I have not driven a LaCrosse, but all the reviews I have read comment on how very quiet this car is.
As for the looks, I see some Taurus, some Jag and some Buick in it. It's ok, not spectacular. The inside of the car is much better than yurakm suggests though.
Sure, everything concerning look and feel is very personal and subjective. Thousands and thousands of families are buying Aztec and like it very much. Some people like chrome; I do not like it. The same with fake wood. I just share my impressions.
I did like the interior of La Crosse on pictures. After seeing it in reality on dealer lot (through window), I was disappointed by the plastic "wood". So much that I did not want even to test drive it.
This is not an abstract discussion for me. I am replacing my 98 Malibu currently. My wife and I expect to drive the new car the next 10 years or so, and we do not like to be unhappy with the car every day for so long.
We decided instead to buy an ex-demo 2004 Regal. Already signed all preliminary papers, and will receive it next week, November 30, 2004.
I drove a CXS on 11/27. Interior is somewhat smaller that what I thought. I am 6-0 and my head just touches in the rear. Fit in the front is fine, but no extra room to wiggle around on a long trip. Interior trim is nice, modern and well laid out.
The 3.6L VVT engine is very nice. Punch the gas and the car scoots to 90 real quick. The car is very quite on the highway.
In comparison, I drove the Pontiac G6 with a 3.5L on the exact same route. The G6 has much higher road noise and the engine never has the power it needs. The Buick CXS brakes and steering were much better, although with more body lean.
The main selling points of the Buick LaCrosse CXS are the 3.6L engine and the hushness of the cabin.
Figuring in a $2k cash back and invoice - $25k, not a bad deal. However, if the Ford 500 could get an engine like the 3.6L VVT, then the 500 would be my first choice.
However, a used Cadillac CTS with the 3.6 might be a good compromise.
The LaCrosse is the only Buick sedan I would buy. IMO, the 3.8L is just too old and not worth consideration.
CXS with my options (PEC, U3l, AY1, R13) is $28k (invoice) - $2k cashback.
Currently there is a $1k cashback. I really think in 6 months this will be $2k. This car is over priced by at least $2k. I may be speculating, but if there is $1k out of the gate, then $2k is going to happen.
I would never pay $30k for this car, $26k maybe.
If I had to pay $30k, I would get the new 2006 Avalon when dealers start dickering in late 2005.
Anyone know if the nine speakers in the optional Concert Sound III system are brand name, e.g. Bose or Boston Acoustics, etc., or are they merely Delco paper cone speakers? How does the system sound if you've heard it? Is it really an audiophile system?
Not necessarily true. The Malibu hasnt really seen a significant price increase at list, despite incentives that hit $3500 cash back.
It seems to me that GM built incentives into the pricing of this vehicle- compared to similar competitors, I agree that it seems at least $2000 overpriced. Sure, they will probably offset added incentive spending by increases at MSRP, but I dont think that by the time an additional $1000 rebate rolls around (to $2000 total), that the MSRP will be up $1000.
GM started this whole thing, and now it seems they cant get out of the trap. Its a shame. Take a look at cars like Toyota's Camry. Now in its 4th model year, and nationwide, incentives range from $500 to $1000 cash OR low but not zero % financing options. And Honda's Accord only offers incentives at MY end, in its 3rd year.
Very interesting piece on incentives, by Jed Connelly, Nissan's Senior VP of Sales and Marketing “Much Ado About Nothing Down – The Hidden Costs of Incentive Marketing”
(Sorry, I cant post a direct link- to view the article, click on Corporate>Speeches>2004 Speeches>2004 California Auto Show Keynote Address [Oct. 27, 04])
Took a look at an Allure this weekend at my dealer. They had a nice red CXS in the front. I was impressed with the car's look and the price was reasonable, listing with leather and On Star for about the same as my Intrigue GL did 5 years ago.
I would need to drive one as I am always suspect of Buick "handling" but if it's similar to my Intrigue I could see buying one to replace it in a couple of years.
I have ordered the CXS with side curtain aribags and the stabiltrak options. Cashmere metalic paint on outside and neutral leather with black accents oninside - like the Volvo S60 sports. No chrome package as I prefer the real Euro look which avoids the USA tinsel effect. See Mercedes, BMW for examples.
