Chevrolet HHR

gogophers1

I had narrowed my choices down to these three cars plus the Toyota Matrix. I still haven't made a final decision.

If you go for the Matrix, make sure you test-drive a manual version before ordering one if you're a shift-it-yourselfer. That vehicle was once on my short list too but a brief drive in the 5spd manual quickly put the kibosh on that thought. What a nightmare that was. It had to be the most vague and imprecise linkage this side of a delivery van. The whole point of having a manual tranny IMO is to make driving enjoyable, not work.

I've yet to test an HHR with the stick but would love to hear more about the linkage and clutch from folks who have. Any thoughts out there?

m1miata

Matrix, with a 1.8 liter engine will get the best gas mileage. That Corolla engine is great overall. I had a Corolla. With a heavier body, as the Matrix has, the gas mileage and speed will be less of course when compared to the light Corolla. You can get the Vibe too, with a little different look to the same theme.

PT Cruiser with a stick will get about the same gas mileage as an HHR with an automatic.
In some cases a mile or two less per gallon. With the automatic, the PT has been known to get less gas mileage than acceptable. If you are talking turbo, you are also talking less gas mileage than an HHR. If you don't like a stick, don't go PT. And the best styling ends with the 2005 model year, so buy soon.

The HHR has fold flat seats, and some may prefer the look to the Matrix. All in all, it is mostly a Chevy PT. And yes, with the automatic, you may get better gas mileage than an automatic PT. Matrix will still beat the two at the gas pump.

Loren

donthegreek

Anyone hear anything on a HHR AWD or 4WD coming in the near future....thats what i'd like plus more engine.

parky129

If you check it out, the PT has to have the rear seat removed to provide a flat load surface, the HHR only has to have the seat folded down. The PT requires premium gas where the HHR gets along with regular gas in equivilent engines. Premium is suggested in HHR but it works fine with regular which I am using with no problems, 28 MPG city driving Automatic.

poncho167

The Pontiac Vibe is basically the same car as the Matrix but more attractive and likely a better dealer network. As gogophers said, the manual transmission in these cars has got to among the worse in the industry. When I test drove this car (a GT version) at the GM autoshowinmotion.com test drive, not only didn't I like driving it, but I found the interior materials to be of the lowest quality, inexpensively built. Autoshowinmotion will be here again in Chicagoland next weekend. I have my pass already. They supply GM cars/trucks and foriegn rivals to test against.

poncho167

From what I have read this chassis was not designed to accept AWD. The traction control with the automatic should be sufficient in most area's of the country.

hhr06

HELP ///////////////////////////////// a'm i doing some thing wrong ? i have had my hhr now for 3 tank fulls and am not getting any where the mpg's i see on this forum. all city driving taking 17 year old grand son back and forth to school, and short grocery trips, i'm not even breaking the 20 mark, what is up any one no? retired 65 here so i'm not doing any highway driving, just short trips. really only good thing so far was the exceptionally good trade in value for my 2004 sienna on the hhr [got over $2500 blue book value] well pleased with car so far just very disappointed so far with mpg's. any and all suggestions welcomed. i'm usuing regular do i move up to next price? ::

m1miata

" If you check it out, the PT has to have the rear seat removed to provide a flat load surface, the HHR only has to have the seat folded down. The PT requires premium gas where the HHR gets along with regular gas in equivilent engines. Premium is suggested in HHR but it works fine with regular which I am using with no problems, 28 MPG city driving Automatic. "

:::::::::::::::END QUOTE:::::::::::::::::

Yes, I know, the HHR has fold flat seats, as first used on the Honda vans. That is a good feature. The PT 2.4 engine does NOT use premium gas. The turbos do. The 28 MPG city driving is hard to believe, but if ya got a car like that - it is a keeper. My guess that in all city driving, with an automatic, which is the tallest gearing in the HHR line, a person should expect around 18 to 20 MPG if it is short hops, and all low 1st and 2nd gear, and maybe up into the 22 MPG or so range if 40 MPH driving now-an-then with a city. All in town, and stop and go, with mainly 1st and 2nd gears, in a Corolla can barely do 28 MPH when babied. Any car over 3,ooo# would be lucky to break the 22 MPG as on the EPA sticker, in town.

The base 2.4 engine in the PT has 165# torque. The base HHR has 150# torque and the optional engined HHR has 162# torque. GM recommends premium in the optional engine. Using regular, it will not be producing the 172HP. If HP is the game, the PT has turbos. Since these are not race cars, I would say 165# torque in a standard PT is not bad when used with a stick. If using an automatic, both PT and HHR need the optional engines if you want to move faster than a snail, and have to merge with traffic on freeways, like in crazy California.

