Real-World Trade-In Values

fushigi · December 2010

So glad to hear everyone's OK.

Car protected the occupants while trashing the car, just like it should have.

Exactly. IMO new car insurance rates should be cheaper for just that reason. Vehicles are far, far cheaper to repair or replace v. "repairing" a human. My mother-in-law, who is in her late 60s, still has issues from an accident she was in 2 days before Christmas of '08.

tallman1 · December 2010

Wow... glad you are okay!

jmeasell · December 2010

Mathias -- you were correct! Someone thought the low miles on the 01 Civic were gold -- the dealer! Claimed he had $9500 invested in the car and needed his asking price to make a profit. Told him the little old lady that traded in the car took him for a ride. I walked.

Have turned my attention to an 03 Camry LE 4-cyl. auto with 53K miles. Two previous owners both on lease. Again, Edmunds TMV suggests $6500 on a trade and $8300 dealer retail. Are these reasonable figures to work with? Still need my mechanic to inspect it. Thanks.

stickguy · December 2010

common, that will buff right out!

seriously, glad everyone is ok. And I guess the dilema of whether to get something snow suitable instead of getting housebound was taken out of your hands!

qbrozen · December 2010

I guess you never really know what an insurance company will say, but I'd be looking for $9k.

Trade value is $5500-$6500. So, even with hard negotiating, you'd be looking at no less than $8k to buy a similar one at a dealer. $9k is much more likely.

qbrozen · December 2010

Yup, those numbers are pretty accurate. Although the retail number may be a little low. $1800 isn't much profit. Probably need to wander up more in the $8500-$9k range. Again, depends on the finer details. Check those tires, brakes, etc. If anything needs replacing, start deducting.

ateixeira · December 2010

Amazing, the entire front end crumpled up ... beautifully.

As strange as that sounds.

Glad you're OK.

lrguy44 · December 2010

Kristie,
Glad you are OK. Gather all the information you can on what like cars are selling for. Newspaper ads, Autotrader, etc. If they low ball you just throw that at them. Good lunck ad keep us posted.

roadburner · December 2010

lrguy nailed it; start preparing a list of comparables. I had a friend who lost his special edition BMW 318ti in a fire- he was lowballed at first but he papered them with data and they ended up increasing their offer by over 50%.
And pray that the other guy's insurance company isn't State Farm.

stickguy · December 2010

found this at your favorite place in Parlin. 99K on a 2004, but it is a T, so what do you think this sucker is worth? Or better to run and hide?

of course, with something like this, service records would be nice! Hopefully it at least has a new T Belt (but I doubt it), since you are in the minority doing it yourself.

http://torchlightmotors.com/inventory_detail.html?vin=YV1SW59V242452166

igozoomzoom · December 2010

Definitely glad to hear that you and your occupants are all okay!

Am I correct in my understanding that it was the other guy's fault? If so, do you feel comfortable saying what insurance company you'll be dealing with?

Definitely do your research prior to discussing any figures with an adjuster.

Edmunds TMV for a 2003 G35 in Clean condition (with leather and sunroof, 108k miles) is around $9400 Private Party (using my GA zip code, at least). KBB only shows the Private Party price to be around $8700.

Search on AutoTrader.com and any other sites that will show similar, semi-local models for sale. In the Atlanta area, a car similar to yours has an asking price of $9000-$11,000 or so. These "comparables" will be your best bargaining tool, in my experience.

Also, don't forget to add your state sales tax percentage to the amount! They are responsible for the value plus any sales tax!

Hopefully it will go smoothly for you. Be strong and don't let them rip you off, no matter what!

Kirstie_H · December 2010

Well, the verdict is in. I'm sure you'll be stunned to hear that they've declared it a total loss. I was pretty nervous on the phone yesterday waiting for their offer - Last month, I considered trading in, and was getting offers of around $5K for it (some front bumper and grill scratches didn't help), plus it was going straight to wholesale. I was hoping I *might* get $8500.

