I've had it since December 19th, and without a sunroof, you should probably fit just fine. I am very comfortable. My brother, who is 6'4" and 350+ is not - if you are 300 or over I'd look at a Tahoe, Suburban, Armada, etc. I'm 250 and have plenty of room. LT's are available with adjustable pedals, too, although I think they are more for shorter people, not goons like you and me...:)
I do not believe or expect this will be as reliable as my Honda CRV, Toyota 4Runner, or Lexus RX330. However, it is *far* more fun to drive, and I don't care about resale value for this car - plan on keeping it (I had my 1996 Impala SS until 2003, admittedly not as a daily driver, though).
Don't even bother looking at one with a sunroof. Dismal stupid lack of headroom. Really upsets me - I'd like to own a sunroof someday. And what's worse is they seem to tie sunroofs in with other options I'd like.
It's amazing the difference between how this drives and how a standard TB drives. Flat in corners, accurate steering, good placement, and the ride isn't punishing given the performance.
I will say that rear seat room is dismal. They should have shifted the rear seats back 6 inches and stole from the cargo area (which is more than ample).
Keep in mind GM incentives (Bleeding Red Tag prices) end January 3rd - I haven't heard what's after that, although we're too hooked on incentives now to go back, IMHO.
Can someone give me some advice whether living in Detroit is a reason for me to go with the 4WD SS instead of the 2WD. I am currently driving a CTS manual shift and opted for snow tires during the winter to overcome traction issues in the winter. If not 4WD is not needed I'd rather go for the 2WD and enjoy the SUV to a greater extend. A side remark about the SS vs. SRT-8; if I had the luxury I for sure would choose the SRT-8; but in at the same time I probably would go for a Porsche Cayman or Boxster (my preference is still to drive a car instead of an SUV; can't tow my boat with a sports car though).
Well, living in Detroit is a jungle in the winter time. So the 4WD is a good choice for the driving that has to be done there. However, the TB SS 2WD does have traction control. So you may be able to get away with it.
But I'm planning on sending the exhausts out to the sides (behind rear wheels), and having the tow-hook come out the middle cut-out. It makes more sense, and I really don't care much for the center exhaust look - that's more for corvettes, Ferrar, and Lambos
Sorry if this is a stupid question, but who is Mopar Performance? Trying to find out more information on the possible PCM upgrade for the SRT 8. Thanks
It's not a stupid question at all. Just go to Mopar.com and you'll find all the info you need. However, the PCM upgrades may not be listed as of yet. DC announced a February roll out.
By the time my SRT-8 arrives, hopefully Mopar will have their exhaust sysyem available to take to my custom mechanic.
If not, I've already been communicating with Flowmaster to encourage them to specially make an SRT-8 50 series muffler. I've always been a fan of the sound their stuff produces.
Thanks for the response; just for my understanding one has to select the 4WD in the Trailblazer meaning it justs adds weight and cost. In normal conditions one would still drive it as a 2WD. Am just not that familiar with 4WD having driven cars only.
Picked up my Black SRT on Jan. 5th, it is a nice complement to my black wrangler. I absolutely love it and am very happy that I got it. I was close to going with an 06 limited, which would have been nice, but my heart about stopped when I saw my SRT sitting on the lot, ready to go. In 12 days, I have roughly 1000 miles on it. Just can't get enough drive time. My buddy, who has a Porsche Cayenne, rode with me through town and said "no [non-permissible content removed] way would I even dare race you". Just an unbelievable car.
No, the TBSS is AWD, not a selectable 4WD system. Typically one refers to a system as AWD instead of 4WD when there is no selectable low range and it is always driving all 4 wheels, although the torque division is usually variable using a number of different methods to decide how much torque to send to a particular wheel.
That being said, I have a 2WD TBSS - because sometimes burnouts are just plain fun.
Yes, I just installed my PCM from Vector Motorsports. They also have a prototype CAI, should be available late this month.
The TBSS was fast before, but it's unbelievable now. Everyone who's run at drag strips before and after are getting a solid .5 off their 1/4 miles (running consistent 13.5's) with this tune. Can't recommend it enough - even better gas mileage!
