"I bought 424.1 gallons of 87 octane gas over 11,408 miles for an overall mpg of 26.9"
you provided no composition of driving, so you are quoted correctly on that one.
Not on the 2005; my error there:
as for the 05 camry, I rechecked the post and could not relocate the 26 mpg estimate, so I believe I made an error in translating your post into a summary table(I was working from note summaries of your posts, not hardcopies of the posts themselves).
If you recall my post #7433, I cautioned against making any assumption about "mixed" mileage unless you actually record the city miles driven (is 50% to you half the time or half the miles driven - only the latter is valid for mileage purposes; you can sit in a car for 3 hours going 30 miles an hour, while you would have driven 210 miles going 70 miles an hour; if combined, that's 30% city, not 50%).
I am accumulating a few more tankfuls before posting the latest information on my 04.
I couldn't disagree more with you about CR, that is, about the mileage in this car. I have, in fact, warmed up the car, and drove it continuously on pure freeway, no wind, no cold or intense heat, no speed above 65, and do not get anywhere near the 35 mpg that CR asserts (in fact, I have never got a single tankful in my camry, or two others I have rented for comparison, to get this). I've done other tests at slower speeds (and a few slightly higher), for comparison. Not a huge amount of wind, or terrain, to deal with in the central valley of california. flat. I have also done several tankfuls up and down mountains; which resulted in (expectedly) lower fuel economy.
No 35 mpg. Not even an abbarent tankful. Not close.
As for most of the other factors; none of them are relevant to me (if anything, I bias my driving to get as much fuel economy as possible), religously check tire inflation, minimize a/c use, we have short rainy seasons, and the roads are neither hilly, windy, coarse, or other unusuals. The engine tune has been checked, thoroughly, by a dealer.
I have no information on what you mean by "tire type"; mine are the original tires (bridgestone potenza I believe, which I have had balanced and rotated every 5,000 miles); if you have a specific suggestion on a tire type that could increase mpg, please provide.
Something must be wrong with your vehicle then. How many rpm's are you turning at 60 mph - maybe your toque converter is not locking up. Are you using ethonol blended fuel - that will reduce mileage by about 5%.
Tires are quite important. I would try about 34-36 psi if you are running lower. As for tires with reduced rolling resistance, one of the best is the Michelin energy (so named because of low rolling resistance). Just changing the tires won't do miracles, but could add as much as 2 mpg.
Speaking of tires, it is possible that one or more of your tires is mildly defective, and this could increase rolling resistance.
Another way to add a little mpg is to use synthetic oil - maybe up to 1 mpg on the highway, with the added benefit of slightly longer change intervals and more protection in the cold as synthetic flows better.
It just doesn't seem right that you can't top 30 mpg. My Sienna with a V-6 and lots of wind drag gets about 26 mpg going 70. If I drop to 65 or slightly lower I can top 30. Once had a tailwind on a long trip and got nearly 30 mpg averaging about 73 mph. When I get up to 80 mph though, I am in the low 20's - just too much air to push. The worst I have ever measured was about 20.5 mpg going 80 mph into a strong headwind - lots of wind in SD.
BTW - have you every checked the accuracy of your odometer? Maybe it is not ticking off the miles fast enough. The markers on the highway should be a good guide.
I can see where I got confused with what you wrote:
210delray #7926 - 05 LE - 26 mpg freeway 210delray #7432 - 04 LE - 26.9 mpg (supecedes msg #7926)
I didn't know what your post numbers meant -- we're only up to #103 with my post here. And by saying 26.9 mpg supersedes the earlier post "26 mpg freeway," I took it you meant I reported 26.9 mpg in freeway driving. Now I get it: 26.9 was my overall average at the time. And that improved slightly to 27.3 mpg by 15,802 miles, when my son took the car.
Sorry, I don't keep track of percentage of city vs. highway driving; I just note when the car was used on a long trip. Besides, my wife drove both Camrys most of the time when we were not on a trip, and she's not about to keep such records!
However, now that I've begun using the '04 Camry for my daily commute, it will be interesting to see the kind of mileage I get. In my '98 Nissan Frontier, with pretty much the same routine day after day, I got 26 mpg time after time. We'll see how the '04 Camry fares under the same conditions -- I would expect better, but who knows?
So, what are you thoughts on this? You never said.
The trip itself (LA to central VA): 30.3 mpg (3767 miles, 124.32 gallons, 10 consecutive tankfuls) mostly 2-lane roads, 3 people, full trunk, cold temps a good deal of the way, and high altitudes in NV, UT, and CO. Also stopping and touring in towns and national parks along the way.
This is as good as it gets for real-world long-trip driving, at least in the winter on 2-lane roads. (This was in the '04 Camry 4-cyl 4A).
I suppose coast-to-coast at a steady 65 mph on I-80 with two people and light luggage in the summertime would do better, no?
1. The rpm is right around 2200 at 65 mph, I recall.
2. Ethanol blended fuel is available and I have tried it at least 5 times (I also keep track of the brand of fuel). It has no effect.
3. I know about the low rolling resistance tires and have used them on my other car. On that car, also a camry, I should tell you there was no difference in mileage on the cheapo dunlops versus the $600 MXV4's. They are quieter tires IMHO and wear better.
