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Pontiac GTO Strut Problems

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    dmsdesigndmsdesign Member Posts: 18
    The strut issue has not been Pontiacs brightest moment, that is for sure. but all of you should look at your front struts if it is a 2006. There is a paper on each of the struts. In the top corner of the paper is a build date. If it is form 1/15/06 to about 5/6/06, then you have what Pontiacs says is the "wrong oil". Also those of you who have had the struts replaced, makes sure they replaced the 2 bolts and nuts that secure the strut to the knuckle at the bottom (2 sets per strut) and the nut the secures the strut together. GM says they are 1 time usages only./ If they did, they would be charged out and show on your repair order. If they do not, then the dealership re-used them. They do not come with the OEM strut

    Also, there is a 95% chance your upper strut bushing is collapsed. I think it is due to the GM putting a spring limiter on the front coil springs when they ship them from overseas. Then they chain down the GTO. This puts long term very serious upward tension on the strut bushing, to the point where I have seen them tear. If the center portion of the strut bushing is equal to or higher than the outer part, then it is collapsed and damaged. What can this do? This can cause your front end to sag and eventually create noises by allowing metal/metal contact inside the strut tower in the fender. I also believe when the strut bushing collapses enough, camber and tow will change, thus you may have accelerated inside tread tire wear. We have seen this especially on vehicles with over 15k miles on them
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    plistplist Member Posts: 19
    dmsdesign

    Thanks for the info especially how to find build date info!
    plist
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    silvanovsilvanov Member Posts: 8
    I received a letter from Pontiac yesterday that started " We would like to discuss your request for assistance regarding your 2006 Pontiac GTO....". I had submitted my reimbursement claim for the rental that I had (while my GTO could not be driven) at the end of September. As of Dec. 8, 2006 I had not yet received my check for ~$950. Numerous attempts to contact the customer service rep failed. She did not return my calls and at times her voice mail was full and no message could be left. The last contact I had with the customer service rep was the end of October, a voice mail left for me saying she had good news. I called Pontiac yesterday evening and talked to some more customer service people. The first person I talked to said that my case was closed and was curios as to why I was calling since my car had been repaired. I explained I had not yet received my money and I was put on hold. He tried to contact the customer service rep that was not returning my calls and he could not reach her. He poked around a bit more and said that the request for a check had been made and that I would receive it in 3-6 weeks. Nonetheless, he transferred me to yet another customer service rep that handles more difficult calls. I spoke to this young lady and explained my situation and I received a completely different set of answers. My case had been closed either Nov. 1 or 16 (I can't recall which date she said) because they could not contact me. There was no explanation why my numerous calls and messages I left for the customer service rep assigned to me were never answered or returned. There was no explanation as to why the letter I had received which was dated Dec 5, 2007 implied that my case was still open. In the end the customer service rep said she would see to it that a check be issued. Now I am totally confused. I guess I’ll have to wait to see if I ever get a check, and if it is for the correct amount.
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    lenorelenore Member Posts: 3
    I didn't mention in my previous message #44 that there also was an oil leak from my rear main seal that ad to be fixed and that my evaporator case had to be replaced, but now I am having to put a new rear end in and they are going to have to repaint my front fenders(both)from tape marks from transport. If any of you have any discoloration on your paint there is a service bulletin on it so have your dealership fix it! I have personally had it with this car because I still have a funny sound coming from the front end going down the highway and when I am not moving the car chirps!!
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    droptopscarletdroptopscarlet Member Posts: 8
    Is this strut problem on all 2006s? I'm eyeing one now.
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    paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    There is specific build date ranges it applies to.

    I am looking at used 05s, better prices, and better cars, the late 06 models they started to cheap out on things as the factory ran low on parts.

    -mike
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    droptopscarletdroptopscarlet Member Posts: 8
    I found an 06 for $27 on the lot and I also can get a GM discount. I don't like the ones that don't have the hood scoop.
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    paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    have the 6.0 and hood scoop.

    I'm looking at paying about $23k for an 05 6mt with 10-15k miles.

    The late 06 models can't plug-play the guage upgrade pack because they ran out of the P-P harnesses at the factory.

