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Isuzu Trooper

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  • bawbcatbawbcat Member Posts: 118
    Beer47: What year is your Trooper and how many miles? I recently replaced the shocks on my 98 with 48k miles. I found that the stock Tokicos appeared to still be in proper working order. The improvement provided by my new Rancho RS-9000s was noticible but nothing huge like you experienced. If your previous shocks were dead, then it makes sense that you would notice a much larger improvement.

    Paisan, thanks for sharing your $/value recommendations! I'll try the sway bar bushings next. Did you use the JC Whitney parts as described in the article on your web site?

    Lastly, most of you are probably aware of this, but beware that installing stiffer springs and/or sway bars may reduce your independent wheel articulation off-road. Sway bars are designed to help keep both wheels on the same axle at the same level (i.e. reduced independence between the wheels). Many serious off-roaders disconnect or remove their sway bars. Stiffer springs definitely have benefits if you're driving hard/fast, but soft springs can actually be of benefit when crawling slowly over bumps. These factors could help explain why Isuzu made the stock springs/bars soft (in addition to the soft springs being more "comfortable" for the typical on-road driver).
  • sdc2sdc2 Member Posts: 780
    breakor, you are quite right that it is too soon to call it a trend. A handful of reported problems could just be a coincidence. But if indeed an Isuzu master mechanic says they are seeing this problem, that is the smoking gun IMHO. But I agree that confirmation/clarification is definitely needed.
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    Yep those are the ones I used ~$20 and about 2hrs of install time.

    In Rock crawling situations stiffer sways would hurt you, but in most other offroad scenarios it is a help.

    -mike
  • breakorbreakor Member Posts: 398
    I just found the latest Moody post. As of 305pm today he dropped it off at the dealer and still does not know what the problem is let alone that cylinder #1 is involved.
    Granted the mechanics reported quote, if true, is of great concern. However, the only proven trend I see is more and more people thinking there might be a problem based on other people thinking there might be a problem.
  • flyinlowflyinlow Member Posts: 62
    Just catching up after a few days, so I don't mean to 'pile on' to Freerlove, but I think this has to be said. In case anyone out there isn't clear on this, the OWNER is responsible for checking the oil, FREQUENTLY. Driving 6000 miles without taking a peek is asking for trouble, even if you drive a Toyota or Honda. I'm personally not comfortable with the idea of people driving even 5000 miles between oil changes, but that's another story.

    They used to advise checking at every gas fillup, but every second time is OK for most people whose vehicles don't have a pattern of using oil. And as a few have noted here, always check the level and look for leaks soon after an oil change, just for peace of mind.
  • kmcgirlkmcgirl Member Posts: 8
    Hi all, I have a 2001s 4wd, and was attempting to change some of the fluids last weekend, transmission, transfer case, front/rear axle, and the gear box.

    I've never done much more than changing the oil and filters in all of my other cars.

    How are you supposed to fill these various parts when some of the refill holes are parallel with floor pan or have an exhaust pipe in front of them? Gravity will not work here as you can't get a funnel in the holes without all the fluids pouring back in your face.

    Is there some technique that others have used on this board? Thanks for any help

    -Kevin
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    You need to get a pump from an auto-parts store. Then you can pump it up to the holes.

    -mike
  • bluedevilsbluedevils Member Posts: 2,554
    Buy a 2-dollar nozzle that attaches to any quart-sized container. It has an on/off flow switch that you twist open/closed. There's a 6" or so flexible plastic tube. Stick the tube in the fill hole and squeeze.

    This isn't the fastest method, but it works. Once the quart container is about half empty, I can't get any more fluid to pump out, so I end up topping off the container from a different container, etc. This can take a while, but it does the job.
  • beer47beer47 Member Posts: 185
    My trooper is a 2000 "s" with almost 70k on the odometer. I do not know what kind of stock shocks were on my truck but the mechanic said when he took them off he could compress them by hand and they would not pop back. They were really shot. I might have weakened my springs as they were doing all the work, but I'll live with them. The Monroe Reflex shock seems like a very good item, well designed, stiff. Any shock would have been an improvement over my OME ones. A real difference in ride and stability. I should have done it 20K ago.
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    You mean your OEM ones, OME = Old Man Emu :)

    When I had my shocks done at 20K mine too were shot.

