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I think crimping the back down to give it more style and making it look less like a wagon had this result.
I was interested in an above note where the dealer came off the price $2000. My dealer is not so hungry. He alluded to $1000, but we were not bargaining hard. I have looked at wholesale/MSRP notes on Edmunds, and I suppose $2500-3000 would be a real good deal; probably not achievable on such a new vehicle. But I am betting the economy will not improve, and dealers will need to do more if they are to survive. I may be wrong.
Then you must factor in a trade. Some dealers will make you feel they have really worked with you, and then not give you much on your trade. I think the best plan is to be well informed, and not afraid to walk away.
Now my question, who has been able to successfuly negotiate away the dealer add on fees, admin fees, etc. In Raleigh, the fees are 499 doc fee, Wilson 399, and so on. What's the deal on the doc fee, can it be waived?
Usually not - the dealer will give you a song and dance about having to treat everyone the same.
What you can do is focus on the out the door price and ignore the line items in your negotiation.
Out The Door (OTD) Pricing questions
Has anyone seen, heard or driven a 4 cyl Venza yet??
Theory had them on the lots this week...
I'm getting a little impatient!!
I just got a sample sticker from Car Max in MD and there's no admin fees, no tow prep pkg, and the delivery charge is 720. I can fly from Clt to Balt for $59 and they will pick me up at the airport. BTW - they were truly $617 above invoice - 2812 model with Prem Pkg #2 and Nav and carpet mats.
Toyota of Lake Norman in Charlotte has $598 in admin fees, ToyoGuard of $600+ and the tow prep pkg which equates to $1400 in useless charges right there. Plus the $795 delivery fee.
As the song says "Shop Around" or just watch this site for good information.
The real explanation in the difference between the two crossovers is probably that the Venza is trickling out to dealers, while the 2009 Murano has been out since January 2008. However, I'm pretty sure Toyota is being careful to not overproduce the Venza and have to resort to incentives.
Just speculating, but I think this means that those waiting to get Acura MDX and Murano-like deals of thousands below invoice might be waiting awhile. Invoice or invoice + a few hundred dollars may be the norm as long as Toyota keeps inventory low and doesn't flood the market.
I see the new Toyota CEO wants to return to the old tried and true stragedy. Comment?
Or how about: The Sienna is aimed at an entirely different market from the Venza. "Mostly plenty of space" is not on top of everyones priority list; but for those that need space, the Sienna is provided. Any nibbles on that?
How about a technical question: Has the sludge problem that was such an issue in 2001, been resolved in the latest V6?
Or .... for new owners: with 6 forward gears, does the tranny downshift at every slight incline? We rented a Ford Focus, and it could not assend a slight freeway over-pass without downshifting. At what speed does the tranny settle into the highest gear?
Maybe .... the Venza is brand new; are there defects that have required a return to the dealer?
Let's hear from the responders.
I have several questions, some about Toyota in general and some specific to the Venza::
(1.) Living in southwest Florida, the dealers here -- as well as in the rest of Florida, Georgia, Alabama, North Carolina, and South Carolina -- get their Toyota's through a so-called SET distribution network "port" based in Jacksonville, Florida. Many of the Venzas have their options (e.g. leather seat trim) put on at the "port", even though all the cars are made in Georgetown, Kentucky. Likewise, the delivery charge in the SET states is higher ($795) than elsewhere ($720). Does any forum participant know how this 5-state SET Toyota "monopoly" got set up...or why?
(2.) I know that, in general, Toyota's dealer holdback is 2% of the base MSRP. However, all the websites I've seen specifically state that the holdback "might" be different in "Southern" states. Does anyone know what it is in Florida?
(3.) Has anyone seen and driven a 4-cylinder Venza yet? I've driven the V6 version in a somewhat controlled environment (i.e. salesperson present); it was not as peppy as I expected, but very nice overall. The negative review of the Venza in a WALL STREET JOURNAL article a few weeks ago notwithstanding, the Venza remains appealing to me. It looks nicer IMHO than the new 2010 Lexus RX350. Moreover, the Venza's EPA mileage estimates are better than those of competitors -- e.g. Mazda CX-7, Nissan Murano, etc. -- in some cases much better. And it doesn't require premium fuel.
