What does the Escape hybrid really get if you consistently drive at 55mph? 60 mph? 65 mph? 70 mph? Keep in mind that by far the most efficient speeds will be between 52 to 57 mph. Of course, not too many people actually drive at that speed.
The 2006 may have a choice of colors. They are starting the model year early, apparently it's already possible to order an '06.
As regards the AC, the salesman is full of it. Regular AC mode runs only when the engine is running, unless the computer decides the battery is too hot. Then it will fire up the gas engine to power the AC. MAX A/C runs the engine full-time (as do the defroster settings).
Getting the 29MPG EPA estimate (4wd version) for highway at 55-65 MPH speeds is entirely doable. Of course like most SUVs the Escape has the aerodynamics of a brick, so the faster you go the more fuel you will burn.
So I take it that there is some sort of elecric heater. In the winter time, it's typical to go out and warm the car up. Where/how is the heat generated if the engine isn't running and you want to get the vehicle a little toasty before getting in. Just trying to grasp the concept of the Escape Hybrid.
"Does running the heat in the winter operate the same way the A/C does in the summer?"
Yes. The temperature control has an extreme setting for both heat and AC. For settings in the normal ranges, the heat or AC goes off when the engine stops. If an extreme (MAX) setting is chosen, the engine does not turn off. Choosing any defrost setting also keeps the engine on.
So far, this has worked well for me. I've seldom needed to use a MAX setting more than briefly--such as to clear the windshield when setting out. The engine is cold then and won't turn off until it warms up, anyway.
There is not an electric heater. However there is an electric coolant pump to circulate hot coolant to the heater core if the engine isn't running. The fastest way to get the car warmed up is to start driving it. This will be easier in the 2006 models featuring heated front seats!
Correcting my own message here. I wrote, "The temperature control has an extreme setting for both heat and AC. For settings in the normal ranges, the heat or AC goes off when the engine stops. If an extreme (MAX) setting is chosen, the engine does not turn off."
That's not right. There's a MAX setting for the AC that keeps the engine running. But the heat is more complex. As another poster just pointed out, when the heater is turned on, the coolant pump (and blower) will keep running when the engine shuts off. I'll add that apparently the car also will keep the engine running if the cabin temp falls below some programmed level.
Thanks, I may see if the order bank is open for the 06 Escapes or perhaps the Mercury Mariner. The Mariners are plush, however no climate control to my knowledge.
I have 6500 miles on a 2005 Escape Hybrid AWD. 26.8 mpg overall, 28-29 highway. With the cruise control set at 60, I got 33 on a 100 mile trip from Napa to San Jose. Some hills, some slow traffic, but pretty much 60mph.
In awful stop-and-go commutes in Washington, DC, I get as high as 36 mpg."
Huh? The CR-V is an SUV, and the last time I checked (snow in Yosemite - Mar 2005), my RT4WD was kicking power to all four wheels. The escape is not a full time 4wd either- like the CR-V, it provides power to the rear wheels only when required.
OK, I see it is sold as an AWD SUV. I've always thought of the CR-V as a car, but some people consider the Escape a car as well. The CR-V is smaller and appears to me to have less off-road capability.
The Escape hybrid would get considerably higher mileage if it were the size of a CR-V. But it fills a different niche.
"The CR-V is smaller and appears to me to have less off-road capability.
The Escape hybrid would get considerably higher mileage if it were the size of a CR-V. But it fills a different niche."
The CR-V is a little bit larger than the Escape (about an inch, but who's counting), and about the same weight. The difference is that the CR-V has only an I4 engine offered, 160 HP/162 torque. Edmunds lists the CR-V as a midsize SUV, while the Escape is listed as compact (because the CR-V has more interior and cargo space).
The two vehicles are direct competitors...
CR-V curb weight 3310 (LX FWD) to 3490 (SE AWD) Normal Escape: 3304 lbs. (XLT FWD) to 3464 lbs (XLT AWD) Hybrid Escape: 3792 (What a PIG! Batteries and components add 330 pounds!)
Dang, you're right. I always thought the CR-V was a toy car. but then, I've been driving a Jeep Grand Cherokee V8. I bought the Escape Hybrid because I wanted high mileage and low emissions in a vehicle that would do what I need. Most of my miles are a lower speeds, either in town or on back roads.
The CR-V (automatic) has EPA mileage of 22 in town and 27 hiway. The Escape has 33 in town and 29 hiway. The in-town comes closer to my usage pattern. The emissions are more different than indicated by the EPA mileage numbers.
