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Midsize Sedans Comparison Thread

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  • tallman1tallman1 Member Posts: 1,874
    You may want to read the messages here: Honda Accord I4 vs V6

    I'm quite partial to the 4 myself.
  • lilengineerboylilengineerboy Member Posts: 4,116
    One of the other things to remember is how portly the cars got. A '66 Mustang weight 2500 lbs w/200 & 3000 lbs w/289. An Accord weights 3300 lbs w/4cyl & auto and 3500 w/6cyl & auto. Just something to keep in mind.
  • lilengineerboylilengineerboy Member Posts: 4,116
    When the system senses that a collision is imminent, the car will brake automatically through hydraulic pump activation. The system works equally well by day or night.

    Volvo City Safety
  • jaxs1jaxs1 Member Posts: 2,697
    The 4 cylinder has plenty of power and gets better mileage. Mileage difference might be more pronounced than the difference on sticker suggests (especially in city driving).

    However, if you really want VSA, you are going to have to get the V6. If you don't drive high mileage and don't do much city driving, you won't spend that much more in gas.
    If you get a really great discounted price on a 2007 LX V6, you might be able to get one for around the same as street prices on a new 4 cylinder 2008 Accord (which likely will have VSA available on 4 cylinder models).
  • jeffyscottjeffyscott Member Posts: 3,855
    I chose 4 cyl in my new Mazda6. My reasoning:

    I drove the I4 a number of times and it always had adequate power for me. I see no reason to pay $2500 extra for a V6 and another $1400 in gas (at $2.5 per gallon) over 100,000 miles to have the excess and unneeded (IMO) power of a V6. I'd rather spend that $3900 on something else.

    My wife has had a Jetta, which is about the same weight as the 6, with 150 HP engine for a couple years. This has had enough power for us even when loaded with people and cargo.

    The acceleration times of the Jetta are comparable to the I4 Mazda6. Also other vehicles we have (manual trans I4 Contour, V6 Windstar) have similar accelleration numbers. These vehicles have always been fast enough for us, so I knew the I4 Mazda6 also would be.

    I am more interested in good handling than straight line accelertion, I think adding 200 pounds (added weight of V6) to the front end of the Mazda6 would adversly affect the handling.
  • exshomanexshoman Member Posts: 109
    I understand what you're going through. My whole life I've driven cars with powerful V8's or V6's. Never had owned a 4 cylinder car, always thought they were wimpy. I had driven a few rentals, and was pretty unimpressed (older Altimas, Focus, Contour, Sontata, Corolla, etc). When it came time to look for a car for my wife, gas was at 3 bucks plus, and so we were looking for something with a bit smaller bite at the pump.

    We were quite pleasantly surprised at the power in the I4 of the Accord. We got the 5 speed (such a sweet combo with this engine), so we get a bit better performance, but I think the Auto is no slouch either. Actually, since my wife hurt her ankle, I've been driving it recently, so I have gained an appreciation for it.

    Having said that, if I had to actually buy a car that was going to be "mine", I would have probably gotten the V6. Sometimes, I just have that "need for speed", and while the I4 is fun, the V6 has gotta be way more fun, especially if you're going to get the slush-box.

    The mileage that Consumer Reports got for the two were very close to each other. I think combined mileage for the I4 was 25, while the six was 23. Pretty good for a 244 horsepower car.

    One other thing to consider as well. Even though the initial cost of the six is probably about 2K more than the I4, I would imagine that you would probably get the majority of that back at resale time.

    Only you can determine if the extra fun factor of the V6 (not to mention safety of the VSC - I'm still PO'ed that I couldn't get that in the I4) is worth the price of a TV or computer. That's something I can't do for you.

    Either way, enjoy.
  • neteng101neteng101 Member Posts: 176
    Loren,

    I'm partial to V6/I6 engines myself now, even over turbo 4s. The Honda J30A5 is one super smooth engine and from what I've heard, its noticeably quieter and smoother than even the Honda K24A8. Since you're unsure, I would just go test drive both the I4 and V6 and see which one you prefer.

    I would say the V6 is a better car for highway cruising... when you need to go 60-80 quickly, the V6 vs. I4 should make the difference.

