MDX Vs Commander

private2private2 Member Posts: 3
edited March 2014 in Acura
I need to decide between a loaded MDX and a loaded Commander. I am looking for advantages and disadvantages of each one, as well as your recommendations.

I live in the northwest (lots of rain), drive short distance to my work, and like to go hiking during the weekend days and to the theater during the weekend nights. I have big friends with kids so I am looking for interior comfort. I also like cars so I am looking for acceleration and power.

I like the commander for its ruggedness; I like the MDX for its elegance.

Let me know what you recommend.

Comments

  • 3rdgin3rdgin Member Posts: 22
    I am in the same situation as you are but live in the SE. Have you looked at both of them and what would you say the pros and cons are? I know the Jeep's ruggedness and MDX is more refined but what about space, ie 7 passenger seating and cargo are behind the second and third row seat?
  • shopper8shopper8 Member Posts: 21
    IMO you are considering apples or oranges. Jeep is a real off road vehicle with low range gearing and MDX is state of the art road and track/safty handling vehicle. I have owned a Jeep since the 70's - wagoneer,cj7, grand cherokee, etc. Low torque power is their advantage. But how often are you really in need of that? I recently, and reluctantly, traded in my beloved Grand Cherokee for an MDX. Haven't used it in snow yet but I am highly confident it will outperform my old car. For what it is worth, the Commander has been listed in a few "biggest busts of 06" lists, that alone is enough for me to stay away. Had Jeep thrown a third seat in the grand cherokee model it would have been a block buster. They badly restyled the 06 Grand Cherokee and then threw a third seat in a retro looking Commander. I think they have shot themselves in the foot for years to come. Go for the MDX, Japanese engineering trumps Chrysler any day of the week.
  • 3rdgin3rdgin Member Posts: 22
    Totally agree about the main differences between the two. I can assure you my wife will not be off-roading nor will I. So what she is looking for is functionality of the vehicle, ie space. Are the third seats and cargo space comparable? That is her main gig.
  • shopper8shopper8 Member Posts: 21
    There is not much space behind third row in the MDX. Third row is suitable mostly for children or small adults. If you fold down third row than car is as big as any SUV. The Honda Pilot 3rd row is a little bigger. If you are going to haul six adults with golf clubs I think you need a Tahoe.
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    definitely go with the MDX. The 3rd-row seat in the Commander is by far the most uncomfortable 3rd-row seat of any SUV that I've ever sat in. Anyone other than a very small child can expect their knees to be up by their chin sitting back there.

    My recommendation: Forget both of these and go with an '06 Armada, which now has a 60/40 split-folding 3rd-row seat. You get excellent power, sophisticated running gear, ruggedness, true off-road capability and seating for 8 adults—all in comfort. I bet it's priced about the same as a Commander or MDX too.

    Bob
  • blkhemiblkhemi Member Posts: 1,717
    If I wanted a minivan, I would buy the Honda Odessey. Thats all the MDX is. It shares its underpinnings with the 99-05 Odessey. I think that the Commander offers the best of both worlds. You get a choice of 3 engines to Acura's one. You get a choice of 3 four-wheel drive options plus the standard two-wheel drive- Acura has a "soft road" awd system only. True enough the Jeep doesn't have the polish of the Acura, but for the money the Jeep is the winner. Don't get me wrong, I think the MDX is a good vehicle. But if I wanted a minivan with a little more ground clearance, I'd buy one. And as for the third seat, the MDX is no more comfortable than the Commander's. Most of the third row seats in mid-size SUV's are best suited for children anyway.
  • shopper8shopper8 Member Posts: 21
    Google Jeep Commander reviews and you will see Autoweek describe the model as a "Design Disaster" or how about Autospies which ranked it #1 Worst Car of '06 "Body designed by Yugo." Or the less threatening Edmunds.com review (which accepts a lot of dough from Chrysler advertising) that likens the car to a "bloated Jerry Lewis on Steroids." WOW, I want to own one of those. If you haven't bought one, please don't, behavior like that would have us all driving Gremlins and Pintos for rewarding Detroit for misreading consumers. If you have, my condolences. The pioneers are usually the guys on TV that eventually end up face down with the short haircut and the arrow in their back.

    I have owned Jeeps all my life and have never been in a situation where I have actually needed low torque power to rock hop at slick rock. And neither will you so don't Kid yourself. Get over it. After a lifetime of driving in a Jeep with all of its "ground clearance" (like I needed it), I quite frankly am lucky to have survived 35 years of driving every model vehicle they have made (ever try to swerve to miss a deer in a CJ7? take my advice...aim for the deer.) Now that I have dependants I am turning Japanese (MDX/Pilot "Consumers Most Wanted, Editor's Most Wanted, etc).
  • private2private2 Member Posts: 3
    Thank you all very much for your good advice, it was useful in making my decision. I drove the two cars back to back yesterday and it was easy to reach a final decision. It all has to do with trade offs.

    As I mentioned in the original posting: I like the commander for its ruggedness; I like the MDX for its elegance. This is where the trade off comparison starts.