I can't wait to run one and just see how they run. A great Engine for Sure.(TB SS) My 6.1 Hemi has a lot left in it too, at least 600 hp with the right tune. The drive train will take a lot punishment and no problems with the 6.1 Hemi yet. A local man runs his 300C SRT-8 all the time and runs side by side with a C6 Vette auto. Stock engine just removes some fuses and runs 13.4 ET (best) He runs rear DRs and just smokes the tires before a run. Both Great Vehicles in my Book and has a lot of potential left in them. I would love to see the LS-7 Engine installed in the TB. Good Racing. Gene
I think that would be fun...lots of TBSS owners going to track so far - lots of slips being submitted. So far the posted times for owners of the 2WD TBSS with the Vector PCM has been consistent 13.5's with one 13.38 at 104 MPH. I think it's going to be as much fun as my '96 Impala SS was.
how are the brakes on the ss tb? does the ss package have upgraded brakes over the straight six? edmunds lists vented rotors front and back for the six cylinder tb but it doesn't list rotor size and i know from other ss models, chevy didn't upgrade the brakes from the standard power plants.
I find it truly amazing that there are TB SS's readily available(at a discount at that) yet people are paying a premium to get into the SRT, even waiting months to get into one.
The SRT is truly the best pick here. It is a blazingly quick vehicle and has the utility to spare(not towing tho). If you're into towing and cargo cap., then by all means the SS is a wonderful ride to have. But if you have gas in your blood and crave max velocity, the SRT is the best way to go, especially if you can get one at a decent price(closest to MSRP as possible).
I looked at a black TBSS in Richmond, VA today, as a replacement for my '93 Typhoon. Not a bad vehicle, but to my eye, not as well conceived and executed as the SRT8. From top to bottom, it has more of a cobbled together look and feel. I applaud GM for trying though, and this clearly is one of there better efforts lately. It stickers for 38K. I will keep my eye on it and if it doesnt move, I may try to lowball it. If I could get it for low 30's, it might not be a bad purchase. That will also buy me time to see if the SRT8's come down a bit in the next 12 months.
I picked up the TBSS in feb. It stickered at 38k and I got it for about 33.5k. Knowing the interiors on GM cars are bad, this one was improved as well as the ride/handling. I couldn't believe I was driving a Trailblazer. The brakes stop the truck easily and handles like a sports car. I added the brake duct kit last month. The radio is also really good and I won't swap it out like I did on my Duramax. The tranny is very lazy and takes a long time to upshift. Power is unreal and I am getting the Vector PCM upgrade to solve shift problems. If you get into the throttle too hard, the 4:10 gear will eat up the mpg like a 60's big block. When I go easy I get about 16.3 combined. I bet on a hwy. trip i'll get 20mpg. That's good for a heavy truck w/a 4spd and 400hp but could have been way better with a 6 spd and a 3:42 gear. BTW, the BMW X5 was a dog and rode hard. The VW was just slow and both got same low mpg. They are well made but over priced and the TBSS eats them alive on many points. War story: I got into a cat and mouse run with a Cayenne S on a twisty back road in GA. He couldn't shake me (my tranny almost betrayed me) but I passed him inside the double yellow when he made too wide a turn and blew his doors off. Impressive.
I saw a black TBSS just north of Richmond on I-95 this morning. It overtook me on the left, then tucked in front of me before exiting. I have to admit it did look all nasty and hunkered down on the move, a sweet looking ride. Maybe not an SRT-8, but sweet none the less! What a great time we live in!
My husband and I are looking to buy the SS soon. I love the look of it and the horsepower is ridiculous but, can anyone tell me what we're realistically looking at for gas mileage? The $3/gallon price tag makes me sick to my stomach!!! :sick:
Hi rick66, i'm thinking about getting a SS, i have a few questions for you, where and what brand did you get the brake duct kit? Is it worth the investment? How about the Vector PCM? does it give you more horsepower or does it improve shifting only? where can i get it? i would love to make the ss to have a 0 - 60mph time to less than 5 seconds. thanks for the help
I took delivery on a new SS May 5th and I'm definitely in love! Rick, there is a TSB with a transmission update that will help with your shifting. I had it done to mine about a week after I took delivery. I tow my '72 Nova race car and open trailer without any problems. I do plan to get the Vector tune and CAI. For the price I think the SS is hands down a better deal than the SRT.
For the price, of course the SS is a much better deal than the SRT, especially when you factor in the SS much steeper discounts.
BUT, for all out performance(which is what it's made for), no other SUV can touch the SRT. It scorches all of them, from a 32k TB SS to a $112k Cayenne Turbo S. Congrats on the new SS tho.