    -mike
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    droptopscarletdroptopscarlet Member Posts: 8
    Gottcha. I've been reading quite a bit about cheaping-out, etc. So ridiculous.
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    paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    My thought on last-year car builds is that as the factory winds down, they start using all the old parts they have laying around, not just on the GTO, I noticed it with the last year of the Isuzu Trooper, the tailights on the 99-01 were clear turns in the back in 02 the last year of production, some had orange, some had clear. So late 06 GTOs likely have a lot of bastardized parts in them.

    -mike
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    droptopscarletdroptopscarlet Member Posts: 8
    I thought I had found a deal, but now I'm not so sure I want to venture. I was looking at a Dodge Nitro and then I found this for only a thousand more . . .
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    eliaselias Member Posts: 2,209
    paisan, one of the gto web sites has the production numbers - iirc there were about fifty 05s without hood *vents* - presumably customers ordered them that way. (i wish mine was like that - i hate phony stuff like the GTO pseudo-hoodscoops - reminds me of the fake plastic louver things on my 85 Z28 hood, although the vents are not as bad as the dopey Z28 hoods).
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    hammen2hammen2 Member Posts: 1,284
    Remember, the GTO rolls down the production line with the Aussie and Middle East Commodore, Utes (wagons), HSV vehicles, et. al. Many, many parts are shared. It's unlikely that they used parts that were just "laying around", considering production continued (and, in the case of the Ute, still continues) for awhile after they were done with the GTO.

    The GTO got several small revisions for '06 (the smoker's package (extra outlet/ashtray) as standard, the door lock button, the revised seat motors and taillamps, for example).

    Two issues that I know of that are different on some '06's:
    1) Monroe Australia made a change from Shell to another supplier for strut oil, with disastrous results (GM-Holden knew nothing of this running change, until struts started failing left and right - pardon the pun).
    2) They eliminated the plug in the dash for the accessory gauge pod (since our U.S. spec GTO's don't get this standard, unlike the Monaro and the HSV/Vauxhall/Lumina variants).

    I wouldn't let this stop me from getting an '06 (if I had the coin, I'd be buying a Brazen Orange '06 and putting it "under glass" for a few years)...

    --Robert
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    paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    They stopped making the non-us monoros a few months before stopping making the GTO and the new Holden models (commodore, ute, etc) are a new design (new generation)

    -mike
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    paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    Is that if you plan on adding it, if you get the later production 06 it costs significantly more to put it in as you have to disassemble your whole dash board and buy a wiring harness for it. Instead of plug-and-play.

    -mike
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    hammen2hammen2 Member Posts: 1,284
    It is true that Holden stopped making Monaros in December of 2005, as the car came with the LS1 engine and it didn't meet Euro-3 emissions.

    HSV models that came with the LS2, plus the GTO and the Vauxhall Monaro (unsure about Lumina SS production) continued on.

    Holden has subsequently introduced the VE Commodore family of vehicles on a new chassis, but they didn't start production until July/August, and there is no VE ute at present/the Ute still being sold in Oz is on the same chassis as the GTO/Monaro/old Commodore/et. al.
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    paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    From what I was told they do not make the 2-door monaro with any engine anymore. But I'm not that familiar with the line though.

    -mike
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    slickwilliedjslickwilliedj Member Posts: 252
    so does this strut problem only effect the GTO? What about 17in wheel tire rubbing the strut causing tires to fail? Has this effected the Monaro also and we just are now hearing about this. Seems kinda odd since this model was built for many years prior to making its was here... be interesting to explore what owners of the monaro are experiencing in the relation to this situation
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    eliaselias Member Posts: 2,209
    supposedly not much leeway to align properly with the 17s. i think the monaros are not available with 17s in their native hemisphere? did the Holden factory peeps think USA drivers want oversteer/turn-in and dialed GTOs negative camber?
    or maybe the camber got squished negative when the cars were battened down for N months on their journey aboard the great monaro-gto-transport-to-USA-ship, with 60 psi in the tires and suspension-spacers/chocks.? the strut failure issue was apparently a batch with wrong sort of grease.
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    dmsdesigndmsdesign Member Posts: 18
    The Monaros did not have a issue withs strut leak like the GTO becasue they did not make Monaro/FGTO for Austraila/ And yes, they are starting to see other Monroe strut leakage issues there.

