New S40/V50

jchan2 · February 2004

Acura produced a 5-cylinder car. The Acura Vigor.

cotmc · February 2004

I appreciate all the good input here. I've made up my mind to keep my old bimmer for awhile longer and see how this new S40 turns out.

Volvomax: Thanks for all the info. I personally think it will be very interesting to see how the S40 vs S60 situation plays out, before the S60 is redesigned. If I was a betting man, I would bet the S60 isn't redesigned until MY2007. I don't read up on the S80, but my guess is that model will be redesigned before the S60.

6thbeatle · February 2004

for clearing up my misconceptions about the volvo 5-cylinder engine and purportedly bad reliability.
i guess odd numbers of cylinders is not that uncommon, come to think of it, triumph does have a pretty nice motor in their triple, but the old acura vigor and the new colorado seem to me very unattractive packages for prospective buyers, simply by not offering the ubiquitous 6-cylinder that most sports car and truck shoppers want. oh well.

as for reliability problems, i have four acquaintances who drive volvos, and two of them absolutely love their vehicle, but the other two said they would buy a different brand of vehicle next time due to the high cost of parts and servicing. i just figured that 50% bad is too bad for me, as i love the styling of the S60, especially the sculpted rear flanks of the sedan. beautiful!

one of the major italian car magazines voted it the most beautiful car design of the year, and italians know good design when they see it. incidentally, the hyundai tiburon is a huge seller among young italian men.

creakid1 · February 2004

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/?news/ae_news_story.php?id=43187

qbrozen · February 2004

polling 4 people doesn't give you too much of a cross-section. You might want to look towards sources of greater diversity like these internet boards. Which, obviously, since you are here, you are doing. So that's a start.

For instance, I don't personally know a single BMW owner who found their car reliable. If it wasn't for boards like these, magazines, published reports, etc., I would think BMW was one of the worst brands on the market.

6thbeatle · February 2004

sometimes asking four people you know personally is just as valuable as reading the anonymous opinions of fourteen people you don't know at all. i find that many posters contribute facts and opinions that they themselves have based on conjecture and hearsay. if you have read any of my numerous posts in the past, i think you would be aware that my eagerness to learn as much as i can about all cars has more to do with my avid interest as a long-time auto enthusiast than with any neophytic naiivete on the subject.

as for the purported reliability of certain marques, i am familiar with the yin and yang of owning temperamental beasts and the very human bond between emotional driver and seemingly emotional vehicle, having owned a vintage mercedes-benz convertible and a pristine mid-sixties mopar, as well as several motorcycles.

i myself am waiting rather impatiently for the return of alfa romeo to these shores so that i can immediately purchase a new 156 sportwagon in light metallic aqua. if my judgements were based solely on reputation, i wouldn't touch an alfa with the proverbial ten-foot pole.

but the difference between alfa romeo and volvo is that alfa romeo has never professed to build safe and RELIABLE cars, whereas volvo always has, and indeed uses this as a major selling point to justify the comparatively premium price of the vehicles in its line-up.

that is why i am more circumspect when someone seems to be simply repeating the company line; i believe some people unreasonably defend their vehicle as a psychological means to justify their decision to buy it, as noone want to be perceived as being unhappy and stuck with "their" poor choice; of course, until AFTER they get rid of the aforementioned vehicle, at which time the critical floodgates will invariably open.

therefore, i'm more interested in reading the opinions of people who have owned a volvo before, and have bought a second or third one which they are happy with, not just the opinions of someone who reads car magazines, or who once owned a volvo but in reality hasn't owned one since.

creakid1 · February 2004

creakid1 "Volvo S40" Feb 17, 2004 3:58am

But then, the only Volvo we ever had was a unreliable Belgian-built '86 760 Turbo 4-cyl. The water pump failed repeatly & everything inside the car broke -- from the power seat, sunroof, stereo... & the new S40/V50 is also made in Belgium.

qbrozen · February 2004

i totally agree in respect to what you will find on the internet. the trick is both weeding out the suspect information and getting a large enough sample that it dillutes the misinformation.

For example, before buying the S70, I read every post I could find. I decided that the more common complaints that did exist were so trivial in content that it would not bother me if it happened to me. Any major issues tended to be one out of hundreds of posts, so I considered those anomalies (or misinformation) and ignored them.

like you, I also seem to be drawn to cars that some might call temperamental. I own both an Alfa and an S70 at the moment. So if I believed everything I read, I have 2 of the most unreliable cars of all time. LOL. My personal experience, however, tells me otherwise (although, since its visit to the paint shop, my alfa has not been happy, but that's another story).

What I meant to say, though, is that 4 real-life people does not make for a large enough sampling to base a judgement on. Sure, their information should carry more weight overall, but the laws of probability dictate that it won't give you a fair assessment of the population as a whole.

