isuzu/Duramax/Allison GM Diesel for 2001

getin

http://www.62-65-dieselpage.com/news5.htm

norm10

I have had a chance to visit the GM Vehicle Test Facility located east of Mesa, AZ recently to witness an evaluation of secondary braking systems for medium duty motor carrier chassis units and had a chance to see a well disguised CK-3500 chassis driving on the full track and oval speedway. It's impressive! The drivers are employees of a GM contractor and I spoke with one who told me off the record that GM put this test vehicle head to head with a Dodge ISB Cummins and the new version Ford 7.3 in a total road performance comparison. In the columns of pulling, acceleration, hill climbs with max. gvw loads and towing trailers weighted at factory recommendations; this engine/transmission combination out did the other two trucks. I think GM is finally getting serious about trucks again.
I was also told that there is a 3500HD cab/chassis on the property (disguised) that has a 17,500 lb gvw rating and has a yet to be evaluated four wheel drive that GM has contracted
with FWD Corp. from Clinton, WS to build up.

sovercash1

I was at Detroit Diesel Corp a couple of weeks ago and GM had about ten of their emissions testers for some training on our 60 series, anyway they told me that the Duramax was running at or above 300hp and doing very well in endurance tests.

Brutus

Ford is planning to replace their 7.3 with a 2nd generation Powerstroke in 2002. Preliminary are figures are that it will be a 6.0L with 310hp and 550 ft-lb of torque. I haven't heard what the new tranny will be. I'm guessing Dodge also has something in the works. All of us consumers win if Chevy starts playing the leap frog game of diesel power increases with Dodge and Ford. There is some info on the new Powerstroke at www.blueovalnews.com.

From what I've heard about the Duramax, it will be over 300hp and around 525 ft-lbs. I've also heard that the endurance tests are looking pretty good so far.

sovercash1

I just got my october edition of Diesel Progress and they have a short test on the duramax agsinst the dodge and ford. The person said the Duramax swas the clear winner. Ford was second and the Dodge was not even close.

Brutus

The Duramax has more hp and more torque than what Ford and Dodge are currently offering. Ford is at 235hp and 500 ft-lb. The Duramax has over 300hp and about 25 more ft-lb of torque. It looks like the Duramax will only be on the market about one model year before Ford introduces their new diesel, so I doubt we're looking at a new king. Only another player. Chevy should get some good publicity next year when the magazines test the Duramax against the Powerstroke and Cummins, but the following year, the test will likely be glorifying the new Ford, and the next year the new Cummins, and the next year, the improved Chevy....

leathal02

they built the new duramax to be upgraded, because they new that ford and possibly dodge were going to build new diesels

so i dont know about ford being praised

isuzu builds more and probably better diesels than navistar

lvstang

a$$holes everyone has one. Lethal02, you bust me up. You're on other posts bashing Japanese trucks and now Isuzu is so awesome because they're teamed with G.M. Isuzu is awesome, them chevy luvs and I mark cars were engineering marvels. Your comment about Navistar is only a comment until you produce some numbers. Dude, just because it says G.M. doesn't make it the greatest thing since sliced bread. I bet if Isuzu were partners with Ford or Dodge it would be Japanese junk.

sovercash1

I dont think the Duramax was at 300hp in that Ride and drive. Think about it are you going to show your hand before you introduce the engine. I think it was at 250hp. And on the Navistar subject the powerstroke 7.3 will not even come close to meeting the next emissions standard. It is going to be a tough 3 to 4 years for all the engine makers that is the reason for the new 6.0L. The diesel page just got to see the next chevrolet with the Duramax, but all he could say is thet Ford and Dodge may never catch up to the Duramax

Brutus

Ford and Dodge may never catch up to Chevy when it comes to diesels? That's pure Fantasyland. Chevy hasn't even put this diesel on the market yet, and already they're blowing away the competition. Where has Chevy been with the diesel in the 90s? Ford already has a diesel ready to be introduced only a year after the Duramax is scheduled to be introduced. The difference is that Ford also had a top performer during the 90s that dominated a huge chunk of the fleet and RV pickup hauler market.