    One note - the V6 does use a timing belt that will require changing around 105k miles, the I4 has a timing chain.
  • captain2captain2 Member Posts: 3,971
    that belt about the only disadvantage I can think of in the Honda V6 - the Toyota 2GR and Nissan VQ both chain. The Honda 4, as is tradition, is smoother and more agreeable than some of the V6s in this group. Like you I have a preference for the V6, mostly around what I perceive to be the advantages of having the power to do what I want - or need to. 20lbs. (or so) per HP is getting a little marginal IMO, although I would admit that 'around town' the extra power is of minimal benefit and further that the FE difference would be greater. The gas mileage (30+) that you can get on the highway with these V6s is what amazes me.
  • jaxs1jaxs1 Member Posts: 2,697
    You don't need the V6 to accelerate on the freeway. The V6 is faster, but the I4 is not "slow," so the V6 is not needed for that purpose.
    Check insurance rates also. Initial purchase price, gas and timing belt changes may not be the only extra costs of the V6.
  • mz6greyghostmz6greyghost Member Posts: 1,230
    I am more interested in good handling than straight line accelertion, I think adding 200 pounds (added weight of V6) to the front end of the Mazda6 would adversly affect the handling.

    Having driven both models extensively, and owning a V6, I can agree with this statement. In about 95% of my normal driving, it's not noticeable, but on an autocross track, or in tight maneuvers, you can feel it. The V6 suffers from more understeer, but it's not out-of-control, and easily manageable.

    Oddly enough, I found a bigger difference in handling with the Mazdaspeed 6. The power is great, and the suspension is much tighter, but the AWD components do make it feel heavier in some maneuvers. Again, not a big deal, especially with high-performance summer tires that are standard on the Mazdaspeed 6.

    Me? I liked the added punch the V6 gave me. The MS6 wasn't out at the time, so I grabbed the V6. In terms of fuel economy, I average the same mileage that I did with my old '99 Grand Am (a 4-cyl with automatic), with more power, flexibility, better handling, and more smiles-per mile. :)
  • mz6greyghostmz6greyghost Member Posts: 1,230
    One note - the V6 does use a timing belt that will require changing around 105k miles, the I4 has a timing chain.

    I hope they change this to a chain for the next-gen engine. My Mazda (or Ford "duratec", however you look at it) V6 has a chain, and I believe the majority of OHC engines have chains now.
  • captain2captain2 Member Posts: 3,971
    don't need the V6 to accelerate on the freeway
    you sure about that?
  • jaxs1jaxs1 Member Posts: 2,697
    Yes, I rented an I4 Accord VP automatic and it accelerated onto the freeway quite quickly.
  • captain2captain2 Member Posts: 3,971
    well I'm glad you had enough of a 'ramp' and/or the freeway traffic was moving slow enough - something that it NOT always the case!
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    I am... after having 120k hwy miles before I ever got my old 1996 with 130 horsepower. Is it "fast?" No, but it is adequate. The 166 hp in my 2006 Accord is "more than adequate" to me, with the V6 being "fast."

    That's my outlook on the issue, but I'm typically not a left lane runner.
  • jaxs1jaxs1 Member Posts: 2,697
    The freeway traffic was not going slowly and there was not any super long entrance ramp. The car moved quickly period. No caveats or excuses required.
    The V6 would have been even faster with it's extra power, but the I4 was quite quick.
    Obviously people get onto the freeway everyday from the shortest onramps with cars much slower than the even the "slowest" Accord model.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    Obviously people get onto the freeway everyday from the shortest onramps with cars much slower than the even the "slowest" Accord model.

    That was my thinking. Ten years ago, an engine making the same horsepower as the I-4 Accord was the TOP engine in the Accord lineup (the 2.7L V6). I figured I could handle that. Like jaxs1 said, people merge in cars that are ten and fifteen years old all the time, and are much slower than today's ECONOMY cars!
  • captain2captain2 Member Posts: 3,971
    Obviously people get onto the freeway everyday from the shortest onramps with cars much slower than the even the "slowest"
    of course they do - and less safely than some others.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    A simple judgement method for me is whether or not I have to floor it (something I've never had to do in my I-4). If you floor it, and still are cutting things close, then you may want to look into something more powerful.

