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I bought my '04 Prius two years ago, I am a male over 50 yrs old. I see equal numbers of men and women driving Prii. Without asking you cannot tell if a woman driver is the purchaser or co-owner. If someone enjoys ranting and raving about getting on the Houston freeway systems just mention it once, don't write a novel about it. I use intelligence and discretion when entering the freeway. I'll punch it if necessary otherewise I'll enter in an intelligent manner. My previous car was a 1984 Corvette, so I know how to merge with authority. I've successfully made the transition from race car to an intellect car.
I've read somewhere that 102 mph was about max for the Prius. I've pushed mine up to 82 when passing and detected no ceiling. Most people I've spoken with buy the Prius for a combo of reasons: The mpg, enviromental contributions, storage capability, tax breaks, driving in the HOV lanes (Calif) as well as no smog checks req'd. Plus, being a conversation piece in parking lots is pretty cool, too.
Buy a car for what you need. Don't bash another's choice preference. Show support and respect, save the Rant/Rave for Craigslist.
Thanks,
Rich
About "saving the planet": I figured that if I bought a Prius, somebody would buy and drive my Outback so therefore I'm not reducing the amount of emissions. Cancels out per se. This would be different if Toyota was begging people to buy the Prius, which is certainly not the case.
Subaru is working with Toyota (to a certain extent) to add hybrid vehicles to the lineup. I just need to wait a couple of years.
Anyway, I decided to try to boost the mileage of my Outback by driving it like I probably would a Prius: smooth acceleration, shifting earlier, predicting traffic lights, coasting more often, not worrying about maintaining speed up hills and (most frustratingly) slashing highway speeds from 80-85 to 65-70. On the first tank driving this way I upped my MPGs from a 5 month trailing average of 21.7 to 24.3 (that's like going from 42 to 53 in a Prius from a total consumption standpoint). That's just one tank but it's nice to actually see a positive result. In warm weather I might be able to get this to 26. 75% suburban/25% highway driving.
The most efficient way for the Prius to cover a given distance is at a constant speed with the gasoline engine running, and at the optimum speed for efficiency. This speed would probably be something like 35 mph which would not be safe or practical for US highways. As you increase speed above the most efficient speed the mpg decreases because of increasing air resistance and increasing frictional losses in the engine, drivetrain, and tires.
In a hybrid like the Prius the gasoline engine is the ultimate source of power. If for a short time you use energy from the batteries to power the electric motors, then the gasoline engine must run more later to recharge the batteries, a process which is less efficient than using the gas engine to run the car without discharging and then recharging the battery.
Having a battery increases efficiency for two reasons: 1) it allows the gas engine to operate for more of the time near its most efficient power output level, and 2) it allows for regenerative braking, in which some (but probably only about 20%) of the kinetic energy of the moving vehicle is recaptured during braking and stored as electo-chemical energy in the battery. With ordinary brakes all the kinetic energy is converted to heat and lost.
Using a Prius for 90% highway driving will give good fuel economy if you don't drive fast and aggressively on the highway. Imagine the following highway driving scenario. You drive on 2 lane roads at 65 mph, but sometimes encounter logging trucks traveling at 55 mph and you want to pass them safely. The battery boost will give you the extra acceleration to do this. If you had only the Prius gas engine you could travel at constant highway speed just as efficiently (and with less capital outlay), but would have no reserve passing power.
In short--a Prius gets excellent mpg at highway speed.
In short--a Prius gets excellent mpg at highway speed.
Weird...
This is my exact commute, 75 mi in each direction, daily. substitute 63 mph instead because the 'highway' is a full access rural highway with up to 6 troopers/cruisers/unmarked cruisers on the 50 mi stretch interspersed with logging trucks and three school zones.
I can't get get lower than 44 mpg and can with good weather conditions get right at 50 mpg.
The HSD design provides electric power directly to the motor from the engine, when needed. Charging the battery may or may not occur at the same time. So it may be true (but not necessarily so) that the electric motor will run off the battery. The electric motor can run off of battery only, engine electricity only, or both, as the situation dictates.