    mike
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    brz71brz71 Member Posts: 4
    As far as i can tell you are correct about the strut oil issue. You are most definitely correct about the ute(pickup). I own a VZ Commodore ute bought new and manufactured in sept 06. VZ being the old platform shared with the sedan wagon and Monaro. Manufacture of the VE sedans started somewhere around the middle of 06. The last monaro rolled off the line some time earlier. Holden got caught short with the GenIII motor. They were holding off on the GenIV for the new model. Unfortunately they were behind time on the VE and the new emission laws came into effect here on Jan 1st 06. The net result was the 6.0lt motor becoming available on the VZ SS commodore sedans and utes. You want to drive something really scary you try a 5.7 or 6.0lt V8 in a pick up! The Monaro was available with the new motor but I think it was only the HSV versions.
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    cyclonehankcyclonehank Member Posts: 3
    I was performing a tire rotation and noticed that the inside of both front tires were rubbing the struts. Took it to my local dealer and was told that Pontiac knows nothing of the problem. After printing several pages of info from several different sites including the newsnet5 investigation from Cleveland, The safety administration request for an investigation, and the class action suit filed in Cali, Pontiac told my dealer that there is an unpublished service bulletin for the strut rub. Pontiac told the dealer to adjust the camber to it maximum but stay within the specs. I threw a coat of paint on the strut and will drive it for a couple of weeks. Stay tuned.
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    hammen2hammen2 Member Posts: 1,284
    ...may be a common issue, primarily for 2004-2006 GTO's equipped with the stock 17" wheels and 245-width tires, but it has nothing to do with the "blown struts" issue which afflicted approximately 2/3 of 2006 GTO production (and what this particular message board is about)...
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    dunlap2006dunlap2006 Member Posts: 1
    Just turned my 06 gto back into Pontiac for the second time. My first set of tires lasted 28,000 miles until i counldnot stand the road noise and purchased new ones. Now 7,000 miles later all four tires are cupped on the inside after even rotating them every 3,000 miles. The dealership said the rubbing noise when i make a hard right was within GM SPECS...Yeah we will see!!!!!
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    dmsdesigndmsdesign Member Posts: 18
    This is a pretty common concern for tire cupping. If we assume your tires and wheels were balanced correctly, and I really cannot assume that to be honest, then you have excess looseness in your suspension. I have done quite a bit of work on this issue and am quite expert at the GTO susepsnion concerns. 2 Things to check:
    1. have someone drive your GTO 5-7 mph, and stand outside the front end and when they are in front of you, have them jam on the brakes. Notice if you have any significant front wheel kick back. My guess is that you will have 1-2 inches of wheel kick back. This changes toe, and camber a lot can can cause cupping

    2. next with the wheels on the ground, you need to check to see if your front strut bushings are collapsed. If you are mechanically inclined, with a 24MM socket, remove theplastic nut cover, then the big nut, then the strut plate on top of the strut tower. You can now access the lower strut nut. Observe if the strut shaft is cnetered in the bushing and observe if the inner strut bushing center rubber is sitting higher than the outer section. The strut bushings are being damaged, like the rear collapsing springs, due to the shipping process of getting the GTO to the states. Re-assemble carefully. I have pictures on my web site on this topic that shows the bad bushings. Also before you dissassewmble them, you can do 1 more test: with the 24mm socket attached with a breaker bar. rotate the breaker bar in a clockwise position 90 degrees. Ther must be 100% firm spring back.

    If you or anyone else needs additional info on this, you can email me at
    michael.white24@comcast.net. I have solutions for both of these concerns and all concerns related to the GTO suspension issues

    thanks
    mike
    dms
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    monarofanmonarofan Member Posts: 30
    Mike

    Thanks for your advice on what to look for.

    What is the address of the website you refer to?

    Chris
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    barr62barr62 Member Posts: 2
    I just Noticed on my rear Left chrome wheel on my Spicy Red GTO ..The film coated is starting to Peel ..Check your chrome wheels you 06 Owners , and does Any one have info on the default Weld behind the fenders? that they are weak specialy upon Impacted :cry: I also hear a Lifter Tappng when i shes cold and fades away , But? i hit a phone pole with it i am just hoping i get her back the same
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    hammen2hammen2 Member Posts: 1,284
    If your wheels are chromed, it was done by the dealer or a previous owner... it did not come that way from Holden's factory...

