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Inconsiderate Drivers (share your stories, etc.)

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Comments

  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel Member Posts: 19,592
    Since when is it safe to stop in the interstate highway because someone has their bright lights on?

    Since when is it safe to tailgate someone with your brights on?

    Also since when is it safe to keep going when you've been blinded by some idiot tailgating you with their brights on?

    I would suggest you buy a car with auto-dimming mirrors. Either that, or stay home at night!

    Mirrors are not the problem, the glare from the high beams flooding your car is. But then someone like me would suggest NOT TAILGATING WITH HIGHBEAMS ON.

    2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • euphoniumeuphonium Member Posts: 3,425
    An extremely bright white light mounted on the package shelf to automatically turn on when the sensor was triggered by following high beams. :P
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,671
    Long ago on I-75 I saw a car slowing to a stop at night with bright lights on the rear of their car that must have been landing lights for airplanes they were so bright. There were 3 or 4 on the rear of a Dodge. I suspect someone flashed their bright lights on him and he turned on the lights and slowed down. He had all 3 lanes of southbound at a dead stop.

    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

  • jwilliams2jwilliams2 Member Posts: 910
    edited May 2011
    If I were you, I would park the car at night. You never know when some aggressive, drunk or senile driver is going to come up behind you with their bright lights on. Or maybe some jacked up truck who's lights are going to flood your car with glare. Much to risky for you to be out at night.

    Tailgating is not safe. Driving with the bright lights on is inconsiderate. I do neither, although I see it all the time here in the Northeast. Stopping on a highway in traffic is moronic. And potentially deadly. Please drive safely. And no need to shout. :shades:
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,408
    Might want to include bulletproof glass with that option ;)

    In Europe where driving is more evolved, cars have had rear fog lights for eons...not understood on the dumbed down side of the pond.
  • oregonboyoregonboy Member Posts: 1,650
    Many times, I have overtaken vehicles on the interstate that are cruising with their brights on. They don't dim for oncoming traffic nor for overtaking traffic. More ofter than not, they are Left-Lane-Campers. :surprise:

    This is particularly annoying when passing them on the right, since the pattern of most headlights is stronger to the right. I generally just speed up a bit to put some distance between us.

    But what is poor Snakeweasel to do?
  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 53,328
    Friday night, was eating at a panchero's (quickie mexican place) which is at the end of a strip mall row, close to the main road and by the main entrance into the center.

    Of course, I am watching out the window at the cars going by. And see a jacked up dodge turning in, but looking odd (and seeing sparks coming from the back). after it comes down the ramp (and turns the opposite way from me), I see that it is all listed over toward the left rear.

    No, not driving on a flat. Driving on the brake rotor or wheel hub.

    yes, the wheel/tire is in the bed, and the dimwit was dragging it along like that. listing like heck, since it had a large lift, and hugely oversized tires.

    he stopped shortly after getting into the lot, and when I left there was a cop parked behind him (probably trying to figure out what to charge him with!), and there was a puddle under the truck, probably brake fluid.

    It takes all kinds.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

  • jwilliams2jwilliams2 Member Posts: 910
    But what is poor Snakeweasel to do?

    Here is a suggestion from Corey Hart....

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d_HlTGzkKeE
  • shriftyshrifty Member Posts: 255
    When I initially said about turning high beams on and leaving them on, I was ONLY referring to LLCs who refuse to move out of the way after giving them a chance to correct the situation.

    I would certainly not do this to anyone driving in the right lane, oncoming traffic (unless they don't turn their highs off after I have already switched to low beams), or to someone who is in the process of passing or about to pass.

    I try to treat everyone with the respect they deserve, with the exception of the LLC as they deserve none in my opinion.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    Want to see something funny? Search on "LLC driving" and see what pops up. It appears many driving schools specialize in LLC techniques!

    OK, I know that's not what the "LLC" means. Good for a yuk, though.