On the Alfa thing. I find peoples' opinions of Alfa most interesting and we've discussed it a little on the alfa board. To keep it short, I have never met an Alfa owner who hated their car and thought it unreliable. Anyone I do meet who says "geez. you own an alfa? yer nuts." and I ask if they have ever owned one and the answer is always "no." So I think this ties into your last paragraph about finding folks who actually own them, drive them, and love them rather than those who are just repeating something they may have heard in passing from their uncle who heard it from his friend's roommate. Its a complicated process to say the least.

jchan2 · February 2004

build quality has improved from the Volvo 760 Turbo.

6thbeatle · February 2004

but the s40/v50 will be built in belgium, and you know what they say about belgians...

wha? oh yeah, those belgians, they sure make good--

chocolate.

i love the new interior. second only to audi. better than VW. but still, a 5-cylinder? even with the hi-po T5 model, i just dunno...

herzogtum71 · February 2004

Re: posts 356-364.

Unfortunately it does look like the V50 cargo volume is significantly smaller than the V40. The main reason seems to be floor-to-ceiling height of the cargo area, which is at least 3½ inches less in the V50 than in the V40 due in part to the floor being higher off the ground. Seems very similar to the design of the Mitsubishi Lancer wagon. I figured this out from a European website by converting the length measurements from centimeters to inches and comparing the results to the measurements in the V40 brochure I have.

Cargo volumes on the European website, when converted from liters to cubic feet, correspond exactly with the Edmunds site and the stats provided in a previous post:
14.7 cubic feet behind rear seat
25.3 cubic feet with rear seat folded down
This is considerably smaller than the European specs for the Mazda6 wagon (18 cubic feet & 60 cubic feet, respectively). As mentioned in a previous post, other countries don't measure cargo volume all the way to the ceiling, and the U.S. specs for the Mazda now are claiming 33.7 cubic feet behind the rear seat. That means that in U.S. terms we can expect the V50 to check in at 27 or 28 cubic feet behind the rear seat, which is a bit smaller than the Toyota RAV4. V40 is listed as 33.5 cubic feet.

I hope I have miscalculated things. Otherwise, this is bad news for anyone with a family who is looking for cargo room behind the rear seat....

quaddies · February 2004

It is mentioned in various reviews of the new S40 and V50 that it will be available in 6 sp manual configurations. This is obviously true in Europe, but I can't seem to confirm this on Volvo USAs website. Perhaps I am mistaken, but are they only going to offer the automatic (Geartronic versions) stateside?

Thanks

dafohosmen · February 2004

The 6 speed will be available as part of the 2005 version. The release of new S40s in a month or so will be called the 2004.5 S40 and will only be available in automatic. Expect the 6 Speed and AWD to be available around July/August

creakid1 · February 2004

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/previews/previews_story.php?id=44236

The car is so good for a Volvo that the engineers must keep the cargo bay small, otherwise who'll need the V70?

herzogtum71 · February 2004

The American articles all had said things like it's a fraction of an inch shorter than the old V40 but otherwise "bigger in every way."

Wish it would get 49.6 mpg US

benjamins · February 2004

We'll see how good the s40/v50 is creakkid. It's obvious you are a big Focus fan and think that anything based on the Focus is superior to Volvo. I think is seeing driving dynamics over other considerations made in purchasing and owning cars. I heard lots of praise for the s60 and v70 dynamics when they were new as well. Time will prove how good these new cars are in terms of durability, reliability, comfort over long distances, and other practical aspects of ownership that car magazines tend not to consider.

I think the priorities are screwed up. It's nice that the v50 may handle well but the purpose of a wagon is to haul things, not necessarily to be sports cars. The Volvo wagon always has been excellent at both hauling a lot of things and towing. Other so-called wagons were just sedans with a hatch, not true wagons. The v70 is an excellent car, lots of towing space, nice ride, solid handling and road manners. There's a lot of reasons why people would buy the larger and more luxurious v70 over the smaller v50, lots of people buy SUVs over better handling wagons for size and perceived safety. It bothers me that Volvo compromised packaging in their newer cars. The s60 has poor rear legroom, not so great visibility, and an unacceptable turning circle, the v70's rear legroom is just OK and now the v50 has smaller hauling space than its predecessor. For many people wanting an affordable, crashworthy wagon, the Volvo v50 may lose out due to having less hauling space than competitors.

creakid1 · February 2004

in El Toro south of L.A.

