Subaru Crew Cafe

1305306308310311343

Comments

  • xwesxxwesx Member Posts: 17,728
    edited October 2010
    That's a nice lookin' car! Every single line on that thing flows effortlessly to the next. I am especially impressed by the hood lines, which flow down into the grille. That is some fine attention to aesthetic detail.

    No manual yet again; what a shame.

    Also, is it roomier in here today, or is it just the echo that makes it seem that way? :P
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 2013 Ford F250 Lariat D, 1976 Ford F250, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    No manual yet again; what a shame.

    It may still come, plus can the front wheels handle that much torque?

    Aren't they supposed to make a wagon?

    Add AWD and Subaru execs will have sleepless nights...
  • xwesxxwesx Member Posts: 17,728
    edited October 2010
    If they make it a wagon and offer a manual, I'd be very tempted for my DD. I wouldn't mind an AWD system on it, but for my personal driver, I could live without it as I do now.

    For the record, the headlights on that Sonata are how Subaru should have done the Legacy if they really wanted the "stretched" look.
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 2013 Ford F250 Lariat D, 1976 Ford F250, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    A turbo'd Tucson would be fun.

    The new Santa Fe will probably get the same V6 (276hp) as the Sorento, but mpgs suffer.
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    It's mentioned in the latest issue of DRIVE magazine, which I got yesterday.

    http://www.drive.subaru.com/Fall10/2011preview.htm

    They must have gotten a lot of complaints.

    Bob
  • miksmimiksmi Member Posts: 1,246
    edited October 2010
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Long time, no see, mike. Still got the GT?

    Funny ad campaign, for sure.
  • miksmimiksmi Member Posts: 1,246
    Hey juice, still got the GT. I'll be looking for a replacement in 2-3 years time (ok, I'm always looking at new rides.) I wish Subaru wagon rear ends were squared off like a V70 or an SUV. Is there anything these days with mechanical AWD (i.e., AWD not implemented by applying brakes a la traction control)? My 00 GT has a viscous coupling center differential and rear limited slip differential. It seems everyone is going away from that, including Subaru.

    ..Mike

  • kurtamaxxxguykurtamaxxxguy Member Posts: 1,798
    edited October 2010
    Now that Subaru's introduced a new NA boxer 4 engine, hopefully they will add a turbo version in 2012.
    A 5-speed AT or CVT would also be welcome.
  • xwesxxwesx Member Posts: 17,728
    Are you planning (hoping?) to upgrade your '09 with a newer version of the same? Also, how are the Nokian tires doing and are you going to replace them before winter?
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 2013 Ford F250 Lariat D, 1976 Ford F250, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Yep, the limited slips are going, being replaced by e-diffs.

    At least both axles are "managed" by VDC.
  • lucien2lucien2 Member Posts: 2,984
    what's being used on the upcoming Countryman? I'm smitten by the little guy.
  • colin_lcolin_l Member Posts: 591
    This works perfectly fine for normal cars, but isn't suitable to high performance models that will see time on the dragstrip, race track, autocross, or serious off-road use.

    I'll say it another way:

    A Legacy GT doesn't need a rear limited slip. :)
  • kurtamaxxxguykurtamaxxxguy Member Posts: 1,798
    There's nothing I can find right now that would make sense for replacing the '09 XT. The '11's XT's have no change in drive train, and the new "touring" features are nice but not worth spending $10 - 14 K to trade my now used 'bu in. If on '12 they introduce a new powertrain, that would be interesting.

    There's a new Audi dealer a short distance from my home, but there's nothing XT equivalent from Audi in the USA (the A4 Allroad would be a viable contender, but it's euro only). Audi's are very low to the ground, which would be problematic in the snows we get in Portland OR (last two years my 'bu drove around a lot of stuck German cars). BTW the first car the new Audi dealer sold was an R10 for around $180K (sold before the showroom opened to the public !!).

    The Nokian WRG2's are doing ok with probably 1 - 2 years more use before they wear down to their winter tread warnings.
  • tsytsy Member Posts: 1,551
    That's easy Kurt- get an STI! ;)

    I am really disappointed in Subaru's continued use of a 4spd auto. Heck, I'm disappointed Honda only has a 5 speed!

    I must say the 7 spd auto in my G37 is really nice. As much as I like to drive stick, I can humbly say this tranny would be able to shift faster than I can with perfect rev match downshifts everytime all with me just flicking the magnesium paddles next to the steering wheel.

    I think the days of the manual transmission are numbered. :(

    Subaru had better get their act together with their trannys or find themselves on their heels like Toyota!

    tom
  • volkovvolkov Member Posts: 1,306
    do you have the x? Anyone know the AWD guts in the Infiniti? Just curious.
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    I'm not certain, but I believe it's based on what BMW uses in their AWD models. By that I mean conceptually, in that they don't just plop the system from the 328ix into the Mini, but rather use a system that's similar in format.

