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Comments
Theoretically, if you can get the TMV price, plus the $2,000 MB marketing support, plus your $1,000 certificate, and use the 2.9% financing, you have yourself one hell of a deal.
However, most 03 models are gone, so dealers may not be so motivated to make such a deal. I got $1,000 below invoice, plus my $1,000 certificate, plus the 2.9% financing. Maybe I could have done better...?
Once you get past the extremely aggressive front styling, I have just fallen in love with this truck. It looks like they have carried over some parts from the M class bin including the 5 speed auto, all wheel drive, and 4 Wheel ETS.
To be honest this is the first time EVER I have considered a Dodge/Chrysler vehicle. I hated these brands, due to their poor quality.
This what I like about the 2004 Durango.
1. Looks (not so much the front, but side and rear).
2. Good ground clearance.
3. Full time AWD including center diff lock.
4. Available side curtain air bags.
5. Five speed auto.
6. Towing capacity of about 7500 with the 4.7L V8
8 7 Pass seating.
9 Good cargo volume.
10. Plenty of space inside.
11. Powertrain Warranty 7 Year/ 100K miles including free towing within this period.
12. All this for about 30 Grand.
I would recomend having a look at this truck if you are planning to buy an SUV.
On whether to keep the truck, repairs like this do give one pause, but once a vehicle gets 5 or so years old, stuff like this can happen, no matter what the brand. It does seem to happen more with MB and the ML, but a Japanese SUV is no guarantee that five years down the road you won't be looking at a new transmission or blown a head gasket. Stuff happens. Spending a grand or two every few years on a major repair is part of the pleasure of owning an older car; it's still a lot cheaper than $750/month for a car payment.
If you still like the car and it is otherwise in good shape, I'd fix it and soldier on, hoping for the best. But if you like a different car and/or want to return to the safety net of a warranty, I'd sell. IOW, make this repair cost part of the overall decision whether to change, but not the only reason.
- Mark
We have a '00 ML430 that is coming up on the end of the lease (thank goodness). We have had the vehicle since 2/00 and we will be turning it in with about 15,000 miles less than the allocated 15,000 mi/yr we so gladly paid for
My question: Besides a good bath and vacuuming, any suggestions to avoid trouble when we turn it in? I plan on taking pictures of it at the very least. New tires went on last year, so it still has good rubber. It has had regular service by the leasing dealer, the last being at 49,600 last week.
I've never leased before and have heard horror stories. Mercedes is holding a MSD of $7000 which I have every intention of getting back without deductions for nonsense.
My thanks as always to those who care to reply.
Mark
I guess M-B wants to gage the market before introducing their crossover. She also wanted to know what I had replaced the 430 with (Lexus) and why. later, ldf
Steve, Host
All the things you like about the 2004 Durango can be had with some other SUV, and without the repair nightmares.
My dealer has been very good with fixes. My Bose unit CD control had problems with the go back switch. I thought they were just going to oil it or something, but they replaced the whole head unit. With a problem as serious as yours, they definitely should replace it, especially if you can demonstrate it in front of them.
2004 ML350 purchased on 10/31/2003 $2.4K below invoice.
Also, how much did the nav system cost? Was is a MB unit or an after market unit?
Thanks, Mark156
Even carsdirect.com has a 2004 price $600 below invoice (in New York), and I bet one can beat that pretty easily.
issues here on this site, I starting to have my dobuts about spending $40K and then to suffer through basic car problems. It seems the problems are more with the options then the car itself.
Would any one of you still recommend the vehicle or would you buy something else?
perfect, but well balanced for economy, utility, safety, off road, and on-road drive-ability.
Some owners have had genuine horror stories with their ML, their dealer, MB USA, or all three. I also think that some owners have higher-than-practical expectations of an ML....
At $40,000, an ML has the drive train of a $50,000 E320, PLUS all wheel drive. I wasn't expecting fit and finish as good as an E or S Class car at this bargain price.