    Horse Power: Believe it or not the MDX has more horsepower than the 4.7 litters V8 from Jeep, and equivalent torque as the V6. The 5.7L will blow the socks off the MDX, but as mention before it is all about trade off. The Hemi easily wins this comparison, but the MDX is powerful enough for my needs.
    MDX = Meets
    Jeep = Delights

    Of Road Capability: I use the off road capability to reach distant hiking trails and snow. This means that the harshest environment for me will be a badly maintained dirt road. On this environment the Jeep will get us there without even breaking a sweat, but the MDX will also get you there and back.
    MDX = Meets
    Jeeps = Delights

    Sitting Arrangement: I am over 6’ tall, and my friends are taller than me. I found dissatisfying that on the Jeep my friends would not be able to sit behind me while I am driving. I set up the driver seat to my appropriate driving position, then I sat in the 2nd row behind the driver and it was downright uncomfortable. My wife (not as tall a me) also notice that the side passenger seat can’t be adjusted for height, so she spend most of the test drive looking at the dashboard plastic. I found this unacceptable. On the MDX, the same experiment resulted in a comfortable position in the front and 2nd row seats.
    MDX = Meets
    Jeeps = Dissatisfies

    Elegance: There is no comparison here. We found a large amount of elegant details in the Limited, but they feel like an afterthought rather than design in. The best way to explain this is by using an analogy. The MDX feels like a designer suit, shirt and tie combination that was adjusted by a tailor for me. The Jeep feels like if we placed a nice coat and tie on a wrinkled shirt and a pair of comfortable work jeans.
    MDX = Delights
    Jeeps = Dissatisfies

    Cruising: This was my final selling point. For me this vehicle is important, as I like to cruise over the Northwest with my wife and friends. The MDX feels like it was designed just for that. The two cars have sufficient power for highway cruising at a little over the speed limit. The MDX will be very comfortable in the highway for six hours, and then be strong enough to drive the last mile on a dirt road. The Jeep on the other side will lead to a dissatisfying trip. My wife will not enjoy the scenery because of the previously mentioned lack of visibility from the passenger side, and my friends will be so uncomfortable that they will not enjoy the trip. The MDX is also full of details that will enhance the travel experience.
    MDX = Delights
    Jeeps = Dissatisfies

    As you can see it is all about trade offs. The MDX meets and delights, while the Jeep exceeds in some categories but sadly dissatisfies in others. I entered this analysis hoping that I would like the Jeep, but the MDX is simply a better design for me. Kudos to the MDX designers.

    I plan to buy it next week, so there is a time window to change my mind if you think that my analysis is incorrect. Let me know what you think.
  • blkhemiblkhemi Member Posts: 1,717
    Minivan Roots:

    MDX= yes
    Commander= All solid truck

    You see, the MDX and Commander dance to a different beat. The MDX is for the people who want minivan-like capabilities, but wouldn't be caught dead in one. The Commander is for us who like all the minivan stuff but also would like to pummel a rock or two without having to worry about the undercarriage being bashed around. The MDX is a great car-truck, but the Commander is the brute of this duo. I test drove an MDX, and while a great ride, it's not as complacent as the Commander. It tended to reverberate in it's ride motions, sort of like minivan. Hmm. That explains it. As for the seating postion, the passanger seat on my Commander Limited is height adjustable. Was the seat in the one you checked out powered?

    Looks:
    MDX: Me-too-styling
    Commander: Classic Jeep

    The MDX, while a handsome car-truck, is dated in terms of styling. It's overall shape is Japanese standard(ie: Lexus RX330). It brings nothing to the table that says look at me. Maybe that works for some people, not most. The Commander is a thoughtful design that will stand out in a crowd of boring SUV's.

    In conclusion, the MDX is a great vehicle. But it does need more updating than just putting on new exhaust tips and new taillamps. It's the oldest design in the Midsize Luxury SUV segment. The Commander is not without fault. But for sheer perfomance, their are few SUV's that can beat it in this price range (despite being 367 pounds more than Grand Cherokee, it's 6.5 sec. 0-60 is identical to the JGC HEMI). The Commander takes this trophy hands down.
  • shopper8shopper8 Member Posts: 21
    blkhemi: i have a soft spot for Jeep lovers so you're all right in my book. a little zealous in your enthusiasm but i understand why. German soldiers used to steal the vehicles during world war 2 b/c their 75 horse power engines could litterally go anywhere.

    but think about it? if we all agree that a 7-8 passenger vehicle is designed for families, how over (or miss) engineered is it to anticipate that mom, dad and the 5 chitlins are going to go serious four wheeling after breakfast at Dennies (I can hear it now, "son, pass me that Jack, Mom just blew an axel going over devels fork..." ). for what the car is intended for MDX is a MUCH better vehicle.
  • blkhemiblkhemi Member Posts: 1,717
    Let's see if I can be less "enthusiastic and sarcastic"

    I do agree that the MDX is great vehicle for what it "is". However, the average buyer would see the Commander and MDX in seperate boats anyway. All they have in common are a third row seat and a wagon-shaped exterior. The Commander is a fresh design that infuses classic heritage whereas the MDX has that every-other-SUV-on-the-block design. Boring. All I'm saying is that the MDX does not even fully compare with the Commander.

