Chevrolet Cobalt

savetheland · January 2005

"I owned a 1973 Opel Manta Rallye. It was my first new car."

It is too ancient for me to remember. I heard about Manta but do not remember a thing.

The first Opel I remember is Kadet (known later in other life as Daewoo Nexia and Potiac something). And then of course Admiral - luxury full size sedan, midsize Ascona, Tigra for that matter - it looked so cool. But in general Opels were usually cheap transportation. Now it seems changing, Daewoo-made Chevrolets take place of Opel while Opel moves upmarket - together with Saturn.

You can consider Saturn as the next reincarnation of Oldsmobile. After Olds gone there is nothing to consider from GM at reasonable price for urban professional like me. I cannot seriously consider trio Chevy-Pontiac-Buick. So Saturn will move upmarket to fill niche left by Oldmobile, just like Pontiac replaced Oakland.

Are you sure they are trying to sell another Opel in USA?

Yes it looks like Saturn will simply be rebadged Opel or very close  up to grill and headlight design. But it may be not a bad thing. Opel failed to sell in USA, but it because being a cheap transport in Germany it has been rebadged as a luxury car , what is completely wrong, because it still had to compete with real German luxury cars. L300 failed, well first it was older Vectra design and who wants older design if there are a lot of newer ones with much better quality. And secondly  yet they made it even cheaper than original Opel. If they do it right new Saturn may be a success.

savetheland · January 2005

They said "twist-beam-rear setup"? Oh my, even Golf doesn't have it anymore. I hardly believe it will compete with Focus, let alone Mazda3, if it is true.

m1miata · January 2005

Looks like the new Jetta will not look as much like the traditional Jetta. New 5 cylinder engine. More room inside and out, as in larger car. Looks like cars, for better or worse, are getting electric assist steering and electronic throttle. Ah, the computer age.

gsemike · January 2005

Vanman, I have to give credit where credit is due. I just read the review of the SS in the new C&D and it's the most overwhelmingly positive review from that magazine for a GM product that's not named Corvette.

The pic of the interior makes it look well executed, high quality and nice. I'm still not crazy about the exterior though.

C&D's assertion that the Cobalt jumps to the head of the class is a little premature until we see some 3 year old Cobalts on the road, but it does look like a step forward.

That said, for 22 large, I'd scrape together 3 more grand and go for the Stang.

m1miata · January 2005

You can get a nice Stang under 21k right now, I am sure. Within 6 months the Stangs, in V6, should be down in the sub 19k range. If I got a Cobalt, it would be the base model. Paying $20 to 22K for a souped up Cobalt, which looks like your basic Civic or Korean car, makes no sense to me. Just an econo FWD with more power, big deal. The Celica looks hotter ( sorry to see it is the last year ).

speeds2much · January 2005

Cobalt styling is top-notch for the segment. Personally, I never liked the Mazda 3's styling: the interior is too busy and pseudo-techie (i.e., cold), reminding me vaguely of the Lexus I300's interior, which I also don't like.

As for fit-and-finish, I checked out a base model (MSRP est. $13,000), and the interior was upscale in feel, the panel gaps were narrow and the doors closed with a solid thunk. Don't know what more anymore can ask. We'll see how the Cobalt holds up over time, but it's a fine small car debut and I think it'll sell well.

I have a few gripes, however. One is the lack of rear disc brakes in the sedan...it should be offered with some kind of ABS or performance package. Second is the lack of a SAT-NAV option. At the $20,000 price point, eg. LT, at the very least, Chevy ought to offer a NAV system. And one more thing. Why no SS Sedan? There was some initial buzz about it, but appparently Chevy pulled the car.

savetheland · January 2005

I just read article about Cobalt SS in Automobile magazine. They specialize on European cars. They liked Cobalt and said that it is more refined (upper scale) than Focus and Mazda3. But in steering and handling department cannot compete even with vehicle based on Focus platform. Because Focus has a more advanced suspension and steering design is best in industry. Chevy has to learn how to tune electric steering.

