"This post is not meant to be insulting, but the "Trail Rated" tag is overrated. I don't have the confidence to put my stock Jeep up against much of anything else in its class."
I don't care personally; I don't own or plan to own a Jeep product. But have you taken your jeep off road into serious trail conditions? If you are using it for around town driving, you are not going to be impressed. They are really designed for off road; the in town trade off in less MPG & etc must be looked at as the price one pays for better off road performance. If that "trade off" isn't good for you, then you are not a "Jeep" person.
I have taken my Jeep off road. I live in a very rural area in northwestern PA and some of the roads in the winter are trail like conditions. I've taken it on gas well roads and other places and can't complain but I wouldn't imagine going anywhere that they show on the Jeep ads on tv. I guess my point is that I wish Jeep would focus more on the total driving experience rather than just the off road portion. Sure, there probably are a lot of people that take their Jeep off road, but a majority of the driving is done on the highway. Why not make it the best of both worlds? I'm sure they can find ways to lighten it up so the mpg continuously stays above 20 but still provide a suitable off road vehicle. I would hope "Jeep people" would want a good off road vehicle yet still not have to pay the gas bill of a V-10. I consider my self a Jeep person, but when gas is $3.49/gallon, my first priority is to be an educated consumer and make my money go as far as I can.
" I would hope "Jeep people" would want a good off road vehicle yet still not have to pay the gas bill of a V-10."
No disrespect intended, but you don't sound like a "Jeep person". A Jeep person wants his/her off road capabilities to be paramount.
It is possible to make compromises in off road abilities, but that is not what Jeep is known for. The only non "rated" Jeep is the Compass; I drove one and got about 23 MPH highway (rental). That vehicle was a crossover from the Caliber.
If you want a "part way" off road, there are plenty of candidates - they generally have part time AWD, though some of them lock the low gear. CR-V, RAV4, Grand Vitara, etc. come to mind. And of course there is the Subaru family, which has great 4WD.
In order to make the Jeep sturdy and thoroughly off road capable, they have to make parts a certain way, build stuff a certain way. That "way" is not for fuel efficiency.
I bought a used 2003 Liberty in August 2006 with about 40k miles on it. I now have 128k miles on it (I drive a lot) and overall, I have seen around 17 to 19 mpg. I just put a large Thule cargo box on the roof (to make up for what has long been my biggest gripe with the Liberty: insufficient cargo space) and was worried somewhat that it might adversely impact my fuel economy. After three tanks, I have calculated the average MPG with the box, loaded with gear at 18.47mpg. I was actually surprised it was that good. I guess this is a testament to the aerodynamics of the cargo box, more than anything to do with the Liberty, but I thought it might be good information to post...in case anyone else is as frustrated with the cargo area of their Liberty as I was.
Btw, I was also carrying two mtn bikes on a spare tire mounted rack, as well as a good load of gear inside the Jeep.This fuel economy is very comparable to what I have been getting the last two years or so.
Interestingly, before I bought the Liberty, I was given another liberty (a 2005) as a rental, and it must have had a larger tank, and gotten better mileage. I think when i tested it, I was getting over 20 mpg, and going over 400 miles on a tank of gas. With mine, I only occasionally manage to get much over 300 miles before my fuel light switches on. I have noticed that the 2005 felt lighter and not as solid as the 2003 I ended up getting, so maybe there is a weight factor there.
only have 26k miles on my 03. No problems -- put on a set of bilstein shocks - great ride improvement. If you 've gone 128k miles and still happy, looks like I have 25 more years of happy motoring. Mpg is low 20's on the interstate 65 mph. Short trips around town -- 15-17mpg. A little worse in winter of course.
The Hyundai Santa Fe is not only not "Trail Rated", it is not designed to BETAKEN OFF THE ROAD AT ALL! My best friend does support for Hyundi and he tells me if you even take a Santa Fe on a gravel road you will void the warranty! It is not an off road vehicle it is a cross-over, or in other words, a CAR with a weak all wheel drive system. If you are making comaprisons or have a need for a high milage cross-over then the Jeep Compass would be what your interested in. It is also the only FAIR comparison. I have a 2003 TJ (Wrangler) and a 1988 MJ (Comanche) I get around 20 MPG out of each around town. My friend has the liberty and he gets alot less milege. I haven't figured out why. I think it may be that the L6 engine has alot of low-end torque so I can shift it at low rpm and get good milage. I bought my first Jeep because 4 wheelers were scarce in Florida but I bought the Wrangler because the truck really lasted well. It outlasted by many years my Dads S-10 (4x2) and brothers Ranger (4x4). which were both JUNK.
Well said! I have two Jeeps (TJ & MJ)/ I bought my first jeep because my mustang just didn't do well on the trail to Blue Lake! Many people buy things based on 'immage' rather than function. What you need to look at is the Liberty has the same drive-train (except Ibdependent axels) as the Wrangler. It is an SUV not a corss-over. It gets good milage in it's class dooing what it was made to do. Stick her in low-lock 4wd and it will do ok. It least it is not like a hummer which can't even carry enough gas for a off-road trip!