4. Tried a couple oils. Mainly castrol. I change every 3,000 and since it's not cold here, I doubt I'd save enough gas money with synthetics to make it worthwhile.
5. Odometer - I've not checked it specifically. Doubt that three camry's (two 2004, and one 2005) would all have errant odometers. I'll do that on both my cars and report back soon. Have you checked yours?
I think what you are trying to say you would get some ungodly much greater mileage than 30 mpg, if you did similar driving that I do (no luggage constant 65 mph).
My other thoughts are: a) that this thing about weight probably makes little difference, b) you didn't do as much driving in city as you think you did, perhaps a couple hundred miles, but not a whole lot; and c) your definition of winter means you probably didn't use the A/C, but weren't really driving in mountains with snow and ice. Just some cool temperatures in southern parts of those states. I could be all wrong on that, but those are my thoughts.
BTW, do you have a favorite brand of gasoline, or recall the dominant brand on this trip of yours?
I've already reported significantly better trip mileage for the '04 Camry, but you won't accept it because it was based on only one or two tankfuls (trips not long enough for more).
On my cross-country trip: a) I don't see how the extra weight could not have bogged down the mileage: about 470 pounds for the 3 people, plus the trunk was fully loaded (including heavy items like a nightstand and books), as was the left rear seat (upholstered dining-room type chair, small end table, and more books). I would not be surprised if we were close to the max payload of the car (900 pounds).
b) We accumulated 90 miles in Arches Nat'l Park alone (admittedly not a city, but all speed limits there were 45 mph or less, with lots of starts and stops for overlooks and short walks). We also spent lots of time touring small towns for their architectural glories, including in CO alone the towns of Delta, Montrose, Gunnison, Salida, Canon City, and Pueblo. So a LOT more than 200 miles was accumulated in towns.
c) We saw temps as low as +10 degrees (F) in eastern NV, +15 in eastern Utah, +14 on Monarch Pass, CO, and closer to home, +24 on Cheat Mountain, WV. There most definitely was snow and ice present, generally not ON the road, because of excellent salting and snow plowing, in all of the higher altitude areas of NV, UT, CO, and WV, as well as western KS. We first traveled north out of the LA basin and then basically east along US routes 6, 50, 56, and farther on, I-70, SR 32 (Ohio), and US 250. Only on one day did temps exceed 60 degrees.
The most common brand of gas we used happened to be Shell, using the lowest grade of 87 (except midgrade 87 or 88 in the high-altitude areas of NV, UT, and CO).
After 105,000 miles, the overall average in 28.3 MPG, adjusted for the 3.2% odo error (low). Highest observed over at least 1,000 miles is 32 MPG, running at a steady 65-70 MPH with non-ethanol gas and no A/C. The mileage is very sensitive to tire pressure; I keep it at 32 LB. A/C reduces mileage by about 1.5 MPG. Lowest observed is winter driving where it drops to about 22 MPG.
I'm getting pretty consistant 27 MPG. 80% city 20 % highway. Actually maybe even more city then 80%. I keep the wheels full of air. I just started running Mobil 1 synthetic not sure if it has upped the mileage any, it may have.
Also it's an automatic with 77,000 miles in Florida Ac running all of its life.
You asked for my thoughts, so I gave them to you. And thanks for the info on the gas brand. I don't notice any particular variation with brand of gasoline (which I record, incidentally, as well as the miles of freeway driven; there is no guestimates on my end). And here are my thoughts (on your thoughts on my thoughts):
a) you have no evidence at all of any significant relationship of weight load to mileage, and nothing from your prior posts supports greater mileage.
b) don't buy guesses on what you drove unless you recorded it. I've been to most of those small towns. It does not take that much driving to do site-seeing. If you didn't record it, you don't know. You are guessing.
c) likewise, you have no evidence at all of the effect of cold air temperatures on mileage; your comments of temperatures "as low as" this or that indicates that those were the daily lows. I'm not sure whether your point was that lower temperatures increase, decrease, or have no effect on mileage. The other thought is that this "excellent" road maintenance indicates there was no snow or ice on the roads.
Now, as far as my car (2004 LE)....I don't have my records in front of me, but I filled it up yesterday, and went a whopping 349 miles on 16.2 gallons, or 21.54 miles per gallon. That's the best mileage this car has got in about 5 tankfuls; but occurred with more freeway miles - 31.52% freeway (i.e., overdrive, no stopping, 60-65 mph, roundtrip from Sacramento to Lockeford, 110 miles, 110/349 = .3152).
YIPPEE!
But no arguments here. We're just exchanging ideas, right? So I have one for you. Do you have another car? If so, why not drive your camry for three consecutive tankfuls with zero highway miles, that is, none at all. In return, I'll switch to shell, and we can exchange data.
My prediction is that you will get alot closer to CR's 16 mpg than you will to EPA's 23.
It does not take much city mileage to really hurt the highway mileage. Really it makes more sense to compare the amount of time driving each not the amount of miles (if you are estimating).
You can drive 50 miles hwy and 50 city, but if the highway takes 45 minutes, and the city takes 3 hours, then the vast majority of your driving is in the city. It is gallons used in city vs gallons used on the highway that is important, not the number of miles driven.
