Yep, it's a shame. Full-Size has come to mean "Super-Size."
I really think with all these trucks getting larger and larger, that there is a market for a good small car-based truck. Utes sell quite well overseas, and with fuel prices sky-high here, they should sell well here too; but again, the product must be right.
Subaru's instincts with the Baja were correct. However, their aim was off, and they just missed the bullseye. In fact, they missed the whole target...
Yeah I'm not sure that the young at heart older surfer audience was really worth going after. Maybe the actually young surfer as a target. I can see weekend warrior DIY's and gardeners being targeted. I can even see outdoorsmen as a target.
It needs a better switchback system like the Avalanche and more width to carry a 4X8 sheet of plywood. Well. basically what we talked about before.
an entry-level Baja X, like the Forester X with the Forester X steel wheels, no moonroof, and unpainted cladding.
There something very (visually) appealing about a Ford F-250/350 Super Duty in bare-bones trim, with black grille & bumpers, black hubcaps and steel wheels. It just looks no-nonsense and work-ready. I'd like to see Subaru offer a Baja with that kind of no-nonsense and work-ready look.
Of course, it wouldn't hurt if there were more "utilitarian substance" to back up the look too...
I know mine is the minority opinion here but I still think the Baja is perfectly suited for the majority of folks who opt for Avalanches and Sport Tracs (due to macho image concerns). There's a weekend gardening show on a local radio station and Subaru has a deal with the host to promote their vehicles. For a while they gave him a Forester to drive but now he has a Baja and he does an excellent job of extolling the virtues of the Baja as the ideal vehicle for the weekend gardener (transporting bags of mulch, plants, etc). I know being able to claim that your vehicle can carry a few sheets of 4x8 plywood sounds good in theory but honestly, how many people really ever use that capability? I've done a home improvement project or two and in 15 years of home ownership, I've only once needed to carry plywood. To me it's the same as low-range gearing, a nice to have feature but one that only a small fraction of owners will ever use and therefore not really worth the additional development/production costs.
I agree, I also think the Baja could also benefit from some of the features on the Nissan Titan--factory spray-in bed liner, cargo tie down tracks, and wheel well storage etc.
I also think it is a necessity that it have lots of low end torque. Nobody who shops for a truck wants a weak little spirited engine in their truck. They want hauling ability that only a properly tuned gas or diesel engine can deliver. I also think that gas mileage is key to its success. That's basically the advantage to a small truck--decent utility without sucking your wallet dry.
Subaru n/a gasoline engines seem to be tuned for high-end operation. The turbos help, but lowers fuel economy. I think that an up to date (direct injection, 4 valves per cylinder, common rail or better design) properly executed turbodiesel boxer engine is critical to the Baja's success in providing the low-end performance truck buyers demand while delivering econocar-like fuel mileage plus durability.
Another improvement would be backs to the seats of rubber or plastic for messy stuff like in the Toyota Matrix, and also fold flat passenger seat to accomodate longer cargo as in the Matrix. Better yet, an interior you could hose out; maybe only on the X trim level.
I know being able to claim that your vehicle can carry a few sheets of 4x8 plywood sounds good in theory but honestly, how many people really ever use that capability?
If nothing else Frank, it's symbolic. One of the problems with Baja is that nobody takes it seriously. As you say, it's good for a few bags of mulch, and not much else. If the Baja were able to carry 4x8s, it would say to those in the light truck market, yes this dog can indeed hunt, and that it's not just another driveway queen.
Another point, for those who do occasionally carry 4x8s, a full-size truck is their only option. I think it would be great to offer those customers another alternative. For every 4x8-friendly Baja sold, could mean one less Dodge Ram, et al sold.
I love the idea of the turbodiesel. It would help to make up for the loss in gas mileage in having a turbo.
Carrying a 4x8 sheet of plywood for me an infrequent event but I definately agree with the argument that the capacity to do so would be a significant marketing aid. I would purchase a Baja without that capability knowing that for those infrequent events I would make do. It is true that most people do not and will not ever carry a 4x8 sheet of plywood or drywall but most people don't live in the practical "how often will I" but rather the "I might someday" or it offers some form of bragging rights that they COULD. Or in the ego world it helps them to feel like someone can't disparage their vehicle for not being macho enough and being unable to carry plywood.
