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Future Crown Vic and Grand Marquis



  • basilsbasils Posts: 25
    True, the Falcon out performs the CV in quickness and cornering, but Ford has the new Mustang GT for that. Why do we need to change the CV into some kind of teenager car? Leave it as is with just some improvements like a bit added horsepower and slight styling changes. For the money this car can't be touched. It's like a Lincoln for the budget minded. The level of comfort is superb and yes, the durablity is top why mess with it? I fear that once the Crown Vic gets changed into another platform, we'll never see it's kind again. No more retro styling, no more superb comfort (unless you pay 40k or more), no more large size ( a great alternative to a clunky SUV), and the end of an era of the big American rear wheel drive car.
    Let's keep it alive!
  • johnclineiijohnclineii Posts: 2,287
    I too love the Panther series, but know that large size, comfort and very conservative styling can also be found in the Montego/Five Hundred. No RWD or V-8 or body on frame though. Thank goodness Mr. Ford tossed Mr. Nasser out the door, or the Panther would be gone already, and those who CHOOSE a Vic/GM would no longer be able to.

    I own and drive a Five Hundred, but I want Panthers to be around for a very long time....
  • chris65amgchris65amg Posts: 372
    ""As stated above, the Panther performs it's role very well; all it needs is some updating, especially in the interior and the drivetrain. My only concern is if Ford monkey's with the drivetrain, it will lose it's bulletproof reliability.""

    One of my dad's friends has a Crown Vic from '93 or thereabouts. The car has 150k miles on it, and since he takes it in for regular oil changes and maitenance, the car is still running very well. Ford doesn't need great performance from this car. It is also as durable as any fom the Japanese, which is hard to say of a Ford. I do agree that they should tweak the drivetrain a bit.
  • marsha7marsha7 Posts: 3,703
    firm up the bucket seats, which would add $10 for firmer foam and better side hugging (if you want cushy, get the bench seat...bucket seats should have firmer support like an LS Lincoln...I sat in my buddy's new Yukon SLT and the seats were supportive)...besides, the old folks do not get buckets and floor shifters, so totally different seats can appeal to a totally different market...and modernize the sound system, it looks like a Lafayette system from the 70s...

    This car is the only one I have seen that does not have the option of heat or air going to dash vents and floor at same time...why???
  • johnclineiijohnclineii Posts: 2,287
    Although primarily about Fusion, there are some interesting hints about the future of Five Hundred here (and perhaps even more so about Crown Vic/Grand Marquis):
  • marsha7marsha7 Posts: 3,703
    on my 2004 CV LX Sport...I see so many CVs on the road, with the badge "Crown Victoria LX" on the trunk, and they have those combination taillights where the upper 80% is red, but there is a 1" x 4" band at the bottom which is the amber signal light...mine is all red...what years and exact models had the combo light (red/amber) and why did Ford change it after they created the red/amber, where the amber signal light is so much more visible in the dark, fog, mist, rain, and just off in the distance on a clear night??? stupid to make it and then limit it to certain years or specific models... :confuse: :confuse:
  • surrfurtomsurrfurtom Posts: 122
    I believe that all the P71 police versions of the CV had the red tailights. The civilian versions up until 2004 had the red/amber lens. In 2004 Ford put the solid red in all CVs. Can't give you a good reason for the change other than consolidation of the tailight lens design. I agree the red/amber are more noticeable for civilian vehicles as they do not have auxiliary emergency strobe lights.
  • Why does Ford or any other car company for that matter seem to put to small an engine in cars the first year they are introduce? Don't they drive these cars first. Yeah I know the are trying to get good MPG. Don't the know we (consumers) would like a good mix of power and MPG.
  • Dropping the CV would really be the death of the CV. Olds did it to all their cars and look where they are now! Buick is next after getting rid of the Park Avenue/LeSabre, Regal, Century names. All of this is IMO, of course. Besides most folks associate the Falcon name with a compact. Look how everyone got so upset about a 4-door Charger!
  • How about a 5.4 in a LX sport and then call it interceptor? I'll take mine black on black please.
  • euphoniumeuphonium Great Northwest, West of the Cascades.Posts: 3,425
    Question: You didn't buy a Marauder, so why would you buy a 5.4 LX Sport? :D
  • A couple years ago I was much more sensible about where my money went. Bought an LX sport. Need more power. Taking way to long to blow through a tank of gas at only 3 miles to work. I'm ready to get that collectable.
  • jefferygjefferyg Posts: 418
    Many of you on this thread have mentioned the use of the CV in police and taxi service. But another common use for the panther platform is Town Car Conversions for limousines and hearses. For his 63rd birthday my dad went out and bought an 05 Grand Marquis before the family plan ended. My dad works for a funeral home and he bought a white GM to replace his white 96 GM - BECAUSE IT MATCHES THE HEARSE! Their hearse is a Lincoln Town Car Conversion, but the GM does look very similar and so they use it for a lead car in funeral processions.

