and put them out of business. There was something about the policeman and mayor were related
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Interesting. I've seen the same thing. Until I read your post, I had assumed that these guys just didn't like BMWs. I guess they don't like Buicks, either.
In most smaller cities/towns in the Midwest, the speed drops as you go through town. I can understand that. The ononous cases are where the speed limit changes several times in a short span--seems designed to be a ticket generator.
I decided to get in the right lane pass all that crap, make a right turn on a side street just before the construction site and take an alternative route. As I was passing that traffic some idiot at the very lasy minute decided to move from the left lane into the right to block me. He was a bit late and almost clipped me as I have to swerve off the road to avoid hitting him (her?).
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
If you want to see Ram tailgating, spend a few days in Atlanta...or non-metro area WA state for that matter. There's indeed a mental factor there.
This isn't a case of a small town or city out in the rural areas, this is in a rather high density suburban setting. A type of setting where unless you knew the boarders between towns you would never know when you went from one to the other.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
On the other hand, I wish it were so where I live, people are completely clueless as to how the merging process operates. It is actually almost a... for the lack of a better way to say it, a reverse zipper where you zip from the back up to the merge point where you should actually start the zippering. Some people merge in way too early, to have someone pass them up and try to merge in 3 - 5 cars ahead of them, which continues on up to the merge point. Stupid I know, but that's how it uh, "works" around here.
As others have said, this is called the zipper method. It makes complete sense and is much more efficient but it is tough on those who like to prepare early.
There are several good explanations of the process out there if one does a google search.
Thank you
jensad
Don't suggest that too loudly: the legislators in Ohio are looking to grab money and power any way they can. They won't undo the red light and speed cameras. They would of course exempt themselves from getting in the mail citations. They exempt themselves from pay cuts, benefit cuts, and even give themselves ability to buy retirement years in the state's weekend pension plans at an 80% discount! We know they'd exempt themselves from citations.
It would just be a money maker like the current red light cameras without a benefit in safety.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Slower commutes aren't what is needed.
I bet smoking costs society a lot more than speeding, I can't compare them.
I saw a woman applying eyeliner while driving an Explorer this morning...IMO that's infinitely more deserving of a ticket than someone cruising along an interstate at 75 or 80.
Being easy doesn't justify obsessive enforcement.
If my morning commute went any slower we would all be going backwards.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
That my friends is not what this country is about. It's just one small step to them tracking my every move. Do you REALLY want that? The freedoms we so much enjoy would then be lost. I say no thank you. The govt already intrudes enough.
And if you're worried about "big brother" watching your every move, well they can do that now if you have a cell phone with GPS!
Plus if you think about it, if you have a 20 mile commute on the highway, it would take you 18 1/2 minutes at 65mph and 16 minutes at 75mph, or a difference of about 2 1/2 minutes longer going at 65mph. So I don't see how gaining the extra 2 1/2 minutes is worth the increased risk of an accident. If technology can help in enforcing something as clear-cut as a speed limit, I think it's worth it. And for those folks needing the extra 2 1/2 minutes, I say just leave earlier in the morning :P
There are ways to avoid that.
If technology can help in enforcing something as clear-cut as a speed limit, I think it's worth it.
Well if you really want technology to enforce the speed limit and make things safer I would think tha technology is there to tell the car what the speed limit is and have the onboard computer limit the speed the car can do.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Great idea!! So a person out on a two laner in the midwest (where SLs can be 70) can't safely pass a semi doing 10 under (or can't maintain speed on inclines). There are very few cars made today that can't safely travel at speeds over 75. Heck in Montana the interstate SL is 75.
2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic
About a year ago, there was talk in a State out west, Oregon maybe, of using GPS in cars to track miles travelled and thus a way to tax for road use. It is not out of the realm that that could happen and be mandated on a national level given our fed governmernt's continuing intrusion into our lives.
You would still have your freedom, but you would no longer have anonymity
& if you are violating the law, why should anonymity shield you from enforcement?