Well in California the Fit is marked up an average of $2000.00 You are correct sticker price on a Fit is about $1000 less. But most dealers are greedy.
The Corolla has horrible crash test ratings? On what do you base that statement? Check out the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration's crash tests and you will see that it is the xB which has horrible crash test ratings and not the Corolla. (The 2008 xB has yet to be tested).
that may be in california...but i still doubt its that much.
There is no more markup on fits in nc. Every dealer has 2 or 3 sitting on the lots. You still get the occasional 'this car has been detailed with 1st place finish so that ads 799 to msrp' kind of crap, but its easy to let the dealer now you are not there to bullcrap.
I have about 1k on my xb. Mixed driving is consistantly above 25mpg. On the road at 75 plus, I am now getting 32.3. Now for all of you who are making comments without owning one this is one of the nicest cars I have owned. Smooth riding, quiet. great pickup and passing power. What more could you want for 18k?
Maybe Horrible was too strong of a word. Both the previous generation XB and the current generation Corolla performed poorly on the side impact crash test. The only time the Corolla performed fairly was when the side airbag equipped cars were tested. Good luck finding a Corolla with side airbags. By the time you find a Corolla with side airbags it will be optioned out and will cost more than my new XB cost.
I am also getting 25-26mpg in my 08 XB. My XB is a stick shift. I tend to drive with a heavy foot and rarely go on the freeway. My XB usually is driven in town about 90% of the time.
I was just at 2 different dealers looking at the Honda Fit. Both dealers had about 5 or more New Fits and a couple of low mileage ones. Both dealers wanted $17000 for a base model and $19000 for the sport. The dealer even had a fit with leather, aftermarket sunroof and chrome factory alloys they wanted $25000 for this car. For that kind of money I could buy an Accord LX-V6 The dealers are acting like these cars are the only ones on the planet. They say it is supply and demand. Well poor supply does not equal a $2000 mark for me. Look how well the Yaris is selling.
yeah, the yaris sells well, but toyota make A LOT more of them available.
I'm sorry about your dealer situation; that markup is out of control. I've seen fits for 17k, but they were sport autos with 16 inch wheels, and some interior appointments, so i understood why.
actually, you probably couldn't get an accord v-6 for that price...not if that dealer marks up car the way they do!
They both look like dork machines anyway, and the Fit is no faster than a Yaris, and Americans don't give extra points for handling, so it comes down to basics, fuel, price, passenger space.
Well you cannot go wrong buying a Fit or a Yaris. I am perfectly happy with my 08 XB. It may not get the same mileage as a Fit or a Yaris but, I am very happy anyways. I cannot think of a vehicle that offers the same amount of room versatility or power all while delivering 25mpg in mostly city driving. The XB is the 1st car that I have ever owned where I did not regret buying it. It is also nice to know that you cannot buy a better car for the money.
and yet, there are people raving about the fit, whereas the yaris is nothing to write home about. If you can get a great handling car for the same price or sliglty more, why not?
i can see that toyota's philosophys are trickling down to their employees; because they to don't belive in amerians who enjoy or give extra points for handling, because they offer nothing along those lines in any of their cars.
I am contemplating getting a 2008 xB. I have a low mileage 2004 xB which I like, but have read a couple of reviews that specifically referenced the "side bolsters" on the '04 seats that aren't present on the '08. It was said that the support for your thighs and legs was poor in comparison to the original xB seats.
Has anyone with an '08 who has taken it on a long drive AND has driven an '04 or '05 with the original seats noticed any fatigue or discomfort in comparison? Just curious. Keep or buy a new one?
Has anyone had any experience using the new Nav system Scion is now offering as an accessory? Apparently it couples with the standard Pioneer radio (not the premium) offering. Is it any good? Any comparisons to the Toyota Camry/Sienna or GM versions been yet made?
Also what about the Scion security system accessory. Any good? Worth getting? Any comments appreciated.