Front seats: Compare to the nearly identically shaped Mazda3, the steering wheel reaches closer to the driver maybe due to the tiltable thigh alone. The door armrest isn't too low even w/ the seat raised, unlike the 3. The center armrest is a little too low, maybe to preserve the stick's shifting ease. The non-adjustable headrest seems to fit the neck contour but only if you're somewhere around 6'3". The fabric material seems to withstand outdoor dirt well. Mazda3's thigh support seems either shorter or weaker.

Rear seats: Seem identically positioned as the Mazda3 w/ the very un-upscale-like lack of thigh angling up. The Volvo has less leg room but way-less severe on the passenger side. This may be due to the front passenger seat's height/tilt features not found in the Mazda3, which also lacks lumbar adjustment for the passenger side -- typical Japanese. They both have the similarly lack of rear headroom on the sedan, as well as the expected narrow rear visibility.

The "TV remote" center stack is WONDERFUL! You can reach everything -- recirculate mode, etc. -- w/ your long fingers(if you got them) easily while resting your palm on the shifter. This is also the first time I get to see how the wood trim looks like.

One of the sponsor drivers parked a Mazda3 2.3 sedan outside, so I compared the shock/spring by pushing down the corners w/ my body weight. Even w/o reminding myself that the Mazda3 has a less-calm rebound setting, I was able to see the obvious difference that the S40 has a slower calmer shock setting on the rebound. The suspension of the T-5 on stage didn't seem significantly firmer for me to push down than the base S40, while the 3 does. I wonder if this T-5 is set up according to spec.

The test drive line is slow for the auto models, so I only tried the base 5-sp & the T-5 6-sp. No, they're not U.S. spec, as the driver-side mirror is convexed.

There are 2 tracks -- one twistier, the other faster. Neither track included bumps for ride-comfort testing, so I commented it in the questionnaire.

I started out on the twisty track w/ the base first then the T-5, & then the base on the faster track.

Then I went back to the twisty track to repeat the base, & asked a volunteer to video tape me from the back seat.

I was either over confident or over spoiled by the previous drive's T-5 high-performance tires. This time I overwhelmed the wonderful DSC on the base S40 near the end of the ride & hit the cones 3 in the row so I lost further chance to go back to try the T-5 on the faster track. But that was educational & entertaining, too, since I was able to either oversteer or 4-wheel drift the car a little bit from time to time on this final ride.

The DSC can be left on w/o really restricting your speed, just like what CAR said about the Euro Focus I. It's amazing, as I viewed the video, how I twisted the steering wheel badly & the car stays on this narrow course. Leaving the DSC on forever is bad for drivers to learn the real skill & can make them dangerous drivers.

I noticed that there is another setting for the DSC on the dashboard indicator -- something like loosen the rear end. So does that mean, at this setting, the car can allow some oversteer, while the T-5 AWD will allow some power rear slide? Sounds like fun!

Since the track is all wet, I didn't notice anything good or bad about how the steering gives you the feeling of tire grip. The steering is not heavy, so I can't feel a lot anyway, but definitely not zero feel.

qbrozen · February 2004

creaK? how was the car overall? fun to drive? etc? Thanks for the rundown on the DSC, but what about everything else??

benjamins · February 2004

We'll see how good the s40/v50 is creakkid. It's obvious you are a big Focus fan and think that anything based on the Focus is superior to Volvo. I think is seeing driving dynamics over other considerations made in purchasing and owning cars. I heard lots of praise for the s60 and v70 dynamics when they were new as well. Time will prove how good these new cars are in terms of durability, reliability, comfort over long distances, and other practical aspects of ownership that car magazines tend not to consider.

I think the priorities are screwed up. It's nice that the v50 may handle well but the purpose of a wagon is to haul things, not necessarily to be sports cars. The Volvo wagon always has been excellent at both hauling a lot of things and towing. Other so-called wagons were just sedans with a hatch, not true wagons. The v70 is an excellent car, lots of towing space, nice ride, solid handling and road manners. There's a lot of reasons why people would buy the larger and more luxurious v70 over the smaller v50, lots of people buy SUVs over better handling wagons for size and perceived safety. It bothers me that Volvo compromised packaging in their newer cars. The s60 has poor rear legroom, not so great visibility, and an unacceptable turning circle, the v70's rear legroom is just OK and now the v50 has smaller hauling space than its predecessor. For many people wanting an affordable, crashworthy wagon, the Volvo v50 may lose out due to having less hauling space than competitors.

benjamins · February 2004

The one thing that concerns me about the s40/v50 vs. the s60/s80/xc90/v70 is that I want a car with a Swedish Volvo feel. It is a different feel than the German feel. The German feel is a more "glued to the road, on rails" feel and has a particular tautness. The Swedish feel is a more "zen like" relaxed feel, while still taut at times, that can still make its way over the road if you push it. Yes, most German cars are crisper but the Volvo Swedish feel is much more to my liking, to some degree Saab has this as well. Since the s40 is based on a German car's chassis I hope that Volvo tunes it to a Volvo feel and that it doesn't feel German. To me, that's the appeal of Volvo, even though most car enthusiasts like to point out the more precise and firm German feel (though I don't agree that they are necessarily "supple") and seem to prefer it. I'll get to drive the s40 in May at Volvo's total access. The last s40 had a Japaneseish feel to it, but is a decent car.