In my opinion, For the most part, those that regularly need 4x8 carrying capacity also need a bit more of a rugged vehicle like a regular truck.
For now, I think the surfer crowd is a lost cause except as a secondary niche. Weekend warriors and gardeners eat this up. They are practical and recognize the utility of the small bed for what they do and enjoy the ride and fuel economy of the car aspect.
I can see that it would be more appealing to the "surfer" or much younger crowd with some different options like the washable interior, etc. That could open up that market more than the Baja has.
Me, I would buy if the Baja were put on the new legacy platform with updated styling. This would lighten the Baja enough that perhaps the normal engine won't feel so anemic. For me, given the weight of the Baja and the fact that I do enjoy an occasional sporty jaunt, Turbo is a big plus. For the most part I just want to know with utmost confidence that I can get out of my own way if I need to.
I prefer the leather option with the kids and the feel as well as the car-like ride... those are things that also appeals to the garden/weekend warrior crowd. So I guess I fit in that category
I have been watching the Baja for some time now and will likely eventually get one before they stop production, but like others, I am hoping for the few additional things (aside from working to keep my 1 car payment rule) to tip the balance. One of those things was the locking hard cover for the bed and another being the Turbo. Now I am looking at cost to operate with the low (from a car perspective) advertised gas milage on the Turbo. Turbodiesel could easily be the answer to that.
As for having the switchback instead of the passthrough. Again this is, to me, one of those things like the bed that can carry a 4x8 sheet. Great for bragging rights or to combat the "I wish it had x like the Avalanche" syndrome. But again, to me it would be seldom used and I could make do without when it could have been used. It is one of those things I tend to put in the category of if someone needs that feature, they probably would have needed out of the Baja (in terms of ruggedness or utility) than the Baja could offer even if it had that feature.
Again, having the ability to carry 4x8s would set it apart from all other small trucks, and as was just mentioned a GREAT marketing aid.
So what if it's rarely utilized? Subaru needs to set this vehicle apart from the crowd, but at the same time it needs to show that it can handle virtually all the common tasks a handy homeowner might ask of it.
I of course realize that perception and image drive sales far more than practicality and reason (which is why the Baja hasn't done well).
yes this dog can indeed hunt, and that it's not just another driveway queen
Bob- To me the definition of a driveway queen is a vehicle that is never used for the purpose for which it was designed (such as the Avalanche or any Jeep, and yes I know there are exceptions). Therefore, the Baja as it's currently configured is the furthest thing from being said queen.
IS WAY TOO NARROW to be useful as a truck. I've said it before and I'll say it again, they need a larger/wider platform that they can make a crossover, full size sedan and baja-like truck out of.
Agreed Mike. That's why I and others would love to see the next-generation Baja—if there is a next-generation Baja—to be built off the (assumed to be) wider Halifax platform, and not the new Outback platform.
Ok, will the people who actually surf raise their hand? Thank you. ;-)
IMHO, one reason that the Baja never "took off" with this crowd is the lack of space. Since you have to put the surfboard in the back, it doesn't leave much room for wet and sandy gear. I'm convinced that when I had my WRX wagon with a Thule cargo box, I could get more cargo in there that I ever could with a Baja.
When I pull up to a surf break, most of the vehicles are SUV's. Everyone from teenage surf rats to surfing doctor's and lawyers are driving SUV's. Even the "Toerag" is advertised in Surfer magazine. I have only seen a couple of surfers with Baja's but many more with Outbacks.
Ok, will the people who actually surf raise their hand? Thank you. ;-)
If my daughter were typing this, she would raise her hand. When she was looking at new cars recently, I asked her about the Baja, and she dismissed it immediately. Reasons? Looks, lack of (or minimal) security for her board. One of the reasons we were looking at the Forester, RS wagon and CRV was that she could get her board "inside" the vehicle, and not on the roof or in the pickup bed using the switchback.
The only problem with keeping a board inside of a car is you don't want to do it for very long on a hot day. The wax will melt and get all over the place.