(4.) Given the late launch of the Venza and fact that the 4 cylinder version is just now becoming available (presumably), does anyone consider it odd that Toyota decided to call it a 2009 model rather than a 2010 model? Obviously, if you buy one and keep it forever, this makes no difference. However, if you plan to trade it in earlier, that hurts its resale value by 1 model year.
Thanks.
I (we) are still waiting to DRIVE a 4 cyl version and if all is fine, ORDER one!!
Still have not received a definitive answer from either Toyota or ANY dealer in my area of the world as to a ship date.
The V6 we drove (twice) was silky smooth with MORE than enough power - would pursue it more if the mileage was better.
Any new info on the 4 cyl??
I suspect the 4 cylinder engine is an item that a lot of us are waiting to drive. And, I suspect that many will go ahead and purchase the V6 after driving the 4 ... but none of us want to buy without at least driving the 4.
As I understand it, the 4 cyl. is a new design. There are several outstanding 4 cyl. engines on the market, but most are around 2 litre. The new engine is much larger, not too much smaller than the 3.0 litre v6 in my 2001 HL. I had a 2.0 litre Acura RSX , DOHC, vtec, and it was fantastic ... true, the car was lighter, but I have no interest in towing capacity; I have no interest in 0-60 in under 7 seconds; but I am interested in initial cost and fuel efficiency.
It will be interesting.
I drive a Tacoma x-tra cab with a 2.7L I4 that produces a claimed 142 HP - It seems to move my 3200 Pound (+ or -) truck around OKish... Although it is a little "loud" at times. Our , I hope soon to be, Venza will spend most of its life at an average speed of 35 MPH, so I think it would be fine with the 4 cyl. As long as it not too loud and cranky with full acceleration I will be happy.
Trying to be Carbon Friendly is at the top of the list for us - cost of the decrease in fuel economy between the 6 and the 4 over 100,000 miles (at $3.00/gal) came out to about $1200. The initial cost of the 4 over the 6 is also a moot point for us.. We are just trying to do our part to decrease the total amount of fuel we use.
As I have said before, this "car" fits us to a "T" ergonomically and I truly think Toyota is onto something here...
I am hoping the 4 is adequate, but even the 6 is still a pretty stingy vehicle compared to the competition (Honda CRV, Mazda 7, etc...) - Added plus, NOT a SUV-lite (OK, CAR-heavy, but not a SUV or Minivan - which I just CAN'T do).
Still waiting for the 4cyl. Toyota - do you hear us??
After my first 100 miles, I've only got a couple of minor things to be checked on so far at the first service visit (4-6 months/5,000 miles). The front passenger assist grip on the ceiling is a little loose and the "wood" trim piece around the gear shift/MP3 holder is badly misaligned. Other than that, everything works and seems to be very solid.
Incidentally, my Highlander (2001 - first model year of a new design) went back immediately after delivery to fix the turn signal (the turn signal cancel mechanism wasn't functioning) and my 4Runner (2005 - third model year) went back within the first year to have the driver-side side airbag module replaced (required a change-out of the entire seat).
www.fitzmall.com ..... I need to check that out. Looks interesting. I never heard of it before.
liners: I am glad that you are happy with your vehicle. Can you give me an idea about the speed that it drops into 6th gear? I do not imagine it would use 6th until 40-50 mph?
Surely Toyota is aware that at least some potential buyers are waiting to make the decision after driving the I4. It would be interesting to know if the delay is part of their marketing stragedy, or if there was a delay in delivery of the 4 cyl? Possibly a delay in EPA certification or some such thing.
It will be interesting.
