-
-
Make
-
- Acura
- Alfa Romeo
- AM General
- Aston Martin
- Audi
- Bentley
- BMW
- Bugatti
- Buick
- Cadillac
- Chevrolet
- Chrysler
- Daewoo
- Dodge
- Eagle
- Ferrari
- FIAT
- Fisker
- Ford
- Geo
- GMC
- Honda
- HUMMER
- Hyundai
- Infiniti
- Isuzu
- Jaguar
- Jeep
- Kia
- Lamborghini
- Land Rover
- Lexus
- Lincoln
- Lotus
- Maserati
- Maybach
- Mazda
- McLaren
- Mercedes-Benz
- Mercury
- MINI
- Mitsubishi
- Nissan
- Oldsmobile
- Panoz
- Plymouth
- Pontiac
- Porsche
- Ram
- Rolls-Royce
- Saab
- Saturn
- Scion
- smart
- Spyker
- Subaru
- Suzuki
- Tesla
- Toyota
- Volkswagen
- Volvo
-
- Model
-
Year
-
Oops! First tell us what Make you're interested in.
-
- Body Type
- Research
Comments
I'm not sure what point you're trying to make. The discussion was resale value, not retail price used. Resale value is either trade-in value or private party sale value; not used retail price. For the majority of people out there it will equate to trade-in value as relatively few go through the added steps of doing a private party sale.
To reiterate my point, if Car A cost $20K new and is worth $5K resale while Car B cost $23K new and has a resale of $7K, then Car B's higher resale in reality means Car B cost $1K more to own than Car A (other operating cost differences excluded). The brands, models, equipment levels, etc. do not matter.
I don't think many buyers consider this. Some cars, with higher resale value, are also easier to sell when the time comes. You will always get more selling it yourself, than from a trade-in.
Ford's hybrid system in the FFH is apparently quite similar to Toyota's and not like those 'pseudo' systems offered by other mfgrs ( except Nissan who licenses use of the system from Toyota) - whether Ford simply copied it, properly developed it independently, or whether we have patent infringement lawsuits in front of us remains to be seen.
oh, I think they do, this is one of the ultimate justifications for spending the extra bucks on that Camcord.. Resale value. The cheapest cars to own in this segment are NOT generally the cheapest to buy or even maintain and haven't been for a long long time.
Let's ignore that they moved Focus production OUT of mexico and back to the U.S. to make room for the triplets. Let's ignore that the 2010 Euro Focus will be built in the U.S. Ford is a global company and the Fusion is sold in latin and south america, too. Same for the upcoming Fiesta. Trucks, SUVS, mustang, taurus/mks, edge/mkx, flex, crown vic/grand marquis - all made in the U.S. or Canada. Get over it already.
Ford's hybrid system in the FFH is apparently quite similar to Toyota's.....whether Ford simply copied it, properly developed it independently, or whether we have patent infringement lawsuits in front of us remains to be seen.
No it does not "remain to be seen". Ford has publicly stated that no Toyota patented technology exists in the FFH and that none of the patents that they licensed for the Escape are applicable to the FFH. The fact that Toyota has not challenged this says all you need to know.
Can you disable the function that re-locks the doors if you don't open it in time after hitting the unlock button on the transmitter?
Edmunds Manager UGC Click on my screen name to send a personal message. Need help navigating? Check out Getting Started in Edmunds Forums.
Need help picking out a make/model, finding inventory, or advice on pricing? Talk to an Edmunds Car Shopping Advisor
1. Chevy...new Cruze looks like a winner but it is three to five years too late. Volt could also be a winner but sell it already. Camaro's interior is pathetic. Hard plastic everywhere, toylike looking gauges....very cheap overall on the interior. I was very disappointed.
2. Ford...some very nice products. New Taurus and Fusion are very nice but the 2010 models were locked up tight so you couldn't really evaluate....what a shame because the interiors looked nice through the glass.
3. Chrysler....I walked through and didn't see anything I liked or that looked good except the Challenger which is just a hair too big for my taste.
