Subaru Forester (up to 2005)

wyoreb

thanks a bunch for your review of the '03.

when you said "not that much roomier", what specifically did you think about passenger room in the back seats? current generation is downright clausterphobic, is the '03 any better at all?

wrt cargo space, would agree that current model is fine, but back seat space is critical for my family with two tall kids to haul around. currently leaning towards the cr-v but would like to think that the '03 forester will get a second look...many other niceties about subaru.

varmint

I think Mr. Dunlop needs to check his spec sheet again. Isn't the Forester's 4 cyl a 2.5L engine (not a 2.4L)?

kens

Steve,

There's a typo in the article -- they mention the engine is 2.4L. Should be 2.5.

Ken

stever

Thanks Ken - I'll send a note over to the editorial folks. There's also a Feedback Form if anyone else sees something amiss.

Steve
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allhorizon

Juice: "D: 2004 Forester turbo, baby. Just wait."

How come I feel hypnotized? You missed your profession.

- D.

kate5000

I wonder why the call Forester expensive. I think it's a great value, for all the "goodies" packed in. And then there's always L model for those on tight budgets.

ateixeira

I sat in the 2003's front seat and adjusted it for comfort. The seat bottom angle adjustments are gone, replaced by a ratchet mechanism that lift the whole seat. It definitely gets a higher view point. The seat bottom angle stays the same. Lumbar support is still adjustable. The seat seemed better padded and has excellent side support.

There is so much travel in the seat now that I can barely reach the pedals when it's all the way back. For reference, I'm 6' even, 38" waist and 32" inseam, 233 lbs, and on a diet! ;-)

Then I went to the back seat and sat behind "myself". I could get comfy and wiggle my knees without touching the seat in front of me (Bob witnessed this magical act). With the current model I'm not sure two 6 footers could sit in the same row, so it is better, just not a lot better.

I might consider the new Legacy 2.5 GT if you have 2 teens on their high school hoops team. They had a wagon at the show that had a shiftronic auto tranny and VTD AWD (55% rear power bias, sweet!). It also gets leather seats with heat, a moonroof, and side air bags.

Edmunds has the demographics all wrong. Subie owners have 2 dogs or cats, are named Dave (or Mike), or if female have a "K" in their name, 25-40 age group, affluent with advanced degrees, and outdoor oriented, with many teachers among us, plus use Macs and wear LL Bean gear and Timberlands. Get it straight guys! ;-)

That test vehicle's $26.2k price is not even close to real-world prices. Fitzmall.com has Premiums for as little as $22.4k, and I don't think I've ever seen one exceed $24k, even with leather and automatic.

-juice

lark6

In terms of describing at least some of the demographic and the pros and cons of the Forester, this is a pretty accurate take. The author can't seem to decide whether it's basic transportation (think Kia Sephia, Hyundai Accent) or something a little more content-laden, however. Still, some observations:

1. "Not fun or nimble"? A relative term. Funny how other trade publications find it a better handler than its competition, especially as it is Impreza-based. The previous generation Impreza was lauded for its handling pretty much everywhere on the planet outside the US.

2. Article describes the 165-hp EJ25 as "relatively small" yet in the next paragraph notes that most competitors' base - or only - engines are smaller and down on horsepower. Clearly the target has moved, but to where? What does edmund's consider the mark now?

3. 215/60R16 tires now considered "small." Size is relative but the OEM tires are a compromise as we all know. I'm still looking for a fix for that, personally.

4. I know my reasons for buying the car, and these are the closest I've seen yet. Still the press and the general public seem a bit confused by the car. Because SoA chose Martina Navratilova and other female athletes as spokesperson, the assumpion is that it's a car for lesbians. SoA's association with the Rainbow Card affirms that in many people's view. Women also outnumber men in terms of ownership - something on the order of 2:1 IIRC? Yet most of the Forester owners I encounter on this board are men. Maybe that's a function of men being more outspoken online.

At any rate I see the Forester for what it is IMO: a tall wagon version of the old Impreza 2.5RS, with enough SUV-like styling cues to lure buyers who want that look without having to accept the compromises of what used to be considered "traditional," truck-based, body-on-frame SUVs.

Strange, I don't usually feel compelled to defend my purchase. Maybe because it's casual Friday and I wore my Birks (albeit the close-toed ones) to work today.