Say you drive a car that gets 25 mpg on the highway. 50 miles is 2 gallons. The same car gets 10 mpg in the city and uses 5 gallons. If the miles driven was a controlling factor, then the mpg should be 35 mpg (25 + 10) divided by 2 or 17.5 mpg, since equel miles were drivin under each circumstance. In reality the car got 100 miles divided by 7 gallons, or 14.3 mpg.
Don't forget you can't really compare city driving, unless the same person drives the same route under the same conditions. Highway is more repeatable, but there are still plenty of variables.
Ok, believe what you want. There's no way my record keeping will be detailed enough to satisfy you.
I did keep some pretty detailed mileage logs for the cross-country trip, but I didn't specifically log miles driven in towns vs. highway mileage. My mileage recordings had the start and end points for each day, as well as key intersections, state lines, larger towns, points of interest, etc. along the way.
Here's what I have (again) on the '04 Camry:
04 LE 4 cyl 4A: Overall mileage from 19 miles (new, with a full tank of gas) to 15,802 miles: 27.3 mpg (15,783 miles, 578.84 gallons)
Best 3 highway mileage readings in that period (with 2 consecutive tankfuls): 35.5 mpg (709.5 miles, 20.01 gallons) mostly freeway 34.9 mpg (815.1 miles, 23.37 gallons) mostly freeway 30.4 mpg (686.9 miles, 22.62 gallons) mostly divided highway w/ traffic lights.
Worst 3 city (small town in our case) mileage readings in that period (single tankful, but at least 10 gallons added): 22.4 mpg (234.6 miles, 10.47 gallons) 23.1 mpg (267.1 miles, 11.54 gallons) 23.1 mpg (241.0 miles, 10.45 gallons)
I cannot do what you asked (drive the car only in town for 3 weeks), since I have to go to work. What I am going to do, which I said before, is use the '04 Camry for commuting in place of my '98 Nissan Frontier, which got 26 mpg consistently (tank after tank), because it was driven almost the same way for each tankful. We'll see if the '04 Camry can do better.
I also will follow up on the overall mileage to date (excluding the time my son had the car) on the '04 Camry, now with 34,600+ miles, as well as info on the '05 Camry, which now has 11,000+ miles. As I said before, the '05 Camry definitely does not do as well as the '04, even though it has the same engine (but 5-speed auto instead of 4-speed auto).
Data looks good to me. Splitting hairs to need more accuracy than that. You can never accurately compare city between two different routes, but will be interesting to see what the commute in the Camry yields.
As I said before, the '05 Camry definitely does not do as well as the '04, even though it has the same engine (but 5-speed auto instead of 4-speed auto).
I have a question regarding you 05' Camry getting worse gas mileage than your 04'. Why do you think this is?
I haven't the slightest idea, because the engine turns at lower rpm at highway speeds on the '05. 65 mph translates to 2000 rpm on the '05 and 2400 rpm on the '04.
I'm wondering if the break-in procedure for the two cars was different enough to cause it. (One of my earlier posts in this thread explains this.)
Do you know if there is a substantial weight difference between the '04 and '05?
I'm very curious about the break-in procedure for new cars. Could you tell me the post # of the thread you are referring to?
I've never owned a new car, so I've never had to worry about the break-in. However, I will be purchasing a new Camry or Accord (I haven't decided yet) soon, so I'd like to do whatever it takes to maximize fuel efficiency for the life of the car.
I owned 2 different camry's --an 03 le 4cyl and an 04 xle 4cyl and agree that these 4 cyl engines are surprisingly noisy and buzzy. In fact I just traded the 04 xle 4 cyl for an 06 xle v6, and what a difference. I always thought the extra money for the v6 was too much, but not any more. this car drives like a dream and the trip computer seems accurate on this car. (way too optimistic on my 04) I only have about 700 miles on it but have been getting around 23-24 mpg 50/50 city highway.
You live in a small town, probably minimal traffic at all, you need your car to commute, and so your reports (in my opinion - and I'm sure you'll address this) vary from alot of freeway driving to a heckuvalot of freeway driving. 22-23 mpg in small town driving, with someone going to work 5 days a week - I'm thinking there is some freeway driving in those city tankfuls. Is that true?
It will take 4-6 weeks to get you some comparative numbers on shell gas (my current tank is Arco).
Its not a matter of "believing"; you didn't record your relative freeway and highway driving. your 27 mpg , if predominantly freeway, is not out of line with the predominantly freeway mileage I get (for me, I would get that in 85% or more freeway). I think I drive more city than you.
As for your posts of 30-35 mpg. I have three things to say. One is WOW. The second is that is your best mpg, not your average (27 mpg). And the third is that your indication of 20-23 gallons of refill, which exceed the specification of 18.5 gallons, gave me some pause. I've run tanks dry on rare occasions, but I've never been able to put much more in than the specification. I look forward to your explanation/response.
You are not reading my posts carefully enough. When I reported 20-23 gallons, these were for two consecutive fillups, since you and others rightfully point out that one fillup isn't a reliable indicator, especially if it's only a topoff. The most I've ever gotten into the tank in one fill is about 16 gallons.
My town and surrounding county is relatively small (about 100,000 people), and my commute is mostly highway, away from town. However, my wife regularly makes short trips into town, and there is traffic (not like Manhattan obviously, but there is still a gauntlet of traffic lights). So the 22-23 mpg was the mileage recorded when she was driving.
Now she has the '05 Camry, and I'm using the '04. I plan to update my mpg ratings soon, when I have the time.