    I'm afraid too many people purchase more engine than they need (although some purchase as a WANT for more fun, but thats two different types of shoppers IMO) because they are afraid to use all of the power their car produces. I know my great aunt, for one, always drives big-engined cars, but never really uses what she buys, She could get similar results for her driving style out of a Civic that she could an Odyssey, but she'd need to rev the Civic to 4k RPM occasionally, something she never does in her Odyssey (that she loves because of the power). I know that's a poor example, but maybe y'all understand what I'm trying to say? I wouldn't drive differently with a V6, I'd just rev lower. I use more of the powerband of my I4 than I would a V6.

    However, I think we are getting into diminishing returns as we get cars that are more powerful and more powerful. If 8.1 seconds to hit 60 MPH isn't fast enough (the last Accord SE I-4 Auto ran that in the Car and Driver comparo from Feb) to travel safely, then I think some lawmakers should be stepping in, because that particular on-ramp isn't a proper accleration lane.

    I HAVE wished for more power in my 130 hp 1996 Accord, but never in my 2006.

    Your results may obviously vary.

    Best,

    TheGrad
  • captain2captain2 Member Posts: 3,971
    and I'll agree with you on this one - road designs etc. should obviously always accomodate a 'lowest common denominator' vehicle even if that vehicle is a 15 year old 70 hp Yugo or a 130hp Accord. In fact, the traffic engineers do consider things like this. Unfortunately though, this is not always the case (despite jaxs' protestions otherwise) and we also haven't talked yet about safely getting by that semi on a 2 lane road. There are indisputably many traffic situations where that power 'surplus' is a good thing to have.
  • mz6greyghostmz6greyghost Member Posts: 1,230
    If 8.1 seconds to hit 60 MPH isn't fast enough (the last Accord SE I-4 Auto ran that in the Car and Driver comparo from Feb) to travel safely, then I think some lawmakers should be stepping in, because that particular on-ramp isn't a proper accleration lane.

    As a civil engineer, I can assure you that 99% of acceleration lanes used for highways are very safe, and plenty long enough to get adequate acceleration to merge. You have to remember that the majority of the highway system was designed in the '50's and '60's, when cars weren't nearly as quick to get to highway speeds, and were downright terrible in handling, steering, and braking compared to the modern cars of today. In most cases, the onramps are not to blame.

    Who is to blame? Other drivers, plain and simple. Ones that are doing 25+MPH over the highway speed limit and refuse to even think about changing lanes to make room for an accelerating vehicle (Yes, I know the highway driver has the right-of-way, but a little common courtesy would be nice.) Conversely, drivers that merge onto a highway and shoot over to the left lane ASAP when they've hardly gotten past 35 MPH.

    I deal with those and many others on a daily basis in my commute, and having a V6 for highway acceleration (whether it's merging or passing) is a nice thing to have. Coupling this with a manual transmission is even better IMO.

    You're right, having a V6 may not be necessary, but it's nice to have.
  • lilengineerboylilengineerboy Member Posts: 4,116
    The 1993 Accord was 2700 lbs w/140 hp on the EX model for ~19.3 lb/hp, 2007 Accord EX 3200 lbs w/166 hp on the EX model for 19.3 lb/hp. Same as same as.
  • jaxs1jaxs1 Member Posts: 2,697
    It can be "nice to have" more power, but a new I4 Accord isn't a Yugo. It is still quite quick.
    It would be nice to have even more power or to have 600HP Viper so you can keep passing 18 wheeler trucks for fun on dangerous mountain roads with split seconds to spare, but the current Accord I4 still is not a slow car at all.
  • neteng101neteng101 Member Posts: 176
    The power surplus is simple - its the difference between being able to safely execute a lane change or merging into traffic from the onramp, or in the case where you lack the power, you simply have to slow down and wait, or maybe come to a stop at the entrance of the highway and wait it out for a safe enough opening.

    Although there are some onramps that are from one highway to another highway that I've driven in an old Corolla that has 115hp (20.1 lb/hp) that was downright scary to me... especially when you've got traffic in the slow lane that's coming at you at like 75-80 mph. And if you stop on the onramp you'll risk someone rear-ending you instead. It became a daily commute and the Corolla was sold within 3 months.