Ed

ateixeira

I guess you could say that the complaints Edmunds has applies to most of its competitors, too. It's actually the quietest in the class, and has the most powerful 4 cylinder engine (best among the few efficient models). Noone has 17" rims, not at this price level.

And I can assure you I'm not a lesbian. ;-)

-juice

peterson10

"Edmunds has the demographics all wrong. Subie owners have 2 dogs or cats, are
named Dave (or Mike), or if female have a "K" in their name, 25-40 age group,
affluent with advanced degrees, and outdoor oriented, with many teachers among
us, plus use Macs and wear LL Bean gear and Timberlands. Get it straight guys! ;-)"

This mid-40s Dave is sitting at a Dell, with a pair of Timberlands on his feet, thinking about all the flyfishing he's gonna do this weekend. Unfortunately, because I'm a teacher, my advanced degree hasn't made me very affluent. My neighbour has two dogs, and I hate 'em!

YetAnotherDave

lark6

juice - understood. Not gonna use the well-worn Seinfeld-ism - and you;ve met me so you know why I won't. ;-) If you've seen the Car Talk site at cars.com where the Magliozzi brothers lump it and the Outback into the gay/lesbian category you'll get my drift. Very mysogynist (sp?) of a pair of guys who broadcast on NPR.

As two men who own Foresters and, based on your current wrangling over the next purchase, two men who spend a lot of time considering what they buy, we came to our own set of conculsions. Many people buy their cars on more superficial grounds.

Ed

ateixeira

See, I told you! ;-)

I bet you used to use a Mac, at one point?

-juice (BS, MS, dog, Mac and Dell, training coordinator, Timberlands, LL Bean shirt)

mikeh19

Hi gang,
Car dings. Don't we all hate them. What's worse is if you have a serial denter (late '90s 2-door Cavalier) in the spot next to you in your apartment garage. It is to the point that I have a series of dings, 9-12 of them, all at the same height and length at different intervals along the rear passenger door. Just small grooves and white vertical lines, I don't see any chipped paint.
My '02 L was bought end of Dec 2001 and I first noticed the damage 3rd week of Jan. Now I've got another 2 dings on the passenger door. I've spoken to the Landlord and all he says he can do it talk to then and put up some tape on the facing wall marking their 'territory' since there is no line on the ground. This doesn't help since I just got 2 more dings.
I am 99.9% sure only because I have no visual proof: eye-witness or video, which I think in cases of vandalism makes or breaks a case.
What can I do? I'll take suggestions ranging from repair advice to how to prove 100% without a doubt my 'neighbour'is responsible. I will be away for 10 days end of next week and I feel that time is the perfect opportunity to prove this as the vehicle will be stationary in the garage all that time.
Trying so hard to be the better man.
Mike

goldencouple1

adidis, Salomon, Rockport, fake Berkies (from Walmart & have lasted for years); mountain bike (Gary Fisher), downhill skis, hiking, running, triathlon; hetero & mid-forties (but married to early thirties, first and only wife); B.A., J.D., LL.M (taxation); IBM (purchased at steep discount)running Windows 98, Microsoft Word, AOL; avid LL Bean utilizer; no dogs at this point, but wish to have two, and always had dogs before; non-Mike., non-Dave, but my brother is a Mike and I once had a cousin named Dave (deceased).

In the interest of full disclosure, however, my wifes cousin (male) claims to be a friend of Martina -- a fact we may scope-out this summer if we visit him. I bet she has a really tricked out Forester!

tidester

Because SoA chose Martina Navratilova and other female athletes as spokesperson, the assumpion is that it's a car for lesbians.

I think that would be a faulty assumption. Subaru is certainly more politically correct than that. I think it is reasonable to conclude they only wished to make an association with sports.

tidester
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lark6

that it's a faulty assumption. As you see I pointed to the Car Talk guys who, for reasons unknown to me, chose to bolster that assumption. Further, I have visited other Subaru-related message boards where less mature or well-informed people have drawn that conclusion. Why a man who drives a Subaru would not drive a WRX or 2.5RS is beyond some of these people.

Having said that, all I need to do is point you to the WRX forum where someone recently wrote:

"I can't believe I never considered Subaru to be a good car until the WRX came out. They need to advertise more on their merits rather than just having Crocodile Dundee talking. =oP"

There are still plenty of people who will buy a product based on its advertising campaign, including who is chosen to pitch that campaign. This person is at least correct in pointing out that prospective owners should get past the marketing spin and judge the product on its merits. In my opinion, not enough people in this country do that anymore.

