to all "cts" owners! wife smelled a musty oder with our Six week old Cts. I discovered a puddle under the driver seat on floor board. took car in today was told its a design problem with a/c unit. service writer said cadillac is aware of problem and that they have personally seen seven cts with same problem. they are going to remove entire system may take two to four days to repair. i suggest all cts owners check beneath driver seat near floor vent. my question is why hasent cad issued recall. please post if youve had this or any other problems.
A recall would not be issued for such a "problem". Such a "problem" would first have a Technical Service Bulletin issued to aid the local dealers' service departments in diagnosing the supposed "problems". I just checked with the NHTSA and indeed in March of 2002 there was a TSB issued for "A/C - Carpet Wet On Front Passenger Side", its ID number is 02-01-37-003. If there really have been seven cases of driver side problems, then that is something that merits another TSB.
Here is a full listing of 2003 Cadillac CTS V6-196 3.2L DOHC VIN N TSBs:
02-I-06 APR 02 Vehicle - Lemon Law Point of Sale materials
02-01-37-003 MAR 02 A/C - Carpet Wet On Front Passenger Side
02-07-30-012 MAR 02 A/T - THM 5L40E Service Information
99-08-51-007A MAR 02 Aluminum Wheels - Refinishing
02-06-04-013 MAR 02 PCM - MIL ON/DTC P0602 Set
02-08-66-003 MAR 02 Trunk - Popping/Oil Canning Noise
99-00-89-019B FEB 02 Warranty Parts - Parts Return Program
02-07-30-002 JAN 02 A/T - 5L40E Operating Characteristics
01-00-89-016 DEC 01 Warranty - Straight Time Pilot Program
01-00-89-015 OCT 01 PDI - Dealer & Production Installed Accessories
I continue to be amused at the number of postings by R&T writer wannabees...just how many of these people who suggest a 6 speed transmission, V8 engine, etc., etc., are in a position to buy a CTS...or anything else?
FUELEDUP - what part of the country are you in? Do you have high temperatures and high humidity? It sounds like a condensate overflow problem. Possibly high condensate with a blocked discharge tube.
For those that are interested, I thought I'd post my initial 'review' of the CTS after having lived with it for a couple of weeks now. Take it for what it's worth...it's merely my opinion.
Styling: In this area the CTS really shines. I don't think there is ANY 4 door sport sedan in the same price range that is as distinctive looking and judging by the reactions I get others feel the same way. I've had the car for only a short time and couldn't tell you how many people have commented on the car or turned backwards in their car seat to get a better look; one car came to a stop in moving traffic to gawk. Most people simply don't know what it is; this is probably due to the otherworldly styling and the CTS's lack of Cadillac badging. One thing I really like about the car is that aside from the Cadillac emblems (on the front and back) it doesn't say "Cadillac" ANYWHERE on the car. I'm sure if Cadillac continues with the redesign of it's cars so they follow the 'art & technology' theme that the badging will be unnecessary; the fact it's a Cadillac will be obvious from its ominous styling. Interior styling is clean and techno looking with none of the frilly, poofy, overstuffed adornments (coffin lining) associated with previous Cads. I've heard criticism that it's not earthy or plush enough and that many people don't like the computer-case-like protruding pod in the center of the dash. Personally, I wouldn't change a thing other than possibly adding cup holders that could hold a big gulp. Another nice feature of the interior is the headliner that's made out of a hip looking mesh fabric instead of the cheap felt used by the majority of automakers. I also like that you can remove the stupid warning stickers that come attached to the sun visor...I can't tell you how much I hated having to live with the bright yellow warnings in my previous car in which they were permanently painted on the visor and clashed with the dark grey interior.
Features: My CTS is a base model except for the addition of the automatic transmission. Really, for the price you get a pretty good set of standard features (leather, cruise control, air conditioning, power drivers seat, dimming mirrors, dual climate control, full array of airbags, antilock brakes and traction control, onstar, remote keyless entry). My only gripe is that although the standard features are good it seems that Cadillac intentionally left out some desireable features that are standard on most other cars in this price range in order to 'punish' those that didn't get a luxury package or to try and force one of the more expensive packages on to the consumer. In my opinion there's really no excuse not to include the homelink garage door opener, a compass on the mirror, and drivers side memory seat in the standard package. Another annoyance of the standard model is that you don't get a power passenger seat...I couldn't care less about the lack of the power feature, but with the standard passenger seat there is a manual adjustment bar at the front of the seat that sticks out WAY TOO FAR and is very visible...just another way to 'punish' those that went with the standard model. Onstar is extremely cool and the voice recognition works remarkably well...I don't know if I'll subscribe after the free year but there's a good possibillity that I will. Then there's the lights...my advice to new CTS buyers is "don't bother with the HID option!". I have the standard headlights and those suckers are BRIGHT!
Performance: The CTS handling is superior. In testdriving both the standard and 'luxury performance' models I can say that both are excellent. Given the choice I would have spent the $$ for the 'luxury performance' in order to get the slightly better handling and bigger wheels and tires...unfortunately most of the cars available with this option also had other options I didn't care about that contributed considerably to the overall cost of the car. The engine can be fairly criticized for being slightly unrefined, loud, and brash while at the same time being slightly underpowered. Although I agree with these observations I still like it; it's an extremely FUN car to drive and in my opinion the engine/exhaust noise (I'm a sicko...I know) adds to the fun. The auto transmission is probably the best I've ever driven. I normally drive with the 'sport' setting off to conserve gas...put it in 'sport' mode though and it has much higher performance with harder shifts at higher RPMs. One transmission feature I like is how it holds a gear and uses engine compression to brake while driving on a downgrade.
