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  • allknowingallknowing Posts: 866
    uh, you guys think that your truck is the best but us Toyota owners know that our truck is the best. :)

    CP - Thanks for the FX4 link. It sounds good but we'll see how much Ford charges for the pkg. It may not be cheaper than the TRD.
  • spoogspoog Posts: 1,224

    "So how did we pick the vehicles? Simple: With lots of time testing new vehicles, we’ve gotten a pretty good handle on which ones work off-road and which ones don’t. So after a quick meeting that featured some creative shouting and yelling (you don’t think that we all agree on everything, do you?), we narrowed down our list to four: the Jeep TJ, the Land Rover Discovery Series II, the Hummer, and the Toyota Tacoma TRD. You can start writing your letters now, screaming, “What about the Kia Sportage (or whatever your favorite 4x4 is),” but whatever it is, if we haven’t already called its name, it isn’t in here. So we suggest you deal with it. "

    What was the winner of the ultiamte 4x4 contest?

    The Toyota Tacoma TRD. Yes, it beat a Hummer, Jeep Wrangler, and Range Rover.

    Think the Ranger could make that list? Nuh-uh. Don't think so. Like fourwheeler says -

    " If your vehicle didnt make the list, deal with it. These are the best of the best".

    Go to the site, click "trucks and events", then "road tests". You will see the *fantastic* photos of the Tacoma in the ultimate 4x4 comparison 2001, and the other competition where it was victorious, the 2001 pickup of the year.

    Toyota designs these trucks from the ground up gang to do well off road. Congratulations Toyota, victory is indeed sweet.
  • spoogspoog Posts: 1,224

    ultimate 4x4 test 2001 , the winner

    "Having a pure mechanical locker in the Tacoma allowed it to outdo other rigs equipped with electronic traction control or limited slips, as drivers could engage the locker before entering a tough section of the trail and then walk right through it with no wheelspin at all. This gave it a definite advantage over the other vehicles that were left with computers and clutches waiting to sense wheelspin before doing anything. "
  • spoogspoog Posts: 1,224
    Go the the ultimate 4x4 challenge on the fourwheeler site and click on the video stream section! It shows the hummer, jeep ,tacoma and range rover offroading. There are some great scenes in that little video. Just click on the film looking icon below thepicture of the range rover.

    Ahh yes.... simply the best offroaders out for a drive in the desert. Good stuff!
  • spoogspoog Posts: 1,224
    There is also a real time video for the 2001 pickup of the year comparison!

    Go to that section in truck evets, road tests, then click 2001 pickup of the year.

    Scroll to the bottom and the "behind the scenes video" is there. Click on it.

    Needless to say the Tacoma win this competition as well.
  • modvptnlmodvptnl Posts: 1,352
    At least he's off the mercury bandwagon and back to quoting magazines. Wonder if he'll admit he was wrong on the math thing......nah!!!
  • cpousnrcpousnr Posts: 1,611
    1.a Ford Ranger AL 4X4 "Best Buy" FourWheeler magazine.

    1.b Ford Ranger XLT, Selected twice buy FourWheeler magazine as best 4X4 compact pickup, think it was 1991 and 1994.

    hats one magazine.

    2.a Ford Ranger Best Buy compact pickup 1993, 1994, 1995, 1996, 1997, 1998, 2000, 2001.

    hats Two magazines. Lets see what else.

    3. Edmunds "Most Wanted Small Pickup" 2000, 2001, Ford Ranger. wanted/articles/43047/page017.html wanted/articles/43048/page019.html

    4. J. D. Powers Initial Quality awards, many, to Ford Ranger.

    Shall I go on?

    Spoog, you get all that mercury drilled out of your teeth fillings yet? Gonna kill ya some day. . .

    My offer is still good, Gonna pre run the San Juans and my tires are ready. . .

  • spoogspoog Posts: 1,224
    What about the unanimous loss in the 1998 pickup of the year test? I noticed you didn't bother to include that test....

    Every makers wins the Initial Quality study.

    But who wins the JD powers long term 5 year reliability studies consistently? Toyota trucks...

