Tire Rack Problems

fiatfan

Just a warning to those who are looking for new alloy wheels for their car. I have had a terrible experience with Tire Rack. I bought 4 new 17" Sport Edition Wheels with new Continental tires from Tire Rack to use in the summer for my 2000 Passat wagon. All 4 wheels bent in less than 6 months. So, I called Tire Rack and they gave me a small discount on 4 new Borbet wheels that are supposed to be "much stronger". I have since bent 7 of these wheels. I even went so far as to buy new tires with reinforced sidewalls to help. We didn't go 2 weeks before 2 more wheels bent. All this on a car that my wife drives to work and back on the highway.

I have come to the very expensive and frustating conclusion that Tire Rack is selling substandard wheels. I have purchased from them for 25 years, but I will never buy from them again.

Be aware of this before you buy. Their prices are good, but unless you just leave the car in the garage, you will have lots of bent wheels and a dangerous car to drive.

tidester

You may want to visit Tires, tires, tires.

tidester, host

fiatfan

I figured since it was a wheel problem, it would not be appropriate for the tire section. The tires I have received from Tire Rack have been fine. The wheels have been a disaster. Especially, since a neighbor has a Passat with the VW 17" wheels and same profile tires and has never had a problem.

tidester

Oh, that's fine! I thought the Tires Forum may also be helpful.

tidester, host

tisse32

Wait, you bent almost a dozen wheels in six months?! Either your town needs to fix the roads, or your wife is rallying the car.

fiatfan

Actually my wife is a very conservative driver. We have never had a single wheel problem on any other car. The 18" wheels on my RX8 have been fine. The 16" wheels on my Kia have also never had an issue. Tire Rack just kept saying it was our fault, but obviously, it's not.

kiawah

Could it possibly be the location that is doing the install?

What is the symptom that you notice? Wobble(ie rim bent)?

or Vibration (ie throwing off the balance weights)?

tltypek

My 17" SSR GT1s are bent and out of round. Never had a bent wheel before in my life, even living in the harshest driving environments. The car has been babied (as all my cars are!) but my wheels are shot. Two years of fighting this battle and counting.... I complained to Tire Rack and they placed the blame on me. Then they tried to shift it to the installer (and his Hunter machines). Then they offered a small credit if I bought new wheels, then told me they don't carry the wheels anymore in my size but "they are great wheels". Now I notice all the SSR wheels seem to be on closeout. SSR won't respond to customer inquiries, and Tire Rack is the only US distributor. I'd say something fishy is going on. Meanwhile, there are no other wheels on the market that fit my Acura TL-S with Brembo Gran Turismo brakes...

fiatfan

I have given up on my Borbet wheels and they have been sitting in the basement with the new Kumho tires mounted. I hate to think how much money I spent on this disaster with Tire Rack. They said they same thing to me, "they are great wheels" and "no one else has had a problem". They blamed the roads, the car, our driving, never the fact the wheels are junk. The originals are back on the car and it has been trouble free.

kewaydin

I also had a similar experience. I installed new Borbet wheels and tires from Tire Rack last Sunday. After experiencing terrible vibrations, I called Tire Rack Thursday to complain. They suggested re-balancing, so I saw their recommended installer on Friday who told me I had three bent rims. I've never bent a rim in my 20+ years of driving, but in less than 50 miles, and less than a week, somehow three became bent? Either the wheels came that way, or they're junk. Apparently a tire tech will review the case and call on Monday, but from what I've read here I don't expect a satisfactory resolution.

paisan

So let me get this straight, you bent your rims and want TR to cover it? How much did the rims cost? If these rims were anything less than $200 a pop you can count on them not being up to the tast of serious potholes etc.

