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I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today!

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  • I saw a little Renault sedan from the 60's on the road today... probably the size of a Geo Metro. It wasn't a Dauphine, I don't think.
  • andre1969andre1969 Posts: 23,880
    ...but I saw a Subaru hatchback yesterday, of late '70's/early '80's vintage. Same basic design that the Brat was based on. Considering the tendency of old Subes to rust, this one actually looked pretty solid.
  • seminole_kevseminole_kev Posts: 1,722
    was it a Justy?
  • andre1969andre1969 Posts: 23,880
    ...I haven't heard the name "Justy" or even seen one in years. Nah, this thing was older than that. I don't think it even had a name, just a series of letters, like "GL" or something like that.

    A co-worker of mine ages ago had a Justy. I remember changing a the valve cover gasket for her. I'll never forget it though, when we were in the parts store getting the gasket. It was a place that supposedly specialized in Japanese cars. I heard one of the workers in the back holler out something like "We got that starter in for the Mazda Pro-Teej?"
  • lemkolemko Philadelphia, PAPosts: 15,306
    Remember how Subaru would have the spare tire under the hood with the engine? Subarus used to be very popular in the town my parents live in NE Pennsylvania. There was a dealership called "The Little Foreign Car Shop" that sold them just outside of town. It also sold MGs, Truimphs and Harley-Davidson motorcyles. This dealership is long since out of business since the owner lost his shirt participating in racing.
  • verozahlverozahl Posts: 574
    Subaru DL is a sedan as far as I remember.

    When it comes to older Mitsubishi, Mazda, or Subaru models (1980s or before), I don't have a clue. My parents bought their first Subaru wagon in 1987/1988, whatever it was called, it was quite light but drove good in winter. You don't see old Subaru wagons around much in the Detroit area, but elsewhere in the upper midwest, they're around! Especially Petoskey and Traverse City and Marquette.

    Then again, my "era of interest" for Japanese cars is mostly late 1980s to late 1990s. Excellent styling, many different models, many of which were sales flops despite their attractiveness.. I'm talking Subaru SVX and Mazda RX-7 here.
  • seminole_kevseminole_kev Posts: 1,722
    wish Subie made some sort of modern version of it.
  • andre1969andre1969 Posts: 23,880
    ...here's what it looked like:


    (be warned, it's a big picture)


    http://strike.colorado.edu/album2/1983_Subaru.jpeg


    I liked the SVX too...just weird enough to be cool, with that style that was kinda futuristic, in a "Battlestar Galactica" sort of way! I also liked the XT they had back then.

  • seminole_kevseminole_kev Posts: 1,722
    Yikes! Liked the SVX...did not like the XT though. Looked like a door stop with wheels.
  • andys120andys120 Loudon NHPosts: 21,305
    when Subie offerred fwd as well as awd in the US. I think it's a GL, ca. 1989.

    I guess your incredible memory for detail doesn't extend to non-Mopars.

    2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93

  • verozahlverozahl Posts: 574
    Yeah, why drive a 'wedge design' when you can drive a superior, Euro-chic Focus design?? I agree completely. LOL
  • seminole_kevseminole_kev Posts: 1,722
    was that supposed to be "bait"?
  • wishnhigh1wishnhigh1 Posts: 363
    Okay...how common are BMW Bavarias? I have seeen 5 in pristine condition in the last few days. It really looks like the predecesser to the 7 series.

    Have any of you heard of the BMW 6000 series? I see a guy around campus with one, but I honestly dont know specifics, other than it is a 4 digit number starting with 6.
  • andre1969andre1969 Posts: 23,880
    ...I think 1985 was actually the last year for that little old-style Subaru GL. Sometime around 1984 or '85, Subaru came out with a newer design that was a little bigger, more modern, in a squared-off way, and available in a 4-door sedan, 2-door hatchback that was styled to look like a coupe, and 4-door wagon. When it came out, the older-style GL 4-door and wagon were dropped, and only that nasty little hatchback remained.

    The newer style got composite headlights before too long. When I was in high school, I worked at a veterinary clinic, and the doctor had an '87 Sube 2-door. Ultimately, these things were replaced by the Impreza.