I was wondering if you would mind answering some questions from me about your career change. I am at the stage of considering career change myself and I would like to get your insight about going to work for a Toyota dealer (I think that is what you said was your career change.)
Would you mind answering some questions? If so, could you send me an email so that I can send you my questions? (Your email address is "private" in your profile.) I have an email address listed on the Bio: line in my profile (you need to replace the "at" and "dot" with the actual characters.)
Thanks.
clethro
Month sales 2005 .... 2006
Jan.. 5600 .... 7700
Feb.. 7100 .... 6500
Mar.. 10200
Apr.. 11300
May.. 9500
Jun.. 9600
Jul.. 9700
Aug.. 9900
Sep.. 8200
Oct.. 9900
Nov.. 7900
Dec.. 9000
By Qtr
1st.. 22900
2nd.. 30400
3rd.. 27800
4th.. 26800
Monthly Sales
Mar.. 10200 ... 7900
By Qtr
1st.. 22900 .... 22100
You should bo well in a Prius.
If your are in really desolate winter conditions, then maybe you need to stick with AWD.
What do your neighbors drive? How do their vehicles handle in the sno?. If they can get buy without AWD then the Prius will do fine. However, if all of your neighbors have AWD or 4WD then I wouldn't get FWD and especially wouldn't get RWD.
Had a rich friend who drove a Carrera 4 with snow tires as his winter car, LOL
Good Luck,
MidCow
P.S. - You could always move to Houston, then RWD or FWD work fine all the time
I don't dare tap the breaks with these people to send them a message, because they'll literally slam into my rear bumper. Anybody have any advice for me?
Or get really good insurance and put the brakes on harder next time.
Beware if you own a Prius 1. And who knows about the Prius 2?
In UK there will be a Prius recall:
link title
My observation has been that if a driver persists in tailgating, i.e. has an opportunity to pass in the left lane, at least 50% of the time the driver is talking on a cell phone and is too lazy to pass.
I'll slow down to 50mph if necessary to encourage such a driver to pass. Some of my friends criticize this as an unsafe driving practice but so is a driver following you at one car length for 5 miles at 60mph.
My sense is that some non hybrid drivers intentionally commit aggressive driving acts against hybrid drivers but with so much aggressive driving in general its hard to form an opinion on this.
Thanks,
Chintan Talati
Corporate Communications
Edmunds.com
The Japanese automaker said its sales were up 7 percent in March compared with a year earlier, driven by a 15 percent jump in truck and SUV sales. But Prius sales were down 22 percent as production problems slowed down Toyota's effort to supply the high-mileage gas-electric vehicles to its U.S. dealers.
Prius sales
Tundra -8.9% m/m
Sequoia -21.8% m/m
Highlander -12.8% m/m
Some products are up and some are down for different reasons. Besides how are you going to buy a hybrid Tundra or diesel Tundra when they come out if Toyota isn't in the truck business.
Because there are better hybrid alternatives now. You think it is bad now, just wait until the government props go away.
... And people are finally beginning realize the payback period on gas savings is very, very, very long!
Hey JOHN1701A don't fret your gas mileage will begin paying you back in just a couple of more years :P
Cheers,
MidCow
Now, regarding the Prius in particular and hybrids in general, that whole cost - benefit analysis is likely to change dramatically for two reasons. One, the price of gas is going to keep climbing until the next major global recession hits. I anticipate that gas will be right around $3 for the summer. The second factor is that it is inevitable that in the next few years we (the US) are going to have to finally confront global warming and that we are going to be faced with carbon taxes and a mandated reduction in CO2 emissions. California has already passed new limitations that are due to go into effect with model year 2009. The automakers are desperately fighting California in the courts. If California wins, all the money the manufacturers spent on legal costs is wasted when it could better have been spent on R&D.
It's not that tough to figure out. The Prius was developed for two basic reasons. To save fossil fuel and lower emissions. Japan was hot on their number one auto maker to do something so they could try and meet the obligations signed with the Kyoto Treaty.