Fit and Finish: Unlike my previous car (also black) the paint seems to be of a high quality with no terrible factory defects although there's a bit of 'orange peel' on the top of the rear bumper. The body panels seem to fit together nicely but there are some sharp edges around the taillights as discovered when washing it the other day as a prodtruding piece of plastic rammed under my fingernail with painful results. Road noise levels are low and I don't have any extremely annoying creaks and squeaks other than a slight rattle from the console area which may require a visit to the dealer if it doesn't disappear after a few more miles.
Minor gripes include occasional lack of range on the remote door opener (sometimes it doesn't work at all), no locking gas cap, smallish (and permanently exposed) cup holders, and leather seats that seem to stretch a bit too easily in the butt region for a person of my stature (keep in mind that I'm 6'1" and 160lbs and my wife is smaller than I).
I know how you feel about expensive packages you are often forced to buy to get one option. I had to buy a 2K pak when I bought my 02 dts in order to get tilt/telescope steering wheel. The moonroof price was also outlandish. However, I got such a good deal that the prices didn't hurt as much, in the final analysis.
If its any consolation, price the base model german sports sedans here on Edmunds and see how fast prices explode skyward when you add anything beyond MT. Until recently, you didn't get a power drivers seat on the base model of many german makes.
I think the entry level lux models tend to use the base model as a loss leader or ad car that is rarely available in any real quantity.
Did you notice the number of MT models compared to those with AT on the dealers lots? Which version did the other customers seem more interested in buying or test driving?
There are many more AT models available than MT and in my area it seems that there is almost no interest in the manual transmission cars. Another thing is that the MT transmission cars I've seen are all base models with no options and they've been sitting on the lots for a LOOOONNNGGGG time. The CTS's with auto transmission are sold immediately and are typically medium to highly optioned...mine is the only base model auto I've ever seen. While my dealer was unwilling to do very much price negotiation on my car, they made it clear that if I was interested in the silver MT base model CTS they could 'make me a deal'.
Personally, if I didn't live in an area where I do mostly in-town driving in stop and go traffic I'd consider the MT CTS. To me, shifting is only fun on the open road...one of the main reasons I sold my Cobra is that I got tired of constantly holding down the clutch pedal.
baron, i do live in south florida. thanks for your suggestion. however this is the seventh cts my dealership has taken in for identical problem and they say its a design problem. so i would again suggest that all cts owners check carpet beneath driver seat otherwise you may be unaware.
Finally received my survey on Saturday . I guess that it wasn't as long a wait as some. Accepted CTS on June 8. Today (Tuesday)the Powers survey came. Before I fill it out I'm going over every question just to be sure there isn't something wrong in my car. The only problem I have is with the clock and computer time. I will check now also under both seats for wetness from AC. Never noticed any musty smell. We've been having a lot of heat and humidity over the past week so if there's going to be a problem it should show up now.
I was at a local store to pick up some milk and I noticed this man going toward his car staring at my CTS. He asked to look inside and I said sure and opened the door for him. I asked what he thought and he said that ...it will never drive like my Cadillac when mine was new. I answered politely ...I am VERY sure that it doesn't and I wouldn't want it to. He nodded and walked away.
Our local dealer has more AT than MT. He said that they sell at 5 to 1. He does order MT just to keep one in stock. Later he admitted that when the MT arrive they usually sell in under a week while right now the ATs are sitting on the lot for over 2 weeks. I bought a MT the day after it arrived. I just had to have it, a black CTS with MT. But the dealers won't stock more than one MT at a time. The dealers don't have any base models in either MT or AT around here.
Well, I turned in my '99 STS off lease this last Saturday. I'll miss it, but I'll be able to visit it now and then since my dad is buying it.
The dealer, Park Cadillac in New Milford, CT, has a beautiful White Diamond CTS in the showroom. It was unique, from what I have seen, in that it was fully loaded with every option including NAV system, sunroof, Luxury/Sport, and yet it had the 5 speed manual. Sticker was just above $39K.
The white really does look great on the CTS, as do black, silver, blue, and red. This white one had the neutral interior.
While I was there, a young couple, I'd say low 30's, were there to pick up their brand new CTS. From what I could tell, it was going to be "hers". It was the sand color, with Neutral interior, and had the automatic. It also was a Luxury/sport. It looked nice, but I don't think that color does the car justice. Nevertheless, nice to see a young couple buying a brand new Cadillac. I had to wonder if, short of Caddy having the CTS, if that couple would have ever been in a Cadillac showroom.
I would think that overall the folks at Cadillac must be very pleased with the response to the CTS, and they must also be excited about all the new cars coming out in the next 24 months. I am.
I will be in the market for a new car in the CTS's price range within a year or so and would love to see it offered with a 6 speed(along with the more powerful V6). Don't quite understand your post. As it is now the CTS is already high on my list so further improvements could only help.
Looking at these sales statistics carefully. For one week in July, I believe the first full week, the plant was down. So there was no production. The CTS plant has resumed production and has been working over-time the last two weeks, now those cars would not have reached dealers lots in time to make a difference. August sales will be telling as to whether or not the CTS is selling above expectations. Remember that the CTS plant was shutdown because of the normal shutdown period, but Lansing Grand River was shutdown for only one week instead of two.
To: Fueldup Ref: Water leak A/C Stay out of the rain till the Cowl Seal is replaced as I experienced the same back in April.
To: Automole Ref: Vibrations in Steering Have experienced and still have this issue but the Cadillac Service cannot find the root cause.
General: Have 8000 miles and enjoy this car to drive with the exception of initial quality and the service. Have a pending possible slipping transmission (AT)and my ON-STAR quit on me and some hardware was replaced this morning. 2 oil changes performed (high price!!) Probably someone on this board will flame me out again like in April however described troubles are for real. there is no excuse such as "1st year car" it just should not happen in todays world.
You mentioned high-priced oil changes. Have you looked into GM's SmartCare/SmartCare Plus packages? It's a way to buy your service in advance in one bulk price; might be worthwhile to check into it. Check the GM website for more info.