It scorches the Cayenne Turbo S? If you're talking about it being much cheaper that's true, but performance-wise it doesn't. They both hit 60 in under 5 seconds (4.8 of the Cayenne). The Cayenne Turbo S's top speed is 168 mph which the Jeep certainly can't crush. The Porsche has 520 hp and 530 ft. lbs of torque both of which it reaches at relatively low rpms. The SRT has 425 hp and 420 ft. lbs. of torque, and it needs to get up to 6000 rpms to get to its max power (the Cayenne does it at 5,500) and its max torque at 4,800 rpms (the Cayenne hits max torque at 2,750 rpms). Not to mention the fact that the Cayenne tows 7,700 lbs while the Jeep can only tow 3,500 lbs. AND the Cayenne get slightly better mileage (though no performance oriented SUVs are great in this area), has greater range and carries slightly more cargo. SO the only place I see it being close to the Cayenne is in 0-60 times. I couldn't find stats for hihger speeds, but due to the hp and torque differences I'd say the Cayenne would widen the gap as speed increased. Yes, I know the Cayenne weighs more, but obviously the hp and torque make up for it. Not saying the SRT isn't a great truck; dollar-for-dollar it kicks the Cayenne Turbo S's butt, but performance-wise it doesn't. I've also read that the interior of the Jeep has a pretty cheap feeling and look which obviously the Cayenne does not. Were you maybe thinking the regular Cayenne Turbo rather than the Turbo S? The SRT is definitely faster than the regular Turbo while still about $60K cheaper.
No sir, I was talking about the Turbo S. Here's why the SRT can even muscle down the S:
It corners better(.88g v. .85) 0-60(4.5 secs v. 4.8) rolling start, 5-60(4.9 v. 5.2) 1/4 mile(12.8 secs v. 13.2 or .4, depending on what you've read) braking(117ft. v. 128ft(blame the blunt weight)
And need a discuss price. But I do have to one up the Porsche, it's resale value is like a vault, it will probably resale close to what it costs new.
But pound for pound, the SRT is just the better all around performer of SUV's. Yes the Porsche has a higher top speed(a whopping 12 miles), but you try maintaining a 5500 pound SUV at those speed, yes even a Porsche. And at it's $112k price point, I can buy 2 3/4 SRT's for it's price of one.
As for the interior, the Jeep is plain as it gets(not horribly so, not like the TB's for instance). But apart from the superb leather seats, the Porsche's interior is just pathetic for it's asking price. Hard plastics abound give the impression of a much cheaper vehicle, much like the spartan interiors of the Porsche cars.
Towing, yes the Jeep's modified suspension cut back towing, and the Porsche tows a healthy 7700 pounds(Something a 330-hp HEMI JGC can do without the turbo's or the 520 hp), but I betcha didn't know the Jeep can carry more on the inside. The Porsche apears big, but the miniscule interior reveals the truth.
Yes for status, the Porsche will be the way to go. But for all-american muscle that crushes Germany's finest(or Austria's), the SRT is it.
BTW: Since when has a mileage estimate of 12/15(Porsche) v. 13/17 been "better". Neither of these vehicles get nowhere close to decent mileage, so for a comparison, I'd probably left that one out.
Firstly, let's clear up some points about the Cayenne you have wrong. All of the Cayenne models can tow 7,700 lbs, and that includes the base V6 (which has a modified VW engine in it that produces 250 hp, 229 ft. lbs. of torque). So no, it doesn't need the 520 hp or more importantly the torque of the Turbo S whereas Jeep needs a huge 6.1 liter "HEMI" (I find it ridiculous that we feel the need to name engines here) to tow 4,000 lbs less than a 3.2 liter V6. Frankly, the HEMI is a dinosaur compared to Porsche's engines. I know that the Austria comment was meant as a dig, but I think you ned to research more because only the chassis is made there. The rest of the truck is made at the new factory in Leipzig, Germany (the Carrera GT was also made there). You also have the gas mileage wrong (not that it really matters). The Turbo S gets 16-18 mpg while the Jeep gets 12-15 mpg. It's funny that you discount the 12 mph top-speed difference, but the .3 difference in all of your stats amounts to "crushing" to you. Sorry, but they are well within the margin of error for driver, conditions and tire differences. Basically, the cars are a dead heat for on-road performance (sounds like the Jeep can't touch it off-road though neither is great at this). Also, you have braking wrong. The Jeep needs 125 ft. 60-0. I can't find the Cayenne braking stats, but I'll keep looking (I doubt your figure is accurate). Finally, the interior. Maybe you haven't sat in the Turbo S because it's anything but cheap looking. Here's a couple of shots of one:
I don't know how many sports cars you've looked at, but generally they all have more simple interior designs. The point is that you should pay attention to driving without being distracted by all of the "noise" in lesser car interiors. Look, I know this discussion stirs the pot in terms of German vs. American car design and the whole status thing. The Jeep is an impressive car, I admit that, but it doesn't crush the Cayenne by any means. Yes, it cost less and there are reasons for that (beyond the badge). The fact is though, there aren't likely to be many people that cross-shop these two vehicles. Oh, and you mentioned holding it's value. Now why do you think the Porsche holds it's value much better? Why do you think it offers a 4 year/50,000 mile warranty while the Jeep only offers 3/38K? DId you see that Porsche's just got rated the highest initial quality by JD Powers (Jeep was at 32 well below the industry average)? Did you know that Porsche is the most profitable car company in the world?
