It's comical that a Rover dealer is calling other brands "junk".
Isn't it though. Land Rover, the keeper of the bottom position in any and everything concerning quality. You must overlook things salesmen say because often times they're just here to shamelessly (and cluelessly) bash any competitor in the hopes of making the products they sell look better.
That post was moved from one thread to another without my knowlegde. I wouldn't come into some other thread and bash the car outright. I only drove the GL around the parking lot last night but my plan was to drive it around some town today and give a more through review of it with both positive and negatives that I would post here.
Now if you would still like me to I will post a more thorough review of the car but be sure I will not pull any punches.
The lack of a safety catch in the power seat alone would disuade me from ever considering that car at all. I am a full sized adult that weighs well over 200 lbs. Keeping in mind that those rear seats are not really designed for a full sized adult and that mostly children will be back there and children love to play with buttons what do you think will happen?
Some 40 lbs kid is going to hit the close button and get pinned against the second row seat. When I was pinned against it it was at the chest level but a small child is going to have his face pushed right into the seat back.
Tried it myself today at the local dealer. As soon as I put any resistance at all against it, it released and went back. Don't think anyone has anything to worry about. The seats are well engineered and very comfortable, unlike some third row seats.
Tried it myself today at the local dealer. As soon as I put any resistance at all against it, it released and went back. Don't think anyone has anything to worry about.
Thank you, I tried the same thing in a GL450 Premier Edition a while back just as I would in any other vehicle and the seat didn't put any "force" on me either. It simply stopped moving, this about them crushing someone is utter nonsense.
Maybe there is just something wrong with this truck then. The seat pushed me into the back of the second row and continued to push me into it for a few seconds before it stopped. The fact that the seat moves at all is not good. They put weight sensors in front passenger seats to shut down an air bag why not put weight sensors in the third row seats to shut them off when anything over say 20 lbs is in them.
I dunno, but I have never been able to duplicate what you've stated since I saw you post that and once before when the GL first came out I toyed around with the 3rd row because it was power operated. I don't see a company like MB making a third row seat that is going to crush anyone.
Thats what blew my mind that first of all the seat actually moved with me sitting in it and secondly that it would push me against the second row seat with enough force to cause some pain.
Now I have broken just about every one of my ribs multiple times so maybe that is part of. I still think the seat should have a sensor in it to prevent it from moving when there is weight upon it.
I dunno what to say, I just don't see that happening and I couldn't duplicate it and I wasn't even sitting in the seat when it stopped. Just a firm press of the hand was all it took to make it stop.
I currently own a 05 Range Rover and have been very happy with the product. No problems, drives through anything, but the gas station. I'm thinking of trading it in for the Supercharge Range Rover. I looked at the GL, but it resembles the Toyota Forerunner. I own and owned several Mercedes and have to say that their quality has gone down tremendously. What lured me to buy our current Mercedes was the lease special that they had. How could I pass up a $55K car for $515.00 with tax for 27 months at 15K miles a year. It makes a great third car.
I agree sometimes salesmen can go overboard with their comments; though, there is no reason to believe the salesman attempted to may the Range Rover look better than the GL.
As it relates to Land Rover’s quality, I've had 25K trouble free miles on my 2005 Range Rover, which is more than I can say about the unreliable Benz I traded. I’ve seen too many older model Land Rovers on the road in the five states I’ve lived in to believe the majority of Land Rovers are as unreliable as the surveys report. Feel free to believe whatever you want!!!
Even if I currently had minor problems, I'd still buy another Land Rover. The classic styling EASILY turns heads. Certainly the same can’t be said about the boring soccer mom minivan look of the GL. $65K for a souped up M-Class, err minivan – no thanks!!!
Style is in the eye of the beholder. Those I know consider the LR an ugly shoe box and only turn their heads in courtesy prior to ralfing. Just another opinion. I wouldn't trade my GL for a Brit safari truck.
Well not to revist that issue, but I think you need to read those posts again. When you start calling things "junk" and what not it appears to be but a plug for whatever product you're selling.
The GL is a just a larger ML for sure, but it is no mini-van.