    There, Andys120, does that redeem me? :-P
  • lemkolemko Philadelphia, PAPosts: 15,306
    ...Subaru still built an "old school" car called the Loyale. It was like a modernized version of the old DL wagon. It even had the funky placement of the spare tire in the engine compartment.
  • kw_carmankw_carman Posts: 114
    I remember the Loyale...

    Vero: I see a Audi 5000 on the way home from school every day...parked in an overgrown yard, behind a rusted mobile home...

    Brat: I saw my first one two summers ago outside of a Kroger in Knoxville. My first thought? What the heck is that rusted POS?
  • ghuletghulet Posts: 2,628
    Bavarias actually are the predecessor to the 7-series, IIRC. Nice looking car for the era (though the rear bumpers are awful), and fairly big and powerful. I think they were made from about 1970-76 (7-series debuted here in late 1977, I think, in the form of the 733i with an available 4-speed manual). I haven't seen a Bavaria in quite a while, though I occasionally do see its contemporary, the 3.0CS/CSi (predecessor to the 6-series), and I frequently see 2002s. Chicago isn't exactly a bastion for old BMWs, probably because of our winters (bad traction and rust).

    The old-style Subaru DL/GL (rounded rear) was offered as a sedan, two-door hardtop, hatch and wagon until MY 1985, when the sedan and wagon were replaced by the boxier versions (which are durable machines if you can keep the rust away). The old-style hatch continued as a price leader until 1987 or '88, when the Justy effectively replaced it. To add slightly to any confusion, there was also a two-door hatch version of the 'new style' DL with coupe-style side rear window and a slightly wrap-around backlight.
  • jrosasmcjrosasmc Posts: 1,711
    Bavaria was sold here from 1971-74.
  • andys120andys120 Loudon NHPosts: 21,305
    you are the God of Details.

    2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93

  • I was under the impression that the Bavaria was somehow smaller, like a 4-door 2002 series or something.
  • jrosasmcjrosasmc Posts: 1,711
    The Bavaria was the predecessor of some sorts of the 5-Series. And it was a pretty expensive car, too, costing about $5000 when it first appeared here.
  • bhill2bhill2 Posts: 2,129
    My recollection is that the Bavaria was a decontented version of the 2500/2800 sedan created for the US market. Presumably, us Yanks weren't yet ready to pay relative megabucks for a car with less than 180 c.i.

    2009 BMW 335i, 2003 Corvette cnv. (RIP 2001 Jaguar XK8 cnv and 1985 MB 380SE [the best of the lot])

  • ghuletghulet Posts: 2,628
    ...was sold here as the 3.0 Si here until the end of the 1975 model year. In general, U.S. versions had larger engines and more equipment than their Euro-sold counterparts even then.

    BMW started selling the 5-series in Europe (as the 520 and 525, IIRC) in 1972. In late 1975, the U.S. got our first 530i, I think they cost something like $10000 at that time!

    The 733i first came to America in 1977 (as a '78 model). By mid-1978 they cost about $21,500 (not quite 450SEL territory, but not too far off).

    Ergo, I'm going to stick by my assertion that, at least in other markets, the 7-series replaced the 3.0Si/Bavaria, since the 5-series and Bavaria were built together for several years. As the U.S. didn't have a 5 until 1975 when the 3.0Si (nee Bavaria) left, it makes sense to us that one replaced the other, effectively, in the U.S. market only, though that wasn't actually the case.

    The 2002 was the coupe version of the 1600/2000 sedans, which unfortunately were never sold in the U.S. I tried to find a picture of one for sale on AutoTrader.com, but there are none for sale on that site.

    Dammit, who has my BMW Buyers Guide? I can't find it anywhere, naturally. It does a better, more thorough and accurate job of demystifying some of this junk than I do.