There really has not been that much of a delay, since Toyota originally said the 4 cyl Venza would arrive in Feb. 09. They are probably a little behind their production plan since the Toyota Georgetown plant shut down for nearly a month (Dec-Jan) as part of a Toyota-wide cost savings effort.Production is now back to normal, though Toyota has announced a number of shut-downs days for the remainder of 2009, these are sporadic and should not affect output significantly. Then again, if car sales in general don't pick up, who knows what the future will hold.
In the training done by Toyota last Fall the planned rollout of the vehicle has always foreseen that the loaded V6's would be made first from Nov through Feb. The more standard I4's would begin arriving in Feb but as you note the economy has forced the vehicle makers to cut back production across the board to balance out inventory.
Our first I4's are now due to hit the ground from 3-4 through 3-15.
This is really starting to become annoying. The dealer is doing everything he can (put me in a loaner plain-vanilla Corolla and is buying the gas), but I'm getting tired of driving that beer can and WANT MY VENZA!
I see where Nissan is doing some pretty good rebates, etc., on Muranos... might go look at one tomorrow.
I completely agree with you that building a new car is NOT very carbon friendly - but you gotta know that this will be the 2nd NEW car I have purchased (and I am about to turn the BIG five-Ohhh!). We will be replacing a 94 Volvo Wagon that has served us VERY well since I bought it in 95 (used) - to bring it up to speed would cost more than the Kelly Blue book is says it is worth. There are NO used vehicles that match what the Venza can offer - and I CAN'T drive a SUV or Mini-van (psychologically or philosophically!!)
The Venza is ergonomically the BEST vehicle for our family. Ingress and Egress are wonderful - added plus it looks kinda COOL!!
Even though the difference in MPG between the V6 and the I4 are minimal, over the life of this car (I am planning 150K or more) every little bit will help... I wish it came with a European Toyota Diesel - but I digress!!
"Carbon Friendly" has become a bit of a catch phrase - but I think if we all did a little to help out we might be leaving a slightly better planet for our kids... Our "little" is opting for the I4 and it's slightly better MPG.
BTW - No rain on my Parade - even though we live in the Seattle area!!
And No offense taken and I hope none given...
The 2009 Toyota Venza may be middle of the road, but it owns that road:
http://www.foxnews.com/leisure/auto/index.html
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,500366,00.html?sPage=fnc/leisure/auto
Took delivery this morning.
What a neat ride.
However, I think that those of you holding out for the four cylinder are making a mistake. I know my engine is brand-new, and will get a bit better, but it certainly does NOT have an over-abundance of power.
The one I drove six weeks ago was without a doubt peppier than mine. We'll see.
No drama, though. I bought it for style, comfort, and utility, not to be a street racer.
.
The dealership I have been dealing with just called to ay they also had a L4 ON the lot...
We may go tomorrow and drive it - I've been through my Racer Phase with the Turbo Volvo Wagon and am also looking for style - utility AND better MPG - ready to give up SPEED!!
Now, can we get one outfitted as we want??
LSP972 - How is your L4 configured - if you don't mind me asking???
Sorry to get your hopes up -
I just listened to the message on our phone again from the dealer -
He said it was an I4 with a comfort package, security package and tow package and put it ON the lot LOT on the 13th of MARCH!!
I am not in Seattle proper and may start looking at the BIGGER Seattle Metro dealers inventory next week...
I am hopeful though - I was thinking that Toyota would be shipping only BASE model I4s initially and the fact that this one has at least leather is a good sign...
Still a little sleepless NEAR Seattle!!
David
Its funny as I read your message. My wife has an 05 Avalon and I drove a 03 Sequioa like you. Just heard my Venza is in Jacksonville and hope to have it next week and its Golden Umber as well. Did you get teh extended warranty? I also use to live in Fl.-Miami
I take it you bought your Venza through a southeast Toyota (SET) dealer. That 5 state dealer network orders vehicles a little different than dealers elsewhere. I just moved to southwest Florida from the midwest a few months ago. Dealers in my area are not doing much price-wise, not yet at least. They seem oblivious to the economy.