Loren

charlotte7

I agree that the Pontiac Vibe is more attractive, but the resale value and depreciation of a Pontiac is considerably worse than a Toyota. I actually think the Matrix is pretty ugly, but the gas mileage is not!

I have a manual MX-6 now, but I'm going to buy an automatic for the new car. I drive nearly 100% city driving (real stop and go, short distances) in heavy traffic and I am tired of the clutch in these situations. I wish I could afford to have a manual "fun" car and an auto daily driver, too.

micweb

All city driving will brutally reduce your gas mileage. If you are even close to the 20 mpg mark with all city, you are doing much better than drivers of similar size vehicles who sometimes only get 11-14 mpg. It's those long stretches of open highway were you bring your average up.

hhr06

thanks for the info i'm just having a hard time beleiving that some are getting these hi mpg figures i see here, there is another forum i visit and most of those owners are getting good mpgs IT HURTS THAT I'M NOT. traded an 04 sienna for the hhr looking 4 better mpgs, hopefully it will get better maybe //////////////////////

62vetteefp

What were you getting in the Sienna? I drive a Montana van probably 80% city taking the kids to school(4 miles away) and to functions. Do get on the highway like to the zoo today for about 10 miles once in a while. My average speed is 30 mph and I get 18MPG (per the DIC). Since the speed limit on the city roads I travel are 35 MPH you can see I spend a lot of time at stop signs. i wonder how much heavier the Montana is?

2lthhr

I read many good posts and reviews about the HHR. I purchased a 2 LT with leather seats and sunroof. At first it was great, seats were comfortable and wind noise was quiet. Now however 3 weeks later and 2300 miles later my driver seat gives me lower right back pain and the car is so loud, sounds like my windows are open, even when they are closed. Also I can hear a whistling noise coming from the driver side, outside mirror. Has anyone had any of these problems? Did I get stuck with a piece of junk? What should I do. Pease help.

hhr06

i was getting tight 18mpg and it dropped to 15 mpg, highway mpg was never better than 24mpg

gogophers1

I read many good posts and reviews about the HHR. I purchased a 2 LT with leather seats and sunroof. At first it was great, seats were comfortable and wind noise was quiet. Now however 3 weeks later and 2300 miles later my driver seat gives me lower right back pain and the car is so loud, sounds like my windows are open, even when they are closed. Also I can hear a whistling noise coming from the driver side, outside mirror. Has anyone had any of these problems? Did I get stuck with a piece of junk? What should I do. Pease help.

Sorry friend, but it's highly unlikely that your HHR has gone from being quiet and having comfortable seats to being noisy and uncomfortable all in the period of 2000 miles. I know it hurts to hear it, but it's not the car that's changed, it's you (and your impression of it). As the expression goes - now that you've lived with the car for a few weeks - the bloom is off the rose.

I liken it to that first date with a new hottie. Day one, everything about the person seems perfect. Initially, even idiosyncrasies can seem charming. But after the tenth date, the way she laughs is completely unbearable and what's with the too-wide gap in her front teeth?

My guess is that your test-drive in the HHR was rather brief - 20 minutes or so with the salesman yapping at you the whole, short time you spent behind the wheel. Sound about right? Did you take it out on the freeway and drive 75+ on a windy day for awhile [before signing the paperwork]? Did you sit in the seat for at least an hour straight before buying it? Have you sat in the seat for more than an hour straight now that you own it?

I think this phenomenon - going to bed one night and waking up with someone seemingly quite different the next day - is a common post-purchase reaction for many of the buyers of hotter new models. Most of the folks driving home new HHRs today fall into the fire-ready-aim category of buyers. The demand at the moment is much greater than the supply. And thus they're tough to find. I.e., if you've already got one, you probably have a bit of an itchy trigger finger.