When the Prius hit our shores with it's advertised 48 MPG folks were skeptical. Some of us tried them and a few bought them. The early Prius was a little econobox similar to the Echo. Not great looking and only got limited attention. Then someone at Toyota had the brilliant idea to get the Greenies in Hollywood interested. The rest is history as far as popularity. If the Prius II had lived up to the hype and most owners were getting 55 MPG combined, I don't think you would see all the cost counting. When the actual mileage started to be publicized many started calculating the pay back. The big question, was the high prices being asked justified? If you are only buying the car for the luxury features, there are nicer cars in the same price range. If you like the high tech aspects then I don't see any reason for worrying about the price. If you are on a budget and the gas mileage is your main concern, there are less expensive options.
Are other people pointing out to those buyers that they'll never break even on the difference between the $40K SUV that they bought instead of, say, a $25K or $30K minivan?
I for one do not see much similarity between an SUV and a minivan. I don't see why people would consider an SUV if all they need to do is haul kids and stuff to soccer practice. Unless of course they live where it snows a lot. Or they have a travel trailer they take camping on the weekends. Those comparisons are so much different than whether to "hybridize" or not.
Now I just don't get it. How can someone compare the hybrid system in an SUV to buying leather seats or a moonroof. Where is the logic there? The only logic I can attach to the Hybrid SUVs is for someone that feels very strongly that they are using more than their share of fossil fuel or dumping a few more ounces of pollution in the air than they should. You cannot put a price on guilt. It is quite obvious that is the main impetus in buying these high powered hybrid SUVs. Apply salve to the guilty conscience, while not giving up any of the power and size of the vehicle.
I must point out that this is opinion. There is no doubt that the planet is warming, but it is not a fact that it is CO2 that is causing this. And carbon reductions don't work. Last time I checked, the cost was 170 billion $$ for a reduction in temperature of 0.001762619 °C.
I agree that the US (and the world) will have to confront global warming, but most like by adjusting to it. Warming (and cooling) happens, and has always happened during the planet's life cycle.
We have the EPA and its testing that is unrepresentative of how people actually drive to thank for the misleading hype.
I don't see why people would consider an SUV if all they need to do is haul kids and stuff to soccer practice.
The SUVs I see aren't pulling or hauling anything. It makes sense for big families to have them. The ones I see have either just a driver alone or may have the driver plus up to two kids and maybe a second adult.
Apply salve to the guilty conscience,
I used to wonder about conscience and the guilt factor. Then I read "The Tragedy of the Commons" (written by Garrett Hardin in 1968.) Now, I'm enlightened about conscience and guilt.
And the year or longer waiting lists in 2004 started before the government prop of $100-$500 off their taxes was even known by most people (perhaps even before it was instituted).
None of those that I know that have an SUV use it to haul anything besides kids (and about half of those don't even half kids).
Azera road test... EPA 19/28/24 .. Edmunds 17.7 - 25% off
Sonata road test... EPA 20/30/25 .. Edmunds 19.6 - 22% off
Camry road test... EPA 22/31/27 .. Edmunds 20.4 - 24% off
It seems dependent on the driver and the way the vehicle is used. What a revelation!
Maybe what we, the consumer, need is for an enterprising attorney to bring a class action lawsuit on our behalf. People who are concerned about fuel economy buy based on those EPA numbers and then are disappointed when they calculate their overall mileage and find they are well under the EPA number. Disclaimers (the fine print) or not, the numbers are in large type, the numbers are hyped on the TV commercials. The numbers are what we see. How many consumers read the fine print or hear the disclaimer being spoken in a soft voice in the TV commercials? How many consumers even know what the EPA's testing procedures are?
A consumer armed with knowledge is a more powerful consumer.
I heard they were going to limit cow production because the amount of methane gas they are producing is a major coause of the greenhouse effect. Are the going to have a cow tax or a vegetarian credit ?
Buying a Prius is good, but the reason is notto save money!
Cheers,
MidCow
The naysayers have their arguments, but we know that the Prius pollutes less. Of course it costs more...does anybody think that the implementation of that kind of technology would be cheap? Somehow I suspect that the noise from non-owners would be louder if the Prius did actually get the EPA rated mpg.
I think you bought the right car for you for the right reasons. Very clear explanation.