chrisducati · January 2005

I hate to tell you but GM USA has time and time again used opel as a base for may of its products. Chevette, Cavalier and all its derivatives, Saturn L series,Pontiac Le mans, Caddy Catera and its successors and the new Cobalt are all based and use many Opel designed parts. I would expect Opel parts to last longer to day than they did in 1973. If you got 18k out of your Opel you got about as many miles as the average Chevy Vega owner did. Strange how many Vegas were sold even after everyone in the country knew they were crap.

vanman1 · January 2005

gsemike : Mustang is NICE. $3K more is true but add extra gas and insurance to the mix also. Mustang would be a much bigger car.

m1miata : The Opels of 30 years ago are nothing like today. I like some Opels I have seen so Saturn should do well by rebadging them.

ambull · January 2005

It's unanimous - all the magazines are impressed:

http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=19&article- _id=9020

m1miata · January 2005

I liked everything about the '73 Opel Manta Rallye, except for the bum engine. I am sure not all were bad engines. It was a fine looking coupe, and would look great today. Add the latest tech for engines and suspension, I would by one today. The Cobalt 4dr I saw the other day looked a bit boring to me. Maybe the coupe is more exciting. As for a $21k Cobalt, I know I would pass, and look towards say a Mustang V6.

m1miata · January 2005

But $22k is not a lot of money to the people at Car and Driver. Seems to me that Cobalt quality, if as good as they say, makes for great competition to the Civic, so as a sub $15k, it makes for a real value play. When you start talking serious cash, as in $22k, that seems like a lot pay for more HP which is not really needed. If they wanted to add an option for SS and bring the cost up to $18k, it may seem more reasonable. In the sport class, the new Eclipse will offer more in the way of style - hopefully it is screwed together well. It looks like a new car. As for Cobalt, I would put it on a list to shop against the Civic, tC, and Mazda3. If you need real HP, the Camaro SS is still out there on used car lots.

gsemike · January 2005

The Mustang would be worth the little bit more of sacrifice.

vanman1 · January 2005

Maybe. I like the new Mustang, it's the best one in decades.

ndsax707 · January 2005

I saw the Cobalt commercial last night where the three different body styles are bouncing the ball back and forth. It's not the first time I've seen it, but it got me thinking...

1) Chevy's advertising over the last year or so has actually been entertaining and builds excitement about their product, especially the Corvette and Cobalt. Now if they could only do a better job of timing the ads with the actual product release, they may be on to something...

2) Every time I see that particular ad I come away impressed with the Cobalt. The styling isn't flashy, but it is sound. And that black SS looks especially sharp.

3) Are these damn things (especially the SS) ever going to show up at the dealers? I see that SW PA finally has some coupes, though no SSs, listed in inventory. I want to drive one of these things and see how it feels.

4) Has anyone seen a Cobalt on the road yet? I've seen sedans at the dealers, but nothing on the streets yet. You can look at pictures all day, but until you see one in traffic you never know how good it looks.

These are my random Cobalt thoughts for the day.

m1miata · January 2005

Cobalt is but a mythical beast, seem only on TV ads..... Well I did see a 4dr. at a dealership. It was a big yawn. The 2dr. may look a bit more exciting, but then again it looks like any other Japanese car, even though it is a USA make. As for the SS model it will be too expensive to even consider. Once you pass the $18k price mark there are so many cars to choose from that would be a better value. At $22k you are into an even broader range of great cars to choose from. Heck, give the Mustang a few more months, and a GT may go for around that price. If I was thinking Cobalt, I am thinking econo car and would not pay over $15k.

johnclineii · January 2005

*I* saw a beautiful blue Cobalt sedan in Florida with temporary tags, about two weeks ago. The driver, a young man in his thirties, looked VERY happy. A woman, probably his wife, was with him....