    Seriously, though, one thing to keep in mind about LLC... there are situations in which the left lane is NOT the passing lane. Hopefully drivers keep that in mind when they encounter someone driving slower than they'd like in the left lane.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    A theory on why many folks go faster than the speed limit, especially in urban areas in which cruise shouldn't be used: it's too hard. It takes effort and skill to keep a car at the speed limit on the highway. It's a whole lot easier to simply put "pedal to the metal" and go as fast as you please. Doesn't take much driving skill (i.e. you don't have to pay constant attention to the speedometer, so you have more time for swerving from lane to lane, flashing high beams at cars you think are going too slow, keeping an eye/ear on the radar detector, texting, whatever).
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,671
    edited May 2011
    >A theory on why many folks go faster than the speed limit, especially in urban areas in which cruise shouldn't be used: it's too hard. It takes effort and skill to keep a car at the speed limit on the highway. It's a whole lot easier to simply put "pedal to the metal" and go as fast as you please. Doesn't take much driving skill (i.e. you don't have to pay constant attention to the speedometer, so you have more time for swerving from lane to lane, flashing high beams at cars you think are going too slow, keeping an eye/ear on the radar detector, texting, whatever).
    LOL. Ain't that the truth of the problem. ;)

    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,408
    You might be right, it does take a lot of work to convince yourself into self-righteousness and that you have the right to drive in any lane you please. It's much less work to drive with lane discipline that is already agreed upon in the developed world.

    But I would wager the LLCs are generally the less skilled - usually of a demographic with diminished reaction times and situational awareness.

    On this note, there should be special testing and license endorsements for driving vehicles of certain weight and size classes. No more half blind 85 year olds driving 40 foot motorhomes or airheaded 23 year olds driving the largest rental moving truck.
  • euphoniumeuphonium Member Posts: 3,425
    edited May 2011
    Agree with you."there should be special testing and license endorsements for driving Class A motorhomes & further testing for those who refer to them as "Coaches". When the little ol guy goes from driving his Prius to a 44' Country Coach, he's not up to the major adjustment in driving the bus. :mad:
  • shriftyshrifty Member Posts: 255
    Understandable when there is a left exit or a turn, however personal experience shows that most people in the left lane do neither.

    But I do agree, I keep this in mind.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,408
    Not to mention he might have never been able to properly drive the bus. I wouldn't want to drive something like that now, I can't imagine I would in 50 years.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    That's one. There's others though.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 53,328
    throw in in the slammer for a while. Years. she deserves it.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,408
    edited May 2011
    Yesterday saw a white Volvo S80 with a driver I won't stereotype want to make a lane change. So what does it do? Slams on its brakes on a 30mph 4 lane arterial and waits until there is no traffic for a block in the lane it wants. Then dawdles over, then gets back in the lane it was originally in! Drivers licenses for all, no tests, no ability, just pay up.

    Also had terrible traffic yesterday, due to the sun I think - people were driving SLOW, which caused bottlenecks. Highlight in the congestion was a [non-permissible content removed] X5 trying to weave through traffic and always getting caught at lights. A mile of it might have gained him 2 car lengths. Lawyer or financial criminal, I can't decide :shades:
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,923
    OK so what is it about me doing 5 MPH over the speed limit that makes me illegally impeding traffic?

    It is if anyone behind you wants to do 6 MPH over the speed limit, or more. Don't be illegal, let them pass. Slower traffic move right, regardless of speed or MPH over the limit.
    '18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,923
    That if you get high beam flashed or "permanently lit up" you had it coming, you deserved it, and you asked for it. I dont' do it to people that show a little bit of driving skill and an iota of courtesy.

    The brights come on for the relentless LLCer who doesn't know how to get out of the way. He or she definitely has it coming. If you slam on your brakes, you'll be easier to pass!

    I'll let the idiot behind me rearend you as I go on my merry way.
    '18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • oregonboyoregonboy Member Posts: 1,650
    I think that you would reconsider your high-beam tactics if the recipient of your ire turned out to be an unmarked cop. :surprise:
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,408
    Today's winner - "new resident" looking driver in a late W220 S500 4Matic having an animated conversation with his passengers. Going about 25-30 in a 40. Made a nice bottleneck.

