Give me a break.You make it sound like it is prevalent in most cars. The fearmongering on the VCM board almost made me not buy an Accord,a decision I would have surely regretted.
"Give me a break.You make it sound like it is prevalent in most cars. The fearmongering on the VCM board almost made me not buy an Accord,a decision I would have surely regretted. "
You're exactly right. I too was worried, but then realized that this is a fairly isolated issue. The VCM on my 08 works flawlessly, is hardly noticeable, and I love the smooth power of the v6.
To my feeble mind 'hardly noticable' would soon turn into a major thing. I would be better off not knowing when it kicked in then at least I'd always wonder.
To my feeble mind 'hardly noticable' would soon turn into a major thing. I would be better off not knowing when it kicked in then at least I'd always wonder. "
I seriously doubt this will become a "major thing". 99% of the time, I'd never know that the VCM was even active if it weren't for the little "ECO" light coming on. Now if I was a paranoid individual, maybe I'd be worried. I've driven just about everything from BMW, Lexus, Infiniti, etc.. and the Honda v6 is plenty smooth for me. For those considering a v6 Accord, don't listen to all the fear mongerers.. Go drive one yourself and see if you like it. I did, and it was a much better value for $1400 more than an I4 Accord. Take a look at all the other extras besides just the bigger engine that you get when going from an I4 to a V6.
Extra large payments Extra gas used Extra weight to have to stop Extra weight to have to turn (in the nose where it really hurts) Extra resources used in constuction
Being able to double the speed limit in most states is plenty fast for me. (I4 MT) :shades:
You like your I4. Good for you. But I must say I sick & tired of elitist comments by 4 drivers that somehow you're so superior in your decision to buy it over the 6. Everyone knows it's heavier, costs more, & burns more gas. So what? It's what we wanted, & we make no apologies for it. When I purchased my SE V6 last Oct, gas was much cheaper than it is now. If I could go back & do it over, would I have chosen the 4 instead? No. Not because there's anything wrong with the 4, I simply wanted a 6.
There is no such thing as a right or wrong choice, it's about making an informed choice based on having all the information.
"...& burns more gas..." I don't even think the difference is much for most people to be concerned with. I4 rating is 21-31 vs V6 mpg of 19-29, that is about $25/month extra on the V6 for the average driver with one fill-up per week. My combined mpg on the V6 is about 24 for the last 9 months.
But I must say I sick & tired of elitist comments by 4 drivers
lol... you should go back and read what V6 folks have written in the past here.
I think we've pretty much decided that people made a choice and most are happy with what they purchased. I don't think dudley was being "elitist".... just sharing his feelings with his tongue firmly planted in his cheek.
I have a 4cyl, and would I love to have powerful V6? yes, heck I would really love a Jetta Wolfsburg Edition with a 2.0T engine, couple it with a DSG automanual 6spd transmssion, and you have yourself an amazing ride! That thing will simply roll! Best of all it gets decent mileage, about the same as the 4cyl accord, but it could do better with its smaller size than the accord, but its geared a bit more for performance and enjoyment, rather than mostly economy with an Accord. Another thing I consider is that it is $22k, and so much fun! But with all that said, the 4cyl these days are more justified to own, rather than going for the V6. I can get by with one, they are pretty powerful, it goes along with the assumption that they are slow.Its no race car, but it'll run with the crowd.
Extra large payments - not an issue, I paid cash, no payments, and car was only $1400 more.
Extra gas used - wow, 19/29 with the 6 vs. 21/31 on the I4.. Huge savings there.... Extra weight to have to stop - not an issue, Accord brakes just fine. Extra weight to have to turn (in the nose where it really hurts) - not an issue, handles great. Extra resources used in constuction - WTF?? do you think the v6 caused a rainforest to be burnt down vs. the construction of a I4??
In addition to a very smooth V6 with almost a 100 hp gain from the I4, here's what my $1400 price difference got me: Chrome Door handles (look much better on the black than body color), dual chrome tipped exhaust, home link remote (very important to me), 4 way power passenger seat. They're both great cars, and both a great value. To each his own.
They're both great cars, and both a great value. To each his own.
Exactly. . . This is why I think they should be sold as two seperate automobiles.
I like the V6 just fine but chose the 4 instead. I could have afforded the 6 but I like the 4 better. I drove several of each before making up my mind.
My choice had nothing to do with power or gas mileage or chrome door handles (which I have purchased for my 4).
I liked the 4 simply because it felt more balanced to me on the roads where I drive. Had I lived in a hilly area or where there are no interstates where I had to pass other cars with little time to do it in my choice might have been different.
I did expect the 4 cyl car to be nowhere near the 6 in performance so I am delighted that the differences are nothing like I expected. I am amazed at just how well the little sister actually does perform every time I drive it.
I will also say that in my case the 6 would have been a hell of a lot more than 1400 bucks. More like double that. I bought my car based on exactly how it is equiped. To get the 6 with the exact same equipment would have cost me more than what I felt like it was worth.
Long story short, not everyone wants the same thing in a car and some things are more important to one person than another. Fact is both are great cars.
lol... you should go back and read what V6 folks have written in the past here.