If I happen to grab lunch while carrying my board, I just park where I can see my car.
[OT] BTW, there was a little article in Surfer mag. about carrying surfboards. They said that fins up nose toward the front was better aerodynamically (like you said), but most surfers in a poll carried fins up/tail front.
i use the honda odyssey for surf trips. forget the image thing, this soccer dad loves the amount of stuff i can do with a minivan the size of the odyssey.
throw the board in back, change clothes inside easily, etc
I just read the 2005 Forester with the MT5 will be rated at 23/30, that's great!
Keep that up, in fact all the 2.5l engines in the lineup should get throttle-by-wire and a similar improvement in MPG.
Bob - I am at the beach, most surf boards are just on some sort of roof rack. Even pickups have home-made racks with boards on them. But honestly I think that's a tiny market mostly about IMAGE, Subaru wants city folks and country bumpkins to *think* surfers drive Bajas.
Honestly? Most surfers drive 10 year old rusted out SUVs or pickups.
for an integrated electric trailer brake control for Subies!
For '05 upgraded Ford's Super Duty pickup (finally!) offers such a feature! This apparently is an industry first—which is hard to believe, given the fact that these trucks are almost always seen pulling a trailer of some sort. Why it took so long is beyond me?!?!
Now it could be argued that for vehicles such as the Super Duty, that this type of feature makes a whole lot of sense; but maybe not so for Subarus. I obviously disagree. If Subaru is going to advertise (which they do) increased towing of 2700/3000 for the new Outbacks, such a feature would go a long way to help owners realize those numbers safely.
Whine whine whine....... You want to carry a big stick, get a damn roof rack. I am not sure if there is a baja spec rack yet, or more importantly a cab for the bed. People with filthy dogs dont want them in the back seat, so a cab is the best bet. Better than a wagon cause the dog hair doesn't migrate around the cab. (I have never been in the back seat of my month old leg wagon, and the seats are allready covered with long white hair from my English Setter. Grrrrrrrrr.) I think there is a furture for the baja. Turbo is fine, turbodiesel is fine once it can be trusted. Look at the mpg of the competition. Our suburban gets about 13mpg, on the highway,(granted it is geared down for towing). That makes 21 look pretty thrifty. I think the problem with Baja is that Toyota undersells it in the small truck niche, and is reliable. Baja needs to work hard to find a following. Maybe it won't work, or maybe Subaru should just keep the production runs low, and wait.
Not my style but I would go for the locking hard cover for sure... help with fuel economy and range of utility to an extent. I can definately see times where I might have something back there that I don't want to get wet. Other times where I want the ability to carry larger things, I want to have the option to take the hard cover off. Taking the cover off would also facilitate the cleaning out of the bed after hauling dirtier items.
all the US Full-size trucks are pre-wired for it. No need to include the actual controller as there are a ton of different styles etc that can handle 2-4-8 axles etc. I would prefer to get a good controller than a generic one that will likely be a compromise (like tires) when the manufacturer decides which one to get for you.
I saw a Chevy S-10 with crew cab and short bed in the parking lot today and it got me to wondering again why the Baja wouldn't be a better choice for most buyers. The Baja's cargo area isn't significantly smaller than that of any of the short bed crew cab trucks but the Baja rides better, handles better, accellerates faster and gets better gas mileage (even with the turbo). About the only thing I can see where the trucks have an advantage is in the towing dept but that should only influence 5-10% of the buyers. Which brings us back to the image thing. The Baja isn't a truck (despite Subaru's EPA classification) and therefore is obviously too "sissy" for Joe six-pack to be seen driving.
The Baja isn't a truck (despite Subaru's EPA classification) and therefore is obviously too "sissy" for Joe six-pack to be seen driving.
I think you nailed Frank. Too many (pickup) truck owners are too concerned about image, than really what fits their needs. It's interesting if you compare the looks and marketing of pickup trucks to that of full-size vans. Both are trucks, with many similar capabilities, yet only the pickup's advertising/marketing/styling is injected with a full dose of "machismo."
