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Stick ... if I've been learning my lessons, from following this forum, usually questions like yours are met with at least two responses: (1) advice that you negotiate a selling price (usually some amount slightly over invoice) and tell what it is in your post; (2) don't get into "what will you give me for my old car" until you've done #1...Charlie
Charlie- Thanks for fast response. That's just it!! They won't negotiate off the MSRP! I have checked on this site and a couple more and come up with an Invoice price of around $53,250ish. I found another regional dealer on the net where you can build it and put your own price on it and showed a bid of $250 over the Invoice price and am waiting to hear back from them. p.s. I just got a call back from the dlr on my cell. I'm sure they want to negotiate a little more. HA!
Akassem...you really have to take the time to read back in this forum....lots of good advice.
1) car dealers just love to perform magic and only quote you the monthly price you pay. The reality is that with the quoted lease, you are actually paying $450 + ($10000/39) = $706 a month for the car.
2) I would bet that if you kept that $10K and used part of it for multiple security deposits you would be way ahead at the end.
Near as I can tell, you are being asked to pay full price for the car which is somewhat crazy given that the 07's are still out.
So....read this forum, then negotiate the purchase price of the car with no lease, then calculate the lease with no down payment, then calculate the lease with multiple security deposits....and now you know where you are.
Now ask the dealer how much he is really giving you for your car....because they just love to quote $10K but that's what they take off the MSRP...Since you could actually buy the new car for $2K less than MSRP. You're really getting only $8K. Be careful.
If you want to give the dealer the difference between the $10k (or whatever he really is giving you) and the multiple security deposits that's fine. Divide whatever you give him by 39 (length of lease) and subtract that from your monthly lease cost. You're just prepaying part of the costs up front.
My delaer is now telling me that my company is on the D plan for the VPP and the discount is 1.65%. What are the other plans? On the web site it only shows the 3.58% for Infinity.
COmpany is Wells Fargo bank. Any insights would be helpful. Thanks.
Okay thanks to this site I have negotiated (up from invoice)and over the internet, a purchase price of $55k (~$250 over invoice)on a fully loaded 2006 M45. I want to lease the vehicle and trade in my 2000 Linc. Nav. Can I or should I get them to give me the trade-in value directly off the purchase price to bring the finance amount down to ~$8-$9k?
MSRP $60070 PPrice- $55000 -Trd $10000 (ish) Bal. $45000 Residual ~$37243 62% or so i was told. Seem correct?? Bal-Resid ~$8250
akassem...there are 2 VIP plans. One is for employees of Nissan/Infiniti and the other, the D plan, is for Nissan/Infiniti suppliers. Depending on which plan you qualify for, the dealer calculates the price you will pay....it's not negotiable. The only parts that are still negotiable are the "administrative cost" which the dealer can add and any dealer installed options.
That's a very attractive residual, but I fear that it will be quite a bit lower when you go to sign the paperwork. You don't mention the money factor ??? Yes, you can give them the tradein money to cut the payments, but please read my comments on multiple security deposits. It's a much better way to reduce the total cost of the lease and will save you money.
You also don't give their lease figure....remember they add on some costs (origination fee, administrative fee, etc) which can change all the numbers. You have to know the total costs.
Thanks for reply! I guess until I see it in writing I have to go with what I've been told about the residual being 62% on 39mo lease. I have seen several posts on your MSD's but need to re-read. I don't have the lease figure yet. I negotiated the price based on purchase with no indication of leasing. They didn't ask and I didn't offer. Any suggestions about how to turn the deal in that direction when negotiating would be appreciated! thanks again. Stick
sure....you've already done the hard part...you have an actual selling price. Now just ask them to use that in calculating a lease. The residual percent is off the MSRP. The MF and residuals should come directly from Infiniti's charts (ask them to show them to you). Just watch out for additional add-on costs...origination fee and registration fees are normal but question "administrative fees" which are just extra profit to the dealer. Then ask for the lease figures if you give them multiple security deposits instead of a downpayment (make them run the numbers...). The 24 month lease will probably cost you less per month than a 36/39 month lease right now..check that out as well.