I'd take a Range Rover Sport Supercharged over the GL or ML too, well except for maybe the ML63 AMG. I said from the beginning that Land Rover still has the edge in luxury SUVs over various offerings from MB, BMW, Audi, Lexus and Cadillac. Land Rovers are unique while the others aren't so much so, IMO.
As I stated previously my post was taken from another thread entirely and inserted into this one. I made a quick blurb in the thread about my initial impressions on the GL and was planning to come back and make a more complete review of the vehicle.
I never really got the chance as by the time I had a chance to drive the truck and shoot some video with my little digital camera the posts had already been moved here and I was being attacked.
I have already asked if anyone wanted to see the video from my more complete review but I am not going to pust it if I am going to be crucified.
Hello. The msrp is $55675 as per mbusa.com. Consumer Reports reports that the bottom line price this vehicle can be had is for $49410. Edmunds says the invoice is for $51057. So, lets hear about some of your buying/negotiating/getting a deal out there. Who's getting the best deal, how much did you pay, what options, where, and how did you do it? I'd appreciate it and I'm positive there are others will appreciate it as well. Thank you.
Hi Howlys, we have a whole discussion devoted to GL pricing. Never understood why people in the US want to pay for the invoice info when all that is available at Edmunds for free.
I know that Mercedes has been taking a lot of heat for their quality. I used to own a 1999 ML 320 and now drive a Toyota Landcruiser. My experience with with the 1999 ML320 has been reasonabily good. I drove it for about 80K Miles and the things I had to fix are:
Alarm Replaced (Warranty) Driver side Window (Warranty) Transmission Shift Control Module (Unde Warranty) Mass Air flow Sensor ($300)
Other than this, I did 80 miles without any major problems. I was never stranded or never had to be towed. Used to get about 20 MPG on highways. My experience was never so bad that I will rule out a Mercedez vehicle.
I am really happy with my Landcruiser and the only reason I am considering the GL320 CDI is because I drive about 60 miles to work each day and could use the milage. I average about 16 MPG in mixed driving in my Landcruiser.
I am still worried about the Mercedez quality, but I am hoping that they have got the message by now with all the bad press that they have been getting. I would still wait for the second model year. The 1998 ML320 owners had a lot more problem than I had.
I am switching from my current Porsche Cayenne S to a GL450 (did some extensive driving on the GL to compare - acceleration & power is almost identical, though the Porsche feels a lot sportier (naturally) and you tend to go faster - the GL feels more contained and calming) - main reason being troubles with terrible quality on the Cayenne (16 pages of repairs in 3 years - I am in the shop every 3 month and the dealer just does not care :lemon: ) and the additional space in the GL.
1st Question for you: I have challenges getting the Cayenne cold in the summer in Las Vegas - the AirCondition runs on full blast for a long time and the rear is still hot - how is the 3-Zone A/C of the GL working out in the heat, does it cool the car all the way to the back? Noone could tell me yet if it actually has a separate compressor for the rear A/C
2nd Question: What extras/add-ons you feel are must haves and which ones are not working out as good as you thought - any recommendations?
3rd Question: Has anyone got any idea on resale value of the GL - any prediction on loss of value in 3-4 years?
The cars i am looking at are the Q7, GL, R-class, new x5, and mabie the escalade or gmc yukon denali. Right now i am leaning towards the Audi Q7, GL seemed very ordinary looking, used to like R, now i think it looks hideous, and the new X5 actually looks very interesting, but i dont want to wait for it to come out. Any ideas on what i should get...??? :confuse:
Looked at pretty much the same cars, here is my conclusion (ordered the GL today): Cadillac/GMC/Suburban: Lots of space, but pretty mediocre quality of finishes and details, did not appear very refined. Drives like a big truck, while pretty fast accelerating, once you turn the wheel these SUV's show their construction on a ladder frame, not very reassuring. The main reason why not buying them though where the breaks - stopping from 70mph take a good 20feet longer than the others :confuse:
R-Class:Looked promising on paper, drove it when it first came out but it was not convincing, sluggish and neither better than a Minivan nor an SUV, not my choice. Pretty good discounts on the car by now, though. While it has 6 seats, luggage space is virtually none (enough for a case of water maybe, but certainly not for family food-shopping if you have the seats full.