I don't remember the exact number they gave me, but it was mid-$11K.

Yes, it was the other guy's fault, completely. I don't know what insurance company he had as I'm letting my insurance company deal with the claim. I just do not have the time or nerves to be calling Chuck's Discount Insurance and Pizza Parlor all day, if it came to it. Someone mentioned State Farm - that's who *I* have.

In Missouri, IIRC, you get to use the payout amount as the "trade-in" value when you purchase a replacement, meaning I'd only pay sales tax on the difference between my payout and the new vehicle price.

I don't recommend this method of trade-in, but financially I'll come out better than if I traded in.

tifighter · December 2010

I don't recommend this method of trade-in, but financially I'll come out better than if I traded in.

I don't know, Kirstie. Sounds like solid financial advice to me...

Glad to hear you are okay.

rayainsw · December 2010

Good deal ....
"when you purchase a replacement, meaning I'd only pay sales tax on the difference between my payout and the new vehicle price."

And what are the current possibilities for the 'replacement'?
- Ray
Just curious...

Kirstie_H · December 2010

Missouri is a property tax state, and you're taxed on what you own as of January 1, for the entire year. So, I'm holding off on any purchase until at least January 2.

Til then, I'm just browsing to see what I can get. I'd like a 4WD / AWD, ideally. Considering a Subaru, or a Ford Escape, or something in that range. It'll be used, for sure - before this one bit the dust, I was going to keep it and drive it with no payment for awhile, so I'm convincing myself to stick with the "no payment" plan.

I realized that since March 1 til doomsday, I had only driven 5,000 total miles, so I can deal with a higher-mileage vehicle that's in good shape. Suggestions are welcome, but not guaranteed to be taken.

ateixeira · December 2010

The Subaru Crew would welcome you in a Forester with open arms.... :shades:

Actually that's a growing segment with lots of good choices, have fun shopping!

qbrozen · December 2010

wow. $11k. Congrats. That's like found money. :P

Coming from a G35, I don't think you'll be happy with a Forester unless you spring for the turbo model. Although the automatic turbo is not a great combo.

Given that I'm so partial to the 2.0T at the moment, if I may be so bold, I throw the following into the ring for your consideration: '09 Jetta SEL 2.0T wagon. If you find one with high'ish miles (around 40k), you should be able to pick it up with auto and moonroof for somewhere in the $15k range. Yes, about $4k more than your payout, but if you want a wagon, unfortunately, you have to go '09.

I'm assuming wagon since you said Escape. If sedan works, then an '07 Jetta GLI loaded up with leather, power seats, moonroof, and 50k'ish miles can be had for around $14k.

OR, an '07 Passat Wagon with leather and moonroof and 50k'ish for around $14,500.

OR, how bout an '04 325 XiT wagon with less than 70k miles and premium pack for $12k-$13k? (although you may find this one too slow, too)

qbrozen · December 2010

Price is good. Low trade is $6k.
But a 2.5T automatic? eh.

stickguy · December 2010

find me one of those 2004 3 series wagons, clean as a whistle, for that price and let me know where to pick it up.

If you can make it a rea wheel drive for less money, even better.

and stick will be fine, but not required in this case!

isellhondas · December 2010

What has Kirstie ever done to you to cause you to reccommend a troublesome Volkswagen??

I'm guessing she knows better.

Providing she doesn't start hurting later, this wreck may have saved her several thousand dollars!

This reminds me of something that happened a few years ago.

I had a lady who wanted to trade in her Taurus for a new CRV.

She had booked out her Taurus and she figured it was worth 6000.00.

Well, as everyone knows, the resale value on a Taurus is dismal to say the least. Similar cars were going through the auction at around 3000.00.

When our appraiser came back from driving it he asked me if she had said anything about the bad transmission.

So, I asked her isf she knew about the transmission problems and her answer was..."Oh, so THAT'S why it slips going up hills and makes those funny sounds".

Verdict...the car is basically totalled. The cost of a replacement transmission in a high mileage Taurus exceeded the value of the car.

