It is a method of putting paint in a small nick with a small enough object to prevent "glopping" which is a word I just invented to describe the placing of too much paint on a chip so that it would become impossible to really touch up the car without easily being able to see the patch job. Try a web site carcareonline.com which has lots of tips on how to do it right. I downloaded the instructions some time ago and found it to be really easy to follow and the chip has dissapeared. If that is not the address, then just search for car care on line and I am sure you will find it. It goes into excruciating detail and will answer questions you don't even know enough to ask. Very informative.
Instead of a toothpick, I cut a single bristle from a cheap paintbrush. I tipped some paint into the scratch--just one quick, careful stroke--and while it looks substantially better, like I said before, it'll never be the same.
I think I'll do another coat of Z5 and Z2 this weekend. I need that force field around my car!
An extension of the toothpick technique is to apply several thin layers over time until it is higher than the main part of the paint, and then use a little "Paint Leveler" to smooth it out. It will not be perfect, but is quite good.
The paint leveler is available in a little bottle at the parts store by the touch-up paints. You put a bit on a smooth cloth, wrap it around a stick or card so it is totally flat, and gently rub down the fresh paint until it is level. It works best after the paint is dried for about an hour.
I'm about to Z for the first time... my wife's got both orange Dawn and dark purple Dawn (PowerPlus) in the cabinet. Do I absolutely have to have blue Dawn or will these work?
I understand that Sal says to use the blue Dawn rather than the other colors, but I'm not sure why. Something about the dye or scent in there that is not in the basic blue stuff.
It seems to me, however, that you have a decent car that deserves Zaino, and you spent about $75 or more for bottles of various Zaino stuff, and I bet you went out and bought real cotton towels that weren't cheap (I sure did), so would it really kill you to get to the 7-11 and spend another $1.25 for a bottle of blue Dawn?
I bet the lady next door has some she will lend you.
Like a true Zaino fanatic, I went and bought some white 100% cotton towels from fieldcrestcannonoutlet.com. I washed them with some liquid Tide in hot water and then dried them as I would normally dry towels in the dryer, but without a static sheet. Result was tons of lint, enough that I am afraid to use them on my car. Am I doing something wrong? Should I line dry the towels or something, or should I wash them again? Any help would be appreciated.
The lint should have been in the dryer filter, and yes, the first few times you wash new real cotton towels, you will get lots of lint. That's part of the real cotton experience.
If you are getting lint that sticks with the towels after drying, just shake out the dry towel and you should not have any problem. Even if there is a little lint in the towel, it won't scratch the paint like poly towels.
If your dryer is not catching the lint in the filter and your towels are really FULL of lint, my suggestion would be to let them dry, shake them out real good, and wash them again. Repeat as necessary.
When I redid my bathroom, I had to get new towels and I got good all cotton towels (although not white). My lady friend told me NEVER dry towels with those fabric softener sheets (e.g.: Bounce); it hampers the absorbency. You will see this very clearly on kitchen towels. If you have used Bounce when drying them, they just don't soak up the water like they used to (despite the fact that they SEEM SOFT). The same goes for the towels you use on yourself in the bathroom and the towels you now use on your car. If it's good enough for my car, it's good enough for my butt. (Or should that be the other way around??)
They shed so much lint the first time i washed them...that I had to clean the lint screen half way thru the drying cycle or it would never have dried! but it gets less with every wash.
Hey, thanks for nothing Squid. Yea, I can afford to buy anything I want, but you know, the wife has a closet full of Dawn already, it was early in the morning, and I wanted to get started working on the vehicles.
Because it contains anti-bacterial oxidizing agents. You are probably ok as someone else who used it claimed he had no adverse affects from using it. And someone else stated that if it was used on a clearcoat you are probably allright.
...but you know what's strange is that I decided to do a little research. There are basically two versions of every Dawn variant, the regular version and the anti-bacterial version. The PowerPlus (purple) stuff is basically the best Dawn they make in terms of grease cutting.
Well I did my claying today and it indeed did remove a lot of "stuff". But I also decided to use a cleaner wax (Meguiars) to buff out some light scratches before my final Dawn wash after the claying.
While the claying did get the paint smooth, the areas where I did the spot waxing are simply better and silky smooth. The Wax also seems to get a little more "hidden" dirt, though that could just be some of my black Lexus paint coming off (no clearcoat?) on the cloth. And no, my paint is not heavily oxidized, the car is only 4 months old.
I remember reading here that someone else decided to wax-clean first and then remove it with Dawn to get a silky surface prep for the Z.