X5: I don't like the dashboard of the newer BMW's (remember the curved dashboard in the 90's of BMW, they had created a great cockpit feel. The X5 drives okay, but is beaten in every category (including price) by the Porsche Cayenne
Porsche Cayenne: Great car, drives very very sporty (I actually have one right now), fast, great handling in corners, great breaks, great resale value, unfortunately only 5 seats - but if you don't need more, it beats all others hands down (and with the new Titanium Special Edition is is virtually the same price as the GL, I calculated my new GL to within $300 of the Cayenne with almost the same equipment.
Audi Q7: the Audi was actually my hope for replacing my Cayenne, same base just a bit stretched with 7 seats, but I was very disappointing when driving it. While the outside looks are subjective (I think it is too bulky in the front and the back is almost a carbon-copy with a Toyota Sienna), I was disappointed by the way it drives. It is substantially slower than the Cayenne (almost sluggish, despite the 350HP), handles more like a truck, breaks where soft and not convincing. While it has 7 seats on paper, the back row is not usable for anyone above 10years old
Mercedes GL: While I was a big Mercedes Fan when I was young, the last 10 years I was not convinced by their cars, too soft, too comfortable, not sporty. The local Mercedes dealer is a business associate and tried to convince me of many cars, but never really successful, even after driving SL, SLK, R-class and E-Wagon over several weekends as trials. With this ' I know that I won't like it' approach I had the GL one weekend and I was surprised. While it is softer than the Cayenne and calms your driving style, it actually is exactly as fast. Interior quality and finishes seems very good, I like the look and feel. The electric third row is priceless and it actually has quite a bit more space than the Q7 - both trunk space as well as fully usable seats for adults in the third row. Exterior Styling: it really is a question of personal taste, while I don't get excited about it and you won't get the 'wow', your car is beautiful' stares that you get in the Cayenne (yup, even after 3 years), I don't think the GL looks offensive (though think it is better looking in black than in a lighter color as black integrates the many black plastic parts. The base price of $55K is deceiving, MB does not really make any with cloth seats, thus leather is a must for $1500 and by the time it is at the dealer they are almost always $65K (and then you still don't have any of the visual add-ons like bigger tires, running boards, chrome etc).
I spend quite a bit of time looking at all these cars and literally ordered a black GL today (and having said this, my heart still bleeds a bit giving up the Porsche, but I have the space requirements of my little son to blame for this).
Can verify the GL = "fast" observation with my new one, as just got a speeding ticket, going 50 (per the cop) right after leaving a hairpin curve... can't believe it, since I remembered slowing the supposedly "top-heavy truck" in the tight turn.
One tiny contrary opinion: I was reminded that running boards wreak havoc on women wearing skirts (mud adheres), if you have any, so I eschewed that and have had no complaints, with the standard (non-adjusted) height quite convenient even for our smallest passenger.
GL is a great car!! The only reason im (just decided) going to go with the Audi Q7 is i actually dont want as big of a car as the GL. I have a sequoia right now, and hate the way it drives, looks...everything about it. I wanted a big change, but stll didnt want to loose all the versatility i had with the sequoia. Plus, i didnt want to spend a lot of money. The GL can get a little pricey if you equip the way you want (i think the premier edition looks amazing and would probably buy that if i was going to get one). I think the escalade is too flashy, the r class is too ugly, and the X5 is not out yet, and i dont want to wait for it. Plus, i definetly agree about the dashboard, and that joystick gear shifter was just weird looking. The cayenne, unfortunatley, was too small for me, so it came down to the GL and Q7, and one was cheaper, better looking (in my opinion), and fit me better. If i had been using the third row more frequently in my sequoia, i would have gone with the GL, which clearly has more room for 3rd row occupants.
I am also looking at the same group of vehicles. May I presume that a Lexus was not mentioned because, although they are tall, they are narrow, and therefore not much cargo room? As to the R - without the rear seats there is a lot of room. I was thinking the diesel engine would redeem it's other shortcomings. I don't believe they are selling the gas engines too well, and deals can be made, but my it's ugly. And those back seat doors - Yikes! Edmund's long term test on the R is more flattering than I thought it would be. I drove the Yukon XL and a Sequoia today. They are trucks, plain and simple. I do like the GL a lot, but the price is out-a-sight. I wish it were selling poorly, so a deal could be made there! I read that the BMW doesn't have much room either. Too many choices, and not enough choices!!!