Just found on Edmunds that the Cayenne Turbo they tested in 2004 braked 60-0 in 116 feet. I would imagine that the new Turbo S would be able to beat that or at least match it. This is an interesting read too:
Actually, in Motor Trends test they stopped 60-0 in 112 ft. in the straight Turbo. Also I doubt your 1/4 mile stat is right. The Turbo did it in 13.79 seconds, and given the hp difference with the Turbo S I doubt it would only be .3 or .5 seconds faster. Can't find the stat anywhere though. Where did you get 13.2 or 13.4? Car and Driver had 13.5 for the Turbo (not Turbo S) BTW. One correction: the Turbo S get 13-18 mpg not 16-18.
I read someone did it in 13.27, another I saw 13.31. Both cars are tops in their class, but I'd say it's hard to compare the two. Both are beautifully engineered cars. Why can't everyone just get along?!?
I know that you're trying to discount me, but the truth of the matter is that the Porsche is just another attack on American iron and it fails, yet again(much in the way the 911 does with Vette.)
Most of the stats I got on the Porsche came from their own website and several European mags, you know the unbiased ones.
Both of these vehicles have hugely conservatively rated numbers, but judging from a person who actually owns one(do you own a Turbo S, or any Cayenne for that matter?), I know the Jeep has the upper hand on most numbers. Call it as you may, the Turbo S is a very nice piece of machinery. And speaking of JDP, isn't the Cayenne the model that dragged Porsche down last year? And remember, this was an IQS study, lets see what happens when those diffs pop loose as they're doing VW Touaregs as of know.
Did you mention noise? I'm sorry that I enjoy the hearing the roar of my engine and note the gear whine the S puts out(oh that's excuseable because it's an off-roader). You know some people like that(ie: most American gearheads.)
And I maintain my point. The interior is unbecoming of a $112k car. My Audi A8 W-12 may have some leather hides left over so that you can cover those plastic armrest/door covers. (And they've bought into the VW/Audi family, wonder if they'll ask for help on the interiors?) Yes Porsche is the most profitable because they're still classified as a "speciallty" maker, not full-line. Yes the Porsche is great off-road, but will it pass a lesser(only $35k) JGC Quadra-Drive II-equipped? NAH. Remember, Jeep is still the only maker to still allow only one wheel to spin for 100% of power if all others are uncapable. Maybe the Turbo S is better in Dubai in the sand dunes, WHOOPS!! Didn't the Turbo S get stuck there in the sand?
Currently, what is Porsche's day-in/day-out availablity on the Cayenne line? 8 days. SRT? - I'll let you guess it.
I don't have to prove to anyone that the Jeep is tops. The Cayenne is what it is, a bloated, cramped, heavy,(IMO, not the best looker around), but very fast and very $$$ vehicle.
BTW: with my Brembo brake upgrade, my SRT stops in 105ft., better than say, a 911(S,4S,Turbo,GT3)/Cayman/Boxster(S), oh yeah, Cayenne(all models). And I didn't "discount" the top-speeds, but really, a 5500 pound SUV going 168 mph safely, comfortably. Highly doubtful. DCX was smart at giving the SRT a 155 mph limiter, but believe me, It will go much further. The only demerit I can see with my SRT is that it's in need of a 6th gear, but other than that, it's still tops.
Very interesting little toy. 0-60 im 2.9 secs? That's fast. something that neither the SRT nor the Turbo S could do.... As a matter of fact, I think the Bugatti Veyron(1.2mil) had better watch out for this little monster because it ties its 2.9 time.
I'm not trying to discount you. You do that just fine yourself without any help by not responding to specific points I raised, but instead making personal attacks. When you're ready to debate this in a more reasonable manner let me know. Until then it's not worth it.