    Bob
  • miksmimiksmi Member Posts: 1,246
    hehe, thanks, Colin. Makes me feel a little better. Everyone I've spoken to that has them isn't impressed with them. Course, I don't know how they were using them.

    ..Mike

  • tsytsy Member Posts: 1,551
    edited October 2010
    Yes, it's a G37xS.

    The AWD system is Nissan's ATTESA-ETS similar to the one in the GT-R without the rear diff. It is set at 100% RWD until slip is detected. It uses an electronic center diff (Electronic Torque Split- hence ETS) that monitors slip 100x/sec and can transfer 50% of power to the front to a viscous diff- almost instantly.

    I have yet to test how good it is- just barely broke the engine in! Although it sounds like we're in for some snow this winter so I'll be able to tell you soon enough! But since the GT-R seems to do quite well with it's AWD system, I figured the G37x might be a reasonable AWD sedan.

    It's fun to drive and has quite a bit of grip- not quite as much as the STI but it also doesn't lean over like the STI did! It's got a ton more torque lower in the rev range and in some ways "seems" faster even though I know it's not. It's a much nicer car to live with on a day to day basis than the STI to be sure, but there are days I miss the STI. Not many though. ;)

    tom
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    edited October 2010
    I bet Mini uses a light version of X-drive for them.
  • tsytsy Member Posts: 1,551
    A "mini" version??? ;)
  • colin_lcolin_l Member Posts: 591
    *rimshot*

    :P
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    :D
  • tsytsy Member Posts: 1,551
    sorry, just couldn't resist!
    :D
  • lucien2lucien2 Member Posts: 2,984
    edited October 2010
    Trying to find a car that an enthusiast would like to drive every day AND that can accomodate a family of four is a bloody pain in the [non-permissible content removed], you know that? As the OB approaches its 12th birthday, I, being the doofy car guy I am, continually mull over what I would get if the thing had to be replaced. Which it will need to be, probably by 2013 if I am lucky.

    I have run the gamut, in my imagination. So far I have considered:
    GTi 5 door
    Elantra Touring
    Mini Countryman
    Outback
    used BMW 3 Wagon
    WRX 5 door
    Impreza 2.5i
    Jetta wagon
    Mazda3
    Mazdaspeed3
    Ford Fiesta (ya I know)
    2012 Ford Focus

    obviously this is a wildly disparate list. I make no apologies; it would be my daily commuter, since the MINI is Kirsten's. Some excel in driving dynamics, others in practicality, others in frugality, and others in utility. Not knowing what the financial future holds in these uncertain times, there exists a range in potential purchase price. It is what it is.

    The stupid MINI has ruined me. I want a car just like it, but the size of a `99 legacy wagon ;) I want a car with great handling, strong brakes, good economy, and off-beat styling. But that I can take the family on vacation in. And isn't a $35k BMW wagon. :surprise:

    Meh. Maybe I'll just get an Impreza 2.5i 5 door, slap on a sway bar and the SSR Comps (I still have those!) and call it a day.

    Thanks for listening. Nighty Night!
  • grahampetersgrahampeters Member Posts: 1,786
    G'day

    So, given the lifespan of the Outback, you will still want it to be exciting in 12 years! That narrows the list to :
    GTi 5 Door
    Mini Countryman
    Outback (possibly not this year's model which seems a bit "off"
    used BMW 3 wagon (you wouldn't would you!?
    WRX 5 door
    Impreza 2.5i
    Jetta wagon

    No Fords - they always end in tears. Like cute blondes, they are great to start with but get tired rapidly, particularly when you realize that the blonde colour is not natural...

    Mazdas might be a possibility but... have they made anything beautiful after the Bertone Luce (1500)

    The GTi is looking good.

    I just ready an article in CAR that reminded me of my love affair with a 1990 VW GTi Mk II 8v. Probably the most fun that you could legally enjoy on a sinuous road - sunroof open, windows down and Thin Lizzy on the stereo - heaven!

    But, like Jekyll and Hyde, a fabulous long distance tourer and fun city car.

    Cheers

    Graham
  • colin_lcolin_l Member Posts: 591
    Lucien,

    My first observation is that every vehicle you have mentioned is smaller than your current Outback, other than another Outback. Are you really sure with a family of four that you want to downsize, even if only slightly in some cases?

