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Whoa, ok that's a price I've never seen since you have to add in the air conditioning package and whatnot to get anywhere. That's far lower than any price I've compared, which usually puts the Elantra around 13.5k-14k + TTL.
CR for maybe lawnmowers, blenders, and deck stains but when it comes to cars I go elsewhere because Consumer Reports is a flawed source. Do you buy CD players at hardware stores? The best car information comes from auto magazines not some company where you pay to fill out their surveys. Are you aware that their information comes only from those who subscribe to their rag. Who are these people that are responding and why are they not responding? What is their demographics? You just don't get a legitimate survey from such a specific crowd of those who subscribe only.
CR's reputation has been getting pretty bad the last few years especially after last years controversal child safety seat apology in which 8 of 11 child seats were incorrectly given bad rating after they admitted the company they outsourced it to screwed up. What an blunder that was. Then there is this automatic approval for Toyota's even though the model didn't go through the normal paces that other cars do. Case in point that Toyota Tundra that they recommended and then had to pull that recommendation after the recalls started coming in.
Do you really trust a company that uses little colored dots to indicate how good a car is? Was it fair for a highly reliable Chevrolet Astro van to get a bad rating based solely on a seatbelt buzzer that was .02 seconds delayed in going off with the key in the ignition. It just doesn't add up and like Toyota, perceptions are starting to change.
Like it or not it is one of the tops in the class and that is what most magazines are saying. Did you read the recent compact shootout in Car & Driver? I believe it came in third out of 7 cars with the new focus in last, and thats not that bad of a car. The Saturn has so much good going for it regardless if its the class leader in power. A good driver doesn't need a 6-7 second 0-60 car to pass or merge on to an expressway.
My 1988 Pontiac Lemans (Daewoo) only had 74 hp and that was more than enough to beat most drivers out of the toll both and merge onto freeways even though it was a lighter car. The Saturn has more than enough oomph for the average driver.
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
Its interesting I have noticed that it seems only about 1/4 of drivers use turn signals. Not only is it not safe but its inconsiderate in that based on their upcoming turn you can make a decision what to do or to prepare to come to a safe stop. The law is 200 feet before a turn. I am surprised its not enforced more often by the police because there is revenue to be made. The police in my area concentrate on speeders, seat belts, and occasionally red light runners which is also a growing epidemic. I bet one of these years they will go the turn signal route as well.
Don't you just love it when they do the slow drift thing right in front of you (without signaling, of course :mad: ) and then they slow down, ever so slightly? Yikes, it's a wonder people are able to earn a living in this country, looking at how they drive. Are they holding guns to employers' heads?
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
I am hoping that market saturation of lane departure warning systems (buzzers and alarms and dancing babies) that go off when you go out of your lane will provide some incentive for people to signal more on the highway, if only to avoid the annoyance of the buzzer/warning.
http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.ef16b02/200
First I showed them the Elantra. They only had GLSes but in a good range of colors. Fortunately they had my favorite for the Elantra, carbon grey. (I also know my daughter likes darker colors like grey.) I asked her what she thought of it and she cooed over it--I think she likes its rounded lines, and she liked the color. There was a red one next to it; I like red but she doesn't. OK. There was also blue and silver, but she said she liked the grey best. (Great, since I do too.) Next we looked at the Sonata. They had my favorite color, medium silver blue, and I asked my daughter what she thought of it. She like it very much (had the grey interior, which I prefer.) I asked her if she liked it better than the other colors, including willow grey, and she said she did. (Two for two!)
She asked about the Accent. She likes the looks of it. I told her I like it too, but that I won't buy one because it doesn't have very good crash protection, which is important. "But it gets 39 mpg!" she said. Sorry.
Next we went to the Kia dealer, and looked at Optimas. Again I was lucky and they had a grey EX, which is not the trim I want but outside looks a lot like the LX with Appearance package. I asked my daughter what she thought, and she liked it, and again grey was her fave color. (Yesss!) She also liked how the name was very close to that of the Altima. (For some reason she likes the previous-generation Altima.)
The Kia dealer also sells Mitsubishis, so my daughter asked "What about an Eclipse?!" I just laughed. Then she asked (tongue-in-cheek I think) if we were going to go over to the BMW dealer. Another good laugh.
So I asked what she thought overall, and she said she liked the Elantra most, then the Altoptima , then the Sonata. Which is the same order I'd put them in, although the choice between the Optima and Sonata would ultimately be based on price since they are pretty even in my book.
My daughter is an exceptionally bright and discerning child.
Haaaaaaaa, Eclipse. I looked at that one. It was quite entertaining in that the engine really roars with a powerful sound, but then you look at the speedometer and see that you're barely doing thirty. There are many reasons you should have laughed when she asked about that one.
Do you think there's a good chance Hyundai and Kia will offer ESC on their 2009 Accent and Rio machines?
I know ESC will become mandatory with all automobiles starting in 2012, I believe.
Still it would be nice if Hyundai/Kia didn't wait till the last moment to make ESC either standard or optional BEFORE '12, know what I'm sayin'?
Awaiting your knowledgeable reply...
Peace!<-AladdinSane- :shades: -
If you want a smaller car than Elantra, go look at a Fit or Versa. At least they have good/good front and side crash ratings. Not that anyone mentioned, but the Aveo is almost as bad as accent. Not good company for safety Please get your loved ones a car with a good/good front/side iihs rating please!
Huh, the NHTSA test weren't nearly as bad, but... yeah... that's pretty terrible IIHS crash test results. And the fuel economy difference is a bit surprising, although Hyundai/Kia isn't the only one where the compact gets better mileage than the compact, since the Chevy Aveo manual is only 24/34 but the Chevy Cobalt XFE manual is 25/36. I guess that doesn't say much for Korean subcompacts.....