I suggest you get the latest Consumer Reports on
cars (or any other reliable source) and see what they say. I know I looked just recently and saw that the ML was excellent in the drive train and
a little weaker on the periphery - but not bad in
anything. Consumer Reports is a more reliable
way to gauge how ML's or any car does across many
owners. Everything made falls into a bell curve
and this means that some things are going to do
poorly - but those poor experiences aren't a good predictor of what your experiences will be.
Based on the good ratings in CU, I'd say if there's a problem it is with dealers and MB USA
who have been slow to respond to customer concerns.
If you are really bothered by car problems, want Honda Accord levels of trouble-free-ness in your car, and don't have any special needs in your SUV, then I'd get a Honda Pilot, RX330, Toyota Highlander, etc. They're good vehicles, more reliable, very comfortable, good values, and because they're more car-based, are a little smoother, quieter, etc.
OTOH, if you are willing to put up with an occasional problem, like German cars, like the ML, need the extra towing capacity, utility, and off-road capability, then the ML is a great choice. It's also a good value now - with the discounts and rebates, you can pretty much get into a ML for the same money as the Japanese SUVs and the warranty and free maintenance is a nice feature.
Another thing to consider is what you'd buy if you didn't buy the ML. The ML's reliablility isn't great, but at this point in its development, I think it is better than a BMW X5, Volvo XC90, or VW Touareg. Buying one of these because of the ML's reliability issues would be jumping out of the frying pan into the fire.
Keep in mind that all vehicles have issues and lemons. The ML is not as good as something like a Honda Pilot, but if you start looking closely at their forums, you see problems too. No vehicle has an unblemished record.
In the final analysis, the problems with the ML would be a factor in my decision, but not the deciding factor. If everything else is equal, I'd avoid the ML. But if you really like the vehicle, I'd be willing to look past the problems.
- Mark
http://waw.wardsauto.com/ar/auto_wards_ten_best/
Before their pick of the 500, Wards had picked MB's 320 (as it was in the E-class) for a couple of years running. The 320 is the component part of MB's 430 engine and we really enjoy it in the C-class.
The 350 is the component part of the 500, which I think is one of the great engines, so that would be of interest to me if I wanted a V6 (it seems like it would be even better than the 320, especially in a heavier ML that can be used for towing) but I do not have a personal experience with it--not even a test drive.
I can recommend the ML500 though: the V8s come standard with bigger, better brakes, wider tires on all four corners, they're faster and stop quicker, and have navigation. You might think about the Xenon option too--I think it is worth the extra $600-700.
I paid $41.0K on Oct 31 2003 from a dealer in BayArea. MSRP was $46+ It was about $2.5 below the invoice. If you need more info, email me.
Options:
Every available option but Sports (appearance package) and Parktronic.
About Navigation:
I spent $825(no tax) on the DVD-based factory navigation AND DVD-rom map disc. I bought this from the internet and installed it myself(free). Took me 15 mins. I also had to buy a pair of radio removal tools for $7. It was working right away!. However it had to be version coded from the dealer in order to activate the voice(no charge, the advisor thought it was factory installed since I had only 500 miles). Retail for nav is $1400(dvd unit) + $270(dvd map) + $200(install) + tax. The navigation works very well. I LOVE it.
My favorite options:
1. Navigation
2. Xenon ( get this! )
3. Power folding side mirrors ( it's standard in 2004)
4. Leather third-row seats ( they are completely removable )
5. Bose
What I've added so far:
1. Burwood shift-knob
2. all weather floor mats
3. Navigation
What I want to get next:
1. Chrome side bars
2. Chrome brush guard
What I don't like:
1. Mileage
2. CD Changer in the cargo area.
-a dash light that covers the gas gauge and part of the speedometer went out. Mine is still under factory warranty so the dealer took care of it.
-The arm rest between the front seats started to ripple--replaced under warranty.
-I scratched the inside drivers side back door handle (inch long) and MB replaced/repaired under warranty (looks like new again)
-The accelerator pedal was sticking a little; repaired/replaced under warranty.
-driver's window would squeak once positioned from one inch to almost all of the way down; now fixed.
The issues with my ML have been small and taken care of by my MB dealer. At this point, I would definitely buy another one if I wanted an SUV in this size range.
