Sorry, perforated leather--if available! My NB GLS has the nicest perforated leather seats. I don't know anything about Subaru's stock leather, however.
I definitely prefer cloth, but can't complain too much about the leather in our Bean and XS. Thank god they are heated, however. Leather is brutal in cold weather. Given the choice, I would have gotten cloth on those two cars.
I definitely like the cloth seats in my 03 WRX the best. They are some of the best seats of any car I've owned.
After spending time in the Bean and XS, the WRX cloth seats feel soft, grippy, and are definitely a more comfortable "surface" than the leather.
I am surprised so many prefer Cloth! Leather is the only way to go for me.
Now, if you never tried leather, then I understand. For years I bought into the leather is so cold/hot, expensive, etc. I bought a 95 Mercury Sable and took the leather only because I got such a great deal (at least at the time). Anyway, after a short while I determined I would never go back to Cloth. Reminds of the first time I got remote entry door locks and speed control. Same feeling for me. Once you have them, you don't want anything else. My opinion.
I'll probably have to give it a try next time because I'm really liking that new moonroof in the '05 Legacy / Outback. Probably can't get it without leather.
Had leather on one car I owned, and on the Mercedes E-class from my uncle's estate (drove it for 2 months). Doubt I would do it again. Burned you in summer, cold and stiff in winter. My butt slid all over the place. Cloth feels nice and holds you tight.
Love the leather, especially in an upper-end car that has that wonderful smell. Some leathers wear better than others, and aren't as slick, those are the best. Can never go back.
I have some of the finest leather in any vehicle I've seen with my '95 M3, extremely thick and durable, with heated seat cushion and lower back. The leather used in any Subaru does not remotely compare --neither does the leather in the current 3 series, actually.
Nevertheless I loathe it. The areas where the seat heaters are do indeed warm quickly in the winter, but the rest of the seat remains quite uncomfortably cold for some time. And in this case with large, aggressive side bolsters that is a lot of surface.
Even with those bolsters though, you slide around much more than a cloth seat of course. It's also hot in the summer but I'm sure being black has a lot to do with that.
Wear and durability are the only things leather has going for it. It's heavier, colder, less grippy, and obviously more expensive. Oh and don't get me started on cheap leather like I have in my '93 Taurus SHO. hehe
had leather in the late '98 OB Limited. Liked the leather aroma but hated it in hot sunny and cold days. Didn't like having my right cheek seating on the center console on hard lefts either. Used to put an anti-skid pad between me and the seats.
Mark: it is easier to wipe off spill with leather, but here's the thing - my kids are in child seats or booster seats anyway. What gets dirty? The child seats! And the carpeted mats on the floor.
So it wouldn't really help me.
The Miata's leather seats are tan, not black, but they still get really hot, especially if I leave the top down and the sun blares right on it.
Are you telling me you have yet to find an errant raisin, goldfish, or fruit bar squashed between the car seat and the upholstery??
But I'm sure you've found at least one sippy cup containing milk under the seat that required carbon dating to identify it's age. Toss 'em right in the trash!!
anyone who lives in real hot climates who likes leather obviously never wear anything except long trousers! and thick ones at that! where I live now, midwest , I could go either way but the backs of my thighs are still burned into both my memory and psyche from growing up in hawaii with leather seats in my parents cars!! as for cleaning up fabric, hasn't anyone heard of scotchguard???
3M proactively pulled the original product off the consumer market about 3 years ago. AFAIK no reason was given other than they had concerns regarding future health issues.
But it looks like it is still on their website or maybe it is a new type of Scotchguard.
I asked because last summer I pulled the car seats from the Accord while it was in the body shop and found a bunch of raisins squished between the Lionheart mat and the leather. They cleaned up but they way they seemed to have melted and smeared would've stained cloth.
Last night I found a cheese stick remnant. Luckily it's been cold so it hadn't turned into a science project yet.
I live in Texas and in my opinion leather is actually less hot than cloth.
Basically 90% of the time you're in your car the A/C is on. The leather seats cool down much faster.
