Maintenance hurts more than helps?
My father has warned me not to change the coolant
nor tranny fluid in my two cars (89 Celebrity and
87 Cutlass Ciera both with 3 speed autos) because
removing the pan gasket will cause the tranny to
leak form then on out and if you flush the coolant,
any debris in there could be plugging up tiny
holes that are no big deal, but when the debris is
removed, now you have coolant leaks. I was curious
to know anyone's opinion on these "myths".
nor tranny fluid in my two cars (89 Celebrity and
87 Cutlass Ciera both with 3 speed autos) because
removing the pan gasket will cause the tranny to
leak form then on out and if you flush the coolant,
any debris in there could be plugging up tiny
holes that are no big deal, but when the debris is
removed, now you have coolant leaks. I was curious
to know anyone's opinion on these "myths".
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This discussion has been closed.
Comments
The coolant thing I'm not sure about.
While a lot of manufacturers claim that their automatics don't require fluid changes, I would not go over 50,000 miles without a change. I use Mobil 1 ATF in my Pathfinder and change it every 50,000. No leaks or failures at 108,000 miles. I would NEVER exceed the manufacturer's service interval on coolant. Even if the freeze point is good the anti corrosion additives weaken and the coolant becomes more and more acidic, attacking the gaskets, seals, and alloy parts. If the system has been maintained properly their should be no leaks to unplug. Does your father work for a radiator rebuilder?
David
Also, radiator coolant gets bad with age - Change it! It is doubtful that you would ever have a problem.
The rationale behind this is that transmission fluids have very aggressive detergent properties. If a transmission has gone 60,000 miles without a change it likely has formed deposits because the old fluid cannot hold any more impurities in suspension. When the fluid is changed, the new fluid dislodges the deposits and can lead to bearing failure or valves and passages clogging.
I have no idea if this is in fact true, but it sounds plausible. Anyone here have any experience with this?
Dave
David
Maintenance is KEY! If you want stuff to last, MAINTAIN THE HECK OUT OF IT..... Follow the severe service chart in your owners manual.
"less than 1/2 the price of the detergent oil"
You answered your own question Some people will only see $$$.
Coolant Change....These guys are absolutely right that the coolant will deteriorate even though the freeze protection remains OK. Please don't exceed 30 months without a change. Unfortunately, the GM (Harrison) radiators are likely to deteriorate beyond practical repair after 8 to 10 years even with good cooling system maintenance. The fellow who said an old Harrison radiator may leak if you flush the contamination out of its corroded spots is quite correct....but I don't think you want to depend on "dirt to keep the holes plugged." Suggest that a reputable radiator shop perform a phosphoric acid flush, pressure test, and do a visual inspection. Some solder repair may put you back in business but, unfortunately, you should also be prepared for the possibility of buying a new radiator or radiator core.
Have to take issue with you on coolant change, the new "Dex-cool" orange low silicate coolant is good for 5 years or 150,000 miles. I switch all vehicles to it nowadays.
dwwebste - put 50,000 miles using Orange Dexcool on my brass/copper radiator in my F350 Diesel with no problems. What's your radiator made of?
I wouldn't believe 5 years either. Name one fluid you're willing to leave in an engine for 5 years untouched. My point was, regardless of how many or how few miles you have driven, the deciding factor for maintenance should be how long the engine was running in engine hours. GM even added an engine hour meter on the new Chevy Silverado/GMC Sierra to accomodate this.
For example, Driver 1 does nothing but stop-and-go city driving just 20 miles a day at an average speed of 15mph. After 5 years, he has only driven 36,500 miles. Driver 2 drives exclusively highway for 90 miles a day at 65mph. Driver 2's car will have gone 164,250 miles in 5 years. But in both cases, the engine has operated the same amount of time, and both cars should receive servicing at the same time, regardless of their odometer reading.
It's like the "100,000 miles before tuneups" claim. It's marketing - it has nothing to do with the car you have or how you drive. I'm sure 75% of the car owners in the US would have to say yes to at least one of the conditions that require you to use the heavy duty maintenance schedule in the owner's manual, which requires much more frequent servicing than those kind of claims would imply.
What the hell is going on here. Does anyone really know or is this like the debate surrounding the big boom theory. HELP
A few years back, I bought a '77 Datsun B210 with a 3-speed automatic and about 100k miles. When I finally checked the tranny fluid (didn't do too thorough a pre-purchase inspection -- funny what you'll do when the price is right and you're broke) I found that the fluid had never been changed. Instead of a nice red, the fluid was a light gray. A couple of mechanics told me _not_ to change the fluid. I seem to remember their logic as being "the tranny is very worn, but because the burnt fluid has totally lost its viscosity, it compensates for the wear. If you put fresh fluid in a worn tranny, you're likely to get slippage."
I have no idea whether they were correct, but I drove that rust bucket for another 3 years (and 40k) -- and it wasn't the tranny that forced the car's retirement. Dealing with a failing steering box, a thrashed carburetor, a shot suspension, and a broken starter switch finally got too frustrating and I junked it (man, I miss that car).
Most cars don't have to drop the pan for tranny fluid. They have a bolt - like changing oil.
Except the Tranny bolt is a lot tighter.
Coolant was changed in my cars every 2 to 3 yrs (sometimes 1 1/2 years when bored) Just empty & re-fill, never flushed.
Harrison Radiator leaked after 9 years on my '89 Corolla. (GM and Toyota Joint Venture).
My '88 Corolla has a leak somewhere but not in the radiator (Denso Radiator - I think). Still original, but I lose a quart every 6 months. (Add a pint every few months).
Change the fluids!!
Transmission fluid should not "wear" out or "lose" viscocity from normal operations.
Usually, when an automatic transmission fails it is because of a leak. Generally, the leaks are around the gasket which gets old and cracks. Stop the leak and the transmission will often work again. When a torque converter goes inside the transmission, it raises other questions too. These units are supposedly sealed so changing the fluid in the transmission does not have any effect on preserving the torque converters internal fluid.
Once, I purchased a used GMC Motor Home with a 350 engine. The transmission leaked, and of course when the fluid gets low, the transmission does not work correctly. All the transmission shops I contacted, big ones, small ones and dealers, told me I needed to rebuild the transmission and replace the torque converter. No GM dealers could or would just "fix" the leak. Luckily, I noticed a guarantee being offered by Jiffy Lub that guaranteed no leaks after they changed the fluid and filter. Of course, it leaked afterwards, but when they were between a rock and a hard place, they got GM to confess that that model always leaked UNLESS a "special" corrective gasket was installed. Once, they installed the gasket that was known only to God and GM headquarters, no more leaks and the transmission ran fine and the torque converter kept right on doing its thing without being replaced or repaired. So, I recommend doing nothing until a transmission does not work the way you expect it to. Then, check the fluid level with the car on a level surface and check it both hot and cold. Add just enough automatic transmission fluid (The RIGHT ONE FOR YOUR CAR TO BE SURE) to get the fluid at the proper level. Then head to a Jiffy Lub or equivalent and request a filter and transmission fluid change and have a new gasket installed at the same time. If that does not fix the automatic transmission, trade or sell the car, transmission problems and all. Torque converters are too EXPENSIVE to make it a good deal to install one! Also, go to a good driving school and learn to drive right. If the torque converter goes, it is probably because you don't know how to drive a car right. You'll do it to the next car too. Once, should be enough.
I try to change my oil every 3-4,000 miles. I used to do it every 2,500, but marriage and kids take more time...
My Dad was a mechanic in the old days ('40s and '50s) and taught me these things. He still works on his cars at 71.