Oh, that was almost too good to pass up, but since my husband is looking over my shoulder, I better not.
I'm afraid that I don't have the skills to help someone out of the CCBS group. In fact, I need to start one called:
"I never get to have a nice new car until the old one absolutely dies and the mechanics refuse to work on it any more, and our parents are fussing at us about what we are driving their grandkids around in..."
It is amazing that there really isn't the perfect family car yet. There are plenty that work and get the job done, but each one we looked at seemed to be lacking at least one feature to make them really great - easy for me to get into, plenty of leg room for all three rows, great gas mileage, comfortable to drive, reliable, etc.
I think I need to get back to work on my calculations to warp space so that the inside of a car is bigger than the outside.
should be called "Chronic Car Keeper Syndrome". We know people like you and we are jealous. There's always the next best thing. However, since we now have the baby we have real requirements now as far as safety and features go. Everything we look at has some drawback. For instance, the above-mentioned Mazda5 on the outside is perfect. Compact size, excellent features for the price, and seating for 6. However, upon closer inspection we realized that it doesn't have a factory DVD option, the gas mileage is barely better than our Odyssey which has much more HP, and the engine revs are at 4000 when driving 70MPH. Might as well keep the Odyssey and buy it at the end of the lease. Only car that seems better at what our 2004 Odyssey does is a 2005 Odyssey. More room, more features, more safety, more power, and 30 MPG on the highway with the EX+ versions.
......would be one that has a feature that completely disallows the use of a cell phone while driving. Come to think of it, that would be a good feature for everyone!
Hey, have you ever considered a portable DVD system, instead of a factory installed one? It works for us quite well.
Each kid gets his/her own for less than the cost of one installed. I don't have long drives around town, though, so always having it in all the time isn't important - we use them just on long trips.
If I did have longer commutes, it might be a different story. It is amazing how many ways they can find to aggravate each other, and the "keep 'em busy" tactic would be a requirement.
Another question: Does the Accord fit you all well, except for the storage space, or is there back seat space issues? We'll be needed to get a better commuter car within the next year, but would like the whole family to fit in, too.
DVD player might be an option but it's so convenient to have it already there in the car. And it will be a bit before I would trust him to hold a portable DVD player. My commute to work is almost 40 miles each way. In the mini-van I can use the DVD player to occupy him, in the Accord the best tactic is McDonald's french fries and a sippy cup. I know McDonald's is bad for him but he still eats all of his vegetables so I treat him every now and then.
Now that we don't have to carry the heavy duty stroller everywhere with us the Accord has more than enough room. The trunk will comfortably hold all of our luggage + the diaper bag + any misc. items we pick up along the way. As I said before, Gee is 6'6 and I am 5'2. I can easily sit behind him even with the seat adjusted all the way back for him. This includes the seat back being reclined as well, not with him sitting straight up. Our car seat is fairly large (Alpha Omega 3-in-1) and I can easily sit on either side of the car seat as can my Mother-in-Law who is about 5'7 and 160 lbs.
As far as driving goes, I love my Accord. It's the 4 cylinder 5-speed manual version and I get about 32 MPG during my mixed driving. The automatic I had got an average of 31 MPG so there isn't a huge difference. It's comfortable, quiet, smooth, and all 3 versions of this generation I have owned have been reliable. It's also one of the safest sedans in it's class thanks to the standard side curtain airbags. The 2006 versions will have refreshed front/rear styling, ESC on V6 models, and more HP. There will supposedly be a LX-V6 version that has alloy wheels, moonroof, and VSA. Definitely a great car for the price IMO. As a commuter I don't think it can be beat. The Camry is also a good choice if you want a slightly softer ride vs. the Accord's slightly firmer ride.
What about an after-market DVD system installed in the car? It's still a lot cheaper than factory-installed and you can often get a bigger screen. But watch out, because bigger screens can also mean less rear visibility for the driver.
Concerning booster seats... I love the idea of the built in booster, but it is a pricey option. True booster seats (as opposed to child seats) can be bought for less than $20, and easy switched between cars or you can buy a set for both cars, keep them in the trunk, etc. (High back booster cost a bit more, but you don't need a high-backed booster unless your car doesn't have head restraints (a.k.a. head rests).
