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Subaru Outback VDC
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Comments
"1. Does the automatic temperature control work well, i.e. does it regulate the temp nicely?
It seems to work very well, from what I've seen. Of course, I've rarely been in the car when it's started cold after being off all night, so I can't really give you a thorough answer.
"2. What is your opinion of wind noise, i.e. is it bothersome at 65 mph?"
Nope, not to me. A lot of extra sound insulation is provided with the McIntosh sound system, and it lowers noise over the already low levels in the other outbacks. Besides, if you have that sound system going, you can't hear wind anyway...much less anything else.
"3. Have you heard any rattles, especially in the dashboard, moonroof/sunroof, etc?"
Nope.
"4. As the VDC is considered slightly overpriced, do any of you regret not going to an Audi Quattro or Volvo Wagon?"
I still don't think it's overpriced at all. By the time you put comparable features/engines on an Audi, BMW, or a Volvo, the Subaru can be $10,000 or more cheaper. Volvo Cross Country (AWD) with leather, climate control, heated seats, premium sound? Easily over $40,000. Lexus RX300, smaller, less comfortable, bad sound system, and by the time you put AWD on there, high $30ks.
I still don't know why people keep complaining about the price. Even over cheaper Subes, it's reasonable. LLBean for $29k...by the time you put climate control, auto-dimming mirror, etc. on a regular OB LTD, you aren't paying that much more for the 6. VDC, $3k more for the Variable Torque Distrobution AWD and the most superb factory-installed sound system I've ever heard. It really isn't that bad.
"5. Is the comfort of the seat sustained for a 250-300 mile trip?"
I haven't been on one that long, but so far I have enjoyed the seat comfort.
"6. Are you happy with the quality control on the vehicle, i.e. fit and finish, lack of mechanical problems, etc."
Absolutely. The only problem my dad has had so far was that the Cruise Control was a little sluggish, and that was fixed in no time. Another one sold at the same dealer hasn't had any problems either. Very very nice.
Mike
As for changes, I doubt there'll be many, and I doubt the tires and wheels will be changed. There's absolutely no reason to change those tires anyway. They're not a victim of the other Firestone problems for one, plus they really are excellent riding and handling tires. Too bad they're too big for replacement tires on my '97 OB...
Mike
Gotenks243 I appreciated your insight as well. I was quoting theline from the pulp magazines that the VDC is overpriced. One has to agree that there is a lot of technology in the vehicle.
I hope that others who own/drive the VDC or L L Bean will offer comments relative to my post #50.
I am new to the board but have enjoyed reading your comments. I've just about decided to replace our '91 Accord EX wagon with an LL Bean. The main thing I want to say is that in the month we have been looking we have actually seen the prices dropping every week. The latest ad from Thomason Subaru in Portland, OR. lists $ LLBeans with MSRP of $30,920 for $27,388. I called to verify this Sat and the still had 2 Wintergreen and 1 Winestone available. I specifically asked exactly what they had as listed options and was told they had 6 disc in dash changer, spoiler, floormats, and upgraded sec sys. A week ago the best price I could find for the same exact thing was $28,045 from Bub Clary Subaru in Longwiew, Wa. I live 35 miles from Longview, so would like to do business with them. They now say they will match Thomasons price. Anyway just thought that might be of some interest to someone. BTW it seems there is no shortage of LTDS or LLBEANS. Not so sure about the VDOas I am not interested in that model.
Bob
Now if they would just put the H6 in a 'non-premium' package...
crawdadking: I really want an LL Bean, but I'm waiting until this summer. With the mini-recession, and more competion for the Bean coming (Toyota Highlander, Isuzu Axiom, and Jeep Liberty), I'm fairly confident that I could get Invoice price plus destination charge and 4.9% financing for 60 months by the end of the summer. Don't get me wrong, there are days I want a new car NOW, but if I wait until summer I'm sure I'll save myself a few thousand dollars.
Thanks to everyone for all their posts about this car. All the input was greatly appreciated!
Kevin
Check out www.tirerack.com and http://www.discounttiredirect.com/. The latter runs specials and currently has a pair of MAS wheels on sale for $60 to $70 a pop, and I know that at least some MAS models fit Subarus. It's worth a call to them to find out.
I think the OE steels were about $80 each, so forget that. Go with 225/60R16 snow tires mounted and balanced, which should cost you less than $700 with the alloys and all delivered.
-juice
Kevin
Try Discount Tire. Bet they can beat Tire Rack's price. I was very pleased with them, and the big tires I got do not rub, as promised.
-jucie
Cheers Pat.
Mike
questions for current VDC owners. Your input
will be greatly appreciated.
1) Detriot area has really rough roads with lots
of pot-holes. So, I am wondering how good is the
suspension in a VDC. Somebody on these postings
once mentioned that the suspension is soft.
