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Comments
Still, a little of this plastic cleaner goes a long way, and you will find lots of uses for it in addition to parts on the car.
LOL...Avalanche ;-))
fastdriver
Isn't their an old song called, "the passion of lovers"?
ohhhh, I remember....... Bauhaus did it. Great song, I'll have to dig it up. If you're into the whole "goth rock" thing, Bauhaus was epic.
LOL...Sorry- yep, Chevrolet!
fastdriver
However from a distance (10 ft or more) the side panels don't appear as if its been recently waxed/polished. Not even after some more z6. Next to a white '99ish Grand Prix that regularly parks next to me regularly at work, it looks quite dull...
Is it possible for me to ever make my white Regal shine as much as that damn Grand Prix?
After I put Zaino on my new car ('02 Lexus), I was so impressed with the results that I have since put in on two older cars. In both instances I used stuff from the auto store that removed oxidized paint, fine scratches and stuff like that. (Then I used clay, but that does not deal with the problem you report.)
If your older paint was oxidized, scratched, not really clean or otherwise not as shinny as possible before you started with the Zaino, then you just sealed that in. Zaino is not abrasive in any regard, and does nothing to set up the paint. You really need to "polish" it with something lightly abrasive to get down to a good clear paint before putting on a polymer finish.
That's my opinion on why you are seeing what you are reporting, but I could be wrong, because I'm no expert. (It could also just be the quality of paint that Buick used in '94, I don't know.)
I also don't know the best way for you to correct this problem, as I don't know how to deal with fixing up dull paint underneath Zaino. I guess you have to take it off, but I don't know what kind of products do that.
I'm sure others here can help.
Good luck.
I got to admit though, it's a good observation.
Not a big deal.
What the hell are you talking about when you say, "and using Sal's words as weapons!!"?? Huh?
Please do me a favor and go refer to an Autopia Zaino user the way you did above and see how fast you are banned.
1) do you mean it it does not look shiny? or
2) do you mean it does not look as bright and white as you feel it should?
Dunno...
LOL...and I thought he made a New Year's resolution to be good? Things must be slow in the OTHER topic, so he thought he'd drop in here! ;-))
fastdriver
"However from a distance (10 ft or more) the side panels don't appear as if its been recently waxed/polished. Not even after some more z6", "it looks quite dull..."
Maybe your paint underneath the clearcoat is faded? If it is faded --no amount of Zaino will fix that.
Just doesn't make sense to me that up close it is highly reflective like a mirror and 10 ft away it looks dull.
I often see other white vehicles that look brighter than mine but not shinier. The highly reflective mirror like shine that Zaino gives reflects whatever the surrounding objects and sky are. On a cloudy day with a gray sky my white vehicle will look gray in appearance but is still very shiny. A white vehicle next to it often would look brighter but not shinier.
And I always lurk in here. Ya never know what you can learn.
very nice shine on a Zainoed 89 T bird
WARNING! The following is a side note not directly related to Zaino. Some may want to skip right over this.
A while back I stated the danger in using high pressure washers and a couple of posters disagreed. Here is quote from the Lincoln LS board (specifically post #6678): "The other day I took My LS to a car wash to spray the bugs off. I used the pressure washer there and a big ol' chunk of paint flew off the bumper. Will this be covered under the warranty?" Good question.
Be careful out there.
I'm not sure what a "Lincoln LS" is, nor am I sure about how the folks at Ford paint their cars, but even the paint on a Kia or Saturn (are these the current standards for crappy cars??) should not fly off the car under any kind of a stream of water, regardless of the pressure.
I'd sure be raising hell at the dealer's office right now. I hope the owner does that, and I hope he gets some good service. I've owned 2 Lexus cars in the past 10 years, and I know if something like that happened to me (as if Lexus paint would just fall off the car) the dealer would be falling all over himself to make it right real fast, and see that I had a swell loaner while the problem was being fixed.
That should just not happen. It seems very rare to me. I have not heard of this before.
Why don't you read the posts and contribute something of substance relative to our disagreement rather than posting useless observations that you don't back up?
Again I ask you to explain this statement,"and using Sal's words as weapons!!"
Show me some quotes where keyrow or I "used Sal's words as weapons."
On Autopia you offer my good friend Bill(DK) samples of Blackfire and Finish First. Bill is about the most vocal Zaino user I know. On this forum you behave like a child.