    I agree the I4 Accord is not slow, but the V6 is a better choice for fast moving highways. Good vs. better. ;)
  • lilengineerboylilengineerboy Member Posts: 4,116
    Its more fun to drive a slow car fast than a fast car slow.
  • captain2captain2 Member Posts: 3,971
    99%? thinking about my time in N England, the older roads, and those usual 20mph tight ramps onto a straight freeway - probably had to do that because there wasn't enough space to do it otherwise - would suggest that you can find the same thing in mountainous areas and/or larger cities, for the same reason. And good point, about being able to use that power to avoid the idiots!
  • jaxs1jaxs1 Member Posts: 2,697
    The 166HP Accord isn't a 115HP Corolla either.
    I have driven the Accord and you can accelerate quite well onto any highway.
    So Camry V6 drivers are going to say 244HP isn't enough and you need the Toyota 269HP to safely enter the freeway. Then 300C drivers are going to say you need 300HP minimum to pass a truck on a 2 lane highway.
  • neteng101neteng101 Member Posts: 176
    True true - but the 166HP Accord (along with I4 Altimas, Camrys, Fusions, etc) are in the middle rung of power these days.

    The newer V6s get you to a power range where you have most of the available power today at your tap. Its not purely more, but a comfort range... 18 wheelers can be pretty quick even, so cars of a certain power level are definitely going to be far more comfortable to drive on fast moving highways.

    You also have to factor in other things like crosswinds... the heavier V6 with its wider tires will be more stable than a lighter car with smaller tires when subjected to strong crosswinds.
  • captain2captain2 Member Posts: 3,971
    the current Accord I4 still is not a slow car at all.
    didn't say it was, this all started with you assertions that there were NO conditions that you could ever need the extra 80 hp of the V6.
  • tallman1tallman1 Member Posts: 1,874
    Some additional thoughts...

    I have a 95 Accord I4 manual 5 speed and an 06 Accord I4 manual 5 speed so I've been at this for awhile. Rarely do I ever need extra power and the 4 is plenty quick. The extra savings in fuel and the cost of the car were the biggest factors in my decision to stick with the 4. I found a big difference in the manual vs the stick so my interpretation of "quick" may be different than someone with an auto trans.

    Unlike thegrad, I have had to floor my cars on occasion. Never in normal traffic or getting onto a highway/freeway, however. To get from western Washington to eastern Washington, one has to travel over a mountain pass and (very rarely) I've had to floor it to pass a car quickly on one very steep stretch.

    I understand the fun factor so I appreciate having the choice for those of us who want to save money. I also understand those who need a more powerful engine if they are gong up steep hills on a regular basis or if they have a short on ramp they use regularly.

    The best advice here is to drive them both and weigh all the factors mentioned previously.
  • jeffyscottjeffyscott Member Posts: 3,855
    ... too many people purchase more engine than they need (although some purchase as a WANT for more fun, but thats two different types of shoppers IMO) because they are afraid to use all of the power their car produces.

    I think you have that exactly right. People buy a V6 and then never rev it over about 3000 rpm. No matter how slow a car I am driving I am still usually the fastest accelerating car at traffic lights, etc. I once stayed with the traffic a few times to see how slowly the typical driver accelerates...I can't remember whether I came up with getting to 60 mph in 1/4 mile or 1/2 mile.

    Folks, if you want to buy a V6, that is just fine, but please stop trying to make the case that it is a need and not a want or that it is safer. If you really think you need to go 0-60 in 7 seconds instead of 9 or 45-65 in 4 seconds instead of 6 in order to drive "safely", I'd have to say that you are not a safe driver.
  • captain2captain2 Member Posts: 3,971
    The 166HP Accord isn't a 115HP Corolla either
    in fact it probably is - both cars having about the same power/weight ratio, meaningful acceleration times should be about the same, other things like tranny type being equal. And sure there gets to be a point at which time that this argument becomes even more pointless - like someone that can look you in the eye and tell you that he/she has to have 500hp in his Vette or Viper to be 'safe'.
  • jaxs1jaxs1 Member Posts: 2,697
    Actually I have rented both and I could feel the difference. The Corolla was just adequate getting onto the freeway and the Accord I4 felt pretty quick.
  • captain2captain2 Member Posts: 3,971
    If you really think you need to go 0-60 in 7 seconds instead of 9 or 45-65 in 4 seconds instead of 6 in order to drive "safely", I'd have to say that you are not a safe driver.
    no, actually, a 'safe driver' even thru your eyes, hopes that he/she never has to use it.
  • m1miatam1miata Member Posts: 4,551
    I had a Corolla -- not too fast. Getting on the freeway was possible most of the time, when the automatic kicked down properly. You say power to weight ratio makes them about the same. Honda seems faster, but you are right, I should do the quick math of power to weight ratio. Thanks! -Loren