307web · February 2004

Do they let you take passengers while you test drive?

creakid1 · February 2004

kids entering the facility need adult's signature, although I didn't see them providing child-safety seats.

creakid1 · February 2004

The German feel is a more "glued to the road, on rails" feel and has a particular tautness. The Swedish feel is a more "zen like" relaxed feel, while still taut at times, that can still make its way over the road if you push it...Since the s40 is based on a German car's chassis I hope that Volvo tunes it to a Volvo feel and that it doesn't feel German.

This can be easily tailored mainly by the shock frequency in the compression vs rebound. Although I only get to hand-push-down the Japanese-tuned Mazda3 & the Swedish-tuned new S40 side by side, I did see a good slow rebound movement from the T-5 on stage compare to the Mazda 3S parked outside. But even some Germans have a fairly relaxing ride. While our '86 Volvo 760 Turbo w/ rear self-leveling Nivomat shocks has a disastrous tuning! & the '93 850 also oscillates badly on the road ripples.

sooo.....
creaK? how was the car overall? fun to drive? etc? Thanks for the rundown on the DSC, but what about everything else??



We'll see how good the s40/v50 is creakkid.

Exactly, the s40/v50 is as good as creakkid. ;-) Or should I say, good enough to satisfy creakid. I found this car perfect! Despite the narrow rear visibility. Since I criticize the steering communication on over 95% of the cars anyway, this Volvo is very good. So it is at least fairly fun to drive. The lightness of the steering is needed 'cause if it's any heavier, some people won't be able twist it quick enough as the DSC is taking care of achieving some low-speed sharp turns. According to some magazines, the T-5's steering is over sensitive to cruise in a straight line at very high speed, but I can't tell since I only get to go up to 2nd gear.

The Mazda3's Mazda steering rack is quick & therefore more exciting, but the car also oversteers easily. So it needs the DSC more badly than the Volvo.

The Mazda3 is like an incomplete S40/V50 w/ incomplete traction control/DSC, incomplete front-seats' thigh tilt & lumbar adjustment, incompletely-high front door armrest, incomplete climate control of weak heater & lacking charcoal filter, incomplete sound system of stereo upgrade & excessive road noise , not to mention incomplete 5-star crash rating, & even incomplete smoothness in its exterior flowing line!

The S40 is a car of perfection, although I've yet to test the ride comfort over bumps. It's a car that's most likely to beat the Mondeo-based Jaguar & comparable to the BMW 320i/325i w/o sport suspension. That's why it takes a black-mailing price tag to offer a complete Mazda3/Focus II.

creakid1 · February 2004

The last s40 had a Japaneseish feel to it, but is a decent car.

The Mitsubishi Carsma platform is a typical Japanese design w/ possibly a pathetically-short-travel design. Once the suspension travel is too short to begin with, there's nothing you can do to make it feel Swedish, German, or French. No amount re-tuning on the springs, shocks, bushings, alignment or reposition of mounting points will save you from a getting a shallow ride that just can't absorb deep bumps.

The German-design Focus II does not have a short-travel suspension, plus, unlike the Focus I, there are front & rear subframe to reduce minor harshness. Some German designs such as Mercedes & BMW these days are likely to provide even longer suspension travel than Swedish cars.

creakid1 · February 2004

Since the head/curtain side airbags can reduce the side impact injury/death by a whopping 45%, this is nearly TWICE the safety!

The Passat, A4, 3-series, S40 & Mazda3(w/ ABS) all have it std, but the value-leader Accord would require moonroof, & even leather in most cases. At least, it dropped the V6 requirement this year.

The base Passat included the lumbar adjustment for both front seats. I think the base S40 does, too, or at least for the driver seat. The Mazda3 w/ pwr windows has it on the driver seat. But the Accord requires moonroof & only for the driver seat. & the A4 requires both moonroof & power leather seats. While the 3-series requires the expensive 3.0 engine w/ the premium package. Lucky Canadian 3-series buyers are exempt from this black mail.

But it seems only the S40 has the adjustable cushion height & tilt for the manual front seat(s) std! The 3-series w/ optional sport seats has it, too, but only the AWD model doesn't require the uncomfortable lowered sport suspension. & the lumbar adjustment is, again, only offered w/ the 3.0. model.