I had to break the news to her and she left unhappy.

Three days later, I get a call..." Something WONDERFUL happened!!"

As it turns out, she was watching TV when she heard a loud crash in front of her house. Turns out, a local doctor who lived a block away had been at a party and he had had a few drinks. She said he didn't seem drunk but he did NOT want the cops to show up and give him a breath test. He also didn't want the publicity.

They exchanged info and he drove home.

He called her the next day and asked waht the book value of the car was.

Of course! 6000.00! With her promise to keep her mouth closed, and a lesson learned, he sweetened the deal by a grand. She got 7000.00 and he let her keep her car that she junked for a few bucks!

ateixeira · December 2010

Good for her financially, but the doc got away with a DWI. Booooo.

isellhondas · December 2010

According to the lady, he didn't appear to be drunk at all. He had dropped something in his car and hit her when he was reaching for it.

I think he was afraid that he just may have been over the line.

He did tell her that he wasn't much of a drinker and that he had learned a lesson. I'm guessing he got off cheap!

ateixeira · December 2010

DUI? Either way, I hope he did learn.

qbrozen · December 2010

I've always been wary of VW, too. But the 2.0Ts have been getting positive feedback for a while now, so I finally bought one myself. Granted, its early to tell, but pushing 60k miles on it now and no real problems.

Kirstie_H · December 2010

I already played "dodge-the-bullet" with a VW once. Not taking chances again, even though I do love the way they drive. Also, I had a world of trouble getting shops to change my oil for a reasonable price.

I live in a rural-ish area now, and one thing I'm looking for is a vehicle that can be worked on by most mechanics locally, and for which parts are fairly readily available. You might think that knocks out Subaru, but there's a dealership close to me. Still thinking something like an Escape would fit the bill.

robr2 · December 2010

...and I have a 1.8T with almost 80K and have not had one engine issue. Suprisingly, this VW has been as reliable as the 3 Hondas I've owned.

qbrozen · December 2010

What? I gotta do everything for ya? You want that washed and waxed before I deliver it? :P

Here are a few I came up with in just a few minutes on the first site I hit up that are close to the terms I stated. Keep in mind, of course, these are just asking prices.

'03 w/75k

another '03 w/75k

how about an '02 w/69k

or an '04 w/82k

or an '03 with just 54k

or '03 with a piddly 23k miles

qbrozen · December 2010

Did you have trouble with your VW?

Well, we certainly can't help without knowing what your local mechanics are able to work on. There is no such thing as a car that is easily worked on these days. They ALL require special tools and computers now.

isellhondas · December 2010

I grew up with VW's and I've owned an assortment of bugs, busses and a 1980 Rabbit that was, by far, the worst car we ever owned.

But I base my recent opinion on some of the used VW's we had. It just seemed that there was always "something" wrong with them usually electrical. Windows fell into doors, they wouldn't start, warning lights on.

Not as bad as an Audi or a Volvo but close.

Form time to time, our GM would put his foot down and make our UCM wholesale every traded in VW unless it was under warranty.

But, once in awhile, that wouldn't happen and we wold sell a few now and then. A lot of them were just fine.

Land Rovers were a no-no. We wholesaled every one of them and they are so troublesome that the warranty companies pulled out of the market.

lemmer · December 2010

Kbb and Edmunds are showing the price on this 2006 Highlander Limited Hybrid as $1000 or more below trade in. Are they that far off?

lemmer · December 2010

I lost most of my post. The same dealer has an identical Highlander with only 54K for only $14.9. That seems really cheap.

I'd be trading in a 2006 Pilot EX-L 2WD with 84K that would be excellent if not for a few door dings.

igozoomzoom · December 2010

In addition to the Escape, also be on the lookout for Mercury Mariners and Mazda Tributes. Both of them are very close siblings (fraternal twins...or triplets) to the Escape and are mechanically identical. But they tend to depreciate a bit quicker than the Ford, making them smart used car buys.