Date_______Miles________Gallons___Cost____MPG____Comments 1/12/06____33,212/404.1___16.01___$35.20___25.2___Son, mixed local driving 1/25/06____33,599/386.5___15.32___$33.70___25.2___Son, mixed local driving 2/05/06____34,012/412.7___16.21___$35.65___25.5___Son, mixed local driving 3/07/06____34,361/348.9___12.11___$26.50___28.8___Car in body shop; city/hwy mix 3/15/06____34,627/266.2____8.16___$18.75___32.6___Hwy/commuting 3/17/06____34,912/285.4____8.07___$18.15___35.4___268 miles home to milepost 39 on NJTP 3/19/06____35,221/309.0___12.00___$27.00___25.8___79 miles to Brooklyn, 127 miles within New York City (4 boroughs), 103 miles from Queens to milepost 30 on NJTP
Total miles since LA: 6,470 Gallons used: 224.42 Total spent: $540.00 Overall mpg: 28.8
I haven't yet refilled the tank since returning from NYC (waiting for gas prices to come down :confuse: )
And yes, each entry in the post above represents a fillup. I even topped off the tank myself in New Jersey both times (the "full-service" state), because the "attendants" were too busy gabbing and exchanging gobs of cash.
I've gone something like 400 miles since, and the gauge is showing about 3/8 full.
I hope this is enough detail for you. Any more, and my wife will have me committed for OCD!
3/24/2006: - 298.8 Miles - 14.72 Gallons - 20.29 mpg
All city miles
Total miles on car--4736
I definitely did not achieve EPA ratings on this tank. I attribute that to the fact that my wife put most of the miles on the car during this most recent period; she drives a bit more aggressively than I do. Also the weather has been very cold and many of our trips were 2 miles or less ... cold weather and short trips will contribute significantly to lower mileage. I plan on changing out the oil again at 5000 miles, and then every 6 months/5000 miles.
I bought my college daughter a '99 Camry (4 cyl) with nearly 100,000 miles on it. Her college is over 500 miles away. When she told me she drove there with gas to spare I didn't believe it, but she has done so several times since. it routinely gets 30 mpg on the highway. A great car for a college student who hasn't got a lot of $$$ for gas.
4/06/2006: - 328.1 Miles - 15.11 Gallons - 21.71 mpg
95/5 (highway/city miles)
Total miles on car--5064
Changed oil at 4984 miles--Mobil 1 synthetic 5w/30 and WIX oil filter. MPG is still below EPA city estimates--I attribute this to multiple short trips (2 miles or less). Overall I'm still extremely pleased with the car.
I have driven my 07 Camry LE 4 cyl auto for 1200 miles in 3 weeks (long commute to work) and the gas mileage average is about 28 mpg, (80/20 highway/city). Btw, we have traffic everywhere in LA. I am pretty happy about it so far, especially that we had a lot rain during these 3 weeks period .
2007 Camry XLE V6: With some city type driving mixed with highway, the first free tanks' mileage was 332 miles with 12.45 gallons = 26.67 mpg.
The first tank I filled was the second fillup, which got me 409 miles on 13.09 gals = 31.46 mpg, mostly all highway miles. For the 2 tanks together it is 29.08 mpg.
I have had this car a week and I have over 1000 miles on it... 3rd tank will get me another calculation tomorrow.
17.5 MPG on regular in all-city driving. Car definitely shifts gears better (faster with almost no slip/lag) when filled with 89 or 91 octane (just as the manual says it will). Never felt underpowered in this car, even with passengers.
I sit in bumper to bumper traffic 40+ miles each way to work and my most recent fill up @400 miles put me around 23 mpg on my 2007 SE V6. Although, when I get some open road, I open it up so who knows.
The one tank I got 26 mpg I sat in traffic due to a wreck for about 30 minutes which definitely lowered my mileage. For the most part when I am on the highway it is clear sailing for all 55 miles.
I averaged a little over 18 this winter in mine and pretty much all city driving (although I do have 4-5 miles of my commute at 40-45 mph. What's your highway mileage? I'm only getting about 26 at steady 70-75 mpg cruising.
I have only used regular so far but will be going on a 2000+ mile round trip this summer and plan to use regular one way and premium coming back to see what the difference is.
"I have only used regular so far but will be going on a 2000+ mile round trip this summer and plan to use regular one way and premium coming back to see what the difference is."
About 20 cents per gallon. The performance advantage of premium grade gasoline will vary from imaginary to imperceptible. If you're traveling from the west or east coasts toward the Continental Divide, the trip back home will yield slightly improved fuel economy. Because of using premium grade gasoline? No - it's because you'll be going net downhill on the return trip.
(Have a safe, enjoyable trip with your family - I'm jealous. )
I have read many posts saying mileage increased with premium but I suspect it won't be enough to offset the $.20 increase.
I will be going from Indiana across I-80 to New Jersey, then up the Hudson River valley and over to New Hampshire, back across Mass and NY to Niagara Falls then back thru Canada and Michigan. Lots of driving (we've done it before but not for about 15 years) but we have so many people and things to stop and see along the way, flying is not an option.