    Oh, also Cspounser, I noticed that the "best buy" award was also given to station wagons and minivans......

    Did you check out those fantastic videos of the competition at ?

    See how fast they were going in the hummer offroad? Well ...the Tacoma beat it....
  • barlitzbarlitz Posts: 752
    The ZR2 was rated the best 4x4 offroad truck 10 straight years by I M Chisler magazine. Also rated best customer satisfaction by J D powers
  • allknowingallknowing Posts: 866
    How can you go wrong if you buy a truck recommended by I M Chisler magazine? I think that the ZR2 is endorsed by Lame [non-permissible content removed] magazine also.
  • cpousnrcpousnr Posts: 1,611
    I had read numerous internet articles that state that the Ranger is preferred by women. . .

    Nah, Rangers dont go off road. . .

    BTW I taught my kids American history because the schools do not do a good job. I am a descendent of the Thomas Jeffereson family I know the importance of knowing our history. 6th cousin, once removed to be exact.
  • allknowingallknowing Posts: 866
    acf2001 - I appreciate the complement and I'm glad that you're enjoying your Tacoma. Concerning Vince, I believe that his goal in life is to appear ignorant and to annoy as many people as possible. I must admit that it isn't hard to make him look bad.

    CP - Nice pics and I have to agree that the Rangers are doing a good job. I'll bet that the drivers had trouble sitting for a while after the pictures were taken though.
  • In the light of a discussion of Tacoma Vs. Ranger, talking about people having chips on their shoulder, being mentally lightweight, has little bearing on this forum. Being adamant about your vehicle preference is fine and dandy, but you only prove YOUR character when you insult others.

    If you don't like Vince, fine, use your god given right to ignore. That's what I do with Spoog...

    So point out the innaccuracies of someones truck's claim to fame, brag on why your personal choice is so grand, and leave it at that. Everything else is impietous.
  • modvptnlmodvptnl Posts: 1,352
    LMAO.....again!!! I have nothing on my shoulder and I actually think Vinny is sometimes obnoxious(almost as bad as spoog!!) I just thought it HILARIOUS that someone would critique someone else's writing skills and then butcher their own post so badly!!! Enjoy the Toy, they're good trucks.

    Later, dudette!!! And try some decaff!!!
  • cpousnrcpousnr Posts: 1,611

    I am sure you will enjoy your Tacoma. I never say it is bad, just not the only 4X4 on the block.

    I am well pleased with my Ranger too.


    Well, had some fun with this, you may enjoy. My trip website.

    Turn on your speakers when you use it.

    Others can have a look too.

  • spoogspoog Posts: 1,224
    Nice picks. I also enjoyed the super flat, well maintained gravel roads these vehicles are travelling on....

    Still, ya gotta love the scenery.
  • But you won't see one in my garage.

    1.a Ford Ranger AL 4X4 "Best Buy" FourWheeler magazine.

    <<<See my first comment>>>

    2.a Ford Ranger Best Buy compact pickup 1993, 1994, 1995, 1996, 1997, 1998, 2000, 2001.

    <<<Yeah, well just because I can't afford the steak doesn't mean I'm gonna eat boiled cabbage because it costs less. I think we're talking about less bang for the buck.>>>

    3. Edmunds "Most Wanted Small Pickup" 2000, 2001, Ford Ranger.

    <<<Don't they also say, "Take it for a long test drive..." ? I guess you missed the review of the Tacoma.>>>

    4. J. D. Powers Initial Quality awards, many, to Ford Ranger.

    <<<Initial Quality award? So the truck is good initially so long as you trade it in before 15,000 miles?>>>

    Edmunds -

    "...Toyota's truck has much to recommend it, including the largest Japanese automaker's sterling reputation for making some of the most reliable cars and trucks on the road...."

    I guess my main problem, CPO, is that because we don't have the time to drive across the country to meet you in the wilderness, that the Tacoma is somehow inferior to the Ranger.

    Please let me know of an article that details that the 4X4 system on a Ranger is better than the Tacoma.


