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The MDX did seem to have a nice NAV unit and it's comfortable to ride in (the ML's DVD-based NAV is improved too over the CD-based unit in our old '00 ML430). The MDX's wheelbase is about half a foot shorter whereas the body is about half a foot longer and yet the cargo capacity is only about the same. However, the ML has a much higher payload capacity--probably by about 500 lbs or more--and that means it will carry more weight and probably will drive and handle much better when loaded down with the same weight, such as when full of adults.
The ML500 has an awesome set of brakes too: huge rotors front and back and the big 275s on all four corners provide excellent wet braking performance. If you haven't already, you'll probably enjoy reading the Wards Auto review about the ML500's engine (one of the ten best in the world) at: http://waw.wardsauto.com/ar/auto_wards_ten_best/
We traded our '00 ML430 with about 74K miles for an '03 ML500. The 430 was our first MB and the best SUV ever.
Now, the 500, is so much better, although it's hard to describe why when reason tells me that objectively it must be just incrementally so. There have been many improvements in the last 3 years that a previous ML owner will notice and appreciate.
My neighbor just bought a new Escalade--Cad's luxury/smaller SUV that is more the size of the ML (i.e., it's built on the smaller Yukon frame rather than the Suburban frame, but it's still bigger than a ML)--and its MSRP is much more than a ML500. If not fully recognized before, I think MLs would now have to recognized as value leaders.
When it came down to trading a few months ago, I ran the math. The ML would have fetched maybe $18K in trade vs. $30K for a new SUV. (I decided I'd go with a Pilot - good value and good reliability.) But when it came time to do the deal, it just didn't seem like a good value to shell out $13K (w/taxes and fees) additional for an SUV I really didn't like as much as the one I was driving.
I figure I can spend $1500/year for the next five years on repairs and be well, well ahead. (If I get a $5K transmission or engine bill however, it will not be so good.) I want to take a break from the $15K I've spent every 3-4 years on a new vehicle. I just feel like there is a lot more value than $18K in my current ML.
My dealer is getting about $250 for an A and $500 for a B. For that reason, I'll do most of the work myself and find a good independent garage to do the stuff I can't. That's the silver lining in the dark cloud of having a car out of warranty - you can actually develop a relationship with a good independent mechanic you know/trust rather than being another smuck in the waiting area of your local dealer's bloated service department.
Warranties are expensive and relatively inefficient safety nets that you pay big bucks for every time you buy a new car.
Just my $0.02.
- Mark
I had a stalling problem under high ambient temps and heavey loads and given the checkered history of fuel pump problems in the ML, I thought for sure I was looking at a fuel pump that was dying under load at high temps.
MB agreed it might be the fuel pump, but ran a bunch of diagnostics with the factory service rep and finally decided it was more likely a crank position sensor. Since this was cheaper to replace than a fuel pump, they said they wanted to replace it first and then do the fuel pump if the symptoms persist. In 5K miles, the truck has been symptom free, but then, the weather has been cool. I am crossing my fingers as I would think a marginal fuel pump would have failed all-together by now.
In this process, my advisor said that his dealership has replaced a lot of ML fuel pumps, but mostly due to faulty fuel level indications, rather than fuel pumping problems. The outright failures of the pump tend to be confined to the 98s and 99s. Apparantly, the fuel level indicator is integral with the fuel pump. Take this all wilth a grain of salt - I'm just relaying what he said.
I wouldn't panic about this. I'd see long-term how it behaves and whether the problems are consistent. The fuel pump is a fairly pricey repair out of warranty - I think $600 or so. I could certainly live with a faulty fuel indication in the first 4th of a tank to safe a $600 repair. I've noticed on occasion that my fuel level drops very quickly through the 1st quarter of a tank, but that usually it levels out and is pretty much accurate by 1/2 tank.
I've completely pleased with the tires I put on at 35K miles - Michelin LTX M/S in the stock sizes. These are the earlier generation from the current generation Michelin Cross Terrains, but I have a friend who puts 30K miles a year on an Explorer and he gets well over 75K miles out of these tires. In 20K, they have no detectable wear that I can tell and they work great in the snow.
Hope this helps,
- Mark
Recently while driving at night I noticed that the BAS/ESP light came on. This did not affect handling at all. When I arrived home I turned off the vehicle and re-started it and the light was no longer on. It has remained off for the last 200 miles. Anything to worry about?
Also, do people really think that it's OK to wait the 12,000 miles between oil changes. I know that's what the manual says, but really?
