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Subaru Outback VDC
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Overall, however, I think Subaru did a nice job in upscaling the car. It is really first class in quietness, smoothness, and comfort, and has an excellent blend of sportiness and cruising comfort. Yhe Volvo 850 turbowagon I traded in was faster and maybe a little better in sport feel, but you definitely paid for it over bumps, and it was still a dog compared to my Toyota Supra. I have learned my lesson, station wagons can be sportier than SUV's, but they are still station wagons.
At about 1000 miles, I am planning on switching to synthetic oil. Does anyone think that is a dumb idea?
Mike
Or a manual option, of course.
I bet if the tranny were perfectly suited, folks would be more satisfied with the power too. My theory is what the engine giveth, the tranny taketh away. It's geared tall for relaxed driving and efficiency, but we want more.
Mike - you might want to wait a bit before going synthetic. I've heard they can be TOO good in that there isn't enough friction for proper break-in. 15k miles is the figure I keep hearing.
-juice
Bob
...at 6-7pm Pacific/9-10 pm Eastern. Hope to see you there!
http://www.edmunds.com/chat/subaruchat.html
Drew
Host
Vans, SUVs, and Aftermarket & Accessories message boards
Wine....stone. That's me! :-) Prefer my red wines dry and smooooth without a meal to enjoy the flavor by itself relaxing in a nice comfy chair outside around dusk. Wife by my side of course, and kids playing (not fighting) in the yard.
Everytime I visit other boards I get turned off by the complaining and slamming. We see too much of that in our daily lives as it is. You people here are great and a nice escape from "mainstream cars". Can't believe Subaru has eluded me so long. Very happy now though.
Greg
-juice
Best regards to all...this is a great group.
Kevin
-Brian
I had a similar problem with my LL Bean. The CEL indicated a problem with a fuel sender (one of two). The on board computer was finally returned to SoA for replacement of both chips and the ECM. The whole process took two and a half days. A loaner was offered during the interim. From what SoA told me, they are monitoring the H6 very closely and are bending over backwards to "do right" by the purchaser. I was greatly impressed by the attitude and action of both SoA and my local dealer, Delray Subaru here in Florida.
Hope this is of help.
Don
Also has anyone figured out a way to use a less expensive soft version that will not damage the rear sunroof?
Thanks,
Ron
http://www.packasport.com/home.html
Greg
I am considering looking at a basket type to put the soft carrier on. That will get it off of the roof.
I looked at the packasport web site, but can't justify $800 plus.
I'll keep you posted.
Ron
A couple of questions.
The dealer has this service plan which costs $169 for 15k service, which is basically an oil change, a tire rotation, a chassis lube, and inspections. The 30k inspections is $299 for the same with plugs, cooling system, and transmission oil changes, which seems more reasonable. Do these seem about right or high?
Also, I am planning on keeping this car suitable for vacation driving until at least 150K miles and as a second car until above 200K with minimal ongoing repair. I am planning, starting at about 10k miles to switch to synthetic oil (every 5k miles thereafter). Aside from following the recommended maintenance schedule, any other suggestions for long term reliability assurance?
BTW, this was also my plan on my Volvo 850 wagon, but at 80k miles, it was starting to cost too much for upkeep; hopefully this will be the one.
thanks,
Mike
I have a Samsonite soft carrier for my Forester, but I also have roof rails that it sits on. The bottom is a felt-like soft material, so it may be OK even on the glass moonroof. You're only supposed to put light things up there anyway.
Mike: you are already on the right track in terms of long-term upkeep. Those prices seem very reasonable to me. I've swapped gear oil before and that stuff stinks! My wife would have paid $300 just to get rid of my gear oil cologne smell!
-juice
On the transmission: I notice the VDC upshifts to 2nd way too soon -- long before the revs can increase enough to generate torque. My surmise on this was that Subaru geared it this way to attain that magic 20 mpg EPA figure for city driving. Whether or not that's the case, I would like to see the transmission giving me more RPMs before IT decides I should upshift. Oh well, maybe that's why I stick with my trusty 4-cyl. 5 speed Outback -- I choose my own shift points. Just drove it to Hilton Head and back by the way, and this was the first time I DID NOT get tired after driving 800 miles nonstop. Love that car! And I'm pretty fond of my wife's VDC too, even if it does have to be an automatic.
Hmm, ECU reset, maybe? ;-)
-juice
Everything from 1.5 hours for a scheduled oil change, the WRONG repairs done (the most disturbing), repairs done so poorly/improperly that I had to complain to the the general manager, not calling when the car was done, leaving the inside of the car dirty, and it goes on. I dont know why my wife kept taking it back there. Its on the way to work...I guess it was easy. They did offer me a free oil change to go back but I dont think so. Really, I dont expect that much: just do it correctly and call me when its done or if its going to be late. Thats all I expected. Anyway, we go to Lou Fusz now but its too early to tell if they are any better. If they stink too then its off to the Dean Team on Manchester.