Contractors are often asked to tow a variety of trailers, so I don't think having an in-dash factory unit will be an issue. Besides, Ford knows this, they know their trucks may be asked to tow a variety of trailers, so I'm sure they've built into the unit answers for any and all contingencies. They've got too much riding on this to offer an inferior brake controller.
I'm just happy to see a truckmaker realize there is a need for this, and have finally offered a solution. I hope Subaru does the same.
Well the thing is it's not so much you need a specific one for a specific trailer, it's more a preference. There are various types of systems that are used to activate the brakes: momentem, brake pedal, etc so it's more a personal preference that i'm concerned about, like I said you are stuck with whatever they give you, like tires it's probably the cheapest/economical unit overall, not your personal preference.... It's a cool idea but more a gee-whiz one than anything else.
Mike- The S-10s cargo box is only 14 inches longer (55 vs 41) than the Baja's while the Sport Trac's is only 9 inches longer. No doubt both are a couple of inches wider also but I consider them to all the in the same league. Especially when it seems that the ability to carry a 4x8 (96 inches in length) is the "true" test of utility.
As for me, I am exactly the profile for the people buying the Baja. I see the Baja being bought by 2 types of people for the most part:
1. Older gardener/DIY types looking for a vehicle which can serve that light utilitarian need while giving the comfort and economy of a car. For them a machismo image is less of an issue.
2. Those people that like "quirky" or "different" vehicles that are not your mainstream Camry or Accord looking vehicles. A factor of self expression. For them, the "quirk" is part of the image.
I am a practical weekend DIY kind of person who likes a unique "quirky" vehicle.
Unfortunately for the future of the Baja, this vehicle isn't typically marketed to either of those types. The Baja has been bought by those types who happen to be seeking a new vehicle, not those for whom advertising needs to sway their emotions into purchasing this vehicle. A lot more gardening or light DIY types could be swayed to purchase if the advertising was geared towards catching their attention.
And that brings up the final injustice to the Baja. Where is the advertising? It is such a new and unique vehicle, that for it to catch on, it would need to be advertised. SOA did very little that I know of to advertise the Baja in any meaningful way. And for the little they did, unfortunately it was to the wrong niche. One TV ad focused on the Baja, geared towards the niches listed above could make for a huge boost for the Baja.
It's almost a Catch-22 situation. Should Subaru spend scarce advertising dollars on a vehicle that isn't selling? But then if the public doesn't know that a vehicle meeting their needs exists, they won't know to look for it and won't buy it, which means Bajas will remain on the lots unsold.
Over at nasioc, a German poster said that he was recently at a German Subie dealer, and there were two 6-speed Legacy Spec-Bs there (black sedan & silver wagon), and appeared to have been driven a fair amount, given the amount of bugs on the front end and windshield. So it appears SOG (Subaru of Germany) is field-testing the cars. My understanding is they would hit European dealers sometime in the fall.
Hey SOA, how 'bout sending that 6-speed H-6 wonder over here too!!
Price it below the VDC, and I think it could sell.
The turbos mate up sooo nicely to the manual tranny, though. Seems like there's no need. And I doubt it would be quicker than a GT manual, so it might be a hard sell.
Maybe if it had VDC and perhaps a Nav or HID option, to distinguish itself a bit.
I really like the looks of this car. I'm hoping Subaru will offer something in this size range. I think they already have set a styling precedent with the R1e. That could easily be scaled up to this size, but with a sub-2.0L engine.
According tot the link, MB is planning to offer a 2.0 turbo version of this car! Could you imagine a WRX engine in a vehicle like this?!?! Yummm!
I agree with [aarestad #1803] post. Where is Subaru's advertising? I think they targeted the wrong audience. Subaru needs to compare the Baja to other vehicles and highlight its utility features.
I have hauled in my Baja: a riding lawnmower, mulch, shrubbery, gas cans, garbage cans (with garbage), recycle materials, lumber and who knows what else. Of course the occassional bike too. I have also taken on 2 foot deep snow drifts and snow banks when I was a volunteer Ambulance driver and was responding to an emergency. However, it is primarily a commuter that also carries my family when necessary. Yet, I still get decent gas mileage.
My point: Why can't Subaru target young families that need a commuter vehicle that also serves as a utility vehicle?