Here is my complete mileage table through today: Fillup no. ODO Gallons MPG 1: 340.0 12.445 27.32 2: 401.1 13.030 30.78 3: 381.3 12.223 31.20 4: 481.9 15.384 31.32 Totals 1604.3miles 53.082 gals 30.22 mpg As you can see with each tank mileage is getting better. The first tank had more city driving, the last 3 tanks almost all highway. The trip computer had me at 34 mpg at this last fillup, so it is off by 2.68 mpg. It is possible that this last fillup, being a rather slow filling nozzle, filled up a bit more than usual.
The Camry V6 probably gets better gas mileage at higher speeds than the 4 cyl because the V6 is not being overworked. Most of the Camry owners I know have chosen the 4 cyl...but those who got the V6 will never get another 4 cylinder Camry. Would it not be much safer if people stayed within or close to the speed limit? There are many freeway accidents shown on TV caused by drivers cutting in and out of traffic. Some speeding big rig will tap the brakes to avoid rear ending the reckless drivers...thus causing the double or triple trailer truck to jack knife and dozens of vehicles get caught in the collision...closing down the entire freeway for hours.
Do you think the '07 V6 might be getting better hwy MPG because it has a 6 spd rather than a 5 spd? I believe the '06 model 3.3 V6 and Avalon with this 3.5 motor had 5 spd autos and are rated a bit lower than the '07.
As for the I4 being overworked and the V6 being more efficient, I would not say "not a clue." This is a very real issue in heavy non-aerodynamic vehicles where the I4 is pushed to its limits thus eating more fuel than the larger engine. Probably not the case with the Camry. I suspect the 6 spd is helping the V6 mileage and thanks to those with '07 Camrys for posting real world numbers.
Both Avalon and 2007 Camry V6 are rated 22/31 EPA. The final drive ratios are virtually equal, the Camry has a higher (numerical) axle ratio but lower (numerical) 6th gear.
The 3.3 liter had lower EPA ratings because it was an older engine. I have been unable to achieve the 3.3 liter highway rating of 29 mpg at normal freeway speeds (70 mph) on my 2005.
Comments
"I bought 424.1 gallons of 87 octane gas over 11,408 miles for an overall mpg of 26.9"
you provided no composition of driving, so you are quoted correctly on that one.
Not on the 2005; my error there:
as for the 05 camry, I rechecked the post and could not relocate the 26 mpg estimate, so I believe I made an error in translating your post into a summary table(I was working from note summaries of your posts, not hardcopies of the posts themselves).
If you recall my post #7433, I cautioned against making any assumption about "mixed" mileage unless you actually record the city miles driven (is 50% to you half the time or half the miles driven - only the latter is valid for mileage purposes; you can sit in a car for 3 hours going 30 miles an hour, while you would have driven 210 miles going 70 miles an hour; if combined, that's 30% city, not 50%).
I am accumulating a few more tankfuls before posting the latest information on my 04.
No 35 mpg. Not even an abbarent tankful. Not close.
As for most of the other factors; none of them are relevant to me (if anything, I bias my driving to get as much fuel economy as possible), religously check tire inflation, minimize a/c use, we have short rainy seasons, and the roads are neither hilly, windy, coarse, or other unusuals. The engine tune has been checked, thoroughly, by a dealer.
I have no information on what you mean by "tire type"; mine are the original tires (bridgestone potenza I believe, which I have had balanced and rotated every 5,000 miles); if you have a specific suggestion on a tire type that could increase mpg, please provide.
Tires are quite important. I would try about 34-36 psi if you are running lower. As for tires with reduced rolling resistance, one of the best is the Michelin energy (so named because of low rolling resistance). Just changing the tires won't do miracles, but could add as much as 2 mpg.
Speaking of tires, it is possible that one or more of your tires is mildly defective, and this could increase rolling resistance.
Another way to add a little mpg is to use synthetic oil - maybe up to 1 mpg on the highway, with the added benefit of slightly longer change intervals and more protection in the cold as synthetic flows better.
It just doesn't seem right that you can't top 30 mpg. My Sienna with a V-6 and lots of wind drag gets about 26 mpg going 70. If I drop to 65 or slightly lower I can top 30. Once had a tailwind on a long trip and got nearly 30 mpg averaging about 73 mph. When I get up to 80 mph though, I am in the low 20's - just too much air to push. The worst I have ever measured was about 20.5 mpg going 80 mph into a strong headwind - lots of wind in SD.
BTW - have you every checked the accuracy of your odometer? Maybe it is not ticking off the miles fast enough. The markers on the highway should be a good guide.
210delray #7926 - 05 LE - 26 mpg freeway
210delray #7432 - 04 LE - 26.9 mpg (supecedes msg #7926)
I didn't know what your post numbers meant -- we're only up to #103 with my post here. And by saying 26.9 mpg supersedes the earlier post "26 mpg freeway," I took it you meant I reported 26.9 mpg in freeway driving. Now I get it: 26.9 was my overall average at the time. And that improved slightly to 27.3 mpg by 15,802 miles, when my son took the car.
Sorry, I don't keep track of percentage of city vs. highway driving; I just note when the car was used on a long trip. Besides, my wife drove both Camrys most of the time when we were not on a trip, and she's not about to keep such records!
However, now that I've begun using the '04 Camry for my daily commute, it will be interesting to see the kind of mileage I get. In my '98 Nissan Frontier, with pretty much the same routine day after day, I got 26 mpg time after time. We'll see how the '04 Camry fares under the same conditions -- I would expect better, but who knows?