Now... a lot of these "early adopters" (as we refer to them in marketing) aren't going to be disappointed the next day. Unfortunately, you're not a member of the Capricious-yet-satisfied Club. But look on the bright side - it takes some people years before they discover they bought the wrong car. You found out the first month!

parky129

I am getting mileage quoted, checked manually with gas pumped divided into mileage traveled. The on board calculator is a general measurement and usually a little low. One thing I noticed is that when traveling in hilly areas if you shift into intermediate gear the car won't suddenly downshift and jump ahead. This is recommended in manual/ I have one mile long hill that using technique stated achieves same speed at top as at bottom. I notice reviewers of PT / HHR usually don't test model for model, they test automatic against manual . Strange?

beliver

gophers: A hard lesson learned for sure. I did the same thing not long ago and I really should know better. Bought a new Mustang and within a week hated the thing. Drove it for 6 months 'till I could no longer stand it. palmed it off on my nephew @ $5000 loss. He thinks it's the greatest thing since sliced bread. Go figure !!

believer

poncho167

How much difference is the resale? Being that resale value is highly influenced by rebates, what would the depreciation be if you added the initial rebate to the resale price? GM is starting to get away from putting money on the hood because of this. A $2,000 on the hood rebate generally means $2,000 more depreciation at resale.

poncho167

You shouldn't have problems with your lower back with these seats. I am sure you have but if not, there is an adjustment for the seat lumbar support.

The wind noise that you hear from the side view mirror has been noted on the forum before. It is caused by the body colored skin (I can't think of the word they use for these) that is put on over the mirror and causes some wind drag, noise. Another driver said he was able to remedy the problem through his dealer. May need some sealent or something.

m1miata

The HHR gets best mileage with automatic. The PT is geared best for the stick, so it compares in gas mileage best against the HHR automatic. If you have an HHR stick, expect worse gas mileage. It is all in how they geared them. Personally, I like the stick as this is a heavy vehicle. Well I like to shift too!

Loren

m1miata

Yes, I have seen your posts about the strange Mustang which is hard to keep straight without swapping ends and such. With all those sold, I would expect hundreds of thousands of accidents every day. Cars spinning and flying off the road -- oh my! I owned a 1965 Stang and a 1985 Stang, with no so good base model setup, and never had it close to spinning out of control. The 1985 was a poor example of a Mustang being the 4 cylinder and soft suspension, but still was not dangerous. The more current models have a lateral G test results around the .86g range, which is hardly bad cornering. For rain or snow, you use appropriate tires for your area.

Loren

2lthhr

Gogophers1
I dont know who you think you are. I came to this forum to get some help, instead here you here telling me that I jumped the gun and bought something, without knowing what I bought. Im sorry that you found the love of your life, only to realize later that she was in love with someone else. This is only a car, not an ex. Being new to this forum I expected to be treated in a polite manner and hopefully get some advice, from others who own an HHR. If you have no advice to give and only wish to criticize someone you do not know, I suggest you get a life. For all others who replied to my post, I would like to thank you very much for your help.

m1miata

Though it will cost you some extra bucks, an upholstery shop could add some foam the seat back for ya, which may help the lower back.

As for noise, the tires could make a difference. The obvious to check is over inflation, but certain makes of tires sure make for a noisier ride. What tire brand and design is on your car? On the tirerack.com they have a lot of tires listed, complete with reviews. How quiet the tires are is one of the listed items in reviews of customers, along with their own testing. Someone else mentioned taking the car in for a fix on
the mirrors. That's all I can think of. I own that other car that started it all, so specific fixes to your car, I can not comment on.

Better luck to ya, don't give up too soon.

Loren

parky129

That is the PROBLEM they should compare like equipped vehicles, with the same equipment. What good is comparing a Geo against a Cadillac? If the test vehicles have automatic, power steering, brakes etc then compare them not a fully equipped model of one car against a lower equipment group of another car. Apples to Apples, not Apples to Oranges! Car testers have the habit of comparing cars unequally such as the PT/HHR test. Aparently they liked the PT more than the HHR, but the HHR still won out!

62vetteefp

If the wind noise is a common problem, and it sounds like it might be, there probably is/will be a technical bulletin released to the dealership which gives direction on how to resolve. The vehicle is so new however they might not have one yet.

Seats are very subjective on comfort. Some like soft, living room foam, others like firm supportive foam. Some like lots of lumbar support, some like none. I have driven some cars where I had to put my wallet behind the small of my back (Century). One thing that might help the back pain is to adjust the seat back to a different angle. That changes the spinal loading and may help.

bobw3

In my experience, seats that are soft are good for short trips, but on long trips the seats that initially seem hard are actually more comfortable for the long trips. So I'd rather buy seats that are on the firm side to start with.

62vetteefp

absolutely but not all see it that way.