My Lincoln LS has all maintenance included for the first 36k miles, but I bought the upgrade service package for oil changes every 3k (rather than 5k) miles plus more frequent filters, rotations, etc., and it has already paid for itself. With 8,000 miles on your car, they'd have to cut the price since you've already paid for some maintenance, but it wouldn't hurt to ask. At Ford, package prices can vary significantly from dealer to dealer, so it pays to shop around. Also, owner's clubs can often cut a discount deal; you might see if there's a Cadillac club that has such a benefit. Could possibly save you some bucks.
I do not think your a troll. The only reason one may critique your posts about owning a CTS is that you are completely negative. For example, you have a right to be mad about the problems you are having with your CTS, however, have you posted anything posotive about the CTS since you got it. Such as its handling, engine, ect. Also, you say, "there is no excuse such as "1st year car" it just should not happen in todays world. I disagree because the Lexus RX300 and BMW X5, I think even the IS 300 had some problems associated with 1st year models. These cars, the Lexus's atleast are very reliable cars so it shows that it almost impossible to launch a car without some problems. Hell, the new Camry had parts coming loose and some rattles when first test driven by Edmunds. And we all know the high quality of Toyota. I have not been to the G35 forum, but I would assume they have some nagging issues with some of their cars as well.
-I haven't experienced the AC leak yet, luckilly. If it's a problem with a cowl leak I'm sure I'll see it as soon as the rains begin.
Do you have the same vibration that I've experienced (low speed)? -or do you have vibration at higher speeds also?
I haven't had an oil change yet but had planned on doing it myself this weekend until I couldn't find a filter for the CTS anywhere. I guess for now I'll have to go to the dealer to buy an oil filter...probably an expensive one I bet!
My other gripes (clock 2 minutes off, low remote range) are still present. The issue with the remote doesn't appear to be the remote itself (or low battery) since I've reproduced it with both remotes...my car was parked in the driveway and I had to hold either remote 1" from the drivers side windshield to get them to function this morning.
I understand with the complexity of todays products that from time to time some things are going to need fixing...especially with a 1st year design. I won't fault Cadillac for having some faulty parts or for making a mistake on the design of the AC, remote transmitter, or clock (since these seem to be problems many CTS's are experiencing). The test will be whether they do an EFFECTIVE job of fixing their mistakes and standing behind their product like issuing a recall for the AC for instance.
autoweek has a pic of the CTSi (and some people thought it wasnt real). This thing is going to be hot. It has a subtly ground effects package and 15-spoke 18" rims and a blacked out grille. The car in the photo is black. Thankfully they have decided to put some aggressive rims on the car and abandoned that 7-spoke conservatism.
I cant wait to see this car in the flesh. A year is too long to wait.
-I think I'm the person you're referring to that "thought it wasn't real"! I never had any doubt that Cadillac would release a CTSi. I merely said that I'd believe it when I see it if it has a 350HP V8...I'm still skeptical that they can (and/or will) fit a 5.7L under the hood. None of the reports of the 350HP V8 have come directly from GM as far as I can tell and we're still talking about a release scheduled for a full year from now. -Then there's also the price (which hasn't been announced) that I'm sure that will be overinflated due to the 'additional dealer markup' that is common on desireable limited edition cars. Still, I hope it happens! It will be a great car regardless of the final engine.
Automole your post # 270: A/C Leak- I am not sure if this situation is related to my original problem but by the description of post# 251 it looks just like what I experienced except more severe and during a rain storm in an early morning commute. Please note that the Service Dept. corrected the situation and I never experienced the problem again. Vibrations- The situation I have is just as described in your original post and it is only at very low speed with wheels in extreme position while driving in or out of a parking space. Personally I think it is not a problem.
Cadillac1 your post# 269 I LOOOVE to ride this car and it has great handling. I feel safe and it is a comfortable and a practical machine and enjoy every minute in this car. I am very happy with the acceleration, HP and torque of this car and is just right for the time being. This car gets hand washed every week and I did add some wood trim to the dash and the console to improve the looks of its interior. A Zaino treatment has been given to enhance the look and I intend to keep it for a while. Now do you call this negative??? I can report to you an average MPG of 23-24 on my daily ~ 100 miles of mixed driving and fully use the sports mode and look forward to every trip I have to make. However what I do not appreciate are stops at dealerships for problems and I will definitely not accept excuses such as “ 1st year Model”. Please note that I do not stop for clocks running 2 minutes slow or other non-important issues. As long it does not impact my driving, comfort, safety and driveability I am a happy and contend. In regards to your post about other brands and issues please take note that I am not in a position and cannot compare and or comment as I do not own any one you listed. But keep in mind like "Automole" reported: The test will be how effective the problem gets solved and the manufacturers stand behind their products!! In this department however I do have fuzzy feelings for this brand!!!!!. Since I agree with all the reviews by owners, negative or positive as seen and observed on this board I see no reason to duplicate their efforts reporting here. However should I discover an issue with my car that may impact owners I do want to report my experience and problem. This is what I call feedback and any good manufacturer will hopefully appreciate this action. If not, they do not deserve me as a customer.
In summary I love this car and just may order a new one for 2004 (CTSi) with all the new goodies and improvements providing the manufacturer hopefully is correcting some of the shortcomings as reported here on this board.
Johnnylinc your post #268
Thanks for your feedback and I will be looking into this suggested approach.
I have kept my CTS in garage anytime it is not being driven, so have not experienced any leakage in the 4 months I have owned it. Could someone provide a one paragraph explanation of the leakage problems experienced? Is it a condition of rainwater entering the passenger cabin? Is it a problem with A/C condensation entering the cabin? Does the moisture show up on passenger or driver side? Does the Tech Service Bulletin have any details? Thanks!