    I think that the Panther cars do need a boost of power without sacrificing mpg. My dad as well as most of my friends who drive them report getting 25 or better on the highway. If ford could somehow squeeze 30 out of the 4.6 they wouldn't be able to build enough of them.

    IMO a major issue they need to work on is rear-seat legroom. My wife and I recently bought an 06 VW Passat and it has more rear-seat legroom than my dad's new GM. The seats in our car are also more comfortable.

    I think building on the Explorer Platform would be a good move. They need to upgrade, but not totally get away from the current exterior styling. A slightly shorter hood and longer wheelbase could get a little extra room in the interior while keeping the big trunk. Rear seats that recline slightly such as in the Explorer/Mountaineer would also be a nice touch for a full-size family sedan.

    The problem I see with my concept is that it would decimate the 500 and Montego. But then again I wonder why anyone would buy a 500 when they can have a CV for the same money? :confuse:
  • ehaaseehaase Posts: 328
    Just how heavy do you think that a CV/GM on an Explorer platform would weigh? How would putting them on this platform help increase fuel efficiency?
  • jefferygjefferyg Posts: 418
    I didn't say it would help fuel economy. However, it could help Ford trim costs if they were only producing one frame for Explorers, Mountaineers, Grand Marquis, and Crown Vics. Besides with the V8 the 2006 Explorer XLT weighs only 400 pounds more than a Crown Vic. Take out the third row seat and the auxillary air conditioner and you're probably getting pretty close to the same tonnage.
  • joe3716joe3716 Posts: 15
    For future GM, like to see (1)the rear rigid axle replaced with an independent suspension system in the rear to eliminate that "jittery feel" when the vehicle goes over bumpy or uneven road surface. (2)Remove or put that flat, black "emission" box and hoses under the gas tank somewhere else that's not vulnerable of being ripped off by road debris or getting wet? (3) tweak or replace the transmission to give higher MPG?
  • navigator89navigator89 Posts: 1,080
    That really is bad news to me. I'm a real fan of the Crown Victoria and Grand Marquis, because of their smooth ride, American looks, and their interior space. However I want to see them modernized a bit with the addition of premium features and a 300hp engine.

    If there is no more Crown Vic/Grand Marquis, Ford will really lose a lot of business from the police, taxi companies and all the people in Kuwait/Saudi Arabia who drive them. (In these two countries, these cars are ridiculously popular.)

    Lol, that's two bad pieces of news about Ford in the same hour. First they wont be putting a V8 in the MKS and now this.
  • euphoniumeuphonium Great Northwest, West of the Cascades.Posts: 3,425
    have you personally invested a lot in their stock? It is the shareholders who are most affected and their concern is primary. If a car of ten year old design has to be sacfificed for the future of Ford, so be it.

    You and I have been wanting the Mustang engine in the CV,GM, and TC for years, but face it, we are in the minority as most of the purchasers like the gas mileage of the status quo.
  • Demise of the RWD Ford's may be exaggerated. Sales of the CV and the GM are down is true and St. Thomas may not have a future. But my guess is that Ford will do something similar to GM with its Zeta body, making a new family of "modular" cars for the Mustang, CV, GM, Town Car and a host of other derivatives. The market is fragmenting and the chances of Ford hitting a new product to the bleachers don't look good. But hitting lots of singles does. My guess is this car, along with 280hp 3.5L V-6 and new versions of the 4.6 that musters up to 350hp will be out in 2011 as a 2012 model. In the mean time, I speculate only the CV and the GM to gravitate to a 117.4" wheelbase (from 116" as St Thomas I am told is unable to deal with 2 wheelbases its so inflexible) along with the town car which starts building along side them in 2008 and the addition of the 5.4L in at least the Police application as an option.
  • Ford has simplified the lineup and offerings down to pare costs. Cost control is impt, but you don't recover your toe hold on pure cost strategy alone. Boldness is what saves you. It makes sense to me to invest in your most profitable car platform versus simply milking it for what it will bring.

    Borrow from the research and development on the Escape hybrid and introduce a V-6 + Hybrid option for the CV....keep the 4.6 currently in usage...allow for a Marauder-style performance package with a 3-valve 4.6 engine that is already in the Explorer. Update the transmission with ones in the development pipeline. Change the styling from 'go-along' to more 'get out of my way'.

    My point is, Do Something Bill Ford. Yes, I will argue it has many benefits to offer being just what it is. However, if you want the new, younger buyers to take note, a dash of 21st century appeal must be added to what is a solid 20th century-designed car if you want to save it...and the company that makes it, imho.
  • hwyhobohwyhobo Posts: 265
    Borrow from the research and development on the Escape hybrid and introduce a V-6 + Hybrid option for the CV

    Agreed. Everyone wants better fuel efficiency these days.