    -mike
  • kncounckncounc Member Posts: 3
    Hi everyone -

    I am new to the message board. I am in the process of trading in my leased rodeo for a 2002 Trooper. Isuzu is running a factory rebate of $4500 and the dealer is matching - making the price $9000 off os MSRP. Is $24,600 a good deal for this car?
  • kjmcgirlkjmcgirl Member Posts: 12
    Your posts gave me some good ideas, I did some more searching and actually found a webpage that describes with photos how to change your transmission fluid. I think it was for a rodeo/amigo.


    Check it out: http://www.4x4wire.com/isuzu/tech/maintenance/tranny/


    Thanks


    -Kevin

  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    Cool, yeah 4x4wire has some good info on it.

    -mike
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    Is that for an LS 4wd or Limited 4wd? If so, it's an excellent price. You won't be let down by it! (but you already knew that Isuzus were good) Be sure to check out http://isuzu-suvs.com


    -mike

  • kncounckncounc Member Posts: 3
    It's for an LS. I read somewhere that you shouldn't pay more than $24K for the LS.
  • tle_portaltle_portal Member Posts: 8
  • rfredarfreda Member Posts: 15
    Pardon my ignorance for asking this question, but what are the driving characteristics of a Trooper whose stocks are considered shot? I've got a 98 LS with only 25K miles on it, and like to keep the tire pressure a couple pounds higher than the recommended.

    It's hard to notice the gradual change over a few years, but it seems like driving over rough pavement and RR crossings, it feels like the passengers are absorbing the brunt of the impact now.

    Thanks in advance.
  • tle_portaltle_portal Member Posts: 8
    $9000 off of MSRP is great! I only got $8K off for my LTD. I am not sure about where you read that on the LS, but it would be interesting to find out the reason.

    BTW, where are you located and are all the Isuzu dealers doing $9K off? I am in Portland, OR and the dealers were doing $7500 to 8K off. I think there is limited supply here.

    Thanks.
  • kncounckncounc Member Posts: 3
    I'm in VA - and actually I think it's this dealer. Sheehy usually marks down the car on its own and it is matching the factory rebate of $4500.

    Personally I think they should - the car will depreciate $10K-12K the first year! And half the year is over...
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    That sounds about right. The easiest way to test is to push down hard on a corner and see how many times it rebounds before stopping. If it is more than 1 or 2 times they are shot.

    -mike
  • jimmyp1jimmyp1 Member Posts: 640
    So, all you financial wizards, what does this mean? I'm having a hard time telling if this is just for the commercial trucks or for the whole entity. Does this look good or bad? I mean, I know the finances don't look good, but do you think there might be hope for a re-born Trooper?


    http://www.reuters.com/news_article.jhtml?type=search&StoryID=1332463&fromEmail=true


    Jim

  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    I think that GM is going to 12% of DMAX which is a separate entity for the Diesel Engines. Right now DMAX is separate. Which means that 49% would be increasing? Hmm looks like they gave up their 49% and dropped to 12% while putting it's hooks in the diesel company DMAX which is the crown jewels of Isuzu. We'll see how it pans out though.

    -mike
  • bsmart1bsmart1 Member Posts: 377
    All this talk about 99' Troopers with engine problems is bugging me. If the 99' has problems, why wouldn't the 00' - 02'?? Don't they all have the same engine?? All are the 3.5L with a few tweaks here and there maybe on cosmetics. I recently purchased a 99' and you guys got me all up in the air now about the purchase.

    Sounds like there are some good deals out there on NEW Troopers. That discount is nothing to sneeze at! Anyone in the SUV car market now should be grabbing the $8K discount. I don't think they are offering that in our area though. Happy Trooping!!
  • tkevinblanctkevinblanc Member Posts: 356
    The 3.5L is a very reliable engine. Stop worrying about it. Do check the oil. :0)
  • bluedevilsbluedevils Member Posts: 2,554
    Tell me again where you got your shocks and what you paid for parts and installation. Our 98 Trooper has almost 70k miles and I really don't know if the stock shocks are shot (try to say that 3 times fast!), but it's probably a safe bet that they are. And they are "Monroe Reflex" shocks?

    Other than causing damage to the springs, what are the other reasons why shot shocks should be replaced? I don't really notice any problems in everyday driving, but perhaps we are just accustomed to the feeling of the shot shocks.
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    It will cause the ABS to kick in faster, and over un-even terrain like potholes and quick turns you could loose control.