Easy now. Squidd99 makes a good point, and he wasn't being critical of you. You should be able to take a little ribbing. This is a friendly group.
I can appreciate you were anxious to do the Z. So was I. I had to let some threatening weather days go by, and it didn't rain, and I could have Z'ed. Gosh, I hated to wait. But wait I did, until the weather was sure and the planets were in alignment.
I don't know, it doesn't seem like all that big a deal to use purple Dawn before a Z treatment (maybe your car will glow under black light now?), but if Sal Zaino says use the blue Dawn, there must a good reason. Why do otherwise?
..as much as the next guy, in fact, I give better .
In terms of what Sal says, I'm not impressed. Yes, yes, I know he is the owner, etc., but the web site has not been updated in ages, the grammar on the instructions is terrible, and maybe only blue Dawn was available when they did the instructions/FAQ. I've emailed Sal questions and his answers aren't exactly precise. I've still never gotten a "real" explanation of the difference between Z3 and Z2 from Zaino.
This stuff isn't "black magic" as some folks seem to think. Blue Dawn is recommended because it's a high-alkaline detergent that'll breakdown most grease and waxes, and was probably the detergent that Sal happen to try first. Doesn't mean that nothing else will work. Maybe I'm a little jaded because I am an engineer by training and do understand a little about chemical engineering. I just wish there more scientific answers readily available.
What in the world do you expect from mail order merchandise.
"This stuff isn't "black magic" as some folks seem to think. " This is why this product is so popular, people do think this stuff is black magic. Sal has people doing prep work that they never thought of doing with any other wax. This prep work is what gets a great shine. Just like painting a car, 90% prep work and 10% paint application, the prep work makes the paint job.
Just get some 3M P/N 051131 and enjoy a great shine, and of course it only gets better with multiple coats. 3M has aanother show car polish that is amazing but it does not have a UV blocker. I guess you could put one on top of the other........HMMMMM.....that sounds familiar! They also have a polish for swirls....HMMMM....familiar again.
Make life easy and get you some 3M, no Z this Z that, is it too humid, which dawn do I use. I do believe in clay bar but use it with soapy water, not the spray wax that usually comes with it. Then wax your car. 3M makes the best window tint so I would think they know a little about optical properties (i.e. shine).
I don't intend to enter the above debates because I am a novice. All I do know is this: I followed the instructions sent by Zaino to a T. I washed with Dawn (blue), clayed, washed, Z-1, now have four coats of Z-2, Z-6, leather done with Zaino, and the gloss shine is unbelievable, the leather is supple and the scent wonderful. I stopped in at the dealership today, and the first thing the general manager said of my red Solara was "now I understand why you would not let us clean it." He said he had NEVER seen a car with such a deep gloss and used the magical word "wet". He intends to get a Toyota rep there next week to take pictures because he is sure Toyota will want to use them. Incidentally, my brother won first prize overall with his PT (ugh) in a car show today. He has a custom paint job Z-d to the hilt. I guess we are believers.
3M polishes are abrasive and remove swirls permanently. 3M does not have any non-abrasive polymer products...actually they don't have any polymer products. 3M products are high quality but their products cannot be compared to Zaino.
3M swirl remover contains abrasives and permanently removes swirls and offers no protection...must have a coat of wax applied on top. All of their polishes, as well as IHG, offer no protection. Z5 hides or covers swirls and may take 2-5 applications(allowing adequate curing time)and Z5 can be used as a last step because it provides the same degree of protection as Z2 or Z3.
3M makes good quality waxes. Zaino makes a polymer coating. In my opinion there are no wax products that are as durable as polymer products. With Zaino you get mirror-like shine, durability and it is extremely easy to apply and remove.
Is there some hype involved with Zaino? Yes...I hear people state that nothing sticks to Zaino...this is bull. As a single example...some bird droppings, if left on Zaino...or any wax or polish..for a long enough time can eat through the protection and into the paint finish.
BTW, what is 3M P/N 051131? It is not on their website. "051131"-xxxxxx is the beginning p/n of many of their marine products.
Tonychris: Since you are a chemical engineer maybe you can shed some light about dimethl amine oxide. This is supposed to be the ingredient that can be too harsh on the paint according to another chemical engineeer.
I never said I was a chemical engineer (please read my post calmly and carefully), I did say I understand a little about chemical reactions.
I won't claim to have an exact answer with regards to your question. All I do know is that (alkyl) dimethyl amine oxide is a common ingredient used in anti-bacterial formulations, it's actually safe enough in the right combinations to use in everything from toothpaste to hand soap.