The new Ford engine will be lighter, faster, have lots more horses and more torque, get better mpg and be more emission friendly than the 7.3L. The 7.3L was a leader in the market (along with Cummins). The Ford 6.0L is just the next generation. Chevy skipped a generation and it cost them lots of market share.

The initial figures for the new Ford diesel exceed the new Chevy figures. Both the Chevy and Ford hp and torque figures will increase in future production years, as is common with new engines. I'm not saying that the new Ford diesel will dominate the new Chevy diesel, but I guarantee the Chevy diesel will not run circles around the Ford diesel.

The best Chevy can hope to do is regain some of the market share in that's it's lost in the heavy duty market. I've talked to some die-hard Chevy/GMC truck fans who were forced to buy a Ford or Dodge because the Chevy was so inferior. That's called being way behind the curve. If the new Chevy is as good as everyone hopes, all that can be said is it's about time.

RichinKs

Dodge is upgrading their current diesel in January of 2000. Many on the Dodge boards are waiting to order it vs the current version of the Dodge diesel. As a sidelight, the 2000 Dodge trucks are the shortest run ever with the 2001's coming out in Jan at the same time as the diesel upgrade. So Chevy is indeed shooting to beat moving targets from Dodge and Ford. It will be interesting where all the players are by 2002/3 when I start looking for my next truck. .... Rich

RichinKs

Oh the new Dodge upgrade is 245hp and 505 ft pounds of torque. Where will it all end? This reminds me alot of the muscle car race of the early 60's. Just hope the big three all have enough frame strength and brakes for the loads these engines can pull. .... Rich

leathal02

statement came out wrong

i meant to say that, even though it is designed by [non-permissible content removed], at least its going to be built in the US

you can say what you want about the toys, but they are assemebled in the us and the parts or mostly what im talking about is the engines are build in japanese land

leathal02

??????????????

2sly4u

Don't even humor Lvstang with a response. He is just a whiny instigator wanting to start something he can't finish.

lvstang

I just calls 'em like I sees 'em. The main difference between lethal and you is I think he tried to explain why he was on one post bashing things of Japanese origin and then praising the Japanese Isuzu design in another post. You on the other hand make no sense at all regardless of what you are calling yourself. You contradict yourself and piss everyone off that you come across. I will admit that even though you get a lot of people upset I never cease to get a good laugh from you.

leathal02

take these message boards too damn seriously it seems

i guess it just comes down to loyalty. some people have extremely strong opinions about what they believe and they plan on sticking to them.

I guess thats why us chevy people are like that, seeing that we have the what is it called, the highest vehicle ownership? isnt that what i heard?, i really dont know and really could care less about sales figures and all that bull$hit, because real life experience counts and magazines and such are just crap

now, i wonder if thats gonna start a fire under someone or if someones going to aggre with me? who knows?

btw, the only reason why i think that isuzu "diesel", diesel being emphasized, is because ive seen it in action, of course not the duramax, but the others, and they seem to be put through hell and do extremely well. the duramax will be built in the U.S. of A. so it will be more american than any other import, all others, the parts more the engines, are made in japan or whatnot, somewheres over the seas, and shipped here

i guess i started another fire, but oh well

leathal02

was supposed to be highest vehicle loyalty

lvstang

We are all entitled to our opinions. I just tend to remember peoples past posts. I asked you about your comments on other posts regarding your dislike of Japanese products and I think I asked in a non heated way why you respect the Japanese design of the Isuzu. You answered it. No name calling, no heated exchange, just your opinion. That's the difference between most everyone and zslybrentbadhothead71.
Take it easy.