Be careful with this reasoning about multiple security deposits. You have to consider your other debt. If you have no credit cards or investment opportunities then yes, loaning money to infiniti at 0% to save yourself some interest expense may be prudent.
If, on the other hand, you are carrying a mortgage at 6% and credit cards at 9-18 pct, saving a few basis points on a 20K loan (lease financing is still borrowed money, still debt, and still technically a loan) is hardly worth your money. In fact I would argue that when the risk-free rate (US treasuries) have a tield above a loan rate you should always borrow money and invest your cash.
I agree...but if you are one of the lucky folks who have a few thousand dollars sitting in the bank or even in a CD, then multiple security deposits are a good way to go. The effective yield works out to be 10% or more.
However, in many cases folks are putting down money up front to reduce their monthly payments. If they take that same money and apply it to multiple security deposits, they actually save money over the life of the lease. Yes, the monthly payments will be a little higher than if you give the money up front, but at the end you get back all those multiple security deposits. If you add up all the costs, it was cheaper to lease the car using multiple security deposits than if you put the money down in front. Of course, you do have the higher monthly payments.
My conservative financial view is that if you are spending every dollar and can't afford slightly higher monthly payments to save money in the long term, then you probably should be considering a less expensive car.
I would like to believe that most buyers of $45K cars can actually afford a slightly higher monthly payment to save money.
No one should borrow to take advantage of multiple security deposits
I am working with a dealer to get a 24mo/12k lease on a 2006 m35x. The dealer told me that he does not believe I can reduce the .00044 mf by making multiple security deposits on a 24 mo lease. (He said you could do it on the 36 and 39). I asked him to go back and confirm with IFS.
Does anyone have any info that would help answer this? Everything I have read here suggests that you can would be able to do this.
I leased my 06 M35 on 24 month lease 21 days ago and reduced my mf from .00044 to .00004 with four multiple security deposits. Your dealer is wrong....
Thanks again you guys are great! Can you explain briefly the formula (hypothetically or using known current values if possible) for determining the approx monthly note now that I know the selling price is $55k? Assuming they agree to use that figure for the lease calcs. And maybe assume another $650 for origination. In other words I have read here that you need the selling price, MF and residual amt. I just don't know how they all come together???? If you could just run down the formula using say 60% residual on 39mo lease I could then recalculate with actuals as need be. Thanks Stick
Current offer on a 2006 M35: MSRP $41490 down 2,875+ 550 administration+ ttx Capitalization $38,615 Residual $27383 in 24 months 12,000 miles monthly payment $479. is it a good deal?
If I understand your post, it's a terrible deal. Are you telling us that you are going to pay full price (MSRP) and give the dealer $2875 plus origination fee plus tax when you drive out the door. If so, that's just crazy.
Now..if the deal is that the MSRP of the car is $41490 and you have negotiated the price of the car down by $2875 to $38615 and you are paying $550 plus tax out the door, then it sounds like a good deal.
I would offer invoice price for a demo car. People are paying less than $750 over invoice for a brand new car.
I would also give infiniti 2 extra security deposits ($1500) which would lower your mf to .00008. By doing this, you will pay about $18 less every month...so you will save $18x24payments=$432 over the life of the lease..and you will get your $1500 back at the end...it's a security deposit, not a down payment. That's pretty good interest on your $1500...about 13% a year. If you put that $1500 in a CD at 5%, you would make only $153. Would you prefer to have an extra $432 in your pocket at the end of two years or $153?
Thanks ghstudio I've not gone to the dealer, but I saw the offer in the Infiniti web page, they do say that price can be negotiated with the dealer, I guess what you are saying is to find the invoice price, negotiate from there, and then see what would be the lease payment will be. any idea what is a good amount to offer over invoice for a 2006 m35?
At this point in the 06 model year, I would consider $300 over invoice fair...your mileage may vary. I wouldn't buy a base M35 though...I would buy one with at least the journey package and I'd recommend navigation. Part of the joy of the M is the gadgets.
I would assume that my used 2006 M45 is worth around $45000. I am not sure why theirs would be worth much more. If you are going to pay close to full boat, why not get an '07? An '07 will also be worth more if for some reason you have to get out of the lease.