This is a guess as to why that person said this chemical is bad for paint. Alkyl dimethyl amine oxide is a 2nd generation anti-bacterial agent, which is designed to bind chemically to the bacterial cell walls and/or surrounding tissues (e.g. your hands and gums), thus maintaining its biological activity for many hours. I'm guessing that somehow this stuff also bonds to the paint and will interact with any organic compounds?
I am moving to Southern California from Chicago. How should I protect my car from the sun? It is midnight blue, so I am concerned that it will fade if I do not protect it well.
I am willing to use Zaino products exclusively. I am also willing to use non-Zaino products, or a combination of Zaino and non-Zaino products. I don't care about brands; I am only interested in good performance.
Two addenda: My car is brand new. It has no scratch or swirl marks whatsoever (I had nothing to do with this, I simply got lucky- that's how it looked when I picked it up at the dealership).
Also, I am more interested in protection than in shine. If I can get shine without compromising protection, great, but protection is what really matters to me.
I was wondering if some of you have every done just spots on your car with Z5 for swirls..etc,
Since I only see spots of swirls, not entire car, instead of using Z5 for the entire car, I can save time, and Z5 by just doing few spots! is there argument that goes against this?
You are not looking at the correct product line. You are talking about the POLISHING compounds that body shops use to buff out new paint jobs or recondition old paint. These polishes have to be abrasive to peform their INTENDED jobs.
You are correct in that the product that I am talking about is not on their website. I found it sometime ago on the net but I do not remember the url. Typical 3M. People say there tint is impossible to find in some parts of the country. I believe it is because they rather manufacture products and sell them to a reseller that will put their name on them.
The wax I am talking about is not in their marine product line, it is in the Perfect-It product line (no not Perfect-It II, or III) and I recall that it is a polymer based product.
OK, here is the url for the polymer (more completely, Acrylic Silicone Fluoropolymer - A.S.F.) based 3M wax. I only gave the prefix of the p/n in my previous post. So the complete p/n must be 051131-39526. Where 051131 must indicate the product line (Perfect-It) and 39526 indicates the actual product. I understand your confusion with all the products that 3M has to offer! I almost started to doubt it myself.......but only for a second, LOL. The page shows a paste, but my local Pep Boys sells it in a Liquid.
Tonychris: my mistake, sorry...I see now...you said you are an engineer with some knowledge of chemical engineering.
lonestarsled: there are two Perfect It waxes: paste and liquid: they do contain some polymers...but very little...They are composed mostly of petroleum cleaners and carnauba. You can look at the MSDS sheets on the 3M website. They do not have any products that are marketed as a polymer product. I am quite familiar with this product, Zaino will easily outlast it. And with so much petroleum cleaners it can't be layered.
It was you who said "They also have a polish for swirls....HMMMM....familiar again." The 3M polish for swirls contains abrasives...Zaino does not. The only 3M product besides abrasive polishes that 3M has that will minimize swirls is 3M IHG which has no protective properties." From 3M: "Thank you for your recent inquiry regarding 3M Automotive Aftermarket Products. We appreciate your interest.
3M Imperial Hand Glaze #39007 is a glaze, a final step. It produces a deep shine by filling in and smoothing over imperfections. Since it contains no mineral, the scratches and swirl marks aren't removed, but rather, filled in. It also contains no silicone or wax, which means it offers no substantial protection from UV light and no durability. It is a "cosmetic" product and can be almost completely removed after one car washing."
I have used 3M products in the past...I still use Perfect It 39009 Swirl remover to permanently remove bad scratches and swirls. As I said, they make good quality products.
Please read my response #1980, you must of caught the blank response. I hit the enter key after typing the title! Also, check out this link, it is from 1997:
Well, I will say that i don't believe that NOTHING will stick to a Zaino'd finish. Of course bird droppings and mud will stick!
And yeah, there are water/dirt spots from driving through hard rain.
But the "light" stuff like dust & pollen....well, since I Zaino'd my car it has remained much cleaner overall. i can only speak from my experience. Light stuff doesnt stick AS MUCH. My last car used to get more "dusty" between washes.
"We have also incorporated a pinã colada fragrance in the product to enhance the overall application process -- it's 3M's longest lasting, most durable product, and it smells great too!"
There are no silicones in Zaino products. Zaino does not use ASF technology. The technology Zaino is using was developed long before the 3M ASF technology. It was something like 1989. Z2 contains no silicones, nor carnauba wax. If it were the same product I would know it because I have used both. If Sal had made his Z7 smell like cherry and gave it a red color would people be saying it is the same as the many other cherry smelling car washes on the market? You know Liquid Lustre Wax looks very similar in color to Zaino Z2 polish. Maybe that is the same product too. And there are a slew of QD products that have the same color as Zaino too. Maybe they are all the same? Use whatever products you are happy with. As I have said repeatedly...3M makes good quality products.