Another option is a Ford Freestyle. I have 12,000 miles on it and it's great. About 25mpg HWY, seats 6 or 7, quiet and roomy inside, and it drives like a car, not a minivan or SUV. It's basically the wagon version of the Ford 500. I paid $24K. And it's a safe 5 star rating for everything and has side curtain airbags. The transmission is continuous variable tranny CVT used on Volvo.
"So far the Mazda5 came close but the engine is a bit high-strung. There doesn't seem to be anything that meets all of that criteria but an Element meets most and is fairly inexpensive."
And the Element's isn't? On paper, at least, they look quite similar. Plus the Mazda5 get's better mileage and is roomier (however, if you drive aggressively, fuel economy is moot). The only concern would be your husband's size. I have heard some complaints from drivers with longer legs.
PS - in the spirit of full disclosure, I am the proud owner of a Mazda5 Touring Edition with a 5-speed.
has the Accord's 2.4L engine which, IMO, is a better engine than the 2.3L used in the Mazda5. The torque is more evenly distributed and it's a smoother engine. The Element puts out more HP and more torque at lower RPM. Gas mileage is not significantly better in the Mazda5 considering it's more of a car than the Element. The 2WD Element 5-speed gets 21/26 and the Mazda5 Touring gets 22/27.
The Mazda5 may be roomier in the sense that it has seating for 6 but the Element has a much roomier feel inside. It is wider and taller and the second row is livable for adults. It also has more total passenger volume than the Mazda5. No third row of seating but we have used the third row in our Odyssey a total of maybe 5 times since we bought it in May of last year.
As you said, my husband can not drive the Mazda5 unless he lowers the seat to it's lowest setting. At that point he can drive it but he likes a higher driving position.
Last but not least, Mazda uses Sirius and we like XM.
Don't know if any of you caught the controversy a month or so ago, but the economist who wrote "Freakonomics" is saying that booster seats don't protect kids better than seat belts. I think them's fightin' words! :mad: Check it out and tell me what you think!
We are expecting our 4th child in 6+ months... that will be 3 kids in car seats and one in a booster...so we have to upgrade. There is plenty of data out there about all the SUVs/minivans/crossovers/Suburbans/vans, but not too much data for someone with what will be 4 under 5.
We currently have a Honda Accord which has been perfect for three car seats. We still marvel at the folks that felt they had no other choice than to buy big with one child or two (now if it's a choice, that's fine...but it is a choice, not a requirement). We can reach all three car seats while standing outside. No stepping in or traversing between or over captains chairs.
So what are our options for 4 kids? It seems to boil down to a traditional minivan or maybe a Mazda5. There are some SUVs and of course the ubiquitous Suburban, but I'd like to get a bit better gas mileage and don’t want to force my wife to master a huge vehicle in the city.
Any thoughts? Any hybrid versions coming down the pike for the 07 models? Does the Mazda5 have enough room for all seats occupied, a stroller and some groceries? Doesn’t seem like it from photos.
felt kind of small for the 3 of us. For 6 people I can't see it being comfortable. The best choice for you really depends on your price range. The Pilot is much larger and only gets a couple MPG less than the Mazda5.
FYI the Pacific has three rows of 2 seats, so if you get that you'll have car seats or the booster in each seat, and the space behind row three is to tiny for much of anything. I'm surprised that the Accord was big enough for three across car seats. I guess you didn't take many vacations or if you did I don't know how you managed to fit all of the luggage, strollers, diaper bags, etc into the trunk. You must be a better packer than us!
You could look at the Honda Pilot or Toyota Highlander as they're more car-like SUVs with three rows. I have a Ford Freestyle that seats seven. Row 2 has space for three, so you'd need to put the booster seat on the seat the you'd flip up to gain access to row 3, and then if you had to carry a lot of stuff you could fold half of the split row 3. Or you could go for the row 2 captain chairs. You'd only have a six seater, but you'd have easier access to row 3, and the Freestyle has pretty good space behind the third row. Or you could go for one of the smaller minivans (Kia Sedona, Mazda MPV) if you didn't want a big minivan.