Curiously, the dealer I visited (Classic Cadillac in Atlanta) had all manual transmission cars except for one autotrans car, which was already sold. My wife loves stickshifts, but I try avoid them since I'm 6'11" tall and I need all the leg room I can get. I'm still not completely convinced that I'm going to live the legroom of this car, but I'm giving it a chance. The dealership has told me they did sell to one of the Atlanta Hawks, who was slightly taller than I am.
The other short list car is a Volvo S80, which has lots of legroom, but is short on sporty handling (unless I go for the expensive T6 variety).
In my case it was rainwater entering passenger cabin and do not believe that it was related to AC unless the cowl seal is part of this assembly. but again I could be wrong. I do not know the contents of the Tech bulletin . so my advice is for you to check if you do find water or moisture under the drivers seat close to the floor vent. your findings will will resolve all your problems in this case. check it and have a nice weekend.
has a pic of the CTSi, is it the angle or is the car seem to be extremely slanted upward from the bumper to the trunck?
Bobsan: I appreciate your post. I understand your feelings. Its easy for me to say that its 1st year model problems, but that exscuse would only be viable if 1st year models were sold at discounted prices. Since you probably paid the same price for a 2003 CTS that a buyer of a 2004 CTS will, you should expect the same reliability and quality as well.
has a pic of the CTSi, is it the angle or is the car seem to be extremely slanted upward from the bumper to the trunck?
Bobsan: I appreciate your post. I understand your feelings. Its easy for me to say that its 1st year model problems, but that exscuse would only be viable if 1st year models were sold at discounted prices. Since you probably paid the same price for a 2003 CTS that a buyer of a 2004 CTS will, you should expect the same reliability and quality as well.
to those of you that may be concerned. it's definetly an a/c problem. as i stated earlier the dealership in south florida has already seen seven cts with same problem. and its apparently a major repair, brought car in on 7/29/02 and will not be ready before 8/5/02. note ,i thourghly enjoy driving my wifes car on the weekends so it will be sorely missed this weekend. also note the function of a/c was fine it was just a major puddle of clear clean water on floor board beneath beneath driver seat.
-Thanks for the link to the pic. That was one UGLY CTS however (and that's coming from someone who likes and owns a black CTS). Between the cheesey grill and old-fart wheels they've pretty much destroyed the look of the CTS. It also appears to be jacked up in the back. I hope they haven't ruined the interior as well.
My fear is that the CTSi will be much more expensive, only have a manual transmission, and ruin the standard styling that I like so much.
I'm too old to give a crap about fancy stripes and blacked-out grills but too young to want spoked wheels.
There was an article in Autoweek.com in which a GM executive stated the CTSi will initially be offered with only the 6 speed stick, but will later-on have an automatic transmission option.
If Caddy had to pick one transmission or the other to go with first (and couldn't come out with both simultaneously), then they are doing it right by coming out with the stick FIRST. Simple reason: the Auto Mags that will be writing about it. In a hot "sports car", they demand a stick, period!
I think the reason the rear-end looks higher in this photo is because a) the car is going around a left-hand turn, and b) it may also be braking, and thus that corner is raised a bit. Simple common sense says there's no way the CTSi will sit HIGHER than the base CTS. If anything, it will sit lower on shorter springs.
Lastly, not sure why everbody is getting all worked up about those wheels as though they are the production wheels. For gosh sakes, even the front bumper/grill area and lower body cladding is probably not the final product. Notice how those pieces are a flat black, vs. shiny painted black the the rest of the car? This car is in prototype form, folks! It's a test mule!
Cadillac uses a 7 spoke wheel design as part of its design theme. The CTS sport, STS, upcoming XLR, SRX...all have 7 spoke wheels. Chances are, they are planning to go with an 18" wheel on the CTSi, and since Caddy doesn't have any 18" wheels right now on the shelves, they are using the ones seen in the photo, which they got "who knows where" for testing purposes. Right now, the body is being worked in the design lab, and the engineering is being tersted in Germany on that test track (Nurburghring (sp)).
Autoweek said that the base 2004 CTS will have a beefed up version of the current engine, and not the new 60-degree engine. I hope the information they've got is wrong.
I saw that. I hope it's bad information. Autoweek is famous for showing pics of cars and misidentifying them. Let's hope that is the case with the engine information.
"While most V6 engines use a 60-degree inclination, the CTS team chose the 54-degree bank angle to accommodate the packaging requirements of the CTS."
With that in mind, it doesn't make much sense that they would suddenly ditch the current engine in favor of a 60-degree design. It also doesn't make much sense that Cadillac would abandon an engine that they newly designed specifically for the CTS platform so soon after the intitial release of the car.
It wouldn't surprise me to see them tweak the current engine for a few more horses though. It also wouldn't surprise me to see the CTSi powered by a supercharged V6 as opposed to a V8 since there isn't much room under the hood for much more engine.
Actually the 3.2L is not a new design. It was a 3.0 in the Catera and is used in Europe extensively in Opels, etc. The 3.2L uses timing belts that should be changed every 60K. The new 3.6L will have timing chains. 60 degrees in a V6 makes it a smooth running engine. A 90 degree needs counterbalance shafts and the 54 degree was just a big mistake. I feel sure that it will not be used in 2004 and believe that Autoweek is wrong on this.
The LS1 V8 which will be in the CTSi is a pushrod engine. The size of the heads makes it much narrower than a 4 valve DOHC design. Believe it or not the LS1 will also fit in the wbody cars.
the 3.6 is an all new design...60 degrees...the 3.0 and 3.2 which is a stroked 3.0, is 54 degrees for the fwd application that this motor is also used for in the saab (i think). i could be wrong on the 54 degrees for the fwd app. the interesting aspect to the new 3.6 in the cts is that the chevy malibu will be getting a new 3.0 v6 60 degree (fwd layout) also and i suspect that the two motors are from the same "family" of ohc power plants that gm is changing over to. if gm follows the form of their northstar, the chains for the ohcs will be "life of the engine" and will not need replacing under normal usage. jackg
robh3 in #284 - I agree completely. It's smart to bring it out first as only a 6-speed, then all the auto magazines will test it and get great 0-60 times, write positive reviews, etc... instead of saying "too bad it only comes in an automatic, blah blah blah..."