Had considered and tested Honda Accord V6, Toyota Camry, Volvo S40 and S60. Allure met and exceeded all comers. Being made in GM Oshawa plant also a plus as it is second best plant inworld for quality of build. Also had great dealer support in Toronto with 2 test drives, both without sales rep on board and second drive lasting over an hour. Even had totop up the tank!
Allure looks great(more like a Jag than anything else), rides great, handles great, and easy to park with excellent viz fore, aft,and to sides. Interior is indeed extremely quiet, seats are comfortable and secure in hi G turns and fit and finish is super - indeed Lexus level all round. Being quite tall, the telescoping steering wheel is much welcomed.
Is there a drawback? Only one is the mandatory OnStar in the base price - but that was more than offset by a very fair discount off MSRP - about 9%. What with a RIM Blackberry at hand and CMA Plus membership, I doubt OnStar will get much use, if any.
Can't wait to turn in my '98 Buick Regal a week from now. I expect within a year the LaCrosse/Allure will rank ahead of Accord and Camry in Edmond's user ratings. One last hope is that GM doesn't destroy resale value on this Buick by discounting it to fleet sales and car rental companies in the USA. Like Lexus, Buick will need to learn how to protect and preserve resale value of this most comparable car. Bob Lutz, are you listening?
Yes I did and it is noticably much better than Concert Sound II in my Regal - thanks to the Quiet Tuning feature plus auto volume adjustment with rising speed in the CXS. This is with the 6 speaker system so not much need in my view for the 9 speaker option.
Corgrats Coopergerry. Which dealer in TO did you buy from?
I also hope GM does not dump this car into fleets. My GP resale has been hurt by this I'm sure. I think GM should give the rental companies and fleets Malibu Classics and Impalas.
Most modern DOHC V6 engines are teamed with 5 or even 6 speed automatic, so it is a bit surprising that GM chose a 4 speed instead of 5 or 6. Considering the fact that the Cadillac CTS has a 5 speed auto, they could have used that tranny for the Lacrosse. But overall the car looks promising and if reliability can match overall performance and refinement then the Lacrosse should do well.
Couldn't GM find a better name for the car? Lacrosse sounds too French.
"Considering the fact that the Cadillac CTS has a 5 speed auto, they could have used that tranny for the Lacrosse." The Cadillac CTS is a rear drive platform, and it's transmission wouldn't be a 'drop in' application for a fwd auto. GM and Ford are presently jointly developing a 6 speed for fwd applications that hopefully will be available for the '06 model year. The 6 speed Ford offers for their Five Hundred is sourced from Japan (Asin, or Aisin, I believe is the name of the manufacturer). So if you're looking for a reason to put off your LaCrosse/Allure purchase, this might be one.
Please how much did you pay in Toronto? for the Allure. I am thinking of buying one(I have $3000 Gm points) but dread the rigmorale of bargaining.It's a shame that Costco does not sell cars in Canada like in the US.
Has anyone seen the new TV ads? I have to say the CXS model looks really nice in the commercials. I think this is one of the better looking midsize sedans. It's plain, but not plain like the 500 or Camry. Hopefully they will make 18" wheels available in later years.
Can anyone tell me the difference between the CXS model Chrome Plated and the CXL Chrome Tech wheels. GM charges $650 for both but the CXS Chrome Plated sure look a lot brighter.
go to the Wheels section, and click on links to pop-up pictures. According to the pictures, the chrome wheels have the same shape as non-chrome ones of the same size.
Had a chance to test drive a new LaCrosse (Allure) this past week.
The engine and suspension are excellent. The interior is OK but not especially noteworthy. The level of quietness and serenity which I was expecting to be extremely high after reading and hearing all the ballyhoo about it was not especially good. Disappointing. Did not sound as quiet as the Lexus ES 330. As for the Concert Sound III system for which GM wants another C$1,030, this was absolutely the WORST sound system I have ever heard in a car. The radio reception was terrible, the sound quality from the speakers was abysmal: tinny highs, muddy mid-ranges and shallow lows, very poor musicality. Typical Delphi paper cone crap speakers, just plain junk. Buick ought to be ashamed to put such a low-end system in this car, after having had the excellent Monsoon system in the previous Regal GS and in view of competition such as the profoundly excellent ELS 5.1 surround sound system which comes standard on the similarly priced Acura TL.