Oil change intervals are a religious debate and you can make a case for longer or shorter as its a cost/hassle vs. engine life tradeoff question and we don't have good data on exactly what the tradeoff is. If you're just planning on owning the vehicle through the warranty period, I'd just go with what MRS says. If you are planning on owning the vehicle long-term and want to do the very best for the engine, I'd do extra oil changes at the halfway point. Unfortunately, they're expensive with the MB: 8 or 9 qts of synthetic. If you're going with the MRS, I'd try and bring it in at the very beginning of when it calls for maintenance (about 1K before). I've even had the dealer do mine for free about 1.5K before it is actually due by telling them I was going on a trip and didn't want to have to find a MB dealer mid-trip.
- Mark
About oil, our first ML was a 430 which we traded at around 74K and the oil always looked like new at the 12K plus intervals (same color as if right out of the container). And, I never had to add oil between intervals.
The cars that I know about since about 1990 came with dino oil and specified intervals at 7.5K. Our neighbor recently purchased a new FX45 and I was surprised that it didn't come with synthetic and had the usual 7.5K interval.
I think it is the new synthetics and having an engine with such close tolerances that make longer intervals a reality, in conjuction with a FSS system. I also think that using premium fuel should help but you can get arguments on that.
Not all synthetics are approved for use for MB's FSS. Also, if you were to tow a lot, in high heat, and do a lot of stop and go driving, mountain driving, and use at high altitudes, the oil takes more of a beating that mainly freeway driving and the FSS system shortens the interval.
Thanks!
I have an 1999 ML320 with 57.5 K miles on it. I was considering getting a new car only because of MB's spotty reliablity record. But, I did the math and figured I could keep my truck for a couple of more years. It will still be a lot cheaper than making payments on a new one.
Besides, I like my truck. I extremely satisfied with it so far.
The list below is my share of problems with the ML but the dealer, New Country of Hartford, CT and my SA, have been extremely helpful during the warranty period and I am very pleased with their service.
Issues during the warranty period
Arm rest bubbling at 15k (dealer replaced arm rest)
Glue substance on the found on front windows (dealer removed window panels to fix problem)
I Replaced all 4 tires at 28K
Lost power steering lower hose clamp (dealer fixed the hose clamp and also replaced the rack and opinion assembly. The vehicle was towed from my home on 2 separate occasion before problemwas fixed properly).
Front brake pads gone by 32k (I did pretty well considering what I have read on this board about the brakes on ML. I replaced the pads myself with OEM pads)
Air Condition system not blowing cold air. (Dealer recharge A/C system)
With each visit to dealer to I complained about driver’s side mirror vibration at highway speed. (It was never fixed to my satisfaction I learned to live with it)
Right headlight bulb dead at 40k (dealer replaced bulb)
One of the license plate lights died (dealer replaced bulb)
Security Alarm triggers by itself (fixed at least 3 times including replacing all keys to the ML)
Dealer replaced frozen speed sensor during a FSS “B” service
Dash light for transmission gear selector dead (dealer replaced bulb)
Power steering recall (Dealer tighened the clamp)
Driver’s side power window failed at 42K
Arm rest is bubbling again at 49k (Dealer replaced arm rest It was not that bad but I took advantage of warranty and had it replaced again)
*** At 50k, I still have about 10% left on the rear brake pads I am on the original battery.
ML was kept overnight at dealer's garage on 5 different occasion. (I was alwys given new model Toyota Camry as a loaner except for my last service on 12/10/03, they gave me a stinky Thrifty Car Rental Dodge Neon
I got the Check Engine Light on my 02 ML500 last weekend. Took it to the shop - it seems the Charcoal Canister in the Fuel System got screwed up !! What the hell is a Charcoal Canister ? Does anyone else have the same problem ? Is it due to bad fuel ? I live in the SF Bayarea and have always filled Shell Premium fuel. Any thoughts ?
Regards,
Tiger2doll
There is a rumor that if you persist in topping off the fuel tank on the ML, that you can overflow the tank and fill the canister with raw gas which causes all sorts of problems. I have had issues where the fuel nozzle would repeatedly trip prematurely so I was forced to top off, but then had another instance where doing this caused fuel to overflow some vent. The ML filler seems sensitive to different nozzle cutoffs and geometries - some folks have had a lot of trouble just getting the nozzle to go in.
If you regularly top off, you might try not doing this.
- Mark
It seems the Purge Valve in the canister concked off. They had to replace it and it is now holding pressure. The SA mentioned that Shell Gasoline has a high %age of Sulphur - which is corrosive. He recommends to fill Chevron with Techron - supposedly better for the Fuel System & also cleans the Fuel Injectors.