I'm happy to send him samples of the products I own because he is a generous person trying to do good things for others (i.e. Viking group buy). I respond to generosity by beng generous. I respond to childish behaviour similarly.
In my conversations with actual paint chemists (yup, we have a few of those around here!), the impression I get is that very little, if any, oil would actually be absorbed into the coating during the process of buffing the coating with a mild abrasive/oil mix. First - auto coatings are highly crosslinked and not very porous. Second, it's a multi-layer system (at least a primer, topcoat and clearcoat) so the chances of anything penetrating farther than one coat (the clearcoat) is incredibly slim. Also, the time that the oil is actually in contact with the coating would make any absorption very unlikely. It would take a long time (and probably a lot of pressure) for an oil to absorb into the surface.
So - why in the previous "test" (one side polished with an abrasive/oil mix, other side sanded with newspaper) did the "oiled" side come out shinier? Probably because it was polished to a smoother surface. Gloss is a measure of the surface roughness of the film - the smaller the bumps and ridges, the higher the gloss. It's highly likely that the newspaper didn't buff the one side to as smooth of a finish.
I'm not a photo expert, so I'm not sure what angle a light meter uses - but typical angles for measuring gloss of coatings are 20, 60 and 85 degrees (with higher angles producing "higher gloss"). I've actually weathered Automotive coatings and measured gloss as a function of weathering time. After a very long test time, the gloss of the coatings I tested (different primer/coating/clearcoat systems), any decent quality system showed very little change in gloss. Of course, the test was controlled and the panels were only subject to high temp, UV light, and moisture. In real life, abrasion from flying dust, debris, etc will roughen up the paint surface which will decrease gloss. Polishing tends to "re-flatten" out the surface and thereby increase the gloss once again.
Any questions, class?
-Jason
When I originally read that Sal was developing a quick drying agent I assumed it would automatically be incorporated into the polish. Obviously, this cannot be done or Sal needs another revenue generator. I just think that this process for quicker drying time is not what this product needed and too time consuming to use. Critics of Z already complain about the effort needed to use and this will simply add to that fire.
On another note, the car with the Z applied over Carnuba continues to perform as well as the one where the Z procedure was followed.
I'm no chemist, but judging from the directions, I also expect that the ZFX additive cannot be mixed into the other products on a long term basis, making incorporation of the quick drying/curing agent impossible. The mixing appears to start a chemical reaction that consumes itself in a short time period. I think it's like that epoxy glue stuff that comes in two tubes, and you have to mix them together just before you use them.
I don't have a problem with the product. I have received it, and think the little bottles are cute, and the directions for use seem clear. After I try it, probably in a few months when it warms up a bit, you'll get a full report.
Keep us posted on that Carnuba deal; maybe Sal has been wrong all these years in suggesting that the wax be removed with Dawn before applying Zaino.
Anyway, being an engineer for a paint company, I couldn't live with myself if I didn't put my 2 cents in.
The bottom line is: do what makes you happy. If light sanding with oils works for you, so be it! And you're right - the better the surface prep, the better the final product.
-Jason
FYI - Excite has been having problems with their new e-mail servers and I cannot reliably read e-mails until their issues are resolved. Also I need to install CAT5 and RGB6 in my new house before drywalling. So if you've sent me a note please be patient. I always respond to personal communication.
There was absolutely no benefit and no value to this topic room with your post #3234 but you posted anyway. Why be different now?
Joebob - We both know he can't answer the question because neither of us did what he asserts, and it has now become obvious that he is too shallow to admit it.
You both can call me all the names you want if it makes you feel superior.
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'can't we all just get along?'
I have no idea of what your motivations are regarding my posts but I guess I shouldn't expect a reasoned, mature explanation from you. My respect for you is at an all time low.
Bushwack - I can get along..... just ask PJ.
And I haven't broken my New Year's Day promise either.
>Just placed an order for Zaino, been using it about a year. But I did not order the >ZFX for (or whatever it is called) a few reason. First, price, no doubt this will receive >much criticism. Second, I don't have a problem with drying time. Third, the mixing >process as described above seems to be a pain and the contents must be used >quickly etc.
>===============
I agree with armtdm on this. I too, never had a drying time problem with Zaino products and mixing little bottles of ZFX only to throw them out, seems as senseless as waxing the car every four weeks. =;-0
He was just making a joke.
On a related note, I applied Zaino for the first time last weekend (Z5/ZFX x3). My shine is getting better by the day. It was somewhat dull and matte at first, but now it is getting brighter and more reflective with each passing second. I was skeptical about the whole Zaino thing, but I must admit that I am very impressed and happy with my Zaino. Has anyone else noticed this phenomenon?