    Second place - [non-permissible content removed] in a dirty Grand Cherokee who honked at a woman in a Prius after she honked at him - as he tried to get out of a turn only lane without looking and nearly hit her. Some vehicles and their drivers. Also too many loud lifted trucks out today, and headache inducing droning Nissan/Infiniti V6s.
  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel Member Posts: 19,592
    Don't be illegal

    So I should start doing speed limit?

    What if there is no place to pull over?

    Face it, in that situation I am not illegally impeding traffic

    2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • euphoniumeuphonium Member Posts: 3,425
    Don't be illegal, let them pass. Slower traffic move right, regardless of speed or MPH over the limit.

    if you get high beam flashed or "permanently lit up" you had it coming, you deserved it, and you asked for it.


    Andre forgets the Speed Limit sign trumps his Keep Right sign. He promotes exceeding the limit while proclaiming LLC is illegal. You can't have it both ways. The traffic laws are not subject to cafeteria selection of which to obey and which to ignore.

    Why should a LLC yield to a driver behind him with such an attitude? True, both the LLC and the Speeder are breaking the law, but the fine for speeding is a lot more than $124. ;)
  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel Member Posts: 19,592
    Another thing he should be aware of, many times tailgaters tailgate on roads where it's only one lane in each direction.

    2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,408
    edited May 2011
    "The traffic laws are not subject to cafeteria selection of which to obey and which to ignore. "

    Well, LEOs or their less than accountable superiors select what to enforce and what not...

    And if I am not mistaken, many speeding fines are indeed lower than $124, in WA anyway.
  • tallman1tallman1 Member Posts: 1,874
    edited May 2011
    Andre forgets the Speed Limit sign trumps his Keep Right sign.

    I have shown you info from the WSP and quoted the RCWs that state, in Washington, this is simply NOT true. The speed limit does NOT trump the keep right sign.

    While I don't agree with Andres aggressive behavior, in Washington, if you are driving 5 over in the left lane on a multilane highway and you are holding someone up, you are breaking the law and can get a ticket.
  • tjc78tjc78 Member Posts: 16,938
    The whole LLC conversation is so subjective. For example, I tend to drive with a heavy foot when the conditions allow. The other night on the NJTP, I was in the left lane (two lanes, ea dir) and moving along at about 85 (65 posted). All of a sudden a newer Accord flies up behind me out of nowhere easily 100++. I can't move over as the right lane was clogged up with some big trucks. I wait for an opening (took around a mile) and eventually move over. The whole mile he was about 3 inches from my bumper, and clearly frustrated.

    IMHO I wasn't LLCing, but in his mind I was.

    2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic

  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    Here are some easy gut checks. One can get a speeding ticket with out keeping right or keeping right. One can get a (failure to keep right, impeding traffic) without speeding and vice versa and other combinations. Now it has alway appeared to me that LLCing has never really ever been enforced, despite pretty clear goals and objectives and laws for not LLCing. So defacto, that is selective enforcement.
  • ronsteveronsteve Member Posts: 1,234
    IMHO I wasn't LLCing, but in his mind I was.

    I'm with you on this one. If you're passing people, then that's just the speed of the fast lane at that time and place. Long as you make your pass in a reasonable amount of time, and move over when it's safe to let faster traffic by.

    It all boils down to one thing... Keep right except to pass!
    2015 Acura RDX AWD / 2021 VW TIguan SE 4Motion
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    Yes and no. No because there are specfici reasons and reasoning for it. Yes because at the worst one should change lanes SAFELY. YES because that can mean a whole lot of things and ranges.
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,923
    I think that you would reconsider your high-beam tactics if the recipient of your ire turned out to be an unmarked cop.

    A cop would never drive so poorly and illegally so as to draw the ire of my high beam tactics ;)

    However, if a cop did drive that badly, then he is the one that deserves the ticket, and I'm just illuminating the way for the cop behind me to ticket the cop in front of me.

    Oh, how lame that "professional courtesy" is extended to all law enforcement and firefighters so that they never get any tickets.
    '18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,923
    edited May 2011
    Andre forgets the Speed Limit sign trumps his Keep Right sign.

    No it doesn't. They are both laws and one doesn't take precedent over the other. The keep right let faster traffic pass on the left laws say nothing about excluding the requirement if your driving the speed limit.