More than 50% of cars in Europe have a Diesel Engine - have the consumption of fuel/diesel and equally as clean & reliable. Reason they are not available here is that the US Diesel is not filtered and thus has sulphites which are poluting the air. The oil companies are not interested in cleaning as it would reduce the overall consumption of oil and eat into their profits.
As a results, all these great engines that are available in Europe (think GL420 CDI - 310hp and double the torque of the GL450, dito the 10cylinder VW Touareg) are not available.
But to come back to your question - no maintenance issues or increased costs
Err diesels do cost more to maintain then their gas counterpart. The differance is that the diesel motor will last three times as long and is twice as efficient so it balances out.
A typical diesel engine in a truck might hold 14 quarts or more of oil. The gas motor that goes in that truck will probably only hold 6-9 quarts. Preventative maintance is slightly higher but generaly service intervals are longer and the whole engine will just last longer so again it balances it out.
Yes, it is. Why else would edmunds.com have a test on it. in fact, many new dieslels are making their way to the US in the near future. An Audi Q7 V10 Turbodiesel, and possibly a diesel engine in the new bmw x5. All sound very interesting...especially the v10!!
anyone concerned with mb reliability these days..?..initial quality studies?...j.d power associates study?....mb ranks quite low?....
comments?
besides the nameplate/prestige..would anyone consider buying the upcoming hyundai veracruz over the gl450?..costs much less, more cargo room, same/more leg room, better warranty than the gl450?...or am i dreaming?
Had some concerns :confuse: re MB, but they were allayed by (a) the absolutely and consistently horrible experiences I've had with all US domestic vehicles for over 40 years, (b) the MB warrantee and extended service contract, etc., and (c) the newest JD Power report of just last week slamming :surprise: RangeRover and Saab(?) or Audi? and a bunch of (to me) surprising big SUVs as quality-deficient... and Mercedes Benz was conspicuously absent from the list of bad ones. I celebrated at NOT seeing mine panned. For the moment, at least....
Yes but you have to remember with the JD Power report all of those vehicles were from 2003, and some car makers (like audi) have "redone" their brands since then. Most of the "big grill" audis have much better quality and dependability. I think the GL would hold up fine, but the Range Rover's are known for falling apart.
Another thing to think about on the JD Power's survey is that they do not weight the "problems" they report. A problem that strands a motorist on the side of the road is given the same weight as a check engine light that results from a loose gas cap or a bit of loose trim on the inside or outside of the vehicle.
JD Power also includes percivied design flaws in at least one of their studies and that does not have anything to do with reliablity. The don't even define what a percivied design flaw is. So a cup holder that someone thinks is too far away or too small or even too large are all problems that go into their report.
Land Rover has also completly reinventied their lineup since 2003. None of the vehicles that were around in 2003 exist today with the expeption of the Range Rover and it has an entirely new powertrain and navigation system.
like i mentioned before, besides the nameplate/prestige...would ANYONE consider buying this thing over the gl450?..supposedly more cargo room, more interior room, better warranty than the mb?....
Well, the nameplate is VERY VERY VERY hard to overlook. Mercedes vs. Hyundai???? Everyone will pick MB. But...i GUESS if it was good looking, and had a very small hyundai name plate on it, it could be good. But regardless of the waranty (which i think it will need) and more room, i think the GL450 is a better car, you dont pay a premium for just the 3 pointed star emblem. The GL is worth the money. If you want something cheaper, look at a tahoe, or the upcoming GMC acadia/Buick Enclave. Mabie give hyundai a few years to gain a better reputation (which it is slowly doing).
Every year the survey comes out, people interpret it in a way to suit their biases. British Rover don't take this personally, but my question is how does Lexus remain on top? Do they make better cup-holders than MB? And does Landrover always reach the bottom of the pile every year due to bad cup holders?
We got to give some credit to these rankings from JD Power.
Because of Mercedes poor quality and reputation, I would only pick a Mercedes if the price was right. A car like the R class (ugly) that they couldn't sell, they had to give the car away. Yes, we leased one, its a great car for the nanny.