    I would consider the Sonata turbo, at the least, but it seems like the v6 Fusion and a host of other midsize sedans ought to be up for consideration. Personally, I'm not interested in a compact sedan for my family of 3.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    You're just like me, I wanted it all. Brand new and under $30k, too. I basically wanted a light, agile, roadster that could seat 8 and had 200+hp with 30mpg on regular fuel that was also reliable.

    It took me 2 cars to meet those criteria. :D

    Given you already have one Mini, I would really urge you to make the other vehicle the bigger trip-oriented car.

    Fiesta - no way no how, WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAy too small. My friend got one and I barely fit in the back seat, you have to move the driver's seat way up.

    Go sample a Mazda5. It's a super-sized Mazda3, and handles like a small car but mimicks a minivan (emphasis on mini).

    Since I looked at it, they gave it more power and a better transmission (5EAT w/manual control), and I think you can still get those in manuals if you want to go that far. It's a 4+2, but the +2 is fine for Q's instruments, or the port-a-crib, and later you can car pool the little tikes around (I bet you use the 6 seats at least once a week).

    A new one is coming and may be worth the wait, but these are dirt cheap bargains IMHO. Fitz has 3:

    Sport Auto: $16,173 (probably cheaper than that Fiesta)
    Touring Auto: $19,255
    Grand Touring Auto: $21,165

    That GT has leather, 17" alloys with V-rated tires, moonroof, LED tails, HIDs, electroluminescent gauges, 4 disc brakes, traction/stability control (finally), 6CD, bluetooth, and most importantly - 6 cup holders!

    That last part was a joke.

    Any how, to be perfectly honest, as a dad with 2 kids, that's absolutely as small as I'd even consider going for the primary trip/family car.

    Other options - another Outback, Passat Wagon.

    On your list I think the Jetta wagon TDI would be my pick.
  • robr2robr2 Member Posts: 8,805
    I''ll chime in.

    The Mazda 5 would probably be a great solution but IMHO, the 2011 redesign isn't that attractive.

    As for the Passat wagon, they are no longer offered. The Jetta Sportwagen (that's how they spell it) is based on the MKV - not the new MKVI - which many will say is a good thing.

    The new Focus 5 door looks like a winner.

    How about a Transit connect with the rear seat option?
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    edited October 2010
    Geez... Glad I'm an empty-nester, as I no longer have those "issues" to deal with,

    My guess is some sort of Euro-wagon will come the closest to filling Loosh's needs/desires.

    Bob
  • robr2robr2 Member Posts: 8,805
    Then grandchildren come along and you just might consider a minivan.
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    edited October 2010
    ^ No. That's the parent's problem, not the grandparent's problem. :)

    A minivan is not on my radar. Wouldn't mind a new Grand Cherokee, though...

    Bob
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Even the "big" cars you like aren't that big.

    Grand Cherokee isn't really any bigger inside than a Forester. Wider, perhaps.

    Lucien would need a Durango or Explorer in that class. ;)
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    edited October 2010
    "Grand Cherokee isn't really any bigger inside than a Forester. Wider, perhaps."

    But it can do so much more than a Forester, and is far more luxurious. Plus it's not saddled with an ancient 4-speed automatic. Yeah, it's pricier, but you get what you pay for.

    "Lucien would need a Durango or Explorer in that class."

    Only if he needs a third row seat.

    Bob
  • lucien2lucien2 Member Posts: 2,984
    edited October 2010
    Automatics are out of the question, unless it's something trick like DSG. I might...MIGHT...consider CVT.

    I think the Outback is currently underpowered in 2.5 guise. And I am not enthusiastic about the auto in the 3.6. Nor does it handle well on the road, or perform admirably in braking. I always have felt our OB had to work too hard with all of us plus a couple of bikes up. Hence my thinking that a WRX with a pod up top could be an agreeable compromise.

    Nonetheless, OB is likely where we'll go. I don't trust VW just yet.

    Once again as usual Lucien needs a 2.5GT manual wagon. And once again as usual, Subaru won't sell one when he needs it. :cry:

    So I'll be fixing the current car for another year, maybe two. And see what's on offer then, and how the budget looks.
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    What about a Forester manual? They're more fun to drive than an Outback.

    Bob
  • lucien2lucien2 Member Posts: 2,984
    are they? I mean, mine was, but now they've put on weight and gone mushy in the suspension. Or so says NASIOC ;)
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    I think if you drive the two back-to-back, you will find the Forester to be more fun, while the Outback more comfy.

    BTW, I drove a new '11 Forester Touring the other day. It was very nice (except for the automatic tranny). It certainly doesn't handle like my WRX, but it's much better than my wife's '01 Forester.

    Bob
  • colin_lcolin_l Member Posts: 591
    edited October 2010
    A four speed slushbox is definitely a major downer.