    Re: weak fender welds, that's a new one to me.

    Neither of these issues relate to the 2006 GTO defective strut issues, so follow-ups should probably be in the main GTO discussion section...
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    hquakershquakers Member Posts: 6
    http://www.smh.com.au/news/news/uncle-sam-gives-tyre-defect-claim-the-boot/2007/- 09/13/1189276892000.html

    Looks like the NHTSA isn't doing anything about the camber issues. Stinks for some GTO owners.
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    eliaselias Member Posts: 2,209
    As far as I've seen, Pontiac has done just fine in handling and reimbursing the GTO owners who had strut-rub or related alignment-issues. They seem to have gone far beyond what the law would require, and the NHTSA ruling supports that. Those who allege a massive safety defect are a bunch of whining babies, in my opinion.
    It's the owners responsibility to keep an eye on tire wear and to do the right thing if abnormal wear occurs. Kudos to Pontiac for stepping up to pay for re-alignment, even for owners whose cars are way outside the 12,000 mile new-car-warranty.
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    hquakershquakers Member Posts: 6
    I think Pontiac has done a good job in general, but many dealerships are being jerks about the issue. I have heard stories about people who went in for a fix and they said they had no idea anything was wrong and refused to do a fix. I guess it just depends on where you go.
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    marc8171marc8171 Member Posts: 1
    my co-worker has 04 gto with 4500 miles car hardly driven. This car is pampered, every now and then you got to get on it! His concern is that the center of his rear tires are worn out,and he's heard about the shipping procedure about cranking them down to tight. Do you know anything about this problem with possible damage done during shipping? Bent rear housings? Any help would be appreciated. Thank you, marc
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    eliaselias Member Posts: 2,209
    the alignment issues manifest with inner-edge of tires being worn. if center of tire is worn that indicates overinflation not an alignment problem, as far as i know. these cars were shipped on their boat rides with 50 or 60 psi in the tires - could your pal have been driving his 4500 miles with 50 psi? also does he run the car on the track and smoke the rears to warm them up for good launches? i suppose you would have mentioned that. well, you did say he gets on it. smoke the tires and they will heat up and the center will wear that way too. drag-launches are best done with the rears *underinflated* slightly, i think.
    anyway, enough with the pampering - maybe get 4 snow tirse on that bad-boy and have some fun with it this winter.
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    mick1mick1 Member Posts: 84
    I agree with elias, your co-worker never checked the pressure in the tires. When I drove my 2004 home from the dealer it was bouncing on the parkway from the slightest bump, all 4 tires were 60 psi!
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    1spc11spc1 Member Posts: 2
    WITH THIS STRUT PROBLEM. IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU KNOW ABIT ABOUT IT. MY ? WOULD BE I HAVE A 2005 WITH ABOUT 13 TO 15 THOUSAND MILES THE INSIDE OF BOTH FRONT TIRES WERE SHOWING WEAR. SO LIKE THE FOOL THAT I AM I JUST ROTATE THEM BY 20000 MILES BOTH OF THOSE TIRES WERE WORN. THE REASON I TOOK IT BACK TO DEALER WAS THAT I PUT NEW TIRES ON FRONT AND THOUGHT IT JUST NEEDED ALLINMENT, BUT IF MORE THAN THAT THEY COULD FIX IT. NO PARTS BUT THEY SENT FOR THEM ( PART # 92046063 BEARING X 2 ) IS THIS ALL THAT IS WRONG. I TOOK ONE FRONT TIRE OFF AND THERE IS TIRE RUBBER ON STRUTS. IS THERE SOMETHING MORE I SHOULD LOOK AT OR THEY SHOULD REPLACE
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    mparis1mparis1 Member Posts: 107
    :sick: How did you/Pontiac resolve the issue?????thanks :sick:
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    dmsdesigndmsdesign Member Posts: 18
    I do know quite a lot about the suspension on the GTO. To start, the bearing they are replacing, does fail, but usually just comes apart when the strut is dissassembled. the part that is of a concern is the strut bushing. It collapses and sometimes tears, which causes the strut shaft to move towards the engine, which can add .75 degrees negative cambers on a static measurement, but worse, while driiving, can cause lots of camber/toe changes becuase the bushing cannot support the strut correctly, which is damaging the inside of the tires. this concern is very common in the gTO community. If you want to see pictures of it, go to my webshots site: http://rides.webshots.com/album/520157103jcDVac