On the other hand, the 05 Range Rover, I was able to get $3000 discount from sticker. After my experience with it for over a year, I would gladly pay full price for it. I was concerned about the reliability, but hearing from my friends about their experience I decided to go for it. My feelings was what could be worse than a Mercedes. I've had no problems with the Range Rover.
My R class has some problems here and there, tranmission is starting to have a jerk to it. Read the ML forum and find alot of unhappy owners. GL is made in the same plant. Its sad that Mercedes problems continues to linger.
I recognize the fact that these two cars are not the same class of vehicle yet my wife and I have reduced our choices of our new car to the GX470 from Lexus and the GL450 from Mercedes. We have leased 2 MLs in the past 6 years and have had no problems with either of them. This time around we wanted a third-row seat so after much debate we settled on these two. I have driven both extensively and am currently negotiating deals on both, but we can't decide!! :confuse: Here are the things that are important to us: GL: More Power than GX More luxurious than GX Better handling than GX Power folding mirrors (not avail on GX) Integrated sattelite radio (only available as a separate unit on GX) Power folding third-row seat (goofy third-row in GX)
GX: Not as large as GL (12 inches shorter) Rear-seat entertainment (also available in GL but for more $$) Integrated Bluetooth (separate and expensive add-on on GL)
The difference in price is about $100/mo on a 3 year lease.
Should we get the Lexus and spend less money while still getting a nice vehicle ($1,000 over invoice), or should we go with the GL for only $100 more per month (selling below invoice - end of month deal)?
We went through the same exercise (a few messages back I wrote down my conclusions) - I actually think the GX looks pretty ugly - more like a delivery van from the back and it is at the end of the day a souped-up Toyota Land Cruiser.
I got my GL last Sunday, love it, it actually ended up quite a bit cheaper than the Lexus - maybe you have to kick your dealer a bit harder (paid $63K incl. Premium/Leather/Sunroof/Keyless/Woodwheel/3-zone (do not skip this feature)/I-pod - List was $68K).
Reading through your list you already made up your mind - go for the GL, you will not regret it
Comparison-tested and test-drove both Lexus GX and Mercedes GL (among others) and hands down, the Mercedes was superior. The smooth/slick powered 3rd seats sealed the decision. Had mine for over a month now and love it. Saw the most current JDPower SUV review had no (repeat NO) quality/reliability complaints about the Mercedes GL470 and found it superior to many of the supposedly great competitors. Don't know about other Mercedes models, but I have no regrets about this one.
Thanks for the feedback. I think I'll probably pull the trigger on the GL. This has been a really tough decision.
I have never liked the looks of the GX, but my wife likes it alot. They are also extremely common in my area whereas I have yet to se a GL on the road. She is still partial to Mercedes though and has loved our past vehicles. We just turned in our 2003 ML350 Inspiration edition. It was a really great car. I loved the looks of it and it drove great. These cars, especially the GL, feel so solid when behind the wheel. I would really miss that if we went for the Lexus. As soon as I told my dealer that I was considering a Lexus he immediately came down in price not wanting to lose a long time customer. I called back the Lexus guy to see if he would come down as well, but he replied that the "price is where it needs to be" (about 1k over invoice). This kind of ticked me off. The Mercedes dealer seems to be bending over backwards to keep my business and the Lexus guy seems to care less if I buy or not.
I seriously doubt that I will ever get the GL for cheaper than the GX. Not with the options I want anyway. The GL I am considering is a Peuter/Black GL with the Premium package, & trailer hitch for about 61k *875/mo lease (3 year / 15k miles/yr.)
Were also thinking about the Macadamia interior but are worried about it holding up with young kids in the car.
Anyway, I'll post my decision when its all finalized. I need to complete this soon because there are only 24 more hours left in the month and they are really dealing right now.
just traded a Cayenne for a GL after almost 4 years. Cayenne had tan leather seats and I have three small kids under 8, did not really have any issues with the seats getting dirty (different to my previous car which had tan cloth seats, they got very ugly dirty in no time - make sure you have leather seats on the GL).