(1) Rich stated "I find it ridiculous we feel need to name engines here"
The 6.1 isn't named "Hemi", it is a hemi, it's also referred to as a V8, does that offend you as well?. Do you find it ridiculous that Porsche refers to the engine in the Cay TT as a "Turbo"? I bet not since it is a turbo.
(2) Rich stated "Frankly the Hemi is a dinosaur compared to Porsche's engines."
The 6.1 HEMI uses the latest technological advances coupled with proven mechanical simplicity to accomplish performance comparable to the best Europe or Asia has to offer. Yes, it's displacement is greater than Porsches fabulous 4.5 TT, but it requires far less mechanical complexity & expense to achieve the same results. To refer to the 6.1 as a dinosaur is "EuroSnobbery". DCX has chosen a different mechanical direction for the 6.1 but is no less technologically advanced.
PS: I'm a Poschephile myself, currently owning two, a Boxster & a 911 and feel they possess possibly the finest automotive engineering division on the planet. I do however feel they dropped the ball with the Cayenne. To get back in the game Porsche needs to develop an On-Road Cay TT that discards the "pork" added to the Cayenne platform necessary for off-roading that 99.9% of Cayenne's will never be exposed to. If they did this it would: (A) drop 4-500 lb's, (B) still be goofy looking, (C) reduce the price a few $K, and (D) perform as many of the Porsche faithful hoped it would to begin with.
Doesn't HEMI stand for hemispherical head? There is definitely some feeling out there that this engine design is somewhat dated. I'm not offended by it at all, but the marketing for the engine is annoying without a doubt. A far as producing an on-road only Cay TT where's the challenge in that? It doesn't take much in the way of impressive engineering to produce a fast, single purpose on-road truck. Porsche wanted to design an SUV with great on AND off-road capabilities. Will Cayenne owners off-road with it much? Nope, but most people that own cars that go 160 mph won't go that fast either. The Porsche faithful were just mad that Porsche built an SUV at all. It had NOTHING to do with performance. With regards to how it looks, I'd be willing to bet that if you parked a Cayenne and Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT-8 next to each other and asked 10 people that owned neither which was more attractive, at least 8 would pick the Cayenne. I know that everytime I get my Cayenne washed people comment on what a great looking truck it is. Most think it looks like a a big 911.
Hemi is short for hemisphere; in engines it means the combustion chamber is hemispherical. Hemi is also a trademark of DC, but lots of companies have used the hemi design in their engines, including (drum roll....) Porsche beginning with the 911 back in '64 - per Wikipedia anyway.
"... I know that everytime I get my Cayenne washed people comment on what a great looking truck it is. Most think it looks like a big 911.."
That being the case, I know an awesome eye doc who can give them some corrective lenses as they are in desperate need of them. I also have to disagree sharply about the notion that most people will take the style of the Cayenne over the SRT. I'm a member of many clubs, both European and domestic and most people often gripe over the exaggeration of the Cayenne style(nothing like the sleek 911, IMO).
Facts? I addressed your assumption of facts(or lack thereof). You haven't addressed any of mine. Like the Turbo S getting stuck as you bill it as a true "off-roading on-roader". I have more if you need them...
BTW: On naming the engines, why is it that Porsche still says in some of it's marketing campaigns that they're the "only carmaker that has hi-po boxer engines", which really isn't the case as the 300-hp WRX Sti is faster 0-60 than a 911(base)?
1. A real head-turner. My college-age daughter described it as "bling-ghetto" and said that was a compliment. 2. The exhaust note is perfect, deep & throaty without droning. 3. The massive torque, combined with the AWD & 5spdAT, is incredible! The drivetrain seems always up on its toes, even compared to my supercharged '03 SVT Cobra and turboed Typhoon. 4. The ride/handling tradeoff is right on the edge. On bad pavement it gives you second thoughts, but on on-ramps its all smiles! 5. This feels like a beast. It feels serious, heavy and brute quick, an unusual combination.
TBSS:
1. Handsome, if unremarkable, appearance. My daughter described it as "easily mistaken for just any other SUV." De-badge it and it would make a great "sleeper!" 2. Strong engine crippled by average transmission. Tranny often seemed confused and sluggish, making the vehicle seem less responsive. Reportedly an aftermarket reprogramming will minimize this some. 3. Felt larger but lighter than the SRT-8. I know it is not, but it felt that way IMHO. 4. Interior had lots of room, but style seemed to be aging & cluttered. Little to distinguish it. 5. Ride felt well controlled but rounded off, it handled broken pavement very well. Some body roll apparent around sharper curves. 6. Feels like a compromise vehicle. My daughter described it as "great if you want a big engine in an ordinary truck." I would not say that, but I think she is correct in ascertaining that it is a more balanced vehicle, good at a lot of things, but perhaps not excelling at any one thing. Again, just one person's opinion, about two great vehicles!