Other warranty repairs:
-replaced windshield washer fluid reservoir
-replaced fuel pump in gas tank; it made a buzzing noise
-squeak in dash at windshield---ML had to be taken to a body shop to weld something under the wiper area (bulletin sent out)
-Recall for power steering hose clamp.
I'm realizing that when I'm listing all of the things done to my ML, it seems like so much more than it felt like. Generally, I had most of these issues done when the ML needed servicing. I was never left stranded so it's easy to forget the small things.
Mine listed for $52,000 (MSRP) with all of the options (bi-xenons w/headlamp washers, third seat w/electric pop-out side windows, 6-CD changer, navigation w/full set of CD's, sunroof, auto sensing wipers, heated seats and parktronic.
The air conditioning system is phenomenal. Even on the hottest days, the air condition system can handle anything mother nature sends!
Also, I agree with Allnation, the CD changer in the cargo area is not a preferred location. Since I have the third seat option, it takes extra effort to get the changer. If it was located maybe in the dash or under the front passenger seat, that would make it easier to get to. I don't change the cartridge often so it's not a major deal to me but I would like it better up front.
Just my .02 worth. Mark156
The land was flat, the wind nonexistent and my ML500 with the big V-8, 288 hp, was barely sipping the gas. On several other tank refills, I was getting 21-23 with no problem on the road. But, once the wind picked up or if the terrain was hilly, the mpg dropped like a lead balloon.
I generally have no problem getting 16/17 in the city. If I make only short city trips, I have gotten only 13 mpg on a few tanks.
The gas mileage really started to get better after 10,000/12,000 miles on the odometer.
Mark156
I only have 700 miles now. and I've been driving like a 90 yr old man. no rpm over 30K
Allnation, I have no idea why the gas mileage improves but mine did. I've always heard that when the engine breaks in that it will get better mileage... but, who knows, maybe it's an urban legend.
mark156
Mark
New vehicles tend to run hotter because there is more friction and the thermostat is very tight (within specs) in older cars the thermostat tends to weaken and will open at less temp, maybe you need a new thermostat if the readings are too low ot it takes a long time to reach operating temp or does not keep operating temp in very cold weather.
- Mark
Happy Thanksgiving to all of you. My 02 ML500 has about 15k miles with 18 mths in service. Had a couple issues fixed this week :
1. BAS/ESP & ETS warning lamps came On - Dealer had to replace some Stop Light Switch. Hopefully its fixed and won't reappear. It seems this is also a known problem !!
2. The Engine Coolant was always about 1/2 an inch below the Cold Level mark - asked the dealer to check it out. They found out that one hose was leaking - replaced the hose & clamp and pressure tested the system. The coolant cap wasn't holding the pressure - had to be replaced !!
In the past 6 mths I have had the following things fixed :
1. Faulty Fuel Gauge - replaced the Fuel Pump & the Fuel Sending Unit.
2. Whistling Noise from left dash - It was the famous Aspirator Motor - replaced it.
3. Rear Brakes squeak when reversing - dealer says its normal - can't do anything. Live with it.
4. Rt Rear door lock makes noise when unlocking - replaced the lock and some retaining clip.
5. Power Steering Hose Clamp recall - no issues so far.
6. Replaced the Windshield WasherFluid Tank - had cracked.
7. The radio was switching from Stereo to mono by itself - some software fix - working fine so far.
8. The Rt side window trim had faded - replaced the Fr and Rear window trim.
This is quite a bit of things failing on a 2002 MY $55K vehicle !! My wife jokes about this car - her 1999 RX300 has been trouble free for the last 4.5 years.
Yesterday I noticed that there is no indicator lamp which come ON when you are in Cruise control - per my wife this is also one of the undocumented "features" of this special car just like No Door Open sign or Not wearing Seat belt sign !! Luckily all the issues so far have happened in town - haven't got stuck or stranded out of town so far.
With our 2nd child on its way, I am wondering should I get rid of it and buy the LX470 ? I need peace of mind when I am travelling with my family. Don't need to be worried about what else is gonna break now !! Anybody else have this many issues with their vehicle ??