  • acf2001acf2001 Posts: 28
    Try DECAF - that's the correct spelling!
  • barlitzbarlitz Posts: 752
    Why is it every thing written about the ranger or any other domestic is inconclusive with you taco owners but every thing written about the taco is gold, it only makes me more proud that I'm not one of you overpaying yuppies who's idea of offroading is driving through puddles or over speedbumps. BTW do your back street boys cd's skip when you go over those treachorous speedbumps or do you have to reset your $50.00 clock.
  • allknowingallknowing Posts: 866
    Stang - Although I can't argue with the concept, I must have missed the post when you made the same critical observation to Vince. It amazes me that many Ranger regulars will defend Vince's outright lies about Toyota owners (not to mention his false information) yet have no problem condemning a Toyota owner practicing similar tactics. I'll admit that I'm a little hard on Vince sometimes when he brings my name into his post claiming that I've said something that I haven't or just something completely erroneous. Maybe I should just ignore his post. Perhaps others should do the same with a post criticizing Vince. Then again, let's acknowledge that Vince is one of those guys simply attempting to aggravate people. As a result of his effort, he typically comes out looking stupid to most. If you go back a year or so and examine his posts in other forums, you&#146;ll discover that he admittedly enjoys irritating people. If he&#146;s having fun, and we can make him look like an idiot in the process, maybe it&#146;s a "win-win" situation. I&#146;m sure that Vince is enjoying this discussion immensely.
  • I was mainly talking to ACF2001, as her post was more slanderous than anything pertaining to Tacoma's or Rangers. I have no argument against anyone proving someone else's post to contain invalid information. My argument lies in those who resort to insults in lieu of compact truck debate. Whoever is ignorant, stupid, feeble minded, etc. is beside the point. I'm here to support my argument that Rangers are a better truck overall, be it by sales volume, standard equipment, price, value or quality.
  • Reply to your above post.

    Festiva now? Can't the same be said about a Tercel, Prius, Echo, or Matrix? EVERY car offers it's own amount of value, quality and quantity of features. The Ranger does offer More for Less money, and that's a fact. If you want the ultimate 4x4, in stock form Tacoma has it.
    2. Rangers are boiled cabbage now? I know you have and love a Tacoma, but you can't ignore the two publications you quoted to show the Ranger is a best buy 1993-'98, '00-'01(edmunds). I think Best Buy means MORE bang for the buck.
    3. You should take ANY car or truck for a long test drive. Especially USED, because that's where the original quote originates from.
    4. Initial quality test is conducted by survey to actual truck owners. This means more Ranger and B-Series owners like their truck better than Tacoma Owners. I think that proves beyond the scope of this forum's audience, which truck offers and performs up to owner's expectations. Thats more opinions than all regulars here combined.

    Finally, Toyota definately has it's reputation for it's long lasting drivetrain, and that should carry on to the Tacoma models. But how come Rangers has been the leader in sales since 1987? Seems the reputation isn't enough...
  • cpousnrcpousnr Posts: 1,611
    for both:

    When I can get a Taco 4X4 that has a standard tachometer, I will consider one.

    That is a critical tool in 4 Wheeling, equally as critical as a skid plate. Ford now has skid plates standard on 4X4's.

    Toyota still has the tach as optional.

    I never said that because spoog will not wheel with me that the Tacoma is inferior to a Ranger nor do I feel it is an inferior vehicle. I do just believe that the Ranger is an excellent vehicle, well priced, outstandingly equipped for the price and can hold it's own with the Tacoma. Heck, I only paid $17.3K for the vehicle, added the tires and skid plates bringing me up to just shy of $18K

    I will say this, spoog is showing more and more that he more than likely does not own that Tacoma which really is not a problem. He does not have to own one to post here. However, in a bit longer than 3 weeks, I will post the links where my Ranger and at least 3 others will be on Medano, Imogene, Engineers, Cinnamon, Breakneck and Brown's pass's in Colorado. And if I see a Tacoma owner, will gladly shake his hand, comment on the great view and smile, knowing that we both got a chance to see a great view.

    First on the pictures, that was Crown King area north of Phonix, temp 112 degress that day. It is rated as a Class 6 trail, very hard. But read about it from . .read the part about taking 7 hours to go 26 miles. Right spoog, a real easy trail, just one of the worst in Arizona by independent standards.