62vetteefp

The Chevrolet division of the General Motors Corporation has bought all the
commercial time during "The Tonight Show with Jay Leno" on NBC tonight. The
17 minutes Chevrolet is buying will be devoted to comedy segments about the
new Chevrolet HHR sedan.

woody68rs

The whistling from the drivers side mirror is a common thing, and Chevrolet has noted it. Call Chevrolet. It occurs where the chrome skin meets the mirror housing (there is some extra flashing of sorts on the chrome skin). We were instructed to have our dealership order a completely new mirror assembly to be installed by the body shop. I can't help you with the seats, we haven't had that problem, but if you mention it to your dealer, they will be more than willing to help you find a solution, they seem to be bending over backwards to make a good impression with the HHR. My wife noted several spots where the paint is rubbing thin where the hood and doors meet the body too. Chevrolet has told our dealer's bodyshop to document the problem while they determine a solution for that problem too. These are just minor issues though, nothing that would make us regret buying the HHR by any means. Although I do recommend you mention your difficulty with your seat to your dealer.

allfiredup

I'm curious to see the sales figures for the HHR thus far. I'll admit I've never been much of a GM fan, but I think the HHR is a great looking vehicle and really hope it does well. I've seen a lot of them on the road, so they're obviously selling.

62vetteefp

sold 5760 in august and 10,000 for the year

micweb

...and it wasn't as big as I remembered it. If you remember an earlier post of mine, I criticized the HHR for having less interior room than the PT Cruiser and seeming smaller on the the outside.

Seems it is all a matter of "biased perception." You see, we traded in our PT Cruiser on a Honda CR-V for my wife at the first of the year, and the CR-V is much larger, so I have gotten used to its size and in comparison the HHR felt a little small for a supposedly "big car." But today, when I checked out the 2006 PT Cruiser, I realized it is my perception of size that has changed, that's all - the HHR is at least equal to the PT inside, and has a bigger "trunk" to boot.

So now, setting aside issues of manufacturing quality (the HHR is unknown at this point, but the PT has a good track record for repairs and quality - see Consumer Reports), I have to admit I prefer the HHR. It's interior is nicer (less flashy than the redesigned PT) and you can't see the posts under the rear seats (the PT has rear seats on posts so you can remove them). I also like the fact that you can get a "flat floor" in the HHR without having to "tumble" or even remove the seats like you do in the PT. Finally, call me a low achiever, but I like the fact that the base engine in the HHR is a slightly more economical 2.2 liter vs. the 2.4 in the PT (yes I know the mileage figures for the 2.4 in the HHR are the same as for the 2.2, but I bet in real world driving - with gas mileage in mind and not stop light drag racing - I think the 2.2 with a standard transmission will be a fine performer, economy-wise).

Those of you who have HHR's already, please keep us posted with problems and, more importantly for those who tend only to write when there is trouble, not happiness, please let us know how many miles trouble free you are getting as well. See you around - maybe in an HHR!

307web

How is city mileage and how adequate is the performance?
I know the 2.4 is supposed to get the same mileage as 2.2, but is designed for premium fuel. I also know you can use regular with the 2.4, but won't that hurt the gas mileage on cars intended to run on premium?

Is one engine louder than the other?
Is a 5 speed automatic coming anytime soon?

redhhrgirl

Hey fellow Ohioian. I just ordered my HHR today. Where in Ohio are you? I am outside of Cleveland

woody68rs

We're just outside of Cincinnati ! Hope you like your HHR as much as we like ours !

62vetteefp

http://www.technofile.com/cars/chevy_cobalt_ss.html

62vetteefp

I loved the ads during Leno's show. I DVR's so I could skip Leno (hey I am asleep normally anyway).

One thing it did was to make fun of the HHR as a tricked up car for kids which means it will probably be a great car to be tricked up.

m1miata

Hummm, a Cobalt over $20K -- I don't think so. They will sell a few, but then again, all cars can be sold to a few. The comparison to an Acura RSX is interesting. I would take the Civic or the RSX over an overpriced blown Cobalt. Cobalt is a nice little econo car, of average looks, as in it looks close to others in its class. Could be a Korean car, for that matter. Just lost in the also rans. For the price you can get an RSX which would have better resale and class. Chevy electric steering in a performance car, I would question.

The best Cobalt is one for under $15K, or as an HHR at under $16K. Beyond that is a reach at best. For $20 to $22K there are all too many better choices. Heck, why not get a Mustang V6? You would have 203 or more HP depending on State, without being blown. Or if you have the urge for torque steer, get the Neon on steroids.

Now back to HHR. Great buy under $16K, to put around town shopping, or hitting the road for touring fun.