    Speaking of strange, unusual BMWs, I saw a circa-1984 (E30) Baur 318i cabrio (folding top, but framed doors and fixed rear side windows), at the 7-11 across from Wrigley Field.
  • verozahlverozahl Posts: 574
    I spotted that 1991 Nissan 240SX SE fastback yesterday and I hope it's still on the used car lot later this week. Good condition, and I didn't expect to find one in northern Michigan. I see them in Ann Arbor occassionally.
  • ghuletghulet Posts: 2,628
    I don't think of those as 'rare', really. Two guys I work with have 240SXs of that era (one's a coupe, one a hatchback).
  • verozahlverozahl Posts: 574
    Well, you don't live in Michigan, ghulet.
    How's the reliability on those two cars?
  • jrosasmcjrosasmc Posts: 1,711
    Here's a car I saw yesterday that I very rarely see: a '93 Cadillac Sixty Special. This model was supposed to have patented 30-way dual power seats, and the example I saw was unlocked and sitting on a used car lot. And guess what? These ballyhooed 30-way seats didn't work at all! So I tried other accessories, and listened to the headlights-on chime; sounded exactly like a Buick Regal. Where did Cadillac come up with this stuff?
  • I've never heard of or seen a Sixty Special!

    Cadillacs are fairly rare in this part from like 1988-1995 it seems... 1995 and later they pick up. But I did see an early 80's baby blue Coupe Deville with the diesel plaque on the side.
  • jrosasmcjrosasmc Posts: 1,711
    I dug up some more dirt. Sixty Special was the name used to designate top-line FWD Fleetwoods. It eventually became the top DeVille/Fleetwood model after the latter name was transferred to the former RWD Brougham when it was restyled for 1993. Andre and Lemko are the resident Cadillac experts here at Town Hall, so they may have a stab at this or correct me for any errors.
  • Ooh! Ooh! Can I be the resident Peugeot and Ford of Europe expert!
  • ghuletghulet Posts: 2,628
    ...since I've had so many, though Andre has had more than a few as well.

    Vero, not trying to disregard what you said, it's just that I find it hard to believe an eleven-year-old mass produced Japanese sports coupe is 'rare', even in flag waving Michigan. I saw one today, puttering down Sheffield Avenue (5-speed hatch with bad exhaust, among other things). I'm guessing the 240SX is about as reliable as any other Nissan with the 140hp 2 liter engine (which also included the Stanza, Altima and NX2000, IIRC), which is to say pretty good.

    Um, I saw a light yellow Triumph TR6, being chased by an Imperial 4-door hardtop, and they drove past a Rambler Ambassador SST two-door hardtop, on an episode of 'The Rookies' (circa 1973) I watched today on TV Land, it's on at 1:00 Central every day.
  • andre1969andre1969 Posts: 23,880
    I had almost forgotten about the 60 Special that Caddy tried to re-introduce in the 80's. From what I've been able to find out, it first came out in 1986. It was created by giving the Fleetwood d'Elegance sedan a 5" wheelbase stretch, to 115.8". In the back, they added a few features such as rear passenger compartment footrests, like what a lot of cars had in the old days and a rear overhead console. ABS was also standard, and so was a full vinyl top.

    Buyers tended to complain about these shrunken '85-88 C-body Cadillacs, that they weren't big enough to be a "real" Cadillac, so the 60 Special was a quick way to make the car look more "important". For 1989, all the sedans...DeVille and Fleetwood, were bumped up to a 113.8" wheelbase, and overall length was up to around 205". On the previous model, it was only 195". Still nowhere near the old C-body's 221", but it helped a little. By this time though, I don't think the 60 Special was on a longer wheelbase anymore. The pictures I've seen of the thing on the web do show it with some pretty hideous fender skirts that made it look more umm...distinctive!

    IIRC, the original Cadillac 60 Special debuted in 1939, and was very modern for the time. It had a very wide, uprigtht, almost early-50's looking body, with no running boards. The rear and front-end were still typical '30's, with separate fenders and such.

    In later years, on up through 1976, Fleetwoods and 60 Specials (I don't think the 60 Special name made it all the way to '76 though) were a bit longer and more plush than the cheaper DeVilles. I think the 60 Special was also always a sedan, and usually it was a pillared sedan, which limits its popularity somewhat as a classic car, as most people want hardtops and convertibles.