    "I recently drove this trail in April of 1999. It had been about 7 or 8 years since I was last on it. I was surprised at how much trail erosion had occurred since my last trip. In these past years, I would imagine that this trail is seeing increased travel. I noticed a lot of motorcycles and ATVs on the trail in April. I imagine that because of this increased traffic, the trail is breaking down more and more each time it gets a good rain. A number of years ago, I would have rated this trail a 4 or an easy 5. It is certainly a 6 or maybe a 7 now. The first 10 to 15 miles is easy. On the last portion of the trail, starting around waypoint 8 or 9, you will see more washed out portions of the road and an increasing number of large rocks becoming exposed.

    My first trip on the trail was in a very stock '89 Jeep Cherokee and I had no trouble negotiating the trail. On the April '99 trip, I drove the trail with a stock suspension '98 Jeep Wrangler, limited slip rear diff, and 30"x9.50 tires. We had to stack rocks at one point in order to get up a rock ledge. My son spotted for me, since a misplaced tire would cost me about an 18" drop and I had nowhere near that kind of clearance under my front end. As it was, I caught the front transfer case after the front wheels settled down on the ledge, but the rear end hooked up and got me over. Closer to Crown King, the trail became more of a continuous rock-dodging driving course. A vehicle with larger tires and ground clearance will do better on the upper half of the trail. As time goes on, I would think that parts of this trail will continue to erode more and more. This will require a more capable vehicle and/or driver. Be aware that portions of this trail could easily become more difficult in a short period of time.

    Trail Specifics- My '99 spring drive took about 7 hours. We stopped several times to take a few pictures and to have lunch. Plan on making a full day of it when you figure in the return trip back to I-17 via the Bumblebee Road (25 miles of gravel and then the freeway).

    Crown King is an old mining town located in central Arizona in the Southern Bradshaw Mountains at about 7000' altitude. Crown King is now known for the large number of summer vacation cabins that it supports. The Bradshaw Mountains run North-South through the central part of Arizona. A lot of gold and silver were mined through out these mountains during the west's gold rush era.

    I ran this trail about 3 months ago with my then recently modified TJ (4.56 gears, lockers, lift, tires, etc.) I would still rate it the same although I was now able to do all of the optional sections of the trail! (there are 4 of them) A lot more fun too! You can make this run in less time if you don't stop to play around, take photos, have a picnic lunch, etc. After you get to Crown King, you can either go back the same way you came, or you can return to the Phoenix area via a county gravel road and the freeway. This return trip takes a couple of hours, depending on how the washboards are doing on the 25 miles of gravel road. On my last trip up, I pulled a high centered 4x4 vehicle off of the rock ledge located in the upper section of the trail (photo of ledge included, less truck). It was a 1/2 ton pickup with no lift. (hey, it had 4x4 on the side of it!) With the longer wheelbase, it high centered on the mid section of the frame after the front wheels were up and over the ledge. I had to pull him off the ledge, then go over it, and then pull him over the ledge with my TJ. (He was stuck damn good, as they say!)"

    I only disputed the obvious technical errors in the 4Wheeler article. The rest of it was personal opinion of the editors of the piece.

    But by your constant rebuke of the Ranger, it should have died while attempting to go where a Tacoma went. By that standard, spoog, I even win that part of the argument.

    See you in the San Juan's. . .oh, sorry, thats right, you declined. . .
  • borzoiborzoi Posts: 1
    Stumbled onto this site in comparing Ranger and Tacoma. Am considering both. Presently I drive a 1986 Toyota 1-Ton which I purchased new. After 15 years, 1 head gasket, 1 alternator, 1 caliper and several sets of front brakes and shocks from heavy towing the poor truck may not pass VT inspection due to rust. The rest of the truck is original, motor, auto trans, rear end etc. The shame of it is the truck still travels I 91 in VT at 80 mph with ease and gets over 25 mpg. Never has it let me down or even a whimper. Has anyone here had such similar luck with a 4 cyl Ranger? Would be interested in hearing as the Ranger's price tag is much less for what I want. Am looking at a new Tacoma Prerunner SR5 Xcab 2WD. Around $20k. Similar Ranger around $17k. 4WD I view as a waste of fuel and cost as I don't off road or plow. Most vehicles in VT that fall off the road in snowstorms usually are 4 wheelers with CT or Mass plates anyway :}. In any event, I don't recall seeing a mid 80's Ranger around my area for quite awhile except in the boneyards or as planters in the trailer parks. Several Toyotas though, still hauling, burning a little oil, leaking fluids here and there, and basically serving their masters without a fuss. Is it worth the $3k? You tell me.
  • 1. So can anyone post an article that states that the Ranger has a better or more optimal 4X4 system that Tacoma?