Bit late into this but a discussion of the Cayenne versus any Jeep or Chevrolet of comparable type is bound to fail. The Cayenne simply murders the rest in all depts, apart from price. A UK magazine road test from a couple of years ago pitted the Cayenne Turbo S against an Audi RS6 Avant and the Audi was barely keeping up on the twisty stuff. I simply cannot imagine the dinosaur Hemi getting anywhere close to the Porsche unit, (good as Hemi was - in it's day). As for an earlier post saying the Corvette outperforms the 911. On price, yes I guess it does in USA. In all other departments the Corvette is a cart by comparison.
As for the Aerial Atom; now there is a bird of a completely different feather. Totally mental. Just shows what CAN be done with little money and a lot of ingenuity. As an every day driver ? er, no thank you.
Don't read reviews much, eh? The Porsche Cayenne Turbo S and the Grand Cherokee SRT8 are about neck-and-neck in performance. And I think the SRT8 is a little bit quicker, too. About the 911 - Corvette thing, puh-lease!
FWIW, there was a comparison between the SRT8 and the TBSS in the Mar 06 Car and Driver. I'm sure many have already seen it. It's on their website too; they like both but give it to the SS. Cool rig...
24 Sienna Plat AWD / 23 Civic Type-R / 21 Tesla Y LR / 03 Montero Ltd
Comments
I do not believe or expect this will be as reliable as my Honda CRV, Toyota 4Runner, or Lexus RX330. However, it is *far* more fun to drive, and I don't care about resale value for this car - plan on keeping it (I had my 1996 Impala SS until 2003, admittedly not as a daily driver, though).
Don't even bother looking at one with a sunroof. Dismal stupid lack of headroom. Really upsets me - I'd like to own a sunroof someday. And what's worse is they seem to tie sunroofs in with other options I'd like.
It's amazing the difference between how this drives and how a standard TB drives. Flat in corners, accurate steering, good placement, and the ride isn't punishing given the performance.
I will say that rear seat room is dismal. They should have shifted the rear seats back 6 inches and stole from the cargo area (which is more than ample).
Keep in mind GM incentives (Bleeding Red Tag prices) end January 3rd - I haven't heard what's after that, although we're too hooked on incentives now to go back, IMHO.
But I'm planning on sending the exhausts out to the sides (behind rear wheels), and having the tow-hook come out the middle cut-out. It makes more sense, and I really don't care much for the center exhaust look - that's more for corvettes, Ferrar, and Lambos
Thanks
Didn't see anything on the site, but sent them a email.
If not, I've already been communicating with Flowmaster to encourage them to specially make an SRT-8 50 series muffler. I've always been a fan of the sound their stuff produces.
That being said, I have a 2WD TBSS - because sometimes burnouts are just plain fun.
The TBSS was fast before, but it's unbelievable now. Everyone who's run at drag strips before and after are getting a solid .5 off their 1/4 miles (running consistent 13.5's) with this tune. Can't recommend it enough - even better gas mileage!
Engine for Sure.(TB SS) My 6.1 Hemi has a lot left in it too, at least 600 hp with the right tune. The drive train will take a lot punishment and no problems with the 6.1 Hemi yet. A local man runs his 300C SRT-8 all the time and runs side by side with a C6 Vette auto. Stock engine just removes some fuses and runs 13.4 ET (best) He runs rear DRs and just smokes the tires before a run. Both Great Vehicles in my Book and has a lot of potential left in them. I would love to see the LS-7 Engine installed in the TB. Good Racing. Gene
The SRT is truly the best pick here. It is a blazingly quick vehicle and has the utility to spare(not towing tho). If you're into towing and cargo cap., then by all means the SS is a wonderful ride to have. But if you have gas in your blood and crave max velocity, the SRT is the best way to go, especially if you can get one at a decent price(closest to MSRP as possible).
There's no separate make/model category for the Turbo, so I guess we can tolerate some regular Cayenne posts as well, lol.
Steve, Host
Thanks!
BUT, for all out performance(which is what it's made for), no other SUV can touch the SRT. It scorches all of them, from a 32k TB SS to a $112k Cayenne Turbo S. Congrats on the new SS tho.