    What other SUV in it's class gives you the choice of 3 engine choices?(besides other DC makes) NONE
    What other SUV in it's class offers the choice of three different 4WD options? NONE
    What's the price of your family getting it's money worth out of truck other than to say it's an Acura? Priceless

    I would also like to state that the DC products of late have actually exceeded many of the foreign makes that we as auto-comsumers have come to adore. So as for the MDX being "MUCH" better than Commander; look at it this way. The MDX's design is half a decade old whereas the Jeeps design's barely a year old. The Commander tows more than MDX. The Commander offers two V8's. And the Commander is without peer when it comes time to leave the pavement onto gravel/dirt/sand/rocks/-what have you and can also smother bumps and ruts in the pavement like best of them. Can the same be said about the MDX? Probably Not.
  • shopper8shopper8 Member Posts: 21
    I am of the opinion that the reason US Auto makers offer so many options is because they don't know the consumer that they are trying to market to. They don't know what the consumer wants and this makes them constantly play catch up to the more nimble and savvy marketers. This isn't Jeep specific, ever try to buy a Ford Explorer? You need to sift through about 10 trim levels simply to get a basic vehicle with leather and DVD. Jeep waited 4 years to come out with a "family friendly vehicle" by placing a third row seat in what looks like a 1987 model Cherokee Laredo, their lowest end model. They offer three engines because they don't know if the car will be bought for 4 wheeling buffs or economy minded car pool queens. The MDX's 265 horsepower gets you over or through just about any gravel/dirt/sand/snow situation you are going to run across and gets about 20% better gas mileage (my '96 grand cherokee had 175 horsepower for comparison and was plenty of power). MDX offers only one engine because it accomplishes the driving mission of 99% of their target audience. The cherokee (commander is not yet rated) has a 1 in 4 chance (23%) of flipping over in a single vehicle accident whereas the MDX has a one in ten. If you are carrying families, that should matter. My basic point is the commander is not designed as a safe family vehicle just because they slid in a third row. It is designed as an off-road vehicle and clearly drives like one.
  • blkhemiblkhemi Member Posts: 1,717
    "They don't know the consumer"

    If Jeep didn't know their "consumer", do you believe they'd sell any vehicles? Hmm probably not. I and most of the people who buy cars love the fact that we have "choices" in our buying experience. As for fuel economy, the MDX's is no stand-out in the world of SUV's. Sure it may be better than a Commander V8 by about 2 mpg, but is equal in V6 range. As for the way it looks, Can Acura say that their vehicle is a stand-out among it's peers? Nah. Curious. Where did you get tha info on the Commander's rollover rate. I sure would like to know because NHTSA nor Consumer Reports nor IIHS has tested the Commander. The MDX is less likely to rollover because as Consumer Reports put it; "The Chrysler Pacifica along with all other "minivan based" SUV's have a less chance of rolling over than standard SUV's" That may be a good thing. You have a 6,000,000 : 1 chance of your vehicle rolling over UNLESS you're doing something insane. So I wouldn't worry about that notion. What I would worry about is when that fabulous Acura runs out of warranty, (1) How would I keep all those front-drive components in working order, and(2) How would I keep my electrics working after 75,000 miles?

    Lastly but definetely not least: "It's designed as an off-road vehicle and clearly drives like one"

    Overexaggeration! My Commander is the best riding SUV I've ever owned. Wish I could say the same for the MDX that rattled all the way back to the dealership after a test drive. Sure it's more than capable off-road, but it is long-haul comfortable. If the MDX is designed for a family, why is third row seat just as puny as the next SUV's seat.

    P.S.-- With today's gas prices the way they are now, all SUV's and pick-ups are a burden on the average person's wallet. However, the MDX needs PREMIUM fuel to get that 265hp that makes it so powerful to "get you over ot through just about any gravel/snow/sand/dirt situation you are going to run across."
    My Commander with a 330hp HEMI takes only the cheap-old regular stuff and blows the doors off of just about every SUV in it's class. Hmm..... How's that for engineering?
  • shopper8shopper8 Member Posts: 21
    In the spirit of the Edsel, Gremlin, and other American missteps. My prediction is it will be discontinued after 3 years of dissapointing sales or massively redesigned to compete. Your purchase probably bought Chrysler another 15 minutes before they plunge into inevitable bankruptcy.
  • rctennis3811rctennis3811 Member Posts: 1,031
    1. The Commander is just as bland as my MDX...it just looks like an old Jeep...PERIOD. Both look great, but aren't going to be awed over in Rodeo Drive.

    2. Funny thing you mention fuel economy between the MDX and Commander. Despite using Premium 91+ octane compared to the Commander's Plus 89+ octane requirement, the MDX will still use less fuel in one year according to fueleconomy.gov.