    Change the styling from 'go-along' to more 'get out of my way' [...] if you want the new, younger buyers to take note, a dash of 21st century appeal must be added

    Please, Bill Ford, don't do it. Younger buyers will not buy CV, and you will lose your base. Have we forgotten the "This is not your father's Oldsmobile" and the roaring success of that campaign? Always take care of your core buyers first. I love the styling of the CV and the GM (even more the one before the last GM "refresh"), I just want 3 things:

    1a. Passthrough between the trunk and the interior for longer items
    - or even better -
    1b. Wagon option
    - and of course -
    2. Better fuel efficiency (how about a diesel compliant with all 50 states?)
  • I don't know hwyhobo...Diamler Chrysler conceived of and came out with the 300 platform, which cuts across many demographics and is a hit in mild V-6 and wild V-8 versions. CV and GM have a certain image that it might take a while to overcome to begin bringing in younger buyers, but I'm not advocating making them into smaller cars...just more modern. I just want them to begin using the excellent "canvas" that the platform provides and begin paiting more than just by the numbers.
  • hwyhobohwyhobo Posts: 265
    I don't know hwyhobo...Diamler Chrysler conceived of and came out with the 300 platform, which cuts across many demographics and is a hit in mild V-6 and wild V-8 versions.

    DaimlerChrysler reported CYTD sales in Nov 2006 of @127K 300s. Ford reported @110K CVs/GMs. Doesn't sound like much of a disparity, particularly considering the amount of advertising DC put into selling that vehicle compared to practically zero advertising from Ford. Crown Vic sells itself because it has established itself with its audience. If you undermine that target market in any way, you better be prepared to plonk a huge amount of money to gain new markets, and it is an iffy proposition.

    Like I said, with such a following, it would be better to improve where it counts, and to expand its appeal, not change the base offer.
  • I'm not trying to argue with you at all, hwyhobo, but the 300 platform also encompasses the Dodge Charger and, essentially, the Dodge Magnum (along with the forthcoming Dodge Challenger). I have not looked up the numbers you quote, but I would imagine that the disparity is a bit larger when you make it all-inclusive.

    Also, how many of the total of CV/GM sales include the (CV)number sold to govt, police, and taxi fleets? There is a Dodge Charger proposal out there for police depts, but it is just getting launched whereas we all know and fear the black-grilled CV in our rear-view mirrors ;) ;)

    I respect the older drivers that own CV's and GM's (going by known demographics alone there) and like the notion of them continuing in the style and manner they currently are. That is their/your right. However, I have lived long enough to see my dad's historically favorite car, the Buick LeSabre, go from RWD to FWD to no drive. The scene changes no matter how much you love something.

    I know the mods don't want us to get into repetitive discussions, and I don't want to get into [non-permissible content removed] for tat comebacks with you. I respect your position, but consider this: All I would like to do is to see Ford set out some goals whereby they creatively enhance the CV/GM and assure its continued survival (and renewal for that matter). I fear that if it is left totally alone, with what 5+ years in the car market means as far as tastes go, we could be on life support with it come 2011/2012. We'd be talking about a car that would have been updated once in 20 years at that point...a risk in today's auto world to say the least.
  • hwyhobohwyhobo Posts: 265
    the 300 platform also encompasses the Dodge Charger and, essentially, the Dodge Magnum (along with the forthcoming Dodge Challenger).

    Oh, but I agree completely. This is precisely my way of thinking as to how Ford should go. Expand the existing offer by adding a wagon and a sporty two-door (but please, no Marauder). I see then we are of one mind.
  • hwyhobohwyhobo Posts: 265
    Okay, having thought about it for a while longer, I am not 100% sure about a sporty coupe the size of a Crown Vic with today's gas prices. Then again, if you look at the SUV monstrosities that many young people drive, I guess I don't know anymore.
  • Ford has to do something to the Panther based cars or they will eventually get gobbled up by competition from Chrysler and maybe even the imports.

    Here's my idea. First, pull the engine/transmission combo out of the Explorer and drop it in the Crown Victoria and Grand Marquis. The only modification would be slightly less aggressive cams which would drop the power down to about 280hp but pay dividens in terms of idle quality and drivablity. For the Town Car - an aluminum 5.4 3V Triton with 325hp. Its about time the Lincoln line was distinguishable (mechanically) from a run of the mill Ford.

    Finally (and most importantly) make a serious commitment to improving the interiors. The F150/Montego interiors would be a nice starting point.
  • We're not totally on the same page, hobo, ;) but we do want to keep the car around a lot longer.

    I think the platform allows for a lot of variety while keeping it true to its roots. A potential hybrid option, or two, a version basically like it is, and one with a higher performance option ala the Marauder (but not having a totally separate car line)....they all could be worked out along with a freshening and updating of the chassis that would maintain what traditional clients like and not have everyone under the age of 60 turn a blind eye towards it. Or so I hope/think.

    We can ONLY hope Ford reads these threads and keeps up with what people are wanting. We may all disagree on the specifics, but change will be needed or we'll be waving good-bye to it one day soon I fear.
  • I am working on a police interceptor fleet at a local police department. I am a contractor not a cop. I am looking for information regarding the electrical schematic for all accessories in todays interceptor.

    I will be re-wiring their vehicles and proposing a bid to do so. Any information or direction is greatly appreciated.
This discussion has been closed.