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Real-World Trade-In Values

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Comments

  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    Glad to be of help!

    The rims sound like a dealer-installed acessory to me actually, although I dont know Toyotas THAT well! I've just leased a place in the Dr Philips area.. which is close to Universal/International drive..etc..

    Im going to do some job hunting this week.. I really do very well when I deal in Luxury cars, I cant stand working for most mass-market stores as a rule...

    Bill
  • tronsrtronsr Posts: 46
    GOOD LUCK BIIL,
    I AM CERTAIN ALL OF US WISH YOU SUCCESS AND WE CERTAINLY HOPE YOU WILL CONTINUE TO KEEP US WELL INFORMED WITH YOUR HONEST AND UPFRONT ANSWERS.
  • I ended up getting $8,400 for the trade. Helped that I went to Carmax first and got a written offer on the car -- $9K, which equates to the $8,400 plus the sales tax savings.

    Thanks again!
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    Glad to be of help!

    And, thecoffeys, glad it worked out for you on your trade!

    Bill
  • tronsrtronsr Posts: 46
    BILL,
    I SEE IN ANOTHER FORUM THAT YOU EVIDENTLY ARE NOW WITH LEXUS? DID YOU MOVE TO FLORIDA ORLANDO AREA? HOW ABOUT AN EMAIL TO ME IF SO AND THE DEALER. I WILL STOP OVER.

    EMAIL TO: [email protected] THANKS
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    Yup!

    I'm not at Jimmy Bryan Lexus in Orlando. It's a lot of fun :)

    If you want to e-mail Me, do it at [email protected]

    Bill
  • Thanks for this post. Without telling you my life story, let me say that I've always been around $2K upside down in every car I've ever traded and it really pisses me off! I pay extra throughout the loan period, hoping I'll catch up somewhere, but it never happens.

    I live in Atlanta and currently have a 96 VW Jetta GL, green, 5 spd, with moonroof, alloy wheels, CD changer, premium stereo, AM/FM Cassette, 82K miles. It runs great. The upholstery could use cleaning (I have kids)and it's missing a reflector in the front (which seems to be common because I've seen several Jettas with the same front reflector missing).

    I leased it in 96 and now am purchasing it outright because trade-in offers I got, even from VW were $8-6K and I owed $10K (around Feb 2000). If I turned it in, I would have had to pay $2K in mileage alone!(at lease end)

    I desire an SUV now so I can carry bikes, lawnmowers, garden tools, etc. without having to put my 2 kids out of the car! I'm a single parent, new homeowner and I just think an SUV would more suit my needs.

    That being said please tell me:
    1. I want at least $6500 for my trade, am I out of the park? I owe about $8500 on it.

    2. If I can't get at least $6500 for it, am I pretty much SOL? I won't be putting thousands down either. If I had it, I would more likely, pay my current car down.

    3. I am privy to used vehicles but it seems as though dealers are willing to give more if I buy new. Would you think I could have a better chance at getting what I want for my car by looking at the new Ford Escape or the Mazda twin? I like the Xterra but I never go off road and research says it's pretty bad gas mileage-wise. I'd also like to stay below $21K for budget purposes.

    4. We as consumers try to do our homework but we find out that our research was in vain. I'm referring to the trade-in and wholesale values we get off the internet. Is there something that can be done to get the websites offering this information to be more on target? I mean, I know they can't upgrade the site weekly, but if they use the same resources as the dealers do, why are the differences so huge? My initial quest proved the information I got from 3-4 sites were anywhere from $2K - $4K BELOW what the dealers were offering me. If you do all you can to prepare yourself but the information is no good, what recourse do you, as a consumer, have?

    Ok, I think I'm done. Sorry, for the vent, but car buying has always been very difficult for me. You wanna trust the dealer but then you meet some crooked ones but then you think you do your research and the dealer laughs at you.

    I've thought about selling it myself but it's pretty scary being that I'm a single female with no family or friends (to speak of) nearby to assist me. I'd be uncomfortable with the test drives and so forth. I don't know... maybe I AM just SOL?

    I'd appreciate your input. Have a great day!
  • I'll try to help you initially. I'm sure Bill will be by later....learning how to pay the 'right' money for cars takes time. There's a saying in the car business that you make the money going in....meaning, you need to buy it right. You need to know the market and try to buy under it.