Ed

tidester

They need to advertise more on their merits rather than just having Crocodile Dundee talking.

Now that's a reason and a half for me to rush out and buy a Subaru! Haven't we all had the fantasy of wrestling crocodiles!? ;-)

But then they may be onto something - I understand that Florida is undergoing an infestation of crocodiles!

tidester
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lark6

Based on your response, I believe you understood my point - not that I was attempting to stereotype but that the motoring press and uninformed consumers frequently try to do so.

If anything, the cross-section of people who frequent these Subaru Crew Town Hall forums proves that Subaru owners come from all walks of life.

Thanks,
Ed

goldencouple1

American crocodiles are largely confined to a power plant on the east coast -- a warmth issue. 'Gators (the reptilian kind, not UF alums) are in abundance (well, the other Gators are abundant too). And the drought in Florida puts them on the move. You are likely to find one in your pool, or your kitchen (that's a true story).

But, that being said, I'd wrestle Dundee if they gave me a new Outback (I'm a Gator). Or Martina, if they gave me a 2003 Forester.

joseph50

An interesting read. As with Lark6 (Ed), the author lost me with that "not fun or nimble" remark.
Besides the kick I get driving my '01 S, what I appreciate most is the boxy design; being able to see the front and back ends makes for no-sweat downtown maneuvering and parking. The jelly-bean Taurus I used to drive was a nightmare in tight situations.

lark6

What, you mean UF alums aren't reptiles? ;-)

Ed
Georgia '85 [and red & black flame suit on]

kens

Mike,

The best way to remove door dings is to use the paintless dent repair services. They use special tools to get behind the dent and massage it out from the inside. There should be plenty of services like this where you live.

As for proving your neighboors wrong, I can only imagine video or a photograph being objective proof.

Before you go to that extent, have you tried talking to your neighboors? Another idea would be to get a big piece of cardboard and lay it up on your Forester so that it absorbs any potential impacts.

Ken

storyteller

I'd wrestle Cindy Crawford if they gave me a Pepsi. Or even if they wouldn't.

On the dings, there used to be a big fat foam fender that you could buy. I suppose the size was four inches wide, three inches thick or so. Had a magnetic backing, so you could park and then slap this thing on your car in just the right spot to catch the blows. I don't know if they are still available. Maybe a search on Google would produce them.

ateixeira

Mike: tough situation. I would try to park towards the other side, if possible, leaving a bit more room. But that just may give room for the door to swing open even harder. Or ask for a different parking spot?

I have this bizarre dream of owning a car with "noodles" surrounding it for protection. I mean those swimming pool floats, know what I mean?

Demographics: past dogs count, our best friends are not immortal, unfortunately.

Speak of it, sukibear, our latest participant in our Cleaning topic, is a female with a "K" in her name, hiker, cyclist, snow boarder, artist, and has a Chow Chow. What did I tell you?

-juice

storyteller

Mike: the bumpers or fenders I mentioned are very much like the noodles used in pools. Just magnetic on the back.

ateixeira

I should have registered my trade mark!

-juice

mikeh19

Thanks Ken and Storyteller for the posts,
Ken: cardboard is a great idea. I wish i could talk to them but i rarely see them. different schedules i guess.

Story: yeah i've heard of the foam thing that sticks onto the body. Maybe seen it once online. Anyone have a link?
Anyone know rough price of a paintless dent repair. Like I said before i've got like 12dings some deeper than others.
Mike

mikeh19

Hey Juice,
I've moved as far to the left as i can (there's a cement post on either side of our two spots) but again i think it only encourages the person to park closer to avoid the pole on their side.
And as for parking tight on them hoping they move over. I've got dings, they still have no clue how to park.

Mike

goldencouple1

My brother-in-law, Doug, also a Gator, almost bought a Forester -- seriously considered it. He has two dogs, is a triathlete and ultra-marathon/marathon runner, and he skis downhill - but is non-Berkenstock, though a healthy eater (quanity and quality). He got a used Volvo for the front leg-room: all that running requires his legs be more straightened out when he's a passenger.

Oh, lark6, Doug's dad is a Georgia alum -- some crazy bets transpire before the big party in JAX.

paisan

It is true that back in the 70s and 80s subaru did target the "alternative lifestyle" folks. Mostly because those were the ones who did most of the biking/hiking/kyacking back then. Also the "granola" people who usually bought subarus generally "embraced the diversity" more than say the Wall Street Brokers.....