I've monitored & contributed to this forum for a quite a while now, & while it's certainly true there have been silly comments made by 6 owners, the ratio is no where close to being even, though admittedly, there are a lot more 4 drivers than 6. None-the-less I see this constant attitude that driving a 4 is somehow smarter, more noble, than choosing the 6. Making the case it costs less to purchase & operate is certainly a valid one, and so be it.
But all this talk about fuel savings really doesn't cut it in the terms in which it's being argued. If its all about the mileage, why choose an I4 Accord? Wouldn't a Prius make even more sense? Or a scooter? Better yet, how about a Segway! That's the only point I'm trying to make.
Again, gather all the useful information, and make an informed decision.
I was having a little fun (hence the )with the concept that the 6 is a superset of the 4, and therefore better in every way.
There are some that think the 6 is just better in every way (it is not) and that everybody aspires to the 6 (they do not). Of course there are many of us (6 and 4 owners that alike) that don't feel this way.
While I prefer the 4 I am not on the warpath against the 6 - although I will occasionally point out the differences to those who are shopping between the two.
I save the warpath for much less logical cars. Example is the Mazda6 wagon. Only avialable with a V-6 that used more gas than my Sienna minivan - kinda misses the point of downsizing by 1,200 lbs. :confuse: Mazda claimed the wagon needed more power - meanwhile you could get the heavier and less aerodynamic Mazda 5 with the 4 cyl.
Off Topic, but if Honda or anybody makes a nice roomy 4-cyl wagon I am all over it. An Accord wagon would have as much room as all but the largest SUV's and would get Accord mpg, have Accord handling and ride etc.
Of course they are all about money and as long as they can get (or con )people to buy higher profit, but less practical vehicles they will.
Given a choice there are many people that would and do opt for the smaller engine for whatever the reason. I see the same discussions concerning the Altima 2.5 vs 3.5. Not to mention most other makes as well.
I remember one year along when Chevrolet had over 40 engine options back in the late 60s early 70s and then as now most of them were sold with the base engine.
Today you don't see so many options but certainly the base engine still gets the most attention from buyers. While most of us here or in places like here prefer a more performance oriented model most still buy the smaller motor given the option.
Sometimes it's cost but often it is nothing but availability. Combine a good salesman with adequate performance and the desire to own a new car and more times than not you are going to drive home in what he's got on the lot.
As already stated gas mileage differences are nil. Cost can get in the way however if one wanted the 6 the difference (over 10% in my case) could be overcome. Some are not going to buy a loaded anything while others will buy nothing but one fully loaded.
I can speak only to my reasons for buying the 4 and the truth is the car was equipped exactly like I wanted except for the V6. In my case the exact same car with the V6 was going to be around 10% more money.
I would rather keep the 4cyl, and have the navigation system in the car, at the same price for the V6. That would be more practical for me than to have a V6.
It is all what we want in a car. My co-worker has a Dodge Charger V8! Plus she lives literally down the street from work, now you think that is practical? No, but is she happy? Yes!!! Does she pay for it? No, lol, her husband does.:) Sometimes, one has to weigh both sides, practicality and enjoyment, some try to shoot for the middle, and some go right for the enjoyment, I am proud to get decent mileage on my 4cyl, but I would love to have a V8 every now and then,Yes, have some fun! I think Honda owners should be glad that we drive one of the better cars on the road.
I said - "You are among the lucky - there are many who do. Check the VCM message board"
And YOU say - "Give me a break.You make it sound like it is prevalent in most cars."
I think that you are grossly exaggerating my remark. I simply said that this person was among the lucky - if you read the forum, there indeed have been many others with problems. Are they the majority? Of course not. But there ARE issues with VCM - in varying degrees. You ignore it at your peril. As many have suggested - if you are considering a VCM equipped 6, be certain you drive the one you will buy - the performance of the VCM and its annoyance CAN vary from car to car. There are numerous car reviews which have also noted its sensations and its being noticeable, from a "hybrid - like surge" to "maddening behavior". These are opinions, yes, but from unbiased people who test drive cars for a living with no horse in the race. Do you sell Hondas for a living? How would any of us know otherwise?
All I am trying to encourage is what dolfan1 posted -
"There is no such thing as a right or wrong choice, it's about making an informed choice based on having all the information."
Actually, it didn't come up at all here until just recently. But that's fine, it will just be better if we take it to the right place now. It's more helpful to those specifically looking for that topic. Thanks to all who are interested!
In my case the exact same car with the V6 was going to be around 10% more money
Major differences between my model EX-L Coupe no NAV
1-Chrome door handles vs painted handles 2-Dual exhaust vs single exhaust 3-18in wheels with bigger tires vs 17in on the 4 4-Electric passenger seat 5- Fog lights standard 6- 6 cylinders vs 4 7- iirc I think the V6 might even have a different rear view mirror
There may be a few other niceities(sp) that I can't remember.
I would rather keep the 4cyl, and have the navigation system in the car, at the same price for the V6. That would be more practical for me than to have a V6.
I'd suggest if someone wanted the power of the 6, but opt for the 4 to get nav & stay within budget; I 'd say buy the 6 & get a Garmin!
But about the "practical" issue. Let's say through some new technological achievement, next year's Accord I4's HP will increase to 280. Everything else stays the same (weight, size, etc). No one would argue the 4 wouldn't be way, way more than adequate - having far more power than necessary for any practical application.