    Back in college, I found a '66 for sale at, of all places, a car dealer that specialized in foreign used cars. I took it for a spin...that sucker was a nice car! 8 power window buttons on the door panel (the vent panes, front and rear, were all power as well), and in immaculate condition. I think they wanted something like $2800 for it. If I had a place to keep it, I would've snatched it up. This thing was too nice to be kept outside, and almost DEMANDED to be garaged.
  • jrosasmcjrosasmc Posts: 1,711
    Yes, the 1989-93 Fleetwoods with the hideous fender skirts remind me of the whale Caprice's.
  • ghuletghulet Posts: 2,628
    ...I always thought the Fleetwood of that era was about as close to a 'proper' Cadillac as you could get back then. I do like fender skirts in general, on the right car, though they add another dimension of PIA to changing a tire.
  • pemleypemley Posts: 3
    Maybe it's only in Canada but they're a dime a dozen up here. Lot's of Loyale around still too. They're really popular with the snowboarders cause they're cheaper, 4 wheel drive and a wagon
  • lemkolemko Philadelphia, PAPosts: 15,306
    ...I saw a red Honda Insight on the PA Turnpike. They're quite rare around here. Guess what? I finally saw my first G35 - a black one in Ambler, PA. Front looks good, the taillights are strange.
  • I've never seen an Insight on the road, but I've seen several Prius's and Civic Hybrids. It wouldn't surprise me if Honda dropped the Insight in favor of the Civic Hybrid.
  • lemkolemko Philadelphia, PAPosts: 15,306
    ...on the road about a month ago. Believe it or not, they're even more uncommon than the Insight. I've seen at least three of them.
  • kw_carmankw_carman Posts: 114
    I don't see many Insights around here, but Prui are more common. The first Pruis I saw up close and personal was an ugly periwinkle one at the Toyota dealer. I wouldn't be suprised if it was still sitting there.
  • andre1969andre1969 Posts: 23,880
    ...but then again there are a lot of nerds where I work, so I guess that skews the statistics :-P

    I've only seen one Civic hybrid so far, although they don't stick out like the Prius and Insight do, so I've probably seen more. This one's a really nice looking Seafoam green that kinda reminds me of my old '82 Cutlass Supreme.
  • Priuses are rather common here, in fact, it's fairly reasonable to see one on a daily basis. The Insight, maybe once or twice a week. I don't know what the Civic hybrid looks like as opposed to a reg Civic...so who knows how many I have seen.

    I saw a late 80's Caprice estate wagon with wood paneling at a stoplight on the way to work today. Uglee! (and rare in these parts, too)
  • You have to look closely to spot a Civic Hybrid. It has a slightly different grille than a regular Civic, plus unique (to the Hybrid) alloy wheels, and a tiny spoiler on the trunk lid.
  • lemkolemko Philadelphia, PAPosts: 15,306
    ...I've seen a hybrid Civic. Is there any special badging to distinguish it from other Civics? Any pictures of a hybrid Civic out there?
  • Lemko - you might have already seen one and not even noticed. It's a very subtle difference. I think the badge on the rear of the car says 'Hybrid', plus the minor details I explained above. The interior has some differences,too. Edmunds has pictures if you go to Honda under New Vehicles.
  • andys120andys120 Loudon NHPosts: 21,305
    In like new condition. Very strange that someone would bother keeping one of those lumps in such good shape.

    This was the one based on the Omni 2-dr.

    2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93

  • That reminds me - I saw an old Rabbit 'pickup' last week.
  • lemkolemko Philadelphia, PAPosts: 15,306
    ...speaking of VW pickups, has anybody seen the VW pickup based on the microbus?
  • maltbmaltb Posts: 3,572
    I see Kombis every once in a while out here: standard and crew-cabs. I worked with a guy who did a really nice restoration on a crew-cab Kombi. He even sewed a new canvas top for the back complete with teak bows. He would show it at the various VW events and generally place well.
  • fujb1fujb1 Posts: 2
    ...in Beverly Hills. Funny to see such an eyesore among the typical transportation used there. I also watched obviously wealthy folks shop on Rodeo Drive, have the Rolls Royce Park Ward door kept open by their chauffeur, and drive away followed by three body guards in what seemed to be a Mercury Marauder - I didn't know they were out yet.

    I love the typical Italian three-wheelers which are used to haul vegetables and fruit to market, just don't take corners too fast...
  • checkmecheckme Posts: 73
    AMC eagle- a woodie- on the drive into work today.
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