Honda Civic - Type R

kroliph

Honda Civic - Type R

kroliph

I keep reading about the possibility of the Civic Type R coming to the US after the RSX Type R arrives. The RSX Type R will have 220 HP and the Civic type R will have 200 HP. Has anyone else heard anything about this?

riopelle

claims that Honda said they would definitely bring the 200 hp Honda Civic SiR over for the 2004 model year. Check out the sidebar to the Desert Foxes article in March's C&D. It doesn't seem to be on the website but here's the link. I'm already saving my pennies...

www.caranddriver.com/xp/Caranddriver/comparisontests/2002/march/200203_comparo_foxes.xml?&page=3

revdrluv

Huh? How will that compare in price to the RSX type S and are they still going to bring the RSX type R?

deplorableone

I have heard reports of the price tentativly set at around 22,000 for the Si-r or even higher. IMO way too much for a civic but I wouldn't know until I see it. That puts it around the RSX price which again IMO would be a better buy. I guess we'll see after the RSX-R and SiR get here.

kroliph

I've seen pictures of the Civic Type R and think it looks much better than the RSX. I think the RSX looks too much like a Chevy Cavalier. Even close to $22,000, it is a pretty interesting package.

revdrluv

No way. The Type-R is OK, but not any better than the RSX. Now, the RSX type-R looks the best.

verozahl

Looks like a Chevrolet Cavalier?! HUH?

kroliph

Looks aside, The Civic hatchback seems to have more room for passengers and space under the hatckback than the RSX. I have read reviews that have said that back seat head room is pretty bad in the RSX. Since they are both built on the some platform, why not buy the one that can actually seat 4 people in relative comfort.

revdrluv

Who is saying the RSX and the Cavalier look the same? Cause they don't at all.

#9 The RSX is more of a sport coupe than a hatchback. You buy it more for the coupe looks than people carrying ability. Thats why Hot Hatchbacks are so cool. Performance and utility.

verozahl

Back seat in my Integra is fine for my brother, but not my cousin (I dunno, somewhere around 5'-7" ?)... RSX must be similar. The Integra and RSX have hatchback utility in a coupe format. Schweet.

The Civic coupe needs to be considered as such. If there's no hatchback utility, it should be styled as a coupe... and hence the Type R should be a 'sport coupe.'

I don't think the Civic Type R is coming... the RSX Type R and Civic Si are. That's the news I have heard.

kroliph

I read someplace that because the RSX Type R will have 220 HP that clears the way for the Civic Type R w/ 200 HP. It is pretty obvious that this is all just speculation. I can't count the number of times I have heard the Civic Type R is coming and have not seen one yet at a dealer. I'm not sure why, but Honda is very reluctant to dominate the Hatchback market. The RSX Type R and Civic Type R would pretty much put Honda on top for the foreseeable future.

verozahl

Same way that Nissan should bring its other sports cars over here. Oh well, buy a 2002 Civic EX and play with it (hahaha). I have yet to see a new Si.

kroliph

Actually, from the pictures I have seen, I think the Civic Type R looks allot better than the Si. But I'm sure the price will be allot more as well. But, I don't think we will have to worry about that. Nothing short of a miracle will get the Type R to our shores.

verozahl

How about a bunch of Honda fans screaming that the Civic EX is a grandmamobile, and that Nissan's on a performance roll with their new coupes?

kroliph

This is definitely off subject. I also heard a rumor that Honda is considering offering a new prelude on a stretched version of the S2000 platform. This makes sense when you consider that Honda will stop producing the S2000 in a year on two. By using the S2000 platform, they will certainly save development costs and will be left with one heck of a sporty coupe. And therefore spread out the development costs of the S2000 platform over two models. This coupe will compete quite nicely w/ RX-8. Just think Civic Type R, RSX type R, and new prelude, Honda would be back in the game!!! Without the S2000, Honda would not even know where the game was at this point.

verozahl

S2000 platform? I don't want a smaller Prelude.

kroliph

I understand the S2000 will be lengthened to accommodate the new prelude. In any case, if Honda decides the do it, it will be a very competitive w/ other vehicles in class. Besides, a rear drive prelude sounds interesting. The ability to carry 4 people is a nice feature as well. By building a coupe, maybe they will be able to lighten the platform a little. I read that the new BMW Z5 will only weigh 2200-2300 lbs.

kroliph

Just read Edmunds comparison of Civic Si and Focus SVT. Sounds like Honda has lost it's way. Maybe SVT knows this market better than Honda now. I knew I should have bought that 2000 Civic Si when I had the chance!!!

Honda needs the type R here now more than ever!!!

verozahl

Honda, get a clue. Dumping the Si, Integra, and Prelude all at once in 2000-2001 was not smart.

Bring the Type-R over. The Si is a poseur and gets Focus fanatics all uppity. I should know, I live in FordFanaticLand.

Not that the RSX is bad. I like the RSX, but it does not say 'ohhhh, you are a stupid idiot for buying a 2001 Integra LS for $3K below MSRP.' It was a great deal. The RSX has auto climate control and keyless entry standard and sells right around MSRP. It needs a center console and body side molding.