Another cheers for the S40!

larsca · February 2004

I just went to the Volvo All Access Drive at El Toro air base in Irvine, and in an otherwise rain filled weekend, I managed to get there between showers. The test track had actually dried up so I got to drive the new S40 on dry pavement.

2.4i
I drove both the 5 speed manual and the 5 speed automatic. For a base version I have to admit I was very impressed with how tight and responsive it was. Compared to let's say a Honda Accord or a Toyota Camry, the base S40 rides very stiff and when thrown through the corners handles like a go cart, and that's without hampering the comfort. I wouldn't say that this 168 HP version is underpowered, but once you try out the 218 HP T5...

T5
This is my kind of car through and through. Let's be honest and up front about that. I've been thinking about getting an S60 T5 for a while (because I can't afford the R) but now I'm actually glad I never bought one since I just found the perfect match for me.

The acceleration doesn't feel as fast as it is due to the flat torque curve. You have full power pulling from 1500 RPM so there's no peak. This makes the engine ideal for paring it up with an automatic gearbox, all though the six speed manual is more fun (and you get about a half a second advantage over the auto on the 0-60 time, if that really matters that much to you). The interior is very quiet, and under hard acceleration you hear a muffled throaty gnarl from the engine. It actually sounds better and louder behind the car.

The handling of the T5 with the sport tuned suspension is tight, as to be expected. If the 2.4i felt like a go cart, this is the F1. Pump the throttle in a corner and the car will start to understeer. Let off the gas and the rear will swing out just enough to remind you that maybe you should slow down a little. But it never gets out of control, unless of course you drive over the limits of physics (creaK?).

The breaks... Well, my wife has a MB C230, and with the break assist we both agree that it's like driving a car with telepathic abilities when it comes to breaking. If you slam the breaks, the car will halt so quick your head will spin. The Volvo, before everyone and their mom had slammed the breaks and break fade had set in, out performed my wife's MB in this area.

For my final test run I loaded up the six speed T5 with three passengers. I didn't notice any difference in handling or performance out on the track, maybe a bit more squealing from the tires on the long far corner turn, but not much else. And according to the 6" 210 lbs guy behind me, there was enough room for him to be comfortable for a trip to Vegas.

I looked briefly on the trunk space and I think it's about the same size as my '94 Accord, and that's pretty good for a car this size.

Final words
I've been a fan of the Infiniti G35 coupe since I first saw one, and it's still a contender for my next car. However, as I get older and my wife and I start talking about kids and all of that, I'm getting more and more concerned about safety and practicability (is that a real word?). The Volvo is certainly safer than an Infiniti (really a Nissan, built to be light weight to have good performance, right?) and with 4 doors and a usable rear seat, it has positioned itself top qualifier for a closer look when it's time to buy a new car. I wasn't impressed by the t-tec seat cloth/fabric, it felt too much like sitting on a wet suit.

And finally a tip
For all you who are going to this event, listen carefully to the announcer and go and sign up for the Michelin lottery the first thing you do. I did, and after a day of fun driving in a fantastic car, I ended up winning 2 two-way radios worth $65! Sunday Feb. 22 was a great day...

creakid1 · February 2004

"And according to the 6" 210 lbs guy behind me, there was enough room for him to be comfortable for a trip to Vegas...I've been a fan of the Infiniti G35 coupe since I first saw one, and it's still a contender for my next car...(The Volvo)with 4 doors and a usable rear seat..."

I'm 5'11", but I can't sit comfortably behind myself in the S40's back seat. Only the passenger side provides enough leg room front & back. & the rear headroom is similarly limited like the sedan version of the Mazda3.

The G35 with 4 doors has this awesome optional rear "dentist chair" w/ sporty posture & usable/comfortable adjustable headrests, but I haven't driven this car, which might only provide, especially the rear passengers, a mediocre shallow ride over bumps.

larsca · February 2004

I'm 6". I like to sit farther up front than most people 5'8", because that's how I like to drive. I feel I have the best possible control over the stearing wheel in that position, and I know that most people prefer the laid back, one arm stretched out and the hand at twelve o'clock on the wheel, looking cool and casual position. That seating position will of course eat into the back seat passenger's leg room. Since I sit more 'up front', that could explain why my buddy in the back seat was feeling like he had plenty of room.

webby1 · February 2004

How was the torque steer?

creakid1 · February 2004

& I didn't notice any torque steer from this one T-5 lap, rest of the 3 laps were w/ the less-torque 2.4.