I am appalled at the problems this Mercedes is having. I have owned a Mazda, Toyota and Lexus in the past and have never had such ridiculous issues happen. My brother has owned GM, Ford and a couple Japanese brands - and never had such issues. The ML is a patethic excuse of a vehicle built by MBZ. Either some morons designed the parts or the installers at the factory are dumb idiots - how can a 50k Mercedes have such issues. Total lack of Quality Control at the Alabama Plant. I guess they hired any Tom, Dick & Harry and made them assemble this POS.
I am going to give it a couple more months and definitely get rid of it before the warranty expires.
Anyways, since I have vented my anger at this car - Happy Holidays to all of you.
Regards,
Rahul
i hope this is not a big $$$$ problem need your advice
98 ml320 70k miles
when hard accelerating upshifting hesitates from 2-3rd
and it hangs at 3800rpm and struggles to go above 55-58mph
moderate acceleration, not apreciable delays or weird upshifts but worries me if i have to hard pass someone, regular driving nothing noticable
if i manually shift and hard accelerate similar problem
help but not with manual shifting and moderate hard acceleration, Hmmmmm
sidenote--i'll never buy another MB product again--period i would have done better with a ford or chevy, jd powers and consumer reports agrees. MB says they are really working at this--BIG DEAL they are losing their base, i suggest audi, toyota, honda etc, not MB
will drive this "very average" vehicle for another 3-4 months then a minivan i was hoping to drive this till next fall may not be able to, if this thing needs a new trans ill donate it to goodwill, i'm not putting another dime--if its simple adjustment ok but if big $$$forget it
Ref---#204(m class problems board) this 98 had more problems than other years, my friends ml55 were the first 2 years they were out, they won't buy another MB product either, so out of 3 vehicles the re-purchase rate is 0, thats' 100% won't buy again Hey what i said was my and my associates opinion just beware
It's amazing how many posts about "getting rid of this thing" jd powers says MB has had the fastest fall in quality then any recent brand, i believe it. expensive, weird electrical gremlins, i don't know many repeat MB buyers...do you? MB is losing it's base while lexus, infinity etc are building, hey with products like the m class which could be class leaders in all area, it's a shame
as a side note to the post of 7293, MB has become Chrysler in quality the merger hurt MB way more than improved chrysler. Wow probably be one of the worst mergers in history, When people get burned, it doen'st take them long to give up the star and get some reliability. It's across the line, the old style s class last of the quality cars, i know s class owners with same problem, and still no dvd based nav system, pathetic is right. never again, and i tell as many people who will listen
In any event, given your anti-MB rant, it sounds like you're planning on selling, so unless the problem is really serious, let it slide. If it were my vehicle with 70K, I'd probably get a fluid change and have the shop check diagnostic codes. It might be something simple or it might not. Without further info, can't say.
- Mark
Mass air flow sensor needs replaced as does the airfilter
298+30 filter+120 labor
i can get this on line for 211 is it hard to replace, is it something to attempt replacing??
Returned from a trip to Lake Tahoe in my 02 ML500 with 17k miles. The trip was fine and the car handles very well in snow. While driving through snow on Hwy 50 when I applied the brakes - they kicked back a couple times - like a pulsating motion. It was as if the car did not want to get the brakes applied. Is this normal ? It was a strange experience - you apply the brakes and they kick back - they don't wanna get applied. When we were out of snow the braking resumed to normal - no kick back or pulsating action. Do I need to worry ?
Thanks,
Rahul
If you are in a situation where you're braking and this occurs, it is vitally important that you continue to brake and steer the car - don't back out of the brakes just because this is happening. The ABS system is warning you that you're overbraking for the traction available, but you want to continue braking as necessary, let the ABS continue to do its job, and steer the vehicle around any obstacles
If this is news to you, I'd strongly suggest you look at the owner's manual and read up a little on how these safety systems function. Skid control is another such system that you need to be aware of what is going on. If you're aware, they can save your life, but you need to know what your car is telling you.
- Mark
Thanks
Rick
Beyond this, most dealers get about $300 for an A service and $600 for a B, occasionally higher if they do things like brake or AF fluid changing. These alternative about anually at 12k miles/year annual driving rate. Good independent garages run a little less. In addition, you're almost certain to get stung a time or two a year for a major repair.
- Mark
It's been a very long time since I posted here (since back in the "Drew" days!).
My 2000 ML320 has the drivers-side brake light out. I want to change it myself, but don't have a service manual. I can easily get the two large screws out from the jam area of the rear hatch, but there seems to be a third attachment toward the front that I can't get to, and don't want to force it.
Anybody have some ideas?