Also, anyone upset at the looks of the car.... remember, it's a TEST MULE! I doubt it will look exactly like the one in the picture.
An article in Car & Driver on the Corvette 50th aniversary speculated that the next gen LS1 will have VVT and other updates that will markedly increase (the already great) HP while keeping fuel consumption at or possibly below where it is now.
I agree. Ford only let the mags test Mustang 5.0s with manuals in the 80's. Because they made 225 hp to the autos' 180 hp. People bought the autos thinking they would 0-60 in the 6 second range. I can't even count how many of those things I killed in my IROC.
If Caddy comes out with the 6 speed then it will be a low 5 second car. The auto will probably be a high 5 second car or maybe 6.1 secs.
Also I have heard that GM is working on a OHC engine based on the current LS6 block.
Yes, exactly - Let's say the CTSi does 0-60 in 5.1 with the 6-speed and 6.1 with the auto, if they release the 6-speed first, all the auto rags test the 6-speed, most people think of the CTSi as a 5 sec 0-60 car, not a 6 sec 0-60 car, even though eventually most of them will probably have the auto. It's a smart marketing move.
should easily break the 5 second mark (~4.7S). After all, the MB C32AMG is same weight class and engine power (349HP/332lb-ft) and does 0-60 in 5.0 with an automatic.
Not all horses are equal. German horses seem to be a little more powerful than American ones.LOL. The CTS weighs 3600 lbs now. The V8 will add a little. The Corvette with this engine does it in just under 5 seconds and it weighs about 400lbs less. The CTSi will not get into the 4's.
...even though it might seem that way by my recent posts! But...
Cadillac recommends you change the timing belt every 100K miles (not 60K as you posted) or 96 months, whichever comes first.
I'm not sure what your source is for Mustang HP ratings but the autos had EXACTLY the same engine as the manual transmission models and produced the same horsepower. The difference in 0-60 times can be attributed to the different rear-end gearing and that the automatic transmission wasn't a particularly good one (I believe it might have even been a 3spd auto as opposed to the manuals 5 gears). Admidittedly my GT was a 5spd 5.0L but my memory of the 90's differs greatly from yours...I can't count how many IROC's, late 80's Corvettes, BMWs, Porshes (yes German horses!), etc. etc. etc. I KILLED in my GT ! During the time that car came out it was virtually untouchable by most other factory cars short of a ZR1 vette or something 'exotic'.
The current automatic in the CTS is truly a great transmission. With the tranny set to 'sport' mode you can get some high-rev hard shifting out of it under full throttle acceleration. I don't see why the 0-60 times would be appreciably different between the auto and manual. I believe one of the current magazines even got a better 0-60 time in the current CTS WITH the automatic transmission. As for which they release first, I really couldn't care less as long as both transmissions are eventually offered as an option on the CTSi. -Just my 2 cents and probably all it's worth.
As for the elusive CTS oil filter I picked one up from my local dealer today for $11.00(ouch). It's actually not a complete filter with housing but merely the filter membrane and 0-rings. I've never owned a car with this filter design before so it's a bit strange and a bit messy to change I would imagine...I'll find out soon enough.
I also asked about getting a replacement drivers side visor with the homelink transmitter since my car didn't have either of the luxury packages and lacked that feature. Then I found out how much it cost. At $225.00 I think I'll continue to use my existing garage door opener and deal with the inconvenience of not having it located on the visor!
My memory is foggy on this but i think the mid 80's (85-86) 5 speed Mustang GT's had 200 hp and the autos had 180 hp. Around 1987 the GT and 5.0 models were bumped to 225 hp. You might be right about those being the same. Around 1989 or 90 Ford admitted that there had been some changes to the engine and it should have been rated at 205 hp. My '87 IROC which now has 205,000 miles on it was specially ordered. '87 was the first year for the TPI and 5 speed combination. There was a 190hp version and a 215hp version. Mine is the 215 hp version and also has the optional 3.45 rearend, limited slip, 4 wheel disc brakes and engine oil cooler. It is also a low option car with crank windows, no cruise, etc. My car's 0-60 is identical to the 5.7L auto IROCs. I never got beat by a stock 5.0 5 speed or auto Mustang. Maybe I was up against bad drivers. That is my experience. Yours might be different. We are quite a bit off topic here, so back to the CTS.
Automole does the filter have numbers "E610H Energetic" or GM 90 536 362 mark on the top, if so you can buy the same filter at autozone for about $9.00. The part number for autozone is D310 this filter is for my 1999 Catera or an Olds 3.5 V6 engine.