Also any real-life experience in towing out there? My '98 Outback does an admirable job pulling a small tent trailer through the Rocky Mountains. What I'm wondering is whether I would notice any significant improvement in towing ability with the H-6 (keeping in mind the tow capacity is the same between the two vehicles (2000 lbs.). Had planned on keeping the 4 cyl. a long while but now wonder whether engine and transmission life would be better in the H-6 over an extended ownership period.
Thanks in advance for any help anyone out there can provide!
The H-6 will tow better than the H-4. More torque and it will also not put as much stress on the engine (same performance at lower RPM).
If I was going to be putting this car down some rougher trails I would stick with the 98. The H-6 does not seem to be as suitable an off road (rocks, bumps and stumps kind of off road) vehical as the previous generations. The front and back bumpers are more succeptable to cosmetic damage, the bottom shroud is plastic and can be cracked and a few other things like that. It will get you to the same places (maybe more) as your 98 but you'll have a higher repair bill at the end of the trip. My impression is that the H-6's are more "optimised" for on road use than the pre-00 OB's. The tan interior shows dirt more, the new interior crinkled molding is harder to clean and if you have that rear subwoofer your reluctant to fling dirty pointy things into the back. I'd stick with my older OB for those outdoor adventures. You'll cry a lot less when something goes bump. Also switch to synthetic for the oil, gear and tranny fluids if your going to be towing.
The actual usable floor space is much bigger. It's a few inches wider between the shock towers because of the new multilink rear suspension. The difference is IMO noticeable.
The brake rotors got bigger for 2001, so that would aid in towing. Certainly the extra torque does, and the auto is perfectly suited. Finally, it's heavier and has a longer wheelbase so it should be more stable. I would try to stay near the 2k weight limit, but even my Forester pulls 1500 lbs well.
-juice
It's been about six months since I posted on this board.
I noticed quite a few posts regarding hesitation when accelerating in the VDC last week.
I had ordered a VDC in Set. of last year and after being told my wagon would be at the dealership around Thanksgiving, I finally had a chance to take delivery at the end of February. When I test drove the vehicle I noticed a distinct hesitation when hitting the throttle, and posted a question about it on Feb. 21 in the Dealers/Pricing Forum #866
I decided to stay in the car I'm driving now. I was also considering the Highlander at that time. After watching the gas price roller-coaster this summer, I'm once again thinking, "Maybe a 2002 VDC?" I hope Subaru works the bugs out of the VDC tranny for next year.
Thanks to everyone for an extremely educational forum.
Tom
Mike
bit
I'd change the oil before I left as well. In fact, I did my first change at 1k miles, too, and my Forester got 30.4mpg the other week. Sweet!
-juice
Any comments on their recommendations?
Well, off to pack for Colorado. My wife is handling the clothes; I have to get the golf clubs ready, select the wines, and decide on the right cd's to take. She has only one thing to do; I have three, just not fair.
Mike
Drain fluid, pour in red line, shift around, drain fluid, pour in more redline. That will get you about a 75% redline, 25% dextron combo. You could do it again to get a 88/12 mix but each time you fill that sucker w redline it costs $40+ ($8/Q, 5q). Ouch. A full flush at the dealer w regular is running $80.
I'm debating if I should just get it flushed every year with regular or do the drain and refil routine w redline. With Redline you could theoretically go longer between changes like synth oil. Do it every 30K vs 15K. Or maybe every 15K just drain 5Q and and add more redline
Any ideas?
I put Mobil 1 75w90 gear oil in my Miata and it's been fine. Cold shifting is slightly easier, but other than that you can't feel much difference. ATF is different, though.
The Miata.net gearheads say every 30k miles. Sounds reasonable to me.
Mike: yeah, but there's something about grabbing a Big Bertha, your favorite bottle of wine, and some nice tunes that gets you psychologically prepared for a vacation.
Have fun.
-juice
...at 6-7pm Pacific/9-10 pm Eastern. Hope to see you there!
http://www.edmunds.com/chat/subaruchat.html
I was crossing the Hudson River at Albany and there is some construction there, with a police radar sign which referenced the same speed as the GPS. Moveover, my old car equals the same speed as the GPS, so I feel confident, to within 1mph that the GPS is OK.
No biggie, you say....take it in and they'll fix it ... Nooooooooooo. I spoke to the service manager and he said, "We're ALLOWED 10% inaccuracy and as you are reading 75 it would have to be more that 77 for it to be a problem".
I asked him to cite where it is written. He could not provide a reference. I told him I was not going to have this car forever and have to do a sum everytime I want to obey the speed limit.
