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Lowest non-school SL I see around my area is 30, arbitrarily applied to everything from wide open edge-suburban roads where some bloated overpaid politico's niece's poodle got hit by a car in 1974, to crowded urban streets with pedestrians everywhere.
And those situations honk me off to no end as well.
That said, I'll usually try to pass as soon as the road straightens out (if clear), so that the car in front won't have had much time to start their acceleration. It usually works, considering that driver's that drive slowly on the twisties tend to be slow on the uptake for most all types of driving situations.
I don't like tailgaters, either. So I do whatever it takes to get them out from behind me. If that means slowing down so they pass, more's the better.
Get rid of the problem, instead. And the easiest way to do so is to get the driver off your tail. IE - let 'em pass.
Or, conversely, you can keep a pissed off tailgater on your rear for your entire drive. Me, I think that would completely ruin your drive. But hey, if that floats your boat...
It's really simple: take a few deep, relaxing breaths and wait for the opportunity to pass the other car safely. If you're lucky, the other driver MIGHT pull over to the shoulder and let you by. As has been discussed, under certain situations, in certain states, that's the law. In other cases it's a very courteous thing to do... but not required.
Who says I am going out of my way to do anything?
I don't like tailgaters, either. So I do whatever it takes to get them out from behind me. If that means slowing down so they pass, more's the better.
The only problem is half the time on the straight flat roads they go slower than I do and I have to pass them within a mile.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Seems unlikely to me, that half of the drivers who overtake you in "the twisties" want to drive fast in the corners but slowly on the straights. :confuse:
But in any case, you will not be inconvenienced nearly as much, by their relative slowness, as they were by yours, because you can easily pass them where they drive slowly: on the straights.
Speaking of which, here is a short story of the ONLY driver that I have ever encountered who tailgated me until he passed me, and then drove more slowly.
I was driving back to my home in the Willamette valley after a weekend at the Oregon coast. It was late at night, dark and foggy, the highway was nearly deserted, and my contact lenses felt gritty from over-wear. (hard contacts)
The highway from the coast is a twisty two-lane, with infrequent passing lanes. It winds over the coast range and is about an hour and a quarter drive, under good conditions.
I was driving as fast as conditions would warrant, which in this case was pretty slowly; certainly well below the speed limit. The headlights in my mirrors kept getting closer, until the following vehicle was right on my butt.
I endured the situation for a couple of minutes, then put on my right signal and pulled over on the narrow shoulder. The driver behind me was hesitant to pass since I could not give him the whole lane without going off the pavement, but I continued to slow until he had little choice.
Once he was in the lead, he realized that the fog was much trickier without a set of tail lights to follow and he drove at a pace slight slower than I had been maintaining. I ran right up on his tail, just to give him a small sample of his own driving courtesy.
Then I backed off and followed his lights all the way back to the valley.
The tailgater probably felt that his car was faster, better, stickier, more powerful, unwreckable, etc., than the car of those "lower" people.
He felt he was much more capable of driving fast through the fog on the curving road because he overestimated his driving abilities. He also overestimated his vehicle's abilities. He probably thought his headlights were much better than those of the "lowly" vehicle in front and he would be able to glide through the fog and night; instead he found he had a car that just like all the rest. Today the headlight parable would be for those with those wunderbar HID lights that blind others.
A similar pattern here in the eastern Midwest is during snows. The people with their "special cars for special people" think they can drive much faster. They tailgate and don't like to pass but they want the car in front to speed up on those two-lane roads.
Or a few years back on I-70 we had a few inches of a granular snow on the pavement. A SUV passed rapidly in the left hand lane, probably thinking he was driving a special car with batman-like abilities in snow and rain. Within a half mile I watched as the SUV slowly rotated toward the median, then quickly did a spinout as the front wheels of his powerful SUV caught the heavier snow at the edge of the driven pavement, then came back onto the driving lanes narrow missing a semi which he had bested with his high ability SUV, then came to rest in the left hand lane.
As I passed I blew the horn repeatedly at the idiot. Of course, he was younger and unseasoned in his driving abilities than someone in their 40s and up is. I still recall the horrified look on his face.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I didn't say that they want to drive slowly on the more straight and flat roads, just that they often drive slower than me. The vast majority of the time its tuners in riced up civic and scion and the like that want to prove their cars and supposive driving skills on very twisted roads. On those twisty roads I drive slow enough that I stay in my lane, my tires don't squeal and I'm not being slammed to one side then the other in my car. On the flat straight roads I do tend to do at least 70.