    Here you will see lots of bad strut bushes. they can be checked in the car. email me if you are interested. Also one thing that most dealerships do not do, becaqsue they do not look up the R&R procedures, is that the bolts and nuts that connect the strut to the knuckle and the nut at the top of the strut, are all TTY bolts and are a 1 time use only. make sure they replace them. You should see this on your warranty invoice

    mike
    dms
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    1spc11spc1 Member Posts: 2
    I took the car in and Fishers put the new bearing in said bushing and struts were good. I bought and gave them new struts from monroe ( 72202 / 72201 ) told them to put the new struts in. They did took the car home 50 miles new stock tires hit struts. Took struts out myself bearings fell apart bushings bent many parts bad. If you look at the parts list from GM I am putting in # 1-6,12,13. The stock struts are made by monroe, I called monroe and asked them about gas struts that when you push shaft in if it does not come back out if they are good (GM mech said they were) monroe said they are shot. The car is still all apart but it has only been 3 weeks or so.
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    dmsdesigndmsdesign Member Posts: 18
    It is alittle confusing. the OEm struts are made by Monroe but they are not gas struts. the Monroe replacement struts are gas, but to be honest, the design of the internals is actually set up for a truck I understand and not the GTO.

    I would not use the GM strut mount bushes, They are too weak. and will collapse fairly easily. the issues of strut rub should be resolved afer replacing the strut bushes, and bearings. then per GM, align the front end with less negative cambers.
    Also, you should check ride height issues. Most of the OEM GTO springs are in various stages of collapsing. Also you should drive your GTO 5-10mph, then jham on the brakes. Observe how much front wheel kickback that you have. You will probably find that you have approx 1 to 2 inches with the OEM radius rod bushes.

    If you need assistance email me. If you want to see pictures of good/bad strut bushes, email me and I will send you a link
    michael.white24@comcast.net

    dms
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    davidbleydavidbley Member Posts: 1
    Mike,
    Thanks for all the info on GTO suspension. Does the strut wear problem exist on the 06 GTO also and if so how do I check it? I have noticed inside front tire wear but don't know if it is the negative camber (normal) or something else 15000 + miles OEM tires. Have had problems with forum postings before so I would appreciate a mail direct to my email at david.bley1@cox.net in addition to forum response if it is permitted.
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    eliaselias Member Posts: 2,209
    fwiw, i had dealership specifically inspect all the front suspension. they say its all fine. yet the car has seen plenty of boston roads & punishment. the wandering problems were apparently all due to worn tires. 56k miles... same dealer had ailgned the car to street specs at 15k miles after factory tires nearly wrecked due to inner tire wear.
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    crystal187crystal187 Member Posts: 1
    I am having a problem with my 06 gto with the gas pedal sticking in the house it will not move when this happens is there any one else that is having this problem with there gto????
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    dmsdesigndmsdesign Member Posts: 18
    Your GTO uses a fly by wire throttle assembly and to be hones has been pretty reliable. there are mutliple systems that can seriously affect the throttle operation. You should take it to a facility that can plug in a scanner to read for codes. Chances are that you have at least 1 stored

    mike
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    eliaselias Member Posts: 2,209
    i think there's a TSB for gas pedal issue , probably visible by searching alldata or an online tsb site..
    (not sure if its for the same symptom you are reporting , crystal187, but sounds similar.)
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    xtranautxtranaut Member Posts: 27
    It wasn't until after I had purchased my 04 GTO and had done all the research I could do to determine that I wanted this car, that I found out about the common strut and tire shredding issues. Apparently, GM never owned up to the design flaw. Simply they put tires that were too wide for the fron end config on the car ... utterly stupid, out to lunch engineering that had to pass with their knowledge and a nonchalant, "oh well, we will just tell the mechanics to tell em nothing is wrong when they show up" attitude.

    Look at the caddy CTS....what a string of design blunders in everything from fuel systems to rear ends and it took forever to get a recall on the rear gears issue.

    Now that Pontiac no longer exits the CLASS ACTION suit filed on behalf of the thousands who bought GTOs and experienced tire shredding, has been dropped. When Pontiac filed bankruptcy, GM was off the hook.