    3. Also, you imply that the MDX will break down mechanically after the warranty expires. Hmm, doesn't the MDX have a longer new car warranty and powertrain warranty than the Commander?
    MDX COMMANDER
    POWERTRAIN
    6 year/70,000 miles 3 year/36,000 miles
    VEHICLE
    4 year/50,000 miles 3 year/36,000 miles
    BODY RUST
    5 year/unlimited miles 5 year/100,000 miles

    4. The 3.7L V6 used by DCX is as unrefined as it gets. But that's not all. The 4.7L and 5.7L are very unrefined too, though they are fun to drive. But if I want the smoothest ride, I'll stick with an OHC engine, or an OHV from GM.

    5. The interior quality of the Commander is not up to Acura's standards. Push your thumb against the passenger side of the dashboard in the Commander and you can feel the plastic move. Try doing that in an MDX.

    6. The MDX comes with more available cargo room - up to 81.5 cu ft to be exact. Compare that to the Commander's 68.7.

    7. Just for those who want to know...interior dimensions between the two are pretty much on par---fairly comfortable, with a kids-ONLY 3rd-row.
    MDX COMMANDER
    HEADROOM (1/2/3)
    38.4 in/39.0 in/36.1 in 42.1 / 40.2 / 35.7
    LEGROOM
    41.5 in/37.8 in/29.3 in 41.7 / 36.1 / 28.9
    HIPROOM
    56.9 in/56.3 in/48.5 in 55.6 / 54.0 / 57.4
    SHOULDER ROOM
    61.2 in/61.1 in/58.6 in 59.0 / 58.5 / 50.4

    8. Chrysler's new navigation system is wonderful, honestly it is. But it's still no match for Honda/Acura's DVD navigation system. ZAGAT-restaurant reviews, voice recognition, Bluetooth calling to all 7-million POIs, larger 7" touch screen, and a rearview camera. They've just had more years of experience with it.

    9. Where's the side airbags that deploy from the front seats in the Commander? The IIHS has already proven to us that they are effective and useful, so why doesn't the Commander have them but the Acura does?

    Both are great family haulers, but you need to rethink some of your arguments against the MDX. But in the end, I'd recommend a car-based SUV (MDX, RX, B9, SRX, etc.) to the average Joe American family.
  • rctennis3811rctennis3811 Member Posts: 1,031
    *CAUTION...800X600*

    Honestly, this:
    image

    looks a lot better than this:
    image

    I know that's not the Commander Limited, but it's essentially the same minus the chrome door handles and the wood trim on the center stack and window switches.

    While the Commander goes for the ultimate off-roading look, the MDX goes for the more sophisticated urbanite look. Since these pictures are relatively large, you can see some of the detailing (or lack thereof) in the Commander. Where's the padded leather door panels? Where's the padded leather center armrest? Where's the LED gauges? Where's the leather steering wheel spokes? Where's the digital climate control? Again, it's just a matter of opinion, but if I'm spending upwards of 35K, I don't want my family hauler looking cheap.
  • blkhemiblkhemi Member Posts: 1,717
    " Your purchase just bought Chrysler another 15 minutes.........."

    Umm. If Chrysler goes bankrupt, Mercedes goes along with it. Do you actually think the carmaker that everyone follows is willing to let that happen? I think not. And by the way, ALL of DC's SUV's perform well in sales. They often beat even DC's predictions. Can't say the same for Acura who has a 45 day supply of MDX's compared to the Commander's 11.
  • blkhemiblkhemi Member Posts: 1,717
    First off, 89 octane is NOT a requirement. It is a recommendation. 91 is required in that soft-roader MDX. Put 87 or 89 in it and ruin the injectors, you've just void your warranty. I don't know where you got your sources from, but my Commander came with a 7/70000 mile warranty. As for the engines not being "refined", I'm sorry that Jeep decided to put some rumble with that punch. Both the 4.7L and 5.7L have gotten plenty of accolades for their "smoothness" and "seamless" power delivery.I take it that you're into car-based (minivan in the case of MDX), so you wouldn't recommend the Jeep Commander anyway. I get this as you mentioned the MDX,RX,B9(the ugliest car since the Pinto),SRX). These are for people who don't care to have a rugged vehicle like the Commander. But it is what it is. A nice competitve SUV for the "average Joe American family".
  • rctennis3811rctennis3811 Member Posts: 1,031
    1. Considering that every 2006 Chrysler, Dodge, and Jeep product is supposed to come with a 3 year/36,000 powertrain warranty, you must be an exception - either the dealer was lenient on you or you need to check your contract. 2005 models had the 7 year/70,000 powertrain warranty.

    2. Also, I'm yet to see a review of a Chrysler engine that touts it's refinement. I never said anything about the 4.7 and 5.7 not having seamless power delivery nor punch; in fact, they're very fast, just not very smooth.

    3. A true car aficionado would know the MDX and Pilot are based on Honda's "Global Midsize" platform, which underpins the Accord, TL, RL, and Odyssey. One could say it's based on a minivan platform, but then one would be incorrect.

    4. Interesting how you bring up how rugged the Commander is. Tell me, out of the many people that are buying SUVs, how many go off-road?

    5. Technically, 91 is "required" for the MDX, but you'll find many who use 87 and their MDXs have been running fine for quite some time, albeit with slower acceleration. Same goes for the HEMI; even though 89 is "recommended", you can use 87 but with slower results.

