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PF Flyer
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In CA, anyway, on three lanes in one direction or more, it is against the law for trucks to use beyond the two most right lanes.
As I origianally said. This all seemed to work VERY well.
PF Flyer
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This is why I'm somewhat reluctant to move out of 3rd lane for LLDominators. It's hard to get back into the faster traffic where I and lots of others were doing fine. I commented earlier about this and was roundly chastised by a few, but getting back over is a problem at high traffic times.
PF: What states did you drive through going to Indianapolis and didn't see a truck in the left lane of two lane interstates?
It surely wasn't Ohio. That's a favorite problem on two-lane portions of I70 in Ohio, especially since the truck speed limit is 55.
It sure wasn't Ohio.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
"Especially in light of the fact that ONLY trucks were being pulled over."
While you highlight left lane violation causality, the fact of the matter is that trucks are subject to more and different enforcement procedures. i.e., not necessarily left lane use! So unless you know specifically they were pulled over for left lane violations, it is most probably the gambit of "more and different" enforcement procedures.
While this may be off topic or unrelated to your concerns and strictly anecdotal, of the 12 western states and three eastern states, and bc,CN I have driven in 2003, AZ truckers have tended to "loligag" far more frequently and longer in their so called passing lane than any other places and by a LARGE MARGIN. (then again the interstate speed limit is 75 mph.)
A few years ago we had some trucks lose their load and a few trucks accidents along western Ohio's I70; troopers were all over the place for months checking loads and stopping the speeders.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I would say I'm a bit of a driving-technique snob. I have a very complicated, involving system of driving(especially freeway driving), and to be honest, by MY standards, I would consider most of my friends and family to be fairly lousy drivers (as I observe when riding with them).
It just seems to me that people in general simply don't pay attention and never look below the surface of a given driving scenario.
edit: btw, I am referring to driving judgement and decision-making(when to pass, etc., when to change lanes), not driving SKILL(parallel parking, bad weather handling). Actually I'd say I'm only about average when it comes to driving skill.
PF Flyer
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I have found that I-95 in NC and SC there is lane discipline. The exact opposite is true for VA and North.
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PF Flyer
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If only other 4WD operators went by the same train of thought. There are others like me. I even see them out there in the blizzard every once ina while. but Joe or jane Soccer in the newest range rover or pathfinder seem to think that 4WD is a license to think that their tires are made of glue and travel at atrocious velocites in the white stuff. I am sure I will see more of them this week when the philly area get some more snow.
Just had to vent.
Regards,
Kyle
As long as they are in the "right" lane. Right?
Kyle
Driving 5-10 below the limit(even if in the right lane in a 4 lane(2 in each dir) highway) does create problems when the the flow of traffic is 5-10+ over the limit. For one, that much of a speed differential is not a good thing. For another, you will see a caravan of truckers trying to pass those guys , thereby blocking the left lane for several miles.
Kyle
I was out early this morning in the snow driving at what I considered an appropriate speed for conditions, about 15mph on a city street, when a BMW veered past me on the wrong side of the road doing more than twice that. I suppose he thought the superior handling of his vehicle meant he could drive the normal speed limit on a snow covered road. I guess despite what truck bashers say, us 4x4 drivers aren't the only ones who get overconfident in our vehicles in inclement weather.
I drive real fast in the snow in my SUV because my eyesight is failing. I want to spend the minimum amount of time on the road. ;-)
It's amusing to see them off the road, often with their vehicle twisted because they're straddling a ditch, or with dents. I can drive slower and get there with my FWD and good tires than they do with their "Special" SUV or BMR or Volvo. I've been passed by some and then found them miles up the road on their cell phone.
One passed in 28 degree snow on the interstate in middle lane which had a layer that hadn't been cut through by truck wheels as much as the right lane. He spun out about 300 yards in front of me, with a truck in the right hand lane coming up on him as he was backwards in the right lane before his SUV slid back toward the median.
I bet the 20s something needed a change of underware. I would have. But I wasn't driving 65 on warm snow with ice crystals from sleet on it...