4. Toyota...2010 Prius---locked up tight. No 2010 Camry to even look at let alone get inside. Sat in a Venza. Fairly nice but a fair amount of cheap hard plastic and minimum size tires were 19s. What's up with that? How much do 19 in. tires cost to replace anyway. This tire size business is getting out of hand.
5. Something I noticed is that Infiniti G37 vs. Lexus ES350 is no comparison. The G37 is just appears much better made inside and out. Push the steering wheel tilt button in the G37 and the whole dash moves with the steering wheel so you always have a perfect view of the gauges. Very nice and I don't think any other manufacuturer does that.
6. Kia....I was very interested in seeing the new Optima and the new Forte(Spectra replacement). The Optima was absolutely ridiculous in regards to interior cheapness. The Forte from what I could see was actually nicer looking inside than the Optima but it was also locked up. What is with these manufacturers? I can see locking up a 150K Mercedes but a 15K Forte. Please.
7. I liked the Hyundai Sonata but nothing new there. The Genesis was very nice...quality...stylish. The new Elantra Touring was there but locked up. Had a sign on it that it going to be coming FALL 2008. Isn't this 2009 already and shouldn't you be able to sit in this thing.
I could go on and on but probably will bore so I'll close. It was a decent show and attendence versus last year was probably down about 10% from what I saw.(I went on the same day of the week last year).
Ford has not taken a penny from the government.
To be fair to captain2 he didn't say they borrowed it from the govt. He just said they borrowed money which they did do.
Well it's not a few extra mphs, it's actually about double the TCH's 20-something mph limit on battery alone. There are other online mags reporting over 40 mpg while trying to max FE so I'm interested to see what MT comes up with if they can restrain themselves long enough.
My daily drive is roughly 80-90% city so I could see myself using the battery a lot in the FFH. That is if the big hills don't force the ICE to kick on all the time. So I believe my "real life" experience with one would nearly verify the EPA's rating. However the lack of AWD in the FFH takes it off my list altogether.
My daily drive is roughly 80-90% city so I could see myself using the battery a lot in the FFH. That is if the big hills don't force the ICE to kick on all the time. So I believe my "real life" experience with one would nearly verify the EPA's rating. However the lack of AWD in the FFH takes it off my list altogether.
Are the Escape and Highlander the only AWD hybrids available?
Maybe the next generation will be more like a modern diesel locomotive with an electric motor on each wheel and the ICE or compression ignition motor is just a generator. A Honda "SH" type drivetrain (originally on the Prelude, then spread through the Acuras) but instead of a bunch of differentials distributing power, just have a separate electric motor on each wheel.
I am curious what you found "ridiculously cheap" in the Optima, since from what I've seen the interior is mostly carryover from the 2008 Optima, which I always thought had a pretty nice interior for its price.
Did you happen to stop by the Subaru area and see the 2010 Legacy?
Um, I used private party numbers, like you say. Check kbb.com for yourself, use ZIP Code 35209.
I chose the different models to represent the retail price WHEN NEW. The Accord LX would be similar to a loaded Sonata WHEN NEW.
Despite what the marketers would have you believe, higher resale is a false indication of value. The actual indication is how many dollars the vehicle has cost you to own. Which means the depreciation in dollars.
They attended to put their hat in the ring and get preapproval for a loan if things got a lot worse, but mostly to show support for GM and Chrysler to get their loans because either one going under would have a huge negative impact on Ford because they share suppliers.
well the camry gives me uninspired driving experience the mazda 6i was a hoot to drive and camry is a passion killer. I am so not into it i that i do care if i drive my 00 tauras or 07 camry which i never had with the 6. sadly it feels like 00 accord and how i felt .
according to most reviewers and critic i have a great car why i do not feel so i do not get.
after reading so many wondefull reviews and thread i have a upgraded in $$$ ,resale
and dependability .
shocking stat living in the north east , i ended up putting more miles on my bicycle and motorcycle than my camry last year .
well at least we do have some Ford guys (baggs32) that can actually read posts - I didn't say Ford had taken any of our tax money - only that they borrowed money (a $23 billion junk bond issue if I'm not mistaken) AND that they further used at least a good part of that money so they could to close plants, buy out labor contracts, and put even more Americans on the unemployment roles. Please please Mr. Press Release tell me it ain't so - go ahead I'll wait.
