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Comments
Steve
Host
SUVs, Vans and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards
Advice: Don't sign anything until you've had a chance to see and test drive the car. Check for defects and make sure that everything you ordered is installed.
One scenario where they may get you is to offer you the option of filling out the paper work while they "finish up a few things". It sounds like they are being nice, but it could be that they're hiding something.
Better safe than sorry.
Ah, wait a sec - Patti said Subaru is pulling the ad!
Donna: congrats, first of all. Look it over closely. Take delivery during the day so you can check out the paint finish. Walk around it twice, once slowly, then quickly. Drive your actual car. It should be smooth. Ask them if they checked the tire pressure, the most common oversight. Check the clutch, the pedals, everything should be smooth. It should track straight, not hesitate, shift smoothly. Check for all the accessories you ordered, and get it in writing that the dealer will install the ones missing for free (they usually charge for installation).
If you got alloy wheel locks, make sure you get a key for the lugs. Check for the wrench that allows you to move the roof rack cross bars. You should get two remote key fobs and 3 keys (one is a valet key). The gas tank should be completely full and the car should be clean inside and out.
Heck, print out these tips or make a check list for yourself, since you will be so excited at delivery.
-juice
Welcome to me!
We're finally adding another Subaru to the family next Saturday (my wife is picking up an '03 Forester) and I was curious about something...
Does anyone offer those 2/24 free maintenance coupon books anymore? I got mine in '99 when I had my my Outback after
someone posted the info on another board. Does anyone know if those offers still exist?
Thanks in advance for your replies!
Many happy and safe miles with your new Subaru!
Patti
-Frank P.
Liberty Subaru in Libertyville, IL is selling the above and the WRX at great savings. The WRX is at invoice. Sales of Subarus are pitiful here in IL.
Tom
Seeing the specs of the new Forester, I cant help but think that Subaru has no intentions of challenging the CRV or the Escape for that matter. Does Subaru/GM not want to gorw market share? $ for $, I see the other vehicles as being a better value. I thought there was going to be a larger Forester this time around. Oh well.
Tom
Bob
The "H" rating may be important for sidewall stiffness, but other tires can also be OK. I am using BF Goodrich Touring T/As on my '98. They are only "T" rated, but they are much better in snow than the Geolandars, and now that they are about 60% worn, they are just beginning to hydroplane at speeds above 70 mph. The Geolandars hydroplaned much sooner and at lower speeds. The Goodrich tires are a bit noisier and have a slightly higher rolling resistance, but I am still getting 25-28 mpg in good weather, depending on driving conditions. Depending on where you buy them, they may come with up to a 65,000 mile treadwear warranty.
I currently have 35,000 miles on them. I expect them to last until 50k. I did have to have them rebalanced recently, but that was covered by the purchase package, so no charge.
-Frank P.
Tom,
Your comparison seems to be primarily based on size. Subaru purposely didn't grow the Forester because it did very well in it's target market segment. Their market research showed that people didn't want to sacrifice handling for increased cargo/passenger capacity.
What other areas do you think the Forester is not competitive? I believe the power/weight ratio, features and overall fit and finish make the Forester extremely competitive against the other two models.
Ken
Actually, the only real 'pro' of drum brakes is that they're cheaper than discs. Discs generally have better performance characteristics. However, most of your braking is done with the front so having rear drums isn't something to be concerned about.
People prefer alloy wheels because of appearance and usually, lighter weight. Steel wheels can have it's advantages: easier to repair, less ice forming on wheels in winter, less likely to be stolen.
Ken
Patti
I spoke briefly with the service scheduler at the dealer where I purchased it, but after getting disconnected a couple of times I finally left him a pleasant message to please call me. Maybe he'll be nice since I didn't call him first thing on Monday morning. I thought it was nice that I waited until 11:00 a.m. Of course, now it's 11:55 and he's the only person there allowed to schedule work.
So, any good guesses on what's wrong with the moonroof. (Yeah, I know, it's broken.)
I also called the parts department. They've never heard of a metal front skid plate and the computer shows zip. Oh well.
Happy Monday everyone!
John
PETA = People for the Eating of Tasty Animals.
As for the roof, does the motor move it up and down just not back and forth? Can you hear the motor trying? On my trooper the rubber gasket around the opening tends to stick a lot and prevent it from opening sometimes. I lubed it up with silicone and no more problems.
-mike
Does anyone know what the output (watts I think) is from the stock (base) radio/cassette deck in the 2002 Forester L?
I have a '99 Forester with 48k miles. It's using quite a bit of oil. The dealer has checked for leaks and found none. He has been documenting oil consumption. I'm up to about a quart every 1500 miles. This is most disconcerting, as I have an '85 Saab 900 with 180,000 miles that doesn't burn a drop of oil.