RichinKs

Trailer Life has a one page write up on the new engine/ transmission. Most we've seen here but a few new things. The engine will be available in the 2500HD/3500. Its targeted for a operating life of 200,000 miles. Has alot of aluminumn that keep its weight to 836 pounds. Fuel economy is to be 15-20 percent better than the 6.5 diesel. It will use the current ZF 6 speed manual transmission or the new 1000 series Allison 5 speed auto rated at 545 ft pounds and 375 hp. GCWR 26000 gvwr 19850. It will have a 12 inch torque converter with Normal and Tow/Haul mode. In normal the torque converter locks in 4th and 5th gears. In Tow/Haul it locks in 2,3,4 and 5 to reduce heat build up. It also has a grade braking feature whereas it will automatcally down shift on downgrades. It also has a spin on filter to be changed every two years or 50,000 miles. Maybe by my next truck in 2003 (haven't got my 2000 yet) GM will have it in production and available(G). ..... Rich

Brutus

The GCWR and GVWR weights must be for the engine and tranny combo, not the truck. I've never seen a 1 ton chassis that has been rated over 20,000 GCWR. The Ford F-450 has a GCWR of 26,000 and the F-550 has a GCWR of 30,000 pounds. With a few exceptions, they use the same engine and tranny as the F-350. I know they have a little different tranny cooling.

Beyond the engine and tranny, the F-450/F-550 are very different from the F-350. They are much stiffer and drive much more like a truck, although you can get aftermarket air-ride suspension. I suspect that any truck with a GCWR of 26,000 would ride much rougher than most people who buy a 3/4 or 1 ton would find acceptable. They also have different brakes, different lubricants and larger tires. Maybe Chevy/GMC has a 1 ton regular duty and then a 1 ton heavy duty that is really more like a F-450?

RichinKs

the ratings are for the Allison transmission.

cheapowner

I am wondering how does a Duramax 6600 V-8 can produce 300hp/525ft-lb but Duramax 7800 I-6 only produce 200hp/441ft-lb and 230/517ft-lb. Should the bigger Duramax produce at least more torque for medium application?

RichinKs

I don't know if you are referring to the hp and torque ratings in my post or who. But the Trailer Life article gave the hp, torque, GCWR etc are FOR THE ALLISON TRANSMISSION ONLY. The article said no HP or Torque numbers are being released by GM for the duramax until production starts. .. Rich

sovercash1

I think the 7.8l is very much Derated. It will go higher than the posted hp and torque figures.

26andrew1

Here is what I do know. Within the next few years all auto/trucks (yes diesel also) will need to meet ultra low emmisions. Guess what as of now Ford trucks can't do it. I don't know about Dodge the new GM trucks will and RUMOR is they are having a bit of a problem with the Isuzu motor meeting the low emmisions as of right now.

I read in a magazine that when the gm 6.5L turbo diesel is running RIGHT it outperforms the ford and cummins. The problem is the injection pump never runs right hence the motor is crap. If you notice the military opted to use the 6.5L turbo, only with a mechanical injection pump. Oh ya the magazine preferred Ford. But admitted the gm had more hp and higher torque at lower rpm, again when running correctly

swobig

what's cheapest and that's probably the case here. Sorry, I don't buy that the 6.5L is the best, but it can be ok...

sovercash1

Is this info coming from.

sovercash1

It is going to be tough for all the engines to make the ultra low emission standards if the fuel does not improve. The Diesel in the USA is not even close to what is sold in Europe. But their fuel is what? 3.00 to 4.00 dollars a gallon.

mbatchelor

I wouldn't doubt that the 6.6L 32v V8 can
crankout 300hp. BTW, BMW is coming out with
a 540TDI sedan with a 4.0L V8 diesel that has
about 240hp.

sovercash1

I f you would like to see the 2001 Duramax 2500HD GMs go to www.62-65-dieselpage.com/duramax/6600.HTM. The dieselpage has driven the trucks and has tested them head to head against Ford and Dodge. Make way for the New king the Duramax/Allison/HDs. Look at web site see if thats ok. Join the club. will post much more info in following weeks.

gwmoore

Knowing GM, and considering the problems they are having supplying 3/4-tons now, who cares how good the Duramax will be, you will probably have to weight 9 months for an order, that is once they are available.

leathal02

cares

sovercash1

If that is all you have to add to the topic you can keep your opinion to yourself. Steve

leathal02

i was too lazy to post my whole thought

I was meaning to say that if you were going to get this great truck, why would you worry about how long it would take to make it or get it...as long as I knew I would be getting it, I could care less how long it would take to make then delivered. I am sure I would eventually get impatient, but I would just have to suck it up!!!!