Me, I am sticking with Zaino because I love the results. The only problem I find with Zaino is that I like to apply it often because it is so easy and am always amazed at the mirror-like shine. I spend too much time (by choice) detailing my car now. I'll wash it...It'll look great...I'll Z6 it...Loooks even better...Next thing I know I find myself applying another Z2 coat because it is so easy...not because it is needed.
051131 has nothing to do with Perfect It. It is a marine product number.
...as someone else said to me a few messages ago, just some good natured ribbing.
Since I already bought a slew of Z products, I'm going to give them a shot. I finally got my first coat of Z1/Z3 on today and while the results were okay, in terms of gloss it's nothing I couldn't get with a good wax. Will it get better with additional coats? I don't know until I get a chance to try it.
I do however attribute the finish so far to the meticulous prep work I did. Washed evey nook and cranny. Clayed and then clayed again areas I wasn't happy with. After the final wash and wipe down, the paint was smooth to begin with.
And for some reason the Z3 removal was a tedious job, it was as much work as any wax. The problem is that I have a black car and I can see anything and everything that is on the paint. And yes, it's about 80 degrees today and very dry. Waited almost 2 hours to dry. It was a lot of work to get the "film" off the paint. Hopefully additional applications will be easier.
Like I said, so far the stuff looks fine, I'm hoping the protection is as good as folks say it is. I just wish there was less "magic" and more science to explain this stuff.
Email or call Sal for more information. Although he is busy as hell he will be glad to talk to you. I am suprised to hear that it was difficult to remove. Many people do find that the initial Z1/Z_ coat takes the longest to dry.
joe bob - you must have been sniffing your Zaino too long!!!!!!!!!!! The 051131-XXXXX is the Perfect-It product line, just read the website!!!!! It is not part of 3M's Marine product line. If it where it would have the word "Marine" on it instead of "Show Car Wax" The complete p/n of the 3M wax that I am talking about is 051131-39526
YeeeeHaaaaawwww - I think we are both on the pipe!!!! All that proves to me is that the 051131 pre-fix probably means that it is a product of the Automotive - Marine division of 3M. It is on my wax bottle and every bottle of wax, glaze and rubbing compound that is in Pep Boys!
If I had one of them fancy digit-all cameras I would take a pic of the p/n for you.
But you are getting away from the initial point that I was expressing to tonychris, which was to check out the 3M wax. No z this, z that, let dry 24 hours, is it too humid. Just wax and enjoy the shine!
Maybe Pep Boys has an old lot of 3M products or they changed the numbers recently. A search on 3M website with the PN you provided comes up blank. You are right!!!...my bottle of 39009 which I purchased 3 months ago has the same prefix. I should have checked that to begin with. I do remember when I purchased it the container was covered in dust. What is going on with 3M's website? If you put the full UPC number in the MSDS search section it will come up blank. If 3M waxes and polishes work better for you by all means use them. The Zaino products work well for me. They are not confusing and I have never waited more than an hour for a coat to dry. Applying thin coats is the key.
YES - The first application is about like a good wax job - THEN - it just keeps getting better and better and better. Your black car will look amazing after layers 2 and 3! You may get to be like fastdriver with his 7 layers!
You MAY have used too much, or perhaps it was not quite dry yet - this will cause the smearing that you see. Either way, a quick wipeown with Z6 will clean it up while it is enhancing the shine. If it is really dry, it just dusts off effortlessly. I know - I get impatient too!
Man, that's some "short" ribbing. Like a dozen posts. Hey, all I know is that Zaino is a great line of products. There are very few companies with products that are actually better than the specs. And even though Zaino Bros is a small mail order type of company, they have given me absolutely great service. Sure, someday there will be other firms that will create even better products. That's the nature of our economy. But till then, I'll be very happy to stick with this line of products. I respect all the chemical knowledge exhibited here, and have learned a lot. But that's all secondary as simple good protection for my daily commuter is primary for me.
And... checon: I really think that Z1/Z2 will give you very good UV and environmental protection. Give it a try.
Well, I finally used the "Z" this weekend, and I am a little upset! I am having a heck of a time getting all of this stuff to dry and come off. I have a honda accord, I used about 3/4" of the bottle out of z-1, and even less out of z-5. I let it dry from about 4pm saturday afternoon until about 1pm sunday afternoon. It was in the 70's and 80's with about 50% RH. Whenever I tried to remove it, all I could do was get it to smear around. I finally got the whole car wet again and re-dried it. That got more of it off but I can still see it smeared around. What is the deal? Am I going to hurt anything by leaving this residue on there until I wash it again in a few days? Any Ideas as to why this happened? I guess I probably used a little too much, but it doesn't seem to be to much that I needed to let it dry for 24 hours. Even that wasn't long enough! Any input would be appreciated. Thanks!