Now, 22 vs 33 is a big difference, so I never looked at the CR-V. I'm sure it's a good car, but not what I want.
I do apologize for my ignorance about the Honda. But then this is an Escape Hybrid group.
"I do apologize for my ignorance about the Honda. But then this is an Escape Hybrid group."
No big, just wanted to get everything straight. I get around 21 in town, but I drive carefully. I have gotten as low as 19 driving all out around town. I do get between 26 and 27 on the highway at 80 MPH.
My big concern with the Escape hybrid is the high cost, and the fact that it is the first year that Ford has attempted the HSD (or it's equivilent). So reliability is an issue for me. That is, if I was in the market, which I am not now - I'm still paying for my current SUV...
I am a bit surprised about the low towing weight of the hybrid. The CR-V has a 1500 pound max trailer weight (though export models (2.0L engine) list 3000 lbs, if the trailer has it's own brakes). Why doesn't that thing at least tow the same as the 2.4L in the CR-V?
The 2.3L Atkinson cycle engine does not have the same power output as an Otto cycle of equivalent displacement. The electric motors can make up the difference on short bursts (that's the design intent) but not continuously, as all power eventually comes from the gas engine.
This was a design decision...Ford could have gone with a larger gas engine for better towing capacity at the expense of fuel economy and emissions when not towing. RX440h and Highlander Hybrid have higher towing capacity.
I'm at 6200 miles with zero problems, getting a solid 28 MPG average. Very satisfied owner. I have a 900 pound tent trailer we'll be pulling with it in the near future.
I've calculated mileage for the past 4,000 miles now and am getting 30.6 mpg. The mileage is rising with the onset of warmer weather, but probably will drop as it becomes necessary to use the A/C. I got the car mostly for some long (thousands of miles), rambling trips across country on back roads, which is the way I like to travel. Based on my experience so far, I think I'll get close to the EPA city mileage in such use.
Gasoline went to $2.29 here today (small-town Virginia).
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the buying service I have is in the DC area only, and it is an amazing one at that. I was told a 6-8 month wait for delivery by the Ford dealer. I only have to put $500 down, which I could get back at any time. The deal is good for any of my compatriots who belong to this same buying service. I hope someone takes advantage of this. When I asked the dealer why he would take $50-$100 profit on a vehicle that many dealers will charge above MSRP, he told me that they did not offer the buying service price on the Thunderbird, nor the current Mustang, and felt that their bottom line profits actually suffered as a result. I guess if I was smart, I would put the $500 down just to get on the waiting list. Who knows, if gas prices ballooned to $3 per gallon, it might be a smart move. But today, I believe gas prices will start inching down a bit since OPEC nations get battered when the world economy goes bad.......and what better way to put the world's economy into a tail spin than to needlessly raise oil prices to record highs. I also feel that my Escape Hybrid's actual mileage based on the way I drive would be substantially less than advertised. Since the pushrod engine's mileage in the Maxx is doing so well, I think I'll stick with the Maxx this time around.
"A co-worker has a 2004 CR-V. I ride in it occasionally. I would rather have my Escape, thanks. They are quite different vehicles."
Yup, they have totally different design philosophies and road characteristics. I don't mind the Escape, but obviously I personally prefer the CR-V (I own one)...
That is why I encourage every one to go out and drive every model they are considering. Bring the kids and the carseat! Check them out and pick the one that you prefer.
Question for those Escape Hybrid owners who have leather interiors. Dealer has the Escape Hybrid we are interested in, every option and color, no extras we don't want, except it does not have leather seating which my wife really prefers.
Dealer says he can have leather installed and that it will be better than the factory leather, softer, etc., etc. You know the drill to get a sale.
Anyone had this done to their hybrid? For those who have the factory leather are you satisfied and would you opt for installing after market leather if your car had everything else you wanted factory installed except the leather?
We have the factory leather. It is of OK quality, not as substantial as the leather in the Volvo it replaced, but the Escape is fully $10K cheaper than the Volvo was...
Not sure what aftermarket leather would cost. I would express one concern if messing with the seats, and that's the Occupant Classification Sensor in the front passenger seat. It decides how much force the passenger-side airbag deploys with (or whether it deploys at all) in a frontal crash. Not sure I'd be comfortable with any changes to the seat that might mess that up (and that goes for adding heated seats, too).
If you really want premium leather and all the goodies the 2006 is supposed to have a luxury option with upgraded, heated leather seats. They start building in May, allegedly.