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
On a beautiful sunny day I'm rolling down the freeway getting ready to pass two semi's. The speed limit is 75 and I'm going about 78; the two semi's are going about 65. Well, just as I come up on the second semi, he decides to change lanes on an incline. I have to drop my speed to a quick 60 mph and follow him as he slowly inches past the first semi. I just don't understand it!
The third semi that was keeping up with me is now running up on my tail.....what can I do? I wanted so bad to do something but my little SUV is no comparison to an 80,000 lb. rig. So, I just follow the "Snail of a rig" until he finally passes #1 semi and then I speed up to my normal speed. No hand gestures or horn were used to show my displeasure.... I just chalk it up to a stupid inconsiderate trucker.
Just to let you know, I'm very considerate of truckers, giving them plenty of room and flashing my lights to let them in. I don't stay in their blind spots or run up on their tails. I give them plenty of room.
I feel better now. Mark
Didn't you notice I was having a little fun with the other posters ? Didn't you see ;-)
at the end ?
Gotcha, on snow covered roads I was doing about 40, when an Xterra (passed) blew by me, must've been doing about 70. Some people are just looking to wrap themselves up in a tree.
Check internet and yahoo yellow pages when you get home and call the company. ASk for safety department or general manger or owner...
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Here in NJ we had a bit of a storm yesterday, and I had to drive home from work in it a bit late (around 1AM) and on the roads last night the *real* dangers I came across were the slow people. I-287 and I-80 were decently plowed so it was certainly possible to cruise at 50 or so with no risk, and that's about how fast the flow of traffic was.
But when someone doing 20 mph with their hazards gets on and moves right out into the middle of the road (where it's most clear), right in front of a 50 mph 18-wheeler... *that* is when I get scared.
If you're afraid of driving in snow, or your tires are baldies you can't afford to replace, or you can't figure out how to use your climate control system properly so your windows are too solidly-fogged up to see out of... STAY TO THE RIGHT.
PF Flyer
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this is typical. snowing htis morning, some guy is poking along, resulting in a long trail of vahicles behind. road expands from 1 lane to 3 at intersection(1 left turn only, 2 can go straight ahead). light turns red as we approach the intersection.
being about 10 cars behind, i pull to the right and end up even with the car at the light. the left turn lane gets a green arrow, and the car starts to go through the light(doesn't want me to pass him!). he keeps trying to edge through. our light turns green, his tires go up in a cloud of snow.
I learned to drive in the snow, when all the cars were big old RWD behemoths. Your snow braking was pumping the brakes manually. Locking the brakes on snow was simply not done.
I now have a Toyota 4Runner. It has ABS, Vehicle Skid Control, 4WD, and 4 wheel disks. It goes really well in the snow. I do realize that it weighs 4300 lbs and I'm not going to stop it in the snow as well as some lighter vehicles. It has significant inertia.
PF Flyer
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That sort of experience, being put in a controlled fashion in a situation where the car loses grip to learn what it feels like and how to react, will serve you well in any manner of situations (light rain- oily roads, heavy rain- standing water/hydroplaning, dirt/gravel) and IMO people who don't have that experience don't really know how to drive.
My scenario:
I'm cruising 100-110 on a rural interstate in dry conditions during daylight hours. As I pull up on a slower car I drop to a passing speed of say 10-15 mph faster than the slower car. I fall into the left lane, complete my pass, and proceed as before.
How is that endangering said car? This is a long straight SE region freeway with great visibility all around. Some guy acted like I was out to get him personally.
Somehow I was called dangerous, road rage and other names but no one could come up with a valid reason why they felt that way that would fit the scenario above.
Just curious what you guys think.
If you are afraid of oncoming objects, front or rear, to the point it effects your driving, I would say you may be a pretty dangerous driver. There are lots of things that have that great a speed difference or more.