Right on the Z3/2 bottles it says "apply to all plastic, chrome, metal, etc. surfaces on the vehicle". Did I read this wrong?
Well, folks claim Z is not a wax but yet I have that nasty wax-type residue on some of my black texturized plastic trim now that doesn't rub off. Looks horrible. Anyway to clean this stuff off of plastic trim?
you made the same mistake MOST new users make: you used too much! You need to let it dry completely (which may take an entire 24 hours, or more, depending on how low the temperature and how high the humidity iswhere you are: if you have high humidity and low temps, you are in for a LONG wait, maybe more than 24 hours. Just let it dry, completely, then it will wipe off well. I made the same mistake you did and I had to let the vehicle dry for an entire 24 hours! Then, no problems. Now I use Z products only very sparingly.
Waxy residue is a prelude, I think, to the dreaded "yellow waxy buildup," which is why we don't use wax.
Anyway, I have found that there are a few "vinyl cleaners" that do a good job of cleaning stuff like greasy fingerprints from plastic and vinyl parts. As far as I know, Zaino has no product designed to to this; I tried the leather cleaner and it does not work on vinyl (but it works great on leather, even white leather).
3/4 of a bottle of Z1? 3/4? What? Hey, that's way tooooo much. On a Honda Accord, you should have used about 1/4 at most. Like the man said, just let it dry. I've made the same mistake on my first try too. Don't panic or feel bad. It happened, but you can recover and go on. Again, first let it dry. It may even take a few days.
After it has completely dried, buff off again, apply a little (a little) Z6, and then apply another layer of Z5 to eliminate any streaks you may have created. Now, when applying the Z6, first open the spray bottle a tiny (TINY) until it only emitts a fine spray. Give each panel just a short little spray and immediately wipe off with a clean towel. On you next coat of Z5, first spray some Z6 on the applicator. Squirt a thin line of Z5 in an "X" shape on the applicator and use just that amount for an entire panel. Again, you should only consume about 1/8 to a 1/4 bottle (ie: about an ounce) for a Honda Accord. I have a Honda Accord Coupe ('98 EX V6), and that's all it takes. A little goes a loooong way.
After the 3 years I have spent in this site and using Zaino, it STILL amazes me that people don't follow/read the directions on the Zaino site as well as the ones that come with your order. THEN, when things get screwed up, they blame the product. I don't know how much clearer the directions can be. Maybe the reading comprehension level is too high!
I'm no expert, but when I started with Z, I put too much on the first time also; and that was after reading a lot of posts here and reading ALL of the Z web pages.
The tendency with the first coat of Z1 is to do what we have been doing with wax for (in my case) the last 30 years. It's a hard habit to break, even when you have been told. Now that I have several coats of z2 and z5 and the really good smelling z6 under my belt, I think I can do it right and not use too much, but it's hard to believe that so little can do so much.
Thanks for the response pblevine. I did only use 3/4 of an inch out of the z1 bottle, and even less out of the z-5. (it is hard to tell since the bottle is opaque). I really was holding back on putting too much on, but I guess not good enough since the damn stuff wont dry. Is it going to hurt anything to leave the residue on there for 2-3 days, even if the car is in the process of getting dirty? I don't really have time during the week to wash and apply another z-5 coat. I at least want to wait a few days since I have spent a ridiculous amount of hours working on my car this weekend with the dawn, clay, etc. I don't want the neighbors to think I have OCD or something.
Also, if it is so damn critical to use sooo little of this product on your car, then why doesn't it say this on the bottle? I don't know the exact words, but the instructions on the bottle say something close to "wash car, put z on car, take z off car."
Comments
I think I'll do another coat of Z5 and Z2 this weekend. I need that force field around my car!
Steve
The paint leveler is available in a little bottle at the parts store by the touch-up paints. You put a bit on a smooth cloth, wrap it around a stick or card so it is totally flat, and gently rub down the fresh paint until it is level. It works best after the paint is dried for about an hour.
Good Luck!
Thanks.
Steve
It seems to me, however, that you have a decent car that deserves Zaino, and you spent about $75 or more for bottles of various Zaino stuff, and I bet you went out and bought real cotton towels that weren't cheap (I sure did), so would it really kill you to get to the 7-11 and spend another $1.25 for a bottle of blue Dawn?