Imagine a commerical like this. A Baja at the gas pump next to a full size pick up and a sedan with the owners conversing. Show the vehicles with the exact same cargo (say a lawnmower and a can of gas). The sedan owner complains about messing up the trunk (with a lawnmower hazardously sticking out the back)and stinking up the interior with a gas can also in the trunk. Meanwhile the full sized truck owner is complaining about pumping in $50 of gas, yet is hauling the same load. Next the commercial highlights the Baja owner who has a $20 gas bill, the lawn mower and can of gas in the back, not to mention the kids (or car pool gang) in the back seat.
Make variations of this type of advertising, just show the utility of the vehicle to the common folk!
The general public doesn't even know the Baja exists. I have been asked numerous times what type of vehicle I am driving and have had numerous positive interactions concerning this vehicle.
It is a great vehicle with great capabilities.
Subaru of America..... I think you need to change your audience! (and advertise it mainstream media)
I suspect that SOA has already decided that the Outback will be the dominant sales model and have planned their ad dollars accordingly. Personally I think it's a shame that a beautiful car like the Legacy GT sedan won't get a fraction of the recognition it deserves.
You would be amazed in the number of Outbacks in New England. The local dealer may have 1 or 2 Legacys and 40 - 50 Outbacks and Foresters. One day, I literally could not find my Sea Mist Green Outback when skiing last winter - there were at least 8 in the same area in the parking lot. I was reduced to pressing the remote until the lights flashed to locate the car! Rob M.
Suppose Subaru were to offer a "regular"-friendly version of the Legacy turbo, to replace the the turbo in the F-XT/Baja turbo? No, it wouldn't make 250 HP, but it would probably make more than the (reported) 210 HP in the F-XT/Baja.
Bob, are you thinking something like the base engine in the Saab 9-3? I have driven one, and it is very torquey and usable but of course doesn't make all that much peak horsepower.
That would be a good use for the 2.0L in my opinion... Low pressure turbo for a more potent base engine, and probably better gas mileage than the naturally aspirated 2.5L also.
I wasn't aware the that Saab engine runs on regular. Actually I was thinking of replacing the existing F-XT/Baja turbo engine. I was wondering if the Legacy turbo, if it were de-tuned to run on regular, it could replace the the F-XT/Baja turbo engine. Not being an engineer, my guess is that it would closely match the performance of the current F-XT/Baja turbo engine, but customers wouldn't have to pay for premium. Maybe I'm wrong, but it seems like it might work?
If someone wants a de-tuned FXT engine, they can get the N/A version. :-)
Not talking about de-tuning the F-XT engine, but the Legacy GT turbo. It would probably match the the F-XT for power, yet run on regular. Why would you object to that?
Comments
I really think with all these trucks getting larger and larger, that there is a market for a good small car-based truck. Utes sell quite well overseas, and with fuel prices sky-high here, they should sell well here too; but again, the product must be right.
Subaru's instincts with the Baja were correct. However, their aim was off, and they just missed the bullseye. In fact, they missed the whole target...
Bob
It needs a better switchback system like the Avalanche and more width to carry a 4X8 sheet of plywood. Well. basically what we talked about before.
Eric
There something very (visually) appealing about a Ford F-250/350 Super Duty in bare-bones trim, with black grille & bumpers, black hubcaps and steel wheels. It just looks no-nonsense and work-ready. I'd like to see Subaru offer a Baja with that kind of no-nonsense and work-ready look.
Of course, it wouldn't hurt if there were more "utilitarian substance" to back up the look too...
Bob
-Frank
I also think it is a necessity that it have lots of low end torque. Nobody who shops for a truck wants a weak little spirited engine in their truck. They want hauling ability that only a properly tuned gas or diesel engine can deliver. I also think that gas mileage is key to its success. That's basically the advantage to a small truck--decent utility without sucking your wallet dry.
Subaru n/a gasoline engines seem to be tuned for high-end operation. The turbos help, but lowers fuel economy. I think that an up to date (direct injection, 4 valves per cylinder, common rail or better design) properly executed turbodiesel boxer engine is critical to the Baja's success in providing the low-end performance truck buyers demand while delivering econocar-like fuel mileage plus durability.