And don't tell me speed becomes deadly when its over the legal limit. Different sections of the country have different speed limits. Ive seen everything from 55 to 75. So I think it's safe to say to try to use legal limits as the argument point for what's a safe and appropriate speed would be absurd. Otherwise, if you're traveling on a road with a 65 mph speed limit and you're doing right at the limit, if you suddenly pass through a section where the limit goes down 10 mph but you maintain 65, are you suddenly transformed from a safe driver to a menace by that white sign?
OR maybe it all goes back to that primal instinct some people have to impose their own speed on everyone else, ie 'my speed is the safest speed. I am driving the maximum amount over the limit that is safe and prudent because I know best, and anybody who passes me is therefore driving dangerously.' Wasn't that like an old George Carlin joke?
No speed limits are used to judge when a policeman can give you a ticket for speeding or not. How much that speeding ticket will cost you in court and how much your insurance will rise.
We can take the rules of the road and whittle them down so they become trivialities at best. We start with speed limits, move on to stop signs, move on to stop before right on red, move on to red lights, move on to ignoring pedestrians in cross-walks, trucks in left lanes speeding and tailgating, etc. One thing leads to another. Fairly soon we have anarchy on the roads. Some parts of the country are already like this. The most dangerous intersection in the country, Bell Rd at 59th. Pheonix.
Three lane road, center lane left turn only. Moderate to light traffic. Looking ahead I see a line of four cars coming the other way, and somedistance behind them, I see the flashing lights of a police SUV/emergency vehicle. Nobody behind me, so I slow a bit and slide to my right just in case the police vehicle needs the room. The first three cars in line see the lights behind them and start to hit the road shoulder and stop. The last car in line continues along his merry way, blissfully ignoring the lights, and now sirens behind him as the police car is forced to slow up behind him. I don't know if he ever got over, but he didn't for as long as I could see him in the rearview mirror. Incredible.
PF Flyer
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And when you can prove that "speed kills" on a clear, dry, lightly traveled interstate highway, let us know. I hate to break it to you, but 85-90 mph under those conditions is hardly "too fast" these days.
Let me re-state my case...
First of all, lets restrict our discussion to someone driving over 100 mph on an dry, rural interstate during the day in low traffic conditions.
It is true that most of the time you will not harm anyone by driving like this and that many modern cars are capable of handling well at those speeds.
My point is that, at those speeds, any unexpected occurence can be deadly. A small lapse in attention such as changing the radio station, looking at a navigation screen, radar detector going off, even cell phone use can take your attention off the road long enough for the car to drift or for the driver to not see an obstacle. Now I am not accusing you of doing any of these things while you are driving this fast, maybe you are and maybe you're not. My point is that I am sure some people are combining driving this fast with other poor driving habits.
Even if you are paying attention, are you paying attention to the road or are you spending too much time looking for cops on the side of the road?
Then there is the issue of unforeseen events - stalled cars, accidents, construction, pot holes, road debris, slick spots, animals (large and small), etc. And don't forget about mechanical problems including tire failure which is potentially much more catastrophic at that kind of speed.
As I said on the last board when this discussion came up, I work in an emergency department and actually see the consequences of motor vehicle accidents at this speed. Very few people walk away without serious injuries. Including those that thought they were driving safely when they just "lost control" of the vehicle.
Hopefully if you do crash while driving like this, there will be no other vehicles involved.
I have already ruled out what most experts consider the most deadly part of the equation by lowering the speed differential. After that both cars are in the same boat when it comes to the "what if" scenario. We are equally at risk while we are passing. After that, I am no longer a risk for the other car. At least not any more risk than a car doing 75 passing a car doing 65.
The unforeseen events are pretty much a none issue during the day. I don't know about where you are from but in the Southeast most of our freeways are pretty well kept and have a HUGE median area. Even at 100 mph nothing on the highway just jumps out of the blue. You have at least 1/2 to a mile visibility.
Why put H,V,Z rated tires on cars and then be afraid to drive nowhere near the speed rating for fear of tire failure? That makes no sense. If all cars wore S(110)-rated tires people would go crazy.