To me, the cloth is like wearing a blanket all the time. I can see the advantages in the winter because the leather can be stiff, but donw here it is less a problem.
The other thing about cloth is it soaks up every odor. If you happen to get in your car after going to bar or a concert or even just watching kids soccer and you are sweaty - that all get soaked up nicely by cloth.
Nah, cloth breathes, leather doesn't. At least if it's not perforated it doesn't.
On a hot day in my Miata, I'll have the top down, but I'll still use A/C to keep reasonably cool. Still, if I'm sweaty the seat just gets sticky, it's pretty nasty. The entire back of my shirt will be wet.
Had leather and I love that aroma when you get in the car, but Here in Ottawa it is miserably cold in winter and hot as hell in summer, and while is was nice to smell and to look at,I won't have it again.
Don't know about the US Baja, but the Canadian Baja has nice perforated leather.
New poster here. Just read all the great reports from Bob and Juice - thanks!
I've been trying to get more info on the 05 OB. Was thinking about buying the 04 OB H6 3.0 auto and wanted to see what I would be missing if I did.
It looks like the 2004 OB can be had well below invoice with the rebates being offered now, so that is one factor in favor of getting one now. Decisions, decisions....
From this discussion, it shows that some people like cloth and some like leather. I just feel that we should have a choice and not be forced into buying leather just to get a moonroof or VDC.
* serious about new design * Forester LL Bean CONFIRMED * even he is concerned about how quickly we get new model info over the internet * new Outback is hot * R2 demand exceeds supply * mid-March production, mid-June intro for 2005s * turbo Outback confirmed
juice, if you read that release closely the reference to the Bean Forester is in the section "Sales in the Domestic Market," not "Sales in the Overseas Market." I interpret that as JDM for the Bean Forester, not the US and the rest of the world. I may be proven wrong, of course.
Well as I'm sure you’ll recall, I recently sprung for after-market leather in my XT so I guess you know where I stand :-) Odd thing is I swore I'd never have leather for all the reasons listed (hot in summer and cold in winter etc.). What can I say? The dealer had a Baja on the showroom floor with two-tone perforated after-market leather and I just fell in love. The look, feel and smell of leather was just too seductive. Yes the leather is a little chilly on a winter morning but the seat warmers quickly remedy that and hopefully the lighter colored perforated inserts will make a significant difference in the summer. But am I just rationalizing? Maybe I really have a tiny bit of Beemer owner in me. Ahhh!!!
-Frank P.
P.S. I feel like I should go to confession and I'm not even Catholic!
There's already been an LL Bean Forester in the Japanese market. It's been on sale for at least a year. Also, there have been now a couple of other reported LL Bean Forester posts regarding a US-spec version. So this now makes it three reports. I'd be surprised if this latest "Bean" report is about European or Australian versions.
I was just checking the SOJ site and it looks like the Forester LL Bean is no longer being offered. It sounds like they will be re-launching that model shortly. It *did* exist, as Ken and others have seen it before on the SOJ site too.
Comments
Zman
Mark
I definitely like the cloth seats in my 03 WRX the best. They are some of the best seats of any car I've owned.
After spending time in the Bean and XS, the WRX cloth seats feel soft, grippy, and are definitely a more comfortable "surface" than the leather.
Craig
Ken
Now, if you never tried leather, then I understand. For years I bought into the leather is so cold/hot, expensive, etc. I bought a 95 Mercury Sable and took the leather only because I got such a great deal (at least at the time). Anyway, after a short while I determined I would never go back to Cloth. Reminds of the first time I got remote entry door locks and speed control. Same feeling for me. Once you have them, you don't want anything else. My opinion.
CUSAFR
DaveM
Steve
Bob
Nevertheless I loathe it. The areas where the seat heaters are do indeed warm quickly in the winter, but the rest of the seat remains quite uncomfortably cold for some time. And in this case with large, aggressive side bolsters that is a lot of surface.
Even with those bolsters though, you slide around much more than a cloth seat of course. It's also hot in the summer but I'm sure being black has a lot to do with that.