m1miata · January 2005

" *I* saw a beautiful blue Cobalt sedan in Florida with temporary tags, about two weeks ago. The driver, a young man in his thirties, looked VERY happy. A woman, probably his wife, was with him.... "

Must have been a girlfriend ;-)

So it was a Cobalt blue car. Hey, has anyone looked up what the name really means? A brittle metallic element associated with ... metals... Anyway, it doesn't matter. I think the car will look OK in a 2dr. and the front will be tweaked a bit some day to make it a little more sporty. A good starting point. Needs a little bit more character to set it apart from all the rest. Nice overall, and non-offensive.

ndsax707 · January 2005

Miata -

I'm curious why you think the Cobalt at $22k is overpriced and not competitive with any other vehicles. The Mustang GT starts at $26,400 without adding any options. Dealers aren't going to take much off of that because they won't have to for quite a while, so I'd say the Cobalt compares quite favorably there. And that doesn't even take into account the better fuel efficiency and lower insurance premiums, which also favor the Cobalt.

I see the SS as competing well with the following cars - GTI, SRT-4, Civic Si, Sentra SeR-V, Tiburon GT, and RSX (to name a few), and any price differential is made up for by the standard equipment on the Cobalt - leather, 18" wheels/tires, upgraded stereo, etc. If you compare the Cobalt to any car above that is similarly equipped, I think the Cobalt would be right in the middle of the price range, and it would be at or near the top in performance.

I admit that I am somewhat biased towards GM cars, so maybe I'm blinded by that, but I think the SS is a pretty sweet car at a fair price.

What car do you think is a better value?

bigdaddycoats · January 2005

I agree with your post. I think the SS is very competitive with all of the cars you mentioned - actually better than all of them. Maybe the RSX has a better interior, but, it is so cramped inside and the back seat is even useless for my children on the test drive I took once. My son could at least fit in the back of the SS. The SRT is fast, but pretty crude in all other aspects.

m1miata · January 2005

You always lose out when you take an econo car, like the baby Chevy, and add on stuff to make it sports car. It is simply the fact. Always has been the fact. You take a $14k car and add stuff to get to $22k, and you will never have something which is precieved to be, nor actually worth as much as a car which has a base price around the same, like the RSX Acura. Do you really think you will have Acura quality in a Chevy? The extra power is only needed at a track anyway. Where do plan to race this? The base Mustang V6 has 210HP and will be selling in the $18K range soon. And the GTs will come down some $3k soon. When has a price ever held on a GM or Ford??? As for resale, I have always taken a beating on Olds. GM cars, except for the last one which was a lighter spanking. Best resale was on Japanese cars I have owned. So, I am careful as to just how much I pay for domestic cars now, and usually look more towards the used cars, or deep discounted new cars. The Cobalt is not a bad little FWD car, but there are a bunch of other choices in FWD autos. Who knows, if the new Jetta with a 5 cylinder engine does not consumer a quart of oil every 1,000 miles, I think a lot of people will be looking to buy'em... OK they buy them anyway, people don't do research on cars much before buying.

Cobalt looks like a great value in the $14 to $15k range.

alpha01 · January 2005

I know this isnt a Jetta vs. Cobalt forum, but I feel that the Jetta may not be a direct competitor for the Cobalt, but also that it has its work cut out for it.

Motor Trend's latest issue has a review of the Jetta, and it isnt exactly glowing. They had some valid critism around the 5 cylinders sound quality and power. And fuel efficiency, at 22/30 with a 6 speed auto, is hardly noteworthy.

Im very underwhelmed by the new Jetta.

~alpha

muffin_man · January 2005

The RSX-S is basically $10000 worth of "stuff" added onto a $14k Civic, right? What's the difference? If you start with a strong platform and put on quality parts, I don't see the problem.

gsemike · January 2005

Certainly the Acurra name has more cache than Honda or Chevy and that counts for something at the cash register. Also, the RSX doesn't LOOK like a $15k Civic. A Cobalt SS looks like a $15k Cobalt with a goofy wing added on.