But, because of that same technological breakthrough, the same can be applied to the V6 as well, increasing it's HP to 350. I guarantee you, there will still be people lining up to buy the 6, even though the 4 would provide all the power needed, and then some.
It's just the way it is. Honda knows this, and that is why they offer both choices.
Yes, I am interested in getting an air filter that could perhaps get me more HP, and MPG's. I am just not sure what filter is the best to get. I don't plan on modifying my car, as it is leased, but this would be a non evasive way to get some results, not alot, but some. I have also heard that it gave you more HP, but took away some mileage as well on some cars.
I guess I agree with the point someone made earlier, that it would be best to get the V6, I could also lose the navi, and V6 and save even more, and still be driving a similar car, and wouldn't feel any different. An EX-L 4cyl lease, is hard to beat, alot of car for the money.
The latest Consumer Reports just tested a stick shift Accord for the the first time in decades (brought on by the high fuel prices) and their results raise some interesting issues. (Regardless of what anybodys opinion of their overall tests, they have the most consistent performance statistics in the industry - by far)
Say you are looking at a midline Accord LX-P with an automatic (as most do) and decide that it needs a little more pep. CR tests this car at 9.8 seconds to 60 mph (they do a version of the street start - no loading the torque converter or popping the clutch) and claim it averages 23 mpg overall. There are two ways to go that will provide a significant change.
The standard way is to look at the V-6 (dealers will push this way as it is the highest profit). You will pay (based on sticker) $3,900 for the added power and few more doodads and whatzits. Your 0-60 will drop down to 7.4 and your mpg will drop 2 down to 21 mpg overall.
Now there is one more way to get quite a bit of extra zip. Look at the manual transmission version of that same car (LX-P). Instead of paying $3,900 extra you save $800. Instead of dropping 2 mpg you gain 3 mpg up to a 26 mpg average. Now you won't be quite as quick, but you will be quite a bit closer to the V-6 than to the automatic I4 with a time of 8.4 seconds to 60 mph.
Comparing the two options (LX-P MT vs the cheapest V-6) shows that for a 1 second savings to 60 mpg you pay $4,700, and lose 5 mpg.
And the best part is the I4 stick shift is real fun to drive, and you get to use both legs, not just one.
Took a look at the article in CR. When you can get a stick it sure looks to be a winning situation. Keeps money in your wallet at the time of purchase and at every fill-up and more get up and go, plus a more involved driving experience. I haven't owned a standard transmission since my 1972 VW Beetle. I've purchased auto tranny's since then because my wife would drive my car 3 or 4 times a year. As luck would have it she informs me that my 08 EX-L V6 is to big for her and she won't drive it. So now I could get a stick but Honda doesn't over it in the V6 Sedan. What was the last year they offered a stick with the V6 Sedan?
Yes it is available with the non VCM 6 in the coupe. I haven't owned a 2 door car since my 72 VW. Hopefully it isn't gone from the 6 cyl sedan for good. I don't think they can pair a standard transmission to a VCM equipped engine so as long as VCM is Honda's solution to eking out a few extra mpg's in the sedan, the manual gearbox probably won't be an option.
"You will pay (based on sticker) $3,900 for the added power and few more doodads and whatzits. Your 0-60 will drop down to 7.4 and your mpg will drop 2 down to 21 mpg overall. "
You can't really look at the $3,900 sticker price difference when comparing the costs of an I4 vs. the V6. In reality, you can get the V6 for about $1,400 more than the same model with an I4. For this you get the bigger motor, chrome door handles, dual exhaust, power passenger seat, and homelink.
In reality, you can get the V6 for about $1,400 more than the same model with an I4
Not in my case. My EX-L coupe is equipped exactly as I want but to add the V6 is a lot more than 1400 bucks. Now you do get bigger tires and wheels, Fog lights, Electric passenger seat, Duals, Chrome door handles plus a few other 'mandatory' items. My 4 cyl car's sticker was around 26,500 and the same car with the V6 was almost 29,000. I was not willing to give up what I had in the 4cyl car just to get the V6. As it was I got pretty darn close to exactly what I wanted.
Just get the EX, if you truly want the V6, reduced cost, and don't really mind losing a few options to get it.
That's my point. I didn't want to give up anything enough to get the V6. I could have bought a V6 sedan for less money than I spent for my 4 cyl coupe but I wanted what I had more than I wanted the V6. Had I not been thrilled with the 4's performance I would be either driving the V6 or another car all together.
I know the V6 is bigger, better, faster, sexier, does everything but wash dishes and change diapers but I wanted the 4. I'm not trying to be cute. The V6 is all those things and more plus it is worth more money than the differences that exist but. . . I wanted the 4.
Totally agree, sometimes, you have to separate the list of wants and needs. I think more of us are getting more practical. There is nothing wrong with that. I am not sure the extra features on the EX-L V6, other than the engine are even worth the extra money. I think my passenger can live without a power seat, I can totally live without the fog lights, as I think they are silly. I am sure there are few other options, that really are just little things. I will be trading for a new lease in about a year, and I will probably look at the EX-L V6 closely, or the new Acura TSX, or perhaps a VW Jetta, with a 2.0T engine. Yep, I am always looking at cars. Honestly, sounds crazy, I would most likely trade every year or so, if I was able to.