I admit my theory is a stretch, but one thing is for certain: The 2005 Chrysler Pacifica flawlessly blends the practicality of a minivan with the sporty appearance of an SUV.
With roomy seating for six, the second row of the Pacifica has captain’s chairs and the third row is a 50/50 split folding seat. Installing car seats in the second row is a piece of cake (quite literally considering that I found a big piece of a Madeline cookie stuck to the bottom of one of them when taking it out of my last test car). These second row seats slide front and back independently from each other to make a huge amount of legroom or shorten the distance between driver and child (very helpful when reaching back to rescue the systematically “dropped” stuffed animal). They also fold and tumble flat if extra space is needed or lift up and rotate on front hinges allowing easy access to the third row.
I have a Highlander, and I can tell you it's definitely not the car for you. The second row seat is really too tight for three across, particularly with car seats. Even if you decided to only put two kids in the second row, the middle seat is narrow and is not conducive to car seats. Any minivan should do, but the Sienna will be coming out in hybrid form, I think, for 2007. That will be too long to wait. Look seriously at the Pilot as well as the Pacifica, but I think you'll find the Pacifica more spacious. The Freestyle is also a good choice, but bear in mind that Ford may be discontinuing it, and that could affect resale value. If you've got tons of money, look at the new Mercedes R-class, which is similar in layout to a Pacifica and has third row seats that are incredibly easy to access.
Honestly, however, I think it's time to bite the bullet and get a large minivan. I don't think you'll regret it because they are the most practical vehicle for the job; they're safe; and often they're cheaper than the SUVs. Add to that the automatic sliding doors (a true gift from Heaven when trying to get kids in and out.) The Odyssey seats 8 now and would be a great choice. (Don't doubt that as your children grow that you will have to include even more kids in the car for playdates, etc.) Any car where the third row seat is optional is, almost by definition, not built for the kind of roominess you're going to need.
One more word of advice. Some cars have a 60/40 split in the second row seat that favors the curb side of the car, but others split the seat differently and favor the street side. Since you wouldn't want you kids loading from the street side, be sure of this when you're looking.
Great thoughts rqueen! Thank you. And thanks to all for the input.
Over the last couple of weeks of researching and peeking in cars, I came to the conclusion that a large minivan was the way to go. None of the crossovers or SUVs were ideal for a large family close but not quite. And by close, I mean by approx 3 inches.
The Pilot third row has a hip width of 49 inches. That’s 3 inches too short for my current 52-inch 3-car-seat Accord configuration. I don’t expect to have three car seats all in the third row any time soon, but it just seems odd to get a “big” car that has less width in the back than the current sedan. I have yet to check out a Pilot, and still will when I go look at an Odyssey.
By comparison, the Sienna, which I checked out at a dealership today, has exactly 52 inches in the third row the same as my Accord. (Still feels odd – seems a “van” should be wider.)
I am planning on at looking at the Honda Odyssey, the Toyota Sienna, the Dodge Grand Caravan and the Honda Pilot. I may check out the Kia Sedona as a more economical choice as well.
General thoughts are that minis get better gas mileage, provide for have cheaper insurance, easier ingress and egress, easier loading and unloading, more storage room (especially with the big holes in the floor of some models), and they are cheaper. Beyond the cool factor, I can find no reason not to get a minivan over an SUV/crossover, and it would be too uncool to let “cool” alone dictate an big and important purchase like this.
If anyone suggests any other vehicle to check out please let me know.
From reading the brochure of most of all the above mentioned rides, it’s clear that the marketing departments and/or the people that ask the questions don’t have many kids-- few pictures with car seats, few layouts or set pics with the full 8 seats.
I have rented two Grand Caravans for family road trips, and liked them both. Built in car seats are simply incredible! I only wish they’d offer the built-ins in the third row as well. Again no one seems to be designing for a big family. I am a bit surprised that only Chrysler offers this great feature.