Despite the fanfare, I would have to conclude that GM is still not serious about producing world class automobiles in this sector (with the exception of the new Malibu). While the driving dynamics of the LaCrosse are commendable, vault-like quietness is absent and the sound system is expecially disappointing. If you are an audiophile and you buy this car, plan on replacing the speakers with good quality after-market ones. The poor radio reception is more difficult to correct. Of course, the OnStar system was present in all its glory, augering out another monthly fee for GM if you are sufficiently absent-minded as to forget your cell phone. By all means, allocate the resources to the intrusive and obligatory OnStar while giving potential buyers a crap sound system.
I was reading the latest Motor Trend Comparison test among Toyota Avalon, 300 Touring Model (3.5 engine) Buick LaCrosse CXS (3.6) and Ford Five Hundred. The Buick was rated the quietest car among the bunch, even beating out the Avalon which was quite a surprise. But the brick on wheel won the overall test. Don't know why.
The Motor Trend article also complimented the design of the LaCrosse in rather glowing terms. It is a well-proportioned collection of sheet metal that please the eye from all angles. Will be a classic which will still look fresh and current 10-15 years from now. Whereas I think many will quickly tire of the chunks-of-clay approaches for the 300 and 500 emanating from the DCX and Ford design studios. Ugh!
priggly, I don't know but have the same question. The local Buick dealer doesn't know (or at least he won't say). Please e-mail me at"mickbonw3@charter.net" when you find out. I was thinking of replacing just the speakers with Boston Acoustics. That should be all that's necessary.
Everything I have read about this car says it's real quiet. I can only assume you drove it in a noisy area. I also can't imagine the sound system is as bad or "abysmal" as you say.
Drive it and see for yourself. I didn't say the car was not quiet, only not as quiet as all the hype suggests. It was driven in a city traffic environment, I'd say average noise levels. The sound system was TERRIBLE. That includes very poor radio reception and WORSE sound fidelity from the speakers which are nothing more than Delphi paper cone junk.
I can not believe that stereo story. I mean, Buick is not crazy, they wanted to compete with Lexus - which offer the wonderful Mark Levinson sound system!
It could be a problem with your car (or ears?)... I dunno, I am not a Buick or GM fan, but that just doesn't make sense.
I am aware of what you stated. Go look at the real wheels on real cars and see the difference in appearance. The CXS Chrome Plated are quite bright and shining, whereas the CXL are not nearly as bright, in fact they have sort of a flat look. I still would like to know the answer to how they are both some sort of Chrome but completly different in appearance. The dealers couldn't tell me and GM Canada or GM US wouldn't tell me.
I think its pretty obvious that ziggly wasnt going to like the Lacrosse no matter what. I think he drove it to prove that it was as lackluster as he suspected. Every review I've seen suggests that the car is very quiet. He said it's average, but compared to what he doesnt say. If he means average compared to expensive luxury cars than I would say Buick did a good job.
but I've seen them at Avis. Maybe I'll try to rent this one next week. Haven't been overly impressed with GM products, hopefully this will be nicer than the Chevy Impala I've been renting.
This car's frontend looks like a Jaguar with a Dodge Neon backend...and for a $30K car, why doesn't it was a lockable fuel door...sheesh, $12K Daewoos have these standard. Nobody siphons gas or pour sugar into the tank anymore?
The junky LaCrosse sound system will compare to the Mark Levinson when pigs fly. It is a piece of junk compared to ANY sound system. If you don't want to believe it, fine by me.
Contrary to your wild assumption, I very much wanted to like the LaCrosse but it is lacking in its sound system and is not as quiet as the ES 330. If Buick is going to compare itself to Lexus, then they better deliver or risk being guilty of hollow rhetoric. Before you decide to act as an apologist for GM, I suggest you go test drive the car yourself so that you will at least know what you are talking about.