    Now, in your case, of course, you aren't trying to make money but minimize loss since you're keeping it to use. Choosing a model that traditionally has strong resale can help to prevent being upside down. You also pay for putting lots of miles on a car.

    No one has a crystal ball about future values for certain models. Until very recently, VW has been soft (slow mover). So, i think the car itself isn't a dog, although a V6 would be better. The bottom line is the hi miles is what's hurting you.

    Currently, for Aug, your car was going for around 7400 at auction in the SE. However, that is for cars with 55,000 avg miles.

    I honestly think 6500 is not a bad price for your car with 80k miles and a 5spd to boot! Maybe, when you get down to the wire and are serious on one of their cars will they move, maybe, a few hundred. But 8500? Nah. They'll just buy one at an auction.

    You have a good chance of getting closer to what you want selling it yourself. Atlanta is a big market!

    Buying/leasing new cars can get expensive. Instead of an SUV , have you considered a wagon? Try a two year old subaru wagon or even a forrester which is based on a car chassis. They ride and handle better with improved gas mileage. Many folks think the SUV craze has peaked, but, i don't have a crystal ball ;)
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    Maybe I can help! :)

    Well, you do have a problem here... However, let's see where you stand on the car. You say that you will owe approx $2,000 ion mileage charges at lease end.

    I'm assuming you did a 48 month, 15k mi/yr lease. Am I correct? What is the residual value, and what is the total mileage allowance?

    Now, my opinion, as the car sits, is that it's probably worth somewhere around $5,000-5,500.
    If I see a high mileage, dirty car that sounds sorta "rough", I'm going to hit it a bit low. But let's not worry about trading it just yet. You may be better off paying the mileage, and taking your lumps there.

    So, get me that info and we'll go from there.

    As far as leasing another vehicle goes, the Escape and the Tribute are both excellent, but you need to look at a few different vehicles. Blackcurrant made a great point in a wagon. Why not look at a Subaru Forester?

    As far as the inaccuracy of the 'net based guides, I see it as inevitable. And I really take offense when Edmunds says that their numbers are accurate. I sell Lexuses in Orlando, and my biggest problem is with internet trade values (Up there with people who want IS300s and GS400s for $500 over invoice :) For example, we had a customer in the other day with a 67K Mile 1993 Mercedes-Benz 300SD. A nice, clean car, but we dont want it down here! It was Black with Black Leather. The Plate frames from Helms Bros motors showed that it was originally sold in Queens, NY. A nice car, but a black/black car is a very very very tough sell here. It'll only sell if it's cheap, hence the low bids we got on it. Also, Diesel S-Classes aren't the hottest MBs going.

    Meanwhile, that 2WD White Explorer that you bought when you lived in Florida is worthless after you get transferred to Cleveland.

    So, by their very nature, theyre going to be inaccurate. THey need to put a disclaimer on them to the tune of

    "This information should only be used as a guide. Vehicle trade-in values are dependent upon color, equipment, and region. A four-wheel drive vehicle may not bring a premium South Texas, while a 2WD SUV May be a very tough sell in the snow belt. So it's important to use common sense."

    Or something like that. Edmunds insists that their values are the absolute truth, yet a buyer in Ohio with a Black/Black 4WD SUburban will get the same trade-in value as the guy with the same truck in Miami. Are they worth the same money though? Of course not.

    Kelley Blue Book asks for your ZIP Code, which I think is a help. But een the guides dont mention color. It'd be too expensive for free websites to have truly accurate data, but then if they put disclaimers up, nobody would use them to the degree that they do. Telling people what you want to hear makes you more popular. A more popular website gets more hits and ergo, more ad money..etc...

    Anyways, rant off. :)

    So, please get me that info, and let's see what the best way to go about this is..

    Bill
  • isellhondasisellhondas Issaquah WashingtonPosts: 20,225
    Of dispensing some very accurate and insightful information.

    It can be VERY hard for people to understand.
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    That's why I started this forum!

    Not to be asmartaleck, but to give people an idea of what their trade *_really_* is worth!

    I hope it helps some!

    Even if some people on Edmunds think that us salesmen are all scum, haha

    Bill
  • THanks guys. Very helpful. I have to say I gagged when I read "wagon". I'll check those out today, though. Safety ratings, insurance costs, gas mileage, meeting my needs, affordability and looks (not necessarily in that order) are all considerations. I'm not familiar with any of those vehicles you mentioned so I have some research to do.