For this one reason, the Grand Caravan is in the early lead. And the Caravan has the big holes in the floor to accommodate the Stow & Go seating. I’d be getting the bench second row which doesn’t stow, but the holes are still there for choice storage. Third and finally, the Dodge is cheaper than the Japanese cousins and the amenities advantage of the Honda/Toyota are extras I don’t need or want or think my kids will have fun destroying. OK that’s three reasons instead of one.
After seeing the Toyota today, the Front and Center added middle seat in the second row is great! Still allows for bucket seats/no bench and it will slide up so that a baby is closer to the driver. That is a great feature.
I will definitely check out the 60/40 driver side issue never would have thought of that thank you again.
Current thoughts and remaining questions which are all easily answered at the dealerships at some point:
Does anyone else have built in car seats?
Can I get a built in DVD player with the low model of these makers. The Toyota brochure seems like I cannot. That’s really the only upgrade that seems worthwhile based on the brochures. (I can be convinced the automatic door is key, but I’m not quite there yet.)
In the Caravan, can a third kid or adult fit in the seat/space between the two built in car seats in the second row bench? I should be able to answer this myself, as I have driven two, but I can’t recall.
In the Honda, is the skinny little stick-in-the-middle seat for the second row functional? Seems a bit smallish.
Can Mom reach the third row seat of an SUV (Pilot) easier than a mini? Is a skinner but closer third row more convenient for loading little ones?
Does 3M make a super-dooper-teflon-titanium-heavy-duty-4-kid-proof Scotch Guard?
You don't mention looking at the Ford Freestyle. Don't over look this for a Pilot or Pacifica. It is likely the largest of the crossovers and rivals mini van in size. Can get second row bench. More room in back than Pilot. Depending on the level you can probably get every feature the other offer including DVD, Nav, AWD, leather, power everything, side curtains to third row, good fuel economy.
Check the consumer reviews here on this car - owners are very happy with it.
Shame they might continue the Freestyle. I drove it earlier this year and loved it but for it's underpowered, noisy engine. If they gave it 250 horsepower and backed any of their products up with better quality, I'd have bought it. Chrysler, as you'll read on the forums, does not seem to have a great rep for quality or customer service. I would love, love , love to buy a Pacifica! Quiet, roomy and powerful and clean, simple interior. Drove one over a weekend as a rental and loved it, but Chrysler doesn't have a good rep. One guy on the Pacifica forum called his a "Pacificrap!" ; ) So I'm looking at a Pilot or a Highlander and I have a feeling the Pilot is going to win out. NowI only have one kid, but a big dog, a hubby, lots of road trips in So Cal. If I had two kids, hands down I would be driving a Honda Oddessey -- drove one last year when the 2005 came out and loved it. But can't justify a mini with one kid but station wagon options are so limited. (I have a Saab wagon now, used to have a Merc Sable wagon.)
I think you need to reevaluate the Chrysler/Dodge minivans. Their quality has gone way up in the last several years. There is very little complaints on the 2002-2006 models. Even the 2001 has been pretty good. With the stow-n-go seats or just having a bench seat and having those two large storage bins, make it a great family van. You can load them down with toys, diaper bag or what ever and still keep your van neat and clean. Plus it still carries the extended engine and power train warrantee. It's a perfect van for a family with kids.
Both the current Odyssey and Sienna earn Good ratings in the frontal offset and side impact tests from the IIHS. Both have standard side airbags for the 2006 model year.
The Chrysler vans score only an Acceptable in the frontal test and haven't yet been tested in the side.
Also consider resale/residual value. The Japanese cars are a more practical buy if you think you'll keep your car for a while. But if you want a Pacifica, don't let one dodo from Chrysler turn you off. The car is really pretty awesome in terms of its spaciousness and amenities. You'll outgrow it a lot less quickly than you would a Highlander, though the Pilot is somewhat more roomy.
If you've seen any of the Los Angeles or Detroit Auto Show coverage, you've seen a lot of interesting new cars that appeal to families. The new Dodge Durango, the first Audi SUV, new cars from Jeep, Lincoln, and more. CUV -- Crossover Utility Vehicle -- is the watchword this year. Anybody have opinions?