While in San Jose, I was commuting 15 miles, roughly from Moffett Field, to Los Gatos, using "expressways", sort of limited access city streets. I averaged 36.2 mpg. Speeds are up to around 50-55, lots of stops. I did some electric-only travel. Coming home, 70mph was 30mpg, as soon as I got off the freeway and into hilly areas north of Napa, I was around 28mpg.
Thanks for the reply stevewa. My wife and I decided to wait for a 2006 model after finding a thread on escape-central.com that also mentioned what was referred to as a Premium Package that includes monochromatic appearance (we want silver anyway), heated side-view mirrors, reverse sensing system, audio & nav., 110AC, cargo cover and floor mats as well as what you mentioned. Also a moonroof option is to be available with the Premium Package ( we don't want one). Black clearcoat metallic to be available. If the thread is correct it looks as thought white will no longer be available usless that color was omitted by mistake in the post.
The only thing bugging us now is that we have noticed while following the Escape that there are two suspension pieces that angle down toward the inside bottom of the rear wheels which look very vulnerable to me. I have since been looking at every other SUV brand I am following and have not seen this on any other make or model.
We don't want 4WD or to go offroading but I can't help but wonder if a rock or something could take out one of those rear suspension pieces especially after having a metal bar that fell off a truck in front of us several years back come up through the floorboard behind my seat!
stevewa I would not post a similar reply again but looking around the site for other interesting things I saw a post which suggested that my reference to another forum, not edmunds, may have violated a posting rule so I am posting my reply again without that website reference in case it is deleted by the HOST.
Thanks for the reply stevewa. My wife and I decided to wait for a 2006 model after finding a thread on another site that also mentioned what was referred to as a Premium Package that includes monochromatic appearance (we want silver anyway), heated side-view mirrors, reverse sensing system, audio & nav., 110AC, cargo cover and floor mats as well as what you mentioned. Also a moonroof option is to be available with the Premium Package ( we don't want one). Black clearcoat metallic to be available. If the thread is correct it looks as thought white will no longer be available usless that color was omitted by mistake in the post.
The only thing bugging us now is that we have noticed while following the Escape that there are two suspension pieces that angle down toward the inside bottom of the rear wheels which look very vulnerable to me. I have since been looking at every other SUV brand I am following and have not seen this on any other make or model.
We don't want 4WD or to go offroading but I can't help but wonder if a rock or something could take out one of those rear suspension pieces especially after having a metal bar that fell off a truck in front of us several years back come up through the floorboard behind my seat!
I spent some time under my Escape today (wiring in a trailer lighting pigtail) and I assume you're referring to the lower control arm. It's a pretty sturdy piece, and it'd take more than the average rock on a highway to detach it from the vehicle. I have yet to do anything in the way of offroading but I know a lot of people do take their Escapes offroad and I've not read of such a problem occurring.
From the press release I read, the only differences between 2005 and 2006 and the Premium Package are:
1. Monochromatic appearance package (like the current "Limited" V6 model) 2. Heated mirrors/seats (this is the one item I'd be most interested in) 3. Upgraded leather seating 4. Moonroof (it's unclear from the release if this is part of the premium package or a seperate option) 5. Reverse sensing system (again from the Limited, also available aftermarket).
Everything else you mention is already available in the 2005 either standard or as an option (ours had the Navigation system, the 110v inverter, the rear floor mats, and the cargo shade).
It appears from what I've read that dealers should be able to take orders for the 2006 model at this time. Good luck!
I received an emailed internet quote from a Ford dealer for a fully loaded Escape Hybrid (w/o Navigation system) for $27,940...Wow what a deal I thought since Edmunds had the msrp as about 29,940 and the Vin# matched the Vin on the Ford Build and Buy site which also listed the price at $29,940. So last night I drove past the 3 Ford dealerships that are closer to the one with the great special. I test drove the car and loved it. It's the right color etc. At the dealer the person who emailed the quote was not there but I had spoken to him a few times that day and he had arranged for his "partner" to help me. When we sat down to discuss the price he explained that the 27,940 was a mistake, the other salesman made a typo. He called that salesman on the phone and they discussed the error. They would not budge one red cent from the 29,940, nor would they split the difference and give me the car for $28,940. I have today to think over their offer but am beginning to feel like this was a scam. I did flat out tell the salesman this sounded like bait and switch. What should I do?
People do make mistakes, but I would be suspicious that the "typo" was made in order to get you into the dealership. It's either sloppy work or bait & switch, neither of which is really acceptable. Go elsewhere.
MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name. 2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h) Review your vehicle
My boss had a similar issue - a car auction house had a 1996 Ford truck that was listed in the paper for $5995 versus the $7995 it was supposed to be listed for.
They tracked it back to a mistake by THEM, not the newspaper, and when my boss pressed them about it, they did the right thing and honored the price.
If that dealership has any integrity (a few do, most do not) they would honor the price. Great test of their mettle.....If they do not honor it, move on to someone else, because you know they are not good people....
Advertised, yes, I believe, unless it's a typo made by the printer.
IIRC, the member was referring to an e-mail quote - I doubt that's set in stone.
MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name. 2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h) Review your vehicle
If the dealer cared about "customer relations" a little more, they would honor the price, take the difference out of the salesman's commission, and make a new customer happy. That pays dividends down the road.
The fact that the general sales manager would not do this shows the business to be of questionable integrity.
EVERY YEAR CONSUMER REPORT RIPES THE FORD ESCAPE FOR IT'S POTENTIAL ROLL OVER PROBLEM.AND REFUSES TO GIVE IT A RECOMMENDATION,ALTHOUGH IT EXCELS IN ALL OTHER AREAS.WHEN IS FORD GOING TO WAKE UP AND MAKE THE COMPUTER ASSIST TRACTION CONTROL SYSTEM AN OPTION AS IT DOES NOW FOR THE FORD EXPLORER?
I am starting to think about the Escape hybrid. I drive a lot of miles so the mpg will pay off for me. My question is whether the car is generally available and if so, what kind of deals are being offered. I heard an ad on the radio yesterday pushing the car. It made me wonder if perhaps sales had slowed a bit on them. Any news?
A reporter with a national magazine is on a series of articles with real people and their car buying experiences. The reporter is looking for people who have recently purchased a car and had an interesting car buying experience using non-traditional methods. Specfically, the reporter would like to speak with people who have purchased a Mustang, Chrysler 300, Dodge Magnum, a Mini Cooper hardtop or convertible or a hybrid vehicle of any make. If you fit what the reporter is looking for, please email the details of your car buying experience with your contact information to kholguin@edmunds.com by Friday, April 22, 2005.
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2006 production run should be starting soon. There are 2005s around, but the recent bump in fuel prices has led dealers to believe they can now charge a premium on their remaining stock...you'll probably have to work to get MSRP.
The thing that bothers me about this vehicle is not only all the energy that goes into making a pack of batteries (mining, refining, manufacturing, replacing, disposal, etc), but the fact that the price difference can't be made up in a decade, even with gas at $3 a gallon. The Escape Hybrid is especially odd in that it comes in an SUV package, but it isn't suited to SUV type applications. I admire when people feel strongly enough about the environment that they'll dole out $5000 and more just to do it, but I really question if this is having a positive impact on the environment, which is the line the advertising agencies use.
In all reality, much of the gas saving technology really has nothing to do with the "hybrid" aspect at all. Cylinder deactivation and automatic shutoff can be applied to ALL vehicles, as can skinnier tires, the Atkinson cycle, running the air conditioner off the batteries at a reduced setting, etc. The real world gains, when this is taken into consideration, are pretty abysmal, which is why I think Honda is heading is probably the more intellingent approach. In the future, ALL vehicles will employ these technologies to some degree, but I ultimately hope diesel takes hold, if our government will finally decide to get behind it the way the Europeans have.
Just got back from a 3,000 mile trip and have about 10,000 on the odometer. I had hoped that efficiency would increase with warmer weather and apparently it has. I now have a 36.1 mpg average for about the past 6,000 miles (last reset). One thing that surprised me is that the last trip was on fairly remote mountain roads with lots of up and down but little stopping and the average mileage rose and rose. I'd assumed the hybrid savings came largely from shutting down the engine when possible, but that ain't so. The mileage rose nicely even as the engine stayed on. The batteries were charged in the downhill runs and then used to assist the ascents. Very, very well done!
I expect mpg to drop back down nearer 30 mpg now that I am back to my usual mix of driving, but I do a lot of back roads and some off-roading (the reason for a 4WD SUV to start with) and I expect to stay at just about exactly double the overall mileage my 1999 Jeep Grand Cherokee can manage.
The speed at which you make up the price is also tied to how many miles you drive, not just the price of fuel. As to your claim that the Escape isn't suited to SUV type applications, with the exception of the lower towing capacity (1000 versus 1500 pounds for the conventional 4-cylinder model) it's really the same vehicle as the 2005 conventional model.