My engine may seize, my windshield my pop out, I may have a heart attack, all those would be catastrophic at speeds much less than 100. And probably more difficult to recover from. We can what if all day.
My question was how my driving at that speed would endanger the OTHER driver in my scenario. But the previous post was full of what-ifs that would endanger ME. I am fully aware of the dangers of going triple digit speeds. I am aware of the consequences of inattention and carelessness. But when I show the courtesy of slowing and passing at a reasonable speed, I am just another car on the road. No danger to the other car. If a few miles down the road my car flips and kills all occupants, that's not any more your business than smoker's lungs or alcoholic's livers. I choose to take that risk and have to live with it.
The EMS, the trip to the hospital perhaps by helicopter, the cost of the trauma team, the cost of maintaining a trauma suite, those all are my business. The cost of facilites for foolish, teenage indiscretions is a problem shared by all. Hence the society has put in place laws about speeding.
This begins to sound a little like the pot argument: a little never hurts anyone, but then a little more must be okay because a little doesn't hurt, then a little more speed, then a little more speed and soon the person can't go back to normal life. They can't see the problem is there with speeding in gross amount.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
The problem is there is no practical way to discriminate about its use or even lack of use. How would denying these services to speeders/drunk drivers (to punish speeders/drunks who cause wrecks), for an example be?
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Again, as you probably know, Euro has had in a lot of places "no speed limits" on its autobahn's. Does that mean that Euro has no rules? Hardly; one they do live by and enforce is: Keep Right Except to Pass! Or its corollary rule: slower traffic keep right! It has had these procedures at least since the autobahn's were rebuilt with the aid of the American taxpayer after WW2, or approximately 55-59 years. What you may find amazing, (in light of this FEAR of speed and speeding) is that Euro has almost the identical per capital/mile etc fatality rate as the USA. As a point of reference continental Euro is 260 M vs the USA of 275M.
I've read several pages of posts in this topic of "inconsiderate drivers" who have a much more statistical chance of taking other drivers out with thier behavior. Most states don't ticket cell phone users. Most states don't ticket make-up appliers, newspaper readers, coffee drinkers, or hamburger eaters. As long as they are doing the "speed limit".
We are obviously never gonna agree if you think my 100 mph all alone on an open freeway is more dangerous than those situations.
All rescue costs will be covered by the insurance that my state requires me to pay. I've been paying for 16 years with no claims. I've paid for that by now I'm sure. Heck if the government can send 80 billion to Iraq, they can spend a couple grand to scrape my butt off the freeway.
I know several casual pot smokers who have very important and lucrative positions. If it were that obvious that someone were a pot-head they wouldn't have to spring pop tests. They would just point you out in the crowd. Legalize it and the losers will weed (he he) themselves out like they do anyway.
Finally.
"Perhaps a tax on alcohol,[there is] smoking materials,[they tax tobacco heavily] fast cars,[insurance surcharges] drivers under ## years of age, [insurance surcharges] would help to pay for what others consider no one else's business."
I'm still not seeing where my behaviour is endangering other driver's LIFE though. At least not any more than any other hazard on the freeway. Actually I'm more afraid of the "speed police" defenders. They are in a constant state of paranoia on the road. Tire blowouts, potholes, stray animals...I bet it's hard driving when you are petrified about darn near EVERYTHING.
http://www.magma.ca/~fyst/appndxd.htm
When traffic is heavy, speeds are regulated by the simple fact that it is impossible to go much much faster than 10 miles over the limit. There are just too many vehicles on the road - in all lanes - to really "put the pedal to the metal."
When traffic is light, yes, more people drive faster, but so what? The roads and vehicles can handle it.
And most of the boneheaded moves I see are not pulled by the fastest drivers. The dangerous ones are the drivers who think that, because they are obeying the speed limit, it gives them license to loaf in the passing lane, never signal before a lane change, switch lanes without checking the rear-view mirror, yack on the cell phone, read a book, eat a Big Mac, pick their nose, etc.
When something bad happens, these drivers invariably whine about "speeders."