I have driven a 2006 xB and found the seats somewhat uncomfortable, but I love the 208 seats. Then again, I am a man of considerable...width, so a more bony butt may find the 2006 seats a better home. It is so subjective, I would just recommend going to the dealer and trying it out.
The nav system does not work off of the base system, it is a completely seperate head unit. It is basically an Alpine nav unit that is Scion branded and has the connections to work with all of the stock controls and inputs.
The Scion security system is a fairly basic unit that ties into the factory harness. It is expensive considering it's lack of features, but will be more reliable and much easier to install than an aftermarket alarm.
Hello everyone and I hope that you are having a great day.
In Central Florida the dealers have added an approximately $600.00 dealer fee for the Scions. My impression is the fee is simply additional dealer profit.
Does anyone have any more insight into this fee? What is the best negotiating tactic in your opinion?
has tanked, IMO. The print review and the online review of the xB seem to be polar opposites. I'm not renewing my subscription, I've given the new format over 6 issues and still find it illegible, blending in with paid-for-advertisements, and the specs pages are awful. Too bad, I used to love that 'zine..
On balance, it seemed a positive review, at least for what I'm looking for. As a car that will also be used by my soon-to-be 16 year old son, all of the changes were necessary, particularly the safety equipment and added power (to make it work in Dallas traffic and, eventually, carting off everything to college).
Too true - they seem to think I buy it to see how well they can add up scores on their comparisons. I (used to) buy it because I respected their opinions, not their stopwatches. Not any more.
I think it is a good deal for $17K for what you get since most other cars for this price have fewer features.
However, I will still pass on it because I didn't like the driving position and many other attributes of the xB.
Seats too low and dash too high bathtub position, giant rear blind spots. Armrest is a joke. You have to try to balance your arm on the very narrow fold down armrest. Factory radios look aftermarket, not integrated into the design of the dash and will attract theft. "I just bought this stereo from Best Buy. Please steal it and install in your 89 Camaro." Gas mileage disappointing. 4-speed automatic disappointing on a car that is a new design.
The only serious problem we have had with our one Month old 08 XB is with the OEM Bridgestone EL400-02 tires. At 1300 miles the right rear tire sidewall failed suddenly with a perfectly straight separation from the edge of the tread to the rim. The mgr of the Bridgestone company store would not replace it under the warranty and in fact told me that EL400-02 was a cheap OEM tire and he could not even get it. Customers of Tire rack that own this tire have reported it in reviews as poor in wear and driveability. Bridgestone customer service is nonexistant as they have not answered my emails and I can not find listed an 800 number as other tire manufacturers have. I would advise new owners of the 08 XB that have these tires to immediately exchange them for the Serenity or another make quality tire.
Ive jumped through all the Bridgestone warranty hoops. Did I mention that the directional stability is also poor on these junk tires. Manufacturers, especially Toyota/Scion should not install on a new car such a lousy oem tire. Im going to take these tires off, throw them away and order Kumho KH-16 to replace them. If I sound disgusted I am!
As the latest Camry wagon-[non-permissible content removed]-crossover, the xB works pretty well and is a good value. Sort of a strippo Camry CE wagon.
But in that case it should have the Toyota badge. As a Scion, the new xB is very ordinary and conventional. Autoweek had an unflattering review with which I agree on most points. They took an avant garde JDM Toyota and evolved it into a porky, gas-thirsty car whose styling causes it to disappear in the crowd of crossovers out there. :-(
As such, it should have a Toyota badge. Leave the Scion name for interesting and different cars.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
I think the poutside is aggressive and unique, without trying to be trend or quirky.
And a stiff wind would've blown the '06 over. The '06 was cheap, but roomy. Like a draft of a future car.
If that is what Scion's mission is, than I don't want any part of it.
The xB and xD will be more substantial, safer, better driving cars. If that makes them too Toyota-like, so be it. Scions can be better without losing their style. I thiunk the xB did that. :confuse:
C&D said the car is light-years better, but gets off the Scion mission.