Keyrow - Please re-read all your posts starting with the first one about oils. Look at them from a perspective other than your own. Take special note of how many times you referred to Sal by name and link that reference to your arguement. You will then see what I mentioned in my little joke. Feel free to extend this exercise to Joebob's posts too.
If you want to continue discussing your comments directed towards me, I would prefer to do so offline. But I think this conflagration should end in here. You made your points, you had your disagreement, I had my little laugh, it's over.
Have a great weekend, everyone.
In post #3206, Joebob rebuts your assertion with his own statement which begins..."Sal has stated many times that after using a product like 3M Swirl Remover..."
It is clear, thefrefore, that you are both citing Sal to support your point. This is what Bretfaz was referring to when he says that two Zaino users are fighting, "and using Sal's words as weapons."
Guys, please, LIGHTEN UP! You have to admit that what you are doing is funny- two true believers arguing over different interpretations of the Word of Sal.
Discussions like this deterred me from trying Zaino for a long, long time. Now that I have tried it, and love it, I am going to do everything in my power to avoid becoming a "true believer". For some reason, people get very emotional about Zaino.
Please. Has anyone noticed that the Zaino shine gets better for a while after it is first applied? I have noticed this. How long can I expect it to improve? It looks so great now that I can't imagine it could possibly get any better, but it does- every day!
Most definitely...I think it improves anywhere from 3-7 days. Your experience may vary. The cool thing is that if you wash it with Z7 on a regular basis there will be very little, if any noticeable degradation of shine even over a few months.
BTW, arguing over what each of us recollects what Sal said is hardly, "using Sal's words as weapons."
Bretfraz writes:
"My respect for you is at an all time low."
I am so sad that your respect for me is so low. I will probably lose sleep. I have lost the respect from a guy who has referred to me with words such as "zealot", braindead", "needing electroshock therapy" and "crackpot response".
I do not need to stoop to your level and throw out insults. When a person has nothing intelligent to say the easiest thing to do is launch a personal attack as you always do.
"And your dogged insistence of continuous battle with me is every bit as childish as you claim my actions to be."
No argument from me on that point. I don't understand why a guy who has stated he would never use Zaino products spends so much time on the Zaino Topic.
You've done both many times. Welcome to the hellish reality which you helped to create.
Just kidding.
Come on folks, this is not really very nice. All the players involved are big assets to the Town Hall detail topics. IMHO, the first person to stop wins?
-Larry
Bushwack: I did not know that defending one's point (and, for me, eventually admitting I was wrong) is considered to be whining. I never met a true whiner that would admit being wrong. Do you sincerely mean that making multiple posts in an attempt to convince others of one's point is to be considered whining and thus to be avoided? That would eliminate every legitimate discussion everywhere! What would happen to our legal and political systems? (Sarcasm for those who haven't figured this out)
Anyway, there MIGHT be hope yet for anyone who has pictures at photopoint.com. Read this-
http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1005-200-8398159.html
fastdriver
PS NO snow yet in So. CT, but still too cold to Z the car or wash it myself. I have to depend on those "paint removal" wand type/high pressure car washes that I have been using for YEARS with no problems. If the paint on Christine never flew off, I don't think it will happen to my current car.
JUST IGNORE IT!!!! Jeez!
Yep, its still to cold in CT & NY for me to use the new ZFX product. But I'll try to keep up with all these comments, and get ready to use it when it starts to warm up. In facr, my car presently looks like a snow ball from all the road salts that have come my way. A Bummer!
But as I drive my daily commuter to work in the mornings, I try to think up some uses for those wax based products I've still got taking up space in a back closet. Lets see, Turtly Wax makes a great protectant for air conditioner cabinets left exposed during the winter. And you can always wax the floor of your garage to stop those ugly oil drips from staining your cement. Also good on old furniture. And those luggage slides used in airports.
And I also found another use for Z6! My glasses. Yep, the coating on my glasses is all scratched up. After cleaning with ordinary "Joy",
I spray on some ZX and wipe clean. It actually make a difference. No Bret, that's not a scientific test, but just a common sense application.
'Understand they just spotted bin Laden...driving a taxi cab in Brooklyn. Now, to force Omar to surface, I suggest broadcasting re-runs of "I Love Lucy".
And 'till next time, Z-On