    I honestly felt that $6500 was not outrageous considering what people were trying to sell their comparable Jettas for in the paper along with the internet information I got. Last week, a Toyota dealer told me $4K was the best he could do. I was looking at a 97 Jeep Grand Cherokee. I wasn't bowled over by it because I actually came to look at the Forerunners but they were $22-26K!! And these were 95 - 97s!! I was curious to see what they would give me. I was totally straight up with the sales person and told her that I could not deal if she could not get me at least $6500 for my car. She didn't listen. She still tried to sell me the Jeep after her boss told her to only offer me $4K for my car. I practically had to walk out on her because she wouldn't take "no" for an answer and her boss would not bend on the trade unless I looked at another vehicle.

    Brentwood -- My lease was up in March. You're right about the lease term but I only had 12K miles per year. At the time, I worked around the corner from where I lived but I was laid off later that year and wound up working 14miles away. I went ahead and financed it in February.

    I'm going to get my car detailed and list it for sale. I'm really nervous about having people test drive it and having to ride with strangers. Do you have any suggestions?
  • isellhondasisellhondas Issaquah WashingtonPosts: 20,225
    Swapping cars often is a quick way to lose money.

    Many people buy cars on a whim and then decide quickly that they don't like it for a variety of reasons. Other people (like me) get tired of a car pretty often and want something different.

    Do you REALLY "need" an SUV? Lots of people buy these and regret the purchase later.

    A good way to get "buried" in a car.

    Sometimes it's hard to be practical when buying a car.
  • tronsrtronsr Posts: 46
    BILL,
    YOU GAVE ME A PRICE OF 12,500 TO 13,000 FOR MY RAV4 4X4 THAT I PREVIOUSLY GAVE YOU ALL THE INFO ON ONE OF THE OTHER POSTS UNDER THIS TITLE.
    I THEN WENT TO KBB AND EDMUNDS AND N.A.D.A. AND GOT THE RETAIL PRICES WHICH VARIED FROM 18,100 NADA {THE HIGHEST} TO THE LOWEST RETAIL OF 13,550 {KBB}. I JUST SOLD IT TODAY FOR 14,900 AS I FIGURED THIS WAS A FAIR ASKING PRICE KNOWING I WOULD GET LESS FOR A TRADE-IN. THANKS FOR THE INPUT.I WOULD LIKE TO GET AN RX300 FROM YOU, BUT I KNOW YOU ARE NOT GIVING THEM AWAY FOR MUCH UNDER MSRP. YOU CAN E-MAIL ME AT:
    [email protected] AND LET ME KNOW WHAT YOU ARE OFFERING FOR A 4X2NOT LOADED.
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    At 14,900 you di very well on the RAV!

    And, about the RX.. check your mail :)

    Bill
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    Selling the car on your own may be the way to go.

    At the very least you ought to be ableto get $7,500, WHich is above wholesale.

    But, for $50 or so get that reflector replaced! :)

    And look at the Subaru Forester, it's a very nice car.

    Bill
  • so a wagon makes you gag, huh?

    How about this idea..........MINNNIVAN!!!!!!

    ;)
  • Search the topics in this 'smartshopper' conference...i think there was one with ideas about selling your car yourself and how to protect yourself.

    If you are uncomfortable with a certain person for a test drive then don't go on it, or, don't let it go. and always meet in a public place. You also don't need to attract attention to your home. (i sold dozens of cars to the public (and wholesaled many more) and only a handful of people knew where i lived.

    isn't there ANYONE who can go on a testdrive with you?

    Parking the car where others can see near a busy road is one of the best ways to advertise. and getting it looking it's best goes without saying...even with dealers...although, the better appraisers can see thru the dirt. (sometimes it's best to show a dirty car if it's had bad body repair but you didn't hear that from me) (Right isell? honest and straightforward ;)

    if you are in a busy area and want to make use of 'free advertising', park it a litle ways down from your home so as to not attract attention to where you live.

    Try consigning it. i hesitate to suggest this cause you don't know the dealer either but try a larger independent. This is an option for you since selling it on your own is difficult given your circumstances. As long as the dealer is established with a thriving business you ought not worry...

    Give it the time to sell.

    Do you have maintenance records? this helps with hi mile cars. don't show the car to someone who is apt to pull the dipstick only to find molasses in the crankcase. all the fluids should be fresh.