    P.S. Must consider the transmission was not as good at getting the Corolla moving along. I think I will just go with the 0-60 times.
  • jeffyscottjeffyscott Member Posts: 3,855
    2002 CR test has 0-60 at 9.8 seconds, 45-65 was 6 sec, and 17.5 sec 1/4 mile for Corolla, that was the most recent I could find. This is pretty comparable to CRs numbers for most of these mid-size cars with a 4 cyl.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    The 1993 Accord was 2700 lbs w/140 hp on the EX model for ~19.3 lb/hp, 2007 Accord EX 3200 lbs w/166 hp on the EX model for 19.3 lb/hp. Same as same as.

    Yes, but remember, I'm in an LX Accord from 1996 (closer to 2900 lbs) and only 130 horsepower. This equals well over 22 lbs/horsepower - similar to the Honda Fit, except the Fit has a Five-Speed Auto.

    The 5-speed autos of today's Accord make much better use of the available power than the 4-speeds of ten to fifteen years ago.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    I agree the I4 Accord is not slow, but the V6 is a better choice for fast moving highways. Good vs. better.

    I think this is the most simple and best way of saying it. Nice work.
  • neteng101neteng101 Member Posts: 176
    Its not a need, and not necessarily safer either. My point is that its easier to get up to speed, etc with the V6... its about ease and suitability... good, vs. better. Why is that so hard for you to accept? :confuse:

    The V6 is just better in some situations. And worse when it comes to fuel economy certainly. The I4 is certainly more than adequate most times I'm sure too - but some of us prefer to travel with more finesse and less brute... revving an engine up to the redline can get a slower car going up to speed faster, but its far less relaxing than using less of a car's powerband and getting the same net result from a V6.

    And yes - you pay the price at the gas pump for the V6. Its not a big deal for some of us, but it does make a difference if one is really trying to save. The I4 Accord is an excellent choice for the frugal.

    P/S - And I guarantee you the Corolla is slower than the Accord I4. ;)
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    The V6 is just better in some situations. And worse when it comes to fuel economy certainly. The I4 is certainly more than adequate most times I'm sure too - but some of us prefer to travel with more finesse and less brute... revving an engine up to the redline can get a slower car going up to speed faster, but its far less relaxing than using less of a car's powerband and getting the same net result from a V6.

    It is a matter of preference like you say, for sure. For me, I don't mind using all that my engine offers to perform certain tasks (passing 18-wheelers uphill at 75 MPH with a carfull of people - sure, I rev 'er up!). To me, I feel that since I am able to perform the task, even with working the engine harder, I have bought an engine that I can use fully to fulfill my needs. A V6 would've been overkill for what I want.

    For you, you don't like having to work an engine (Which is understandable, I guess... ;) ) so a V6's ability to do a similar workload without as much "drama" is worth the cost upfront and in fuel economy.

    I see no flaw in your thinking; I just don't follow the same logic. Two different sets of ideas :)