Best regards,
Tiger2Doll
- Mark
1) The steering pipe clamp recall. I have seen
puddles of an oil like substance under the
front right corner.
2) My air deflector failed to retract while
closing the sunroof. It sent pieces flying
all over. I had to literally rip off the
remaining pieces to get the roof closed.
3) The clear coat is peeling off the front
wheels and the exposed aluminum is pitting
and turning a dark color. Looks real ugly.
4) My SPORT model fog lights are half full of
water. (They have never fixed this one)
5) The heated seats actually burn you in the
left butt-cheek.
6) The driver window switch is intermittent
(I’m on my second).
There is a serious, but intermittent rattle over the right rear passenger. I expect it is merely a loose wire clamp, but I am afraid to have them fix it. It would require partial disassembly of the headliner, and I fear they won't restore it properly or make it worse. The service guy has previously suggested I live with it, just like the really loud squeak the brakes make in reverse.
This is not to say I am seriously disappointed with my ML. I actually enjoy the car immensely, it is MB I am disappointed in. I can't help but wonder if these repairs and the others I read about are taking a toll on the corporation. How long can you ride on a reputation before you must once again rebuild it.
As I approach the 50K mark, I wonder if I should trade or ride it out. The hit this car has taken in depreciation is unprecedented for MB. Have any of you noticed what the used MLs are going for on eBay?
The MDX loaded has pretty much everything I need and fully loaded with the NAV and DVD entertainment system it offers more options for about $3000 less than a comparably equipped ML350. But I drive a Acura now and while it is a competent car, it just isn't exciting, nor would I consider it luxurious. The ML's scare me with their reliability records, although I am not sure if the kinks are worked out in the 2004 models. Any advice would be appreciated!
I think it really boils down to personal preference - I much prefer the more professional German feel to the ML. I also think the the ML has more utility in things like towing, off-road capability, and room inside.
But in most other areas, you have to give the nod to the MDX. And if you're into the nav systems, there is absolutely no comparison - the Acura navs are about the best and the MB navs about the worst. All the electronics and controls of the ML are relatively poor compared to the Japanese - for example, the CD changer is a big clunky thing mounted in the cargo area that is difficult to get to unloaded and impossible to get to if you have stuff piled up back there. The Japanese got rid of trunk-mounted changers five years ago.
I assume you are taking the heavy, heavy discounts of the ML's into account in your pricing. Many are going below invoice with dealer incentives.
Yes, the ML is a bit scary on reliability. I think they've generally turned the corner to be an OK car on reliability, but the MDX is one of the very best, so there is no match here. If dealing with problems now and then bothers you, I'd go with the Acura. MB does have free service and a good warranty, so at least for 50K miles, there is no monetary hit to any ML problems you might have.
So it boils down to whether you like the ML's "german nature" and utility enough to offset the better value and higher reliabliity of the Acura. If I had to buy one today, I'd probably get the Acura - actually I'd probably save some money and get the Pilot which is basically the same vehicle as the MDX but with less luxury and more utility for a lot less money.
- Mark
My friend, a 2003 MDX owner constantly complains how inaccurate his MDX Navigation is. My 2004 ML350 DVD Navigation has been ACCURATE, FAST and EASY to use. I just spent good 2 full days of driving in downtown LA, and I was NEVER lost. I was able to drive my destinations on time without getting lost even once. Note that I do not live in LA area. All of my passengers and myself were impressed about the DVD-Based ML's Navigation.
Maybe you are talking about the old CD-based navigation that requires 10 CD-ROM's to cover US/Canada.
MDX has a better gas mileage AND does NOT require 91 octane gas. BIG PLUS!
ML's gas mileage sucks. Then we are talking about a 2.5 ton truck.
I really like the rain-sensor windshield wiper. It's raining here in SF now.
So far I've experienced no problem with 2004 ML350. I will let you people know when things break.
- Mark
My navigation system is awesome on my ML. I have the 10 CD set up and it works perfectly. The setup is different than on my friends 2001 S500 sedan.
Mark156