    6. Obviously the Commander will have a shorter supply - it just came out! Yet despite being new, incentives are already being piled on it, whereas Acura's MDX is maintaining the number 2 best selling luxury SUV slot without incentives, "Employee Pricing Plus", nor rebates.

    I also find it interesting how when I take in my MDX for an oil change, I get a free rental TSX or a free Chrysler, Dodge, or Jeep vehicle since my dealer has an Advantage Rent-a-car built inside. I'll let you know how the Commander is once they loan me a Limited fully-loaded this week. I'm sure the resale will stay up on these things!
  • blkhemiblkhemi Member Posts: 1,717
    Checked the contract and my warranty is 7/70000 miles. It was being phased-out in mid '06. Check Ward's ten best engines, and you should see the 5.7L review. You're right. A true car aficionado would know that the MDX/Pilot is based off the '98-'02 Accord platform. But one would also know that when the MDX was marketed 5 years ago(pretty long time ago in the "luxury" field), it was touted as being based off the Odessey--not the Accord even though they all sprout from it. Up here in New England and in states where people live in rough terrain, we go off-road everyday technically. With snow typically 6-months around the year, car-based SUV's just don't cut it. And yes, both the Commander and the MDX will have a slight power lost when a lower grade fuel is used, however, the MDX's power lost is more significant than in the Commander . And when you do use a lesser octane than required-not recommended, You shorten engine life by quite a bit. And by the way, speaking of power, since this year's new SAE-ratings measuring horsepower, the MDX fell to 253hp. Seems that a lot of foreign makes were using the old method of measuring horsepower(ie: Toyota/Honda). Oh, and don't get me started on towing. The Jeep Commander tows a healthy 7200 pounds. HMMM. Wonder what the MDX tows? I got it, 3500 pounds. My horses tow more than that. So in essence, my(1) Commander can tow(2) of your MDX's. The only incentives that are being offered as I type this post is $1500 on the Commander. The MDX's around here are being discounted for up to $5000(READ: $5000 off an Acura). $2000 Honda cash, $1000 owner loyalty, $2000 dealership discount. Seems not even the prestigous Acura is immune to discounting. Interesting.

    And for the record, Jeep's resale value has always been in the top 5% of ALL SUV's.

    Check It out: I bought '98 JGC 5.9 Limited brand new:$36,783.98
    In 2005 when I got it appraised at--
    A HONDA DEALERSHIP, the vehicle was worth $13,745,
    this on a vehicle 7-yr old vehicle(American at that)

    So resale has never been a problem for Jeep.
    Oh, and when I get my oil changed or any service, I always get a vehicle just like mine. So If I owned a MDX, why on Earth would I want a "lesser" car? Beats Me!!
  • rctennis3811rctennis3811 Member Posts: 1,031
    1. What Ward's had to say for this year's 10 BEST regarding the 5.7L HEMI:

    " Hip Hopping with Hemi

    DaimlerChrysler 5.7L Hemi Magnum OHV V-8

    Chrysler Group originally launched this engine in an '03 Dodge Ram pickup. Now Chrysler is at it again, flaunting its long-range planning acumen by designing the ground-breaking 300-Series sedan (and the husky Magnum station wagon on the same platform) to accept the Hemi.

    The combination is a smash hit, both playing on the other's strengths: The 300C hit the market with immediate, hip-hop "street cred" and features the Hemi. Thanks in no small part to the Hemi, the 300C overshadowed virtually every other new vehicle launched in 2004. The 300-Series would have been cool without the Hemi. W it, it's a home run.

    In every model that offers the Hemi - an expanding list - Chrysler gets customers to pay extra for an unabashedly in-your-face V-8. The company says the overall take rate is a giddy 46%.

    Earning a spot on the Ward's 10 Best Engines list for a third consecutive year, the Hemi is a juggernaut, seemingly better in each new application."

    Like I said, the HEMI has a lot of power and is a blast to drive, but there is no mention of refinement in their press release.

    2. Despite the MDX being old, it's been continually updated year-to-year (not so much for 2006) and it still manages to have more convenience features than a Commander.

    3. I have cousins in up in Boston that drive a 2004 RX330 - a car-based SUV. They get around fine, just like many of their friends do. I go up there every year and when it snows, it SNOWS. Apparently, the neighbors that do have car-based SUVs can also get out of their driveways fine.

    4. The MDX's power loss is more significant how? I'm not saying you're wrong, but I'd like some proof first.

    5. I know what my MDX can tow, it's just average. I knew that when I bought the vehicle, as the only thing I would ever need to tow would be our boat (the MDX can tow up to 4500lbs for a boat), but we keep that at the lake. But when comparing the 3.7L V6 to the 3.5L V6, trailer towing is equal. Obviously, an OHV V8 will be able to tow more than a SOHC V6, although gas mileage is a little higher.

    6. Interesting how you state Jeep's resale value is so high. Compare a 2005 Grand Cherokee Limited 4WD fully-loaded except for the Off-Road Group to a 2005 Acura MDX Touring with Navigation. Both come in for around $42,500. Add 15,000 miles to both and tell me which one has the higher resale. The GC plunges down to $26,100 trade-in value while the MDX goes to $34,350. Quite a difference in resale for the GC despite it coming with a DVD entertainment system and rear sonars on the checked option list while the MDX not.