    Why should a LLC yield to a driver behind him with such an attitude? True, both the LLC and the Speeder are breaking the law, but the fine for speeding is a lot more than $124.


    Not really, I got a speeding ticket not long ago which wasnt much more than $124 (I think $168) and that's with all of CA's ridiculous fees and costs thrown on top of the fine. As long as you don't get written up for 15 or more over the SL and dont' have points on your record, it'll be low cost on the fine. The high cost comes from the insurance scam of having your rates go up for irrelevant tickets. Of course you can avoid that by paying a bribe to the gov't and court of "traffic school fees" of around $50 and also to the judges son's ran traffic school fee of anywhere from $20 to $60.
    '18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • euphoniumeuphonium Member Posts: 3,425
    There are three or more cars in the passing lane. "A" car is in the lead followed by cars B,C, & D. If you are driving Car D do you wait until C & B have passed A or do you think C & B should get out of your way? If so, why?

    Car B is happy to follow A because the lane is smoother & keeps up with A's speed. Car B doesn't feel guilty about his position because he believes Cars C & D must wait their turn. Meanwhile Car B, happy where he is, does not make any road rage communication with Car A.

    Is this Double LLC and what can you do about it while in Car D?
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,923
    So I should start doing speed limit?

    What if there is no place to pull over?


    First answer is no, you should not slow down unless your intent is to move over immediately to the right, but even so, better to speed up with the pass and let others pass after you.

    Second answer is if there is no place to pull over you must be talkinga bout a one lane highway (or 2 lanes if you consider oncoming traffic). In that situation simply get out of the way at the nearest turnout.
    '18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,923
    IMHO I wasn't LLCing, but in his mind I was.

    Hard to believe you had to pass 1 full mile of trucks before you could find a spot to let him pass. It would be more believable if it was 1/2 mile.

    But, if your going 85, then your passing each and every truck fairly quickly, so in this case, your reasonable, as long as you didn't slow to 84 while he was riding you (in order to conserve gas I'm sure :P )
    '18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • euphoniumeuphonium Member Posts: 3,425
    Andre says:The high cost comes from the insurance scam of having your rates go up for irrelevent tickets.

    All tickets are relevent in the eyes of the law. It is NOT a scam when the insurance companies use different driving records to charge different premiums for a wide range of quality drivers. Insurance is a risk transfer process you need & the law requires financial responsibility. In WA, you can drive w/o FR, but it is against the law to be involved in a crash w/o FR. Ignorance believes: (If it is highly technical & not understood, it must be a scam.)

    Your credit rating is also a rating factor in computing your premium = good.
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,923
    Okay, if your going 99 down the passing lane and I am going 109, it's your legal duty to move over to the right and allow faster traffic by you.

    If your in a Corvette doing 139 MPH, and I'm in an R8 doing 149 MPH, it's still your legal duty to move over to the right and allow faster traffic to pass, get it?

    Now as to your ABCD example.

    Car B is wrong to LLC. You can't follow someone just because you like the smoothness of the passing lane if there is faster traffic behind you; you are impeding traffic clogging up that lane.

    Car C may not want to pass Car A nor B and will simply move right immediately after passing slow Truck Z?

    If Car C wants to pass Car B and/or Car A, they may, and should do so reasonably quickly. This is why it is so important for Car A and B to obey the law, and move over to the right to allow faster traffic to pass.

    In this way everyone gets to where they are going faster, more quickly, and safer. When car A or B breaks the law, it causes commotion and hysterics. Car C or D may pass on the right, on the shoulder, and on who knows what, when all could be avoided by simply not LLCing.
    '18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,923
    In WA, you can drive w/o FR, but it is against the law to be involved in a crash w/o FR. Ignorance believes: (If it is highly technical & not understood, it must be a scam.)