I like your inclusion of the Jetta for consideration. That is one sweet engine. As an 08 EX-L V6 owner I'm generally happy with my choice. One thing constantly nags me though. The Honda V6 will really get up and go but you have to be willing to run it all the way up to the upper rev bands. I had it out on an interstate yesterday and ran it between 4,000-6,000 RPM and managed to easily put in my rear view mirror the traffic that was holding me up. Recent trips in friends GTI's would have them accomplishing the same thing but at much lower revs. I know available torque is on tap at much lower RPM's on turbocharged engines, but other mgf's have peak torque available in the 2,400 rpm to 4,000 rpm range from their non turbo engines of similar displacement to mine. I have to wind mine up to 5,000 rpm for peak torque. I know reliability can be iffy with the VW's but one of my friends GTI is a 2000 model with 105,000 miles on it and the other has an 04 model with 30,000 miles and they have had no problems. Peak torque at 1,700 rpm, that's pretty sweet and imminently usable, and on hand with the 2.0T in that Jetta. Drive them both before you make your choice.
Yes! I will again, my mom owns an 08 Jetta SE with the 2.5 engine, and its awesome! I am really considering it, but with the 2.0T. I am sure the 2.0T could keep up with the Accord V6. Perhaps.
In the twisties it would probably out pace the Accord due to it's shorter wheelbase and being lighter. Straight out on the hwy I'd give the nod to the Accord. That shorter wheelbase is going to make for more cramped quarters then the Accord and if I'm reading the models list correctly the 2.0T can only be had with a manual transmission or possibly their automated manual DSG tranny, but that would add considerably to the cost. If passenger room is not a high priority the GTI, which has been called VW's Porsche, would be the best way to go. I've been on the back roads in my friends GTI and some of the things they have pulled have almost left me in need of a change of shorts, but their driving skills exceed mine by a long shot, so I leave the the stunt driving to them. My Accords wheels stay firmly planted on terra firma while they seek roads that allow them to get airborne. There ages are 47 & 60 but those GTI's seem to invoke a youthfulness once behind the wheel.
Last year i looked at the 2007's & 2008's V-6 models. The 4's were fine for their power output,but i wanted a little more oomph.
I found a 2007 SE V-6 that was just what i wanted. Like a previous poster,i didn't need all the bells and whistles.
I'm happy still with my choice, especially since so many have had complaints with the 08.
I believe my gas mileage is pretty close to the 4 enough that its a non-issue for me,and better than the 08's,or equal.. The styling is great with the dual exhaust tips,alloy wheels,17" tires,and the Royal blue Pearl paint.
My buddy has a 9.3 Saab turbo that feels like a V8. Gobs of low end torque. From 1500 and lower in 3rd, 4th or 5th to some degree just mash on it and she really pulls hard. The car has over 200K (nothing but normal service) on it as he drives around 200 miles a day commuting. The car is dead silent and pulls like a freight train. If you didn't know better you would think it was a V8. It is an older Saab around 99-2000 but still drives like new.
My problem with the V6 isn't just Honda's but I don't like how a V6 sounds. . . any of them. Now V8's that's another matter. I do like how a V8 sounds and I like how a 4cyl sounds when they are right and spinning up around 7-8 grand.
Years ago I was going to buy a Nissan 300 ZX turbo but one test drive and I couldn't stand it. Plenty of power alright but I couldn't get past that V6 sound.
I know that's just silly but to me it is also true.
Admittedly you'll never get a V8 sound from a V6. But some of the most horrendous sounds I've heard from a V6 were from the a Nissan 300ZX, circa early to mid 90's. I'd try the Honda V6 if you haven't already. It's no V8 but on 3/4 to full boil it has a meaningful and pleasant sound to me. It won't replicate the type of pull you mentioned from the Saab though.
Honda engines have always been high revving/low torque engines - just their engine theory coming from having been primarily a motorcycle manufacturer. They have never had low end grunt. If you do not care for that, I suggest you look elsewhere for a car - that is simply their corporate culture, and none of us is ever going to change it.. My 2004 S2000 ran 4000 RPM at 76 MPH. Annoying as hell and I got rid of it in part for that reason - ridiculous. You could not listen to the radio or carry ona conversation with someone less than a foot away in the passenger cabin. Wanted it for weekend trips but any time on the interstate was unbearable.
Honda engines have always been high revving/low torque engines - just their engine theory coming from having been primarily a motorcycle manufacturer. They have never had low end grunt. If you do not care for that, I suggest you look elsewhere for a car
No torque doesn't bother me so much plus I do love my 08 4cyl coupe. Nice and smooth and I do like how Hondas pull harder and harder all the way to redline. I remember my Honda bikes with much fondness as well. I owned a V65 Magna and a V30 (500cc) at the same time. Now the V65 had plenty of torque and would make your hair grow plus eat your lunch too. The little V30 on the other hand was much more fun for many reasons. One was how she would literally scream all the way to somewhere around 10 or 11 grand. I rode her to work which at the time was second shift. Didn't get much better than coming home at 3AM except for the bugs. I'll always miss that bike.
I have no doubt that I would love the V6 too. After all its a Honda right?? Still my little 4 banger pleases me greatly.