I was looking at the IIHS crash test ratings, apparently the fit got a poor score for rear-end collisions, Versa still had a passing score, but both had good scores for front and side impact, as you said, and both are good alternatives to the Korean subcompacts...
Subaru seems to be really cleaning up on safety though, all their models have great ratings everywhere and of course they have their little awd advantage. Impreza's still the only compact with a top pick currently...although I think Civic is just as good(just not enough ECS availability yet)
I'd have taken a more serious look at the impreza if I liked the looks more and if the other features/prices were a bit more comparable. It's certainly great for going into bad weather and being well protected.
I'm hearing that the '09 Civic will also get this feature which will be nice. Miss it on my '06 model, but it's a great car even without it.
The Sandman
Anyway, we'll know well before December whether the Elantra GLS is available with ESC for 2009. But at the least, your oldest could choose the SE or Touring, which we know have ESC standard--and certainly don't cost any more than a Civic, and probably much less (comparably equipped).
They did the same thing with ABS awhile back. It was EX-only.
Peace!<-AladdinSane-<- :shades: -
Decisions, decisions!
The Sandman
Have you considered the Optima? Good crash scores and safety equipment, and with discounts and rebates the price would be pretty close to that of an Elantra SE (i.e. Optima LX with ABS/ESC and Appearance pkgs). Also a bit larger and more comfy car, with a more powerful I4 with a 5AT, and FE is not that much less than the Elantra.
The Sandman
Winner: Honda Civic
Runners-Up: Toyota Prius, Hyundai Elantra
Then there's the Versa, generally considered a subcompact, with mid-sized interior room. And the Civic, a compact, with less interior room than the Accent and Rio, which are considered subcompacts. :confuse: :confuse:
Maybe the Cobalt XFE is just the ticket (I've never heard of it before, so I'll need to check it out).
Best Regards,
Shipo
Looking at it from a $4.00 per gallon basis, and with my current commute hack as the reference point against which all others are judged, I find the following annual fuel costs for these cars:
MPG – Annual $
- 22 ---- $9,090.91 -- 1998 Dodge Grand Caravan (long since paid off)
- 29 ---- $6,896.55 -- 2009 VW Rabbit Coupe 5-Speed (about $16,000 out the door)
- 32 ---- $6,250.00 -- 2008 Mazda 3 5-Door 5-Speed (about $18,000 out the door)
- 34 ---- $5.882.35 -- 2008 Honda Civic LX 5-Speed (about $17,000 out the door)
- 36 ---- $5,555.56 -- 2008 Chevy Cobalt XFE Sedan 1LT 5-Speed (about $14,000 out the door)
The Rabbit and the M3 5-Door have an advantage because I frequently need to schlep our 75 pound Labrador (who loves to swim and get muddy and who sheds A LOT) around and I'd rather not stick him in the back seat. That said, the Cobalt is so inexpensive and gets such good mileage that it would be cheaper to keep the 1998 DGC for dog duty than it would be to peddle the old girl and get the Rabbit or the M3. Hmmmmz.
Best Regards,
Shipo
A used Corolla or Yaris (hatch for the Lab!) would be another option--more pricey than an Elantra, and the driving position is not as adjustable, but high FE and a pretty nice highway ride.
As for the new Corolla, I have yet to drive one, but all reports indicate that it's pretty numb and unresponsive as well. FWIW, both my mom and my mother-in-law have Corollas, and they're nowhere even near the Civic or the Cobalt in that department, and those two are handily trumped by the Mazda 3, which in turn is less responsive than the Rabbit. I mean, I gotta have some fun.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know, "Act your age!" Geez, I'm over 50 and still insist on driving a stick shift wherever and whenever I can. I guess some folks never grow up.
At this point, I’m thinking that it’s between the Rabbit and the Cobalt, and over the course of the first 50,000 mile year, the Cobalt will cost me about $2,000 less than the Rabbit to buy and save me another $1,400 in fuel. The flip side is that if I opt for the Rabbit, I’ll save roughly $1,000 by not having to insure three cars, and I might be able to get say $1,500 out of the old Caravan, $2,000 max, so the first year would be between $400 and $900 cheaper if I keep the old van and buy the Cobalt. Now I have to decide whether having a little bit of fun is worth $900.
Hmmm, thinking as I type, if I sell whatever I buy after the contract is over, will a 1 year old Rabbit with 50,000 miles on it have a higher percentage resale value than a 1 year old Cobalt with the same mileage? Don’t know the answer to that one. :confuse:
Best Regards,
Shipo
But I think it's interesting you were not impressed by the Elantra yet like the Cobalt's ride and handling enough to seriously consider it.
I've driven the Mazda3 on the freeway and I love how it handles, but I don't like the firm suspension and tire noise on bad roads--which there are too many of where I live. Civic also is too noisy for my taste for a long drive; for around town it would be fine though.
If I were you I'd seriously consider the "buy used' play, run the car into the ground, and buy another one. Instead of $14-18K up front, it would be about half that. The car would be worth diddly after 2-3 years, but who cares?
As for the buy used play; I guess I'm just too picky, I don't like other people's cast offs. Call it a character flaw, but there it is.
Best Regards,
Shipo
If you want ride, comfort, and quietness then the Cobalt leads the compact class in those regards. The seats were specially designed to provide comfort on long commutes. The seat designer is well known and tested the seats to go in the Cobalt well before production started. They are firm but the comfort is good for all day driving.
I don't see how a Hyundai got put into the top of the conversation because its not quite there for that status. There is no bad compact car so its a question of what you like and want to live for. Keep in mind if you go the Hyundai way that the powertrain warranty is non-transferrable to those outside of your family.