2) How is the passing power/acceleration in 65-75 mph
range on highways. Some reviews (like Car Point)
say acceleration is good up to 65 mph but is average
in 65-75 range.
3) What about wind noise during highway rides and
engine noise in general ?
Thanks in advance !
Soft it exactly what you want for pot-holes. The springs absorb impacts nicely and yield a quiet and smooth ride. There is a lot of suspension travel, soft spring, and gas shocks for good rebound control.
You do not want a harsh/sporty ride if roads are poor! Imagine the dental bills, the damaged wheels, etc.
-juice
The JGC is probably wider, but I'd say the OB matches it in every other dimension.
You get two moonroofs, so the people in the back will be pleased. Try one out, and bring the family to see how they like it too.
-juice
There were a lot of things I didn't like about my Durango, but I must say up front that it NEVER broke down on me. I bought the 8 passenger model, but in reality it was a 7 passenger vehicle. Only Mini-Me could have fit in the center of the front bench. When the rear seat was up, there was no room for cargo. When the rear seat was down, PLENTY of cargo room, but now you have a 5 passenger vehicle. My intention in getting this truck (and make no mistake here: it rides and handle like a truck), was to haul around my daughter's volleyball team and all their gear to tournaments. A Suburban would have been the better choice. Also, this was the worst handling vehicle on wet roads I've ever owned. That's probably 90% tire related. The Goodyears that come on the Durango look muy macho, but they are a scary tire on a wet road. I should have swapped them out for something better, but I was leasing and didn't want to invest any more than I had to in the vehicle. After owning the OB for 3 weeks, IMHO, there's no comparison. The only trade-off I made is passenger capacity. Best of luck with your decision.
Kevin
djstewart: I think the Bean gets an 80 watt Panasonic stereo.
Sid: that price sounds good for all the options it has on it. I've seen cheaper, but that was without options.
-juice
When I was considering an Outback OR a Forester last December, the dealer tried to steer me to the bean/vdc alternative to my CURRENTLY owned Forester S model. The VDC has a great stereo, but I could get the same by dumping a couple of thousand dollars in my stock Forester.
I looked at the dealer straight in the eye, and told him I would never consider a Subaru for over 30,000 even one with a v6, and ESPECIALLY not one with an automatic/v6 as the only choice. He was disappointed, and I hope that disappointment gets repeated enough so that Subaru pays attention. Give us the H6 in lower trim Subaru! OK, my spleen is vented... best!
perrito
Closest is the VW 4Motion, which costs more, makes less power, and is less reliable and fuel efficient.
The A4 is much smaller and uses that same engine. Everything else is far more expensive (XC, 325xi, A6).
I have a feeling the H6 engine will make its way into other models soon. The Outback Sedan first, then the GT, most likely.
If you want major power and a 5 speed manual, the WRX is the way to go.
-juice
Bill
Good luck and happy driving.
BTW... The pearl white is a beautiful color.
-juice
I purchased my LL Bean at Clawson Honda Subaru
in Fresno California. Ask for Joey.
Tel. (559) 435-5000 x110
www.clawsonmotors.com
Since reliable was the first word you used to describe what you want, I'd go with the Subie. The Passat V6 has about 15% more problems than average, according to Consumer Reports. The A4 is similar.
The Outback scores over 20% better than average, and while the H6 engine is new, it actually seems to have fewer problems than the 4 cylinder.
The A4 is kind of small, and it's about to be replaced anyway. So test drive the Passat V6 4Motion and the Outback LL Bean. Even the Outback VDC, with discounting, falls into your price range.
-juice
I recently purched a VDC in the Pacific NW for just under $30k. This, with LL Bean loss-leaders going for $27,500. So I paid an extra $2500.
What really did it for me is the added safety of the more sophisticaed AWD, the traction control, and most importantly, the stability control. I beleive that stability control will become increasingly common in the future - kind of like ABS is today - and I didn't want to drop this kind of cash on a car that would seem obsolete in a few years. As a point in reference, I was seriously considering Audis & BMWs before I settled on the VDC, so $30k didn't seem so unreasonable to me.
Of course, the Mac stereo & added sound insulation are just icing on the cake. I sure wish the VDC had the Bean's free service, though.
I think that if you can find a Bean for $27.5k then you are getting an incredible value. But I was not successful finding a (German) car with all of the VDC's attributes for anything less than $37k, so $30k for the VDC seems like a good value as well. It just depends how you feel about the value of VDC & traction control.