The trip itself (LA to central VA):
30.3 mpg (3767 miles, 124.32 gallons, 10 consecutive tankfuls) mostly 2-lane roads, 3 people, full trunk, cold temps a good deal of the way, and high altitudes in NV, UT, and CO. Also stopping and touring in towns and national parks along the way.
This is as good as it gets for real-world long-trip driving, at least in the winter on 2-lane roads. (This was in the '04 Camry 4-cyl 4A).
I suppose coast-to-coast at a steady 65 mph on I-80 with two people and light luggage in the summertime would do better, no?
2. Ethanol blended fuel is available and I have tried it at least 5 times (I also keep track of the brand of fuel). It has no effect.
3. I know about the low rolling resistance tires and have used them on my other car. On that car, also a camry, I should tell you there was no difference in mileage on the cheapo dunlops versus the $600 MXV4's. They are quieter tires IMHO and wear better.
4. Tried a couple oils. Mainly castrol. I change every 3,000 and since it's not cold here, I doubt I'd save enough gas money with synthetics to make it worthwhile.
5. Odometer - I've not checked it specifically. Doubt that three camry's (two 2004, and one 2005) would all have errant odometers. I'll do that on both my cars and report back soon. Have you checked yours?
6. Can't respond to Sienna V6 - different animal.
I think what you are trying to say you would get some ungodly much greater mileage than 30 mpg, if you did similar driving that I do (no luggage constant 65 mph).
My other thoughts are: a) that this thing about weight probably makes little difference, b) you didn't do as much driving in city as you think you did, perhaps a couple hundred miles, but not a whole lot; and c) your definition of winter means you probably didn't use the A/C, but weren't really driving in mountains with snow and ice. Just some cool temperatures in southern parts of those states. I could be all wrong on that, but those are my thoughts.
BTW, do you have a favorite brand of gasoline, or recall the dominant brand on this trip of yours?
- 321.5 Miles
- 13.79 Gallons
- 23.31 mpg
90/10 city/highway miles
Total miles on car--4111
On my cross-country trip:
a) I don't see how the extra weight could not have bogged down the mileage: about 470 pounds for the 3 people, plus the trunk was fully loaded (including heavy items like a nightstand and books), as was the left rear seat (upholstered dining-room type chair, small end table, and more books). I would not be surprised if we were close to the max payload of the car (900 pounds).
b) We accumulated 90 miles in Arches Nat'l Park alone (admittedly not a city, but all speed limits there were 45 mph or less, with lots of starts and stops for overlooks and short walks). We also spent lots of time touring small towns for their architectural glories, including in CO alone the towns of Delta, Montrose, Gunnison, Salida, Canon City, and Pueblo. So a LOT more than 200 miles was accumulated in towns.
c) We saw temps as low as +10 degrees (F) in eastern NV, +15 in eastern Utah, +14 on Monarch Pass, CO, and closer to home, +24 on Cheat Mountain, WV. There most definitely was snow and ice present, generally not ON the road, because of excellent salting and snow plowing, in all of the higher altitude areas of NV, UT, CO, and WV, as well as western KS. We first traveled north out of the LA basin and then basically east along US routes 6, 50, 56, and farther on, I-70, SR 32 (Ohio), and US 250. Only on one day did temps exceed 60 degrees.
The most common brand of gas we used happened to be Shell, using the lowest grade of 87 (except midgrade 87 or 88 in the high-altitude areas of NV, UT, and CO).
Also it's an automatic with 77,000 miles in Florida Ac running all of its life.
a) you have no evidence at all of any significant relationship of weight load to mileage, and nothing from your prior posts supports greater mileage.
b) don't buy guesses on what you drove unless you recorded it. I've been to most of those small towns. It does not take that much driving to do site-seeing. If you didn't record it, you don't know. You are guessing.
c) likewise, you have no evidence at all of the effect of cold air temperatures on mileage; your comments of temperatures "as low as" this or that indicates that those were the daily lows. I'm not sure whether your point was that lower temperatures increase, decrease, or have no effect on mileage. The other thought is that this "excellent" road maintenance indicates there was no snow or ice on the roads.
Now, as far as my car (2004 LE)....I don't have my records in front of me, but I filled it up yesterday, and went a whopping 349 miles on 16.2 gallons, or 21.54 miles per gallon. That's the best mileage this car has got in about 5 tankfuls; but occurred with more freeway miles - 31.52% freeway (i.e., overdrive, no stopping, 60-65 mph, roundtrip from Sacramento to Lockeford, 110 miles, 110/349 = .3152).
YIPPEE!
But no arguments here. We're just exchanging ideas, right? So I have one for you. Do you have another car? If so, why not drive your camry for three consecutive tankfuls with zero highway miles, that is, none at all. In return, I'll switch to shell, and we can exchange data.
My prediction is that you will get alot closer to CR's 16 mpg than you will to EPA's 23.
You can drive 50 miles hwy and 50 city, but if the highway takes 45 minutes, and the city takes 3 hours, then the vast majority of your driving is in the city. It is gallons used in city vs gallons used on the highway that is important, not the number of miles driven.