    -mike
  • bawbcatbawbcat Member Posts: 118
    Beer47: The reason your stock shocks did not spring back afer being compressed by hand is because they are hydraulic shocks, not gas pressurized. Only gas pressurized shock tend to expand on their own. Even my brand new Rancho RS-9000 shocks did not spring back after being compressed, because they are not gas pressurized either. It sounds like your stock shocks were pretty worn at least, since you noticed such a significant ride improvement. After 70k, that seems reasonable.

    When you remove the stock shocks, if they still provide reasonable resistance to both compression and extension when held in the upright position, then they are still basically functional. They may be worn, but it is more difficult to tell the difference between a worn shock and a good one by hand unless you compare side-by-side. A shock that is completely failed will be obvious though, as it will provide little or no resistance to compression and/or extension.

    Determining the condition of your shocks while they are mounted on the vehicle may not be easy either. The most obvious thing you can do is what Paisan suggested. Push down hard on the front or rear bumper or drive over a speed bump and see how much the vehicle bounces.

    I think it's pretty safe to say that if your Trooper has over 50k miles, you will see some improvement if you replace the factory shocks with anything of at least moderate quality. For those on a budget, gas shocks from Gabriel or Monroe will do fine. For those who want the best, there seems to be a lot of Trooper owners who like OME (i.e. Old Man Emu) or Rancho.

    There is no real risk of damaging your springs due to worn shocks. They carry the weight of the vehicle regardless. I suppose that the springs might wear a little faster if your shocks are bad, since they will flex more as the vehicle bounces, but I would guess that this is not that significant.
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    I thought the RS9000s were gas-charged.

    Have to agree, the damage to the springs will be far less significant than the safety factor IMHO.

    -mike
  • beer47beer47 Member Posts: 185
    I paid $199.96 plus tax for the Monroe Reflex including installation at a local shop. If you can match or beat that, I would go ahead and do it. Your right that the shock performance deteriorates slowly over time and you will not notice it all in one day. My trooper was getting really bouncy on small bumps. I can put up with a lot but this was getting embarassing. Imagine riding a thorobred in the Derby and then imagine riding a donkey. They are both equines but you know one is smoother at speed. My trooper is back riding like a thorobred! Maybe you can catch a deal @ Sears or the like. Monroe owns the Rancho brand and they try out new technology there first before expanding it to the Monroe line. Like trying something out in a few Audis before putting in all VWs. From my research online, the Reflex is the latest out from Monroe and designed for SUVs like Troopers. Good Luck on your search!
  • bluedevilsbluedevils Member Posts: 2,554
    beer, thanks for the information.
  • savvas_esavvas_e Member Posts: 347
    The truth is that Tenneco Automotive own the Rancho and Monroe brands. The Rancho shocks are made in Monroe's factory in Nebraska. However only the Rancho RS1000 is a rebadged Monroe product. The RS5000 and RS9000 are standalone products.

    I also thought that the RS9000 is a gas shock. However, going back through the Rancho website I can only find mention of the RS5000 being a gas shock.
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    Also I think that company also makes things like mufflers and stuff too?

    hmm I heard the RS9000s are just adjustable 5000s.

    -mike
  • bawbcatbawbcat Member Posts: 118
    The RS9000 is not gas charged. See below for info from the FAQ on the Rancho web site (http://www.gorancho.com/faq/rs9000.stm):

    The RS5000 uses the same technology, i.e. it is not gas charged either. Some people have stated that the RS5000 is equivalent to the RS9000 set on 3. I don't think that is true. They are similar shocks in design, but the RS5000 is advertised as having 10-stage valving, and if I recall correctly, the RS9000 was advertised as having 15-stage. The new RS9000x (different from the original RS9000) has 17-stage.

    -----------------------------------------
    2. Are the RS9000's gas-charged?

    No, The RS9000 are not a gas pressurized shock. Gas charging is of several methods by the shock absorber industry to control the internal fluid.

    3. If they're not gas, what does "Cellular Gas" mean?

    Cellular gas technology is a high quality closed cell foam material. Cellular gas technology allows 100% oil fill of the shock absorber that increases heat dissipation, reduces heat fade and allows the shock to operate in either orientation.
  • savvas_esavvas_e Member Posts: 347
    Yesterday I removed the driver's seat from my car as one bolt had worked its way loose in the frame, causing an annoying shifting of the seat when braking. Fixed all that up and it's like a new one now.

    But while I had it out, I took the opportunity to look over the TOD control module. I spotted one, solitary, empty connector on one of the plugs that connects to the module. The other plug was fully wired. I was tempted to put power to this empty connector and see what happens, but was running out of time. However, I will get back to it in the next couple of weeks and test it with a multimeter.