But, as I took off the T-5, I did notice a one-time throttle time-delay response or maybe just the lack of linear power built-up curve, more like a sigmoidal curve. The car is not automatic, so it's not the tranny doing the delayed response.

larsca · February 2004

You don't notice any torque steer due to the built in electronic "shock obsorbers" in the steering. The torque curve is very flat, so the car accelerates faster than you think. There's no "peak", so you don't get that typical kick when the engine reaches max hp/max torque, and this is what's so unique about this car. The engine's max torque is reached at 1500 and keeps up until 4500, where max hp takes over for another 500 revs and then it's time to shift. This translates to a flat acceleration curve, and it means the car is less 'nervous' compared to for instance, early Saab turbos. (Remember the early 900 Aero, where you might accidentally do a lane change when hitting the throttle in third gear? Yikes!)

The S40 T5 is 'user friendly', but not as exciting as high revving Asian imports. If you like to scare elderly people by revving 8000 just to overtake them in their Buicks, then stay away from the Volvo. But, if you're like me and like to be able to 'hide' the fact that you're accelerating at full throttle from your surrounding, not alerting the local police of what you're up to, then the Volvo is great. It has the torque of a BMW 330, so you can get good acceleration without hitting the high revs. Of course, when you do hit those high revs, you get that wonderful five cylinder gnarl. If it was up to me, I would have made the exhausts larger to the sound would be just a tad louder.

larsca · February 2004

You don't notice any torque steer due to the built in electronic "shock obsorbers" in the steering. The torque curve is very flat, so the car accelerates faster than you think. There's no "peak", so you don't get that typical kick when the engine reaches max hp/max torque, and this is what's so unique about this car. The engine's max torque is reached at 1500 and keeps up until 4500, where max hp takes over for another 500 revs and then it's time to shift. This translates to a flat acceleration curve, and it means the car is less 'nervous' compared to for instance, early Saab turbos. (Remember the early 900 Aero, where you might accidentally do a lane change when hitting the throttle in third gear? Yikes!)

The S40 T5 is 'user friendly', but not as exciting as high revving Asian imports. If you like to scare elderly people by revving 8000 just to overtake them in their Buicks, then stay away from the Volvo. But, if you're like me and like to be able to 'hide' the fact that you're accelerating at full throttle from your surrounding, not alerting the local police of what you're up to, then the Volvo is great. It has the torque of a BMW 330, so you can get good acceleration without hitting the high revs. Of course, when you do hit those high revs, you get that wonderful five cylinder gnarl. If it was up to me, I would have made the exhausts larger to the sound would be just a tad louder.

creakid1 · February 2004

"But, if you're like me and like to be able to 'hide' the fact that you're accelerating at full throttle from your surrounding, not alerting the local police of what you're up to, then the Volvo is great."

I like the fact that the S40 looks like the S60/S80 from behind, not because it's pretty, but fools the cops thinking you are slow. & even if you speed too much, the cops might have difficulty distinguishing your car from the other Volvo's around.

creakid1 · February 2004

"The engine's max torque is reached at 1500 and keeps up until 4500, where max hp takes over for another 500 revs and then it's time to shift. This translates to a flat acceleration curve, and it means the car is less 'nervous' compared to for instance, early Saab turbos."

The similar-characteristic 5-valve Audi 1.8 turbo was being chosen as the smaller engine certified for N.A. because a similar-hp normally-aspirated VR5 VW engine has weaker low end, higher fuel consumption, w/ no better vibration smoothness & is costlier to built. But VW needs to offer such engine at least in Europe because the lack of "max-torque all the way for several thousand rpm" means there's a distinct torque-peak sweet spot &, therefore, auricular tone change to give the driver the feeling of accomplishment & satisfaction as he revs the engine throughout the range.

In the Auto Motor und Sport TV a few weeks ago, there's a prototype electronic kit in Europe called ATD by Pro Drive that allows you to dial from 4 different settings of front/rear torque distribution from setting 0, 1, 2 & 3 on a WRX STi test bed. At setting 3, the car drives like a pure RWD drifter. At setting 0, I believe, it makes the car behaves w/o needing the steering correction in complicated cornering as found in the original WRX STi. So this is a cool 4-wheel-power-drifting car w/ the ESP switched ON!

Unless the T-5 AWD can be programmed to dial the amount of power drift, I'm most likely to pick the FWD S40 2.4 5-sp to satisfy myself, aside from preserving the no-delay right-now firm throttle response of a normally aspirated engine.

creakid1 · February 2004

"The S40 T5 is 'user friendly', but not as exciting as high revving Asian imports. If you like to scare elderly people by revving 8000 just to overtake them in their Buicks, then stay away from the Volvo."

The Acura TSX 2.4 revs quietly & smoothly w/ peak 200 hp around 7000 rpm. Who will get scared being passed by this car?

It's interesting how I didn't like the TSX during the test drive due to "zero" feel of tire grip from the steering, despite a heavy steering. Neither did I like the ride comfort despite long suspension travel. & of course the turning circle makes this cars bulkier than a full-size sedan.