If you don't mind can you let me know the dealer and state where this was done? I actually had a dealer in NY say that they can't take additional scty deposits by law. The dealer I am dealing with is telling me that he can't reduce the mf below .18 so he will take 2 deposits and bring it down to .24. (seems odd to me but when I try and check with IFS they say talk to your dealer).
I am looking at a 2007 M35x with Technology and Advanced Technology packages. The MSRP is 51450, and the Invoice is 47298. What would be a good 24 and 36 month price? Also would someone please explain to me the advantage of a security deposit... I have heard that it is not needed if you have a good credit report.. but i have also heard that it will lower the price of your car... Thanks
I have not yet been quoted... but I think it will be similar to this
24 mo MF- .00275 Residual 65% 36 mo MF- .00275 Residual 52%
Why don't you call another infiniti dealer in NY State and see what they can do for you. I guess it's possible that your dealer is tacking on some MF for himself and he won't give that up....but that's a guess.
I only looked at the 24 month lease. The $610 looks right...you are paying a mf of .00044 which you could reduce to .00004 with 4 additional security deposits, if you wanted (see my previous posts on that topic).
My question is why are you paying $2164 when you pick up the car? First payment is $610 plus registration fee ($150?) plus tax on the $610...but that doesn't total $2164. The origination fee of $550 is bundled into the lease calculations so it's included in the $610.
When I leased last month, I left the dealer after giving him a check for my first month's lease payment plus the registration transfer fee....as well as four security deposits. You seem to be paying some other fee up front.
I just negotiated a lease for a 2006 M35X with journey/tech/sirius package. I utilized the VPP program to get a price of about 47,300 for a 51K car...I know that price is not negotiable...I think I did fine there.
I am doing a 36 month lease. Here are the terms I was able to get (thanks to this board). MF .000125 (they say its the buy rate), residual 53% (they say thats the buy rate). I feel good about this deal, but I was wondering about the residual. Does 53 sound right? They said it was from their book. Do you think I can get .54? I saw someone on this board even mention .55. Any thoughts on this deal in its totality would be appreciated.
I read the board and saw that you mentioned .000098 and 54% as the buy rates on 7/12. My offer was .000125 and 53%. Do you think they have room? It actually ends up making about a $500 difference over the life of the lease if those numbers are attainable.
Also, I did some calculations on VPP. Because of the 2.5% destination cost add-on, I actually come netting a purchase price of slightly higher then I think I could negotiate. What is a "good price for an 06 M35X? 300, 500, 1000 over invoice???
You have to be careful when reading other people's mf and residuals. Each M model has it's own mf and residual and the residual changes whether it's a 12K or 15K lease. You don't mention if you have a 12k or 15K mile lease but you are certainly in the right ballpark. You can't negotiate residuals...they are whatever infiniti says they are. Ask them to show you the infiniti rates on their computer screen or on a printout. They are what they are.
why the $1700 first payment??? Great that you took advantage of the MSD....
I don't think you'll do better than this month's rates on the 06's.... Next month the monthly payments on'07s may come down a little...actually I expect the residuals on the 07's to go up but with the same mf. Of course, that's just a wild guess on my part.
the current rate on a 36 month M35X lease is .00106, NOT .000106. the third zero makes about an $80/month difference. I had thought the rate was .000125, turns out they misread that to me and that they meant to say .00125. I spoke to a friend in the business and he told me MF's do not go out more then 5 digits past the decimal...So i guess it was an honest mistake. The money factor on the 24 month lease is actually next to nothing (.00001).
So, after tons of research, I finalized and purchased the car tonight. I was able to get a 36 month lease with the hourney/tech on the M35X with everything rolled in for $720/month. My MF was .00106 and the residual was 54%...fyi, I saw the rate sheet and all the "buy rate" info and I think my residual was supposed to be 53, not 54%....
I am finalizing a deal a 2006 M35X Journey Tech List is 51K sales price is 47K $1500 at signing includes first month's payment, tags and acquisition fee. 39 Months 15K Miles Residual is 53% and factor is .00106 I am also interested in a 24 month lease Residual is 65% and factor is .00044
Please let me know what the payment "should" be with these numbers.