You can get a great Toyota vehicle, a great value, for $17k. And it looks cool. :shades:
Yeah, because it was definately only 20-30 year olds driving the old one [/sarcasm]. I see more old people driving xBs than young people, both for the old and new models.
Come on now. Thirsty? It gets roughly 11% less gas mileage. (for 2008 ratings, new car=22/28, old car = 26/30 (manual), using the combined mileage yields (1-(25/28))x100=10.7% less) In the 2007 ratings, it would have been 25/31...is that thirsty? In fact, I regularly beat that. I get about 26 around suburban streets (no faster than 40 mph, lots of stops and hills) and 32 on my commute which is an equal mix of suburban driving and 50 mph highway with some stoplights. I would probably get about 3 mpg more with the old xB, at most.
The new xB is hardly porky. Although it is 600 lbs heavier than the old one, it is still considerably lighter than a Caliber, a PT-Cruiser, or an HHR. In fact, it is only about 100 lbs heavier than a Mazda 3 wagon.
It bears no resemblence to a crossover either, at least no more than the old xB. It is shorter (height) than the old one, is closer to the ground, all while being wider and longer. You make it sound like it offers AWD and an offroad package.
I do agree, it is not as funky or different as the orignial, but to many of us, that is a good thing. I like and almost bought an old xB, but the over-the-top styling, lack of cruise control, and 4000+ RPM on the highway (manual) scared me off.
I finally managed to get the xB from my wife for a highway trip. She really loves it and now I agree.
This vehicle is the Silver metallic model. We added leather interior, sport steering wheel, Scion Navigation and XM radio and 16" Corolla 5 spoke alloy wheels (Scion emblem). I had low profile tires on previous vehicle and they were constant problems plus rougher ride.
The vehicle handles better than most I have owned in a long time. That includes Accura MDX, Accura 3.5RL and 06 VW Jetta TDI (Which I traded in on the xB at $1500 difference. VW service HORRIBLE and excessive long wait for parts.
I averaged 27.6MPG @75MPH and lots of hills, passing and jackrabbit starts. We get 24 MPG city driving. At age of 70, this vehicle is delightful for entering and exiting. Seats are comfortable and visibility is excellent.
My complaints are:
No daylight running lights
Clock and outside temperature are hidden in display menu and not visible at all times
4 speed automatic instead of 5 speed. Downshifting on grades is annoying RPM change. RPM at 70 is approx 3000 and downshift goes over 4000.
Daylight running light problem is soon to be cured with Fog lamp accessory and a little electronic knowledge. I will add two $.99 cent diodes in the wiring and ignition will turn on lights automatically. The fog lamps are like driving lamps and they cosmetically enhance the bottom grill at each side. I will do the installation as my dealer has never done one. The installation requires good mechanical knowledge and braveness due to cutting the grill. The instructions are great. I sent the modification to Scion Headquarters site.
I suggest buying one of these. It is a head turning vehicle especially the way we have this one "dolled" up.
:shades: My leather upgrade ran $1495 and was done in one day by local people in San Antonio thru the dealer. The leather is charcoal with ash (gray like) inserts with ash stitching. The colors exactly match the xB headliner and xB side panels. The side panels have the Ash color also which set off the Charcoal interior. The sport steering wheel reflects the same two colors. The leather makes the seats very comfortable.
The upgrade was excellent. You can contact Toyota dealer in Boerne, Tx for name of installer. He orders the kits from another source and just installs them.
I have had at least 6 different GPS Navs in my automobiles and this new Scion xB navigator is one of the best I have ever used. You can pick a trip and have it play the trip back to you through the whole route. NEAT. The sound system is great with 160W audio. Screen displays give you all kinds of equalizer settings, sound surround settings and much more. I have XM activated on mine and what a unit. If you get the radio alone you pay $1495 and the Nav radio unit is $1995. This unit has a huge screen. You can play DVD's on the screen while you are parked and have parking brake on. There is not much this unit does not have. Too many features to mention.