A first generation Mazda6 is a safe and reliable choice if you're not dead-set on a small SUV. The '04-'06 'Sportwagon' and '04-'08 5-door are the most versatile picks and tend to be priced lower than the 4-door sedan. Ford dealers can handle all maintenance and repair on them because they share powertrains (among other things) with the Ford Fusion.

You mentioned the Subaru Forester, which is a can't miss (IMO). You might also want to look at the Legacy (sedan and wagon). The '05-'07 models are reasonably priced and they are very well built AND they have better crash test results than anything comparable (even better than a Volvo S60)!

Actually, another SUV just came to mind that is a great used deal- the '05-'06 Saturn VUE. They're decent looking and drive even better! The first few model years had some reliability problems, but the '04 and newer are pretty solid. They came with either a GM 2.2L Ecotec 4-cylinder (143hp) or a Honda-sourced 3.5L 250hp V6. The 2.2L is noisy and slow and it had a CVT instead of conventional automatic until 2006. Avoid the CVT...and the 2.2L altogether, to be honest. The 250hp Honda V6 is paired to a Honda 5-speed automatic that is well worth a few more bucks or overlooking a few more miles on the odometer. The V6 sounds and feels just as good as it does in an actual Honda and the power is excellent for this size vehicle. The powertrain has also been as reliable and durable as you'd expect from Honda. A 2005 or 2006 V6 FWD with under 100k miles is easy to find for around $7k in good condition. Any GM dealership can maintain and repair them.

isellhondas · December 2010

You would think that GM would be embarasssed to come to Honda for engines for their Saturns?

I don't know if I would want to buy a used "orphan" especially one that never sold well.

robr2 · December 2010

You would think that GM would be embarasssed to come to Honda for engines for their Saturns?

Actually it was a technology swap. GM used Honda V6's in the Saturn Vue and Honda used Isuzu diesel technology in Euro Hondas.

I don't know if I would want to buy a used "orphan" especially one that never sold well.

And as such would be a great value right now - they've taken the huge depreciation hit and can be bought cheap. As for service, it can be repaired at just about any GM dealership.

isellhondas · December 2010

I didn't know about the technology swap but I guess it makes sense.

Still seems odd that after building millions of V-6 engines in various sizes that they would use Honda engines.

Just seems weak, that's all.

In 1994 Honda realized that the SUV craze wasn't going away so they turned to Isuzu. they took Rodeos and rebadged them as Passports.

Passports did nothing to bolster honda's reputation. The guys in our shop despised them and they had lots of problems compared to "real" Hondas.

After 100,000 miles those engines got pretty loose.

stickguy · December 2010

not much for customer service, are you? If I wanted a salesman with attitude, I would shop Volvos with Jim!

a couple of nice cars int here. Some very ambitious pricing too.

I actually would rather have a RWD in one of these. Seem to recall hearing less than glowing reports about the AWD system on these as they age. I don't really need it, so why pay more up front, on gas, and in repairs?

robr2 · December 2010

Still seems odd that after building millions of V-6 engines in various sizes that they would use Honda engines. Just seems weak, that's all.

At the time (2004), Saturn was being poised to make a comeback. The only V6 they wanted to use was exclusive to Cadillac and they didn't want to share. By the time the next Vue (2008) was coming out, GM had a new V6 capable of competing. But we all know what happened in 2008.

Passports did nothing to bolster honda's reputation. The guys in our shop despised them and they had lots of problems compared to "real" Hondas.

All it did was keep Honda customers in the fold until Honda could develop something on their own. A customer that defects is tough to bring back.

Kirstie_H · December 2010

Yes, I had the usual electrical gremlins. One time I parked my car, took the key out, and the radio and lights stayed on - no way to turn them off. Just weird stuff like that. I had it easy compared to others who owned the same year/model.

igozoomzoom, thanks for the ideas. I am not dead-set on anything yet, and it's nice to have a long time to shop, compare, get ideas, and seek out what the best used value is going to be for me.