I drove a CXS today and found it to be a nice improvement over the 2002 Regal GS I now have. I expected it to be quieter, have better handling, and improved interior over my Regal. I wasn't disappointed. I expect to buy one in a month or two. There is a dealer on the east coast that quotes no haggle prices on the internet. Their prices posted for CXS's are $1000 below invoice. At that price I believe the LaCrosse to be competitive when comparing to other sportier, more powerful, or more luxurious names.
The LaCrosse is thousands less than a Lexus. You can't expect it to be exactly the same car. For the money, I think it's great. I will check out the stereo though. Do you think maybe there was something wrong with the one you were in? Did you check to see if maybe the equalizer was set wrong?? Mite explain your strange experience.
I don't expect the LaCrosse to be a Lexus but if it's going to be compared to the Lexus then there should be a lot of similarity. If there was something wrong with the one I was in the problem was confined to the sound system. The equalizer was not set wrong. The engine and suspension were fine.
Comments
As for the looks, I see some Taurus, some Jag and some Buick in it. It's ok, not spectacular. The inside of the car is much better than yurakm suggests though.
I did like the interior of La Crosse on pictures. After seeing it in reality on dealer lot (through window), I was disappointed by the plastic "wood". So much that I did not want even to test drive it.
This is not an abstract discussion for me. I am replacing my 98 Malibu currently. My wife and I expect to drive the new car the next 10 years or so, and we do not like to be unhappy with the car every day for so long.
We decided instead to buy an ex-demo 2004 Regal. Already signed all preliminary papers, and will receive it next week, November 30, 2004.
The 3.6L VVT engine is very nice. Punch the gas and the car scoots to 90 real quick. The car is very quite on the highway.
In comparison, I drove the Pontiac G6 with a 3.5L on the exact same route. The G6 has much higher road noise and the engine never has the power it needs. The Buick CXS brakes and steering were much better, although with more body lean.
The main selling points of the Buick LaCrosse CXS are the 3.6L engine and the hushness of the cabin.
Figuring in a $2k cash back and invoice - $25k, not a bad deal. However, if the Ford 500 could get an engine like the 3.6L VVT, then the 500 would be my first choice.
However, a used Cadillac CTS with the 3.6 might be a good compromise.
The LaCrosse is the only Buick sedan I would buy. IMO, the 3.8L is just too old and not worth consideration.
But, thats with no options, correct? The MSRP on the CXS is $29K.... I'd definitely add Stabilitrak and Side Curtain airbags.
~alpha
Currently there is a $1k cashback. I really think in 6 months this will be $2k. This car is over priced by at least $2k. I may be speculating, but if there is $1k out of the gate, then $2k is going to happen.
I would never pay $30k for this car, $26k maybe.
If I had to pay $30k, I would get the new 2006 Avalon when dealers start dickering in late 2005.
Thanks.
It seems to me that GM built incentives into the pricing of this vehicle- compared to similar competitors, I agree that it seems at least $2000 overpriced. Sure, they will probably offset added incentive spending by increases at MSRP, but I dont think that by the time an additional $1000 rebate rolls around (to $2000 total), that the MSRP will be up $1000.
GM started this whole thing, and now it seems they cant get out of the trap. Its a shame. Take a look at cars like Toyota's Camry. Now in its 4th model year, and nationwide, incentives range from $500 to $1000 cash OR low but not zero % financing options. And Honda's Accord only offers incentives at MY end, in its 3rd year.
Very interesting piece on incentives, by Jed Connelly, Nissan's Senior VP of Sales and Marketing
“Much Ado About Nothing Down – The Hidden Costs of Incentive Marketing”
http://www.nissannews.com
(Sorry, I cant post a direct link- to view the article, click on Corporate>Speeches>2004 Speeches>2004 California Auto Show Keynote Address [Oct. 27, 04])
~alpha
The LaCrosse could never be an executive's car with that small of a back seat. At least in a Camry you can put 2 adults in the back seat.
I would need to drive one as I am always suspect of Buick "handling" but if it's similar to my Intrigue I could see buying one to replace it in a couple of years.