-mike

ateixeira

I think it would be fair to say that Subaru owners are generally open minded and tolerant, at least from my experience. Look how generally peaceful and constructive our threads are.

Mike (capital M, paisan's is lower case): you are between a concrete wall and a hard place, the neighbor's door. Sorry.

-juice

mikeh19

Thanks for the sympathy, Juice

Mike

gened1

I think Griot's Garage catalog has magnetic body protection. www.griot'sgarage.com or try a google search.
Gene

lark6

goldencouple and paisan: my introduction to Subarus came in the mid 1980s from a number of kayaker and hiker friends who lived in north Georgia, North Carolina and Tennessee. One of my best friends at Georgia had one for many years but he is now a Nissan/Infiniti man.

Sad thing is that, for all those years, they kept trying to get me started paddling and I had excuses (e.g., working on my Master's). I finally took up the paddle in 1996, far too late. Wish I'd done it sooner - would be in much better shape physically and mentally - but still glad I finally made time in my life to do it.

Ed

PS: The kayak is why I won't put the dust deflector or little wing on my Forester's rear hatch.

storyteller

Mike: This isn't the one I saw (which was many years ago), but it is cheap and might do the trick. Go to: http://www.bmpd.com/bmw/parts/catalog/carcare_1.shtml

ateixeira

I always loved kayaking. I should get one, but I think I'll wait until my daughter is old enough to join me. There are places right on my way to work (Fletcher's Boat House, along the Potomac).

$16 for those protectors, nice find! Paintless dent removal costs a lot more.

-juice

stever

You know you failed your friends. Boaters from that part of the world paddle open boats (half the paddle, twice the man, etc.). I learned out of Chattanooga myself :-)

Steve
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grahampeters

G'day

Gee, the lesbian/gay thing slipped right by me. In Australia, Subarus seem not to have that narrow a definition and are seen as different. Probably a good thing too.

Not sure that it would even hold much sway here as Australians are generally pretty tolerant provided you don't rub them the wrong way. May explain why all cities and particularly Sydney has such a healthy and very integrated gay community, probably second only in size to San Francisco. The march at the Sydney Gay and Lesbian Mardi Gras is probably the biggest family entertainment in the country.

Cheers

Graham

lark6

Steve: No I didn't, at least not with an open boat. They were/are more into whitewater kayaks, even the high-performance "squirt boats" than I am. They mostly paddled the Hooch, Nantahala, Chattooga and Ocoee. Again. maybe if I'd started younger...

Graham: Although I haven't been to Australia yet, my wife and some friends have and came away with the same observations re openness. They're not car buffs so no observation of the various market niches. I just think its sadly strange how US vehicle buyers tend to reduce their opinion of a brand to an oversimplified minimum.

Ed

PS: I do have an Aussie Subaru part on my car - a Forester GT grille.

rsunico

Sorry if this has been posted yet (how does one look through archives). Saw (finally) and loved the new Forester. The guy from Subaru Corporate told me the rear seats were pushed back 3 inches.. amazing. Also there is 80/20 chance the 2.0 Turbo will be available next year? Anyone confirmed this? How do people think about the new competion -- e.g., Nissan Murano (hot car), Toyota/GM Matrix/Vibe.. even Mitsu is bringing something out. Funny took these folks a while to realize not everyone wants a humongous SUV.

nypdau

43-male-hetero-BS-doc martens (or Teva's)-built own computer (Athlon based)-cat, shared with gen-x girlfriend (co-habitating)

I bought the 01 Forester (my first Subaru) after lengthy research, mostly on W3 but also in magazines and books. I built my computer after exhaustive research as well, each component carefully selected for value and performance.
I sense a common mindset amongst the male Forester owners on this board. I suspect that many have gleefully described (to whomever is within earshot) the array of features that the Forester offers. Most of my friends know that I am a safety/preparedness nut. Who else carries 100' of tubular webbing and a caribiner/figure 8 in their ski-fanny pack? (I won't ever sit for 2 hours on a broken ski lift again!)
James:)

tidester

how does one look through archives
At the top of the main SUV's topics listing page is a link to the archives.