    And i always put new tires on the car if the existing ones are ready to be replaced. The reason? it gives the impression it was cared for and it will ride like a new car!

    and focus on the positives...one owner...recent _____ repaired (fill in the blank), etc.

    Good luck!
  • You guys are great! I looked at the Forrester AND the Outback. Man.... they still look like station wagons! I'm seeing Brady Bunch here. And mini-vans? Partridge Family (I know they had a bus). I guess it's the stigma. I only have 2 kids and I'm still young (32)! It's hard enough trying to get a man's attention, let alone drive up in a family-mobile! (tee, hee)

    Anyway, aside from the jokes, I compared the Forrester to the Escape (on Subaru's page) and the Escape really beat it out in space, gas mileage, price, looks, etc. So did the Xterra. Both would fit my needs but I like the look of the Escape better and I don't need AWD in Atlanta, do I? I did notice, however, that Consumer Reports has recommended the Forrester 3 yrs in a row. Maybe I'll go by Subaru and check it out in person. I don't see too many around Atlanta though. Not many advertised for sale and not many on the roads. Would that suggest that I would have a problem selling it if I had to?

    Thanks for the points on selling my car also. Honestly, there isn't anyone to help me sell it and go on the rides with me so I'll do it all myself. But I'm used to it. Heck, single female, 32, 2 kids, homeowner in Atlanta with no support base? I've come this far, certainly I can sell a car! (pumping myself up)

    I have the majority of the maintenance records and I have kept up with the maintenance schedule pretty well. Tires were bought in March. I think I'm set! Just get it detailed, tires rotated and oil change ... replace that blasted reflector ..... (why the hell is a 6+ inch reflector $37 anyway??!!)... place some ads, and I'm in business!

    By the way, Brentwood, I know you're in Orlando, but Blackcurrant, where are u located? Assuming you sell cars also, I will gladly send folks your way if I come across people in your area!

    Thanks again, guys! I'll be sure to keep you posted! Have a pleasant day and great weekend!
  • tronsrtronsr Posts: 46
    I CHECKED MY MAIL, SENT YOU AN EMAIL AND STILL NO EMAIL FROM YOU?????
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    Hmm...

    I mailed you last night and it bounced.. Lemme check my mail and I'll see....

    Bill
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    Glad I could help! :)

    Just make sure you meet in a public, well-lighted place. And be careful!

    But, it's like anything else I suppose.. and no, you dont need AWD in Atlanta!

    Bill
  • audia8qaudia8q Posts: 3,138
    For the car people on here.....

    In your area's what appraisal guide book do you primarily use??? Here in the northeast we use "Galves" and NADA as a comparison...
    also, how often do you go online for an appraisal?

    Rich
  • loan in the SW, of course, then it's over/under.
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    Rich,

    We use a combination. As a rule we use Black Book, but we also refer to auction results a lot to get an idea.

    We get the weekly books from the local sales, and there's like 5 sales around Orlando so its a good idea of market.

    Bill
  • joelincolnjoelincoln Posts: 100
    Hi,
    I'm trading in my '92 Mark VII LSC and have found large discrepancies between the prices listed on the net (Edmunds, Kelly, etc) and what dealers are willing to give me. They all seem to be using the Galves book to make their assessment. I am in NJ. I am being offered around $3500 but Kelly says $4300 as a minimum.

    Why the big difference and why does everyone seem to use Galves?

    Joe
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    Well,

    I don't have enough info to go on really to give you an idea of what your trade might be worth.

    Galves is very very accurate, but rarely says what you want to hear. It's put out by a people tha are also wholesalers (I bought cars from them when I was working at a dealer in NJ, which is where I am from).

    For any '92 to bring "Book" it has to be clean, damage free, and evrything has to work. THose little dents andsuch do hurt the car's value substantially.

    Get me the specs on your car and I'lltry and give you an ida of what it may be worth.

    Bill
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    THe average auction value of that car is about $2,700 with about 100K or so miles...

    So $3,500 might be pretty strong actually..

    Bill
  • joelincolnjoelincoln Posts: 100
    Thanks for the info,
    My '92 Mark VII LSC has 99k miles, moonroof, JBL stereo, and alarm system. No accidents or major repairs. I am original owner and have all repair records. I have maintained it well and it looks great and is mechanically solid. It does have some exterior blemishes but nothing that you wouldn't find on any 8 year old car. The interior is fine except for some cracking on the driver's seat leather and wear on the leather-wrapped steering wheel. Tires need replacement.