-mike
Motorsports and Tuning Host

tltypek

My wheels (on the TL) were almost $500 each (SSR Integral GT1s) and were bent almost immediately. Not a darn bit of help from TR.... and of course the wheels were discontinued by the manufacturer shortly after I bought them, and no other dealer but TR was authorized to sell them...never bent a rim in my life, and I've had 9 performance cars and lived in 5 different states with them, some with some pretty bad roads. My VR4 drives the same roads as the TL, with even lower profile tires (TL has 45, VR4 has 40) and no bent rims on that car.

kewaydin

That's the thing. In the five days and 50 miles the wheels were on, I didn't have the opportunity to hit any potholes. The worst they saw was the transition between new and old pavement on the highway, and that was in rush-hour traffic. Any wheel at any price should be up to that task.

paisan

Something is fishy here. I mean how do you get dented rims in 50 miles? I highly doubt they would send em dented. I ordered probably 100s of tires and at least 30 sets of rims from them without issues. Mine always ship from DE.

-Mike
Motorsports and Tuning Host

kewaydin

Good question. Frankly I agree that it's unlikely that TR would send bent rims, but I find it equally hard to believe that 3 rims were bent in as many days on my regular commute. As I say, the roughest thing they saw was a bump between old and new pavement where they're resurfacing the highway, and that was at low speed due to traffic. I'd accept responsibility if they'd seen any true road hazard, but if that wee bump were enough to bend three, then these wheels weren't fit to begin with.

paisan

I'd probably lay the blame on UPS. Those guys really fling stuff around.

-mike

stevecebu

I have used Tire Rack many times but am wondering if this is really happening if they are worth dealing with on wheels. I know that when you have an unusual problem, no one believes you. Chances are all the rims were defective and if you can find someone who is qualified to test the wheels for structural integrity you might have a lawsuit.
Alloy rims tend to break not bend, it sounds as though these are very soft and aluminum is actually quite soft depending on what grade you buy as raw material. I worked as a Tool & Die Machinist for about 15 years a long time back so I've worked with all this stuff and theer are way to get it tested. Chances are they made a whole defective batch. It's poor customer service to pass the blame on to the customer without checking it out. Maybe buying teh rims locally is a better idea.
I will probably look into that as an option as well. $500 rims should NOT bend or break except under extreme use.

burdawg

My brother in law is a partner in a company that is a big player in the tooling industry for custom wheels. Actually, they're one of the last independent US based shops that CNC machines molds used for casting wheels. I asked him about your posts the other day and he said that since almost all manufacturing is now done in China quality has become a big problem, much more than when most of it was in Mexico. His info is that porousity in the aluminum is the problem, and US based companies are sending quality engineers to China to try to find the root cause.

stevecebu

My brother in law is a partner in a company that is a big player in the tooling industry for custom wheels. Actually, they're one of the last independent US based shops that CNC machines molds used for casting wheels. I asked him about your posts the other day and he said that since almost all manufacturing is now done in China quality has become a big problem, much more than when most of it was in Mexico. His info is that porousity in the aluminum is the problem, and US based companies are sending quality engineers to China to try to find the root cause.

Ever see Chinese gold? They sell it here and it looks nothing like gold more like coppery bronze it's actually reddish.
Too bad custom wheels are such big $$$ and yet use such low grade materials. Aluminum and Magnesium are very light but must be made right.
I haven't been out of Hong Kong when there but can only imagine how many corners they cut during manufacturing. Same way in the Philippines. They use far too much sand when they make concrete and it shows after a few months when it's been completed.
Well I guess I'll have to find wheels that are actually made in Japan or Germany.

fiatfan

Supposedly, the Borbet wheels are made in Germany and TUV approved, but I find it hard to believe. Something is seriously wrong with the wheels and Tire Rack did nothing. I was a big fan of theirs and purchased tires and wheels from them for over 20 years. Now, there is no way I would buy anything. I think they know the wheels are junk, but tell the customer they never have any problems. If I had been buying some crazy 22" wheels and they bent, I would have understood, but 17" wheels are just not very big these days and should hold up. They are still sitting in my basement. $1000 of wheels and tires wasted.

tltypek

I'm getting ready to give up on my SSRs and fork out the cash for some Subaru wheels (the only ones I can find now that fit over my Brembos and in the narrow wheel well of my Acura TL). I won't be buying wheels from Tire Rack ever again.