I bet the lady next door has some she will lend you.
Like a true Zaino fanatic, I went and bought some white 100% cotton towels from fieldcrestcannonoutlet.com. I washed them with some liquid Tide in hot water and then dried them as I would normally dry towels in the dryer, but without a static sheet. Result was tons of lint, enough that I am afraid to use them on my car. Am I doing something wrong? Should I line dry the towels or something, or should I wash them again? Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks.
The lint should have been in the dryer filter, and yes, the first few times you wash new real cotton towels, you will get lots of lint. That's part of the real cotton experience.
If you are getting lint that sticks with the towels after drying, just shake out the dry towel and you should not have any problem. Even if there is a little lint in the towel, it won't scratch the paint like poly towels.
If your dryer is not catching the lint in the filter and your towels are really FULL of lint, my suggestion would be to let them dry, shake them out real good, and wash them again. Repeat as necessary.
When I redid my bathroom, I had to get new towels and I got good all cotton towels (although not white). My lady friend told me NEVER dry towels with those fabric softener sheets (e.g.: Bounce); it hampers the absorbency. You will see this very clearly on kitchen towels. If you have used Bounce when drying them, they just don't soak up the water like they used to (despite the fact that they SEEM SOFT). The same goes for the towels you use on yourself in the bathroom and the towels you now use on your car. If it's good enough for my car, it's good enough for my butt. (Or should that be the other way around??)
Good luck with the lint problem.
They shed so much lint the first time i washed them...that I had to clean the lint screen half way thru the drying cycle or it would never have dried! but it gets less with every wash.
You're a real constructive person.
You are probably ok as someone else who used it claimed he had no adverse affects from using it.
And someone else stated that if it was used on a clearcoat you are probably allright.
While the claying did get the paint smooth, the areas where I did the spot waxing are simply better and silky smooth. The Wax also seems to get a little more "hidden" dirt, though that could just be some of my black Lexus paint coming off (no clearcoat?) on the cloth. And no, my paint is not heavily oxidized, the car is only 4 months old.
I remember reading here that someone else decided to wax-clean first and then remove it with Dawn to get a silky surface prep for the Z.
Thoughts?
I can appreciate you were anxious to do the Z. So was I. I had to let some threatening weather days go by, and it didn't rain, and I could have Z'ed. Gosh, I hated to wait. But wait I did, until the weather was sure and the planets were in alignment.
I don't know, it doesn't seem like all that big a deal to use purple Dawn before a Z treatment (maybe your car will glow under black light now?), but if Sal Zaino says use the blue Dawn, there must a good reason. Why do otherwise?
Steve
In terms of what Sal says, I'm not impressed. Yes, yes, I know he is the owner, etc., but the web site has not been updated in ages, the grammar on the instructions is terrible, and maybe only blue Dawn was available when they did the instructions/FAQ. I've emailed Sal questions and his answers aren't exactly precise. I've still never gotten a "real" explanation of the difference between Z3 and Z2 from Zaino.
This stuff isn't "black magic" as some folks seem to think. Blue Dawn is recommended because it's a high-alkaline detergent that'll breakdown most grease and waxes, and was probably the detergent that Sal happen to try first. Doesn't mean that nothing else will work. Maybe I'm a little jaded because I am an engineer by training and do understand a little about chemical engineering. I just wish there more scientific answers readily available.
"This stuff isn't "black magic" as some folks seem to think. " This is why this product is so popular, people do think this stuff is black magic. Sal has people doing prep work that they never thought of doing with any other wax. This prep work is what gets a great shine. Just like painting a car, 90% prep work and 10% paint application, the prep work makes the paint job.
Just get some 3M P/N 051131 and enjoy a great shine, and of course it only gets better with multiple coats. 3M has aanother show car polish that is amazing but it does not have a UV blocker. I guess you could put one on top of the other........HMMMMM.....that sounds familiar! They also have a polish for swirls....HMMMM....familiar again.
Make life easy and get you some 3M, no Z this Z that, is it too humid, which dawn do I use. I do believe in clay bar but use it with soapy water, not the spray wax that usually comes with it. Then wax your car. 3M makes the best window tint so I would think they know a little about optical properties (i.e. shine).
Oh, what is the matter with a PT!! No I do not have one.
3M swirl remover contains abrasives and permanently removes swirls and offers no protection...must have a coat of wax applied on top. All of their polishes, as well as IHG, offer no protection.
Z5 hides or covers swirls and may take 2-5 applications(allowing adequate curing time)and Z5 can be used as a last step because it provides the same degree of protection as Z2 or Z3.