    What do you think?
    Joe
  • Hi guys, I'm new in this topic but I'm looking to get out of my 2000 Z3 and am suffering from heart failure at the "trade-in" rates I'm being offered. I paid almost $35K in May 1999 and now I'm hearing that I'm only going to get $26.5K if I trade. Am I crazy to be looking for $30 to 31-ish? The car is in great shape, good options, has 12K miles, and S. Fla (where I live) is a decent market for this sort of sportscar. Brentwood, you're "in the area". What do you think?
  • jrct9454jrct9454 Posts: 2,363
    I will of course love to hear the insider's answer to your question, but my first reaction is that mid-high $20s is probably about right for this car. This is pretty typical for a BMW or MB during the first couple of years after new - I used to use a rule of thumb of 20-30% on any one-year-old car like this, unless there was something really extraordinary about it, and I'm afraid that certainly doesn't apply to a Z3. I'm talking about wholesale, of course - the dealer will turn around and try to sell it for at least $32k...but will be lucky to get $30k, which is why nobody wants to buy it from you to resell at the number you're looking for. Sorry, but I have a lot of experience trading low mileage Germans after 1-3 years, and unless you're dealing with something really hot, this is the nature of the biz...
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    Yup...

    $3,500 is "all the money" for that car. Based on my data, it's not even really worth that I'm afraid, so.. take the $$ and run!

    Bill
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    These are always very very tough cars to appraise.

    Here's a general rule of thumb though, On a car that sells near MSRP, Expect to be something like $2-3K below invoice.

    On a car that's cheap-sold, Expect to be substantially below that.

    Look at it this way, say that a Z3 has an MSRP of $35K, an Invoice of $31K and they go for about $34K.

    Where would the used 2000 Need to be priced for it to seem worthwhile to you? It's have to be right around $30-31K, right? And it's very tough to sell cars like that, as they dont attract used-car buyers, and new-car buyers generally do not consider them.

    That being said, my data generally supports this to some degree. These are cars that may bring big money at an auction, but the actual wholesale-level bids on them may be lower... much lower. EVen so, I'm seeing a good $7K+ Off of MSRP at the sales..

    Could I have a bit more info on the car?

    Bill
  • I was offered $650 for my trade-in from a supposed "no-haggle, fair price" dealer. It's a 92 Sunbird SE sedan, 93000 miles, 4 cyl, ABS, auto, A/C, rear defrost. Problems are some rust on the panels below the doors (seems to be a common problem for this car) and a small amount underneath the trunk lid, small amount of paint chipping on the front side panels near the hood and on the front of the hood, and some minor interior blemishes. Mechanically the car is in good shape, new brakes last summer, new exhaust this past spring, new tires today (had to be inspected). Edmunds gives me a quote of over $3400 for trade... I realize this is for a car in perfect shape and I am new to the car buying game, but I can't believe I'd lose $2800 in value from a "fair price" dealer because of the described problems. Any input would be greatly appreciated...
  • isellhondasisellhondas Issaquah WashingtonPosts: 20,225
    Those aren't exactly at the top of the Hit Parade as far as being desirable merchandise.

    What is "some" rust to one person may be a "rust bucket" to another.

    The new brakes,etc are nice but add no real value...sorry.

    It's a car that will probably be wholesaled by the dealer.

    Why not run an ad and try to sell it yourself?
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    Well,

    Im afraid that $650 is that car's value. At best. I have no idea where Edmunds got $3,400 as a trade-in value for that car! Actually, the convertibles aren't even selling for that much. They have an average wholesale selling price of about $2K or so.

    $3,400 would be like low retail on a Clean Convertible!

    Even in markets where rust isnt an issue, Im not seeing any of them sell for even close to that. Truthfully, rust absolutely slaughters the value of a car. It's worse than a horrible paint job. And, the panelsa below the doors are rocker panels, which are structural on a unibody car like that.

    Average wholesale on a clean one is about $1K

    I hate to say it but $650 seems very fair to me. I'd try selling it yourself.

    Times like this make me think that the people at Edmunds who value cars are on something.