The cost is also offset by various tax incentives. These incentives are designed to help consumers make greener choices even when the financial side doesn't pencil out as well as it might.
The battery technology, Nickel Metal Hydride, is probably the most environmentally friendly of all battery technologies. The electrolyte is a strong alkaline which can be diluted with water, and is fully absorbed in the battery making a spill unlikely. Unlike LiIion, NiCd, and lead acid, there are no toxic metals used.
The Escape does not use skinny tires. It's really not at all different from the standard Escape models, coming in at a trim level somewhere between the XLT and the Limited.
You claim Atkinson cycle could be applied to a conventional car. Not true. There is not enough low-end torque to make an Atkinson cycle engine driveable with a conventional transmission. Cylinder deactivation can and has been used in conventional autos before (remember the Caddy 4/6/8 debacle). Idle-stop can be done but without the electric launch capability it'd result in a noticable delay in starting from a stop.
If the "real world gains" are so abysmal then where are the conventional cars that deliver this same utility along with the economy and the environmental "greenness"? They don't exist. There is not another midsized 5-door car that can get the kind of performance and economy the current generation Prius is capable of while polluting so little.
after some serious studying it came down to kia sorento or escape hybrid (price,space,mileage)test drove both.kia's mpg is 16 but you get alot for price. I went after hours to a dealer just to different colors and styles on escape. looked at a titanium green esc hybrid.keys were in ignition. mother in law who came for ride runs back to my car as wife and I hop in to check it out! decision made.called the dealer next day . was called back by sales mgr. thanked me for not driving vehicle to newark and if i want one I'd get it at invoice.I checked nyt/edmunds ,went to talk price and took it home for 100 under inv. this veh is cool! people ask if its stalled .friends think i control acceleration w/ remote. :shades:
I'm saying the "real world gains" aren't that great. Time after time, people have listed the Civics getting high 30's, the Prius' getting mid to high forties, and Escapes getting high 20s to mid 30s. Oh sure, I suppose people aren't "driving these vehicles right", but then again, most people waste gas by nature.
"The speed at which you make up the price is also tied to how many miles you drive, not just the price of fuel."
It doesn't matter about the speed, you'll NEVER make up the cost of fuel with a hybrid vehicle. You could drive any vehicle 40-50 MPH, and you'd be surprised what your mileage is. People driving hybrids are just generally more aware of their driving habits than the average driver, which is the reason they bought the vehicle in the first place. Regardless, just when you are getting close to making up the cost, if you ever do, you'll have to replace the batteries.
"The cost is also offset by various tax incentives. These incentives are designed to help consumers make greener choices even when the financial side doesn't pencil out as well as it might."
The tax incentives are a joke. I'm not positive, but I believe they range is somewhere in the $1,500 bracket now (although a couple states have incentives above and beyond that, such as Oregon). Depending on your income bracket, this will save you between $200-$400. The price to buy a hybrid vehicle over a similiarly equipped vehicle, however, is about $7,000: $3000-$4000 for the technology, and additional couple thousand because they are the "top of the line", if there is a line, and a couple thousand more because dealers are loath to budge off the MSRP.
"The battery technology, Nickel Metal Hydride, is probably the most environmentally friendly of all battery technologies. The electrolyte is a strong alkaline which can be diluted with water, and is fully absorbed in the battery making a spill unlikely. Unlike LiIion, NiCd, and lead acid, there are no toxic metals used."
This is a relative statement. You still have to rape the earth to mine these materials, then you have to refine them, manufacture them, and replace them. Simple physics says energy is neither created nor destroyed. To make a battery, you need energy, just as you would to pump oil, run around the block, etc.
"The Escape does not use skinny tires. It's really not at all different from the standard Escape models, coming in at a trim level somewhere between the XLT and the Limited. ... "There is not another midsized 5-door car that can get the kind of performance and economy the current generation Prius is capable of while polluting so little."
You're switching vehicles on me now. You're right, the Escape doesn't come on skinny tires, but the Civic and the Prius DO. The Prius is definitely the poster child for fuel savings, but the tradeoffs aren't realistic for someone like me, who lives in Minnesota. You can't drive on the skinny tires, you HAVE to warm your car up during the 5+ months when there is snow on the ground, and most of my driving is done on the highway, where the gains are minimal (again).
"If the "real world gains" are so abysmal then where are the conventional cars that deliver this same utility along with the economy and the environmental "greenness"?"
