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Comments
I'm still hearing justificiation of a higher price for a car because, well, just because...
If a car costs more to insure it's most likely that it has a higher risk to the insurance company for theft, accident, and other kinds of damage.
That price has NOTHING to do with a car's being better than another car or worse than another car.
If someone wants to justify their likes for a car and being gouged by dealers in this area (your area may be different) then that's okay with me. I just don't want to hear forever that somehow that makes the car better than another car. I expect others to respect my choice of vehicles.
>(immobilizer system),
Other cars have theft deterrent systems that keep the engine from running also. Honda isn't unique in any way.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Buy the car YOU want, and I will buy the car I want. We should both be happy then, right?
There is a thing called $$.
I know, that when I look a new lease. I will look at what I want. Slow down and research, I am really focusing on a fun and fast engine.
But, for the same payment I paid on my 06 Accord SE lease, I have loaded GM car that has all the features, except for a V6. Features, that can be found on a $30k Passat I looked at. Perhaps a few more features. So that is good! Remote start comes in handy in the winter.
>Then simple logic says it will also cost more to insure
But that's still not complete. The insurance cost represents the probability of loss to the insurance company. Factors such as the driver's age, driving record individually and for a group, color of car, equipment on the car, and cost to repair are examples of factors in the actuarial prediction for insurance costs. I.E., if Civic coupes are owned by people who are more interested in racing from stoplights, driving at speeds far above the limit, driving carelessly, and the repair costs for damage from relatively minor hits are high then the cost of ownership for the vehicle will be higher than someone owning another brand of car quite capable of going from A to B but the mind set of the owners of the second brand doesn't lean toward the race car mentality.
A higher insurance cost on an equivalent car doesn't mean it's worth more.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I thought we were talking about why the Accord would cost more to insure than the Malibu. I assumed we were talking about the same driver, same driving record, same color, same equipment, etc. :confuse:
I think if you bought a Malibu that cost $23k or an Accord that cost $23k the insurance cost would be the same, because the value would be the same.
1987 Chevy Beretta has 136,000 miles and some rust. The brakes felt damp (small line where it seeps out a connector) - flange ends of brake lines. Asking $750. New battery, air filter, manifold.
If they were closer in age, well it would be a toss up.
Most people I know with Camry and Honda don't have problems until after 100k miles. have never purchased Japneese since I want to support America.
After owning my 2001 Malibu I can no longer afford to buy GM.
List of problems as follows(have prof from dealer)
Intake Manifold leaked and replaced 34k
Transmision Rebuilt at 38K
BCM body control module failed 3 times in 2 years(left me stranded each time)
Ignition cylinder replaced 3 times( anti theft system failure)
AC pully failure( GM makes a modular AC unit ,can't replace pully must replace whole compressor 46K
I purchased and extra warranty which expired one month after the ac was replaced.
Now I have problems with lights cutting off and on, my be BCM again.
If I do buy American it will be Ford not GM.
There are a lot of good cars out there, both domestic and imports. But, if you do choose an "American" brand, make sure it really is "American" - make sure it was built in the USA with mostly North American parts. I know that rules out many so-called "American" cars.
Lehrer
Now, lets say they make a very good product, holds up well, but for me, will its value be worth anything in a year? That alone is reason enough not to get the car. A car is the second largest investment, other than a house. So why would I put that much into a car that is worth so much less in a year. Why should I eat their negative value?
At this time, GM's car are not priced according to their true value.
But, I will say my 08 Pontiac G6, with 25,000 miles has been a quiet, 95% rattle free ride. My 06 Accord, had plenty of rattles, and was more noisy than the G6.
However, I hate the engine in the G6, miss the Accord engine! Swap them out, and I would be okay. The G6 is pretty solid, and actually impressed.
I had a USED Chevy HHR...within 14k I had the steering column replaced, the headliner taken out for a leak, the shifter replaced, rotors, ALL TSBs!! Pulled doen the hatch and the plastic cup came off in my hand. Pulled up a door lock and it came off..(apparently they are pressed on and not threaded anymore)
Paid $12.5 for an 11 month old car with a sticker of $24K at a new car lot. (The original owner took a royal beating) I was getting $7500 trade offers LOL...
Now those who say GM is suddenly great and reliable I say it takes years to design a car. Anything sold today was designed before the Fall when cutting corners was routine. I would look at GM again 4 years from now when TODAY'S NEW GM is designing cars being built tomorrow...
I drove the Chevy Malibu,,,yeah it had more toys but I had no confidence in the car at all. I know this. My Honda will have issues..Hell the new BMW 335 has fuel pump issues that cannot be resolved. But I am confident after researching both cars the Honda will have less of those pesky fit and finish issues. The Accord is worth $3000 more then a Malibu all day long,,,and in 6 years that money will be returned. I bought a Honda Care Wrap 84/80K EW for $655...The price of EWS are lower for a reason... $650 0 deductible for 84 months? HONDA BACKEDWARRANTY? All day long...Yeah I bought it online but the Honda Dealer I bought it from (Saccucci Honda) could actually sell it for that price!!
100K Drive train warranties are a joke. Thats not what goes wrong in cars. Most of the time it's $300 crap over and over again. Hyundai used the long warranty to sell cars so Chevy is trying it. But like Hyundai Chevy will need years to overcome their perception and what they are doing NOW to design, choose vendors, to build cars 3 years from now will make all the difference.