I do have a good friend who is a mechanical engineer - wonder if he can refer me to a local facility to test the wheels. SSR literally will not answer emails, and phone calls only go straight back to Tire Rack. I even tried calling Japan!! Can't say I'm impressed with this defensive customer service.

paisan

The Subaru wheels may not be any better. I have bent several rims on my Subaru. 16" OEM 2.5RS wheels when I hit a few potholes in NYC and once when I hit a concrete slab that they lay down where bus stops are. They had torn up the asphalt and not the concrete so I hit about a 1"-2" slab of concrete and put a nice dent in my rims.

Non-OEMs are generally less sturdy than ones that come original on cars, that's why I usually stick to OEM rims on my cars.

-mike

burdawg

OEM's also meet a lot tighter run out spec. Aftermarket wheels, especially wide diameter ones, can have 5x the runout and be considered OK.

tltypek

Yeah, my VR4 still has stock wheels at $850 a pop, no problems with those. This was my first street-tuning effort, as I couldn't afford the car I wanted, so I turned a lesser car into a close facsimile for the bargain price of $13,000 over invoice.. I took delivery of my TL with a substantial amount of re-tuning by Comptech. The 12.8 inch brakes required aftermarket wheels (stock 17 inch, just a spoke design that could clear the massive calipers)..... I do a lot of aggressive mountain backroad driving (paved roads).

paisan

hmm, aggressive + on-road driving is a recipie for disaster. I encourage you to save it for an HPDE or Auto-x. Far far safer for both you and the general public.

-mike

tltypek

These are private roads on acreage owned by people I know.

paisan

Cool, private roads are great, have at it!

-mike

tangofoxtrot

Something is definitely wrong here. I have been driving for 37 years here in New York City and New Jersey. I have driven on some roads that are worse than Berlin in the 1940's. I have only dented one rim in my life that was when I hit a huge pothole in my M3 going about 80 miles an hour. The rim bent and the tire exploded. I cannot picture having so many problems with wheels on a regular commuting basis.

paisan

I think a lot of it has to do with the lower profile tires folks are running these days. The OEM rims I bent driving in NYC were wearing 215-45-16 tires with a slender sidewall on them. Often times cars now are running 18" wheels with 45 or 40 series tires and a small sidewall, as well as stiffer sidewalls than in the past with run-flats etc. All this contributes to rim-abuse/damage IMO.

-mike

zamboknee

....my engine shut off. I was pushing through a few standing waters (about 6-8 inches deep after heavy rains) in my Toyota 4Runner and on the last one, my engine just shut off. The electrical system works fine it's just that the engine won't turn at all. Some info: the air filter was soaking wet, starter won't engage.
Any ideas what I screwed up here? Is my engine toast? Should I let it sit for a couple days (tow driver recommended that)? Is there a minor repair I can do on my own? I had 4 years of Automotive Repair training in high school so I know which way is up on a wrench.
ugh. but thanks

kiawah

Figure out whether the problem is electrical, or mechanical.

Water doesn't compress, so if you sucked water into your cylinders, the engine will be locked and nothing will be able to turn the engine over. Pull out the spark plugs, and see what comes out (water, you are in trouble). Carefully stick a narrow air nozzle into the spark plug hole into the cylinder, and see what blows out when you open up the air to it. Check the oil dipstick, see if the level is higher than normal. Oil floats on water, so if water got into your crankcase, your oil level would be high. You could also try draining the oil to see what comes out.

Water in the cylinder yields broken connecting rods, and crankshafts.....in addition to the obvious rust ruining the bearings problem.

If the engine checks out mechanically, then get a volt meter on the base electricals. Check that you have +13 volts on the main power feed to the starter. Check to see if you have +13 volts on the fuse buss. Check then to see when you turn the key in the ignition, whether you have +volt feed to the starter solenoid.

Good luck.