Another improvement would be backs to the seats of rubber or plastic for messy stuff like in the Toyota Matrix, and also fold flat passenger seat to accomodate longer cargo as in the Matrix. Better yet, an interior you could hose out; maybe only on the X trim level.
Eric
Eric
If nothing else Frank, it's symbolic. One of the problems with Baja is that nobody takes it seriously. As you say, it's good for a few bags of mulch, and not much else. If the Baja were able to carry 4x8s, it would say to those in the light truck market, yes this dog can indeed hunt, and that it's not just another driveway queen.
Another point, for those who do occasionally carry 4x8s, a full-size truck is their only option. I think it would be great to offer those customers another alternative. For every 4x8-friendly Baja sold, could mean one less Dodge Ram, et al sold.
Bob
Carrying a 4x8 sheet of plywood for me an infrequent event but I definately agree with the argument that the capacity to do so would be a significant marketing aid. I would purchase a Baja without that capability knowing that for those infrequent events I would make do. It is true that most people do not and will not ever carry a 4x8 sheet of plywood or drywall but most people don't live in the practical "how often will I" but rather the "I might someday" or it offers some form of bragging rights that they COULD. Or in the ego world it helps them to feel like someone can't disparage their vehicle for not being macho enough and being unable to carry plywood.
In my opinion, For the most part, those that regularly need 4x8 carrying capacity also need a bit more of a rugged vehicle like a regular truck.
For now, I think the surfer crowd is a lost cause except as a secondary niche. Weekend warriors and gardeners eat this up. They are practical and recognize the utility of the small bed for what they do and enjoy the ride and fuel economy of the car aspect.
I can see that it would be more appealing to the "surfer" or much younger crowd with some different options like the washable interior, etc. That could open up that market more than the Baja has.
Me, I would buy if the Baja were put on the new legacy platform with updated styling. This would lighten the Baja enough that perhaps the normal engine won't feel so anemic. For me, given the weight of the Baja and the fact that I do enjoy an occasional sporty jaunt, Turbo is a big plus. For the most part I just want to know with utmost confidence that I can get out of my own way if I need to.
I prefer the leather option with the kids and the feel as well as the car-like ride... those are things that also appeals to the garden/weekend warrior crowd. So I guess I fit in that category
I have been watching the Baja for some time now and will likely eventually get one before they stop production, but like others, I am hoping for the few additional things (aside from working to keep my 1 car payment rule) to tip the balance. One of those things was the locking hard cover for the bed and another being the Turbo. Now I am looking at cost to operate with the low (from a car perspective) advertised gas milage on the Turbo. Turbodiesel could easily be the answer to that.
As for having the switchback instead of the passthrough. Again this is, to me, one of those things like the bed that can carry a 4x8 sheet. Great for bragging rights or to combat the "I wish it had x like the Avalanche" syndrome. But again, to me it would be seldom used and I could make do without when it could have been used. It is one of those things I tend to put in the category of if someone needs that feature, they probably would have needed out of the Baja (in terms of ruggedness or utility) than the Baja could offer even if it had that feature.
So what if it's rarely utilized? Subaru needs to set this vehicle apart from the crowd, but at the same time it needs to show that it can handle virtually all the common tasks a handy homeowner might ask of it.
Bob
yes this dog can indeed hunt, and that it's not just another driveway queen
Bob- To me the definition of a driveway queen is a vehicle that is never used for the purpose for which it was designed (such as the Avalanche or any Jeep, and yes I know there are exceptions). Therefore, the Baja as it's currently configured is the furthest thing from being said queen.
-Frank
-mike
Bob
IMHO, one reason that the Baja never "took off" with this crowd is the lack of space. Since you have to put the surfboard in the back, it doesn't leave much room for wet and sandy gear.
I'm convinced that when I had my WRX wagon with a Thule cargo box, I could get more cargo in there that I ever could with a Baja.
When I pull up to a surf break, most of the vehicles are SUV's. Everyone from teenage surf rats to surfing doctor's and lawyers are driving SUV's. Even the "Toerag" is advertised in Surfer magazine. I have only seen a couple of surfers with Baja's but many more with Outbacks.