Be prepared to pack a lunch and a 6 pack of drinks and sit in the vehicle with the instruction manual. It is thick and full of pictures and procedures. Don't get frustrated.
The VW TDI Jetta Nav system was over $2000 and did not have anything to compare to this one. That is why I chose Magellan plug and play unit for it instead of factory.
Here's a bit of feedback I can provide after owning my 2008 xB (automatic) for 2 months.
Fuel economy: Avg is 27.5 mpg if you can trust the computer. When I was tracking it manually, I was getting about the same so I'm relying on the machine now.
Drive: pleasant, considering how inexpensive the vehicle is. Sure it gets buzzy when you pedal to the metal, but that is rare for me. I'm often ahead of everyone taking off from a traffic light and I'm barely touching the gas. I will say that some of the funniest wind noise I get is from the roof when its windy (and up here in Minneapolis it can get that way often.) Overall, I love my xB much more than my 2005 Mustang (ugh, I hated how that thing handled in traffic -- no more American makes for me!)
I did not put much in the way of options on the vehicle, as I'm not big on bling or dvds or nav systems (its called a map!) Still, I love my wagon meets SUV love child of a car.
Most leather seat kits are by Katzkins. I had my 2006 xB done for $1250 as part of a combo deal with a sunroof for another $1250. The installer was a firm that was a dealer for Webasto and Katzkins. The leather kit included front and rear seats, headrests and door panels, replacing all the original fabric. The fabric covering is slipped off the front seats and the Katzkin leather seat covers are slipped on. The leather has a padded backing, and the seams are pulled down into the cushions by tie down straps that penetrate through the cushions. The rear seats were more complicated as the fabric covering was bonded. To avoid pulling off chunks of foam, the cushions had to be "skinned" with a knife. http://s49.photobucket.com/albums/f280/vintagefortytwo/xB%20Leather%20Seats/
Comments
You are correct sticker price on a Fit is about $1000 less. But most dealers are greedy.
But the 5-speed can....
The January 2006 issue of Car & Driver did a "comparo" called "Rebellious Boxes":
http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=15&article_id=10524
The Scion xB article is at:
http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/10528/2006-scion-xb.html
In that article it says "it was last in acceleration to 60 mph, 0.1 second behind the Element..."
The Element article is at:
http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/10525/2006-honda-element-ex-p.html
And it says "The Element nips the Scion by 0.1 second in the sprint to 60 mph, arriving in 9.5 seconds."
So the Scion xB was tested at 0-60 in 9.6 seconds.
DrFill
~alpha
The manual should be about 1.6 seconds faster to 60, that is very significant.
DrFill
There is no more markup on fits in nc. Every dealer has 2 or 3 sitting on the lots. You still get the occasional 'this car has been detailed with 1st place finish so that ads 799 to msrp' kind of crap, but its easy to let the dealer now you are not there to bullcrap.
Now for all of you who are making comments without owning one this is one of the nicest cars I have owned. Smooth riding, quiet. great pickup and passing power. What more could you want for 18k?
Both the previous generation XB and the current generation Corolla performed poorly on the side impact crash test. The only time the Corolla performed fairly was when the side airbag equipped cars were tested. Good luck finding a Corolla with side airbags. By the time you find a Corolla with side airbags it will be optioned out and will cost more than my new XB cost.
My XB is a stick shift.
I tend to drive with a heavy foot and rarely go on the freeway. My XB usually is driven in town about 90% of the time.
Both dealers wanted $17000 for a base model and $19000 for the sport. The dealer even had a fit with leather, aftermarket sunroof and chrome factory alloys they wanted $25000 for this car. For that kind of money I could buy an Accord LX-V6
The dealers are acting like these cars are the only ones on the planet.
They say it is supply and demand. Well poor supply does not equal a $2000 mark for me.
Look how well the Yaris is selling.
I'm sorry about your dealer situation; that markup is out of control. I've seen fits for 17k, but they were sport autos with 16 inch wheels, and some interior appointments, so i understood why.
actually, you probably couldn't get an accord v-6 for that price...not if that dealer marks up car the way they do!