The dealer has told me that one quart every 1000 miles, though unusual, is acceptable to Subaru. Oil consumption must go beyond this before they will consider repair under the 60,000 mile warranty. This is very upsetting. I thought I was purchasing a car that would last as long as my Saab and I find myself adding oil by the quart, though the car hasn't even reached 50,000 miles.
I would appreciate any advice on this matter. I am otherwise happy with the Forester and do not want to have to sell the car to alleviate the problem. Help!!!!!
-Drew
An important deciding factor, as I had posted previously, was the addition of side impact head protection on the '03's. This will be my wife's car primarily. She's 5'2" and especially at risk with all of the big SUV's and trucks out there today. Again, I'd encourage everyone to read the Insurance Institute report on the importance of side impact head protection that you can link to on the VDC page.
Regarding the supposed non-competitiveness of the Forester, I'll agree that the CRV is a good vehicle and MSRP is competitive with the Forester when similarly equipped. 60 month residuals are about 5% higher on the CRV than the Forester, but I'm betting that there are better deals out there on the Forester so the cost over a five year period should be comparable. Of course, there's no Honda credit card program, so we didn't even look at the CRV. We've had the Subaru card since '97 and have $3100 in coupons
The Escape is another matter. Never minding what I feel is the superior quality and feel of the Forester (I haven't had a single repair on my Outback in nearly 5 1/2 years), given the higher rate of depreciation of the Escape I'd guess that the Escape is a move expensive vehicle to own over a five year period.
BTW I'm pretty sure that the 2002 L radio is 80W. I believe the X radio is 80W and the XS radio is 120W.
Congrats to Daryl, Garry, Christopher, and Marlene.
I think the limits on oil consumption is 1 quart per 1000 miles. So yours is high but not enough that they'd try to fix it (unless a leak was found). I'd take the bottom cover off and put it up on ramps, then check very, very closely to see if you can find a (slow) leak.
Other than that, change the front seals when you do the timing belt, though that may be far off. Also make sure you're checking the oil level on a level surface.
Another thought - maybe try synthetic, which doesn't burn as easily as dino oil.
Sorry if I'm all over the place, just wanted to get some suggestions out there.
Garry: my dealer (Fitzgerald, in MD) offered my pre-paid maintenance when we bought my wife's Legacy, so it may be up to the dealer. I do most service myself, so we passed, but it did actually seem like a good value if you use your dealer regularly.
Tom: Honda's MSRP may seem lower, but that's because Subaru simply offers more content. When you compare the LX to the X, only the Subie has ABS, for example.
Compare loaded up EX models to the XS Premium, and Subaru has heated seats, heated mirrors, heated windshield (front and rear), rear LSD, 16" vs. 15" wheels, 4 vs. 3 channel ABS, side air bags that also protect the head, and a much bigger moonroof.
The other factor is the actual street price. You can get a Forester at invoice, but CR-Vs are selling for MSRP in most cases, with a few lucky buyers getting $500 off.
-juice
-mike
-juice
Drew -- As for oil consumption, that's a tricky one. I'd follow juice's advice and check for any leaks on your own. Since the dealer has already documented your concern (a good thing), just keep an eye on it and take it in if it gets any worse.
Ken
When you push the switch the back of the moonroof drops down and sits there. No rearward motion at all, but, luckily, it will close. Being a curious do-it-yourself kind of guy, I looked for an obvious obstruction and then decided to leave it alone. I'd love to take it apart, but I'll control those urges until the warranty ends in a few years.
1:25 p.m. and still no return call from the service scheduler. The man needs an assistant.
John
Tom
Biggest complaint ? When I sit in the back seat of a new XS premium, my head hits the head liner. We have gobs of head room in our '01 S premium. The (alleged) gains in rear leg room are scarcely measurable, but we think it was OK to begin with. The loss of head room is a bigger factor IMHO, and I can live with the first gen cup holders (at least we have 2 up front).
I'm 6', 185 lbs. I have a number of friends over 6' that have sat back there without complaint. I think one factor that gets overlooked a lot is how the front passengers sit. I always sit very upright. Those folks that prefer the "barca lounger" driving position really cut down on rear seat room big time.
Also, there are other subtleties to consider. Somehow the '01-02 MT seems to offer more front driver's side leg room than the '01-02 AT. I know it sounds funny, but I've sat in a bunch of them now and compared.
In the MT, if I move the seat all the way back, I can't fully depress the clutch pedal. Brake pedal position matches the clutch pedal nicely. If I don't sit all the way back in the AT, the brake pedal position is too close for comfort. So for me, I end up sitting farther back in the AT when driving. On the passenger side, I need to sit all the way back, and still rest my feet solidly against the floorboard in both versions. Go figure.