    And, having driven my ex-gf's Corolla many times, I can tell you that the Automatic Corolla (circa 2004) was definitely fine around town, but pathetic on the highway. It has a tall overdrive gear, which made for great mileage (it revved at 3,000 RPM at 80 MPH - low for an economy car) but it was gutless when it came time to pass. A drop of the foot was always necessary, kicking it down to 3rd gear to speed up much at all, and that was a boomy-sounding experience! The Accord I4 accelerates effortlessly by comparison.
  • captain2captain2 Member Posts: 3,971
    the effective usable power loss comparing any of these cars MT vs. AT is quite a bit. And obviously much less so, with that power 'surplus' in the V6 versions. A Honda with a 4 banger and a MT is a hoot to drive and 'feels' (and is) much quicker than the AT version because you can keep the engine in its powerband. With the V6 it effectively makes no difference what the tranny is - you don't have to 'work' at it, in either case.
  • scape2scape2 Member Posts: 4,123
    There is another factor why people buy V6's rather than 4cyl engines. Torque. Load down a 4cyl sedan with 5 passengers, gear and then traverse mountain roads. There is a difference in the confidence the car will get you up and around those steep mountains... :shades:
  • scape2scape2 Member Posts: 4,123
    I am still scratching my head here.. Why is it ok for the Camry to go to rental fleets by the thousands, and Corolla's? I drive by a large Hertz lot and they have tons of brand new Camry sedans.. :confuse: Yet, for Ford its pure doom and gloom...
  • jaxs1jaxs1 Member Posts: 2,697
    If that's how you drive your Honda Accord (load the car up with 5 adults, pack the trunk down with heavy cargo, then promptly proceed to the mountains trying to pass 18-wheelers on two lane roads on a steep incline) then you will see the most benefit from the V6.
  • lilengineerboylilengineerboy Member Posts: 4,116
    I have found that if I require something less than 15-20% of the time, its better to find another alternative. I don't need a moving van around the house for the 2-3x a year I need to move some furniture around, a uHaul trailer rental and the hitch on my vehicles will suffice. When I was living in CA, I didn't need an AWD car with snow tires for the 2-3x a year I went to Tahoe. It was cheaper/easier to rent an SUV (and keep my baby out of the snow and salt, etc).
    If you often travel with a full car load of people and luggage, having some extra power would be nice, but none of these cars is slow enough to be dangerous in 4cyl guise (having spent time with a VW Vanagon and MBZ 240D, I am qualified to speak on slow).
  • jeffyscottjeffyscott Member Posts: 3,855
    I liked that description :) .

    Yep, if you regularly drive like that then the V6 may be the way to go.

    OTOH, if that is more like something that happens once or twice during the time you own the car, then renting a larger, more powerful vehicle for those one or two occasions you actually have a need for it might be more cost effective...not to mention you might rent something that is more comfortable for 5, than a mid-size sedan is.

    Reminds me of a guy I know who bought a Sequoia because he was going to be making many trips to FL with a fairly full load of passengers. I think he has gone maybe twice in the last 5 years, the rest of the time the monstrosity mostly carries his wife about 3 miles each way to work and back.
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    I had my 92 Accord for 12 years. It had 140hp, and I was completely satisfied with it. But, now that I've been driving the 03 V6 Accord for 3 years, I wouldn't trade it for an I4 and $2,000 right now. You get spoiled by that smooth effortless power. Even when you are not using the extra power of the V6, it's just so quiet and smooth, it makes driving it more enjoyable.
  • jaxs1jaxs1 Member Posts: 2,697
    Yes, some people buy large SUVs so they can pick up bulky items at Home Depot once or twice a year.

    However, I would actually be more likely to buy the V6 if I drove 3 miles each way to work. Then the extra gas cost would be next to nothing on a 30 mile per week commute.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    This reasoning can be taken too far. I know, I did it a few years ago when I got a mid-sized hatchback when the lease expired on our Grand Caravan. I figured we almost never used the capacity of the van, and it sucked gas pretty good. I was right... but I was also wrong. It turned out, my DW (primary driver of the van and hatchback) really liked the feeling of driving a minivan. She didn't say so at the time I bought the hatchback, but after a couple of years it was clear she was suffering serious MVWS (minivan withdrawal syndrome). There was an easy solution. Last spring I needed to add a car to the family fleet. Instead of buying a new car (maybe a hatchback?) for myself, I bought a used MPV for DW for about the same bucks and I got her hatchback. She loves her MPV, it saved us big bucks on a long-distance trip last Christmas (driving vs. renting or flying), and I like driving the hatchback. :)
  • gooddeal2gooddeal2 Member Posts: 750
    I think it depends on the area also. If you live in the northeast, it’s a lot better to have a V6 cuz people here leave very little room between each cars so that no one can get in. it’s harder w/ a 4c to keep up w/ the stop and go traffic. OTOH, 4c is good enough in CA cuz people there drive very conservative.

    Personally, I like the V6 and cannot live w/o it. I drive 250 miles/week to go to work and it’s a lot easier to merge into a lane, pass or cut in front of people. I hate when those slow cars that make other drivers to slow down cuz they cannot merge into the lane fast enough, thus causing the entire backup. :blush:
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