Loren

sandy06

I bought HHR LS automatic in July for the mpg. Loved the style being a bit different. However my fuel economy has not been all that great. Getting 15.9-16.6 in town which is where most of driving is. Had hoped for better. I have 1350 miles now and I went back to the dealer where I bought it in Oklahoma and was offered $12,000 trade in. I knew I'd take a loss, but did not expect quite that much in 67 days. So I checked with another dealer in Texas, as I'm in the Ark-La-Tex area and he offered to allow me $12,500. I guess that for now the best that I can hope for is that the mpg does get better over time. I paid sticker for the car, $16,990 so that's a real loss, not to mention the registration. It is all in the eye of the beholder and what the intended purpose is. I just expected more and got disappointed. But it IS a neat attractive niche vehicle in my opinion. I like the HHR, its looks and the standard equipment and it looks like I may have to live with it for awhile and hope for better.
By the way, the Oklahoma dealer told me he'd sell it for about $14,000, that seems like a big amount of depreciation to me but makes a great buy on the used side.
My advice is to check out the car and be realistic in your expectations and make several test drives, more than just a quick spin around town. I'm in late 40's and should have known better.

m1miata

It is possible that gas mileage improves by 3,000 on the odometer. I would expect between 18 and 22, or an average 20 MPG for in town driving. Really short hops, on a cold engine, yeap, around 16 MPG seems about right for most cars. How are the mixed driving and highway MPG numbers? If you can get in the 24-26 MPG range in mixed driving, or more aggressive highway driving, and around 28 to 30 MPG for light footed highway driving, that is about right. That is what my PT gets. It is a stick, but the gas mileage range is the same as that of an automatic HHR. And some HHR owners are getting better gas mileage.

As for trade ins this soon, I would say, no way. Sell it yourself. You will take quite a hit on the trade-in. Well, either way, it won't look pretty. Keep it a bit longer and see how the mileage goes - up or down. Although not always popular with GM fans, I will stick by my statement of buying GM cars used. Actually, most Fords too. I have seen all too many GM cars selling for near half price in two years, and more commonly at half in three years time. Heck, I could have bought a one year old Monte Carlo for $12,800, but it was a rental car with 29K miles. Still, that is dropping $10K in one year.

Your mileage may get a little better around town, but remember few cars will do better than 20 in town anyway. Keep the car, and enjoy the ride. In say 7 years, you have all the value out of it. I know, like little ol' me, we all start looking around for something different, or even buy again in three years time. The most patient I have ever been with a car was 7 years. Ya just get the bug for something else. Well, actually I added another car in-between, come to think of it. Anyway, have fun with the HHR and 16 to maybe even the 18-20 MPG gas mileage may happen in the near future.

Loren

sandy06

I certainly hope it improves but if not I guess one way to look at it is, I can buy alot of fuel for what I'd be losing. But it is a neat fun vehicle and I liked it or I wouldn't have bought it. So I guess I need to stop complaing and just enjoy it.
The longest vehicle ownership for me is 14 years with a K5 Blazer and I still have it.
Thanks for your input and will just give it more time to break in.

gogophers1

I have to agree with Loren on this one. Good mileage comes to those who wait. And the word is still out on what real-world mileage will be when all these freshly minted HHRs start getting broken in. At this point, it's all speculation. EPA is 22-30 with the stick (and I suspect higher in reality - who knows - no one here has reported personal mileage experience with the stick version yet), 23-30 auto regardless of engine. That's pretty darn good for a vehicle with so much versatility IMO.

I've been reading posts here with people taking trips and averaging close to 30 highway with full loads of passengers and cargo. And that's on green engines. I remember how irritated I was the first few months I owned my Elantra 5spd (EPA rated 33 highway). 75% of my driving is done on the expressway and I was only averaging mid to high 20s for the first 6K. I thought something was wrong with the car! Of course, it was my first new car so what did I know? Then, as if someone had waved a magic wand, the highway mileage increased by 5 or 6 miles per gallon. Now I consistently average 33-35 mpg.