It corners better(.88g v. .85)
0-60(4.5 secs v. 4.8)
rolling start, 5-60(4.9 v. 5.2)
1/4 mile(12.8 secs v. 13.2 or .4, depending on what you've read)
braking(117ft. v. 128ft(blame the blunt weight)
And need a discuss price. But I do have to one up the Porsche, it's resale value is like a vault, it will probably resale close to what it costs new.
But pound for pound, the SRT is just the better all around performer of SUV's. Yes the Porsche has a higher top speed(a whopping 12 miles), but you try maintaining a 5500 pound SUV at those speed, yes even a Porsche. And at it's $112k price point, I can buy 2 3/4 SRT's for it's price of one.
As for the interior, the Jeep is plain as it gets(not horribly so, not like the TB's for instance). But apart from the superb leather seats, the Porsche's interior is just pathetic for it's asking price. Hard plastics abound give the impression of a much cheaper vehicle, much like the spartan interiors of the Porsche cars.
Towing, yes the Jeep's modified suspension cut back towing, and the Porsche tows a healthy 7700 pounds(Something a 330-hp HEMI JGC can do without the turbo's or the 520 hp), but I betcha didn't know the Jeep can carry more on the inside. The Porsche apears big, but the miniscule interior reveals the truth.
Yes for status, the Porsche will be the way to go. But for all-american muscle that crushes Germany's finest(or Austria's), the SRT is it.
BTW: Since when has a mileage estimate of 12/15(Porsche) v. 13/17 been "better". Neither of these vehicles get nowhere close to decent mileage, so for a comparison, I'd probably left that one out.
http://www.chryslerforum.com/m_3429/tm.htm
I don't know how many sports cars you've looked at, but generally they all have more simple interior designs. The point is that you should pay attention to driving without being distracted by all of the "noise" in lesser car interiors. Look, I know this discussion stirs the pot in terms of German vs. American car design and the whole status thing. The Jeep is an impressive car, I admit that, but it doesn't crush the Cayenne by any means. Yes, it cost less and there are reasons for that (beyond the badge). The fact is though, there aren't likely to be many people that cross-shop these two vehicles. Oh, and you mentioned holding it's value. Now why do you think the Porsche holds it's value much better? Why do you think it offers a 4 year/50,000 mile warranty while the Jeep only offers 3/38K? DId you see that Porsche's just got rated the highest initial quality by JD Powers (Jeep was at 32 well below the industry average)? Did you know that Porsche is the most profitable car company in the world?
http://www.edmunds.com/apps/vdpcontainers/do/vdp/articleId=109458/pageNumber=1?s- ynpartner=edmunds&pageurl=www.edmunds.com/new/2006/porsche/cayenne/100684771/roa- dtestarticle.html&articleId=109458
Most of the stats I got on the Porsche came from their own website and several European mags, you know the unbiased ones.
Both of these vehicles have hugely conservatively rated numbers, but judging from a person who actually owns one(do you own a Turbo S, or any Cayenne for that matter?), I know the Jeep has the upper hand on most numbers. Call it as you may, the Turbo S is a very nice piece of machinery. And speaking of JDP, isn't the Cayenne the model that dragged Porsche down last year? And remember, this was an IQS study, lets see what happens when those diffs pop loose as they're doing VW Touaregs as of know.
Did you mention noise? I'm sorry that I enjoy the hearing the roar of my engine and note the gear whine the S puts out(oh that's excuseable because it's an off-roader). You know some people like that(ie: most American gearheads.)
And I maintain my point. The interior is unbecoming of a $112k car. My Audi A8 W-12 may have some leather hides left over so that you can cover those plastic armrest/door covers. (And they've bought into the VW/Audi family, wonder if they'll ask for help on the interiors?) Yes Porsche is the most profitable because they're still classified as a "speciallty" maker, not full-line. Yes the Porsche is great off-road, but will it pass a lesser(only $35k) JGC Quadra-Drive II-equipped? NAH. Remember, Jeep is still the only maker to still allow only one wheel to spin for 100% of power if all others are uncapable. Maybe the Turbo S is better in Dubai in the sand dunes, WHOOPS!! Didn't the Turbo S get stuck there in the sand?
Currently, what is Porsche's day-in/day-out availablity on the Cayenne line? 8 days. SRT? - I'll let you guess it.
I don't have to prove to anyone that the Jeep is tops. The Cayenne is what it is, a bloated, cramped, heavy,(IMO, not the best looker around), but very fast and very $$$ vehicle.