It's called diesel. Diesel is actually BETTER for the earth (worse for humans, but that usually isn't a concern), gets similiar mileage, and the performance is comparable, or even better. Diesel, diesel, diesel.
I looked into diesels when I chose my Escape hybrid. In Europe, where diesel fuel is much less polluting (different formulation) I might have tried one. In the US, diesels are far more polluting than gasoline hybrids. And there is no diesel SUV in the US with mileage comparable to the Escape hybrid.
The diesel fuel standard will soon be modified (in 2006?) and we in the US may have to take a look at clean diesels when that happens. There is, of course, nothing to preclude combining a parallel hybrid design and a diesel. My guess is that that will be exactly what is done for larger vehicles. Whether that sort of approach will make economic sense for small vehicles will depend upon the price of gasoline. It already would make economic sense in much of the world, but not in the US at current prices.
Comments
As regards the AC, the salesman is full of it. Regular AC mode runs only when the engine is running, unless the computer decides the battery is too hot. Then it will fire up the gas engine to power the AC. MAX A/C runs the engine full-time (as do the defroster settings).
Yes. The temperature control has an extreme setting for both heat and AC. For settings in the normal ranges, the heat or AC goes off when the engine stops. If an extreme (MAX) setting is chosen, the engine does not turn off. Choosing any defrost setting also keeps the engine on.
So far, this has worked well for me. I've seldom needed to use a MAX setting more than briefly--such as to clear the windshield when setting out. The engine is cold then and won't turn off until it warms up, anyway.
Jim
That's not right. There's a MAX setting for the AC that keeps the engine running. But the heat is more complex. As another poster just pointed out, when the heater is turned on, the coolant pump (and blower) will keep running when the engine shuts off. I'll add that apparently the car also will keep the engine running if the cabin temp falls below some programmed level.
Choosing any defrost mode keeps the engine on.
Jim
26.8 mpg overall, 28-29 highway.
With the cruise control set at 60, I got 33 on a 100 mile trip from Napa to San Jose. Some hills, some slow traffic, but pretty much 60mph.
Hmmm, I've gotten 30.5 with my I4 CR-V at those speeds. Too bad it isn't a hybrid...
or an SUV, or AWD, etc.
In awful stop-and-go commutes in Washington, DC, I get as high as 36 mpg.
In awful stop-and-go commutes in Washington, DC, I get as high as 36 mpg."
Huh? The CR-V is an SUV, and the last time I checked (snow in Yosemite - Mar 2005), my RT4WD was kicking power to all four wheels. The escape is not a full time 4wd either- like the CR-V, it provides power to the rear wheels only when required.
The Escape hybrid would get considerably higher mileage if it were the size of a CR-V. But it fills a different niche.
The Escape hybrid would get considerably higher mileage if it were the size of a CR-V. But it fills a different niche."
The CR-V is a little bit larger than the Escape (about an inch, but who's counting), and about the same weight. The difference is that the CR-V has only an I4 engine offered, 160 HP/162 torque. Edmunds lists the CR-V as a midsize SUV, while the Escape is listed as compact (because the CR-V has more interior and cargo space).
The two vehicles are direct competitors...
CR-V curb weight 3310 (LX FWD) to 3490 (SE AWD)
Normal Escape: 3304 lbs. (XLT FWD) to 3464 lbs (XLT AWD)
Hybrid Escape: 3792 (What a PIG! Batteries and components add 330 pounds!)
The CR-V (automatic) has EPA mileage of 22 in town and 27 hiway. The Escape has 33 in town and 29 hiway. The in-town comes closer to my usage pattern. The emissions are more different than indicated by the EPA mileage numbers.
Now, 22 vs 33 is a big difference, so I never looked at the CR-V. I'm sure it's a good car, but not what I want.
I do apologize for my ignorance about the Honda. But then this is an Escape Hybrid group.
No big, just wanted to get everything straight. I get around 21 in town, but I drive carefully. I have gotten as low as 19 driving all out around town. I do get between 26 and 27 on the highway at 80 MPH.
My big concern with the Escape hybrid is the high cost, and the fact that it is the first year that Ford has attempted the HSD (or it's equivilent). So reliability is an issue for me. That is, if I was in the market, which I am not now - I'm still paying for my current SUV...
I am a bit surprised about the low towing weight of the hybrid. The CR-V has a 1500 pound max trailer weight (though export models (2.0L engine) list 3000 lbs, if the trailer has it's own brakes). Why doesn't that thing at least tow the same as the 2.4L in the CR-V?