The new Jetta looks like a Corolla. I'm not impressed.

savetheland · January 2005

I saw several Cobalts already, but all were rental cars. But it is North California, after all.

venus537 · January 2005

you have some valid concerns about the jetta but i saw both the cobalt and the new jetta. the cobalt is no jetta. one comes across as an economy car and the other as a near luxury car.

one has a comprehensive list of safety and near luxury features even in base form and the other doesn't.

yeah, i would say these cars are not direct competitors. heck, a jetta 2.0t looks very appealing in comparison to the A4, S40, 9-5 and TSX.

muffin_man · January 2005

Actually, I think the Cobalt coupe looks nicer than the RSX, which is pretty plain. It's a nice car, but nothing special to look at.

As far as the Acura name, I don't think it means all that much. The RSX is a dressed up Civic, the Acura EL is a Civic with leather, and the Acura TSX is a European Honda Accord.

Now, you will probably get better resale on the RSX, but I'll take the better overall performance of the Cobalt SS (and the $2k saved up front) any day.

m1miata · January 2005

Went to the Chevy site to see some photos of Cobalt. They seem to like the backside view --- interesting. Guess that is suppose to be the most unique angle in comparison to the rest of the Civic styled cars? What we seem to have here is a very nice knock off of a Japanese car. At the right price, this thing could sell. Problem around here is that no one has them. None to be found. Oh well, best to always wait for the $3k or more off on new ones, or buy used. I have been wacked by buying new American cars one too many a time. That said, if the car is good and you keep it 7 to 10 years, it should not matter as much about the resale value. Just look at some Buicks or Pontiacs that are half priced in about 2 or 3 years. Now those are bargains. It is so much easier to get a great deal on most USA cars vs. Japan used. And the discounts on new cars --- now-a-days, some $3k to $7K off. Of course the retail is a somewhat fictions price anyway.

gsemike · January 2005

We actually don't get the EL here in America but I have seen some candian ones and they are undeniably Civics. Besides that , only people in the know know that the RSX is a Civic and TSX is a European Accord. When most consumers look at the Acuras, they see distinct cars offered by a premium nameplate. In contract, when most people see a Cobalt SS, they're going to see a Cobalt and think "$22k?????????????"

venus537 · January 2005

yes, the the TSX is an european accord. the key word being "european" as in having distinct differences with the N.A. accord.

as far as the RSX, Honda should delegate that car as a high end sporty civic.

not to knock the cobalt, but it come comes across as an economy car no matter how much steroids it's on. same with the neon and the ultimate souped up economy car the WRX.

i agree with whoever said that it's almost always better to get a higher model than trying to equipped a lower model to assimilate a higher model.

i see great success for the regular cobalt because it's not trying to be something it's not.

bporter1 · January 2005

This is a typical GM problem. They always are very slow to ramp up production of any new vehicle because of quality concerns. Only after a few months do they start to produce more of the new models. Meanwhile demand overtakes supply and then prospective buyers either wait or they buy something else.

johnclineii · January 2005

Ford did/is doing the same thing with the Five Hundred, too. Japanese manufacturers often have the luxury of doing that to the domestic market over there first, so the things are ready for almost immediate production here.

Lately, though, there have been many Japanese models either introduced at the same time here, or in North American specific form with no real Japanese counterpart (such as the Accord--the Japanese version lives under the Acura TL)...

m1miata · January 2005

Went the local dealer and asked to see the new Cobalt and Equinox cars. They did not have them in stock. This is interesting. Is Chevy going out of business? If so, why bother to spend all the money on advertising? And they wonder why Japan is gaining every year on US sales. If I wanted to buy two cars today, with cash in hand, I could not due to lack of stock. I looked in two other cities, and they have no Cobalts in stock. They also have no Corvettes in stock.... Oh well, I don't need a car now anyway. A friend wanted to see the Equinox SUV, but doesn't exist, I guess. An American Revolution? Maybe Chevy will have to rename the campaign, An American Expedition in Search of the Lost Cars?

dkgw · February 2005

Hello my name is Merrill I'm from the Poconos of PA and I am a Chevy Cobalt owner.