"area in northwestern PA and some of the roads in the winter are trail like conditions"... Sorry but you have no idea do you. I live in Utah and have more trails than paved roads. I have access to off road trails one mile from home. It is interesting but Hyundi has their suppport people here and recently bought a cherokee to plow their lot because the Hyundi is "too weak". You get what you pay for don't compair a car to a truck. The Liberty I rented and drove in a snow storm from New Hampshire to Conneticut was alot better than the Trail Blazer I rented and drove over Donner Pass when they closed the road to all but 4x4's or chains. The knob came off in my hand and ended driving over in 2wd! It was kinda stupid because there was only AN INCH OR TWO on the road! I remember driving my Comanche in a storm in Conneticut when I was in the Navy when the snow was up to the bumper. I was doing fine and then then I noticed the road markers on the wrong side! I wasn't even on the freeway (I95) Oh, on the Santa Fe, read your owners manual it will say not to allow the tires to spin in snow...this is because it will damage the cable that powers the back wheels! :P
I have a 2003 Liberty Renegade with over 212K on it with the Thule rack - I drive mostly backroads & a little freeway - get about 278 per 15 gal = 18.54 mpg on average don't know if the rack is making a difference or not but from your numbers I would say it does?.....
Comments
I don't care personally; I don't own or plan to own a Jeep product. But have you taken your jeep off road into serious trail conditions? If you are using it for around town driving, you are not going to be impressed. They are really designed for off road; the in town trade off in less MPG & etc must be looked at as the price one pays for better off road performance. If that "trade off" isn't good for you, then you are not a "Jeep" person.
No disrespect intended, but you don't sound like a "Jeep person". A Jeep person wants his/her off road capabilities to be paramount.
It is possible to make compromises in off road abilities, but that is not what Jeep is known for. The only non "rated" Jeep is the Compass; I drove one and got about 23 MPH highway (rental). That vehicle was a crossover from the Caliber.
If you want a "part way" off road, there are plenty of candidates - they generally have part time AWD, though some of them lock the low gear. CR-V, RAV4, Grand Vitara, etc. come to mind. And of course there is the Subaru family, which has great 4WD.
In order to make the Jeep sturdy and thoroughly off road capable, they have to make parts a certain way, build stuff a certain way. That "way" is not for fuel efficiency.
I bought a used 2003 Liberty in August 2006 with about 40k miles on it. I now have 128k miles on it (I drive a lot) and overall, I have seen around 17 to 19 mpg. I just put a large Thule cargo box on the roof (to make up for what has long been my biggest gripe with the Liberty: insufficient cargo space) and was worried somewhat that it might adversely impact my fuel economy. After three tanks, I have calculated the average MPG with the box, loaded with gear at 18.47mpg. I was actually surprised it was that good. I guess this is a testament to the aerodynamics of the cargo box, more than anything to do with the Liberty, but I thought it might be good information to post...in case anyone else is as frustrated with the cargo area of their Liberty as I was.
Btw, I was also carrying two mtn bikes on a spare tire mounted rack, as well as a good load of gear inside the Jeep.This fuel economy is very comparable to what I have been getting the last two years or so.
Interestingly, before I bought the Liberty, I was given another liberty (a 2005) as a rental, and it must have had a larger tank, and gotten better mileage. I think when i tested it, I was getting over 20 mpg, and going over 400 miles on a tank of gas. With mine, I only occasionally manage to get much over 300 miles before my fuel light switches on. I have noticed that the 2005 felt lighter and not as solid as the 2003 I ended up getting, so maybe there is a weight factor there.
I have now filled up 6 times. here are my mpg's
20.80
19.57
20.88
20.22
20.22
21.57 (about 90% highway)
The engine is unmodified. I do plan to switch to synthetic oil and a new air filter when the next changes are due.
I would say most driving is about a 70%/30% split highway/city but I mostly drive 75-80 MPH on the highway.
I have a 2003 TJ (Wrangler) and a 1988 MJ (Comanche) I get around 20 MPG out of each around town. My friend has the liberty and he gets alot less milege. I haven't figured out why. I think it may be that the L6 engine has alot of low-end torque so I can shift it at low rpm and get good milage.
I bought my first Jeep because 4 wheelers were scarce in Florida but I bought the Wrangler because the truck really lasted well. It outlasted by many years my Dads S-10 (4x2) and brothers Ranger (4x4). which were both JUNK.
It is interesting but Hyundi has their suppport people here and recently bought a cherokee to plow their lot because the Hyundi is "too weak".
You get what you pay for don't compair a car to a truck. The Liberty I rented and drove in a snow storm from New Hampshire to Conneticut was alot better than the Trail Blazer I rented and drove over Donner Pass when they closed the road to all but 4x4's or chains. The knob came off in my hand and ended driving over in 2wd! It was kinda stupid because there was only AN INCH OR TWO on the road!
I remember driving my Comanche in a storm in Conneticut when I was in the Navy when the snow was up to the bumper. I was doing fine and then then I noticed the road markers on the wrong side! I wasn't even on the freeway (I95) Oh, on the Santa Fe, read your owners manual it will say not to allow the tires to spin in snow...this is because it will damage the cable that powers the back wheels! :P