How about reading back in this forum where there are excellent entries about leasing....there are also a few previous posts that that point to calculators.
While you're at it, read about multiple security deposits and other options that will save you money.
i was quoted a 2 year 24,000 lease of a 2006 m45 sport with technology package for 650.00 a month. with 5000 down. My first lease am I in trouble with this or does this sound good?
You are correct, not all car manufacturers offer a multiple security deposit option...and each one that does offers you a different financial benefit. This is an Infiniti forum and Infiniti does offer the MSD option. For each additional security deposit (rounded up to the nearest $50), Infiniti Finance lowers the MF by .0001 . That reduces your monthly payment.
Comments
1) car dealers just love to perform magic and only quote you the monthly price you pay. The reality is that with the
quoted lease, you are actually paying $450 + ($10000/39) = $706 a month for the car.
2) I would bet that if you kept that $10K and used part of it for multiple security deposits you would be way ahead at the end.
Near as I can tell, you are being asked to pay full price for the car which is somewhat crazy given that the 07's are still out.
So....read this forum, then negotiate the purchase price of the car with no lease, then calculate the lease with no down payment, then calculate the lease with multiple security deposits....and now you know where you are.
Now ask the dealer how much he is really giving you for your car....because they just love to quote $10K but that's what they take off the MSRP...Since you could actually buy the new car for $2K less than MSRP. You're really getting only $8K. Be careful.
If you want to give the dealer the difference between the $10k (or whatever he really is giving you) and the multiple security deposits that's fine. Divide whatever you give him by 39 (length of lease) and subtract that from your monthly lease cost. You're just prepaying part of the costs up front.
Good luck...post your new price here
"The 07 rates and residuals are .00275/54% for 36 mo and 15 k with 700+ "
This is a M35 sedan (not sport/or awd)
COmpany is Wells Fargo bank. Any insights would be helpful. Thanks.
MSRP $60070
PPrice- $55000
-Trd $10000 (ish)
Bal. $45000
Residual ~$37243 62% or so i was told. Seem correct??
Bal-Resid ~$8250
LsTerm- 36-39mos 12k miles
Does this sound right??
Car-Man Can you compute? Help? Thanks
Stick
You don't mention the money factor ??? Yes, you can give them the tradein money to cut the payments, but please read my comments on multiple security deposits. It's a much better way to reduce the total cost of the lease and will save you money.
You also don't give their lease figure....remember they add on some costs (origination fee, administrative fee, etc) which can change all the numbers. You have to know the total costs.
Stick
If, on the other hand, you are carrying a mortgage at 6% and credit cards at 9-18 pct, saving a few basis points on a 20K loan (lease financing is still borrowed money, still debt, and still technically a loan) is hardly worth your money. In fact I would argue that when the risk-free rate (US treasuries) have a tield above a loan rate you should always borrow money and invest your cash.
However, in many cases folks are putting down money up front to reduce their monthly payments. If they take that same money and apply it to multiple security deposits, they actually save money over the life of the lease. Yes, the monthly payments will be a little higher than if you give the money up front, but at the end you get back all those multiple security deposits. If you add up all the costs, it was cheaper to lease the car using multiple security deposits than if you put the money down in front. Of course, you do have the higher monthly payments.
My conservative financial view is that if you are spending every dollar and can't afford slightly higher monthly payments to save money in the long term, then you probably should be considering a less expensive car.
I would like to believe that most buyers of $45K cars can actually afford a slightly higher monthly payment to save money.
No one should borrow to take advantage of multiple security deposits
Does anyone have any info that would help answer this? Everything I have read here suggests that you can would be able to do this.
Thanks for the help!
Stick
MSRP $41490
down 2,875+ 550 administration+ ttx
Capitalization $38,615
Residual $27383 in 24 months
12,000 miles
monthly payment $479.
is it a good deal?
MSSRP- $58,570
Invoice- $53,250
Best offer- $54,000
24 mth - MF - .00028
Residual 65%
The car has been used as a managers demo and has 3,900 miles on it. Any ideas on what an aggressively fair price reduction for this usage would be?
This is my final Ace in the neogiation. Thanks for your input!