It wasn't the gas mileage, it wasn't the cost. It had more to do with the fact that as soon as I saw my car sitting on the show room floor I wanted it. I walked past it every time I went there to check out the Si Civic, several V6 sedans along with a couple 4cyl sedans. At the end of every session I would tell the salesman that I wanted a V6 just like that red one sitting on the floor.
On one of my visits he asked me if I wanted to drive that red one. I told him "no I want a V6 just like it but I would like to drive a coupe just to check it out". The rest is history. . . I drove that 4cyl red coupe home and have had absolutely no regrets period. It had much more than I expected. Plenty for 95% of my driving. I'm sure I could have lived with the sound of the 6. Actually the sounds from the V6 only really bug me when driven flat out. Normal driving they sound fine for the most part plus I would agree that Honda's V6 sounds better than most. The bad ones are American push rod types like the 4.3 that was in my pickup.
As a fellow SE 6 owner, I do hope Honda brings back the model, as it provides a lower cost vehicle that help those who want the 6 but can't afford, say, the EX 6. Personally, I would have loved to have the EX, but it was out of my price range. Some here have opted for the EX 4 instead of the 6 to get the bells & whistles instead of the larger engine. I went the opposite way, giving up the bells & whistles to get the 6. Isn't it great we have that choice to make!
Interesting comparison....the VW turbo 2.0. I actually had a Jetta rental recently configured that way. Fun car. My biggest complaint is that it required premium fuel. The other one related to the fact that VWs have generally been considered troublesome....something you just don't see with a Honda.
In truth, my '08 I4 Accord is the first "mainstream" car I've had in quite a while. I've had Mustang GTs (high torque, low revs), a Mazda RX8 (low torque, high revs), to name just two recent examples. Both were fine cars. Both did what they did in different manners. Both were fun, just in different ways.
IMHO, the EX I4 is the "sweet spot" for the Accord. Good power for a 4 banger. Very "zingy". Lighter weight does make a difference in the feel of it (vs the 6 cyl). But, I'd be the last one to cast any stones for anyone desiring more power from the 6 cyl.
It's just a marvel to me how far Honda has come in refining the 4 cyl sedan.....especially for the price.
I would pick the EX-L 4cyl, as it would have everything I want, and since I lease, I could get one for a decent price. I usually trade my car about every 1.5 years, but this model, I would see myself keeping longer.
IMHO, the EX I4 is the "sweet spot" for the Accord
While the V6 is the top of the pile I see it leaning more towards a personal luxury car (especially the coupe) while the 4 is more of a driver's car. It does take more work to get the good out of it but once you do the rewards are great.
Both exceptional automobiles but meant for two distinctly different driving styles.
gyusher....I actually see the '08 Accord EX being as close to an Acura as any of the previous iterations that went before it.
The I4 I found more "tossable". Or, as you put it "more of a driver's car". V6 was a wee bit smoother. Personal preference, of course, but I never liked a lot of "bling" on my cars. So, the added chrome of the V6 didn't appeal to me. But again, that's just a personal preference.
Of the two "top dogs" in the segment, the Camry and the Accord, it was clear to me what side of the fence Honda comes down on......that is it's a much sportier drive....particularly the I4.
I had one person tell me that I should compare Camry SE to get that same "Honda feel". I tried to like both the Camry and the Altima. I just couldn't, no matter how many test drives I did of either. Can't quite put my finger on it, but the Accord just has that well-engineered feel to it.
Yep, well that would explain why many like Hondas. Once they get into one, they usually stay within the brand. Their hooked. I know I am. But, now days there are many other great cars, but feel they are just now "almost" catching up with Honda. They are not quite there yet though. I have not test drove the V6 in the Accord, and perhaps I will soon, I also would like to test drive the new TSX. But, I am not in a position to trade yet, so doing this, might make me want to trade in even more.
I have an 08 EX-L I-4, an 08 TL-S and an 01 TL 3.2. I love every one of them. The TL-S is my business car and the one that I drive the most. The EX-L is more of a family run about that I can drive only by standing in line behind other family members. Yesterday, I took the EX-L on a 250 mile highway trip with two other people in the car. I am totally impressed. It has a lot of room and is very comfortable, it handles extremely well for for highway cruising (steering is very precise) and the engine power and dynamics are impressive. In stop and go city driving, I think it is better than the TL-S. The I-4 handles much better than an EX-V6. I recently drove an 09 TSX, great car, but does not has the room of the Accord. I think it's important to consider how you are going to use a car 99.9% of the time, then buy the one that best meets those requirements.
Comments
The fearmongering on the VCM board almost made me not buy an Accord,a decision I would have surely regretted.
The fearmongering on the VCM board almost made me not buy an Accord,a decision I would have surely regretted. "
You're exactly right. I too was worried, but then realized that this is a fairly isolated issue. The VCM on my 08 works flawlessly, is hardly noticeable, and I love the smooth power of the v6.
To my feeble mind 'hardly noticable' would soon turn into a major thing. I would be better off not knowing when it kicked in then at least I'd always wonder.
To my feeble mind 'hardly noticable' would soon turn into a major thing. I would be better off not knowing when it kicked in then at least I'd always wonder. "
I seriously doubt this will become a "major thing". 99% of the time, I'd never know that the VCM was even active if it weren't for the little "ECO" light coming on. Now if I was a paranoid individual, maybe I'd be worried. I've driven just about everything from BMW, Lexus, Infiniti, etc.. and the Honda v6 is plenty smooth for me. For those considering a v6 Accord, don't listen to all the fear mongerers.. Go drive one yourself and see if you like it. I did, and it was a much better value for $1400 more than an I4 Accord. Take a look at all the other extras besides just the bigger engine that you get when going from an I4 to a V6.