Thanks
- Mark
I suspect more force will be required, but I don't want to break somthing, either.
Thanks
- Mark
Anyone report in on the DVD based Nav unit yet? I find the MB Nav system great here in the northeast. But places like Delaware and some southern states don't seem to have hardly any road coverage dispite there being a CD for a given area. I was wondering if the DVD improved the road coverage. MB website makes it sound like we could have it installed in our older ML's.
NoFear: yes, the lighting unit has a snap-in feature, and just a bit more muscle will pop it out.
Got all my bulbs replaced successfully. By the way, at the same time I lost the drivers side low beam headlight, drivers and center brake lights! What are the chances of that?
Thanks for the help and advice.
has anyone replaced a air flow meter thing mine needs replaced. is it something i could do?? MB wants $320 to do it (ouch) that includes a $30 airfilter which i just bought at advance auto for $16
How difficult is to install the unit? Has anyone done it?
Does the installation has to be performed by Mercedes dealer in order to have the phone integrated with the radio and the sound system or anything else I am not aware of?
How do I activate the phone since I already have a local service provider? Is this done by a dealer and do I have to pay an additional fee for the service?
I also understand that I need an additional hand held unit needed to program the In-dash unit in my car. What else I need to purchase in order to have this unit fully operational?
I appreciate your assistance,
Sincerely,
Richard S. Mleczko
Ah!! Good old Drew. What ever happened to him. If I remember he had a spat with Edmunds. Used to be host on this board.
ML's are so predictable. The problems are standard in all their cars. Those of you who have replaced the driver side power window switch raise their hands.
My brake light and driver side low beam lamp has died too. What a coincidence??? I just got a rear brake lamp from pep boys and am looking for a more powerfull low beam bulb. I think the original one is too bad and drive with my fogs on most of the time. Since the fogs are kind of focussed on to the road it never troubles drivers in the opposite lant.
Tony
Cheers
Pat ( a disillusioned MB owner)
You have a 99 ML. I wouldn't put $ into 99 ML. Use that $ to buy a newer model.
Since the warranty ran out in May, I've spent nearly $1500 maintaining this POS. My lease runs out at the end of Apr. Fortunately, I have a Subaru to drive. I think I'm gonna park this thing, until I turn it it, and get another Subaru!!
Cheers
Pat ( a disillusioned MB owner)
so where is the "engineering" in this, i've had enough problems with mine that what i plan to do is drive till it drops and donate it then get a toyota, I WILL NEVER BUY/LEASE ANOTHER MB PRODUCT there are just too many better more reliable choice. jd powers says that mb has had the fastest drop in quality recorded geeeeeeeee
From ower of 04 Chrysler ML350
Got the vehicle back last week from the shop - the car has 17k miles on it in 20 mths. Issues fixed :
1) Engine Coolant Leaking - 3rd Attempt to fix. Seems the Coolant Cap was not holding pressure. They had put a new cap in on the last try as well. Hopefully, its fixed and will not reoccur.
2) The Left Headlight Low Beam Bulb wnet out - replaced the bulb. My 99 RX300 hasn't had a bulb replaced in the last 5 years !!
3) Rear Cupholder fell off - replaced with a new one. Hopefully will not break soon.
4) Severe Rubber rubbing noise coming from Rt side of Dashboard - took off the whole dash and re-insulated the area with felt. Noise is gone for now - keeping fingers crossed.
5) Front Rt door lock making loud squeaking noise on unlocking - the lock assembly and actuator had to be replaced.
This is the 6th time I had to take the car for some repair in 20 mths. Will definitely sell it before the warranty runs out. This car is the most expensive mistake I have made so far - what a piece of crap for $55k. The CEO of MBZ - some Jurgen S guy, was named the WORST CEO in 2003 by Business Week. No wonder the quality sucks !!!
Regards,
Rahul
Please don't make sarcastic comments. And yes, Jurgen S should get fired - not because of a burned out bulb but because of the total lack of Quality Control while building this vehicle. He should get fired for : Failed Fuel Pump, Failed Aspirator Motor, Leaking Coolant, Failed Purge Valve, Bad Door locks, squeaky dashboard, etc etc. The list of problems just goes on and on. I fail to understand why is MBZ hell bent on screwing up the reputation built over 100 years. By cutting corners and using low quality parts - they are going to ruin their brand - which is their cash cow ! If the Japanese Auto makers can keep improving on quality - why the hell can't Mercedes ?? Anyway, hope you are happy with your vehicle. Have a nice day !!
Regards,
Rahul
what is left for us, overpriced low quality electrical nightmares. they dropped the ball and we are moving on