Comments
Here is a full listing of 2003 Cadillac CTS V6-196 3.2L DOHC VIN N TSBs:
02-I-06 APR 02 Vehicle - Lemon Law Point of Sale materials
02-01-37-003 MAR 02 A/C - Carpet Wet On Front Passenger Side
02-07-30-012 MAR 02 A/T - THM 5L40E Service Information
99-08-51-007A MAR 02 Aluminum Wheels - Refinishing
02-06-04-013 MAR 02 PCM - MIL ON/DTC P0602 Set
02-08-66-003 MAR 02 Trunk - Popping/Oil Canning Noise
99-00-89-019B FEB 02 Warranty Parts - Parts Return Program
02-07-30-002 JAN 02 A/T - 5L40E Operating Characteristics
01-00-89-016 DEC 01 Warranty - Straight
Time Pilot Program
01-00-89-015 OCT 01 PDI - Dealer & Production Installed Accessories
Styling: In this area the CTS really shines. I don't think there is ANY 4 door sport sedan in the same price range that is as distinctive looking and judging by the reactions I get others feel the same way. I've had the car for only a short time and couldn't tell you how many people have commented on the car or turned backwards in their car seat to get a better look; one car came to a stop in moving traffic to gawk. Most people simply don't know what it is; this is probably due to the otherworldly styling and the CTS's lack of Cadillac badging. One thing I really like about the car is that aside from the Cadillac emblems (on the front and back) it doesn't say "Cadillac" ANYWHERE on the car. I'm sure if Cadillac continues with the redesign of it's cars so they follow the 'art & technology' theme that the badging will be unnecessary; the fact it's a Cadillac will be obvious from its ominous styling. Interior styling is clean and techno looking with none of the frilly, poofy, overstuffed adornments (coffin lining) associated with previous Cads. I've heard criticism that it's not earthy or plush enough and that many people don't like the computer-case-like protruding pod in the center of the dash. Personally, I wouldn't change a thing other than possibly adding cup holders that could hold a big gulp. Another nice feature of the interior is the headliner that's made out of a hip looking mesh fabric instead of the cheap felt used by the majority of automakers. I also like that you can remove the stupid warning stickers that come attached to the sun visor...I can't tell you how much I hated having to live with the bright yellow warnings in my previous car in which they were permanently painted on the visor and clashed with the dark grey interior.
Features: My CTS is a base model except for the addition of the automatic transmission. Really, for the price you get a pretty good set of standard features (leather, cruise control, air conditioning, power drivers seat, dimming mirrors, dual climate control, full array of airbags, antilock brakes and traction control, onstar, remote keyless entry).
My only gripe is that although the standard features are good it seems that Cadillac intentionally left out some desireable features that are standard on most other cars in this price range in order to 'punish' those that didn't get a luxury package or to try and force one of the more expensive packages on to the consumer. In my opinion there's really no excuse not to include the homelink garage door opener, a compass on the mirror, and drivers side memory seat in the standard package. Another annoyance of the standard model is that you don't get a power passenger seat...I couldn't care less about the lack of the power feature, but with the standard passenger seat there is a manual adjustment bar at the front of the seat that sticks out WAY TOO FAR and is very visible...just another way to 'punish' those that went with the standard model. Onstar is extremely cool and the voice recognition works remarkably well...I don't know if I'll subscribe after the free year but there's a good possibillity that I will. Then there's the lights...my advice to new CTS buyers is "don't bother with the HID option!". I have the standard headlights and those suckers are BRIGHT!
Performance: The CTS handling is superior. In testdriving both the standard and 'luxury performance' models I can say that both are excellent. Given the choice I would have spent the $$ for the 'luxury performance' in order to get the slightly better handling and bigger wheels and tires...unfortunately most of the cars available with this option also had other options I didn't care about that contributed considerably to the overall cost of the car. The engine can be fairly criticized for being slightly unrefined, loud, and brash while at the same time being slightly underpowered. Although I agree with these observations I still like it; it's an extremely FUN car to drive and in my opinion the engine/exhaust noise (I'm a sicko...I know) adds to the fun. The auto transmission is probably the best I've ever driven. I normally drive with the 'sport' setting off to conserve gas...put it in 'sport' mode though and it has much higher performance with harder shifts at higher RPMs. One transmission feature I like is how it holds a gear and uses engine compression to brake while driving on a downgrade.
Fit and Finish: Unlike my previous car (also black) the paint seems to be of a high quality with no terrible factory defects although there's a bit of 'orange peel' on the top of the rear bumper. The body panels seem to fit together nicely but there are some sharp edges around the taillights as discovered when washing it the other day as a prodtruding piece of plastic rammed under my fingernail with painful results.
Road noise levels are low and I don't have any extremely annoying creaks and squeaks other than a slight rattle from the console area which may require a visit to the dealer if it doesn't disappear after a few more miles.
Minor gripes include occasional lack of range on the remote door opener (sometimes it doesn't work at all), no locking gas cap, smallish (and permanently exposed) cup holders, and leather seats that seem to stretch a bit too easily in the butt region for a person of my stature (keep in mind that I'm 6'1" and 160lbs and my wife is smaller than I).
Overall though, I'm EXTREMELY happy with the car.
I know how you feel about expensive packages you are often forced to buy to get one option. I had to buy a 2K pak when I bought my 02 dts in order to get tilt/telescope steering wheel. The moonroof price was also outlandish. However, I got such a good deal that the prices didn't hurt as much, in the final analysis.
If its any consolation, price the base model german sports sedans here on Edmunds and see how fast prices explode skyward when you add anything beyond MT. Until recently, you didn't get a power drivers seat on the base model of many german makes.
I think the entry level lux models tend to use the base model as a loss leader or ad car that is rarely available in any real quantity.
Did you notice the number of MT models compared to those with AT on the dealers lots? Which version did the other customers seem more interested in buying or test driving?
Personally, if I didn't live in an area where I do mostly in-town driving in stop and go traffic I'd consider the MT CTS. To me, shifting is only fun on the open road...one of the main reasons I sold my Cobra is that I got tired of constantly holding down the clutch pedal.
The dealer, Park Cadillac in New Milford, CT, has a beautiful White Diamond CTS in the showroom. It was unique, from what I have seen, in that it was fully loaded with every option including NAV system, sunroof, Luxury/Sport, and yet it had the 5 speed manual. Sticker was just above $39K.
The white really does look great on the CTS, as do black, silver, blue, and red. This white one had the neutral interior.
While I was there, a young couple, I'd say low 30's, were there to pick up their brand new CTS. From what I could tell, it was going to be "hers". It was the sand color, with Neutral interior, and had the automatic. It also was a Luxury/sport. It looked nice, but I don't think that color does the car justice. Nevertheless, nice to see a young couple buying a brand new Cadillac. I had to wonder if, short of Caddy having the CTS, if that couple would have ever been in a Cadillac showroom.