    I'm not against rating insurance risks. I simply believe correctly that the amounts of tickets the typical driver has has little to no correlation to the insurance risk they pose. The traffic laws in CA are so poorly enforced, that any correlation is pure coincidence. Speeding tickets are so arbitrary that most people with speeding tickets on their record have no record of accidents. Meanwhile, many who have no tickets on their record are causing the majority of accidents (at fault mind you). There are exceptions (like someone who has 10 tickets is probably more likely to cause an accident) , but I see no evidence from the Insurance companies that all tickets correlate to increased risk. Certainly, some tickets probably correlate more then others, but how come they dont' make a distinction between types of tickets and the insurance rating? It's either no points, one point, or two points or more. They mostly look at the points, not the tickets, it's just an excuse to charge more.

    I'm all for reasons to charge less, but I don't agree with every reason they use to charge more. Especially when you have collusion between the industry with the provision of free radars and equipment to police departments, coming from you know who, the auto insurance industry. Now is that a donation or a business investment!!!! hahaha.
    '18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,923
    All tickets are relevent in the eyes of the law. It is NOT a scam when the insurance companies use different driving records to charge different premiums for a wide range of quality drivers.

    Using accident records to show driving record to show quality of the driver is acceptable. Using citations to show quality of the driver is unacceptable as enough studies on the subject have not been performed because those studies would be unfavorable to the insurance industry in regards to using citations to rate drivers. Some states may have better enforcement then others. Running red lights might correlate to more insurance risk than speeding. Where's the data to support the premise?
    '18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,408
    IMO there is definite collusion between traffic law enforcement strategies and the insurance empire.
  • ronsteveronsteve Member Posts: 1,234
    The places I've seen this most are Wisconsin, and the Pacific NW... there is this "entitlement queue" that can get to be 10 or more cars lined up in the left lane to make a pass, and the right lane is wide open.

    There's no give-and-take with some of them, but rather a "my turn" mentality that when Car L decides to use the open right lane, and based on timing hopes Car D will let him in, no dice... but by this time it's now queued up to Car T and you have to fall all the way to the back.
    2015 Acura RDX AWD / 2021 VW TIguan SE 4Motion
  • euphoniumeuphonium Member Posts: 3,425
    Experience of Claims Departments prove that whoever has the most tickets and or points is the most difficult to defend in the court rooms. Drivers of youthful age piloting high performance vehicles should be given to the Western Association of Risk Plans, otherwise known as Assigned Risk plans.

    "I see no evidence from the Insurance companies that all tickets correlate to increased risk."

    You are choosing to ignore the obvious & that choice is 100% wrong.

    "collusion between the industry with the provision of free radars "

    That quirky assertion is fortunately not FACT. :sick:
  • echothatechothat Member Posts: 8
    I went to my daughter's school this morning, parked out front, and was trapped in my parking spot by the MONSTER SUV's and luxury sedans whose drivers felt that it was okay to speed around me while I was trying to leave.

    I get so tired of drivers thinking that they are the only ones on the road. How tough would it have been to just let me out of my parking spot?

    Finally, I got out of my car, stood in the road with my hand out and got cars to stop long enough for me to back out and be on my way.
  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel Member Posts: 19,592
    A cop would never drive so poorly and illegally so as to draw the ire of my high beam tactics

    While i wouldn't call it poor driving or illegal driving I have seen police drive in such a way that you would use your high beam. Also I find it interesting that you defend one type of illegal driving why blastung another.

    2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel Member Posts: 19,592
    First answer is no

    Well you said to stop being illegal, doing speed limit will would make me legal.

    In that situation simply get out of the way at the nearest turnout.

    Why should I have to inconvinece myself simply because you are impatient? You keep on saying people should drive legally with regards to LLC'ing why don't you apply the same reasoning to speed?

    On a two lane highway sit and wait until you can safely pass.

    2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • euphoniumeuphonium Member Posts: 3,425
    Around here parents drive their kids to school and have them picked up after school. When did kids stop going to and from school by themselves?

    When you arrive early enough for any parking spot, those who parked further away from the event tend to make you now wait for them. And why not?
  • euphoniumeuphonium Member Posts: 3,425
    "Selective Adherance" is the mantra of some drivers wanting certain laws obeyed while they choose to ignore other more valid rules of the road.

    Therefore as the Speed Demon demands the LLC get out of his way, so can the LLC choose to ignore the SD and why not? :P
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