I was wondering if anyone else has had this problem .. I have a 2003 Mustang gt.. I cannot find a rear facing infant seat that will fit in the car allowing the driver and passenger to be in the car also.. If anyone has found a seat that fits please post it model # brand and all... The car has all the locking things for all different kinds of car seats. I have even called ford motor company.. We do have another car and suv but the mustang is more fun and gets great gas mileage!!
Mustangmommy,were you able to find anything? This raises concerns for me. My husband really has his heart set on getting a 2006 Mustang, but we are planning for a baby within the year and as much as I'd love a mustang, I want something more Mommy friendly. --darn nesting instincts!! Have you found it to be terribly impractical?
I don't care what they say, the Mustang is not a family car. Let it be your husband's car if necessary, but you'll get pretty frustrated after a while if this is your main mode of family transport. Those back seats are mighty tight and it won't be easy to strap a baby into a car seat -- let alone a thrashing toddler. Let us know what you decide!
I have been looking through the boards and at automakers websites, and I just can't seem to find anything that has the capacity for 7 - don't need it all the time so smaller rear/stow away seats are fine! - with THREE of those seats being in the middle (i.e. a bench with shoulder harnesses -a must!) that at least lists under 25K.
Am I being delusional to think that there is one or does such a beast just not exist?? :confuse:
The trend seems to be bucket/captains in the middle which does NOT work for me
Thank you, thank you, thank you for any help. This has really been driving me nuts!
Well, Ford Freestyle has an option for a second row 60-40 foldable bench seat, so it will seat 7. I do not know if the middle seat of this second row bench has a shoulder harness available.
Shoulder harness is not quite as critical in the middle row of any back seat as there is virtually nothing to hit your head on in the event of a front impact, which is where the shoulder harness has its most effect.
If kept to the base model, Freestyle can be bought for south of $25K with the rebates that are available.
I have a Freestyle SE that can be bought for under $25K easily with dealer incentives. The middle seat in the 2nd row does have shoulder harness. I have 25,000 miles on the car and so far zero problems.
Other options would probably be in the used car category...a used Sienna with 2nd row bench, Toyota Highlander, or Honda Pilot.
I have an ’04 Mustang and right after we bought our rear-facing infant seat and tried to install it I came to the realization that I was going to have to buy a new car until my dear hubby realized that the back seat of the mustang has 3 different ways to install the car seat with the LATCH system on either the passenger or driver side ( which is impossible due to the fact that you would have to have the seat up so far no one would be able to fit in it) or you can actually install it in the middle of the two seats, with the added advantage that the two front seats then nestle the car seat nicely and keep it snug. I may be a little harder to get the car seat in and out but beats me having to sell the car I love!
"I have been looking through the boards and at automakers websites, and I just can't seem to find anything that has the capacity for 7 - don't need it all the time so smaller rear/stow away seats are fine! - with THREE of those seats being in the middle (i.e. a bench with shoulder harnesses -a must!) that at least lists under 25K."
Perhaps the most flexible option would be a Toyota Sienna CE 8-passenger model. Those start at about 25k list but are hard to find in many areas.
The 4x2 Highlander base model with the third row option is about 26k list, but it does have a 2-3-2 seating arrangement.
I do believe that would be possible, based on my observation. When I was considering one about 3 or 4 months ago, I needed atleast 2 car seats to fit plus diaper bag that was easily handy. We put it (diaper bag) in the middle of the seats. I do believe 3 car seats would be possible, but if I was a mom and had 3 kids, I'd want to own a SUV.
Warren Clarke just did a ranking of the Top 10 2006 Luxury Cars with the Lowest TCO. Of the ten vehicles, Volvo had a whopping four on the list. No other brand even had two! As a mom, I've always wanted Volvo...maybe now I can justify what seems like the "extra" expense for one.
Stay away from Dodge caravan rear shoulder straps don't catch in crash my daughter was badly injured. Jerk front and rear shoulder straps in ANY dodge caravan or durango something is wrong. Jerk straps in ANY other minivan ALL will catch first jerk.
Comments
Oh, that was almost too good to pass up, but since my husband is looking over my shoulder, I better not.