Obviously, not every model is the same but one thing is certain: tight, new engines drink more gas than broken-in ones. And I think new engines today are tighter than new engines were in the past (hence the surprising increases in the mileage of today's new models after a few thousand miles). Just hang in there!

parky129

I bought my HHR in August 25 2005, The gas milege has varied between 29.5 and 27MPG US. 2.4 automatic country living little high traffic driving, garage sales each week so that takes care of stop and go. I always check mileage against input. The on board indicator is a little lower than actual mileage. Hang in there mileage will improve.

mchhr

I picked up my HHR on Labor Day and have gently put 1101 miles on it. I seem to get either 28.4 or 29.4 mpg per IDC on trips of 100-125 miles. I'm thinking the lower mileage is on 90 plus days. I seem to spend a lot of time with my foot completely off the gas pedal, and almost never use cruise control. I got the automatic for the ease of in-town driving, and the 2.4 engine for the hills into town. I have removed the rear seat headrests, and the visibility is much improved.
Hubby even managed to set the clock.

micweb

However my fuel economy has not been all that great. Getting 15.9-16.6 in town which is where most of driving is. Had hoped for better.

The key question is: what kind of mileage where you getting in your previous vehicle? How much city driving are you doing? City driving really kills mileage, it's only on the freeway where you bring up your average.

16 mpg is not bad for a 3200 pound vehicle with an automatic, given current driving habits. I got 16 mpg with an '86 VW Golf with an automatic...it freaked me out too, but eventually I figured out driving on nothting but city streets is the hardest driving you'll ever do.

labrat6

You need to give it a little more time to come into its own. I have just turned 1700 miles on mine and it improves with each mile I drive. We are all to anxious for the best to happen without wanting to wait. Then again we all read the EPA numbers and expect them to be gospel. With the subjective sliding scale they use to arrive at their numbers it a wonder they come as close as they do. If you are seriously thinking about getting rid of it, put it on Ebay and with the shortage of them in dealer showrooms you will probably get close to full retail for it. They are in demand. Of course any dealer you approach will want to skin you alive if he can and knows he can resell it quickly and at a nice profit .

poncho167

A little off topic: Yes I agree the $16,000 Cobalt is probably the best one for the money over all, depreciation, etc. But I disagree with the notion that no Cobalt is worth more than $20,000. The Cobalt is competively priced and the SS by some is considered a bargain for what you get for the money-performance, above average looks.. If you read the tests on Cobalt sedans and coupes, quite commonly they are at the near or at the top in their class. There are about 10 cars like the Cobalt who come in around $20,000 including the Toyota Corolla. There sure must be a lot of over-priced cars out there in this class. The SS is a lot of car for $20-23,000, and will out perform the Mustang V6 in every way, not to mention the V8 GT in some catagories.

62vetteefp

Do not listen to M1 He thinks it is crazy to buy a new car due to appreciation. Well it might be crazy but some of us (almost 20 million a year) want a new car anyway.

vanman1

For people who are getting 16-17 city, you will never get much more than that if

1. You are using your A/C or
2. You are doing a lot of stop/go or
3. You sit in traffic jams fairly regularly

City mileage can be killer and no car will do well under these conditions.

m1miata

" Do not listen to M1 He thinks it is crazy to buy a new car due to appreciation. Well it might be crazy but some of us (almost 20 million a year) want a new car anyway. "

:::::END QUOTE::::::

I assume you meant to say depreciation and not appreciation. Depends on the car and how much money you have to blow. I bought a new PT because it has not only a great warranty, but was nearly the same price as a used one. Most GM cars drop like a rock the first couple of years, or so. As for the HHR, it is hard to say. I assume it will be better than say a Buick or Pontiac, which is usually near half off in a couple years. Not a very good investment. IF a GM is as good as they say it is, why not improve on the warranty, and why not buy used, as they say they are now as good as Japan makes. Save $5K to$25K depending on the car, buy it used and spend the money on gas

I have owned new cars over the years, and a few made sense as buys. Had a first year Stealth, which was a base model, and cost less than what people are paying now for a Cobalt. Looked as good as the $34K model. Had a new Mustang which held value pretty well. But the Olds 98 Regency and the Olds Starfire were bad choices in new cars. The Olds 98 dropped like a rock for resale. The Starfire started rusting and parts falling off in 3 to 5 year period. That would be a poor choice used too. As I got older, I got more selective in which cars to buy new. The Corolla was a good one to buy new, but they hold their value. I bought a Miata used, with only 36K miles on her for $7,200, which was around a third of current model cost. Since you can buy a PT, with air, out the door for around $14,600, I figured it was a fair deal, and has a 7 year warranty.

Now, crazy is a good thing too, if ya got the bucks! A new Corvette would be nice. I am far too poor, and cheap to buy one new. A C5 is in my future dreams. Well they look cool anyway. I have only driven the C4, which was OK. I assume the C5 is far superior, and easier on the back getting in and out of.

:shades: Loren