SUVs Archived Discussions
tidester
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gened1

According to my new Autoweek, pg 8 April 8, There will be a seven seat Sport Ute Subaru in 2005 or so.
Gene

nypaul

49 year YOUNG married white guy here with 2 adult(or so they think...lol) sons. And yep me and the wife love the outdoors. We're into hiking, backpacking, do a little canoeing and have done some bicycle touring(still ride my old 1980 Dawes Super Galaxy). We do have a dog of our own plus we are raising a puppy for a local guide dog school.
To be honest I never even would have thought to look at a Subaru except while at the house of a friend of a friend one Saturday night the talk turned to cars. They commented that they thought our '71 VW bus was "cool" and I asked them how they liked the Outback wagen in their driveway. Well they went on and on about the car and then started singing the praises of the dealer's service department. Well, all that was enough to get me into the show room to have a look, I didn't think I'd buy one though. I was looking for 4 seats and room for a dog, and kind of had my mind set on the 02 Honda CR-V. After looking at, driving, and talking to people about Subarus I changed my mind. My wife, Kathy, liked the Forester better than the Outback and so that's what we got.

Paul

mtngal

And I was definitely impressed. We tested an auto and I would have to adjust to that - I had a hard time not being too heavy footed (says something about the pickup). The auto seemed to shift without fuss and didn't have a problem even with my tendency to stomp on the accelerator. It was much quieter than the Tacoma and quieter than I expected. The seats were firm but supportive - not like the Tacoma's which don't seem to have much padding. Overall I was happy with it. Happy enough that I'm really interested in the new ones coming out.

However (there is always something that bugs me) the cup holders are terrible. That won't stop me from buying it, but I was wondering what others have done better the situation. Since our commute is so long, and we get up so early, coffee in the mornings and water in the evenings become a necessity, and didn't I read earlier that the new ones are better in this department?

After our test drive we went by the Pontiac dealer and looked at the Vibe. When we saw it at the LA auto show I thought it was kind of cute (and better looking than the Matrix). How my opinion changed when I actually saw it, touched it and sat in it. I didn't bother driving it - not even close to the Forester!

So the practicality of the Forester wins over my desire for a second Wrangler. Just hope I can get the numbers to work next month!

scirocco22

mtngal-- Yeah, I noticed that somebody where I work just bought one ...saw it parked in the company parking lot. When looking at it up close, I wasn't that impressed. It's small and uglier than the pictures I've seen. I also thought it looks better than the Matrix, however.

The cupholders in the new Forester are in the area between the front seats and no longer pop out of the dash.

Hope you'll be the first one on your block to have the new '03 Forester sitting on your driveway!

--'rocco

mtngal

Thanks for the info about the cup holders. I like them between the seats - they don't spill coffee or water on anything else.

I doubt if I'll be the first around here with a '03. Like all mountain areas, the subarus are very popular.

I did take a peek at the WRX they had in the showroom. But practicality and price won out over my WOW reaction...

Is it my imagination, or is the front end of the Forsester shorter than the Outback? I sat in an Outback at the LA auto show and couldn't tell where the front end was. I had no problem with the Forester, but that might be more from a higher seat height. Or am I just imagining it all?

scirocco22

mtngal-- I'm assuming that you're referring to the length of the hood or engine compartment. hmmmm... I'd have to assume that it would be more likely that you are seeing more "hood" area in the Forester because, as you stated, of the seating position being slightly higher. When I drove my friend's Outback, it did seem that I could have been sitting just a bit lower than what I would be in my Forester. I think the Forester has a much better visibility outlook all around than the Legacy platform.

--'rocco

nypdau

As I remember, the 2003 Forester has a drivers cup holder that pops out just to the right of the tach/speedo cluster. It is one of those "push-in-pop-out" types that is damped as it glides open. Much improved over the 2001 design. It still has potential to soak your leg with coffee if you bumps too hard though.

scirocco22

nypdau-- I think you're referring to the JDM model. The N.A. pictures that we've seen have the cupholders between the seats.

JDM --from gvmelbrty's album: http://homepage.mac.com/gvmelbrty/.Pictures/subaru/forester03_stereo.jpg

U.S. version lacks cupholder to the left of stereo but have two stationery cupholders molded in the plastic between the front seats.

http://homepage.mac.com/gvmelbrty/.Pictures/subaru/forester03_radio.jpg

gvemlbrty's album: http://homepage.mac.com/gvmelbrty/PhotoAlbum1.html

--'rocco