The new S40 is the only car that ever passed all my requirements(save the narrow rear glass) w/ flying color. By testing the shock absorbers of that T-5 on the stage has assured me that the car will have a calm absorbent ride over bumps.

I don't recall the other sedans like the Mazda3, 3-series, X-Type sport, C240 sport providing a plush ride that "glides"(as benjamins pointed out) while handles like a sports car. Thanks, Focus II, for providing such foundation! & thanks to Volvo for the comfy seats, luxury features such as charcoal filter, available premium sound system & perhaps additional sound insulation. The Japanese-tuned shock absorbers in the Mazda3's got to go!

To be honest, the new C-class has a perfect driving position, but not the present 3-series, which forces me to re-contour my posture to fit, even w/ the optional sport seats w/ full adjustment. So the 325i might have difficulty to win my heart, besides, even w/ the std suspension it might not glide as well as the new S40 over bumpy roads/curves!

creakid1 · February 2004

"Of course, when you do hit those high revs, you get that wonderful five cylinder gnarl. If it was up to me, I would have made the exhausts larger to the sound would be just a tad louder."

Doesn't the revving-required S40's 2.4 5-cyl already sound more exciting than the 325i's in-line 6?

creakid1 · February 2004

"I'm 6". I like to sit farther up front than most people 5'8", because that's how I like to drive. I feel I have the best possible control over the stearing wheel in that position, and I know that most people prefer the laid back, one arm stretched out and the hand at twelve o'clock on the wheel, looking cool and casual position."

Heh Heh Heh, thanks to its ultra-close telescopic steering column, even more so than the Mazda3 just like the Mazda6/TSX/C-class, I can rest my left elbow on the beautifully-high door armrest & still able to hang on to the wheel near 9 o'clock position. Unlike the Mazda3, 3-series & especially the VW's, I don't have to tilt the steering wheel all the way high in order to read the gauges, so this "door-armrest to steering wheel" brace can be achieved at my favorite chair-high seating position, thanks to the tall Swedes. That's like really sweet!

bigdaddycoats · February 2004

How much time did you get driving? Were you by yourself or always with passengers? Sounds like you had a great time. I just signed up for the event in Chicago - can't wait.

creakid1 · February 2004

Be there early before the presentation speech so you'll have time to get familiar inside the car parked indoor. & by the time you hop into the test-drive cars, you can tailor your driving position right away.

The only time I took a passenger was when I asked another guest to video tape me from the back seat.

I just realized that it is an excellent promotion video 'cause it's just a home video, & it shows the impossible "abrupt maneuver in the wet". To most people, this is the first time they see something that can't be achieved throughout the human history becoming reality.

Not every DSC/ESP vehicle allows the vehicle-speed to be kept up like this! This is the Focus ESP style, & only cars w/ safe predictable handling can afford to be programmed this way!

creakid1 · February 2004

then you can lap as many times as you want.

If you want one T-5 6-sp ride for each of the 2 tracks, then expect 3 or 4 more 2.4 5-sp laps.

If you want automatic, forget it! I don't know. ;-) But I'm sure you can do at least 2 laps.

They might change that by the time the Chicago event starts. Ours got three 2.4 5-sp on the twisty lap, but only one auto T-5 & one 6-sp T-5. I don't remember if the the faster lap had the same, at least there's hardly any wait for the 5-sp there also.

creakid1 · February 2004

although it was BMW that almost did.

Evolved originally from the most trouble-free car sold in Germany -- the German-built Focus I -- the new S40, I hope, has the potential to provide at least a tolerable reliability not too far from the Lexus.

Believe me, even if it costs more plus more repair than the Mazda3, it's still worth it to drive a "perfected Mazda3".

You know what? I'll be proud to stick a "FORD" oval sign on the trunk lid of my new S40. At least that makes me look young & brave, too. ;-) Besides, this is the closest thing to importing the made-in-Germany Euro Focus II from Europe.

Remember those little emblems on the Isuzu's & Proton's saying the suspension is tuned by Lotus? Well, my Volvo's no ordinary Volvo 'cause its entire suspension & steering design are FROM the Focus II, just minorly tuned by Volvo.

larsca · February 2004

Creakid1, you should upload your video of the event somewhere (and pass on the address to us here of course.) First because I want to see the spin, second because there are a ton of people out there who haven't seen the S40 other than on pictures, so I'm pretty sure there will be a rush for downloading the vid.

bigdaddycoats, I went on a Sunday at 1.30. Maybe because the die hard fans had been there the day before, maybe because it was raining all weekend, I don't know, but for some reason there wasn't that many people there. I got to take the 6 speed T5 around the twisty course 3 times, an automatic T5 once, a five speed 2.4i once, and on the longer course I drove the T5 six speed once and the 2.4i auto once. (I had more fun on the twisty course.) And I had time to look at the Evolve S60R, the XC 90, eat five brownies and win a Motorola two way set. One heck of a day, wasn't it?