I'm afraid that I don't have the skills to help someone out of the CCBS group. In fact, I need to start one called:
"I never get to have a nice new car until the old one absolutely dies and the mechanics refuse to work on it any more, and our parents are fussing at us about what we are driving their grandkids around in..."
It is amazing that there really isn't the perfect family car yet. There are plenty that work and get the job done, but each one we looked at seemed to be lacking at least one feature to make them really great - easy for me to get into, plenty of leg room for all three rows, great gas mileage, comfortable to drive, reliable, etc.
I think I need to get back to work on my calculations to warp space so that the inside of a car is bigger than the outside.
Each kid gets his/her own for less than the cost of one installed. I don't have long drives around town, though, so always having it in all the time isn't important - we use them just on long trips.
If I did have longer commutes, it might be a different story. It is amazing how many ways they can find to aggravate each other, and the "keep 'em busy" tactic would be a requirement.
Another question: Does the Accord fit you all well, except for the storage space, or is there back seat space issues? We'll be needed to get a better commuter car within the next year, but would like the whole family to fit in, too.
Now that we don't have to carry the heavy duty stroller everywhere with us the Accord has more than enough room. The trunk will comfortably hold all of our luggage + the diaper bag + any misc. items we pick up along the way. As I said before, Gee is 6'6 and I am 5'2. I can easily sit behind him even with the seat adjusted all the way back for him. This includes the seat back being reclined as well, not with him sitting straight up. Our car seat is fairly large (Alpha Omega 3-in-1) and I can easily sit on either side of the car seat as can my Mother-in-Law who is about 5'7 and 160 lbs.
As far as driving goes, I love my Accord. It's the 4 cylinder 5-speed manual version and I get about 32 MPG during my mixed driving. The automatic I had got an average of 31 MPG so there isn't a huge difference. It's comfortable, quiet, smooth, and all 3 versions of this generation I have owned have been reliable. It's also one of the safest sedans in it's class thanks to the standard side curtain airbags. The 2006 versions will have refreshed front/rear styling, ESC on V6 models, and more HP. There will supposedly be a LX-V6 version that has alloy wheels, moonroof, and VSA. Definitely a great car for the price IMO. As a commuter I don't think it can be beat. The Camry is also a good choice if you want a slightly softer ride vs. the Accord's slightly firmer ride.
Also, try reading this article about booster seats: http://www.edmunds.com/ownership/safety/articles/42977/article.html
Danger of third row seats - may kill your kids?
PF Flyer
Host
News & Views, Wagons, & Hybrid Vehicles
The Mazda Mania Chat is on tonight. The chat room opens at 8:45PM ET Hope to see YOU there! Check out the schedule
And the Element's isn't? On paper, at least, they look quite similar. Plus the Mazda5 get's better mileage and is roomier (however, if you drive aggressively, fuel economy is moot). The only concern would be your husband's size. I have heard some complaints from drivers with longer legs.
PS - in the spirit of full disclosure, I am the proud owner of a Mazda5 Touring Edition with a 5-speed.
The Mazda5 may be roomier in the sense that it has seating for 6 but the Element has a much roomier feel inside. It is wider and taller and the second row is livable for adults. It also has more total passenger volume than the Mazda5. No third row of seating but we have used the third row in our Odyssey a total of maybe 5 times since we bought it in May of last year.
As you said, my husband can not drive the Mazda5 unless he lowers the seat to it's lowest setting. At that point he can drive it but he likes a higher driving position.
Last but not least, Mazda uses Sirius and we like XM.
What Are Automakers Doing for Women?
Part I: GM
Part II:Toyota
Part III:Volvo
Do Safety Seats Protect All Kids? New Research, New Debate
We currently have a Honda Accord which has been perfect for three car seats. We still marvel at the folks that felt they had no other choice than to buy big with one child or two (now if it's a choice, that's fine...but it is a choice, not a requirement). We can reach all three car seats while standing outside. No stepping in or traversing between or over captains chairs.