Extra large payments
Extra gas used
Extra weight to have to stop
Extra weight to have to turn (in the nose where it really hurts)
Extra resources used in constuction
Being able to double the speed limit in most states is plenty fast for me. (I4 MT)
But I must say I sick & tired of elitist comments by 4 drivers that somehow you're so superior in your decision to buy it over the 6. Everyone knows it's heavier, costs more, & burns more gas. So what? It's what we wanted, & we make no apologies for it. When I purchased my SE V6 last Oct, gas was much cheaper than it is now. If I could go back & do it over, would I have chosen the 4 instead? No. Not because there's anything wrong with the 4, I simply wanted a 6.
There is no such thing as a right or wrong choice, it's about making an informed choice based on having all the information.
I don't even think the difference is much for most people to be concerned with. I4 rating is 21-31 vs V6 mpg of 19-29, that is about $25/month extra on the V6 for the average driver with one fill-up per week. My combined mpg on the V6 is about 24 for the last 9 months.
lol... you should go back and read what V6 folks have written in the past here.
I think we've pretty much decided that people made a choice and most are happy with what they purchased. I don't think dudley was being "elitist".... just sharing his feelings with his tongue firmly planted in his cheek.
Best of all it gets decent mileage, about the same as the 4cyl accord, but it could do better with its smaller size than the accord, but its geared a bit more for performance and enjoyment, rather than mostly economy with an Accord. Another thing I consider is that it is $22k, and so much fun! But with all that said, the 4cyl these days are more justified to own, rather than going for the V6. I can get by with one, they are pretty powerful, it goes along with the assumption that they are slow.Its no race car, but it'll run with the crowd.
Some of the "extras" of the V-6
Extra large payments - not an issue, I paid cash, no payments, and car was only $1400 more.
Extra gas used - wow, 19/29 with the 6 vs. 21/31 on the I4.. Huge savings there....
Extra weight to have to stop - not an issue, Accord brakes just fine.
Extra weight to have to turn (in the nose where it really hurts) - not an issue, handles great.
Extra resources used in constuction - WTF?? do you think the v6 caused a rainforest to be burnt down vs. the construction of a I4??
In addition to a very smooth V6 with almost a 100 hp gain from the I4, here's what my $1400 price difference got me:
Chrome Door handles (look much better on the black than body color), dual chrome tipped exhaust, home link remote (very important to me), 4 way power passenger seat. They're both great cars, and both a great value. To each his own.
Exactly. . . This is why I think they should be sold as two seperate automobiles.
I like the V6 just fine but chose the 4 instead. I could have afforded the 6 but I like the 4 better. I drove several of each before making up my mind.
My choice had nothing to do with power or gas mileage or chrome door handles (which I have purchased for my 4).
I liked the 4 simply because it felt more balanced to me on the roads where I drive. Had I lived in a hilly area or where there are no interstates where I had to pass other cars with little time to do it in my choice might have been different.
I did expect the 4 cyl car to be nowhere near the 6 in performance so I am delighted that the differences are nothing like I expected. I am amazed at just how well the little sister actually does perform every time I drive it.
I will also say that in my case the 6 would have been a hell of a lot more than 1400 bucks. More like double that. I bought my car based on exactly how it is equiped. To get the 6 with the exact same equipment would have cost me more than what I felt like it was worth.
Long story short, not everyone wants the same thing in a car and some things are more important to one person than another. Fact is both are great cars.
I've monitored & contributed to this forum for a quite a while now, & while it's certainly true there have been silly comments made by 6 owners, the ratio is no where close to being even, though admittedly, there are a lot more 4 drivers than 6. None-the-less I see this constant attitude that driving a 4 is somehow smarter, more noble, than choosing the 6. Making the case it costs less to purchase & operate is certainly a valid one, and so be it.
But all this talk about fuel savings really doesn't cut it in the terms in which it's being argued. If its all about the mileage, why choose an I4 Accord? Wouldn't a Prius make even more sense? Or a scooter? Better yet, how about a Segway!
That's the only point I'm trying to make.
Again, gather all the useful information, and make an informed decision.
I was having a little fun (hence the
There are some that think the 6 is just better in every way (it is not) and that everybody aspires to the 6 (they do not). Of course there are many of us (6 and 4 owners that alike) that don't feel this way.
While I prefer the 4 I am not on the warpath against the 6 - although I will occasionally point out the differences to those who are shopping between the two.
I save the warpath for much less logical cars. Example is the Mazda6 wagon. Only avialable with a V-6 that used more gas than my Sienna minivan - kinda misses the point of downsizing by 1,200 lbs. :confuse: Mazda claimed the wagon needed more power - meanwhile you could get the heavier and less aerodynamic Mazda 5 with the 4 cyl.
Off Topic, but if Honda or anybody makes a nice roomy 4-cyl wagon I am all over it. An Accord wagon would have as much room as all but the largest SUV's and would get Accord mpg, have Accord handling and ride etc.