Prelude is what I want to see... sixth generation Prelude should also be a Type-R. Let's get rid of all the poseurs, eh? Prelude Type-R would be the trick!

kroliph

Yes, I definitely agree. Honda needs some sort of new Sports Coupe. The danger is to pander to as many people as possible by offering a watered down coupe on the Accord or Civic platform (Civic SI). Honda needs to offer a no excuses sports coupe on the S2000 platform. Honda certainly has the technology now to dominate that niche market at an affordable price. The S2000 is awesome, but the price to join is a little high and allot of us need to be able to seat 4 people. Honda could also think about a 4 passenger convertible on S2000 platform. Now that would be one fun car!!! Oh well, Honda is just too busy pandering to the masses.

sunilb

Anyone want to guess at how much Honda will price the CTR in the U.S. at? In contrast, how much do you think it's worth?

My guesses are that they will price it around $22.5K (slightly lower than RSX-S, due to A/C being optional and no sunroof). Of course, I'd prefer to see it at $20K.

bococartoons

I read an article about the civic type-R @ www.sportcompactcarweb.com. in Europe the car is going for between 20k and 22k. They say that they have heard rumors about it arriving in the US in 2003. Here's the website for the article:

http://www.sportcompactcarweb.com/archives/features/feature01_0502.shtml

kroliph

Great article at the above link. I really hope Honda can bring the car over at a competitive price. I think 20-22k would be fine. I hope they offer the Sunroof and A/C as an option. I actually really enjoy a sunroof. If they can't keep the pricing below 22K, I'll have to give the Impreza WRX the nod. I'm not going to hold my breath waiting for the Civic Type R though.

riopelle

Awesome article Boco. Honda never should have bothered with the current Si, but just have brought over the CTR badged as an Si. It makes no sense to me to sell two different Si's, and two, or even three, RSX's. Maybe Honda will just upgrade the SI with parts from the CTR bin for the new model year.

Hmmm, I happen to think the RSX looks a lot like a Cavalier, albeit better looking.

I saw an Si with 16's this weekend, they helped it's looks a LOT.

kroliph

I don't understand all the different variations of RSX. I understand the need to market the product to as many people as possible. I also do not understand why Integra name was dropped. Talk about name recognition!! Most people I talk to don't know difference between TL, RL, RSX, MDX. If you say Acura SUV, then they know. I'm sure that horse has been beaten to death in the Town Hall though. Anyway, one of these days I'll get around to driving the Si. I'm not going to buy one until Honda actually steps up to the plate and takes a swing not just show up at the game. 16-17 inch wheels and the 6-speed from CTR would have been the minimum needed to generate interest. Honda, please surprise us in 2003. I have read that 2004 will be the last year for S2000. After that, I don't see any reason to visit a Honda dealer!!! Unless you want to be bored to tears.

kroliph

Took a very nice test drive in the Si on Saturday. I like the Hatchback styling. The engine has all the typical Honda goodness. (Although, I do miss that VTEC engagement on the previous model.) I think it has one of the smoothest 5-speeds Honda has ever made. The rally style shifter is great. The seats provide great support. But the handling is a real disappointment. A real oversight by Honda. I can deal with the fact that Honda produces more interesting versions of this car for other markets if they would have made this a fun to drive. My old 1991 Protege was more fun to drive with less HP! The previous version had much better handling and was certainly more interesting to drive. Honda has all the parts right. They just need to button this thing down and make it out-handle all other Civics before it!

After the test drive, I explained my thoughts to the dealer. He was honest and told me that 4 local Honda dealerships have a total of about 15 of these things for a couple of weeks and have been only able to sell 2!!! I told him it didn't surprise me. The Si is not priced far from the RSX type-S. I told him I would just spend $3000 more and get one of those. Or the WRX, MP-3, SVT Focus, and did you read the new review of the Dodge Neon SRT-4. Now some of you may be thinking how could you compare a Dodge to a Honda. The point I'm trying to make is that there is allot of other choices out there now. Honda needs to do something interesting with the Si to separate themselves from the rest. The Si is too important a product for Honda! Now it is just another car like any other. I'd rather have a fun handling MP-3 than a sloppy Si. Look for a good used Civic Si on Prelude and remember the fun cars Honda used to make for us. HONDA, BRING THE CTR BEFORE IT IS TOO LATE!!!!!!!

I did learn something new though, Honda is bringing an Accord Type R, w/ 6-speed manual. Unfortunately it will probably cost 30,000.

nippononly

There are a lot of cars in this market now to compete with civic SI, and this car does not impress enough with its handling, at least from what I read in the press. Of course, I am sure that if they brought type R here it would have none of the compromises for the masses that the SI does, but in that case it is true that the price might be too high to sell well. I mean if type R and RSX-R are a couple of thousand $$ apart, which would you buy really? I'd go the extra $2K and get the extra 20 hp and stuff in the RSX-R. And what ABOUT the WRX? And other models in that price range as well.

seminole_kev

I don't think the CTR would have to be overpriced. In the UK the Civic Type-R is the same price as a Focus ST170 (basically a SVT Focus that sells here cheaper than the Civic Si). Either Honda's eating a huge loss in the UK market, or they've way overpriced the Si for the U.S. market.

nippononly

the civic SI is priced as high as it is because they have to build it there then ship it over? I heard the only place they are building SI's is in the UK. Problem is, ultimately they can't price the SI the same as the type R, because one will totally undercut the other, in which case CTR is going to be on the order of $21-22K at least, wouldn't you say? Or maybe they will lower the price of the SI in its second model year?

sigirl

I heard something about JDM TypeR bodykits available in Canada? Anyone hear about that?

kroliph

Just saw a copy of Motortrend and they said the Civic Type R was coming in 2004?! I hope this is true. The Si was such a dissapointment for the price. Lets hope they keep alll the good stuff such as 6-speed, 17in wheels and limited slip differential. My money is on them not bringing it over though.