So what are our options for 4 kids? It seems to boil down to a traditional minivan or maybe a Mazda5. There are some SUVs and of course the ubiquitous Suburban, but I'd like to get a bit better gas mileage and don’t want to force my wife to master a huge vehicle in the city.
Any thoughts? Any hybrid versions coming down the pike for the 07 models? Does the Mazda5 have enough room for all seats occupied, a stroller and some groceries? Doesn’t seem like it from photos.
Thanks all!
There were latches for THREE car seats in the back seat, and they all fit in there. That was a big plus.
I can't recall what else she liked, but you can Google and find the review I'm sure.
Lars SS
(single dad raising two youngsters)
You could look at the Honda Pilot or Toyota Highlander as they're more car-like SUVs with three rows. I have a Ford Freestyle that seats seven. Row 2 has space for three, so you'd need to put the booster seat on the seat the you'd flip up to gain access to row 3, and then if you had to carry a lot of stuff you could fold half of the split row 3. Or you could go for the row 2 captain chairs. You'd only have a six seater, but you'd have easier access to row 3, and the Freestyle has pretty good space behind the third row. Or you could go for one of the smaller minivans (Kia Sedona, Mazda MPV) if you didn't want a big minivan.
http://www.motherproof.com/review_detail5.asp?ID=38
I admit my theory is a stretch, but one thing is for certain: The 2005 Chrysler Pacifica flawlessly blends the practicality of a minivan with the sporty appearance of an SUV.
With roomy seating for six, the second row of the Pacifica has captain’s chairs and the third row is a 50/50 split folding seat. Installing car seats in the second row is a piece of cake (quite literally considering that I found a big piece of a Madeline cookie stuck to the bottom of one of them when taking it out of my last test car). These second row seats slide front and back independently from each other to make a huge amount of legroom or shorten the distance between driver and child (very helpful when reaching back to rescue the systematically “dropped” stuffed animal). They also fold and tumble flat if extra space is needed or lift up and rotate on front hinges allowing easy access to the third row.
Lists all of the crossover reviews here. Pretty good reviews because they look at things not normally examined in a car magazine review.
Honestly, however, I think it's time to bite the bullet and get a large minivan. I don't think you'll regret it because they are the most practical vehicle for the job; they're safe; and often they're cheaper than the SUVs. Add to that the automatic sliding doors (a true gift from Heaven when trying to get kids in and out.) The Odyssey seats 8 now and would be a great choice. (Don't doubt that as your children grow that you will have to include even more kids in the car for playdates, etc.) Any car where the third row seat is optional is, almost by definition, not built for the kind of roominess you're going to need.
One more word of advice. Some cars have a 60/40 split in the second row seat that favors the curb side of the car, but others split the seat differently and favor the street side. Since you wouldn't want you kids loading from the street side, be sure of this when you're looking.
Would love to know what you decide!
Mom getting under the hood to check the oil?
My wife does the washer fluid, and I know I've shown her where and how to check the oil, although I don't think she's ever had need to
Over the last couple of weeks of researching and peeking in cars, I came to the conclusion that a large minivan was the way to go. None of the crossovers or SUVs were ideal for a large family close but not quite. And by close, I mean by approx 3 inches.
The Pilot third row has a hip width of 49 inches. That’s 3 inches too short for my current 52-inch 3-car-seat Accord configuration. I don’t expect to have three car seats all in the third row any time soon, but it just seems odd to get a “big” car that has less width in the back than the current sedan. I have yet to check out a Pilot, and still will when I go look at an Odyssey.
By comparison, the Sienna, which I checked out at a dealership today, has exactly 52 inches in the third row the same as my Accord. (Still feels odd – seems a “van” should be wider.)
I am planning on at looking at the Honda Odyssey, the Toyota Sienna, the Dodge Grand Caravan and the Honda Pilot. I may check out the Kia Sedona as a more economical choice as well.
General thoughts are that minis get better gas mileage, provide for have cheaper insurance, easier ingress and egress, easier loading and unloading, more storage room (especially with the big holes in the floor of some models), and they are cheaper. Beyond the cool factor, I can find no reason not to get a minivan over an SUV/crossover, and it would be too uncool to let “cool” alone dictate an big and important purchase like this.