I would think that overall the folks at Cadillac must be very pleased with the response to the CTS, and they must also be excited about all the new cars coming out in the next 24 months. I am.
Ref: Water leak A/C
Stay out of the rain till the Cowl Seal is replaced as I experienced the same back in April.
To: Automole
Ref: Vibrations in Steering
Have experienced and still have this issue but the Cadillac Service cannot find the root cause.
General:
Have 8000 miles and enjoy this car to drive with the exception of initial quality and the service.
Have a pending possible slipping transmission (AT)and my ON-STAR quit on me and some hardware was replaced this morning.
2 oil changes performed (high price!!)
Probably someone on this board will flame me out again like in April however described troubles are for real.
there is no excuse such as "1st year car" it just should not happen in todays world.
My Lincoln LS has all maintenance included for the first 36k miles, but I bought the upgrade service package for oil changes every 3k (rather than 5k) miles plus more frequent filters, rotations, etc., and it has already paid for itself. With 8,000 miles on your car, they'd have to cut the price since you've already paid for some maintenance, but it wouldn't hurt to ask. At Ford, package prices can vary significantly from dealer to dealer, so it pays to shop around. Also, owner's clubs can often cut a discount deal; you might see if there's a Cadillac club that has such a benefit. Could possibly save you some bucks.
Do you have the same vibration that I've experienced (low speed)? -or do you have vibration at higher speeds also?
I haven't had an oil change yet but had planned on doing it myself this weekend until I couldn't find a filter for the CTS anywhere. I guess for now I'll have to go to the dealer to buy an oil filter...probably an expensive one I bet!
My other gripes (clock 2 minutes off, low remote range) are still present. The issue with the remote doesn't appear to be the remote itself (or low battery) since I've reproduced it with both remotes...my car was parked in the driveway and I had to hold either remote 1" from the drivers side windshield to get them to function this morning.
I understand with the complexity of todays products that from time to time some things are going to need fixing...especially with a 1st year design. I won't fault Cadillac for having some faulty parts or for making a mistake on the design of the AC, remote transmitter, or clock (since these seem to be problems many CTS's are experiencing). The test will be whether they do an EFFECTIVE job of fixing their mistakes and standing behind their product like issuing a recall for the AC for instance.
I cant wait to see this car in the flesh. A year is too long to wait.
A/C Leak- I am not sure if this situation is related to my original problem but by the description of post# 251 it looks just like what I experienced except more severe and during a rain storm in an early morning commute. Please note that the Service Dept. corrected the situation and I never experienced the problem again.
Vibrations- The situation I have is just as described in your original post and it is only at very low speed with wheels in extreme position while driving in or out of a parking space. Personally I think it is not a problem.
Cadillac1 your post# 269
I LOOOVE to ride this car and it has great handling. I feel safe and it is a comfortable
and a practical machine and enjoy every minute in this car.
I am very happy with the acceleration, HP and torque of this car and is just right for the time being.
This car gets hand washed every week and I did add some wood trim to the dash and the console to improve the looks of its interior.
A Zaino treatment has been given to enhance the look and I intend to keep it for a while.
Now do you call this negative???
I can report to you an average MPG of 23-24 on my daily ~ 100 miles of mixed driving and fully use the sports mode and look forward to every trip I have to make.
However what I do not appreciate are stops at dealerships for problems and I will definitely not accept excuses such as “ 1st year Model”. Please note that I do not stop for clocks running 2 minutes slow or other non-important issues. As long it does not impact my driving, comfort, safety and driveability I am a happy and contend. In regards to your post about other brands and issues please take note that I am not in a position and cannot compare and or comment as I do not own any one you listed. But keep in mind like "Automole" reported: The test will be how effective the problem gets solved and the manufacturers stand behind their products!! In this department however I do have fuzzy feelings for this brand!!!!!.
Since I agree with all the reviews by owners, negative or positive as seen and observed on this board I see no reason to duplicate their efforts reporting here. However should I discover an issue with my car that may impact owners I do want to report my experience and problem. This is what I call feedback and any good manufacturer will hopefully appreciate this action. If not, they do not deserve me as a customer.
In summary I love this car and just may order a new one for 2004 (CTSi) with all the new goodies and improvements providing the manufacturer hopefully is correcting some of the shortcomings as reported here on this board.
Johnnylinc your post #268
Thanks for your feedback and I will be looking into this suggested approach.
The other short list car is a Volvo S80, which has lots of legroom, but is short on sporty handling (unless I go for the expensive T6 variety).
but again I could be wrong.
I do not know the contents of the Tech bulletin .
so my advice is for you to check if you do find water or moisture under the drivers seat close to the floor vent. your findings will will resolve all your problems in this case.
check it and have a nice weekend.
has a pic of the CTSi, is it the angle or is the car seem to be extremely slanted upward from the bumper to the trunck?
Bobsan: I appreciate your post. I understand your feelings. Its easy for me to say that its 1st year model problems, but that exscuse would only be viable if 1st year models were sold at discounted prices. Since you probably paid the same price for a 2003 CTS that a buyer of a 2004 CTS will, you should expect the same reliability and quality as well.
has a pic of the CTSi, is it the angle or is the car seem to be extremely slanted upward from the bumper to the trunck?
Bobsan: I appreciate your post. I understand your feelings. Its easy for me to say that its 1st year model problems, but that exscuse would only be viable if 1st year models were sold at discounted prices. Since you probably paid the same price for a 2003 CTS that a buyer of a 2004 CTS will, you should expect the same reliability and quality as well.
My fear is that the CTSi will be much more expensive, only have a manual transmission, and ruin the standard styling that I like so much.