With higher fuel economy, a larger back seat, and a 2-door model, Yaris just hits the spot a little better that the Fit.
DrFill
and the backseat cushion isn't a rock.
having said that, i would love an uber cheap yaris 3 door as a newer alternative for an older car.
The Fit isn't some Sentra SE-R or something.
DrFill
I am perfectly happy with my 08 XB.
It may not get the same mileage as a Fit or a Yaris but, I am very happy anyways. I cannot think of a vehicle that offers the same amount of room versatility or power all while delivering 25mpg in mostly city driving.
The XB is the 1st car that I have ever owned where I did not regret buying it. It is also nice to know that you cannot buy a better car for the money.
i can see that toyota's philosophys are trickling down to their employees; because they to don't belive in amerians who enjoy or give extra points for handling, because they offer nothing along those lines in any of their cars.
Touche!
DrFill
Has anyone with an '08 who has taken it on a long drive AND has driven an '04 or '05 with the original seats noticed any fatigue or discomfort in comparison? Just curious. Keep or buy a new one?
Also what about the Scion security system accessory. Any good? Worth getting? Any comments appreciated.
I have driven a 2006 xB and found the seats somewhat uncomfortable, but I love the 208 seats. Then again, I am a man of considerable...width, so a more bony butt may find the 2006 seats a better home. It is so subjective, I would just recommend going to the dealer and trying it out.
The nav system does not work off of the base system, it is a completely seperate head unit. It is basically an Alpine nav unit that is Scion branded and has the connections to work with all of the stock controls and inputs.
The Scion security system is a fairly basic unit that ties into the factory harness. It is expensive considering it's lack of features, but will be more reliable and much easier to install than an aftermarket alarm.
In Central Florida the dealers have added an approximately $600.00 dealer fee for the Scions. My impression is the fee is simply additional dealer profit.
Does anyone have any more insight into this fee? What is the best negotiating tactic in your opinion?
With appreciation and kind regards.
They applaude the new power (0-60 in 7.8, top speed of 124), and the content, but want quirkier styling and more cubbie holes.
More or less, it is more Toyota than Scion, to their eyes, which isn't necessarily bad, but counter to the mission.
DrFill
But their stopwatch does come in handy. I figured a xB with a stick was 8 seconds.
The HHR lacks the features and style of the xB. :shades:
DrFill
However, I will still pass on it because I didn't like the driving position and many other attributes of the xB.
Seats too low and dash too high bathtub position, giant rear blind spots. Armrest is a joke. You have to try to balance your arm on the very narrow fold down armrest.
Factory radios look aftermarket, not integrated into the design of the dash and will attract theft. "I just bought this stereo from Best Buy. Please steal it and install in your 89 Camaro."
Gas mileage disappointing. 4-speed automatic disappointing on a car that is a new design.
But in that case it should have the Toyota badge. As a Scion, the new xB is very ordinary and conventional. Autoweek had an unflattering review with which I agree on most points. They took an avant garde JDM Toyota and evolved it into a porky, gas-thirsty car whose styling causes it to disappear in the crowd of crossovers out there. :-(
As such, it should have a Toyota badge. Leave the Scion name for interesting and different cars.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
And a stiff wind would've blown the '06 over. The '06 was cheap, but roomy. Like a draft of a future car.
If that is what Scion's mission is, than I don't want any part of it.
The xB and xD will be more substantial, safer, better driving cars. If that makes them too Toyota-like, so be it. Scions can be better without losing their style. I thiunk the xB did that. :confuse:
C&D said the car is light-years better, but gets off the Scion mission.
You can get a great Toyota vehicle, a great value, for $17k. And it looks cool. :shades:
DrFill
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
Come on now. Thirsty? It gets roughly 11% less gas mileage. (for 2008 ratings, new car=22/28, old car = 26/30 (manual), using the combined mileage yields (1-(25/28))x100=10.7% less) In the 2007 ratings, it would have been 25/31...is that thirsty? In fact, I regularly beat that. I get about 26 around suburban streets (no faster than 40 mph, lots of stops and hills) and 32 on my commute which is an equal mix of suburban driving and 50 mph highway with some stoplights. I would probably get about 3 mpg more with the old xB, at most.