creakid1 · February 2004

was shot by a guy who thought I want myself as the main subject, even though I only asked him to show my hands on the steering wheel. & my Sony PC100's stupid small-diameter lens isn't wide enough to cover both me & the road ahead, & only the road to my left. & when I hit the 3 cones, they were on my right so didn't show. & it wasn't a spin, either, but understeer. I never got to spin the S40. Only when the cones passing by on my left side did they show approximately how fast I was going while twisting the steering wheel like mad.

p3dab5 · February 2004

Does anybody have any idea how the AWD system on the S40 will compare with other AWDs on the market, say Subaru's for instance? I have been very impressed with Subaru in winter conditions in the past so I'm wondering if the Volvo will stack up. Thanks!

kens · February 2004

The S40 uses a Haldex system that's basically FWD until the system senses slip. It's advertised to work pretty fast and based on my Drive experiences with the S60 AWD, it does react pretty quickly.

A reactive system will work fine for most on-road applications. However, a proactive full time system like those found on the Subarus (Active and VTD AWD) and Audi Quattro will always have some amount of power going to the rear wheels. These applications will fare better for conditions where there's continuous slip. Also, systems that have more power sent to the rear axle (Subaru VTD, BMW, G35) will also allow for a more neutral/oversteer tuning that typically translates into more "sporty" driving. However, based on the intial reviews of the S40, it does seem to fare pretty well as a FWD vehicle.

Ken

creakid1 · February 2004

I'd get jealous if the AWD S40 T-5 can be modified w/ this future kit ATD from Europe to redistribute torque in its ESP system for power drift fun, but I really prefer normally aspirated engines. & this 2.5 T-5's low end is already so much stronger than the 2.4.

People started to ask me, in terms of output, are the new S40 2.4 & T-5 comparable to the 325i & 330i, respectively. Well, the T-5, yes, but not the 2.4, whether you're talking about the fat-torque 323i or the peakier 325i.

The price difference b/t the 325i & 330i similarly equipped is like $5k, but it's only about $2k b/t the S40 2.4 & T-5 when both are equipped w/ the same suspension & 16" wheels.

How tempting it is to upgrade to the T-5!

Maybe the 2.4 w/o turbo will last longer than the 2.5 w/ turbo? Any comment?

creakid1 · February 2004

I can't believe Volvo grouped the options I don't want w/ super discount while charges a fortune for the ones I want. The expensive moonroof & leather at $1200 a piece cost only around $2200(Premium Package) together w/ memory pwr driver seat, dual-zone auto climate control, wood panel & leather shifter all thrown in for "free". Except the last two little items, I don't want any of those clumsy luxury stuff. & I can't believe the expensive front-spoiler/fog-lights Sport Package w/ nearly identical suspension & same-size wheels costs $750 & doesn't include the leather shifter. So by the time I add it to the $695 stability control(Passat only charges $280), the $895 13-speaker sound system(w/o XM radio until maybe '05) & the $695 bi-xenon headlights, that'll cost $3035! & maybe I want to add the $450 metallic paint(which is free for the sister Mazda3 or even the luxury Passat). Boy, I better forget about adding another package just to get the compass. & forget about the nice-looking rear spoiler?

I guess I'm waiting for the '05 5-speed. I wonder how much less is the 5-sp manual vs the 5-sp auto?

stickguy · February 2004

based on the pricing for the S60, the manual s/b about $1,200 less than the geartronic.

I personally am anxious to see if a V50 T-5 6 speed FWD will be available for '05, and how much it will be.

And proving the old adage different strokes for different folks, I would get the opposite options from Creak. I have to have the moonroof, and want the leather and 8-way power seats (the luxo goodies), but wouldn't pay the money for the Xenons, VDC or the stereo upgrade.

One option: wait for the S40 to be available for Euro delivery. One can configure a car much differently. I looked into this a few years ago on the 60, and it was like an ala carte menu. FOr instance, you could get a base car w/power passanger seat, and some other US package items could be gotten individually.

Hmm., a trip to Sweden next April over spring break to pick up a V50..

webby1 · February 2004

Is this for real ?

http://www.news40.vcc.volvocars.se/tease/default.asp

larsca · February 2004

No, it's not real. It's an ongoing ad campain complete with commercials and everything in the UK. You can go to volvocars home page in England and watch the whole commercial.

In my humble opinion it is a pretty poorly executed idea for a commercial, but then again - Volvo's marketing team have had a lot of success lately so who am I to question their judgement?

New S40/V50

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