Yeah, maybe a Halifax Baja would be ticket. :-)
-Dennis
If my daughter were typing this, she would raise her hand. When she was looking at new cars recently, I asked her about the Baja, and she dismissed it immediately. Reasons? Looks, lack of (or minimal) security for her board. One of the reasons we were looking at the Forester, RS wagon and CRV was that she could get her board "inside" the vehicle, and not on the roof or in the pickup bed using the switchback.
Bob
If I happen to grab lunch while carrying my board, I just park where I can see my car.
[OT] BTW, there was a little article in Surfer mag. about carrying surfboards. They said that fins up nose toward the front was better aerodynamically (like you said), but most surfers in a poll carried fins up/tail front.
-Dennis
throw the board in back, change clothes inside easily, etc
Keep that up, in fact all the 2.5l engines in the lineup should get throttle-by-wire and a similar improvement in MPG.
Bob - I am at the beach, most surf boards are just on some sort of roof rack. Even pickups have home-made racks with boards on them. But honestly I think that's a tiny market mostly about IMAGE, Subaru wants city folks and country bumpkins to *think* surfers drive Bajas.
Honestly? Most surfers drive 10 year old rusted out SUVs or pickups.
-juice
For '05 upgraded Ford's Super Duty pickup (finally!) offers such a feature! This apparently is an industry first—which is hard to believe, given the fact that these trucks are almost always seen pulling a trailer of some sort. Why it took so long is beyond me?!?!
http://www.fordvehicles.com/2005superduty/towing/index.asp?bhcp=1
Now it could be argued that for vehicles such as the Super Duty, that this type of feature makes a whole lot of sense; but maybe not so for Subarus. I obviously disagree. If Subaru is going to advertise (which they do) increased towing of 2700/3000 for the new Outbacks, such a feature would go a long way to help owners realize those numbers safely.
Bob
You want to carry a big stick, get a damn roof rack.
I am not sure if there is a baja spec rack yet, or more importantly a cab for the bed. People with filthy dogs dont want them in the back seat, so a cab is the best bet. Better than a wagon cause the dog hair doesn't migrate around the cab. (I have never been in the back seat of my month old leg wagon, and the seats are allready covered with long white hair from my English Setter. Grrrrrrrrr.)
I think there is a furture for the baja. Turbo is fine, turbodiesel is fine once it can be trusted. Look at the mpg of the competition. Our suburban gets about 13mpg, on the highway,(granted it is geared down for towing). That makes 21 look pretty thrifty. I think the problem with Baja is that Toyota undersells it in the small truck niche, and is reliable. Baja needs to work hard to find a following. Maybe it won't work, or maybe Subaru should just keep the production runs low, and wait.
Frog, you're new here, so I'll let this ride... Hint: There are better ways of offering advice and making friends. You're not off to a good start.
Bob
I haven't measured them, but the Baja's crossbars look to be about only 12" apart. You might be able to fit a 4 foot board up there.
-Dennis
There is a cab option for the Baja, its about $1100 which matches baja's color. We saw a Yelow Baja with a cab on it as a dealer car.
http://www.4are.com/product/baja/
Not my style but I would go for the locking hard cover for sure... help with fuel economy and range of utility to an extent. I can definately see times where I might have something back there that I don't want to get wet. Other times where I want the ability to carry larger things, I want to have the option to take the hard cover off. Taking the cover off would also facilitate the cleaning out of the bed after hauling dirtier items.
-mike
-Frank
I think you nailed Frank. Too many (pickup) truck owners are too concerned about image, than really what fits their needs. It's interesting if you compare the looks and marketing of pickup trucks to that of full-size vans. Both are trucks, with many similar capabilities, yet only the pickup's advertising/marketing/styling is injected with a full dose of "machismo."
Bob
-mike
I'm just happy to see a truckmaker realize there is a need for this, and have finally offered a solution. I hope Subaru does the same.
Bob
-mike
-Frank
1. Older gardener/DIY types looking for a vehicle which can serve that light utilitarian need while giving the comfort and economy of a car. For them a machismo image is less of an issue.