    7. Owner loyalty cash applies to almost every make and model. Heck, I bought my wife a 2004 Lexus LS and it too had owner loyalty cash. I even purchased our first MDX (2004 Premium model) for $3000 off sticker since it was CLOSEOUT for MY04. Despite these "incentives", the value still seems to hold well.

    8. I also sort of doubt that you got $14,000 for you 1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited 5.9 when most people are selling theirs on eBay Motors at around $7,000. Sure KBB's Suggested Retail Value is $13,760, but trade-in value is much lower at $8,700 and private seller value is lower tue. $13,760 is what you can expect to pay from a dealer if you were to buy one from them.

    9. Interesting how you call your vehicle "lesser"...your words, not mine. Remember, I still get to choose from a loaded TSX (navigation and all) (you can special request an MDX, TL, RL, etc. but you must book ahead a couple of hours) or any fine Chrysler, Dodge, Jeep vehicle which is usually fully-loaded. I know last time they gave me a Durango Limited 4WD with navigation and that's what I'm basing my information on when talking about the Commander.
  • blkhemiblkhemi Member Posts: 1,717
    So as far as the HEMI goes, you say they are releasing it on more Chrysler cars for the hip-hop crowd? I would be careful on how I word sentences as most people who buy HEMI-equipped vehicles are middle-to-upper class Surburbanites. I can assure that most people who are in their early 20's aren't driving off the lot in $30-$35,000 300C's or Magnum RT's It's not Chrysler's fault that most people want a little speed with their vehicle. I wouldn't call new front and rear fascia's "continuous updating". Oh, I forgot the dual exhaust tips. I'm glad to hear that your family in the NE are some of the few people who have no problems in their car-based 'utes. But let me assure you, when you come to Kennebunkport,Maine in the middle of December in 6ft drifts of snow, that RX300 or MDX want cut it. You can read about the MDX's power loss in this month's issue of Motor Trend ( it's the one that says truck/suv prices for '06, just for your proof.) And by the way, a 12 horsepower decrease is significant when the manufacturer is mis-leading in it's ad in stating that a vehicle has more power than it's rated at. I have to tell you that the MDX's tow rating is BELOW average. A Jeep Liberty with that same little V6 that is consistently being bashed tows a hefty 5000lbs. This from a compact utility.

    I can also assure you that I don't have to make -up a story about the value of my '98. It was in mint condition and that was what Honda offered me at the time. It only had 42,000 miles on it, so that's probably what makes it so unbelievable that a Jeep can muster that form a Honda dealership. How did you come up with the trade-in values on the JGC? What's interesting is that I got $38k(new @ about $43k) back on mine when I got the Commander while I a collegue of mine who just got realistic and traded in his '04 MDX(death trap) with only 9600 miles on it because it was in service for half of ownership only got back $28k. Mint Condition and ended up buying a Lexus GX470 (a very good choice--oh and truck-based). Interesting how all of a sudden Acura is generous with "incentives". And in terms of lesser, I merely was stating that you'd rather drive a vehicle that in your opinion, is second rate to an MDX. So if the service is so great at Acura, why would you have to get a loaner car just to get an oil change. I've never waited more than an hour for an oil change. Well I just made my point exactly...........
  • shopper8shopper8 Member Posts: 21
    I just traded in my '96 Grand Cherokee with 80k miles on it to buy a brand new Acura MDX and got a bowl of soup and a handshake as a trade-in ($2500). I took it to another dealer and they offered half a bowl of soup and a hand shake ($1500). Jeep trade in values are horrible - I have owned 4 over the years. They are throw away cars at 120k mi. In an earlier posting, you mentioned that you traded in a brand new JGC, bought new for $43k (a record transaction for Jeep by the way) and sold it back with a couple thousand miles on it for $38k to buy a Commander. Your convinced you got a good deal? The car depreciated 12% in one month and your doing a victory lap on the resale value of Jeep/Chrysler.

    My prediction: trail rated Commander will be gone in three years. Families won't buy them because of price, styling, gas mileage, and safety. And traditionalist who really want a true off road vehicle will still buy the Jeep Grand Cherokee or Liberty.
  • blkhemiblkhemi Member Posts: 1,717
    Your predictions are ridiculous. Jeep took huge flack off of the 84-01 Jeep Cherokee because it was not "mainstream" enough when newer model vehicles were coming from all major automakers. Yet somehow, they kept rolling them off of the assembly line for 17 YEARS!!! And made huge profits off of them. So Jeep will NEVER discontinue the Commander in three years because for (1), they have to much invested in it, and (2), they have never discontinued a vehicle without it running it's forecasted course.