Say you drive a car that gets 25 mpg on the highway. 50 miles is 2 gallons. The same car gets 10 mpg in the city and uses 5 gallons. If the miles driven was a controlling factor, then the mpg should be 35 mpg (25 + 10) divided by 2 or 17.5 mpg, since equel miles were drivin under each circumstance. In reality the car got 100 miles divided by 7 gallons, or 14.3 mpg.
Don't forget you can't really compare city driving, unless the same person drives the same route under the same conditions. Highway is more repeatable, but there are still plenty of variables.
I did keep some pretty detailed mileage logs for the cross-country trip, but I didn't specifically log miles driven in towns vs. highway mileage. My mileage recordings had the start and end points for each day, as well as key intersections, state lines, larger towns, points of interest, etc. along the way.
Here's what I have (again) on the '04 Camry:
04 LE 4 cyl 4A:
Overall mileage from 19 miles (new, with a full tank of gas) to 15,802 miles:
27.3 mpg (15,783 miles, 578.84 gallons)
Best 3 highway mileage readings in that period (with 2 consecutive tankfuls):
35.5 mpg (709.5 miles, 20.01 gallons) mostly freeway
34.9 mpg (815.1 miles, 23.37 gallons) mostly freeway
30.4 mpg (686.9 miles, 22.62 gallons) mostly divided highway w/ traffic lights.
Worst 3 city (small town in our case) mileage readings in that period (single tankful, but at least 10 gallons added):
22.4 mpg (234.6 miles, 10.47 gallons)
23.1 mpg (267.1 miles, 11.54 gallons)
23.1 mpg (241.0 miles, 10.45 gallons)
I cannot do what you asked (drive the car only in town for 3 weeks), since I have to go to work. What I am going to do, which I said before, is use the '04 Camry for commuting in place of my '98 Nissan Frontier, which got 26 mpg consistently (tank after tank), because it was driven almost the same way for each tankful. We'll see if the '04 Camry can do better.
I also will follow up on the overall mileage to date (excluding the time my son had the car) on the '04 Camry, now with 34,600+ miles, as well as info on the '05 Camry, which now has 11,000+ miles. As I said before, the '05 Camry definitely does not do as well as the '04, even though it has the same engine (but 5-speed auto instead of 4-speed auto).
I have a question regarding you 05' Camry getting worse gas mileage than your 04'. Why do you think this is?
I'm wondering if the break-in procedure for the two cars was different enough to cause it. (One of my earlier posts in this thread explains this.)
I'm very curious about the break-in procedure for new cars. Could you tell me the post # of the thread you are referring to?
I've never owned a new car, so I've never had to worry about the break-in. However, I will be purchasing a new Camry or Accord (I haven't decided yet) soon, so I'd like to do whatever it takes to maximize fuel efficiency for the life of the car.
The search box located just above the first post and just below the last.
- 326.1 Miles
- 14.38 Gallons
- 22.67 mpg
90/10 city/highway miles
Total miles on car--4437
You live in a small town, probably minimal traffic at all, you need your car to commute, and so your reports (in my opinion - and I'm sure you'll address this) vary from alot of freeway driving to a heckuvalot of freeway driving. 22-23 mpg in small town driving, with someone going to work 5 days a week - I'm thinking there is some freeway driving in those city tankfuls. Is that true?
It will take 4-6 weeks to get you some comparative numbers on shell gas (my current tank is Arco).
Its not a matter of "believing"; you didn't record your relative freeway and highway driving. your 27 mpg , if predominantly freeway, is not out of line with the predominantly freeway mileage I get (for me, I would get that in 85% or more freeway). I think I drive more city than you.
As for your posts of 30-35 mpg. I have three things to say. One is WOW. The second is that is your best mpg, not your average (27 mpg). And the third is that your indication of 20-23 gallons of refill, which exceed the specification of 18.5 gallons, gave me some pause. I've run tanks dry on rare occasions, but I've never been able to put much more in than the specification. I look forward to your explanation/response.
My town and surrounding county is relatively small (about 100,000 people), and my commute is mostly highway, away from town. However, my wife regularly makes short trips into town, and there is traffic (not like Manhattan obviously, but there is still a gauntlet of traffic lights). So the 22-23 mpg was the mileage recorded when she was driving.
Now she has the '05 Camry, and I'm using the '04. I plan to update my mpg ratings soon, when I have the time.
The "Big Trip" east: 30.3 mpg -- for more details see: 210delray, "Toyota Camry Owners: MPG-Real World Numbers" #83, 5 Feb 2006 6:42 pm
Date_______Miles________Gallons___Cost____MPG____Comments
1/12/06____33,212/404.1___16.01___$35.20___25.2___Son, mixed local driving
1/25/06____33,599/386.5___15.32___$33.70___25.2___Son, mixed local driving
2/05/06____34,012/412.7___16.21___$35.65___25.5___Son, mixed local driving
3/07/06____34,361/348.9___12.11___$26.50___28.8___Car in body shop; city/hwy mix
3/15/06____34,627/266.2____8.16___$18.75___32.6___Hwy/commuting
3/17/06____34,912/285.4____8.07___$18.15___35.4___268 miles home to milepost 39 on NJTP
3/19/06____35,221/309.0___12.00___$27.00___25.8___79 miles to Brooklyn, 127 miles within New York City (4 boroughs), 103 miles from Queens to milepost 30 on NJTP
Total miles since LA: 6,470
Gallons used: 224.42
Total spent: $540.00
Overall mpg: 28.8
And yes, each entry in the post above represents a fillup. I even topped off the tank myself in New Jersey both times (the "full-service" state), because the "attendants" were too busy gabbing and exchanging gobs of cash.