Had considered and tested Honda Accord V6, Toyota Camry, Volvo S40 and S60. Allure met and exceeded all comers. Being made in GM Oshawa plant also a plus as it is second best plant inworld for quality of build. Also had great dealer support in Toronto with 2 test drives, both without sales rep on board and second drive lasting over an hour. Even had totop up the tank!
Allure looks great(more like a Jag than anything else), rides great, handles great, and easy to park with excellent viz fore, aft,and to sides. Interior is indeed extremely quiet, seats are comfortable and secure in hi G turns and fit and finish is super - indeed Lexus level all round. Being quite tall, the telescoping steering wheel is much welcomed.
Is there a drawback? Only one is the mandatory OnStar in the base price - but that was more than offset by a very fair discount off MSRP - about 9%. What with a RIM Blackberry at hand and CMA Plus membership, I doubt OnStar will get much use, if any.
Can't wait to turn in my '98 Buick Regal a week from now. I expect within a year the LaCrosse/Allure will rank ahead of Accord and Camry in Edmond's user ratings. One last hope is that GM doesn't destroy resale value on this Buick by discounting it to fleet sales and car rental companies in the USA. Like Lexus, Buick will need to learn how to protect and preserve resale value of this most comparable car. Bob Lutz, are you listening?
If so, how good did it sound?
I also hope GM does not dump this car into fleets. My GP resale has been hurt by this I'm sure. I think GM should give the rental companies and fleets Malibu Classics and Impalas.
Couldn't GM find a better name for the car? Lacrosse sounds too French.
;-)
Congrats coopergerry! I used to work not far from there back in the early 90's (Eglinton and Laird). I had my car serviced there once or twice.
Let us know how you like the car.
I am thinking of buying one(I have $3000 Gm points) but dread the rigmorale of bargaining.It's a shame that Costco does not sell cars in Canada like in the US.
You pay a little and get the invoice cost and go from there. At least you know where a dealer can go.
http://www.buick.com/lacrosse/features/
go to the Wheels section, and click on links to pop-up pictures. According to the pictures, the chrome wheels have the same shape as non-chrome ones of the same size.
The engine and suspension are excellent. The interior is OK but not especially noteworthy. The level of quietness and serenity which I was expecting to be extremely high after reading and hearing all the ballyhoo about it was not especially good. Disappointing. Did not sound as quiet as the Lexus ES 330. As for the Concert Sound III system for which GM wants another C$1,030, this was absolutely the WORST sound system I have ever heard in a car. The radio reception was terrible, the sound quality from the speakers was abysmal: tinny highs, muddy mid-ranges and shallow lows, very poor musicality. Typical Delphi paper cone crap speakers, just plain junk. Buick ought to be ashamed to put such a low-end system in this car, after having had the excellent Monsoon system in the previous Regal GS and in view of competition such as the profoundly excellent ELS 5.1 surround sound system which comes standard on the similarly priced Acura TL.
Despite the fanfare, I would have to conclude that GM is still not serious about producing world class automobiles in this sector (with the exception of the new Malibu). While the driving dynamics of the LaCrosse are commendable, vault-like quietness is absent and the sound system is expecially disappointing. If you are an audiophile and you buy this car, plan on replacing the speakers with good quality after-market ones. The poor radio reception is more difficult to correct. Of course, the OnStar system was present in all its glory, augering out another monthly fee for GM if you are sufficiently absent-minded as to forget your cell phone. By all means, allocate the resources to the intrusive and obligatory OnStar while giving potential buyers a crap sound system.
Here's the interior noise in db:
Avalon 66.4
LaCrosse 65.9
300 67.6
500 69.6
I don't know but have the same question. The local Buick dealer doesn't know (or at least he won't say). Please e-mail me at"mickbonw3@charter.net" when you find out. I was thinking of replacing just the speakers with Boston Acoustics. That should be all that's necessary.
It could be a problem with your car (or ears?)... I dunno, I am not a Buick or GM fan, but that just doesn't make sense.
This car's frontend looks like a Jaguar with a Dodge Neon backend...and for a $30K car, why doesn't it was a lockable fuel door...sheesh, $12K Daewoos have these standard. Nobody siphons gas or pour sugar into the tank anymore?
By the way, it's "priggly," not "ziggly."