He said, bring it in next week and he'll plug the computer in to his computer, BUT if the speedo is the same as what the computer reads there is nothing he can do. I said, hold on, isn't that the SAME computer that is telling the speedo what to show. He said YES. OK, well why do think it will be different? And why is this a valid test?
Ok, I won't bore you anymore, as it degenerated into a bunch of imbecillic posits from this guy thinking he was talking to a fool. I gave up trying to reason with him.
How on earth can something so damn piddly turn into a nightmare? I swear, had he said, bring it in and we'll look at it, I would have not had an issue. Instead he gave me a bunch of crap.
I am really worried I have made a 30K mistake. I would greatly appreciate any perpectives seasoned Subaru owners might be able to share.
Gary
The car's speedo is getting mechanical readings from the wheels about 3 feet away.
Nevertheless, here is what I suggest. Take two cars, both with FRS hand-held radios, and hit the highway. Then drive side-by-side at different speeds, and compare your speedo to another one.
Odds are, it'll be about right.
I did this after my tire swap, since the tires were a little bigger than standard, and sure enough there was a small error (it read slow), but nothing significant.
-juice
2. The GPS is the gives the same speed as the speedo in my old car. Again, possibly both are inaccurate, but like the radar, I feel highly improbable.
3. GPS *IS* inaccurate, but not by the same amount over a 3 hour period. That is so improbable to be impossible. I do agree that single data point though is very unreliable. In this case though I kept it on the whole time.
So whilst it is theoretically possible that all the devices are all inaccurate AND off by the same amount AND that the Subaru is correct, well, I feel that it is not probable, though Johny Cochrane could probably get the dealer out of it.
Moreover if I execute the test you suggest, and they are different then could be said that it is simply another improbable data point and not a definitive test.
I need a definitive test
Thank you for your reply.
Hmm, I wonder how police cruisers calibrate their speedos. Maybe a shop that does that can have a look at it.
Subaru must be able to adjust it, because the tires on the Outback are 7% bigger in diameter vs. a Legacy GT, with the same final drive and gearing. I doubt they make a different component for each model with different tires, because the Legacy L has yet another size tire and a different final drive, so again it would need a re-calibrated speedo.
-juice
2. The GPS is the gives the same speed as the speedo in my old car. Again, possibly both are inaccurate, but like the radar, I feel highly improbable.
3. GPS *IS* inaccurate, but not by the same amount over a 3 hour period. That is so improbable to be impossible. I do agree that single data point though is very unreliable. In this case though I kept it on the whole time.
So whilst it is theoretically possible that all the devices are all inaccurate AND off by the same amount AND that the Subaru is correct, well, I feel that it is not probable, though Johny Cochrane could probably get the dealer out of it.
Moreover if I execute the test you suggest, and they are different then could be said that it is simply another improbable data point and not a definitive test.
I need a definitive test
Thank you for your reply.
Bob
1) 6 yr/100k warranty (gold)
2) Air Filtration
3) Bug deflector
4) Dimming mirror w/ compass and security upgrade
5) Trailer hitch setup
6) Woodgrain trim on door panel
My price is $32,315 without tax. Is this a good deal? I should have the car by late August. The fist allocation order was on 7/9. Did I do OK?
Thanks!
-juice
I'd trust the GPS + Radar. I have yet to drive a car that has a dead-on accurate speedometer. Our VDC is among the more accurate ones I've driven, but is still about 5-8% off. It seems that most cars come from the factory reporting faster speeds than they are actually travelling. Thus, you're less likely to get a speeding ticket.
It's highly improbable that the GPS would interfere with the radar.
HTH,
Theo
What part of CA are you in? Which dealer?
Ken
Think about this for a minute - if the car manufacturers let a few cars out the door that read even 1 MPH low instead of high, imagine the ensuing law suits from unwary speeders getting tickets!
They set the speedo to read a little high to make sure they have no liability for speeding tickets and to accommodate fluctuations in tire pressure.
If you can get it fixed without hassle, go for it, but please don't think you have somehow made a poor purchase...
Topic: July 10th: "Auto Mechanics - Ever been ripped off?"
How bad was the damage? If the ABS and VDC lights were on steady (not flashing), then perhaps there's a problem with the ABS controller. I believe when the VDC or ABS is active that it flashes to acknowledge it's on. I could be wrong though - It could be the other way though (flashing means an error). Anyone with a VDC want to confirm?
-Brian
Drew
Host
Vans, SUVs, and Aftermarket & Accessories message boards
Reading the owners manual it seems that the VDC light likes to come on just for the heck of it when other lights come on. There are many combinations and conditions that the VDC light comes on with the check engine light and it means nothing. I wouldn't worry about it.
I will report back on the outcome. I also spoke to Subaru and they said they will get involved, if necessary.
I also noticed the wheels are not balanced too. I am going to ask for that to be done also.
Like I mentioned, the car is a week old today, so I feel I am not off to good start.