I looked at that page of the new HD's, let me tell you, thats about the best lookin truck ive seen. Especially if they are going to change it up a bit, the grill and whatever else it is

If I hadnt already bought my Z-71 I would seriously think about getting one

In fact I might think about it after a year of so, when the so-called bugs are worked out.

sovercash1

as you do about the wait. I will order one in the winter of 2001. Their will be a full report on the 2001 HD trucks engines drivetrains, Wed 15th at www.pickuptruck.com. Also if you look at the dieselpage pictures of the GMC it looks to me like they sit 2-3 inches higher than the old trucks. Anyone else see that. Sorry for jumping on you Leathal02. The IFS looks to be very heavy-Duty. I still like IFS.

sovercash1

of buying a new truck. I waited 8 weeks in 93 to get my K2500. Will order my next! If it take 8 weeks or 8 months. So be it. The Allison will be worth the Wait, Great transmission.

z71

souvercash1, it seems to sit quite a bit higher. Do you think that the black strip above the chrome part of the bumper is wider? It seems wider to me.

sovercash1

I went and got the 2000 GMC brochue. It does look like the Black part of the bumper is thicker. What 2 inchs? maybe. If you go to pickuptruck.com Wednesday they will show all the 2001HD trucks on there web site. The GMC maybe had the PTO option which in the article said they would site higher. The bumper looks to be the same height from the ground.

z71

Did the 2000 GMC brochure have the HD models in it? I have the 2000 Chevrolet brochure and it doesn't have any of the HDs in it. So do you think that the only reason that the trucks in the 6.2/6.5 diesel page article are higher are because of the PTO option? I hope that they are all taller, and the one with the PTO option is even higher than the ones on the 6.2/6.5 page!

sovercash1

brochure only has the Sierras in it. I"m just guessing that the GMC has the PTO option. We will know come Wednesday I hope what exactly they will look like. Give me a 2500HD or a 3500HD Duramax/Allison,4x4 Crew cab Full Leather and everything you can get on it please!

sovercash1

I also went and compared the picture of the 2001 HD Chevrolet from the 65 webpage and the 2000 silverado brochure. The black part of the bumper is thicker on it just like the GMC. You have good eyes. I usually see stuff like that right away but missed it. Wednesday is it here yet?

z71

people tell me that I notice the most useless things...glad to see that there are others out there like me! I'm like you, I can't wait until Wednsday to see what all the new trucks will have. Have you seen the picture of the white crew cab HD silverado that Dave 40 posted a while back? You said that is what you were interested in. (I want basically the same truck as you) It is a sharp looking truck. The quality of the pictures on the 62/65 page are better, but the crew cab pic isn't bad either. If you want I can find the address. Just post back and tell me.

sovercash1

I think I have seen it. Was it a crewcab short bed? Showed the right side of the truck. Had a couple of people in it. Is that the same truck?

z71

thats the one. I figured that you had already seen it. I guess that we will see a lot more of them Wednsday!

sovercash1

I went and looked at the crewcab real close. To me the plastic on the bumper is normal size. Maybe no Pto? I compared it to the brochures and the dieselpage Silverado. I can't wait.

z71

and it doesn't look as tall as the ones on the diesel page. It may just be the angle, though, because I have a thing on my computer that can zoom in on the picture and I compared it to a 1/2 in a Silverado brochure and the plastic strip is still a lot bigger. If the PTO option makes it taller, I will probably order it even though I don't really have any use for it ( I could probably find something to use it for, though!)

roger350

Guys, where is the picture of the crewcab you've been talking about? Is it Wed. yet? Gosh, this waiting is driving me crazy!

sovercash1

is at www.pickutruck.com/IMAGES/silvercrew.gif everyone that I have talked to said the same as you did. Order the PTO option. I will do the same. Come on Wednesday!!!!!! We sound like a bunch of 10 year olds waiting on Christmas. I Can't help it. Still a kid at Hart.

z71

what the mileage will be on the 8100? I asked that on the post about it and they didn't know. I wonder if the HD will come standard with the 6.0...have ya'll heard any thing about the cylinder cutoff feature on the 8100? It sounds pretty cool.

z71

what do y'all think? The Chevy looks pretty good, but I wish that they had shown more body styles.