Enjoy your Prius
Cheers,
MiCow
I know the car is FWD and has all the latest skid/ABS technology, but the car is incredibly light. Can anyone speak to how their car performed - whether they changed out tires (snow tires) or added weight to the car to make it more stable.
Any info would be appreciated. Thanks!
Through March 31 Toyota/Lexus has delivered 42175 hybrid vehicles, thus the 60,000 limit should be reached right around May 1st. All 2nd qtr and all 3rd Qtr deliveries will qualify for the full credit - again subject to your personal tax situation.
Prius .. $3150
HH .. $2600
400h .. $2200
TCH .. TBC
Estimates on other models
2006 HCH .. $2100
2005 HCH .. $1700
2006 Insight .. $1450
HAH .. $650
FEH 2WD .. $2600
FEH 4WD .. $1950
Mariner 4WD .. $1950
I've been bucking snow drifts since the early '80s in everything from MGB, Pinto, Escort, and now my lowly Saturn. I love a small car in winter because I don't have to worry about flipping over and with a manual transmission, I can just about get out of anything -- including my extremely steep gravel driveway which is often ice covered. And one the 2 occasions when I ended up in a drift (my fault!) my brother pushed me out by himself once and once my 15 year old son popped me out on just brute strength. Try that with an SUV!
I'm not knocking every big vehicle -- coming from the farm and construction fields, I appreciate my truck, too. But these city slickers are just sheep, buying a marketing strategy because "the Man" told them they look cooler in a big vehicle. You'll see them buying the expensive brand of shampoo for the same reason.
Does anyone have an opinion as to any potential adverse effects with having 40PSI on all four tires?
Mine are 42 front and 40 back. It's fairly surprising that your dealer has filled them to 'preferred' levels upon the original delivery. That's a good sign I'd say.
Yes, the Prius hardcore like to run the tires like rocks; I have the opposite bias - I drive the car like any other, and refuse to put up with the rocky ride and dodgy behavior of the car with the tires at super-level pressures.
Take your choice, and see what works for you; the tires are not overburdened with the weight of this car, even at lower levels than the factory recommends - it's all about rolling resistance and fuel economy, vs comfort and a more normal feel. You decide.
Our car, with an engine that is still barely broken in, consistently gets 40 mpg on regular. Any attempt to pay attention boosts that figure to 45 mpg. It is especially economical if the engine gets warm and doesn't significantly cool down during the day, which would be a typical profile for a RE agent - 50 mpg would be within reason. You do the math...fuel costs would be, say, 1/3 of the Pathfinder?
"Yes, the Prius hardcore like to run the tires like rocks; I have the opposite bias - I drive the car like any other, and refuse to put up with the rocky ride and dodgy behavior of the car with the tires at super-level pressures. "
I completley agree, not to mention the safety factor. Yes, you will get slightly better mileage, but you reduce your handling and normal car behavior.
You have to ask yourself is the higher mileage worth the lower safety factor due to pooer handling? (Not that the Prius handles or accelerates all that well to start with)
Good luck and BE SAFE!
MidCow
I predict as gas prices continue to go up so will air pressures
blkmamba- Hi and welcome to the Prius forum! I've had my Prius since Feb '04 and have averaged a lifetime mileage of just over 44 mpg. I live in California so mpg is lower than other folks get out of this state. (Blended gasoline recipes, cleaner enviro, etc). I would encourage you to look into one, join the Prius world and take that step ahead.
cheryl06prius- Look back several hundred posts ago in this forum and look to see what john1701a has shared regarding tire pressures vs mpg. I agree with the previous poster that rock hard tires can affect the traction and ride of a vehicle for the sake of improving gas mileage. I've been running 42 front/ 40 back for the time I've owned my car (26k miles odo). I had my share of swerving to avoid things and the ride probably could be smoother. However, I have noticed a definite decline in mpg when my tire pressures haven't been reguarly checked. I can handle a rougher ride to gain 4-5 more mpg. My wife's car is an '01 LaSabre and it rides like a dream with 36 psi. It just passed 50k miles with the original tires. I have read in past posts that the Prius factory tires in the '04 year probably won't last beyond 28k miles, but I think that's more due to the quality of tire than air pressure.
Thanks,
Rich