    Oh, I got a sour deal? The JGC I bought was factory-ordered (which means it had things on it that other JGC's didn't, to help you understand the price). It didn't have a couple thousand miles, more like 9100. Any vehicle that you drive off the dealership lot, (oh , and this includes Acura), will lose at least $7k. So to tell me that I got a bad deal, you may want to look at the deals you've made when continuously (4 of them you say) buying such a "horrible" vehicle. ANY car with over a 120k miles won't be worth anything. No car is immune to that. What does a bowl of soup have to do with buying a car? I only got a Coke when I was in the process of making the dumbest decision of buying an MDX, however, I was offered clam chowter when I was buying the Commander. Interesting. Oh and for the record, families are buying these things in droves. It has been selling faster than JGC and the redesigned Ford Explorer, which the Commander and Explorer was released similtanuously. Was your '96 optioned to the max like my '98 5.9 Limited? Probably not. And you mentioned styling. If GM can move Hummer H2's like hot cakes in the middle of a gas crissis, I assure you the last thing Jeep is worried about is some car-based SUV lover calling the Commander "ugly". The Commander refuses to blend in, unlike the vanilla bland MDX. Price. Umm, last I checked the MDX was "pricier" than the Commander. I know that they are tick-for-tat when fully optioned, however you can get a Commander for around $28k. Try that with even the base MDX(no roof rack, which is standard on the Commander) and you come up with roughly $35k just to start. If you want to save gas, go with the V6(17/22). Safety, I don't remember the MDX getting a great crash-test score either. Nice try Shopper.
  • rctennis3811rctennis3811 Member Posts: 1,031
    1. I never said they were releasing it to the hip-hop crowd, that's just your misinformed self saying that. I provided a rebuttal against your claim that Ward's said the HEMI was refined, but in fact it said nothing about refinement regarding the HEMI on their 10 best list. In fact, I never worded a sentence like that at all.

    2. Since it's inception, the MDX has received a new navigation system, a new Bose audio system, rear video camera, faster DVDROM processing unit, new seats, new gauges, new steering wheel, new center console, refreshed exterior, new wheels, side-curtain airbags, new exhaust system, stability control with traction control, Brake Assist, OnStar, Bluetooth, projector-style headlamps, ambient lighting, and more. Yes, I'd call those continuous updates.

    3. The MDX had no power loss, just number loss. A 2006 model will still accelerate just as quickly as a 2005 model, since it has the same amount of power coming from the 3.5. The SAE just restated the HP in lower numbers through the new, fairer testing methods. A loss of power would be if the exhaust were more constricted for 2006. You need to be careful with how you word your sentences... ;-)

    4. The Jeep Liberty is a truck-based compact ute, so of course it will tow more than say a CRV or something of that class. What I mean is the MDX is on-par with the SRX, Highlander, Pilot, B9, etc. in terms of towing. And I assure you, most people in my suburban community don't tow very much. Our SUVs are considered "mall cruisers."

    5. Since when does the fact that vehicle is truck-based essentially make it better? If there was no point to car-based SUVs, then how come almost every automaker is jumping on the bandwagon and the public is buying the "hype" up? You make it seem as if every single American needs to tow and go off-road. Sorry, we don't all live in Maine. By the way, something cannot be in "mind condition" if it was supposedly in service for half of its ownership period. Your friend does know that all states have Lemon Laws, right?

    6. Again, you're putting words into my mouth when stating that I said I would rather drive a Chrysler-Dodge-Jeep vehicle when my car is in for service. I said they offer the choice of those vehicles.

    7. Hey, we finally have something in common! I've never had to wait more than an hour for an oil change either! It just so happens that Acura gives loaner cars for the day when I need to get to work.
  • rctennis3811rctennis3811 Member Posts: 1,031
    1. Jeep didn't discontinue the Cherokee because it wasn't "mainstream"...it was outdated, period. The Liberty is a MUCH better vehicle than the Cherokee ever was.

    2. Any car driven off the dealer lot will lose at least $7,000 including Acura? Say it ain't so, as I traded my 2004 MDX Premium for a 2005 MDX Touring and the value of the 04 only lost $4500. Don't believe me? I can scan the sales contract if you'd like. :-)

    3. Ever heard of eBay Motors? Apparently, many cars are sold there with over 120,000 miles and the seller still gets money for them. Ahem.

    4. People are buying the Commander in droves? Oh, don't you mean the H3?

    5. While I'm not calling the Commander ugly (in fact, I think it looks pretty good; much better than the "new" Explorer), it's nothing special in the design department. There's no huge wheels like the H2/3, no big chrome grill, no high ride height, no available Yellow exterior color, and no HUMMER badge. It basically just looks like a 2001 Jeep Cherokee, which DCX has already said.

    6. Safety!?! The MDX got great crash-test scores!
    *A "Best Pick" by the IIHS.
    http://www.hwysafety.org/ratings/rating.aspx?id=149

    *5 Star Frontal/Side by the NHTSA
    http://safercar.gov/NCAP/Cars/3214.html
    Apparently, the 2005 MDX has a lower head injury rating (frontal crash), thoracic trauma index (side crash), and chance of rollover than the 2005 Jeep Grand Cherokee.