    I don;t want to sound facetious, but their quote is grossly out of line I'm afraid :(

    Bill
  • tboner1965tboner1965 Posts: 647
    It seems this car is in the price range that a good number of people can come with cash in hand and buy. My wife and I sold a '91 Sunbird 2 Door in '98 for $4500 and it had about 72K on the clock, no rust and no ABS, but everything else was about the same.

    I think we had it at the MIL's insurance agency on a main street in our town about three weeks before it sold.

    Two head gaskets and a tranny repair in 12 months was enough for us.

    Cheers,

    TB
  • Thanks for the info everyone - I guess even Edmunds can't be believed sometimes ;) I'm thinking about keeping the car through the winter anyways... either that or I will try to sell it myself. Can't wait until I graduate and start making some real money...

    p.s. hey, isellhondas, got any civic si's sitting around? I've been looking for a 95 or so... ;)
  • Guys, thanks for the feedback even though you seem to be confirming my worst fears! Unfortunatly, there really isn't anything "exceptional" about the car (except maybe the color - Topaz Blue with matching interior is pretty different, but still- anyone can walk in and order that). I've now got about 12.5K miles on it, and although I maintain it very well although I do have one scratch on it (I suspected some teenagers from a parking lot, but had no proof. grrr.). Bill, if you give me your email address, I'll send you a pix and some more info and we can take the talk "off-line".
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    I'll be happy to help!

    Send it to [email protected]

    Bill
  • jrct9454jrct9454 Posts: 2,363
    Firstly, let's define the term "market price": that is the price that a willing buyer and a willing seller agree is the value of the goods at any given time and for any given transaction. Three dealers have helped define the market price for your car, but you are not a willing seller. That's OK, but remember that neither Edmunds nor Kelley intend to offer to buy your car. It's pretty clear what the wholesale market price is for this car, but you don't like the number - that's not an unreasonable reaction, but it also means you're likely to be frustrated. This illustrates how I trade cars: I always get multiple bids from dealers who sell the car new - the guides are interesting reading, but are pulp fiction a good deal of the time.

    Second, I traded my 1996 RL with about 15k miles on it exactly three years ago [9/97] on a new MB E320. Market wholesale at that time: about $28000. I got it at about $36k new in Feb 96, so that seemed eminently reasonable to me. So does the number you're being quoted, for the following reason...

    Thirdly, these cars retail routinely for the very low $20k range - $21 - $22.5k, depending on dealer, miles, etc. Considering cost to certify for their used car program, recon, etc, the price you are going to get at wholesale sounds exactly like the prices you've been quoted. Selling it yourself at retail almost always nets a higher price, at the expense of the trouble of advertising, screening buyers, etc. Around NorCal, the retail prices at the beginning of this paragraph are realistic. Hope you can get a deal going that meets your needs...
  • jccsscjccssc Posts: 44
    Thanks for the info, you are right - I got frustrated since I expected to be paid higher on my RL trade-in than what I have been quoted. 3 dealers' appraisals seem like enough to determine the "market" value of the car. I guess what is happening is RL is not a "hot" seller even new - (I saw ads from dealers posting a really low lease rate for 2000 RL's). Even the name ACURA cannot help it much. I just have to accept the fact that it is how much my car is worth. : (
  • jaclazjaclaz Posts: 37
    Not the best New car buy!!
    A '00 RL MSRP's for $42,500, your lease residual gives it a value of $19,000. So in four years the value has declined 55%, retaining 45% of it's MSRP value. A '00 BMW 328 4dr ($39,500 MSRP) after 4yrs. would have a $20,200 Residual and a '00 MB 320 E ($47,750 MSRP) would have a $26,000 Residual after 4 years. The 328 retaining 51% and the 320E retaining 54% after 4 years... Soooo..., you can see the Europeans do get more value. Let's see what happens to a Lexus GS400 ($46,800 MSRP), it retains 52% with $24,100 Value after 4. Audi's A6 Quattro 2.7T Wunder car!!! MSRP of $39,100 retains only 48% with a value of $18,500 after 4...Volvo's S80 flagship ($36,000 MSRP) retains 50% returning $18,000 after 4.....