    2. Can anyone state facts or articles that suggest that other than the price, the Ranger is better suited in terms of quality, reliability and driveability than the Tacoma?

    Have yet to see those...

    CPO - I'm glad you have names and places to take your Ranger but you are incorrect about the Tach.

    Please find me someone who has a found a Tacoma 4X4 V6 truck that doesn't have the IX, LX or LL package. My guess is you won't be able to find such a truck because it is an unpopular combination of options; and dealers know what is and what isn't hard to move. So they order what will move and if you want the SR5 package you have to code a trim level. I understand the Tach is an "Option" but if you stop looking at Edmunds a take a look at the lots, you'll see what I mean.

    To say they don't come with one standard is one point of view. I would tell you that you won't find a 4X4 on a lot without a tach since most code the SR5 pacakge which forces you to select a trim level which gives you the Tach.

    Any other misconceptions? Seemed like there were a few more but I seem to be last rational Tacoma Guy standing and I just can't read every post... heh heh.

    And I do not subscribe to the Spoog, "Cut and Paste the Same Thing Over and Over Again," model. Nor do I believe, that Tacomas are inherently superior. I just haven't found evidence to the contrary. And I do own one. I've taken enough pictures of damned thing you'd think it was my new baby. I'm sure with the first dent or chip, I will manage a tear.

  • Yeah, sorry but the Ford Festiva just popped in there. Must be the wiseguy in me. I don't think I would have lumped the Tecel, Prius, Echo in there since they (as well as the new Focus) were/are very popular and not so much of a flop; not that the Ranger is a flop. Suzuki Swift would have been a good one but basically best buy or best bang for the buck doesn't mean the most bang. ;-)

    Eh... If I thougth I could have afforded it we would have gone with the Silverado. Now with all the problems I've been reading about with those and after washing a "compact" pickup for the first time, I'm glad we stuck with the Tacoma.

    I know Rangers have totally out sold Tacoma's since 1987 but if you look at the market data, I think this has more to do with the fact that with a lower price over the last 20 years and the abilitiy to sell your trucks in the same country you manufacture them in, that you will sell a ton more than those coming over on slow boat to the USA for distribution all over the US to a market who in the last 20 years hasn't looked to fondly on Japanese automakes for fear of loss of American jobs.

    Rangers are Good but Tacomas are better I think. There would have been a Ranger in the driveway had Ford dealers dealt better with me in the past an if the Ranger had better styling (just can't get into them). Maybe when the drive train gets a little more refined without things like leaking seals and loud AC units with better styling and a kick [non-permissible content removed] 4X4 packagae for the same $X$ amount, I'll feel better about giving up Toyota Reliability. For now, it would cost me more to be in the shop than drive a more expensive truck.

  • acf2001acf2001 Posts: 28
    Cars and trucks have always captured the hearts and minds of Americans. I believe that one buys a vehicle on both intrinsic worth (quality of components, value, etc...)and esoterics (styling, marketing effects, etc...). If you watch the commercials for Fords, Chevys, and Toyotas... they are NOT selling the intrinsic qualities but the feeling qualities. Now to get back to the arguments made here that Fords are a better value...It may be true money-wise but worth is so much more. I am tired of this argument of consumer best-buys!!. The way we move cars is by advertising and marketing to key age groups by IMAGE. Pontiac is great at this. They build their performance into their marketing - NOT their cars. So you get a ton of young people who think their cars are fast, riding on your butt. Ford trucks - now they try to sell the COWBOY image and that common theme, so popular (#1 in music format,too)in this country, SELLS! Toyota, I believe personally, sells itself not in its ads (although they are changing to the tough image too). I never saw one ad on TV for a Tacoma before I decided to purchase it. I went with what appealed to me in looks and interior quality. After all I want to look outside and see something nice in my driveway. The styling of American stuff to me is ugly.... and that just doesn't sell in my book.
  • plutoniousplutonious Posts: 799
    My 1998 Tacoma TRD 4x4 V6 Ex-cab came stock with the following:

    1. 31" Goodyear Wrangler GSAs
    2. Heavy duty suspension with beefier
    springs up front and beefier leaf
    springs in back, Bilstein shocks, and
    a thicker sway bar
    3. Over-sized fender flares
    4. Clutch-start cancel feature that allows
    the engine to be started without pressing
    the clutch (no rolling backwards down the
    5. A fully locking rear differential in the
    rear that can be turned off (probably the
    most useful 4x4 feature in ANY 4x4)
    6. Highest ground clearance in its class
    7. A smooth dual overhead cam V6

    While others are whining about the Tacoma's tach not being standard (hmm, I've never seen a Tacoma that didn't have a tach and I think you're REALLY reaching for an argumentative point here), I think it's the domestics that are short on options. None of them ever put together a package like my truck, in 1998 or even now. And I also it's high time Ford, Chevy and Dodge got with the program and junked their archaic pushrod engines and went DOHC.

    In my humble opinion, the options Toyota offers with the Tacoma, combined with Toyota's reputation for quality and durability, makes this a no brainer.

    One last point. Everytime I look in the classifieds, I'm amazed at how many Rangers and S-10s are being sold, at least 75% of them being late models. Then I to to Toyota's column, and there's just a handful of them being sold, usually late 80s and early 90s models. What's that tell you? It tells me a lot more than Edmunds, Consumer Reports, JD Powers or Car and Driver Magazine ever could.
  • 1. I believe this comes from CPO's posting about the FX4 4X4 package for 2002 Rangers. I don't recall anyone stating Rangers better currently, just that it can definitely hold it's own on the off-road, and coupled with the vast after market for Ranger and great availability and low price of replacement parts, Ranger is pulling ahead in capability. Of the factory floor, Tacoma has better off-road capabilities, but I'd bet 90% of the people who will off-road won't know the difference. Those who do, will be modifying their vehicle anyway, so that capability difference gets shortly thrown out the window. To date, the only place I can find any information on the 2002 FX4 is edmunds, and that's little more than a blurb.

    2. "Get behind the wheel of this truck, and you'll note the excellent handling and the nearly flawless ergonomic layout in the cabin." Edmunds Most wanted 2001. I think and believe based on articles like above and my test drive of 2001 models Tacoma and Ranger that seat comfort, standard features, on-road ride/handling, and reliability (driven by proper maintenance) that the Ranger is a better offering for a compact truck. With the new 2.3l 4v 4banger and 4.0l v6 (and updated 3.0l), 5 speed automatics, and the tried and true 5 speed manuals, the drive train reliability gap is either negligible, or none-existent. Ford Rangers receives overall 4 star ratings for years 1995-2000. Toyota Tacoma receives 4 stars in 1996 and 1999, but 3.5 stars in '95, '97-98, and '00. 90% of reviewers recommend the Ranger, while 88% recommend the Tacoma. This is similar to the ratings given by JD Power's initial quality phone survey to owners.
    It's definitely a close running, but these indicators clearly are not in Tacoma favor.

    About the tach, I think that point was made because it is optional on Tacoma's. Most probably still come with them, as seen on the dealership inventories, but you are paying more for something that should be standard with any manual transmission or off-road vehicle. The tach is standard on even the most basic of Rangers. And leaking seals and loud A/C units are not typical of Ranger's either, even if there are some posts under the Ford Ranger Problems forum. And styling is a good argument; who can justify buying a vehicle they just don't like the looks of? That's another reason I'm all Ford... The latest Tacomas front fascia looks cross-eyed to me...
This discussion has been closed.