The new xB is hardly porky. Although it is 600 lbs heavier than the old one, it is still considerably lighter than a Caliber, a PT-Cruiser, or an HHR. In fact, it is only about 100 lbs heavier than a Mazda 3 wagon.
It bears no resemblence to a crossover either, at least no more than the old xB. It is shorter (height) than the old one, is closer to the ground, all while being wider and longer. You make it sound like it offers AWD and an offroad package.
I do agree, it is not as funky or different as the orignial, but to many of us, that is a good thing. I like and almost bought an old xB, but the over-the-top styling, lack of cruise control, and 4000+ RPM on the highway (manual) scared me off.
This vehicle is the Silver metallic model. We added leather interior, sport steering wheel, Scion Navigation and XM radio and 16" Corolla 5 spoke alloy wheels (Scion emblem). I had low profile tires on previous vehicle and they were constant problems plus rougher ride.
The vehicle handles better than most I have owned in a long time. That includes Accura MDX, Accura 3.5RL and 06 VW Jetta TDI (Which I traded in on the xB at $1500 difference. VW service HORRIBLE and excessive long wait for parts.
I averaged 27.6MPG @75MPH and lots of hills, passing and jackrabbit starts. We get 24 MPG city driving. At age of 70, this vehicle is delightful for entering and exiting. Seats are comfortable and visibility is excellent.
My complaints are:
No daylight running lights
Clock and outside temperature are hidden in display menu and not visible at all times
4 speed automatic instead of 5 speed. Downshifting on grades is annoying RPM change. RPM at 70 is approx 3000 and downshift goes over 4000.
Daylight running light problem is soon to be cured with Fog lamp accessory and a little electronic knowledge. I will add two $.99 cent diodes in the wiring and ignition will turn on lights automatically. The fog lamps are like driving lamps and they cosmetically enhance the bottom grill at each side. I will do the installation as my dealer has never done one. The installation requires good mechanical knowledge and braveness due to cutting the grill. The instructions are great. I sent the modification to Scion Headquarters site.
I suggest buying one of these. It is a head turning vehicle especially the way we have this one "dolled" up.
Hopefully the 34 and under crowd is just as impressed.
I just fit in thur! :shades:
DrFill
The colors exactly match the xB headliner and xB side panels. The side panels have the Ash color also which set off the Charcoal interior. The sport steering wheel reflects the same two colors. The leather makes the seats very comfortable.
The upgrade was excellent. You can contact Toyota dealer in Boerne, Tx for name of installer. He orders the kits from another source and just installs them.
Be prepared to pack a lunch and a 6 pack of drinks and sit in the vehicle with the instruction manual. It is thick and full of pictures and procedures. Don't get frustrated.
The VW TDI Jetta Nav system was over $2000 and did not have anything to compare to this one. That is why I chose Magellan plug and play unit for it instead of factory.
Fuel economy: Avg is 27.5 mpg if you can trust the computer. When I was tracking it manually, I was getting about the same so I'm relying on the machine now.
Drive: pleasant, considering how inexpensive the vehicle is. Sure it gets buzzy when you pedal to the metal, but that is rare for me. I'm often ahead of everyone taking off from a traffic light and I'm barely touching the gas. I will say that some of the funniest wind noise I get is from the roof when its windy (and up here in Minneapolis it can get that way often.) Overall, I love my xB much more than my 2005 Mustang (ugh, I hated how that thing handled in traffic -- no more American makes for me!)
I did not put much in the way of options on the vehicle, as I'm not big on bling or dvds or nav systems (its called a map!) Still, I love my wagon meets SUV love child of a car.
http://s49.photobucket.com/albums/f280/vintagefortytwo/xB%20Leather%20Seats/