As far as mechanics, let's just say there are a LOT of domestic pickups and SUVs in this area. My Infiniti drew puzzled looks sometimes, and a "what kind of car is THAT?" (not from mechanics, of course). I know that no modern cars qualify as easy to work on, but I don't really want to go into a shop and have them say that this is the first time they've worked on a vehicle like this.

isellhondas · December 2010

Oh, I know that was Honda's intent with those Passports but they turned people off in the process as well.

They just were nowhere near Honda's normal level of quality.

Then Honda rebadged their Odysseys as Oasis and Isuzu sold a few (very few) of those.

I used to steer my used car customers on a budget toward the 4 cyl Saturn cars. I always thought they were pertty decent cars and I could sell them for thousands of dollars less than a used Honda or Toyota.

qbrozen · December 2010

Trade-in is in the $11k range, so they are asking about $2500 over trade-in. A good asking price and a fair deal at that price (as long as it all checks out, of course).

But why would you trade one mid-size SUV for another with higher miles??

qbrozen · December 2010

If I wanted a salesman with attitude, I would shop Volvos with Jim!

Hey! Don't make me start correcting your grammar, mister!

I feel like I SHOULD be a salesman.

lemmer · December 2010

Because it is a hybrid. My wife's daily commute is a series of up and down hills and stop signs. She gets about 16 or so doing this. I figure the hybrid would get high 20s in the same conditions.

So, what is my Pilot worth?

mcrrt · December 2010

I think this got lost in the shuffle of all the discussion surrounding Kirstie's unfortunate accident...

Lansing, MI area
2003 Chevrolet Venture LT
AWD
3.4l V6/4sp auto
106K miles
Black with tan leather
R. side power slider, dual power seats, quad captain's chairs, Homelink, CD/cassette (how retro!)
No major dents, just the dings and scratches expected of an 8 year old van
Rocker panel rust on both sides, but only one small hole (so far)
Matching tires with at least 50% tread left
New pads and rotors on all corners 2 months ago
All other maintenance up to date

Anyone care to offer a "real-world" guesstimate?

Thanks!

crkyolfrt · December 2010

I will, even though I'm at an automatic disadvantage cuz I'm Cdn, and I'm not sure if that is dlr or private. This is very off the cuff and I have not looked up any pricing for reference.. $4100?

ateixeira · December 2010

The real issue with that Vue wasn't the powertrain, it was the steering. Numb as novacaine. I test drove two of them, because the first time I was so disappointed I had trouble accepting it.

qbrozen · December 2010

About $11k-$11,500.

If she is getting 16 in the Pilot, I would guess low 20s on the Highlander.

Sounds like she's doing 21k miles per year? In which case, you'd save $1300/year in fuel (figuring $3/gallon).

After taxes and fees, you're probably going to be putting up $4500 extra for the Highlander with 16k more miles. It'll take you 3.5 years to break even, if the Highlander even lasts that long (170k miles by then!).

qbrozen · December 2010

Well, yer in MI, which means you may as well be in a different country as far as my pricing is concerned.

Guesstimate? If the dealer notices the rust, I think you'd be lucky to get $2k for it. They may go $2500 if they can club you like a baby seal on the car you are purchasing.

lemmer · December 2010

It is CCBA more than anything. I have a Miata, 944, a GS400 and the Pilot. They are great cars and cost me next to nothing to own. I feel the need to do something just to do something.

corvette · December 2010

My A4 had a similar episode with the radio. It normally turned off when the key was removed, but decided not to once. Tried turning the key on and off, nothing changed. Turned it off with the power button and the display stayed lit up even after I got out of the car and set the alarm. I "fixed" it by disconnecting and reconnecting the car's battery, and it never happened again. Kind of validated my decision to turn the Audi in at the end of its lease.

Glad you weren't hurt in your crash.

mcrrt · December 2010

The estimate of $2-2500, while I'm sure realistic, is depressing.

Fortunately, the whole being "clubbed like a baby seal" analogy made me grin.

Thanks for your input!

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