About the interior cleanliness... yes, on the leather, and look into a brand-new interior/exterior mink oil special treatment does a Rain-X-type thing, endorsed by my Mercedes dealer. Pricey, ~$500 inside and same price for outside treatment, but lifetime guarantee from some outfit Ex...something, out of SanDiego? Have the flyer at home... talk to your local dealer, because this is brand new, from a well known chemical treatment manufacturer, repels bug/tar, makes liquids bead up even on interior carpet and I witnessed how it protects against spray paint defacement. Expect I'll pop for it soon, myself.
Comments
Isn't it though. Land Rover, the keeper of the bottom position in any and everything concerning quality. You must overlook things salesmen say because often times they're just here to shamelessly (and cluelessly) bash any competitor in the hopes of making the products they sell look better.
M
Now if you would still like me to I will post a more thorough review of the car but be sure I will not pull any punches.
The lack of a safety catch in the power seat alone would disuade me from ever considering that car at all. I am a full sized adult that weighs well over 200 lbs. Keeping in mind that those rear seats are not really designed for a full sized adult and that mostly children will be back there and children love to play with buttons what do you think will happen?
Some 40 lbs kid is going to hit the close button and get pinned against the second row seat. When I was pinned against it it was at the chest level but a small child is going to have his face pushed right into the seat back.
Thank you, I tried the same thing in a GL450 Premier Edition a while back just as I would in any other vehicle and the seat didn't put any "force" on me either. It simply stopped moving, this about them crushing someone is utter nonsense.
M
M
Now I have broken just about every one of my ribs multiple times so maybe that is part of. I still think the seat should have a sensor in it to prevent it from moving when there is weight upon it.
M
M
Thanks.
I currently own a 05 Range Rover and have been very happy with the product. No problems, drives through anything, but the gas station. I'm thinking of trading it in for the Supercharge Range Rover. I looked at the GL, but it resembles the Toyota Forerunner. I own and owned several Mercedes and have to say that their quality has gone down tremendously. What lured me to buy our current Mercedes was the lease special that they had. How could I pass up a $55K car for $515.00 with tax for 27 months at 15K miles a year. It makes a great third car.
As it relates to Land Rover’s quality, I've had 25K trouble free miles on my 2005 Range Rover, which is more than I can say about the unreliable Benz I traded. I’ve seen too many older model Land Rovers on the road in the five states I’ve lived in to believe the majority of Land Rovers are as unreliable as the surveys report. Feel free to believe whatever you want!!!
Even if I currently had minor problems, I'd still buy another Land Rover. The classic styling EASILY turns heads. Certainly the same can’t be said about the boring soccer mom minivan look of the GL. $65K for a souped up M-Class, err minivan – no thanks!!!
The GL is a just a larger ML for sure, but it is no mini-van.
I'd take a Range Rover Sport Supercharged over the GL or ML too, well except for maybe the ML63 AMG. I said from the beginning that Land Rover still has the edge in luxury SUVs over various offerings from MB, BMW, Audi, Lexus and Cadillac. Land Rovers are unique while the others aren't so much so, IMO.
M
I never really got the chance as by the time I had a chance to drive the truck and shoot some video with my little digital camera the posts had already been moved here and I was being attacked.
I have already asked if anyone wanted to see the video from my more complete review but I am not going to pust it if I am going to be crucified.
Oh but of course, I'd like to read the review and the see the video!
M
Please continue in Mercedes Benz GL-Class: Prices Paid & Buying Experience
Alarm Replaced (Warranty)
Driver side Window (Warranty)
Transmission Shift Control Module (Unde Warranty)
Mass Air flow Sensor ($300)
Other than this, I did 80 miles without any major problems. I was never stranded or never had to be towed. Used to get about 20 MPG on highways. My experience was never so bad that I will rule out a Mercedez vehicle.
I am really happy with my Landcruiser and the only reason I am considering the GL320 CDI is because I drive about 60 miles to work each day and could use the milage. I average about 16 MPG in mixed driving in my Landcruiser.
I am still worried about the Mercedez quality, but I am hoping that they have got the message by now with all the bad press that they have been getting. I would still wait for the second model year. The 1998 ML320 owners had a lot more problem than I had.