    How's that for ***** safety?
  • blkhemiblkhemi Member Posts: 1,717
  • blkhemiblkhemi Member Posts: 1,717
    I stand corrected about the crash scores. Unlike some people, I can take a little criticism. I meant to say the H2 because I was talking in terms of " style". The H3 has more of it than the H2. And if you're talking about the H3 in terms of sales, GM says in the monthly reports that I get (36 year retiree) that the H3's are selling even slower than the H2's even with the better fuel economy. I'm glad to here that you got more for your MDX as that's not always the case. You might want to go back and read your post as you did say something in reference to the hip-hop crowd and the HEMI besides what Ward's said. Funny, didn't see Honda/Acura motors listed. Oh and speaking of the HEMI, just picked up my new copy of Truck Trend and they are praising the HEMI engine for its smothness in operation, so read up on it. A person who pays a seller on the Internet anything over what is worth on a vehicle is nuts. Never said the Acura lost power for '06 but rather lost rated power. I have a problem when a manufacturer is mis-leading in it's advertising about power. You as a consumer should as well. I was merely stating that while the Liberty is in the compact class, it still out-tows the MDX. And I know most MDX or RX330 owners aren't towing anything, but it just doesn't seem concievable that a truck so powerful can only tow so little. And just to let you know, it doesn't have anything to do with being car-based. The Ridgeline tows a healthy 5000 pounds. It's all about packaging. Oh and yeah, my buddy's MDX was in mint cond. as he didn't have to worry about scuffs and scratches on it because it was on a freakin rack 15 days out of month. If you take the time and read the MDX's problems post on this very site, you'll see that there are just as many people complaining about problems as on the Jeep forums. I have no doubt of Honda's engineering. IMO, it's better than Toyota's. But it's not perfect. And finally, I can agree with you on something. Both Commander and the MDX is better looking than the supposedly "newly invigorated" Explorer.

    I could go on and on about the MDX and Commander. Truth is that they are remarkable vehicles on different sides of the tracks. However, if our federal government doesn't get it in gear and do something about the energy crisis, both me and you will be battling over hybrids next...........

    ........hopefully I worded my sentences properly :)
  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H EdmundsAdministrator Posts: 11,114
    Let's tone down the hostility and argumentative nature of the conversation. Deciding which vehicle is best is a subjective matter, and no one is going to "win" the argument. People have different requirements and tastes in vehicles, and no one vehicle suits everyone.

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  • anonymouspostsanonymousposts Member Posts: 4,202
    1. Honda never mis-led in its advertising its horsepower. In fact they should be commended for being one of the first manufacturers that retested thier whole line-up and restated power using the "new" criteria. maybe the other manufacturers were "smarter" by figuring many consumers would find it hard to comprehend that only the way they measure the horsepower changed and not the actual amount of power.

    2. Truck trend...Tells you right there what the smoothness frame of reference is.

    3. Frame based vehicle tow more as a rule. So I would expect nearly any frame based SUV to tow more. But I also would expect it to be much a less refined and poorer handling vehicle. That's why car-based SUV's sell so strongly. many people want the truck "look" but not the truck NVH tradeoffs.

    4. MDX problem board has 920 posts from April 26,2002. Whereas the Cherokee had 2129 from about a year earlier. I scanned some of them and for the most part it looked like the problems with the Cherokee were more serious and pervasive.

    Funny thing is I once wanted another Daimler-Chrysler product, The C-Class Benz. I went into that forum to get a little information on them and that was the only time I was told NOT to buy the car and expect Honda/Toyota reliability by its occupants.

    The MDX/Cherokee discussion is rather simple though. Do want a truck or a rugged car. If you have lived thus far without a truck and just want something a little more rugged looking, you'll probably do best with an MDX. It's not "trail rated" but I'm sure not it's capabilities would be more than adequate. But if you spend time far off the beaten trail and need to tow a lot of stuff often, you'd better get the Jeep.
  • blkhemiblkhemi Member Posts: 1,717
    Up until Sept.30, 2005 they were bragging about the MDX's "supposed" 265hp. I don't know what you'd call misleading, but if a carmaker is saying the vehicle has more power than it does, that is cheating the consumer. Although it didn't lose any power, it still is bad business to advertise a vehicle with a higher power rating than it really does. The new SAE rules were in effect 1/1/2004. So for 2 model years, Honda and Toyota "mis-led" the consumer.

    Wonder what would've been the outcome if DC or GM had "lied" about horsepower ratings? What's so interesting is that the domestic makes actually either stood pat or gained power ratings. The new Z06 Vette gained 5-hp under the new testing.
    So since it was Acura/Honda and Lexus/Toyota, were supposed to just overlook that? I think not.

    You failed to type about all those tranny failures in the MDX's.
    "Serious and pervasive"? I'd say so

    Your expectations of the Jeep truck platform vehicles should be higher. Pick up a copy of the latest Consumer Reports(those guys love Acura's) and they talk about how quiet and refined the Commander and JGC is. Oh, and the ride quality rated "HIGHER" than that of the MDX's. Interesting.
  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H EdmundsAdministrator Posts: 11,114
    Since this discussion is no longer about future vehicles, and it seems to be simply an argument between a couple of memers, we're going to close it. If you want to discuss these two SUVs, please hit the SUVs board. Thanks.

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