3M makes good quality waxes. Zaino makes a polymer coating. In my opinion there are no wax products that are as durable as polymer products. With Zaino you get mirror-like shine, durability and it is extremely easy to apply and remove.
Is there some hype involved with Zaino? Yes...I hear people state that nothing sticks to Zaino...this is bull. As a single example...some bird droppings, if left on Zaino...or any wax or polish..for a long enough time can eat through the protection and into the paint finish.
BTW, what is 3M P/N 051131? It is not on their website. "051131"-xxxxxx is the beginning p/n of many of their marine products.
Tonychris: Since you are a chemical engineer maybe you can shed some light about dimethl amine oxide. This is supposed to be the ingredient that can be too harsh on the paint according to another chemical engineeer.
I won't claim to have an exact answer with regards to your question. All I do know is that (alkyl) dimethyl amine oxide is a common ingredient used in anti-bacterial formulations, it's actually safe enough in the right combinations to use in everything from toothpaste to hand soap.
This is a guess as to why that person said this chemical is bad for paint. Alkyl dimethyl amine oxide is a 2nd generation anti-bacterial agent, which is designed to bind chemically to the bacterial cell walls and/or surrounding tissues (e.g. your hands and gums), thus maintaining its biological activity for many hours. I'm guessing that somehow this stuff also bonds to the paint and will interact with any organic compounds?
Like I said, just a guess.
I am willing to use Zaino products exclusively. I am also willing to use non-Zaino products, or a combination of Zaino and non-Zaino products. I don't care about brands; I am only interested in good performance.
Two addenda: My car is brand new. It has no scratch or swirl marks whatsoever (I had nothing to do with this, I simply got lucky- that's how it looked when I picked it up at the dealership).
Also, I am more interested in protection than in shine. If I can get shine without compromising protection, great, but protection is what really matters to me.
Since I only see spots of swirls, not entire car, instead of using Z5 for the entire car, I can save time, and Z5 by just doing few spots! is there argument that goes against this?
You are correct in that the product that I am talking about is not on their website. I found it sometime ago on the net but I do not remember the url. Typical 3M. People say there tint is impossible to find in some parts of the country. I believe it is because they rather manufacture products and sell them to a reseller that will put their name on them.
The wax I am talking about is not in their marine product line, it is in the Perfect-It product line (no not Perfect-It II, or III) and I recall that it is a polymer based product.
http://www.3m.com/market/automotive/product1.html
lonestarsled: there are two Perfect It waxes:
paste and liquid: they do contain some polymers...but very little...They are composed mostly of petroleum cleaners and carnauba. You can look at the MSDS sheets on the 3M website. They do not have any products that are marketed as a polymer product. I am quite familiar with this product, Zaino will easily outlast it. And with so much petroleum cleaners it can't be layered.
It was you who said "They also have a polish for swirls....HMMMM....familiar again." The 3M polish for swirls contains abrasives...Zaino does not. The only 3M product besides abrasive polishes that 3M has that will minimize swirls is 3M IHG which has no protective properties."
From 3M:
"Thank you for your recent inquiry regarding 3M Automotive Aftermarket Products. We appreciate your interest.
3M Imperial Hand Glaze #39007 is a glaze, a final step. It produces a deep shine by filling in and smoothing over imperfections. Since it contains no mineral, the scratches and swirl marks aren't removed, but rather, filled in. It also contains no silicone or wax, which means it offers no substantial protection from UV light and no durability. It is a "cosmetic" product and can be almost completely removed after one car washing."
I have used 3M products in the past...I still use Perfect It 39009 Swirl remover to permanently remove bad scratches and swirls. As I said, they make good quality products.
http://www.3m.com/market/automotive/newsletter/winter98pg1.html
3M developed the acrylic silicone flouropolymer (A.S.F.). So anything using A.S.F. is either 3M or using 3M technology!!!!!!
And yeah, there are water/dirt spots from driving through hard rain.
But the "light" stuff like dust & pollen....well, since I Zaino'd my car it has remained much cleaner overall. i can only speak from my experience. Light stuff doesnt stick AS MUCH. My last car used to get more "dusty" between washes.
"We have also incorporated a pinã colada fragrance in the product to enhance the overall application process -- it's 3M's longest lasting, most durable product, and it smells great too!"
Let me go smell my bottle of Z2....
If Sal had made his Z7 smell like cherry and gave it a red color would people be saying it is the same as the many other cherry smelling car washes on the market?
You know Liquid Lustre Wax looks very similar in color to Zaino Z2 polish. Maybe that is the same product too.