Of course they are all about money and as long as they can get (or con
Given a choice there are many people that would and do opt for the smaller engine for whatever the reason. I see the same discussions concerning the Altima 2.5 vs 3.5. Not to mention most other makes as well.
I remember one year along when Chevrolet had over 40 engine options back in the late 60s early 70s and then as now most of them were sold with the base engine.
Today you don't see so many options but certainly the base engine still gets the most attention from buyers. While most of us here or in places like here prefer a more performance oriented model most still buy the smaller motor given the option.
Sometimes it's cost but often it is nothing but availability. Combine a good salesman with adequate performance and the desire to own a new car and more times than not you are going to drive home in what he's got on the lot.
As already stated gas mileage differences are nil. Cost can get in the way however if one wanted the 6 the difference (over 10% in my case) could be overcome. Some are not going to buy a loaded anything while others will buy nothing but one fully loaded.
I can speak only to my reasons for buying the 4 and the truth is the car was equipped exactly like I wanted except for the V6. In my case the exact same car with the V6 was going to be around 10% more money.
It is all what we want in a car. My co-worker has a Dodge Charger V8! Plus she lives literally down the street from work, now you think that is practical? No, but is she happy? Yes!!! Does she pay for it? No, lol, her husband does.:) Sometimes, one has to weigh both sides, practicality and enjoyment, some try to shoot for the middle, and some go right for the enjoyment, I am proud to get decent mileage on my 4cyl, but I would love to have a V8 every now and then,Yes, have some fun! I think Honda owners should be glad that we drive one of the better cars on the road.
And YOU say - "Give me a break.You make it sound like it is prevalent in most cars."
I think that you are grossly exaggerating my remark. I simply said that this person was among the lucky - if you read the forum, there indeed have been many others with problems. Are they the majority? Of course not. But there ARE issues with VCM - in varying degrees. You ignore it at your peril. As many have suggested - if you are considering a VCM equipped 6, be certain you drive the one you will buy - the performance of the VCM and its annoyance CAN vary from car to car. There are numerous car reviews which have also noted its sensations and its being noticeable, from a "hybrid - like surge" to "maddening behavior". These are opinions, yes, but from unbiased people who test drive cars for a living with no horse in the race. Do you sell Hondas for a living? How would any of us know otherwise?
All I am trying to encourage is what dolfan1 posted -
"There is no such thing as a right or wrong choice, it's about making an informed choice based on having all the information."
Major differences between my model EX-L Coupe no NAV
1-Chrome door handles vs painted handles
2-Dual exhaust vs single exhaust
3-18in wheels with bigger tires vs 17in on the 4
4-Electric passenger seat
5- Fog lights standard
6- 6 cylinders vs 4
7- iirc I think the V6 might even have a different rear view mirror
There may be a few other niceities(sp) that I can't remember.
I'd suggest if someone wanted the power of the 6, but opt for the 4 to get nav & stay within budget; I 'd say buy the 6 & get a Garmin!
But about the "practical" issue. Let's say through some new technological achievement, next year's Accord I4's HP will increase to 280. Everything else stays the same (weight, size, etc). No one would argue the 4 wouldn't be way, way more than adequate - having far more power than necessary for any practical application.
But, because of that same technological breakthrough, the same can be applied to the V6 as well, increasing it's HP to 350. I guarantee you, there will still be people lining up to buy the 6, even though the 4 would provide all the power needed, and then some.
It's just the way it is. Honda knows this, and that is why they offer both choices.
There must be after market gear to increase the 4's HP to that level or more.
Something that I'm truly interested in doing at some point in the future. Maybe in a year or two once I start getting the itch.
I guess I agree with the point someone made earlier, that it would be best to get the V6, I could also lose the navi, and V6 and save even more, and still be driving a similar car, and wouldn't feel any different. An EX-L 4cyl lease, is hard to beat, alot of car for the money.
Say you are looking at a midline Accord LX-P with an automatic (as most do) and decide that it needs a little more pep. CR tests this car at 9.8 seconds to 60 mph (they do a version of the street start - no loading the torque converter or popping the clutch) and claim it averages 23 mpg overall. There are two ways to go that will provide a significant change.
The standard way is to look at the V-6 (dealers will push this way as it is the highest profit). You will pay (based on sticker) $3,900 for the added power and few more doodads and whatzits. Your 0-60 will drop down to 7.4 and your mpg will drop 2 down to 21 mpg overall.
Now there is one more way to get quite a bit of extra zip. Look at the manual transmission version of that same car (LX-P). Instead of paying $3,900 extra you save $800. Instead of dropping 2 mpg you gain 3 mpg up to a 26 mpg average. Now you won't be quite as quick, but you will be quite a bit closer to the V-6 than to the automatic I4 with a time of 8.4 seconds to 60 mph.
Comparing the two options (LX-P MT vs the cheapest V-6) shows that for a 1 second savings to 60 mpg you pay $4,700, and lose 5 mpg.
And the best part is the I4 stick shift is real fun to drive, and you get to use both legs, not just one.
There was a V6 stick available in 07. They dropped it for the current generation. Hopefully, it will return in the sedan soon.
You can't really look at the $3,900 sticker price difference when comparing the costs of an I4 vs. the V6. In reality, you can get the V6 for about $1,400 more than the same model with an I4. For this you get the bigger motor, chrome door handles, dual exhaust, power passenger seat, and homelink.