FYI, for anybody who believes the VDC is like an Outback Limited with more power, it's much more than that. I drove a Limited & VDC back-to-back, and in more ways than one, the VDC is in another class. The steering has a much nicer feel to it - better weighting with more feedback. The Limited's steering seemed over-boosted by comarison. The suspsension calilbration on the VDC was much nicer as well. The VDC had much better control of it's chassis, with gross body motions well damped, giving the car a fantasic, stable, well-planted feel. The combination of the better steering & shock damping makes the VDC much more confidence inspiring on the road.
Finally, the added sound insulation coupled with the super-smooth & quiet H6 made the car seem effortless when pulling away from a stop. And yes, the added power is nice too.
All of these things add up to make the VDC seem much more sophisticated. Yes, I know I'm talking about a Subaru here, and many of you reading this will probably think that "sophisticated" and "Subaru" don't go together. But I would not have purchased an OB Limited (no offense to anybody who has, I was just looking for something different). I fell in love with the VDC, so to Subaru, I say, good job! A true entry-luxury wagon with great personality, style, performance, safety, utility & value.
Complaints?
Please, Subaru, please, give us a 5 speed automatic (or manual)!!!! Third gear is just too steep, hurting the 65-75 passing acceleration. It's not bad, but it's not what it could be. I drove an Acura 3.2 TL the other day, and while I feel the OB VDC was equal or better than the TL in nearly every way, third gear passing performance in the Acura was awsome, while the VDC it's just good. Also, while you are at it Subaru, make the automatic shift more like the Acura's as well. That TL had a fantasic automatic, with better shifting than even the Audi & BMW units.
I've driven many other cars lately, and I think Subaru could have done better with front seat comfort. Again, it's not bad, but I know they can do better. I can get comfortable in the driver's seat, but as a passenger, I can't change the incline of the seat bottom and therefore cannot get adequate thigh support. A little more thigh bolstering would be great, and not require me to rake the seat bottom of the driver's seat so much. FYI, for truly fantasic seats, see the BMW E46 (new 3 series) with the sport package seats. I would have paid extra for seats like these in the VDC, had they been available as an option.
I'd prefer a bit more rebound daping on the shocks, as the car floats a little when cresting hills, and even a little more steering feel/effort than the VDC is endowed with (think Passat here). But then, I autocross my manual steering Miata on a regular basis, so I'm probably not the norm on these issues.
Other than that, I think the VDC is a wonderfully refined & sophisticated car with great personality that will undoubtedly yelid many very enjoyable road trips to, through, and into the mountains. And that's why I bought the car.
George
-juice
-Brian
Ken
My car was as stripped as a VDC can get, which is to say completely loaded. It had none of the dealer installed options, however.
If you can get a VDC for $30k or so, I don't think yuo should feel bad about paying extra for the added safety & technology over the LL Bean. And you loose the name brand to boot, so that should make you happy.
Perhaps you should attempt to experience the benefits of VDC first hand. Some sales people are knowledgeable to do this for you. Wait for rain (or snow!) and find a dealer who can take you out and demonstrate the VDC. It's pretty cool, and may convince you to spend the extrs $$$.
George
Outbacks selling below invoice. I got a good deal for
my new VDC which I bought today (900 dollars below
invoice). It seems Subaru dumped lot of VDCs and
LLBeans into dealerships in the last month or so and
dealers are eager to sell them at reduced costs. I dont
know how true it is, but that's what the dealer told me.
Anyway, it rides and feels smooth.
Has anyone had problems with their rear view mirror being knocked out of alignment when the passenger side sun visor is lowered?
Is there an adjustment that can be made??
I absolutely agree with you regarding the 5-speed automatic (with sport-shift, like the Acura TL), a manual option, and better bolstered seats. I don't know if you read (or remember) my posts from back in November, but I complained then about those very items you just mentioned, after a couple of test drives.
Bob
Fitz has Beanos under $27k, freight included. The car mags were balking at the $32k asking price, but if they bothered to think of real-world prices they'd see the value.
-juice
Does anyone know of any rebates or special financing incentives in the works or how soon they will go into effect? The current 3.9% financing expired at the end of February.
Could Subaru be mounting these differently from car to car? What say the other VDC owners?
I drove the limited and the LLB and there never was any doubt that I would get the bean over the limited but for some reason I just didn't make the leap to the VDC (maybe $2500 had something to do with it. But the more I read and the more I looked at the options I lose on the bean and gain on the VDC the better the VDC begins to look. One thing I need to do is drive a VDC and see if it impresses me as much as it does some of the guys here.
There is one thing that bothers me however, all the dealers are openly advertising the bean below invoice but not the VDC. I have had salesmen tell me on the phone that they will make just as good a deal on the VDC but that remains to be seen. It is a good sign tho that Fitzgerald is discounting VDC's just as much as beans.
Well the search goes on. Will probably try to drive a VDC tomorrow. Unfortunately you can't tell much on those test drives.
Good posts,
Guy