Now..if the deal is that the MSRP of the car is $41490 and you have negotiated the price of the car down by $2875 to $38615 and you are paying $550 plus tax out the door, then it sounds like a good deal.
which is it?
I would also give infiniti 2 extra security deposits ($1500) which would lower your mf to .00008. By doing this, you will pay about $18 less every month...so you will save $18x24payments=$432 over the life of the lease..and you will get your $1500 back at the end...it's a security deposit, not a down payment. That's pretty good interest on your $1500...about 13% a year. If you put that $1500 in a CD at 5%, you would make only $153. Would you prefer to have an extra $432 in your pocket at the end of two years or $153?
http://www.edmunds.com/advice/leasing/articles/48365/article.html
I've not gone to the dealer, but I saw the offer in the Infiniti web page, they do say that price can be negotiated with the dealer, I guess what you are saying is to find the invoice price, negotiate from there, and then see what would be the lease payment will be.
any idea what is a good amount to offer over invoice for a 2006 m35?
I have not yet been quoted... but I think it will be similar to this
24 mo MF- .00275 Residual 65%
36 mo MF- .00275 Residual 52%
Why don't you call another infiniti dealer in NY State and see what they can do for you. I guess it's possible that your dealer is tacking on some MF for himself and he won't give that up....but that's a guess.
List $51,140
Purchase price is $46,990
lease:
39 month 39000 miles
1st payment, tax, title, lic due $2877.xx
$644.xx per month.
24 month 24000 miles
1st payment, tax, title, lic. Due $2164.xx
$610.xx per month.
Residual for 24 month is 66 percent and rate is 1.056%
My question is why are you paying $2164 when you pick up the car? First payment is $610 plus registration fee ($150?) plus tax on the $610...but that doesn't total $2164. The origination fee of $550 is bundled into the lease calculations so it's included in the $610.
When I leased last month, I left the dealer after giving him a check for my first month's lease payment plus the registration transfer fee....as well as four security deposits. You seem to be paying some other fee up front.
I just negotiated a lease for a 2006 M35X with journey/tech/sirius package. I utilized the VPP program to get a price of about 47,300 for a 51K car...I know that price is not negotiable...I think I did fine there.
I am doing a 36 month lease. Here are the terms I was able to get (thanks to this board). MF .000125 (they say its the buy rate), residual 53% (they say thats the buy rate). I feel good about this deal, but I was wondering about the residual. Does 53 sound right? They said it was from their book. Do you think I can get .54? I saw someone on this board even mention .55. Any thoughts on this deal in its totality would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Rich
39 month @ 10K per year
First payment $1700
MSD 9x$600=$5400
Monthly payment $515
Please let me know
Also, I did some calculations on VPP. Because of the 2.5% destination cost add-on, I actually come netting a purchase price of slightly higher then I think I could negotiate. What is a "good price for an 06 M35X? 300, 500, 1000 over invoice???
I will ask to see the residual at the dealership. I cant wait to get it!
I guess the deals next month on the 06 cant get much better then what they are now...time to act....
I don't think you'll do better than this month's rates on the 06's.... Next month the monthly payments on'07s may come down a little...actually I expect the residuals on the 07's to go up but with the same mf. Of course, that's just a wild guess on my part.
Has he migrated elsewhere? Thanks..
So, after tons of research, I finalized and purchased the car tonight. I was able to get a 36 month lease with the hourney/tech on the M35X with everything rolled in for $720/month. My MF was .00106 and the residual was 54%...fyi, I saw the rate sheet and all the "buy rate" info and I think my residual was supposed to be 53, not 54%....
Multiple security deposits could have brought your mf down to .00036.
List is 51K sales price is 47K
$1500 at signing includes first month's payment, tags and acquisition fee.
39 Months 15K Miles
Residual is 53% and factor is .00106
I am also interested in a 24 month lease
Residual is 65% and factor is .00044
Please let me know what the payment "should" be with these numbers.
Thanks
While you're at it, read about multiple security deposits and other options that will save you money.
5000 down includes first month, tax, dmv fees plates etc. drop off to home or office fee
between 535-550 month 24 month 15,000 miles a year