2. Those people that like "quirky" or "different" vehicles that are not your mainstream Camry or Accord looking vehicles. A factor of self expression. For them, the "quirk" is part of the image.
I am a practical weekend DIY kind of person who likes a unique "quirky" vehicle.
Unfortunately for the future of the Baja, this vehicle isn't typically marketed to either of those types. The Baja has been bought by those types who happen to be seeking a new vehicle, not those for whom advertising needs to sway their emotions into purchasing this vehicle. A lot more gardening or light DIY types could be swayed to purchase if the advertising was geared towards catching their attention.
And that brings up the final injustice to the Baja. Where is the advertising? It is such a new and unique vehicle, that for it to catch on, it would need to be advertised. SOA did very little that I know of to advertise the Baja in any meaningful way. And for the little they did, unfortunately it was to the wrong niche. One TV ad focused on the Baja, geared towards the niches listed above could make for a huge boost for the Baja.
Bob
-Frank
Hey SOA, how 'bout sending that 6-speed H-6 wonder over here too!!
Bob
there probably is still a niche but I'm not sure how big.
~c
The turbos mate up sooo nicely to the manual tranny, though. Seems like there's no need. And I doubt it would be quicker than a GT manual, so it might be a hard sell.
Maybe if it had VDC and perhaps a Nav or HID option, to distinguish itself a bit.
Then again just offer those on the GT.
-juice
-mike
I've hauled all kinds of things in an S10/Ranger/Shortbed that I wouldn't think of putting in a Baja.
-mike
I really like the looks of this car. I'm hoping Subaru will offer something in this size range. I think they already have set a styling precedent with the R1e. That could easily be scaled up to this size, but with a sub-2.0L engine.
According tot the link, MB is planning to offer a 2.0 turbo version of this car! Could you imagine a WRX engine in a vehicle like this?!?! Yummm!
Bob
Nissan will bring the next Cube here.
Honda will bring a version of their Fitt/Jazz.
So...we have a new segment. Boxy compacts. Value priced, too. Scion is $14 grand, and Honda's version will be priced *below* the Civic.
-juice
I have hauled in my Baja: a riding lawnmower, mulch, shrubbery, gas cans, garbage cans (with garbage), recycle materials, lumber and who knows what else. Of course the occassional bike too. I have also taken on 2 foot deep snow drifts and snow banks when I was a volunteer Ambulance driver and was responding to an emergency. However, it is primarily a commuter that also carries my family when necessary. Yet, I still get decent gas mileage.
My point: Why can't Subaru target young families that need a commuter vehicle that also serves as a utility vehicle?
Imagine a commerical like this. A Baja at the gas pump next to a full size pick up and a sedan with the owners conversing. Show the vehicles with the exact same cargo (say a lawnmower and a can of gas). The sedan owner complains about messing up the trunk (with a lawnmower hazardously sticking out the back)and stinking up the interior with a gas can also in the trunk. Meanwhile the full sized truck owner is complaining about pumping in $50 of gas, yet is hauling the same load. Next the commercial highlights the Baja owner who has a $20 gas bill, the lawn mower and can of gas in the back, not to mention the kids (or car pool gang) in the back seat.
Make variations of this type of advertising, just show the utility of the vehicle to the common folk!
The general public doesn't even know the Baja exists. I have been asked numerous times what type of vehicle I am driving and have had numerous positive interactions concerning this vehicle.
It is a great vehicle with great capabilities.
Subaru of America..... I think you need to change your audience! (and advertise it mainstream media)
what's up with that?
~c
-Frank
Suppose Subaru were to offer a "regular"-friendly version of the Legacy turbo, to replace the the turbo in the F-XT/Baja turbo? No, it wouldn't make 250 HP, but it would probably make more than the (reported) 210 HP in the F-XT/Baja.
Bob
That would be a good use for the 2.0L in my opinion... Low pressure turbo for a more potent base engine, and probably better gas mileage than the naturally aspirated 2.5L also.
~c
Bob
-Dennis
Not talking about de-tuning the F-XT engine, but the Legacy GT turbo. It would probably match the the F-XT for power, yet run on regular. Why would you object to that?
Bob