    I never see too much posted about this issue so it is hard to know how many have been affected by it..or even KNOW about it, until a tire blows or they go for a routine rotation, to be told their tires are chewed and ready to pop.

    I am curious..what are others experiencing? My car only had 16k miles on it when I bought it so this car wasn't even a daily driver.. I ultimately inherited what will eventually happen and would have probably happened sooner if the owner had driven the car regularly.

    Just wondering what the dealers are saying when you take the car in.
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    dmsdesigndmsdesign Member Posts: 18
    There is a real stabilitiy issue in the front of the GTO, and a collapsing coils in the rear that do a real number to tires. To resolve your front tire wear, you need to dump you crappy OE front strut bushings with some aftermarket poly units like Pedders. Then you need to replace your strut bushings and bearings to keep you strut from moving around at the top. These are well documented concerns. If you need more data, email me

    mike
    dms
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    eliaselias Member Posts: 2,209
    As far as I know, most GTO owners have experienced this issue, and GM has stepped up as far as I had heard. I understand part of the cause was negative-camber via the factory or due the long-compressed-springs-boat-ride from Australia to USA.
    I understand GM issued a TSB about this issue along with revised alignment specs. They were able to fix it on my GTO via proper alignment at 15K, and a side-to-side tire-rotation. Factory tires lasted until 25k after that.
    From 15K->70k miles, inner-edge tire-wear has not been an issue and the car reliably needs new tires every 25K.
    The initial symptom was horrible inner-edge tire wear, belts almost visible but not quite. I noticed it at 15k miles.
    Since the car had more than 12k miles, I paid for that work at first. Later I got a letter from Pontiac in which they volunteered/insisted that they reimburse me 100%.

    So from my viewpoint, GM did "step up".

    And I do plan to have pedders suspension parts installed at the next opportunity!
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    xtranautxtranaut Member Posts: 27
    Mike

    Please send me this information on the struts and coils. I went to a local dealer here in Houston and they acted like they had never heard of the issue and wanted 199. to "check it out". I told them to go pound sand. Now i have to drive 25 miles to get another dealer who originally sold the car to take some responsibility. This car is starting to be a real pain in the a--

    The bulletin that was issued to owners must not have stated the severity of the problem because as I understand what the dealer who sold me the car to say, the car had a corrective alignment and something done to the rotors ?? That was at 389 miles after the purchase of this car in 04. It has 18k miles on it now.

    There is no appearance of unusual wear on the tires and they are the originals I think. I am sure they have been rotated in this time but the fronts have low tread.
    With my hand, I do a check n the inside of the tire and feel no evidence of rubbing.

    What I am wondering is, aside of the bushings in the strut, if just replacing the strut with something better (is there such a thing?) and changing the FRONT tires to a 235 (or just this alone) be a remedy??
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    dmsdesigndmsdesign Member Posts: 18
    Here is a link to show you what typical strut bushings look like:

    http://rides.webshots.com/album/520157103jcDVac

    Please do not do the 235's The reason is Pontiac went to the 245 because it is heavier than the Monaro in Au, and needs to extra load support of a 245.

    Align issues are totally resolveable. You just need to install some non GM stuff. Now I will also tell you, with a 2004 GTO, front struts are TOTALLY gone by 50k. this info comes from the Monroe, who makes your struts.

    mike
    dms
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    xtranautxtranaut Member Posts: 27
    Will a dealer do the work with Pedders parts? Will a dealer still do the work and pick up the tab for this or do they have the mindset that this is ancient and forgotten?

    If I had the struts replaced, (Monroe) would the new bushings and bearings be sturdy stuff or do I still need to get the complete Pedders package? And if so, What will that cost me?

    How important is it that I do the coils? I hadn't even heard about that problem.

    The alignment was what GM did for the original owner at 389 miles that Elias mentioned they did for him. It was teir answer to the strut rub. Now, I dont show any wear and I cant see any evidence of my tires rubbing the strut but honestly, did an alignment really do anything to correct that issue??

    I saw your pictures. Its like seeing crime scene photos. Just tell me what I should do step by step -- or what I should tell the dealer svc word for word to get this issue resolved. I'm freaked about driving the car now and thought that because i bought a car with low miles that looked new, I wouldn't have to spend a lot of money.

    I guess I'd better wait to buy tires.
This discussion has been closed.