BTW: with my Brembo brake upgrade, my SRT stops in 105ft., better than say, a 911(S,4S,Turbo,GT3)/Cayman/Boxster(S), oh yeah, Cayenne(all models). And I didn't "discount" the top-speeds, but really, a 5500 pound SUV going 168 mph safely, comfortably. Highly doubtful. DCX was smart at giving the SRT a 155 mph limiter, but believe me, It will go much further. The only demerit I can see with my SRT is that it's in need of a 6th gear, but other than that, it's still tops.
Hilarious video for your weekend:
dugg's CarSpace (go to the bottom of the page)
Steve, Host
(1) Rich stated "I find it ridiculous we feel need to name engines here"
The 6.1 isn't named "Hemi", it is a hemi, it's also referred to as a V8, does that offend you as well?. Do you find it ridiculous that Porsche refers to the engine in the Cay TT as a "Turbo"? I bet not since it is a turbo.
(2) Rich stated "Frankly the Hemi is a dinosaur compared to Porsche's engines."
The 6.1 HEMI uses the latest technological advances coupled with proven mechanical simplicity to accomplish performance comparable to the best Europe or Asia has to offer. Yes, it's displacement is greater than Porsches fabulous 4.5 TT, but it requires far less mechanical complexity & expense to achieve the same results. To refer to the 6.1 as a dinosaur is "EuroSnobbery". DCX has chosen a different mechanical direction for the 6.1 but is no less technologically advanced.
PS: I'm a Poschephile myself, currently owning two, a Boxster & a 911 and feel they possess possibly the finest automotive engineering division on the planet. I do however feel they dropped the ball with the Cayenne. To get back in the game Porsche needs to develop an On-Road Cay TT that discards the "pork" added to the Cayenne platform necessary for off-roading that 99.9% of Cayenne's will never be exposed to. If they did this it would: (A) drop 4-500 lb's, (B) still be goofy looking, (C) reduce the price a few $K, and (D) perform as many of the Porsche faithful hoped it would to begin with.
Lots of people hashed it out in the Hemi's: any make, any size....What do you think? discussion years ago.
Steve, Host
That being the case, I know an awesome eye doc who can give them some corrective lenses as they are in desperate need of them. I also have to disagree sharply about the notion that most people will take the style of the Cayenne over the SRT. I'm a member of many clubs, both European and domestic and most people often gripe over the exaggeration of the Cayenne style(nothing like the sleek 911, IMO).
Facts? I addressed your assumption of facts(or lack thereof). You haven't addressed any of mine. Like the Turbo S getting stuck as you bill it as a true "off-roading on-roader". I have more if you need them...
BTW: On naming the engines, why is it that Porsche still says in some of it's marketing campaigns that they're the "only carmaker that has hi-po boxer engines", which really isn't the case as the 300-hp WRX Sti is faster 0-60 than a 911(base)?
1. A real head-turner. My college-age daughter described it as "bling-ghetto" and said that was a compliment.
2. The exhaust note is perfect, deep & throaty without droning.
3. The massive torque, combined with the AWD & 5spdAT, is incredible! The drivetrain seems always up on its toes, even compared to my supercharged '03 SVT Cobra and turboed Typhoon.
4. The ride/handling tradeoff is right on the edge. On bad pavement it gives you second thoughts, but on on-ramps its all smiles!
5. This feels like a beast. It feels serious, heavy and brute quick, an unusual combination.
TBSS:
1. Handsome, if unremarkable, appearance. My daughter described it as "easily mistaken for just any other SUV." De-badge it and it would make a great "sleeper!"
2. Strong engine crippled by average transmission. Tranny often seemed confused and sluggish, making the vehicle seem less responsive. Reportedly an aftermarket reprogramming will minimize this some.
3. Felt larger but lighter than the SRT-8. I know it is not, but it felt that way IMHO.
4. Interior had lots of room, but style seemed to be aging & cluttered. Little to distinguish it.
5. Ride felt well controlled but rounded off, it handled broken pavement very well. Some body roll apparent around sharper curves.
6. Feels like a compromise vehicle. My daughter described it as "great if you want a big engine in an ordinary truck." I would not say that, but I think she is correct in ascertaining that it is a more balanced vehicle, good at a lot of things, but perhaps not excelling at any one thing. Again, just one person's opinion, about two great vehicles!
As for the Aerial Atom; now there is a bird of a completely different feather. Totally mental. Just shows what CAN be done with little money and a lot of ingenuity. As an every day driver ? er, no thank you.
24 Sienna Plat AWD / 23 Civic Type-R / 21 Tesla Y LR / 03 Montero Ltd