Are you still in Florida? Do you mind telling me which dealer you ordered your Venza from, what options you got/considered, and what kind of pricing you were able to get?
Thanks a lot!
Did you forget about $4 gas last summer that will be back sooner than you think? 21mpg ave, isn't good enough for me to invest in a new vehicle to keep long term.
Enjoy your new ride anyway.
No, I didn't drive a four cylinder. But it doesn't take an engineering degree to figure out that MY six cylinder will have more power, get-up-and-go, whatever you want to call it... and MY six cylinder isn't that peppy.
So, untwist your knickers and buy what you want...
.
Power isn't everything these days. I think you need to unwind a little.
- The Venza is a heavy vehicle.
- I'm thinking that the 4-cyl will need to work harder than the V6, which means it'll be louder, rev higher more often, pushed harder, etc.
- My previous vehicle was a 4Runner V6 with lots of low-end torque.
- I prefer the 20" wheels (and the 20" tire size is found in other vehicles which should mean they are higher volume with more choices).
Finally:
- The V6 is available now.
I have been thinking about your comment all day. I'd be suspicious. True, new engines do often become more fuel efficient with time; oil consumption often improves, but I doubt you would be able to feel a significant change in it being "peppier." I would have the dealer check out the computer ....... there are so many variables that are computer controlled that could impact performance. I'd watch gasoline consumption carefully.
I have not driven the Venza, but the dealer raves about how "peppy" it is, as well as others have commented on the performance as well.
I think it is pretty exciting that more and more writers on this thread are taking delivery. Please share with us your experiences. I am interested in performance (mentioned above) but also wind noise, rattles, and of course real world efficiency.
Noise: The Venza seems to allow more road noise in than my 4Runner. It's hard to tell, though -- the 4Runner had more engine noise that might have drowned out any road noise (it was a low, truck-like growl which was kind of nice).
Fuel Economy: The information screen shows an average of 17.5 MPG, but it's steadily increased the more I drive. I'm hoping to get to around 20MPG.
JBL Audio: The Venza's JBL Synthesis is superior to the 10-speaker JBL Synthesis in the 4Runner. I'm not an audiophile by any means, but my music sounds fuller and richer, especially around the mid-range. Even FM radio stations sound better.
Interior Qualify: I have several misaligned trim pieces on the dash. The worst is the woodgrain piece around the MP3 compartment. I'm hearing what sounds like a rattle in the dash and one in the driver's side door, but I haven't had a chance to troubleshoot either one yet.
More later...
I hope others will file reports of their experiences as well, plus, I hope we will get updates from time to time.
When we bought our 2001 HL, it was early in the model year. Wind noise was a real problem. Totota followed with a service bulletin, we returned to the dealer and they replaced the seal around the doors. No more problem. The 01 has been a fantastic vehicle, and in that regard, I almost hate to trade it in. I consistently get between 20 and 23 mpg (calculated, not by an on=board display). I own a 2500 Dodge Diesel and the on-board display is about 4 mpg too optimistic.
Good luck to all new owners, and keep those post comin'
If the 2010 Venza does not have upgraded the I4 to DFI, and the V6 for that matter, it will be a serious mistake.
Do you mean like shocks and springs or larger sway bars or a turbo/supercharger kit or are you thinking of something on late night tv for $19.95 that miraculously doubles your horsepower and mileage?
There are turbo kids available for the Lexus, but I don't know if the models are direct injection. its also not inexpensive for the kit, 3-4k, and would do bad things to your warranty. With the exception of Scions (which are mostly about body modifications or audio systems), late model Toyotas don't seem to have a huge aftermarket following.
The author, Jeff Sabatini, test drove the car in the snow and reported it was heavy and handled poorly. He said the huge 20" wheels made it a handful in the snow where it often struggled to gain traction. He also said that even mild acceleration caused the stability control system to kick in, reducing power and applying single wheel braking to quell slippage, thus rendering the benefits of all wheel drive moot.
Has anyone had this experience? I'm thinking about buying one, but I need a car that handles well in the snow.