If anyone suggests any other vehicle to check out please let me know.
From reading the brochure of most of all the above mentioned rides, it’s clear that the marketing departments and/or the people that ask the questions don’t have many kids-- few pictures with car seats, few layouts or set pics with the full 8 seats.
I have rented two Grand Caravans for family road trips, and liked them both. Built in car seats are simply incredible! I only wish they’d offer the built-ins in the third row as well. Again no one seems to be designing for a big family. I am a bit surprised that only Chrysler offers this great feature.
For this one reason, the Grand Caravan is in the early lead. And the Caravan has the big holes in the floor to accommodate the Stow & Go seating. I’d be getting the bench second row which doesn’t stow, but the holes are still there for choice storage. Third and finally, the Dodge is cheaper than the Japanese cousins and the amenities advantage of the Honda/Toyota are extras I don’t need or want or think my kids will have fun destroying. OK that’s three reasons instead of one.
After seeing the Toyota today, the Front and Center added middle seat in the second row is great! Still allows for bucket seats/no bench and it will slide up so that a baby is closer to the driver. That is a great feature.
I will definitely check out the 60/40 driver side issue never would have thought of that thank you again.
Current thoughts and remaining questions which are all easily answered at the dealerships at some point:
Does anyone else have built in car seats?
Can I get a built in DVD player with the low model of these makers. The Toyota brochure seems like I cannot. That’s really the only upgrade that seems worthwhile based on the brochures. (I can be convinced the automatic door is key, but I’m not quite there yet.)
In the Caravan, can a third kid or adult fit in the seat/space between the two built in car seats in the second row bench? I should be able to answer this myself, as I have driven two, but I can’t recall.
In the Honda, is the skinny little stick-in-the-middle seat for the second row functional? Seems a bit smallish.
Can Mom reach the third row seat of an SUV (Pilot) easier than a mini? Is a skinner but closer third row more convenient for loading little ones?
Does 3M make a super-dooper-teflon-titanium-heavy-duty-4-kid-proof Scotch Guard?
Check the consumer reviews here on this car - owners are very happy with it.
Thanks so much for any info!
jenn
Steve, Host
Chrysler, as you'll read on the forums, does not seem to have a great rep for quality or customer service. I would love, love , love to buy a Pacifica! Quiet, roomy and powerful and clean, simple interior. Drove one over a weekend as a rental and loved it, but Chrysler doesn't have a good rep. One guy on the Pacifica forum called his a "Pacificrap!" ; )
So I'm looking at a Pilot or a Highlander and I have a feeling the Pilot is going to win out. NowI only have one kid, but a big dog, a hubby, lots of road trips in So Cal.
If I had two kids, hands down I would be driving a Honda Oddessey -- drove one last year when the 2005 came out and loved it. But can't justify a mini with one kid but station wagon options are so limited. (I have a Saab wagon now, used to have a Merc Sable wagon.)
The Chrysler vans score only an Acceptable in the frontal test and haven't yet been tested in the side.
Ford Mustang Reaches Out to the Whole Family (Inside Line)
You may want to ask over in Advice - Child Car Seats That Fit too.
Steve, Host
Am I being delusional to think that there is one or does such a beast just not exist?? :confuse:
The trend seems to be bucket/captains in the middle which does NOT work for me
Thank you, thank you, thank you for any help. This has really been driving me nuts!
Shoulder harness is not quite as critical in the middle row of any back seat as there is virtually nothing to hit your head on in the event of a front impact, which is where the shoulder harness has its most effect.
If kept to the base model, Freestyle can be bought for south of $25K with the rebates that are available.
Other options would probably be in the used car category...a used Sienna with 2nd row bench, Toyota Highlander, or Honda Pilot.
'24 Chevy Blazer EV 2LT
Perhaps the most flexible option would be a Toyota Sienna CE 8-passenger model. Those start at about 25k list but are hard to find in many areas.
The 4x2 Highlander base model with the third row option is about 26k list, but it does have a 2-3-2 seating arrangement.
I'll keep checking back, in case someone else has something to add!
Rocky