First off this is a beautiful machine. Being someone who LOVES cars and can appreciate a well tuned Civic or a nicely built Diablo (Although I can't afford the latter one LOL) I got my Cobalt on Wednesday January 26th at 6pm (that's when I signed the loan papers) And I've put 200 miles on the car in the past 5 days. You see I'm really in love with this car. It's Stylish, it's roomy, and everyone I've shown it too says the same thing. "Wow that's a nice car." I'll keep you posted with my experiances with this car.

BTW it handles Very well in the snow

ndsax707 · February 2005

Thanks for the update dkgw. It's nice to finally have some feedback from someone who owns a Cobalt instead of all of us here just guessing based on what we've read, seen, and heard. Did you get the sedan or coupe? What options? Were you able to get the price down from the MSRP much? Keep us updated on your your experiences and give us details!

ndsax707 · February 2005

Wow, you're right miata! You broke the story, Chevy is going out of business! If they expect to compete with the Japanese they'll need to have at least a 60-day inventory of each car on the lot. Then they can expect high prices too because the demand would obviously outweigh the available supply. What kind of a stupid company thinks it can make a profit by selling its product as quickly as it can be produced? This is the nail in the coffin! Chevy is doomed! DOOMED!!!!

pat · February 2005

First Drive: 2005 Chevrolet Cobalt SS Supercharged - check it out!

tommc · February 2005

Can't believe someone would put Cobalt in the same sentence as Mustang GT. Getting just a bit carried away. Cavalier replacement with a much higher price tag, even though it may be a nice small car. From post 787.

((I'm curious why you think the Cobalt at $22k is overpriced and not competitive with any other vehicles. The Mustang GT starts at $26,400 without adding any options. Dealers aren't going to take much off of that because they won't have to for quite a while, so I'd say the Cobalt compares quite favorably there. And that doesn't even take into account the better fuel efficiency and lower insurance premiums, which also favor the Cobalt))

ndsax707 · February 2005

Can't believe someone would post a response to a response to a response to a statement without reading the first two posts first. Read post #806 and try again. I was refuting miata's implication that if you're looking to buy a Cobalt you may as well get a GT.

vanman1 · February 2005

I see tons of Equinoxes on the road and Chevy is selling them with few incentives. My dealer has about 5 on the lot. Only 2 Cobalts though, they are slow to come out from what I can see.

Where do you live?

lngtonge18 · February 2005

I stopped by one of my local Chevy dealers on Sunday and saw at least 6 base Cobalt sedans in varying colors. No coupes in sight. There were a few Equinox as well. I live in northern Florida. GM appears to release cars relatively early in Florida. I saw a nice blue LT sedan on the road down in West Palm Beach back in November. The blue is a very rich looking color. The base Cobalts do look bland and like a Civic on the outside, but the interior is actually pretty upscale looking. I personally would rather have the more upscale looking LT sedan though.

npgmbr · February 2005

Rosenthal Chevy has about 3 sedans

Bob Peck Chevy has almost 10 sedans

m1miata · February 2005

I live on the Central Coast of California. There are none for sale in San Luis Obispo, Santa Maria, Arroyo Grande, to name a few stores. Guess we don't many Chevy cars in Calif.

ndsax707 · February 2005

1 2005 Cobalt LS Sedan(s) Found

HOME MOTORS

1313 E MAIN ST

SANTA MARIA,CA 93454 - 4799

Phone:(805) 928-7744

Fax:(805) 925-5220

Map/Directions View Inventory

3 2005 Cobalt LS Sedan(s) Found

SUNSET AUTO CENTER, INC.