And there are a slew of QD products that have the same color as Zaino too. Maybe they are all the same?
Use whatever products you are happy with. As I have said repeatedly...3M makes good quality products.
Me, I am sticking with Zaino because I love the results. The only problem I find with Zaino is that I like to apply it often because it is so easy and am always amazed at the mirror-like shine. I spend too much time (by choice) detailing my car now. I'll wash it...It'll look great...I'll Z6 it...Loooks even better...Next thing I know I find myself applying another Z2 coat because it is so easy...not because it is needed.
051131 has nothing to do with Perfect It. It is a marine product number.
Since I already bought a slew of Z products, I'm going to give them a shot. I finally got my first coat of Z1/Z3 on today and while the results were okay, in terms of gloss it's nothing I couldn't get with a good wax. Will it get better with additional coats? I don't know until I get a chance to try it.
I do however attribute the finish so far to the meticulous prep work I did. Washed evey nook and cranny. Clayed and then clayed again areas I wasn't happy with. After the final wash and wipe down, the paint was smooth to begin with.
And for some reason the Z3 removal was a tedious job, it was as much work as any wax. The problem is that I have a black car and I can see anything and everything that is on the paint. And yes, it's about 80 degrees today and very dry. Waited almost 2 hours to dry. It was a lot of work to get the "film" off the paint. Hopefully additional applications will be easier.
Like I said, so far the stuff looks fine, I'm hoping the protection is as good as folks say it is. I just wish there was less "magic" and more science to explain this stuff.
I am suprised to hear that it was difficult to remove. Many people do find that the initial Z1/Z_ coat takes the longest to dry.
Put the crack pipe down!!!!!!!
http://www.3m.com/marine/prod.jhtml;$pageID$-masf-msa-cap
I could provide more links to marine products that start with the same digits if you like (if they don't exceed 115 characters).
If I had one of them fancy digit-all cameras I would take a pic of the p/n for you.
But you are getting away from the initial point that I was expressing to tonychris, which was to check out the 3M wax. No z this, z that, let dry 24 hours, is it too humid. Just wax and enjoy the shine!
You are right!!!...my bottle of 39009 which I purchased 3 months ago has the same prefix. I should have checked that to begin with. I do remember when I purchased it the container was covered in dust. What is going on with 3M's website? If you put the full UPC number in the MSDS search section it will come up blank.
If 3M waxes and polishes work better for you by all means use them.
The Zaino products work well for me. They are not confusing and I have never waited more than an hour for a coat to dry. Applying thin coats is the key.
I have to go walk my dog now!!
You MAY have used too much, or perhaps it was not quite dry yet - this will cause the smearing that you see. Either way, a quick wipeown with Z6 will clean it up while it is enhancing the shine. If it is really dry, it just dusts off effortlessly. I know - I get impatient too!
And...
checon: I really think that Z1/Z2 will give you very good UV and environmental protection. Give it a try.
Well, folks claim Z is not a wax but yet I have that nasty wax-type residue on some of my black texturized plastic trim now that doesn't rub off. Looks horrible. Anyway to clean this stuff off of plastic trim?
Thanks.
Anyway, I have found that there are a few "vinyl cleaners" that do a good job of cleaning stuff like greasy fingerprints from plastic and vinyl parts. As far as I know, Zaino has no product designed to to this; I tried the leather cleaner and it does not work on vinyl (but it works great on leather, even white leather).
After it has completely dried, buff off again, apply a little (a little) Z6, and then apply another layer of Z5 to eliminate any streaks you may have created. Now, when applying the Z6, first open the spray bottle a tiny (TINY) until it only emitts a fine spray. Give each panel just a short little spray and immediately wipe off with a clean towel. On you next coat of Z5, first spray some Z6 on the applicator. Squirt a thin line of Z5 in an "X" shape on the applicator and use just that amount for an entire panel. Again, you should only consume about 1/8 to a 1/4 bottle (ie: about an ounce) for a Honda Accord. I have a Honda Accord Coupe ('98 EX V6), and that's all it takes. A little goes a loooong way.
You'll get the hang of it.
fastdriver
The tendency with the first coat of Z1 is to do what we have been doing with wax for (in my case) the last 30 years. It's a hard habit to break, even when you have been told. Now that I have several coats of z2 and z5 and the really good smelling z6 under my belt, I think I can do it right and not use too much, but it's hard to believe that so little can do so much.
Maybe it is magic after all.
Also, if it is so damn critical to use sooo little of this product on your car, then why doesn't it say this on the bottle? I don't know the exact words, but the instructions on the bottle say something close to "wash car, put z on car, take z off car."