1st Question for you: I have challenges getting the Cayenne cold in the summer in Las Vegas - the AirCondition runs on full blast for a long time and the rear is still hot - how is the 3-Zone A/C of the GL working out in the heat, does it cool the car all the way to the back? Noone could tell me yet if it actually has a separate compressor for the rear A/C
2nd Question: What extras/add-ons you feel are must haves and which ones are not working out as good as you thought - any recommendations?
3rd Question: Has anyone got any idea on resale value of the GL - any prediction on loss of value in 3-4 years?
Tks for your help
T
True Cost to Own
Cadillac/GMC/Suburban: Lots of space, but pretty mediocre quality of finishes and details, did not appear very refined. Drives like a big truck, while pretty fast accelerating, once you turn the wheel these SUV's show their construction on a ladder frame, not very reassuring. The main reason why not buying them though where the breaks - stopping from 70mph take a good 20feet longer than the others :confuse:
R-Class:Looked promising on paper, drove it when it first came out but it was not convincing, sluggish and neither better than a Minivan nor an SUV, not my choice. Pretty good discounts on the car by now, though. While it has 6 seats, luggage space is virtually none (enough for a case of water maybe, but certainly not for family food-shopping if you have the seats full.
X5: I don't like the dashboard of the newer BMW's (remember the curved dashboard in the 90's of BMW, they had created a great cockpit feel. The X5 drives okay, but is beaten in every category (including price) by the Porsche Cayenne
Porsche Cayenne: Great car, drives very very sporty (I actually have one right now), fast, great handling in corners, great breaks, great resale value, unfortunately only 5 seats - but if you don't need more, it beats all others hands down (and with the new Titanium Special Edition is is virtually the same price as the GL, I calculated my new GL to within $300 of the Cayenne with almost the same equipment.
Audi Q7: the Audi was actually my hope for replacing my Cayenne, same base just a bit stretched with 7 seats, but I was very disappointing when driving it. While the outside looks are subjective (I think it is too bulky in the front and the back is almost a carbon-copy with a Toyota Sienna), I was disappointed by the way it drives. It is substantially slower than the Cayenne (almost sluggish, despite the 350HP), handles more like a truck, breaks where soft and not convincing. While it has 7 seats on paper, the back row is not usable for anyone above 10years old
Mercedes GL: While I was a big Mercedes Fan when I was young, the last 10 years I was not convinced by their cars, too soft, too comfortable, not sporty. The local Mercedes dealer is a business associate and tried to convince me of many cars, but never really successful, even after driving SL, SLK, R-class and E-Wagon over several weekends as trials. With this ' I know that I won't like it' approach I had the GL one weekend and I was surprised. While it is softer than the Cayenne and calms your driving style, it actually is exactly as fast. Interior quality and finishes seems very good, I like the look and feel. The electric third row is priceless and it actually has quite a bit more space than the Q7 - both trunk space as well as fully usable seats for adults in the third row. Exterior Styling: it really is a question of personal taste, while I don't get excited about it and you won't get the 'wow', your car is beautiful' stares that you get in the Cayenne (yup, even after 3 years), I don't think the GL looks offensive (though think it is better looking in black than in a lighter color as black integrates the many black plastic parts. The base price of $55K is deceiving, MB does not really make any with cloth seats, thus leather is a must for $1500 and by the time it is at the dealer they are almost always $65K (and then you still don't have any of the visual add-ons like bigger tires, running boards, chrome etc).
I spend quite a bit of time looking at all these cars and literally ordered a black GL today (and having said this, my heart still bleeds a bit giving up the Porsche, but I have the space requirements of my little son to blame for this).
Can verify the GL = "fast" observation with my new one, as just got a speeding ticket, going 50 (per the cop) right after leaving a hairpin curve... can't believe it, since I remembered slowing the supposedly "top-heavy truck" in the tight turn.
One tiny contrary opinion: I was reminded that running boards wreak havoc on women wearing skirts (mud adheres), if you have any, so I eschewed that and have had no complaints, with the standard (non-adjusted) height quite convenient even for our smallest passenger.
As to the R - without the rear seats there is a lot of room. I was thinking the diesel engine would redeem it's other shortcomings. I don't believe they are selling the gas engines too well, and deals can be made, but my it's ugly. And those back seat doors - Yikes!