Wear and durability are the only things leather has going for it. It's heavier, colder, less grippy, and obviously more expensive. Oh and don't get me started on cheap leather like I have in my '93 Taurus SHO. hehe
~c
-Dave
So it wouldn't really help me.
The Miata's leather seats are tan, not black, but they still get really hot, especially if I leave the top down and the sun blares right on it.
-juice
or simply Oxyclean does a great job.
Cloth is the way to go ! Also, conceptually, i don't like killing animals & sitting on them & enjoy.
I hope subaru will give me dual moonroof with cloth.....
But I'm sure you've found at least one sippy cup containing milk under the seat that required carbon dating to identify it's age. Toss 'em right in the trash!!
IMHO, leather is the only way to go.
where I live now, midwest , I could go either way but the backs of my thighs are still burned into both my memory and psyche from growing up in hawaii with leather seats in my parents cars!!
as for cleaning up fabric, hasn't anyone heard of scotchguard???
Greg
They do change colors, depending upon the age. ;-)
-juice
But it looks like it is still on their website or maybe it is a new type of Scotchguard.
-Dave
Last night I found a cheese stick remnant. Luckily it's been cold so it hadn't turned into a science project yet.
The only stain I had was when Hadji got sick one time, but it cleaned up well and you can't tell where it happened.
Thankfully, the dog got used to car travel. We do 5-6 road trips per year!
-juice
Basically 90% of the time you're in your car the A/C is on. The leather seats cool down much faster.
To me, the cloth is like wearing a blanket all the time. I can see the advantages in the winter because the leather can be stiff, but donw here it is less a problem.
The other thing about cloth is it soaks up every odor. If you happen to get in your car after going to bar or a concert or even just watching kids soccer and you are sweaty - that all get soaked up nicely by cloth.
DaveM
Nah, cloth breathes, leather doesn't. At least if it's not perforated it doesn't.
On a hot day in my Miata, I'll have the top down, but I'll still use A/C to keep reasonably cool. Still, if I'm sweaty the seat just gets sticky, it's pretty nasty. The entire back of my shirt will be wet.
-juice
Don't know about the US Baja, but the Canadian Baja has nice perforated leather.
Cheers Pat.
Forester STi...dreamy!
-juice
Just read all the great reports from Bob and Juice - thanks!
I've been trying to get more info on the 05 OB. Was thinking about buying the 04 OB H6 3.0 auto and wanted to see what I would be missing if I did.
It looks like the 2004 OB can be had well below invoice with the rebates being offered now, so that is one factor in favor of getting one now. Decisions, decisions....
Bob
The only catch is selection will decrease, but if you can be flexible about the color, I'd risk it and wait. YMMV.
-juice
Doesn't the new GT have a perforated leather? I hope so as I want that big moonroof in the wagon and I'm sure it will only come with leather.
swampy - your last 2 posts had me ROTFLMAO!
-Ian
* Forester LL Bean CONFIRMED
* even he is concerned about how quickly we get new model info over the internet
* new Outback is hot
* R2 demand exceeds supply
* mid-March production, mid-June intro for 2005s
* turbo Outback confirmed
Darn, I should have made a bet!
-juice
-Brian
now too many choices.....no idea what to buy....maybe i am getting greedy:
1. leg GT - no ground clearance, no double moonroof.
2. leg GT wagon - no ground clearnance, but doesn't look as good. again, the handling is not as good as sedan
3. forester llbean - excellent, back leg roo problem, ground clearance....but i always prefer legacy-based.....not impreza-based
4.OB T - great, ground clearance, won;t have VDC
will not be as quiet as H6
5. OB H6 - ground clearance, vdc - great. But won't be as peppy
so, what will i buy....since my 2nd car will mostprobably 7-seater...
where will i get 50k.....to buy 2 cars...i dunno.
Thanks Subaru....either you give no choice or full of choices. !!!!!!!!!!!!
Ed
-Frank P.
P.S. I feel like I should go to confession and I'm not even Catholic!
Bob
Bob