But in any case, you will not be inconvenienced nearly as much, by their relative slowness, as they were by yours,
I wouldn't say that doing SL or slightly better on a twisty dangerous road is really inconvenicing them.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Of course he had a special car with Batman like abilities, he had an SUV. I know way to many people that think that if you have AWD/4WD you can drive like normal in any type of situation. I find it amazing that right after a major snow storm most of the cars in the ditch are AWD/4WD cars and SUV's.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Winner goes to an ancient woman in a Tempo - she was probably in her 80s and the car not much younger. Brake lights always on - I think this was an electrical defect as she was moving along decently enough, even up hill - brake lights on 100% of the time. This was annoying me, so I went to pass her (4 lane road), she speeds up, matches me for a second, then drops way back. Nice. I watcher her in my mirror as she later made an abrupt lane change and turned off the road.
Also got behind some oldsters in a top of the line Camry going about 18 in a 30.
Driver's on the road are often simply guilty of being clueless, inattentive, and unaware of their surroundings.
It would be like taking a knife to a gun fight. It would be like wearing a swimsuit to an important formal job interview.
Maybe it's those Trailblazer SS buyers that are to blame!
I actually had someone do that. Well it was a lady that wore a swimsuit and had put on a wrap around skirt and a very loose flowery top. So she wasn't just in a swimsuit but was dressed as going to the beach. She even said that she was going to the beach after the interview. needless to say she was out of the running even before I started the interview.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
How will you make the other driver do this if they aren't cooperating? And if they're tailgating... they're not cooperating.
Honestly, what you are describing is what you want the other driver to do. And you can't control the other driver.
So, why take all the steps to ensure they stick around your car? If they pass, you can drive worry free. Speeding up to prevent their passing keeps them angry and near you.
Not exactly a pleasant drive to me.
If someone needs to go faster than I am going on a two-lane road, I want them to pass. Better they get the ticket at the speed trap up ahead, than I get it. And if it's dark, they'll illuminate the highway ahead of me, vs. blinding me with their improperly adjusted headlights (especially the improperly adjusted Xenons I love so much). Lots of advantages to me to let the car behind me pass.
All I am trying to say here is that the roads need to be shared. Driving a car that has superpowers doesn't give anyone more rights on the road than anyone else.
Now he will reply that he did not say exactly that which I have attributed to him... or not, (just to be contrary). :shades:
I moved out of the way, and sure enough he pulls into the driveway. So much for courtesy!
It's the exact same thing I would do if no one was following me. If you are following someone and want to pass and the speed limit increases you should wait to see what speed they increase to before attempting the pass.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I hesitate to take the side of the more aggressive drivers because I don't fall into that category. However, I am not a fan of drivers who try to control speeders. Nor am I a fan of LLCs, some of whom fall into the previous category.
Snake: When you say, "It's the exact same thing I would do if no one was following me", you kind of make their point. In general, a considerate driver does things differently when someone else is around. In this case, delaying your acceleration a few seconds allows the car to pass safely. I don't have a good argument for the times that others go slower than you on the straights. I've rarely, if ever, seen that happen.
The fog story reminds me of similar situations. The one and only time I passed someone like that was a long time ago. I learned my lesson. As soon as I passed I was amazed at how tough it was to drive while leading. I've had it happen to me many times since and just figure they were learning their lesson as I had. And as someone already said, I get to relax while they blaze the trail.
Washington has the delay of 5 vehicles law:
RCW 46.61.427
On a two-lane highway where passing is unsafe because of traffic in the opposite direction or other conditions, a slow moving vehicle, behind which five or more vehicles are formed in a line, shall turn off the roadway wherever sufficient area for a safe turn-out exists, in order to permit the vehicles following to proceed. As used in this section a slow moving vehicle is one which is proceeding at a rate of speed less than the normal flow of traffic at the particular time and place.
Notice that it doesn't mention speed limit, but normal flow of traffic, etc.
With that being said, if you pull over, I will wave my thanks to you... just as most people wave to me when I pull over.... whether there are 5 cars or not. Everybody's happy and no one has to take a deep breath or get aggravated.