Not in my case. My EX-L coupe is equipped exactly as I want but to add the V6 is a lot more than 1400 bucks. Now you do get bigger tires and wheels, Fog lights, Electric passenger seat, Duals, Chrome door handles plus a few other 'mandatory' items. My 4 cyl car's sticker was around 26,500 and the same car with the V6 was almost 29,000.
I was not willing to give up what I had in the 4cyl car just to get the V6. As it was I got pretty darn close to exactly what I wanted.
The point was if you want a lower content 4 with more power you can't get one unless you pay a lot more money.
That's my point. I didn't want to give up anything enough to get the V6. I could have bought a V6 sedan for less money than I spent for my 4 cyl coupe but I wanted what I had more than I wanted the V6.
Had I not been thrilled with the 4's performance I would be either driving the V6 or another car all together.
I know the V6 is bigger, better, faster, sexier, does everything but wash dishes and change diapers but I wanted the 4. I'm not trying to be cute. The V6 is all those things and more plus it is worth more money than the differences that exist but. . . I wanted the 4.
I found a 2007 SE V-6 that was just what i wanted. Like a previous poster,i didn't need all the bells and whistles.
I'm happy still with my choice, especially since so many have had complaints with the 08.
I believe my gas mileage is pretty close to the 4 enough that its a non-issue for me,and better than the 08's,or equal.. The styling is great with the dual exhaust tips,alloy wheels,17" tires,and the Royal blue Pearl paint.
My problem with the V6 isn't just Honda's but I don't like how a V6 sounds. . . any of them. Now V8's that's another matter. I do like how a V8 sounds and I like how a 4cyl sounds when they are right and spinning up around 7-8 grand.
Years ago I was going to buy a Nissan 300 ZX turbo but one test drive and I couldn't stand it. Plenty of power alright but I couldn't get past that V6 sound.
I know that's just silly but to me it is also true.
No torque doesn't bother me so much plus I do love my 08 4cyl coupe. Nice and smooth and I do like how Hondas pull harder and harder all the way to redline. I remember my Honda bikes with much fondness as well. I owned a V65 Magna and a V30 (500cc) at the same time. Now the V65 had plenty of torque and would make your hair grow plus eat your lunch too. The little V30 on the other hand was much more fun for many reasons. One was how she would literally scream all the way to somewhere around 10 or 11 grand. I rode her to work which at the time was second shift. Didn't get much better than coming home at 3AM except for the bugs. I'll always miss that bike.
I have no doubt that I would love the V6 too. After all its a Honda right?? Still my little 4 banger pleases me greatly.
It wasn't the gas mileage, it wasn't the cost. It had more to do with the fact that as soon as I saw my car sitting on the show room floor I wanted it. I walked past it every time I went there to check out the Si Civic, several V6 sedans along with a couple 4cyl sedans. At the end of every session I would tell the salesman that I wanted a V6 just like that red one sitting on the floor.
On one of my visits he asked me if I wanted to drive that red one. I told him "no I want a V6 just like it but I would like to drive a coupe just to check it out". The rest is history. . . I drove that 4cyl red coupe home and have had absolutely no regrets period. It had much more than I expected. Plenty for 95% of my driving. I'm sure I could have lived with the sound of the 6. Actually the sounds from the V6 only really bug me when driven flat out. Normal driving they sound fine for the most part plus I would agree that Honda's V6 sounds better than most. The bad ones are American push rod types like the 4.3 that was in my pickup.
Personally, I would have loved to have the EX, but it was out of my price range.
Some here have opted for the EX 4 instead of the 6 to get the bells & whistles instead of the larger engine. I went the opposite way, giving up the bells & whistles to get the 6. Isn't it great we have that choice to make!
In truth, my '08 I4 Accord is the first "mainstream" car I've had in quite a while. I've had Mustang GTs (high torque, low revs), a Mazda RX8 (low torque, high revs), to name just two recent examples. Both were fine cars. Both did what they did in different manners. Both were fun, just in different ways.
IMHO, the EX I4 is the "sweet spot" for the Accord. Good power for a 4 banger. Very "zingy". Lighter weight does make a difference in the feel of it (vs the 6 cyl). But, I'd be the last one to cast any stones for anyone desiring more power from the 6 cyl.
It's just a marvel to me how far Honda has come in refining the 4 cyl sedan.....especially for the price.
While the V6 is the top of the pile I see it leaning more towards a personal luxury car (especially the coupe) while the 4 is more of a driver's car. It does take more work to get the good out of it but once you do the rewards are great.
Both exceptional automobiles but meant for two distinctly different driving styles.
The I4 I found more "tossable". Or, as you put it "more of a driver's car". V6 was a wee bit smoother. Personal preference, of course, but I never liked a lot of "bling" on my cars. So, the added chrome of the V6 didn't appeal to me. But again, that's just a personal preference.
Of the two "top dogs" in the segment, the Camry and the Accord, it was clear to me what side of the fence Honda comes down on......that is it's a much sportier drive....particularly the I4.
I had one person tell me that I should compare Camry SE to get that same "Honda feel". I tried to like both the Camry and the Altima. I just couldn't, no matter how many test drives I did of either. Can't quite put my finger on it, but the Accord just has that well-engineered feel to it.