This was a design decision...Ford could have gone with a larger gas engine for better towing capacity at the expense of fuel economy and emissions when not towing. RX440h and Highlander Hybrid have higher towing capacity.
I'm at 6200 miles with zero problems, getting a solid 28 MPG average. Very satisfied owner. I have a 900 pound tent trailer we'll be pulling with it in the near future.
Gasoline went to $2.29 here today (small-town Virginia).
I would rather have my Escape, thanks. They are quite different vehicles.
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I would rather have my Escape, thanks. They are quite different vehicles."
Yup, they have totally different design philosophies and road characteristics. I don't mind the Escape, but obviously I personally prefer the CR-V (I own one)...
That is why I encourage every one to go out and drive every model they are considering. Bring the kids and the carseat! Check them out and pick the one that you prefer.
Dealer says he can have leather installed and that it will be better than the factory leather, softer, etc., etc. You know the drill to get a sale.
Anyone had this done to their hybrid? For those who have the factory leather are you satisfied and would you opt for installing after market leather if your car had everything else you wanted factory installed except the leather?
Not sure what aftermarket leather would cost. I would express one concern if messing with the seats, and that's the Occupant Classification Sensor in the front passenger seat. It decides how much force the passenger-side airbag deploys with (or whether it deploys at all) in a frontal crash. Not sure I'd be comfortable with any changes to the seat that might mess that up (and that goes for adding heated seats, too).
If you really want premium leather and all the goodies the 2006 is supposed to have a luxury option with upgraded, heated leather seats. They start building in May, allegedly.
As the weather gets warmer I'm expecting it to climb even higher. I think the EPA rating is well within reach on the Escape.
I averaged 36.2 mpg. Speeds are up to around 50-55, lots of stops. I did some electric-only travel. Coming home, 70mph was 30mpg, as soon as I got off the freeway and into hilly areas north of Napa, I was around 28mpg.
The only thing bugging us now is that we have noticed while following the Escape that there are two suspension pieces that angle down toward the inside bottom of the rear wheels which look very vulnerable to me. I have since been looking at every other SUV brand I am following and have not seen this on any other make or model.
We don't want 4WD or to go offroading but I can't help but wonder if a rock or something could take out one of those rear suspension pieces especially after having a metal bar that fell off a truck in front of us several years back come up through the floorboard behind my seat!
Thanks for the reply stevewa. My wife and I decided to wait for a 2006 model after finding a thread on another site that also mentioned what was referred to as a Premium Package that includes monochromatic appearance (we want silver anyway), heated side-view mirrors, reverse sensing system, audio & nav., 110AC, cargo cover and floor mats as well as what you mentioned. Also a moonroof option is to be available with the Premium Package ( we don't want one). Black clearcoat metallic to be available. If the thread is correct it looks as thought white will no longer be available usless that color was omitted by mistake in the post.
The only thing bugging us now is that we have noticed while following the Escape that there are two suspension pieces that angle down toward the inside bottom of the rear wheels which look very vulnerable to me. I have since been looking at every other SUV brand I am following and have not seen this on any other make or model.
We don't want 4WD or to go offroading but I can't help but wonder if a rock or something could take out one of those rear suspension pieces especially after having a metal bar that fell off a truck in front of us several years back come up through the floorboard behind my seat!
From the press release I read, the only differences between 2005 and 2006 and the Premium Package are:
1. Monochromatic appearance package (like the current "Limited" V6 model)
2. Heated mirrors/seats (this is the one item I'd be most interested in)
3. Upgraded leather seating
4. Moonroof (it's unclear from the release if this is part of the premium package or a seperate option)
5. Reverse sensing system (again from the Limited, also available aftermarket).
Everything else you mention is already available in the 2005 either standard or as an option (ours had the Navigation system, the 110v inverter, the rear floor mats, and the cargo shade).
It appears from what I've read that dealers should be able to take orders for the 2006 model at this time. Good luck!
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They tracked it back to a mistake by THEM, not the newspaper, and when my boss pressed them about it, they did the right thing and honored the price.
If that dealership has any integrity (a few do, most do not) they would honor the price. Great test of their mettle.....If they do not honor it, move on to someone else, because you know they are not good people....
troy
IIRC, the member was referring to an e-mail quote - I doubt that's set in stone.
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The fact that the general sales manager would not do this shows the business to be of questionable integrity.
-C...
As far as deals, don't expect too much of a break. Hybrids for the most part sell at or near (or in some cases above) MSRP.