    I recall Mike saying that there is a 4H input shown in the schematics and I'm guessing that this is it.
  • bsmart1bsmart1 Member Posts: 377
    OK, lets hear it for gas mileage on the 3.5L Trooper. I want to hear what mileage you folks with the 99' model are getting. I've owned a 88' a 97' a 99' and an 01'. It seems the 99' is getting the worst mileage of all of them. Explain that!! Anybody getting in the upper teens in mileage with this year model??
  • bsmart1bsmart1 Member Posts: 377
    The Rancho 9000's are NOT gas charged. That became obvious when I installed mine. The other thing I noticed was the original factory shocks on my 97' Trooper had a dead spot of about 3/8" when changing direction. I noted this after removing them to install the Rancho's. Pulling and pushing on the stem revealed the dead spot. I suppose this is not uncommon for shocks with 60K miles on them. Noticable improvement in ride when the Rancho's were installed.
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    That's about right on the milage. Don't forget the '99 is the heaviest and biggest engine of them.

    With my stock setup I got 20mpg once on the highway @ 60mph and 38psi in the tires.

    Normally I get abour 17mpg with the lift + steps + loaded down with tools + 275 tires + 77mph

    -mike
  • savvas_esavvas_e Member Posts: 347
    Mine ranges anywhere from 18L/100km (approx 15mpg)in city driving and 11L/100km (approx 25mpg)in highway cruising.

    Most trips away that include four wheel driving usually return 14L/100km (approx 21mpg).

    My conversions from metric to imperial are a bit rough, mind you. Also keep in mind that Australian standard unleaded ranges from 91 to 93 octane so we may get slightly better mileage than the USA where standard unleaded is 89 (is that correct?). The highway cruising figure is achieved with 98 octane fuel.
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    But your fuel uses a different system of Octane rating so I think yours is actually lower Octane. I got better milage with 87 than 93 (did about 5K with each)

    -mike
  • savvas_esavvas_e Member Posts: 347
    It's an ISO rating that is used in Australia. The problem with standard Australian fuel is the way it is manufactured, we tend to have more additives to bring it up to spec rather than it being refined properly. The 95 and 98 octane fuel are refined correctly and generally have to be to provide for the higher tech Japanese and European motors.

    I tend to run the 98 simply because it is cleaner and keeps the motor cleaner. It's also 10% dearer, but it evens out as the car tends to use 10% less than 91 anyway.

    Pity that we don't get Japan's 100 octane stuff. Mitsubishi and Isuzu both have normally aspirated versions of their V6s that can produce 220kw and 250kw respectively, running on 100 octane.

    Mind you, the Isuzu motor gets 250kw at 7000rpm. This is the same motor used in competition by Bruce Garland in the Holden Rally Team.
  • sbcookesbcooke Member Posts: 2,297
    My 99 averages around 12-14 around town. More 12...however I do lots of short trips...My work is only 15 minutes from home so it is hard to get a good read. If I strip off the roof rack and do highway driving @65 mph I can get over 18 fairly consistently. Offroad I get about 10 mpg.

    Is the '99 heavier than the 2000 an up? I wouldn't think there would be much difference.
  • tkevinblanctkevinblanc Member Posts: 356
    I noted from a web site description that the Monroe Reflex comes with rubber bushings while the Bilsteins, KYGs, etc. come with poly bushings. Would that make much of a difference over time? I can't imagine that the poly bushings are more than a few cents more each... of course, you probably couldn't find appropriately sized ones.
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    the 98-02 should all weigh about the same. The original poster though was comparing it to his 95? and/or 89? Which were lighter IIRC than the 98-02

    -mike
  • tek182tek182 Member Posts: 6
    Hey guys, I haven't checked the board in a while so I missed Breakor's comments on the engine trouble. Well guess what, mine was the #1 cylinder too! That to me sounds like alot more than mere coincidence! To top it all off, I just got a call from the dealer where my trooper is (400 mi away, it broke while on vacation), and the new short block they installed was no good. He said they started it up and it was making a real bad noise. They tore it down and he said they had a hard time turning it with a breaker bar(yes, it did have oil in it I was told). So he said he would order another one, which will take a week to get there. He also told me that they don't make a long block, because that is what I requested. Hopefully, all will go well with my old heads on this new block. At this point, I would just like to get it back. With all these problems, I wonder if there is any chance of a recall. Thank God this happened while it was still under warrenty! Thanks for all the info everybody, keep on Troopin!
  • robb36robb36 Member Posts: 1
    Hey all, I just purchased an '02 Trooper S. I just filled it up, and did my first MPG calculation. After reading posts here and elsewhere, I fully expected to see 13-15 MPG. I got 18.6 MPG with 70% highway and 30% city driving! Needless to say I'm very happy with that, considering I only have 168 miles on the clock.
  • njdadnjdad Member Posts: 9
    This is a great forum and although I've only recently been reading it, I've learned a
    great deal about Trooper issues and recommendations. And now I'm jumping in to
    share my experiences and to get feedback on a bunch of questions I have.