Gene
-mike
Look at it this way, the Golf is tight, and the Impreza has slightly more room (per a recent comparo I just read, C&D IIRC). The Forester, in turn, has a bit more room than the Impreza, especially head room.
Honda pulled a rabbit out of a hat with space utilization, room is plain impressive. But to match the Forester's cargo floor space you have to move the seats forward a little, diminishing the advantage.
Another thing I forgot is Honda's warranty is just 3/36. Subaru's B2B is also 3/36, but you get free roadside assistance for 3 years and a 67% longer powertrain warranty.
-juice
Check it out!! Interesting that this review has the car 40kg (88 lbs) lighter, and I think C&D review had the 03 100 lbs heavier!!
Bob
I imagine people who are checking out RHD Foresters in other markets are noting an increase in driver's side lateral leg room.
Ed
Ed: I wonder if the JDM model is reversed?
-juice
It was my Father's Day present to my wife's car.
Bob
Can that really be true???? How could they overlook such an important yet almost no-cost feature? It's like neglecting to put in a day-night mirror (well maybe not quite). People's priorities vary. I drive long distances and like to be able to "seek" out new stations as old ones fade out behind me.
Are the other Subie models similarly deficient?
-james
Congratulations on your new purchase! There really isn't a whole lot to check up on at your first oil change. If everything is working and running smoothly, there shouldn't be anything required.
You can even do the oil change yourself. Our vehicles are very easy to work on. Just remember to go through your routine check up of fluids and other safety items (lights, horns, brakes, etc.).
While your vehicle is in it's first year (<12K miles), the dealer will be receptive to fixing little things like any squeaks, rattles and minor annoyances in the rare event they happen. Otherwise, you have 3 years or 36K miles to have any issues worked out under warranty.
Ken
RR
If you want to get a car with the exact options that you want, find out from the dealer what cars are coming in their next allocation but haven't arrived in port yet where the options are installed. Choose your trim line, color and transmission and that car can be equipped the way you want.
http://home.cdsnet.net/~zastava/products.html
Of course, I am still annoyed that my 98 civic coupe has more front legroom than many of the small SUVs and about the same rear legroom as the Forester, RAV 4 etc.
I am considering the Forester XS Premium, probably red or silver (wish it came in green).
Questions:
1. The red has a beige interior only right? Some of the on-line literature says gray.
2. Does the CD changer have a random mode that switches between disks or does it only randomize tracks on each disk?
3. It seems that the Forester has less road noise than other vehicles I've considered such as the CRV and Tribute. When I drove it, it seemed to have more wind noise, and I noticed Car and Driver commented that wind "howled" around the A pillar at highway speeds. Can anyone tell me if this is noticable, and if so, if it is bad at low speeds or highway speed?
4. Does the huge sunroof have a tilt feature?
5. I thought I read that the rear glass is heat reducing green. Is that right? Is it very dark?
6. Any comments on front legroom? I am having trouble trusting specifications for this measurement for numerous vehicles. I have found that some actually have almost no toe space, such as the CR-V on the passenger side. In my civic, there is actually plenty of toe room to cross your feet, move feet around, etc.
It seems that vehicle are trying to maximize the short overall length with interior volume and the result sometimes seems to be less room where I really need it. (For example, I would give up a few inches of cargo space in the CRV or Forester for more front and rear legroom. Ironically, with the CRV, the rear seats slide on a track, but I couldn't put the front seat back as far as needed).
Any other pros/cons I should know about?
I feel a little like I am sacrificing the high seating position, and also wish reclining rear seats were available like in several vehicles I have looked at.
-mike
1. How soon will the chat transcript be posted after the chat?
2. If I post a few questions here, would you all consider using them? if not, hopefully someone will have thought of them as well.
I do try to make the chats regularly - maybe too regularly - and wanted to make this one as it's pretty significant to a Forester owner.
Thanks,
Ed
I'll be at an I-club meet in Long Island on thurs night so I won't be here either
-mike
Congrats, Christopher.
That skid plate looks good, and just $160! The catch is it seems to block access to the oil filter, so you'll have to remove/replace at each oil change. Still, it's tempting...
Tom: your Civic coupe has a 1.6l in-line block laid out transversely (side-to-side). Compare that to a 2.5l horizontally opposed block laid out longitudinally. The fire wall is farther back to make room for that powertrain.
We could compare it to the old Acura Vigor, remember those? 5 in-line laid out longitudinally for good handling balance (engine block was between the axles) and quicker turn-in. They didn't have much leg room, though.
The moonroof does not tilt, and the glass isn't that dark. Tinting costs $140-200 or so.
-juice
-mike