Thank your for pointing that out. And here I was thinking I was the only one that noticed that Snake admits he is an inconsiderate driver when others are around him, and he's basically admitting to driving oblivious to what other drivers do around him and will drive as he always does, disregarding what traffic is doing around him. No consideration for what the other drivers are doing.
I'm glad I wasn't the only one that caught onto this.
I was just making a suggestion in this one instance. I know enough not to argue with him 'cause it would go on for years.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I jest, but seriously, on what authority do you make such a statement?
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I've never heard that before. However, I didn't know a change in the official speed limit was involved in the scenario you were describing a few posts back.
I thought you were talking about roads that had curves with no change in speed limit... except for maybe the yellow advisory signs. Those are roads that I encounter all the time when traveling. Someone may drive the speed limit or higher on the straight sections but slow down on the curved sections. I think those folks should let cars pass on the straight sections because there are just going to be more curves ahead.
Now in your example (with changing speed limits), if you are consistent (driving the SL, 5 over, or whatever) on the curves and on the straight, that's fine. However, if you drive the SL on the curves and accelerate to drive 5 or 10 over on the straights, that's a little inconsiderate, IMHO. Even worse would be someone who drives under the speed limit on the curves and refuses to let others pass easily when they get the chance.
So you have nothing to back up your opinion aside from the fact that your golf pro agrees. Okay, fine. :P
Well, guess what, you smug, self-righteous know-it-all, my state's code doesn't mention that a driver has to pull over when any specific number of vehicles is following. It does mention that drivers who are driving below the speed limit should pull over and let other vehicles around if they are impeding "the normal and reasonable movement of traffic". I was aware of that. It is common courtesy to not impede traffic. I was questioning your oddly specific statement that "5" is the magic number.
Thanks.
Maybe 5 is a State specific thing, including California. I think five is way too high, personally. I think the law should be 2 or 3.
It is entirely generous because if you have 5 cars behind you, then you are driving way too slow and causing a convoy of gridlock.
I personally subscribe to the "move over when safe to do so" for ONE over taking (in the left or #1 lane) car. I also realize I might be in a very small minority.
Based on posts here, Alaska, California, and Washington have the "5" rule. I'm sure other states must have it, especially in the west. The number may not be five though.
After reading some article, I'm not sure Alaska considers it against the law if the lead car is going the speed limit. I don't know how CA interprets it but I posted WA's version earlier.
Nearly all of our roads are two-lane (one in each direction) and most are more windy than straight, so it is important to be courteous to other drivers in order to keep traffic flowing smoothly. Unfortunately, we have more than our fair share of those who are not. :sick:
That's the way it is in PA. Even the law itself states that impeding traffic is only pertinent if below the speed limit. Even with that qualification, I still see drivers leading parades down the road, traveling under the speed limit. I would guess tickets are issued very infrequently.
I guess it annoys me because I do tow trailers, and have cracked my shin on my own once in a while... usually just after I put it in place and am loading the vehicle prior to attaching a trailer. Not that I habitually walk that close to other vehicles, but laziness annoys me in general, and leaving an unused ball attached is just lazy.
I have seen a number of references to keeping right unless passing or driving above the "normal flow" but nothing that says it is ok to drive at the limit in the left lane. Based on the code below, it seems to contradict what you have said.
The best reference I can find is:
S3313(d)(1)(ii). When traveling at a speed greater than the traffic flow.
If you're leading a paradel, you are certainly NOT traveling at a speed greater than the flow, and should move over
http://www.dmv.state.pa.us/pdotforms/vehicle_code/chapter33.pdf
The law states that the fine is "at least" $100. Seems like a good enough excuse to enforce it! A driver in this state generally has to be going 10 mph or more over the limit to hit that threshold.
Or if I just stay in the right lane, people expect me to either slow down or speed up to allow them to merge, even though it's their job to merge into my lane and not the other way around.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
For me, driving on the Seward Highway was actually a good experience, I've seen a lot of people move over when someone came up behind them if they could do so safely. Being from the East coast it was a pleasure to see this happen, as it is almost non-existent here. I found myself pulling over quite a bit as I was doing some sightseeing, it is amazing up there.
I took a picture of one of the signs that says something to the effect of "more than 5 cars behind you is illegal". Unfortunately it was somewhat dark and my picture is blurry, wish I could find it again.
http://www.howwedrive.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/goingtopass.jpg
I was looking at the subject (Left lane domination?) and figured there was more than one lane in the same direction.