    I have a 1996 Trooper S with a 5spd manual transmission. It currently has 128K
    miles. I've had some issues with this Trooper over the years:

    1) My manual transmission had to be replaced at about 90K. This was tough to
    swallow since I thought I'd NOT have transmission troubles with the 5spd vs. an
    automatic. Anyone have similar problems with their manual transmission? I'm not
    too familiar with manual transmissions, but what basically happened was the main
    gear was stripped down to the shaft ( I saw it). Supposed reason: The tranny guy said they put the Rodeo manual transmission in the Troopers and because the Trooper is larger it puts
    more stress on the transmission. Who knows.
    2) The 4WD solenoid went bad and I had to have that replaced at about 100K. I
    was assured that it wasn't linked to the new trans and it made sense to me.
    3) I've also been experiencing the ticking from the engine. I guess it's the lifters from
    what I've been reading on this site.

    Otherwise, I love the Trooper and the size and utility it offers.

    OK, now I'm looking for some recommendations on a few things. Any advice
    would be greatly appreciated:

    1) Tires. I need to replace the Pirelli Scorpions that I have on it now. I do about
    95% road riding (alot of it highway) and 5% snow. From research on tirerack.com,
    it seems the Yokohame Geolander H/T Y816 tires seems like a good choice.
    Anyone have an opinion on these tires for my driving or any other tire
    recommendations?
    2) Engine Oil. I've been reading about using Mobil 1. This is synthetic oil I'm
    guessing. I've been using the cheapest oil I can find and change my oil about every
    4000 miles or so. It does burn oil now and ticks as mentioned before. Is the Mobil
    1 really worth using? What grade should be used (I live in NJ)?
    3) Shocks. I've never replaced my shocks and I've been reading about them alot on
    this site. I'm not sure that I need them since I haven't noticed a real change in driving
    comfort, although I'm trying to be more attentive now. If I get them replaced, I've
    seen a post about the Mornoe Reflex - is this a good choice or is there another you
    recommend?
    4) Are there other good Trooper forums?
    5) Chance of my getting to 200K without serious engine repairs???

    Thanks in advance for any advice.
  • bluedevilsbluedevils Member Posts: 2,554
    Our 96 Trooper S (4x4, as all were back then) got better fuel economy than does our 98 Trooper S w/Perf. Package. This is in spite of the fact that the EPA ratings are 14 mpg city / 18 hwy on the 96 and 15/19 on the 98.

    Our 98 gets 18-19 on straight highway and about 16.5-16.7 overall, with 60-70% city, 30-40% highway. Straight city would probably be 14-15.
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    Check out http://isuzu-suvs.com there is lots of info there. Also I see NJ in the login, from NJ? We usually go offroading in NJ 1x a month so look for "Pine Barrens Trail Ride" posts.


    -mike

  • bsmart1bsmart1 Member Posts: 377
    There's gotta be more 99' owners out there willing to talk about their mileage.. I'm curious about that statement, about the 99' being heavier than the 00-02 models. I just don't know about that. Why would it be? It's the same engine and drive train. I would think the models with the 'grade logic' would get less mileage since the engine does the braking when going down grades of noticeable decline. The engine never gets an opportunity to 'free-wheel'. There's gotta be something different about the 99' fuel system to cause it to perform a little less efficiently, but what could it be?? 14 mph in the 99' is much different than 17-18 in the 01' model.
    You guys getting 18-21mpg are really lucky!! I would make a few adjustments if I thought it would give me those mileage numbers. Happy Trooping???
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    99 was heavier?

    the 00-02 have drive-by-wire which is probably a more precise fuel delivery? maybe? Just grasping at straws.

    I've found driving style has a big effect. I can knock mine down to 10mpg easily if I drive balls to the wall in city traffic.

    -mike
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