I'll agree that there would seem to be a good possibility that Ford did not borrow too heavily from Toyota in their Hybrid system - but certainly not because Ford says so - what would you expect them to say? More likely because Toytoa hasn't sued them yet, as you mention. Toyota has every right to be protective and proud of their innovations and leadership in Hybrid technologies and I'm sure they have plenty enough money to sick a whole flock of lawyers on anybody or anything that they could prove violated some of their patents.
Made in Canada is really no better than Made in Mexico as neither really helps the US economy, it also deosn't matter which particular models are made over the borders only that they are doing it and Ford is obviously not the only guilty party in this.
It is to the credit to Ford and the beancounters that have been in charge that Ford doesn't have its hands out right now - they had already made many of those hard choices that the governemnt is now forcing on GM as part of the loan terms of the money that they are getting. IMO - and a bit off topic - I am torn on this whole loans to automakers routine - on one hand anything that they (the former Big3) do to 'survive' is likely going to cost some real honest taxpaying Americans their jobs and likewise turn some areas of our country into economic disasters - so therfore we need to insure their survival. Vs. the fact that the 'American' auto industry hasn't been a factor of any consequence in the car business for many many years now - their choice - so therefore they don't deserve the help. Let them go back to making trucks and SUVS and hope that gas doesn't get to $4-5 again. Tough choices for sure.
I sat in a Legacy but I'm not sure if it was the 2010 or not. I sat in a "special edition" and I didn't really think it was that special. Interior was tight, door seemed tinny and no frame around the window seemed a little fragile. Dash looked kind of old fashioned and headroom was tight and I'm only 5'9" but the seat may have adjusted high, not sure. It may have the 2009. If the 2010 was there it must have been in back of the display area which I didn't get to.
A side note. Mazda has a 2009 Mazda6 sport, no options at all except auto trans that I could tell. That was open to sit in. They had a black 09 Mazda6 Grand Touring with all the bells/whistles there but it was locked up. Not a good way to advertise IMO.
Why is it so hard for you to believe that Ford actually developed their hybrid system without ANY assistance from Toyota? It's the truth. Even Toyota admits it. Why can't you?
And with that, I'm done on this topic.
well the camry gives me uninspired driving experience
What led you to believe that a Camry woud do anything other than that? I thought it was pretty much common knowledge that that is the car for those who want a soft ride and don't care about things like steering "feel".
For now Ford has not taken any tax dollars. Yes, Ford did see the future and did get some money lined up for the now. How do you fault Ford for doing this? Ford is not struggling in Europe or Asia either. Ford is doing a great job in the quality and safety regions of car manufacturing. Ford has more models with 5 star crash ratings than Honda! I just cannot believe the bias and decent in this forum for anything that doesn't have a Toyota or Honda badge in this forum. Just puzzles me, when a car company, any car company is doing good things it should be recognized. Hyundai has made great strides in quality. VW is shedding its quality issues of the late also. If GM can turn its ship around, kudos to GM. :surprise:
If the Legacy seemed cramped, it was probably the 2009. The 2010 is supposed to be roomier. Probably has not made its debut yet.
I also don't get this "let's keep the cars locked" strategy, unless it's a prototype or something special that is on a pedestal. I mean, the whole idea of car shows is to SELL CARS, right? :confuse:
Other than some luxury and poser hybrids (Saturn VUE, GM Pickups to name a couple) that's all I know of. Escape Hybrids are VERY hard to come by around here and there's usually a long wait list for them. Since I'll never buy a Toyota, unless it's absolutely necessary to do so, the Highlander never made my list.
If we are going to go down that road, then is the Honda Accord, Toyota Camry, Subaru Legacy, Nissan Altima (with too many more to mention) Japanese since they are built in America?
I also feel that Ford saw the light early on when they came out with the Fusion, and other models, and put real quality back into them. They knew that the SUV/Truck market would falter eventually and needed something to fall back on, and to come out with a car that is on par or above the Toyota/Honda models was the real ticket. I have a Camry Hybrid, and let me tell you, the quality in the Fusion is far better than the Camry. If Ford has that Hybrid out last year, I might be driving that instead.