    Hope you enjoyed the comparisons!
    Happy motoring! Jack
  • jrct9454jrct9454 Posts: 2,363
    ...new ones are sold pretty much at invoice, or around $37k for a non-nav. So a 4-year old car is indeed holding about 45-50% of original price [not MSRP, which doesn't mean much]. I liked my RL a lot, and kind of wish I had it back - it's a car that gets no respect from anybody except people who own one. For that reason, a used one is indeed a superior buy to a new one.
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    Well,

    I'm afraid that those are not very strong in the market. While they are very nice cars, Compare the Price of an RL to:

    A Jaguar S-Type
    A Lexus GS
    A BMW 5 Series
    Mercedes E-Class
    Audi A6

    And that was answered above as it was mentioned that they sell at Invoice. Generally, Imported Luxury cars do not sell at Invoice.

    Now, I ran that Acura against Auction data, And the average seems to be low-mid $17Ks with an average of about 50K miles.

    Also, the "distress-sale" of the New RLs sure isnt helping their residual values at all. When new cars are sold cheap, it hurts their resale value..

    As far as the accuracy of the websites, I find Edmunds to frequently be very far off-base. If you scroll up, I've posted some examples... I wish they would be more accurate, it'd make everyone's job a lot easier. Just today I had a customer with a printout from Edmunds. As often happens, their value was about 10-12% High of market. This was on a Cadillac, and the customer was not happy when he was told what his car wqas really worth. So I brought the auction recap sheet out and asked him what seemed like a more reasonable source! Inititally he didn't trust me, as dealers do not have a stellar reputation, but the point of the matter is, these guides, by their very nature, cannot be very accurate. There areaccurate guides. However, they are not free.

    Information costs money I suppose and you get what you pay for..

    In your case, you have a RWD Luxury car going into winter that's about to turn 5, and a soon to be obsolete model... this car would have been worth a bit more in, say, March.

    Hope this helps!

    Bill
  • isellhondasisellhondas Issaquah WashingtonPosts: 20,225
    Don't expect to have equity at lease end. The residuals are calculated pretty close.

    I think Acura shot themselves in the foot with the new RL. First of all, they shouldn't have changed the name! What is a RL anyway...a Renamed Legend?

    Nice cars, though.

    Also, back in '96 Acura blew out a lot of leased RL's these are showing up at the auctions now en masse. The more of them, the lower the price.

    Color is also important on these. If it's a "bad" color, they will go begging at auction.
  • jccsscjccssc Posts: 44
    i agreed with Bill, the dealers and the market actually "control" the trade-in price of a car. Take my RL as an example, even though Kelly/Edmunds are both showing high values but if several dealers are quoting a lower value because of the market - nothing you can do but accept the fact!! Either decide to go on with life and accept the offer (to trade-in a new car you now want) or keep the car, or if you have enough "doh", cough up the cash to bail the pink copy out and sell the car retail.

    I also agree that RL is a nice car. As a matter of fact, it has no problems whatsoever. However, it is just getting bored to drive the Honda/Acura cars for over 15 years (my previous cars are Accord and Legend), and it is just my decision to go for a more "exciting" car.

    john
  • audia8qaudia8q Posts: 3,138
    I have been consistanly buying off lease 97 RL's for the last few months (premium pkg. w/good colors, white,green,silver works for us)..and having great luck re-selling them. As mentioned in a earlier post...the car isnt worth anywhere near 41K new compared to similar priced competition but for a slightly used one for $23000 is a great value in my opinion...

    Also to anyone trading...don't forget that most states give you a sales tax break on the trade in value. On a pricy car this can amount to quite a bit of money. I have seen customers sell cars themselves because they werent getting enough but when they figured in the sales tax savings they would have received the same amout when trading in to a dealer.

    example:
    trade value $20,000
    sales tax 6%
    = $1200 in sales tax savings thus giving the customer a net trade amount of $21,200.


    Rich
  • As it's referred to is only 3%. So, it's important to consider what your actual rate will be. It still may be worthwhile to trade. Obviously, the higher the trade price the greater the advantage. With a 6% tax rate i'd be hard pressed to justify going thru the hassle of selling an expensive 20k and up car.
  • jmon4jmon4 Posts: 1
    Does $3,700 sound like a fair trade-in
    for a 95 ply grand voy le with 63,000 miles
    and all the equipment (4 captain chairs,
    dual air, power seat...etc.)? Interior &
    exterior is in good condition. I'm buying a
    honda odyssey through a buying service not
    directly from a dealer. Does this make
    a difference? The trade-in value in
    edmund's was over $9000. That's a big gap.
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