I'm too old to give a crap about fancy stripes and blacked-out grills but too young to want spoked wheels.
If Caddy had to pick one transmission or the other to go with first (and couldn't come out with both simultaneously), then they are doing it right by coming out with the stick FIRST. Simple reason: the Auto Mags that will be writing about it. In a hot "sports car", they demand a stick, period!
I think the reason the rear-end looks higher in this photo is because a) the car is going around a left-hand turn, and b) it may also be braking, and thus that corner is raised a bit. Simple common sense says there's no way the CTSi will sit HIGHER than the base CTS. If anything, it will sit lower on shorter springs.
Lastly, not sure why everbody is getting all worked up about those wheels as though they are the production wheels. For gosh sakes, even the front bumper/grill area and lower body cladding is probably not the final product. Notice how those pieces are a flat black, vs. shiny painted black the the rest of the car? This car is in prototype form, folks! It's a test mule!
Cadillac uses a 7 spoke wheel design as part of its design theme. The CTS sport, STS, upcoming XLR, SRX...all have 7 spoke wheels. Chances are, they are planning to go with an 18" wheel on the CTSi, and since Caddy doesn't have any 18" wheels right now on the shelves, they are using the ones seen in the photo, which they got "who knows where" for testing purposes. Right now, the body is being worked in the design lab, and the engineering is being tersted in Germany on that test track (Nurburghring (sp)).
Autoweek is famous for showing pics of cars and misidentifying them. Let's hope that is the case with the engine information.
"While most V6 engines use a 60-degree inclination, the CTS team chose the 54-degree bank angle to accommodate the packaging requirements of the CTS."
With that in mind, it doesn't make much sense that they would suddenly ditch the current engine in favor of a 60-degree design. It also doesn't make much sense that Cadillac would abandon an engine that they newly designed specifically for the CTS platform so soon after the intitial release of the car.
It wouldn't surprise me to see them tweak the current engine for a few more horses though.
It also wouldn't surprise me to see the CTSi powered by a supercharged V6 as opposed to a V8 since there isn't much room under the hood for much more engine.
The 3.2L uses timing belts that should be changed every 60K.
The new 3.6L will have timing chains.
60 degrees in a V6 makes it a smooth running engine. A 90 degree needs counterbalance shafts and the 54 degree was just a big mistake.
I feel sure that it will not be used in 2004 and believe that Autoweek is wrong on this.
Believe it or not the LS1 will also fit in the wbody cars.
power plants that gm is changing over to. if gm
follows the form of their northstar, the chains for the ohcs will be "life of the engine" and will not need replacing under normal usage. jackg
Also, anyone upset at the looks of the car.... remember, it's a TEST MULE! I doubt it will look exactly like the one in the picture.
Because they made 225 hp to the autos' 180 hp.
People bought the autos thinking they would 0-60 in the 6 second range.
I can't even count how many of those things I killed in my IROC.
If Caddy comes out with the 6 speed then it will be a low 5 second car. The auto will probably be a high 5 second car or maybe 6.1 secs.
Also I have heard that GM is working on a OHC engine based on the current LS6 block.
The CTS weighs 3600 lbs now. The V8 will add a little.
The Corvette with this engine does it in just under 5 seconds and it weighs about 400lbs less.
The CTSi will not get into the 4's.
Cadillac recommends you change the timing belt every 100K miles (not 60K as you posted) or 96 months, whichever comes first.
I'm not sure what your source is for Mustang HP ratings but the autos had EXACTLY the same engine as the manual transmission models and produced the same horsepower. The difference in 0-60 times can be attributed to the different rear-end gearing and that the automatic transmission wasn't a particularly good one (I believe it might have even been a 3spd auto as opposed to the manuals 5 gears). Admidittedly my GT was a 5spd 5.0L but my memory of the 90's differs greatly from yours...I can't count how many IROC's, late 80's Corvettes, BMWs, Porshes (yes German horses!), etc. etc. etc. I KILLED in my GT
The current automatic in the CTS is truly a great transmission. With the tranny set to 'sport' mode you can get some high-rev hard shifting out of it under full throttle acceleration. I don't see why the 0-60 times would be appreciably different between the auto and manual. I believe one of the current magazines even got a better 0-60 time in the current CTS WITH the automatic transmission. As for which they release first, I really couldn't care less as long as both transmissions are eventually offered as an option on the CTSi.
-Just my 2 cents and probably all it's worth.
As for the elusive CTS oil filter I picked one up from my local dealer today for $11.00(ouch). It's actually not a complete filter with housing but merely the filter membrane and 0-rings. I've never owned a car with this filter design before so it's a bit strange and a bit messy to change I would imagine...I'll find out soon enough.
I also asked about getting a replacement drivers side visor with the homelink transmitter since my car didn't have either of the luxury packages and lacked that feature. Then I found out how much it cost. At $225.00 I think I'll continue to use my existing garage door opener and deal with the inconvenience of not having it located on the visor!
mid 80's (85-86) 5 speed Mustang GT's had 200 hp and the autos had 180 hp.
Around 1987 the GT and 5.0 models were bumped to 225 hp. You might be right about those being the same.
Around 1989 or 90 Ford admitted that there had been some changes to the engine and it should have been rated at 205 hp.
My '87 IROC which now has 205,000 miles on it was specially ordered.
'87 was the first year for the TPI and 5 speed combination. There was a 190hp version and a 215hp version. Mine is the 215 hp version and also has the optional 3.45 rearend, limited slip, 4 wheel disc brakes and engine oil cooler.
It is also a low option car with crank windows, no cruise, etc.
My car's 0-60 is identical to the 5.7L auto IROCs.
I never got beat by a stock 5.0 5 speed or auto Mustang. Maybe I was up against bad drivers.
That is my experience. Yours might be different.
We are quite a bit off topic here, so back to the CTS.