1300 N 'H' ST

LOMPOC,CA 93436 - 3303

Phone:(805) 736-7577

Fax:(805) 736-4229

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2 2005 Cobalt LS Sedan(s) Found

PETE JOHNSTON CHEVROLET-CADILLAC

2485 THEATRE DR

PASO ROBLES,CA 93446 - 9605

Phone:(805) 238-7800

Fax:(805) 238-0704

Map/Directions View Inventory

1 2005 Cobalt LS Sedan(s) Found

GRAHAM CHEVROLET CADILLAC

301 S HOPE AVE

SANTA BARBARA,CA 93105 - 4044

Phone:(805) 898-2400

Fax:(805) 898-2422

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1 2005 Cobalt LS Sedan(s) Found

TAFT CHEVROLET BUICK PONTIAC

501 NORTH ST

TAFT,CA 93268 - 2826

Phone:(661) 763-4201

m1miata · February 2005

So sad, if that is all Chevy can do in the way of inventory. This is funny, Taft having one, while we don't here. I didn't know Taft had car dealerships. Oil is up, so maybe Taft is making some serious $$$ again. When I am up in Paso or down to Santa Maria some day, I will check out the Cobalts. Maybe they will have a coupe.

vanman1 · February 2005

The car just started trickling in before Christmas. My dealer only has 2, I just don't think there are many anywhere.

dkgw · February 2005

I've always loved having a car that not many people have at the moment. It was that way when I owned my Neon, which I didn't buy this time around because EVERYONE (Hyperbole) Has one. The Cobalt is at the Unique phase of it's existance where I can own one and say "Hey not many people have one of these bad boys" Wait six months to a year and Cobalts will be All over the place like the Civic, Neon, and Focus.

m1miata · February 2005

People pointed at, asked about, and went crazy over the Dodge Stealth when it was new. I had the first one in my area of California. When on vacation, people everywhere asked about it, and made a comment or two about her. The first year was a one year ahead of the new Prelude, new Camaro, and all the others that improved one year following the release of the Mitsu 3000/ Dodge Stealth. Some thought it was a Ferrari. Ummm, well, ummm, it looked good anyway. Was in no way racing a base model Stealth against anything. It looked great and handled great. Was fairly reliable, but not a typical Japan quality car due to it being a Mitsu. Now that Mitsu. has a long warranty, and hopefully a full Japan quality and reliability to the cars, I would consider an Eclipse....... Or have they changed? As for Cobalt, I doubt I would buy one. For an sporty little car there are loads of options, be it the Mazda3, Scion tC, or even the PT Cruiser. If there is some magic to the ride of a Cobalt and the price is right, heck maybe it is something to consider. I don't think Cobalt will have the PT or the Stealth magic though.

vanman1 · February 2005

Chevy bought the whole cover front and back of one of this mornings Toronto area commuter papers and plastered it with Cobalt pictures / ads. I guess the big marketing dollars are starting to roll.

Cobalt is not (from what I have read and seen) any magical car. It is however very competitive with the Corolla, Civic and Mazda 3 and that is all you can really pull off in this very tight segment. What will sell it is it's looks (best of the bunch IMO), power (also best), nice interior and huge dealer network. Hopefully the longer term quality will be there but I suspect it will.

vuefor2 · February 2005

I took a test of the Cobalt today to see what it was like. I am an owner of a Ion so I wanted to compare. I can see I should have waited. While the Ion has been a good car, the Cobalt is more refined and nicer in almost every way. The ride is nice, the interior is beautiful and the over all handling is better. That said I think the ION looks a little more original and there have been a lot of upgrades since ours was made in 2003.

In terms of reliability, our Ion has been great and it was a first year car. I see no reason the Cobalt will not follow suit. Chevy has hit a home run with this car I think, hopefully Japanese car buyers will take a look.

Chevrolet Cobalt

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