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In all reality, much of the gas saving technology really has nothing to do with the "hybrid" aspect at all. Cylinder deactivation and automatic shutoff can be applied to ALL vehicles, as can skinnier tires, the Atkinson cycle, running the air conditioner off the batteries at a reduced setting, etc. The real world gains, when this is taken into consideration, are pretty abysmal, which is why I think Honda is heading is probably the more intellingent approach. In the future, ALL vehicles will employ these technologies to some degree, but I ultimately hope diesel takes hold, if our government will finally decide to get behind it the way the Europeans have.
I expect mpg to drop back down nearer 30 mpg now that I am back to my usual mix of driving, but I do a lot of back roads and some off-roading (the reason for a 4WD SUV to start with) and I expect to stay at just about exactly double the overall mileage my 1999 Jeep Grand Cherokee can manage.
The cost is also offset by various tax incentives. These incentives are designed to help consumers make greener choices even when the financial side doesn't pencil out as well as it might.
The battery technology, Nickel Metal Hydride, is probably the most environmentally friendly of all battery technologies. The electrolyte is a strong alkaline which can be diluted with water, and is fully absorbed in the battery making a spill unlikely. Unlike LiIion, NiCd, and lead acid, there are no toxic metals used.
The Escape does not use skinny tires. It's really not at all different from the standard Escape models, coming in at a trim level somewhere between the XLT and the Limited.
You claim Atkinson cycle could be applied to a conventional car. Not true. There is not enough low-end torque to make an Atkinson cycle engine driveable with a conventional transmission. Cylinder deactivation can and has been used in conventional autos before (remember the Caddy 4/6/8 debacle). Idle-stop can be done but without the electric launch capability it'd result in a noticable delay in starting from a stop.
If the "real world gains" are so abysmal then where are the conventional cars that deliver this same utility along with the economy and the environmental "greenness"? They don't exist. There is not another midsized 5-door car that can get the kind of performance and economy the current generation Prius is capable of while polluting so little.
"The speed at which you make up the price is also tied to how many miles you drive, not just the price of fuel."
It doesn't matter about the speed, you'll NEVER make up the cost of fuel with a hybrid vehicle. You could drive any vehicle 40-50 MPH, and you'd be surprised what your mileage is. People driving hybrids are just generally more aware of their driving habits than the average driver, which is the reason they bought the vehicle in the first place. Regardless, just when you are getting close to making up the cost, if you ever do, you'll have to replace the batteries.
"The cost is also offset by various tax incentives. These incentives are designed to help consumers make greener choices even when the financial side doesn't pencil out as well as it might."
The tax incentives are a joke. I'm not positive, but I believe they range is somewhere in the $1,500 bracket now (although a couple states have incentives above and beyond that, such as Oregon). Depending on your income bracket, this will save you between $200-$400. The price to buy a hybrid vehicle over a similiarly equipped vehicle, however, is about $7,000: $3000-$4000 for the technology, and additional couple thousand because they are the "top of the line", if there is a line, and a couple thousand more because dealers are loath to budge off the MSRP.
"The battery technology, Nickel Metal Hydride, is probably the most environmentally friendly of all battery technologies. The electrolyte is a strong alkaline which can be diluted with water, and is fully absorbed in the battery making a spill unlikely. Unlike LiIion, NiCd, and lead acid, there are no toxic metals used."
This is a relative statement. You still have to rape the earth to mine these materials, then you have to refine them, manufacture them, and replace them. Simple physics says energy is neither created nor destroyed. To make a battery, you need energy, just as you would to pump oil, run around the block, etc.
"The Escape does not use skinny tires. It's really not at all different from the standard Escape models, coming in at a trim level somewhere between the XLT and the Limited.
...
"There is not another midsized 5-door car that can get the kind of performance and economy the current generation Prius is capable of while polluting so little."
You're switching vehicles on me now.
"If the "real world gains" are so abysmal then where are the conventional cars that deliver this same utility along with the economy and the environmental "greenness"?"
It's called diesel. Diesel is actually BETTER for the earth (worse for humans, but that usually isn't a concern), gets similiar mileage, and the performance is comparable, or even better. Diesel, diesel, diesel.
The diesel fuel standard will soon be modified (in 2006?) and we in the US may have to take a look at clean diesels when that happens. There is, of course, nothing to preclude combining a parallel hybrid design and a diesel. My guess is that that will be exactly what is done for larger vehicles. Whether that sort of approach will make economic sense for small vehicles will depend upon the price of gasoline. It already would make economic sense in much of the world, but not in the US at current prices.