Its not all about the assembly line getting better. Its about designing a reliable car made from reliable parts first...then assembled well. the NEW GM is only months old. We shall see what they put out in a few years,,, Tha will make all the difference. Honda and Toyota know this. They also know todays GM cares are made out the past's bad habits...
Not scientific but considering Honda customers have far higher expectations I would have expected more "problem threads" and a lot more posts.......
I used the Coupe threads because that's the car I bought and far less clutter. The car is basically the same.
How do we even know that GM is even "new"?
Just one car? Click at the link below if you think its just one car. Looks like the 09 Accord is having the same issue as my 08. Remember this is only 1 web site that you have to become a member just to post your complaint so you can only wonder how many people are really having issue's
http://www.carcomplaints.com/recent_trends.shtml
Even though I cringe at those Chevy commercials, I would say it's for the same reason Hyundai mentions them in their commercials. They know that they have a major perception problem about the differences in the brands, and they are trying to get people to notice their newer products.
What is going to convince the consumer that they are truly new? Notice, more SUV"s? Yep! If you didn't know, the new Malibu shares alot with the old G6.
The Malibu is just a Pontiac.
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Keep in mind that was a rental.
GM is on par as far as I'm concerned. I have had my 08 Malibu for over a year and not one rattle or issue. My friend has an Accord and every time he sits in my car he comments on how much he likes it. I always tell him, buy one!
Also, I honestly don't think 08 G6 would last that long without some major repairs. I know that my transmission will need replaced sooner or later down the road. I won't have to worry about it, but someone will! Way sooner than expected! I am thinking sometime under 100k. I have 25k and its already showing signs, and has been since new!
I would wonder wonder about newer GM cars lasting as long. But that's just me.
Sure its a Pontiac, but really no different than any other recent GM product. Such as the Malibu.
The Malibu is just a Pontiac. "
First, there are no new "SUV's". They are a trio of "CUV's". Now this may sound like splitting hairs, but there is a HUGE difference in a new Equinox getting 32 mpg vs. a new Tahoe getting 20mpg.
I do know that GM is using older platforms. But they are global platforms that have gotten good reviews elsewhere, replacing even OLDER NA platforms. IIRC, the G6 is an Epsillon 2 platform, while the Malibu is Epsillon 1. Similar?? Yes. But if you look at the reviews, the G6 was always "eh.....mezza mezza" while the Aura and Malibu are actually looked at as decent, if not better than most in their class. BOTH cars have scored better than the Camry in tests, but not the Accord ( which is regarded by everyone as the standard bearer in the class).
The Difference? They are actually putting more money and thought into the design of the newer models, and it's showing.
All you need to look at is the trio of new CUV's. All are based on the Theta platform, which underpinned the former Equinox and Torrent. When I read this, I cringed, as the reviews on the formers vehicles were nothing short of horrendous. Now, all of a sudden, they are leaps and bounds better. Even Caddy has put the SRX on this platform.
How is this possible? Direct Injected 4 bangers in the Equinox and Terrain. DI, DOHC V-6's as options, and standard in the Caddy, as opposed to old pushrod sixes. Better suspension components. Better materials for the interior. Better attention to fit and finish.
What engine do you have in it? the 3.5 or 3.6??? Is it a 4 or 6 speed auto??
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Well, there is rough use abuse and then there is abusive abuse. People do some pretty harsh things to rentals.
That said, I had an 09 Altima rental in Vegas with 500 miles on it and it has rattles and loose trim already.
Get the V6 if you go GM!! It'll be worth the upgrade.
I am not sure what is keeping their 4's from being truly peppy.
Why is it you see more people get the 6 in a GM car? Well, they make more 6's, probably making more 4's now, but you lose all the fun!!
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What were they driving, 1986 Cavaliers?
I have driven the 4 banger Accord and it feels like a 4... nothing else.
As for the Malibu, the vast majority of them on the road are I-4s. I rarely see another V6, one in 10 maybe.
"Can't ask for much more than this from a four-cylinder — plenty of pull for passing and merging, quiet at high engine speeds and very frugal. I rarely was left wishing for more power. Unless you absolutely have to have V6 power, the four-cylinder will satisfy 90 percent of the time." — Senior Road Test Editor Ed Hellwig
"I settled into the cockpit fully expecting the vehicle to feel a bit light on juice in certain situations. But this was never the case. I put the car through its paces on highways, on city streets and up and down steep mountain roads in the foothills near my apartment. The Accord proved itself up to the task in each and every circumstance that came its way." — Associate Editor Warren Clarke
"The Accord is the first car I've driven in some time that has made me seriously reconsider my affection for bigger engines. The power is there, and the refinement is there — there isn't even a hint of that frenetic thrashing I used to associate with inline fours. If I can have good fuel economy without giving up quietness and power, count me in." — Road Test Editor Brian Moody
-Edmunds' Editors opinions of the 2003 160 horse Accord.
Consider that the Accord bvdj84 speaks of had an additional 10 horses (after the SAE revised numbers the actual increase equated to approximately ten even though the technical specs increased by 6 for that year). I have an 06 4-cylinder as well. When passing at 75 MPH on the highway, you know its a four cylinder, with a quick-acting transmission and sporty throtle response, I can see where people would feel like the engine was bigger than it really is.
When I would go to pass someone with my 08 Accord 4 banger I would push on the gas and it would hesitate then if I got to aggressive it would jump from the lethargic state to almost red line. That used to drive me nuts. I did find out that there is a TSB for the valve ping control that causes those symptoms.