Edmund's long term test on the R is more flattering than I thought it would be.
I drove the Yukon XL and a Sequoia today. They are trucks, plain and simple.
I do like the GL a lot, but the price is out-a-sight. I wish it were selling poorly, so a deal could be made there!
I read that the BMW doesn't have much room either.
Too many choices, and not enough choices!!!
thanks
As a results, all these great engines that are available in Europe (think GL420 CDI - 310hp and double the torque of the GL450, dito the 10cylinder VW Touareg) are not available.
But to come back to your question - no maintenance issues or increased costs
A typical diesel engine in a truck might hold 14 quarts or more of oil. The gas motor that goes in that truck will probably only hold 6-9 quarts. Preventative maintance is slightly higher but generaly service intervals are longer and the whole engine will just last longer so again it balances it out.
comments?
besides the nameplate/prestige..would anyone consider buying the upcoming hyundai veracruz over the gl450?..costs much less, more cargo room, same/more leg room, better warranty than the gl450?...or am i dreaming?
anyone?
JD Power also includes percivied design flaws in at least one of their studies and that does not have anything to do with reliablity. The don't even define what a percivied design flaw is. So a cup holder that someone thinks is too far away or too small or even too large are all problems that go into their report.
Land Rover has also completly reinventied their lineup since 2003. None of the vehicles that were around in 2003 exist today with the expeption of the Range Rover and it has an entirely new powertrain and navigation system.
comments?
We got to give some credit to these rankings from JD Power.
On the other hand, the 05 Range Rover, I was able to get $3000 discount from sticker. After my experience with it for over a year, I would gladly pay full price for it. I was concerned about the reliability, but hearing from my friends about their experience I decided to go for it. My feelings was what could be worse than a Mercedes. I've had no problems with the Range Rover.
My R class has some problems here and there, tranmission is starting to have a jerk to it. Read the ML forum and find alot of unhappy owners. GL is made in the same plant. Its sad that Mercedes problems continues to linger.
Here are the things that are important to us:
GL:
More Power than GX
More luxurious than GX
Better handling than GX
Power folding mirrors (not avail on GX)
Integrated sattelite radio (only available as a separate unit on GX)
Power folding third-row seat (goofy third-row in GX)
GX:
Not as large as GL (12 inches shorter)
Rear-seat entertainment (also available in GL but for more $$)
Integrated Bluetooth (separate and expensive add-on on GL)
The difference in price is about $100/mo on a 3 year lease.
Should we get the Lexus and spend less money while still getting a nice vehicle ($1,000 over invoice), or should we go with the GL for only $100 more per month (selling below invoice - end of month deal)?
M
I got my GL last Sunday, love it, it actually ended up quite a bit cheaper than the Lexus - maybe you have to kick your dealer a bit harder (paid $63K incl. Premium/Leather/Sunroof/Keyless/Woodwheel/3-zone (do not skip this feature)/I-pod - List was $68K).
Reading through your list you already made up your mind - go for the GL, you will not regret it
I have never liked the looks of the GX, but my wife likes it alot. They are also extremely common in my area whereas I have yet to se a GL on the road. She is still partial to Mercedes though and has loved our past vehicles. We just turned in our 2003 ML350 Inspiration edition. It was a really great car. I loved the looks of it and it drove great. These cars, especially the GL, feel so solid when behind the wheel. I would really miss that if we went for the Lexus.
As soon as I told my dealer that I was considering a Lexus he immediately came down in price not wanting to lose a long time customer. I called back the Lexus guy to see if he would come down as well, but he replied that the "price is where it needs to be" (about 1k over invoice). This kind of ticked me off. The Mercedes dealer seems to be bending over backwards to keep my business and the Lexus guy seems to care less if I buy or not.
I seriously doubt that I will ever get the GL for cheaper than the GX. Not with the options I want anyway.
The GL I am considering is a Peuter/Black GL with the Premium package, & trailer hitch for about 61k *875/mo lease (3 year / 15k miles/yr.)
Were also thinking about the Macadamia interior but are worried about it holding up with young kids in the car.
Anyway, I'll post my decision when its all finalized. I need to complete this soon because there are only 24 more hours left in the month and they are really dealing right now.
thanks