    But I'm happy to surrender my clutch. I won't miss it. I can row my own on 2 wheels. To me the most important factor in "fun to drive" is the horsepower and torque. I don't carve many canyons as a dad, not that Kansas is renowned for them anyway. :P. My evo has awesome brakes but I don't think it is a coincidence my stock pads lasted over 60k miles.

    So yeah. Power.

    Healthy six cylinder or turbo four, 5 or more speed auto of any type (dsg is damn cool, though), sedan or small/midsize ute. Done.
  • lucien2lucien2 Member Posts: 2,984
    I hear the gospel according to Colin :)

    Sedans are a non starter here. bikes, bike trailers, camping gear, musical equipment....our life is not a sedan life. wagon or mini ute.

    and after last winter, I gotta say, AWD is nice to add to the mix, although I suppose most of the time it's irrelevant.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Just got an e-mail from Acura about the TSX wagon, but they dogged that car with automatic-only. Dumb!

    Isn't Hyundai supposed to do a Sonata wagon? The 274hp turbo sedan runs $24k, a wagon would still be $25k or so. If they do, that would be a HECK of a bargain, a good $4k less than an H6 Outback.
  • robr2robr2 Member Posts: 8,805
    Just got an e-mail from Acura about the TSX wagon, but they dogged that car with automatic-only. Dumb!

    I'm sure market research showed that the 16 people interested in a TSX wagon with a manual didn't justify the certification costs. :) I know I'd like to see one.

    On another forum I visit, there were grumbles that Acura didn't bring the TSX wagon with the diesel and a manual - I'm sure the 2 poeple that would actually buy that combo will be happy with a Jetta.

    The Sonata may come as a wagon soon but AFAIK, Hyundai hasn't said anything.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Acura pitches that a sports sedan, so why not the wagon?

    The RD-X and MD-X don't come in manuals, so I don't think they have a single wagon bodystyle choice with one.
  • robr2robr2 Member Posts: 8,805
    They are pitching it as a sports wagon:

    http://www.acurainthenews.net/video-2011-acura-tsx-sport-wagon-ad-blitz-begins/#- more-102

    I know we think that sports means it should have a manual but Hondaphiles will be happy to get something. In reality, most of the competition doesn't offer a manual version either. No stick in the A4 Avant, the Jetta offers one only in the base or TDI models, there's no Legacy wagon offered, there is the 9-3 Sport Combi.
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    No manual to choose from is bad enough, but why no SH-AWD in this wagon, at least as an option? :cry:

    Bob
  • robr2robr2 Member Posts: 8,805
    Could the even offer it? The sedan is FWD only and I don't think it's something they can just toss in.
  • hammerheadhammerhead Member Posts: 907
    "Once again as usual Lucien needs a 2.5GT manual wagon. And once again as usual, Subaru won't sell one when he needs it."

    I know what you mean. Mine has 183k now, and my long-range crystal ball sees one, maybe two more Subarus in our future (Grace likes the Forester!) The 99 is going to need some work - the center diff is on its way out - but that's still cheaper than new, and there's nothing comparable in the Subaru lineup right now.

    I'm about 6 years away from retirement, so it would be nice to have a couple newer cars bought and paid for before I pull the pin.

    If we sell the trailer and go back to a (smaller than before) motorhome, we'd have no need for the towing capacity of the Suburban. The truck and/or a small trailer would suffice for our hauling needs.

    Cheers!
    Paul
  • lucien2lucien2 Member Posts: 2,984
    my sadness is that this one is rusting. For the last year it's been paint bubbling, but I noticed this month that it has finally broken through and is visible rust (driver's side rear quarter panel where the metal meets the plastic of the bumper skin). Otherwise she looks good and the interior is fine.

    183k? Ok good, that gets me to 2014! :)

    ugh. just got back from a hop in the MINI, I am hopelessly in love with the thing. Especially the brakes. I just hate the idea that, most of the time, I just drive myself to and from work in a car that gets 19mpg city. Whereas the Cooper gets 26 or so, goes fast, stops well enough to bruise your harness shoulder, and is so driver oriented- from headlight throw pattern to steering weight. Champagne tastes on a beer budget, as my college guidance counselor told me in high school. That hasn't changed, I guess.

    perhaps I should get another Mini, and plan on trading it off on a family car in 5-6 years when the kids hit the lanky stage and really demand more car.....? By then we'll know exactly what our needs are, Elie will be 12 and Axel will be 6. Forester 2.0D by then?
Sign In or Register to comment.

Your Privacy

By accessing this website, you acknowledge that Edmunds and its third party business partners may use cookies, pixels, and similar technologies to collect information about you and your interactions with the website as described in our Privacy Statement, and you agree that your use of the website is subject to our Visitor Agreement.