I've gone something like 400 miles since, and the gauge is showing about 3/8 full.
I hope this is enough detail for you. Any more, and my wife will have me committed for OCD!
- 298.8 Miles
- 14.72 Gallons
- 20.29 mpg
All city miles
Total miles on car--4736
I definitely did not achieve EPA ratings on this tank. I attribute that to the fact that my wife put most of the miles on the car during this most recent period; she drives a bit more aggressively than I do. Also the weather has been very cold and many of our trips were 2 miles or less ... cold weather and short trips will contribute significantly to lower mileage. I plan on changing out the oil again at 5000 miles, and then every 6 months/5000 miles.
'24 Chevy Blazer EV 2LT
- 328.1 Miles
- 15.11 Gallons
- 21.71 mpg
95/5 (highway/city miles)
Total miles on car--5064
Changed oil at 4984 miles--Mobil 1 synthetic 5w/30 and WIX oil filter. MPG is still below EPA city estimates--I attribute this to multiple short trips (2 miles or less). Overall I'm still extremely pleased with the car.
I'm getting 21 with 0% highway.
100% City/0% highway
I have driven my 07 Camry LE 4 cyl auto for 1200 miles in 3 weeks (long commute to work) and the gas mileage average is about 28 mpg, (80/20 highway/city). Btw, we have traffic everywhere in LA. I am pretty happy about it so far, especially that we had a lot rain during these 3 weeks period
- 328.1 Miles
- 15.11 Gallons
- 21.71 mpg
95/5 (city/highway)
My mistake on previous post. 95% of miles were actually city.
The first tank I filled was the second fillup, which got me 409 miles on 13.09 gals = 31.46 mpg, mostly all highway miles. For the 2 tanks together it is 29.08 mpg.
I have had this car a week and I have over 1000 miles on it... 3rd tank will get me another calculation tomorrow.
First 2 tanks = 26.49 avg. mpg actual (27.2 avg trip computer)
50-60% city.
Car definitely shifts gears better (faster with almost no slip/lag) when filled with 89 or 91 octane (just as the manual says it will).
Never felt underpowered in this car, even with passengers.
381 miles
12.23 gallons
= 31.18 mpg
95% highway, total ODO now at about 1200 miles.
Trip computer now reading about 35 mpg for this tank, 95% highway, 65 to 70 mph. It is breaking in well, and mileage is getting better and better!
I sit in bumper to bumper traffic 40+ miles each way to work and my most recent fill up @400 miles put me around 23 mpg on my 2007 SE V6. Although, when I get some open road, I open it up so who knows.
I have only used regular so far but will be going on a 2000+ mile round trip this summer and plan to use regular one way and premium coming back to see what the difference is.
About 20 cents per gallon. The performance advantage of premium grade gasoline will vary from imaginary to imperceptible. If you're traveling from the west or east coasts toward the Continental Divide, the trip back home will yield slightly improved fuel economy. Because of using premium grade gasoline? No - it's because you'll be going net downhill on the return trip.
(Have a safe, enjoyable trip with your family - I'm jealous.
I will be going from Indiana across I-80 to New Jersey, then up the Hudson River valley and over to New Hampshire, back across Mass and NY to Niagara Falls then back thru Canada and Michigan. Lots of driving (we've done it before but not for about 15 years) but we have so many people and things to stop and see along the way, flying is not an option.
Look for my report in August
Fillup no. ODO Gallons MPG
1: 340.0 12.445 27.32
2: 401.1 13.030 30.78
3: 381.3 12.223 31.20
4: 481.9 15.384 31.32
Totals 1604.3miles 53.082 gals 30.22 mpg
As you can see with each tank mileage is getting better. The first tank had more city driving, the last 3 tanks almost all highway. The trip computer had me at 34 mpg at this last fillup, so it is off by 2.68 mpg. It is possible that this last fillup, being a rather slow filling nozzle, filled up a bit more than usual.
You have to drive really slow on the highway in order get a good number. I mean at the speed limit - 65mph.
Would it not be much safer if people stayed within or close to the speed limit?
There are many freeway accidents shown on TV caused by drivers cutting in and out of traffic. Some speeding big rig will tap the brakes to avoid rear ending the reckless drivers...thus causing the double or triple trailer truck to jack knife and dozens of vehicles get caught in the collision...closing down the entire freeway for hours.
What pablum. Not a clue!!!
It's possible at 100+ mph when the I4 is not in Overdrive but that is not normal HIGHWAY driving.
As for the I4 being overworked and the V6 being more efficient, I would not say "not a clue." This is a very real issue in heavy non-aerodynamic vehicles where the I4 is pushed to its limits thus eating more fuel than the larger engine. Probably not the case with the Camry. I suspect the 6 spd is helping the V6 mileage and thanks to those with '07 Camrys for posting real world numbers.
40 mpg @ 55 mph
35 mpg @ 65 mph
30 mpg @ 75 mph
The 3.3 liter had lower EPA ratings because it was an older engine. I have been unable to achieve the 3.3 liter highway rating of 29 mpg at normal freeway speeds (70 mph) on my 2005.